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pebblebeach, just do slow runs of just a few mins at a time to begin with, barefoot really hurts your achillies and ankles. I run all the time, and TBH barefoot trainers were no good for me. Just going now after a couple of weeks of hollys, should be interesting!!
Emsz is right, barefoot runners see beginner problems so much that they even have an acronym for it TMTS (too much too soon).
Basically it seems to be harder on your feet, the muscles need to work to stabilise the foot especially on uneven ground, the ankle, barefoot the ankle now takes on the stabilisation that is otherwise provided by the cushioning of the shoe and the achilles/calves, which are all of a sudden working alot harder than they have before.
The reccomendation even for experienced runners is to build up slowly, like starting from scratch essentially.
This is what I have done (easy for me as I had injuries for nine months, put on weight and lost my fitness) and I have had no niggles, just calf soreness on the longer runs, now (4 months) I rarely get that either. I also rate shin compression guards for recovery although the other half thinks I look like a pratt wearing them in bed!
Matt
But if the guy can already can a 10k like he does wearing a zero drop shoe, without any issues, then maybe his ligaments, muscles, and what not are already predisposed to this barefoot style.....so absolutely no breaking in necessary.
Going for my first run in zero drop road shoes tonight and I'm really looking forward to it (5 mile club handicap). Been running the trails in bare grips for ages but all my running shoes re 4mm drop. These things are light though, very light.....bare-x 150's.
My last few (well, four) pairs of trainers have all been racing flats with little padding and minimal heel-toe drop.
A couple of weeks ago i bought a pair of Puma Faas 500. I'd forgotten how nice it was to run in a big comfy cushioned shoe. **** minimalism!
Just got some Merrell trails yesterday, on offer in local Decathlon at half price 🙂
Now browsing barefoot running drills, anyone got any tips or just take it slow and build up to longer distances?
I got mine for £35 in jones sale - very pleased with that given that sale sticker said £42.50. I just went straight in no messing, no major aches or pain, calves a bit tight but that's it. I can't be doing with fannying about.
mogrim - MemberJust got some Merrell trails yesterday, on offer in local Decathlon at half price
Now browsing barefoot running drills, anyone got any tips or just take it slow and build up to longer distances?
that's more or less it.
but if you want to practise the technique of landing softly, but without over-working your Achilles:
run on the spot, landing on the large 'pad' behind your toes, aim to land on the outer side of the pad first (behind your little toe), then let the rest of the foot land gently, with your heel coming down last.
there should be no jarring impact.
Thanks, ahwiles!
I'd forgotten how nice it was to run in a big comfy cushioned shoe. **** minimalism!
Nice....
I'd forgotten how nice it was to run in a big comfy cushioned shoe. **** minimalism!Nice....
For me, i mean. I wouldn't want to put people off trying it who are seeking to solve injury problems or who want to see if it'll make them faster. I think there's definitely a place for a big comfy shoe in a high-mileage week though.
I'll still be racing in my Hyperspeeds.
For me, i mean
I was agreeing with you! Flats for racing bit more midsole for mileage.
Ah i see 😀
I used f195 for a bit and TBH they messed up my ankles and I couldn't run as fast as I could in normal shoes. Haven't bothered with them for a few months and I've gone back to normal trainers ( addidas if it makes a difference)
Non-Tarmac + Roclite 295 = Mile upon slow mile of good times.
[img][url= http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8170/7894333780_384fa258d4.jp g" target="_blank">
This is what you need.
Oh no, the barefoot debacle.
Oh no, the barefoot debacle.
I say it's a miracle cure.
Yours
Barefoot Bob
😆
Love the video!
First park run today, 18.51 and 6th. Slower than I thought but nearly 2/3rd on grass and quite boggy in places.
15mile planned for tomorrow as a recce for ripon ultra. Got back to speedwork this week to with 3x1mile then 3 sprints of 50ish m, fastest mile was 5.41 at the end. Also doubled up and did a 6 miler the same day! Yesterday I rode to work, ran a tough 6 at lunch, rode home then did an hour of karate... This may account for a few seconds slower on today's 5k, maybe!
Nice report here on the race my training partner Caroline is doing - http://www.mudsweatandtears.co.uk/2012/08/31/wmrc-preview-eritrea-return/
“I’m still standing”
Yes, yes I am. I’ve been trail running now for a few months and I’m feeling much better thanks.
As to how it’s going? Well that’s rather difficult for me to assess, you see I’m not timing myself nor using any GPS nor timing methods. I’m not that interested in tracking progress other than how my body feels. You see I have no “marathons” nor “events” to train for. I’m running in the woods and beaches near me cos’ it’s something I can do to stretch myself and enjoy the environment straight after work, quick and simple and it’s different to biking.
Progress: Other than my legs still feel sore the day after I’m actually doing ok, my stride feels much better and paced now than it did after the first couple of weeks, I seem to have settled into a rhythm and due to years of cycle racing experience I can tap into and back off depending on how my body is feeling, so this has helped me able to pace on and off at will. I’m not sure how newbies to running cope with not being able t do this.
Location: I run locally on beaches and woods/forests, I choose the soft sand and dry’ish trail paths near by and also use my local woods/forest a lot up and down the river. This is the nicest trail I use and sometimes I’ve been able to bounce up some sharp turns that have made me walk previously. Wooded roots and slippy angled trails are now becoming things of the past as I’m able to pick and glide(ish) over them where once they’d trip me up. Dodging trees and overhanging branches seem much easier to dodge.
Breathing, well sometimes I top out and have to peg right back, I suffer with a bit of over exuberance and can often get too excited and my breathing suffers, this is coming with experience and I’m finding less and less times where I have to double breath out of pattern so to speak.
Knees, these sometimes kill. I use some rather fancy trainers designed for this type of running and I’ve had no issues with them, but the knees sometimes hurt like hell after a run. Doesn’t matter if it’s the same trail used or same pace, just no idea why. So I’m choosing to ignore the pain and putting it down to “I’ll get over it” and that’s exactly whats happening.
Other People: I’ve met some other folk doing these trails, only a couple of guys but they’re much faster than I am (and going in the opposite direction) although I say Hi, they’ve so far refused to acknowledge me, lucky me.. But I like it that way, I’m not doing it for them after all.
Trials: I’m finding my trails are holding up well, the FC have been hacking down trees in one of my woods and other than that I’m enjoying the environment.
Water: I don’t take any along with me. Trials are loops in my world so I’m back at the start point (normally car/home) so I top up then. I’ve never ridden without water bottles so this is new to me not sipping whilst exercising, I just can’t be bothered to carry a bottle. I guess at some point I’ll buy a small handheld one.
Kit: Same as when I started. Trainers are holding out well (Salomon Sportcross3’s) some sympatex stretchy shorts (non Dutch style) and long sleeve sympatex top. Socks I’m using Sportwools hiking lites.
Motivation: Some days I’ve run for ages, some days I’ve done no more than 3k and felt whacked, there seems to be no pattern to this and I’m putting it down to age and a change from loadsa cycling to a mix of both now.
Future: Plans only extend to a different environment, fells I seem to have a thing for in my brain and steeper rockier trails but other than that I’m happy swallowing flies near the river.
Nice write up there Bikebouy!
My mate came 21st in the Worlds junior womens uphill race, Taking 3rd spot for GB and getting a silver for the team Prize! 8)
I started running properly last october and did my first half marathon yesterday (glasgow) did it in 1h 54mins, pretty pleased as I wanted to do it in under 2hrs. Six weeks to my next one!
Cool!
I did the Kent coastal one yesterday. Described by the organisers as "undulating", described by me as "f'ing undulating". Glutes feel like they've been smacked with a baseball bat today 🙂
Injured with less than 6 weeks to the marathon. Oh well 🙁
Bugger. What happened?
peroneal tendon went last week. On reflection I was overdoing it, 22 miles sunday, bike monday, 10 mile intervals tuesday.
Unlucky Dj, get some ice on it! Fingers crossed your back at it soon.
Going to give [url= http://www.ilkleyharriers.co.uk/index.php?page=incline ]THIS[/url] another go tomorrow night. 1 mile sprint, straight up. I may need marrow receipes after.. Soup? 😀
Rode to work today, just so i dont get thrown off the forum for not being a cyclist.. Strange really but running has taken over. At best im now a commuting cyclist after selling the mtb 3 months ago ive not missed it yet.
Just out of interest, does anyone else get really bad stitches when out and about?
I went out for a trot round the village (about 4 miles0 last night and less than half way round got a really nasty stitch. Bad enough I actually had to stop for a bit. It eventually passed, but was not fun, so I'd welcome any tips for preventing them or getting rid of them.
Thinking about it, when I get a stitch it's usually in the same place. Is that normal?
Do more sprint intervals. That'll increase your cardiovascular capacity so much you won't get stitch any more 🙂
On the subject of running, I've had to come to work by train this week, so no bike (too much faff given the circumstances), only got running kit. So if you see someone at Ceasar's camp or Tunnel Hill huffing and puffing along, it could be me.
Oh yeah - must get myself a headtorch from Amazon for my birthday, due to lots of store credit. I think there's a Cree LED powered one for £16
Rarely get it, but used to get it occasionally going downhill. I think, though could be completely wrong, that the stitch is caused by one of the muscles that supports your guts cramping. Cramping's often caused by muscles being asked to do more than they're used to, so I guess over time it will strengthen and stop cramping, or you could find ways of trying to reduce the bumping that's causing it to be stressed, but trying to land softer - but that's pretty rubbish conjecture by me :). Google's probably got some better answers.
Stich? No, no not yet..
Orchards run tonight, up the river, turn right over the bridge, through the orchards and back through the woods..
Nice.
Very nice.
Last (second!) triathlon of the year done, so just entered this [url= http://www.cotswoldcare.org.uk/train/details.php ]Race The Train[/url] to keep the motivation going.
To beat the train, you need to average 8 min mile (5mins per km). I can do 4m30s per km regularly & consistently, but throw in those climbs over Cleeve Hill and this is going to be a challenge...
Eeeeek.. mental..
Wow, just had an awsome high volume week. 69 miles mostly junk but with a couple of tasty club runs in there. Managed to stay niggle free aside from an lingering piriformis issue. Yesterday's run of 18 miles was interesting especially when I totally conked out 8 miles from home.
This week i mostly appreciated that NB110's are ace, as are Inov8 Bare-x 150's. Oh, and I ripped through the uppers of 165 mile old Saucony Triumph's and confirmed my contempt for Salomon SpeedCross 3's.
Good work seanoc.. I was tempted by the speedcross 3 but i suspect they havnt moved on much from the 2s? Have you tried fellcross? Think i will stick with inov8, tempted by the new mudclaw 300 but may just get another pair of x talon 212 for my next buy As they are faultless.
I did Wetherby 10k, came in 19th with a chip time of 37.53, Miles off a pb, but nice to be back in 37min from 38 at recent races. Gave it everything on a hot day [25c]so pretty pleased and also beat some good rivals by 45seconds that have had the better of me recently 8)
Work to be done still, Ripon ultra still looming only 4 weeks away and then snowdonia marathon. Need to keep going long on a weekend and get my arse out of bed for the speedwork as my next 10k is Leeds abbey dash..
Got some new Adidas adizero hagio and christened them at wetherby, mega light shoe and great from the box. Nicely discounted at Pete blands too.
So up tomorrow before first light, 4 x 1 mile reps or fartlek round town? 😐
That's some commitment there nosemineb, I've been told that I can't get up earlier than 6 as it wakes the young'uns.
I've never tried the fell cross and probably never will. I got the SC3's cheap and generally only use them for gardening or playing footie with the young lad. The mud claw 300 looks good but I'm not sure what it has over the x-talons. My x-talons have been phenomenal and will definately be getting replaced when they eventually die......they seem to just go on and on though.
I believe the 300 has a talon like upper but with the very grippy studs from the mudclaw. I think if it was sub 250 i would have gone for it.
I find the earlier i go the more success i have leaving the house with everyone asleep. Also 2 days a week i work 6am till 2pm so i'm used to getting up, bad night sleep last night, blaming it on the 10k 😕
Just ordered a set of those adizero hagio nosemineb.
I'll be blaming you if they don't make me faster 🙂
I can live with that! 😀
Planning a lunch time run in the hagio today, 7 mile ish. Then a Fell race tonight at Roseberry topping, its only 1.5 mile so nowt but a quick thrash!
Saturday i have volounteered to pace for a parkrun and already planned a 20mile recce of Ripon ultra for Sunday morning, starting in Masham and heading to Grantley before returning to Ripon. Should take me over 40 miles again this week plus biking and karate. 😀
Ripon ultra looks pretty good-what sort of elevation gain and what sort of pace are you envisaging?
I'm on for clocking another big week; should complete the Strava TR100 challenge today (3 days early)....not many long runs though just a heap of 6-10 milers. Doing a recce of a trail marathon on Monday so that should kick next week off nicely with a 27-28 miler.
Not sure on elevation, Not huge however it does get up on to the edge of nidderdale. The second half should be a nice run out and ive been told it certainly is the hardest part, looks like it too- http://connect.garmin.com/course/1737838
Ive only had a quick look at the strava challenges, i thought they were races.. Will have another look at them.
I believe Ripon is doing entry on the day if you fancied it?
I would think 8- 8.30min miles ish. Will have a better idea after the weekend 😯
[url=
vid[/url] from the race midweek.. Not sure on positon, i was doing ok going up, but far too slow coming down, wet rock steps and worn shoes not great combo.. Legs still sore too. [Thats me in burgandy on the cover shot!]
@nosemineb - that roseberry topping vid brings back memories; I used to do the Tuesday (I think) night race when I was younger - do you still get free choice of route up and down ?
I've been unlucky enough to pick up a stress fracture in the build up to the Redcar Half; was in the best form I've been in for a while (and now weigh under 13 stone for the first time in 10 years - which helps! ) - gutted.
Hoping to be back on the trails in time to do the Cleveland Survival in March next year - anyone else do it ?
Yep, Stick to the track until youre in the wood and touch the trig at the top other than that anywhere you want. Wish i had recce d the chute, lost loads of time there i reckon. Great race. Never heard of the Clevland survival one.
Hope you get fixed soon.
Sounds just the same - fun 🙂
The survival is usually entertaining - 40km route somewhere on the moors organised by Cleveland Mountain Rescue team; route is by a series of checkpoints which are given just after the start and the start location only given two or three weeks before the actual event.
Bloody running! Done a real easy pace 27mile/6000ft training run yesterday and now the hamstring in my right leg is knacking. Definately aggravated it by doing a 10k run in some inov8 180's on Thursday and now, well, it hurts.
On a more positive note, set a new PB on Sunday in the local 10K race 🙂
Unlucky seanoc, fingers crossed it passes.
Did 22 mile on sunday, 1750feet and 9.30m/m. i think the whole ultra route is around 2500ft of up. Which makes it tough cos its runable! Its around 70%off road and a really nice route. I seem to have recovered pretty well after so all seems well.
Seanoc, where have you been running?
Good effort Mogrim, Dont be shy give us your time?
41:34 or thereabouts, not got an official time - despite chip, they haven't posted them (yet). Hilly race, hope to get it below 41 in next month's run in central Madrid.
Yeah that does sound tough...nothing like a massive mountain to give you a good excuse to drop down to a walk. Most my running is pretty local, either from the house or on route to work.
Yeserdays route was a recce for an event next month (that I really hope I'm back on form for) http://www.southwalesldwa.org/ravens/wrd26.html
That makes my last weekend's jog in the Chilterns look a bit tame 🙂
Got to love the ldwa for value for money! £7, so at the pricey end of their events :), and no doubt plenty of free food and drink included.
I'm currently 5 1/2 weeks from my first ever marathon.
Went out yesterday morning and did my 20 mile run. Took me 2hr47 so at least I'm feeling confident I should be able to do the full thing in sub 4hrs on the day!
Legs still a little sore today but at least I'm walking!
Looking forward to just switching back over to the bike once it's done though.
LDWA is bonkers crazy for the money, relies on friendly volunteers and a great community. As much tea and toast as you care for at the start, as much cake, sarnies and tea as you want on the way around, then stew or chilli at the finish. No medal mind you, but I know which I would prefer. Our local LDWA has secured the 100 miler for 2014 so, erm, that hold be interesting.
Right, I started this thread when I was building up to Snowdon and ripon ultra so its fair ressurect it now I've done both.
The ultra went pretty well. Lots of slow running and fast walking on hard ground. Considering I had only done 22m in training I was actually emotional at the end of the 35miles having finished in 5.40. We aimed for sub 6 and ibwas 11th of 130 starters.
Yesterday was Snowdon marathon, my 3rd attempt and the best weather I have run it in. Such a great marathon that I will be back. I got a 3min course pb in 3.36. Had hoped for neared to 3.20. I had done consistent 7min mile till 16m point, perhaps to fast. Th wheels dropped off at 20 before the last 2mile up which I shuffled up then past loads gritting my teeth for the last 2 to llanberis.
Leeds 10k next.
Looking forward to steady paced base through winter. Hopefully upping the mileage and knocking high paced running in an effort to run daily with less doms from the faster running I've been doing.
Sorry that was posted via phone and I can't be bothered editing the mistakes. Forgive me I am tired!
Cool!!
First XC of the local series for me. No idea how I did, but I wasn't last, so an improvement over my first one!!
Been fiddling with lights this week and have bought a pair of those hoka clown shoes as I'm trying to run to work occasionally rather than ride, but the run means using a stony bepuddled farm track that normally results with soggy feet and bruises. I reckon with these Hokas I should be walk on water 😀
Very good times; ultras are fantastic arn't they (although the profile on your one shows nowhere to hide; I much prefer hills)!
Them Honkas look mental, still zero drop but I'm sceptical about how they would perform with a less than perfect form. Wouldn't the mentally high midsole just exaggerate any supination, probation?
My hamstring was still giving me issues right up to the race which meant my prep didn't go as planned. I managed a contentious 2nd; the field wasn't strong but then you can only race whose there.
Concentrating on a sub 19 minute 5k now (I'm not built for speed).
I've only tried em for about 3 miles so far. Definitely feel odd, and I could certainly feel other muscles complaining that wouldn't normally, but we shall see. Still scuffing the ground a bit too as I don't think I've adjusted to the height yet, felt nice to plough straight through a rubblely bit of track though. Bit like the first time you try a full suss bike 🙂
I ran my first ever Marathon yesterday!
Preston Guild Marathon and done in 3.37 which I was chuffed with, especially considering the dire weather conditions!
Back to the bike for me now though........once the legs recover!
First xc yesterday. Being chased by people I should be beat, dirty as hell, brilliant. Need longer spikes.
@Crispo - good effort
Jedburgh Ultra for me, mudfest, although watching people dig there shoes out of the mud with there bare hands provided some amusement
Go on then, what's your focus for the year?
My "A" race is the Cliff Brecon Beacons 10 peaks; at 85km and 4800m it's a bit lumpy.
There's a couple of "B" ultras in there too, as well as two trail marathons and a fell series.
First race of the year is today and I'm way off form, still really looking forward to it though.
Get my leg working and do the FRA champs.
Currently doing lots of biking and 2 X 5 mile runs. 1st race is Edale skyline on 24th March....
I fancy some x talons for racing and am planning on getting the 212s over the 195s, they look more durable and 20 grams is hardly going to make a difference is it?
Pete Bland are taking pre-orders on a mudclaw 265.
Want to try and get back into doing at least one run a week, just always seem to have knee and hip pains for the days after, which puts me off a bit!
It's a proper pain in the arse the injuries you pick up from running eh Tom? I've had my fair share and even now still find it really hard to distinguish between a niggle, pain and injury.
Pieface; the X-talon 212 is much more robust than just a race shoe; I've got 300 miles on mine and have only recently demoted them to a 'from the door' trail shoe.
Never used mudclaws; are they much more aggressive than x-talons?
Not necessarily a "focus" for the year, but from that other thread up there I'd like to see if I can stop just plodding along and get my 5k and 10k times lower (let's say much nearer 20 mins and 45 mins respectively from their current 25 and 55 mins).
I'm just getting back into running after a gap of several years. Just plodding at the moment (typically 3-5 miles, 2 or 3 times a week with BMF sessions thrown in to work on intervals and core strength). Avoiding injury is my immediate goal so that I can gradually build up the mileage and intensity to be ready for the Highlander Mountain Marathon at the end of April and, ultimately, Tranter's Round sometime around midsummer.
I've done a handful of MMs in the past, most recently 6th place in the B class in the Mourne MM in 2006. I've always harboured a notion to do the Tranter and I'm not getting any younger!
I'm not very knowledgeable about running though. I much prefer running in the hills and on trails as it seems to be more forgiving on the knees and hips. Road/pavement always gives me some kind of niggling pain so I might need some advice on shoes, technique etc.
Hay, thought i would pop and check this thread and hay someone has posted! well a week ago!
Focus will be Chester marathon and 3 peaks fell race for me.
Still at the back of my mind is another bgr attempt and were going this Saturday to look at leg 5. My mate is in full swing for a may attempt and I am keeping him company whilst fancying my chances without committing fully yet 😕
Its been 4 months since i rode a bike now. Running has taken over completely for me. I still look in on this forum though, it was my first and to be fair i cant stick it on running forums.
anyway im at around 45 mile a week now and starting to build speed work back in for the upcoming local 10k races and anything else that takes my fancy to.
I've done 2 fell races this year and came 11th in one! Also a park run on a very snowy course.
Good to see the thread still Limping on! (well it is a running thread!!) 😆
local 10k races
Whats "local" for you nosemineb?
Also what the weather like for leg 5 this weekend?
I've just started running after about 20 years of not doing it. I use the term 'running' very loosely. Shins are not enjoying it but the knees are ok. I am at the run a bit wlak a bit stage but will get better (hopefully). I'm sticking to grass and the woods and don't plan any pavement pounding.
oo.. ooo.. just noticed Nosemineb that you did the Leeds abbey dash. I did my pb there. What time did you do?
Running
...should be punishable by summary execution, unless being employed as a method of survival/capture evasion.
Persons who run in the road should be tortured, then executed.
Your Fuhrer has spoken.
...should be punishable by summary execution, unless being employed as a method of survival/capture evasion.
If you don't practice, how on earth do you plan to be able to use it for a method of survival/capture evasion???
Verses has never been in a survival/capture situation!
@ Seanoc - I've never used X-talons so can't comment, however the mudclaws are incredibly grippy.
Surely the captor gives you sufficient time to get your running shoes and fluorescent beanie on?
Hay surfer, 37.06... Bet you beat me?! My slowest yet but a good come back race and my pb isn't much quicker so I was pleased.
We're watching the weather for the weekend, I think leg 5 and cat bells will be a pleasant run even in the snow but travelling could be the deal breaker. Fingers crossed!
Re x talon and mudclaw, x talon is really nice for pretty much all fell running and racing I'm on my 2nd pair. They have good sized studs. However they don't have the full on grip that the mudclaw has when it's a steep decent, mudclaw is the clear winner downhill. I think the new 260? soon to be released will be amazing.
Oh and local to Ripon / Harrogate area, we seem to have a good mix of all races.
I seem to be going from injury to injury at the moment: First my calf, and now my ankle.
Managed to do 17km in the snow on Saturday though. That isn't much compared to most of you here but as someone who only started running a couple of months ago I thought it was a decent effort.
Just ordered some Inov8 Roclite 295s in the hope they will offer a bit more mud grip than my Asics Gel Fuji Trainers.
Just ordered some Inov8 Roclite 295s in the hope they will offer a bit more mud grip than my Asics Gel Fuji Trainers.
Hopefully you got them from [url= http://www.peteblandsports.co.uk/products/inov8-roclite-295.htm ]here[/url].
Indeed I did 😀