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Amazing, awesome.
Kudos to the ref too he did very well.
Boo ya! I'm still terrified that this is what it takes to beat the AB's
edit: completely agree a_a, Barnes was a monumental step up from the other games I watched today
Congratulations Ireland!
Kearney was a lucky boy mind.
As was Stockdale when Read knocked on.
As I said I only saw bits of the game but Scotland are playing the toonie way - high risk high reward. Sometimes it works for you and you are geniuses like against England last year, sometimes you look like clowns
Kick a kick off deep to Wales you know what will happen - they will set a ruck and kick deep giving you the ball. so you know if you kick deep from a kickoff you get the ball back around the halfway line. Kick deep to Scotland they will always try to attack. If they get caught then they will try to kick. sometimes you get turned over, When it pays off you look great, when it doesn't you look stupid
high risk high reward.
I knew you would say that!
Thing is the reward from running at a set defence out if the 22 is minimal its just plain stupid, lost them the game.
Oh wow Ireland! Huge congrats.
I think I have the stats correct but it looks like another 30 odd missed tackles today from England. Did the new defense coach start the job yet (that's rhetorical)?
DanW, Kearney wasn't tackled or part of any ruck or maul. So he was entitled to play the ball.
AA - thats not what lost them the game. Bok phsicality at the breakdown and in mauls won it from the bits I saw. Like it or loathe it thats how Toonie wants to play.
Toonie has been using these matches to try combinations out and to give players experience. I think a couple of guys have played themselves out of the WC / 6N squad Ryan Wilson and Grant Gilcrest in particular.
Mucho congratulations to Ireland. to stop the ABs scoring a try is a fantastic achievement and to beat them is just great. Enjoy your beers lads - you deserve it.
Cheers Duckman
I don't know TJ, I missed the first chunk but there was a lot of very bad decision making and unnecessary risk in the (admittedly short) bits i caught. Kicks out on the full and running straight in to touch are pretty unforgivable as other examples
Like you say TJ, you only saw bits of the game....I saw it all, poor game management including the moment of insantiy that was trying to play fancy rugby in your own 22 did indeed lose you the game, that was a gifted 7 points and you lost by 6!
Kicks out on the full need the kicker slapping and slapping hard. It happens to often to Scotland.
We are short of a decent captain I think.
Playing fancy rugby in our own 22 won us the Calcutta cup last year - remember that. England never recovered after that try
Loved that Irish win!
Wales were strong, despite a little wobble.
Yeah but you really can only dine out on "THAT CALCUTTA CUP WIN" for so long......pool stage of the world cup and Japan are within 1 score in the last 10 minutes, home crowd giving them a huge boost.....you need to be playing smart or you'll be going home very early!
They've got to find a difference between high risk, exciting rugby and suicidal rugby. I'm fine with any team trying to run out of their 22... so long as there's half a chance and it's not just pre-meditated and there's a back up clearance kick option is the space disappears for example
Well done Ireland. Keeping the AB’s tryless is one hell of an achievement. Ireland are so accurate in pretty much everything they do, they’re comfortable on the ball and rarely make silly errors. It might not be pretty but it’s bloody effective. Guess the IRFU will want to hang on to Joe after the WC. They really rattled the AB’s and made them look ordinary and undisciplined (by their standards). There will be some sore bodies tomorrow after that match though
They look nailed on 6N winners next year and a lot will be expected of them at the WC.
Its the Toonie way - do you remember him as a player? every game he would create tries from nothing and give tries away. You just hoped the balance was positive.
A bit more pragmatism at times would be great. But with the coach and players we have? don't hold your breath
Bring back Dan Parks! Bring back Andy Robinson!
I quite agree DanW.
AA – thats not what lost them the game. Bok phsicality at the breakdown and in mauls won it from the bits I saw. Like it or loathe it thats how Toonie wants to play.
I think it was Gatland’s fault ; )
Wow. What a year it’s been. Pro14. Champions cup. 6N grand slam (the “hard” way - although that was when it was judged that Twickenham was a tough game) and topped off with a win over New Zealand. What a time to be alive.
Peter
O
****ing
Mahoney!
POM was massive today. Massive. A game winning performance.
Here DD you forgot about the summer series win in Australia for the first time 😜
POM was outstanding, actually everyone played well apart from Cronin. It’s the one area of concern.
Stockdale 12 tries in 14 caps, some return that
Guardian report described it as 2 heavyweights slogging it out, which I thought was a pretty good analagy. Guinness in hand.
Here DD you forgot about the summer series win in Australia for the first time
Oh cripes, I forgot about that one. There’s just been so many things, it’s hard to keep up. 😀
Stockdale 12 tries in 14 caps, some return that
Not bad for a donkey hey?
Not bad for a donkey hey?
He very nearly ****ed it up for you 2 mins before too!! Another ref would have binned Kearney for clattering the winger in the air. Mind you another ref might have binned an all black for persistent infinging.
This Ireland team are starting to remind me of the pattern of England in 2003. Beating NZ in the run up to the RWC. Believing they will win every game. Monster pack. Solid defence. Great 10. Doing it their own way.
interestingly, I thought they had missed their golden generation, but the current team have raised the bar.
Im loving the fact that NH standards have raised over the last decade. Wales and Scotland gutted when they lose to SA /Aus these days.
With the luck luck of the draw, the final (so theoretically the winners too) could come from 8 teams next year. I’m gutted I no longer go to Japan, as I’d have loved to be out there.
Oh, and did anybody else think the ref bottled it 4 min from the end in Sco/SA? That looked a blatant shoulder charge to me.
Dan, a few incidents worthy of another look, sadly.
The SA headbutt
Nowell's lifting tackle
The NZ deliberate knock on, while on the ground, while offside
Kearney was a lucky boy as well.
dants - to me that was worth a penalty only. some attempt with arms, no involvement with the head, Watson was on the ruck when he started his run up but detached just as he hit.
Possible yellow but not cast iron yellow.
No idea how Biggar escaped a yellow on his try line too flashy!
Scotland lost just due to bad disjointed play and although the will disagree the mltrying to run it out the 22, turn over, try was just a bit dunderheaded just because there was no back up.
SA managed to avoid two yellow cards (I guess we also avoided a couple) the shoulder charge was obvious, but the backwards headbutt was pretty obvious.
A very solid Ireland performance with Sexton excellent again.
I thought the ref was ok but the game naturally balanced itself out in terms of infringements.
The ABs look like they need a rest as its a lot of travel as well as rugby. They left it too late to respond and that along with their errors is indicative of fatigue.
did Scotland not also score a try from running it out of their 22? I really must watch the whole game!
High risk / high reward means one minute you look like geniuses, the next total dunderheads!
FlashyTJ - I only caught snippets on iPlayer yesterday between flights (In Edinburgh for the night last night - would have been raucous had SCO won!) I thought absolutely no attempt with arms - a typical SA drop of the shoulder & smash.
The ABs look like they need a rest as its a lot of travel as well as rugby. They left it too late to respond and that along with their errors is indicative of fatigue.
They have played a very limited game plan for a while now and look quite un-NZ at times which seems to be keeping some trump cards for the WC. Still a monstrous side and while they have played a lot of rugby you have to say it was the consistent Irish pressure and intensity that brought the errors- credit to Ireland on that
High risk / high reward means one minute you look like geniuses
I’m not sure genius means what you think it does.
Don't be daft Gauss, 1 Calcutta cup in a decade, it's clear!
Dan, a few incidents worthy of another look, sadly.
The SA headbutt
Nowell’s lifting tackle
The NZ deliberate knock on, while on the ground, while offside
Kearney was a lucky boy as well.
The Tongan with the very borderline high hit off the ball on Wainwright was lucky too.
did Scotland not also score a try from running it out of their 22
Jones made a good run out if defence, not sure if itvended in a try or not but it was against an unorganized defence the one after the try was just plain dumb, a couple of passes then kick is fair enough but not what they did.
I know there were 3 points in the game at the time but Russell's 50m drop goal attempt when there was momentum with Scotland and broken play is another classic. Too many freebies to let the other side off the hook
Guess the IRFU will want to hang on to Joe after the WC.
My money is on him being the next NZ coach after the World Cup.
@danw yes it was indeed a big achievement by ireland not just on the field but tactically too.
The ABs undoubtedly do not want to peak too early with a world cup round the corner. Yet they have the expectation to win every game. It is a problem which has always plagued them and as shrewd as Hanson is I think the ABs may now be on a downward slope going into the world cup. I thought England chucked it against them last week.
Crucially Ireland have found a gameplan to contain the ABs which the other teams will replicate. But i think that cagey way of playing can always be beaten in a world cup by a very expansive style of play which is why i think Scotland could win it if the ABs are knocked out by someone else. Apologies for the essay
.
Crucially Ireland have found a gameplan to contain the ABs which the other teams will replicate
With the greatest respect to Irelands victory, it was found during the Lions tour by Gatland, replicated badly by England and superbly by Ireland.
They werent particularly smashed in the set piece by either of the NH team, but they were contained and denied the ball which nullifys thier magic loose play.
Plenty of skullduggery from NZ yesterday as well - a fair bit of blocking in front of the runner in the 2nd half.
On another note, Mercer had a shocker yesterday, looked like the least likely international on the pitch for a while. And clearly Farrell has surpassed George as a starter. I think Farrells stint at 12 forces the oppo to worry about him.running through, Georgie boy rarely offers that (for England)
Crucially Ireland have found a gameplan to contain the ABs which the other teams will replicate.
Wales for one dont have the players to do it.
With the greatest respect to Irelands victory, it was found during the Lions tour by Gatland,
I'm glad somone has mentioned this as Gatland took endless abuse on her for playing a conservative style but when Schmidt does itvhe's the next All Blacks coach.
You won’t beat NZ playing like NZ.
My worry for Ireland is they have come to the fore early enough for people to find a way to beat them.
Scotlnd don't have the players either to contain a team as good as the all blacks. We pushed NZ close playing the NZ way 😉
What did England get the yellow card? Can't find out anywhere.
Too early for next weekend’s predictions? Hope not, so mine are:
Italy v NZ 6:52
Scot v Argentina 26:20
Eng v Aus 16:16
Wales v SA 18:15 (with a sprinkle of wishful thinking)
Ireland v USA 60:3
France v Fiji 33:12
Brizzle with another good sized crowd today.
TJ it was George for cynically killing Japan's momentum after an interception
Starts at around 29s here: https://www.skysports.com/watch/video/sports/rugby-union/11556778/england-35-15-japan
Scotland will either spank Argentina or be beaten. Will not be a narrow win
I don't see anything other than an English win TBH.
Arg vs Sco could be a cracker. Argentina I reckon
I'll be behind the sofa for the Wales game as normal 🙂
Wales wouldnt beat NZ playing like 8 legged 10foot tall Martians
Rofl!
Is Evans completely fit? I guess his fitness determines if he or Smith start. I'm glad Ball seemed to be back firing too.
Absolutely agree with your backs too even is 1/2p is out. If he's fit then it makes selection easier
I can see Biggar being picked for points off the tee as much as anything if 1/2p is not fit and I'm sure that will be a huge dilemma, but it feels like a backwards step and I think Anscombe needs to continue. I'd even have Patchell on the bench rather than Biggar. Gareth Davies would be very unfortunate to miss out and I see him as a bench option rather than starter. Not necessarily for going forwards but for this match in light of Williams starting already and doing a lot right and being better for the experience
Is Evans completely fit?
I presume so or he wouldnt have benched in the last few games. Francis is a fat knacker but is our strongest scrumaging tighthead with Lee injured. The SA ginger 1 looked a beast v Nel so Lewis will have to bench I think despite his work in the loose. Smith Dee and Lewis off the bench will be a handy change.
Wales wouldnt beat NZ playing like 8 legged 10foot tall Martians 🙁
a_a the other extreme to Tj? ; )
Whilst NZ are little doubt the better team, at the moment I live in hope. A lot of the 6nations games are hard to call right now and it is not impossible that Wales could win. Then having seen Ireland beat NZ yesterday, NZ under huge pressure, Wales pull off a miracle.
Or Scotland beat NZ in the quarter finals. Wales play Scotland in the semis and Ireland in the final.
With the greatest respect to Irelands victory, it was found during the Lions tour by Gatland, replicated badly by England and superbly by Ireland.
I think you will find we beat them in 2016 long before Gatland drew in NZ 😜
And we did beat them playing the NZ way scoring 5 tries in the process.
Irelands keep ball tactics are different from Gatlands Lions who played more like Wales just with better players. Wales play a high pressure defence with lots of ling kicks. Ireland just get the ball and grind the opposition down.
Kryton - the danger is that Farrell is so crucial to us that he gets broken we’re royally we f*cked. Ford from the Argentina tour was actually quiet good the Ford we are stuck with is shit but still gets picked.
Some of the new boys have gone well this autumn (e.g Wilson and Moon) whilst others have work to do. Hopefully the Daly at FB experiment will end once Watson is fit again. It looks like Brown’s days are done.
Kryton – the danger is that Farrell is so crucial to us that he gets broken we’re royally we f*cked. Ford from the Argentina tour was actually quiet good the Ford we are stuck with is shit but still gets picked.
You know what I'm about to say... right? 🙂
From Scotland game, I mentioned it whilst watching. Video ref obviously not been to specsavers. Again....
https://mobile.twitter.com/twitter/status/1063854662204428288
World Rugby say mitigating factors were behind the decision not to cite Kolisi.
They include Horne "illegally preventing Kolisi rejoining play" and the "moderate force of the strike to the head".
****ing idiots!!
The citing commissioner said he only did a gentle headbutt (acknowledging making contact with the head) so it was ok. Don't get it myself but there you are.
edit: beat me to it
North fit but 1/2p out.
England seem to have gone back to the tactic of giving the visitors dodgy meals to set them up for the weekend 🙂
While it has been three years, the head was considered worse than the fist at a disciplinary hearing. But hey-ho; retaliation is ok as well now it would seem.
Ashton likely to be broken for the weekend and Manu is apparently not 100% so probably won’t feature.
Even with the Aussies having the squips we’ll probably make bloody hard work of Saturday giving away 5,000 brainless penalties away.
While it has been three years, the head was considered worse than the fist at a disciplinary hearing. But hey-ho; retaliation is ok as well now it would seem.
Its a ****ing disgrace, meanwhile 1/2p still concussed two weeks after a "fair" chargedown. The people in charge just look like morons I'm afraid.
I need to mention my hatred for these stupid slogans that are appearing everywhere. “Will makes us family” Really, what about Dave? “Whatever it’s takes.” Glasgow giving away their intention to cheat shamelessly? Do they add anything at all to the game?
#crappyrugbymarketingbullshithashtaggery
Scotland players ranked as food! Written by a Bok fan but one who clearly has spent loads of time in Edinburgh!
thought you might enjoy it - I did
Gordon Reid had to scrum against Frans Malherbe. Basically, it was a case of sheep’s pluck minced with salt, oatmeal, suet and onion inside a lining of intestines. Reid needs more marrow.
Stuart McInally was a lively hooker. He was like neeps and tatties, with butter and chives. The problem was he was up against High Veld ribs and chilli biltong.
Tighthead WP Nel had to deal with the Gingerman, the Ginga Ninja from Somerset-West. Nel ended up looking like salty Highland porridge, the kind you can pick up with your hands. Some might call it cold mielie pap, too.
Jonny Gray is the smaller of the Gray brothers. They both seem like strong salmon, with their colouring and flopping about and high energy and fresh young faces, without being that aggressive. The junior Gray was monumental in one mammoth maul drive by the Scots, which may have suckered them into going back to it one too many time, at the death.
The Scottish loose trio was supposed to be a full breakfast, with black pudding, lorne sausage, beans, brown sauce, and tattie scones, but in the end it was just bangers and mash, too easily cleaned off the plate, as the home team lost 13 turnovers, many of them to Thor and Mad Marx.
Greig Laidlaw is shortbread. That’s it. He’s been around since 1736. He’s the perfect accompaniment to a cup of tea. And he won’t surprise you or let you down.
In contrast, Finn Russell is a very modern fusion dish. He is a schizo-sushi roll with a quail egg on top, with goat cheese, basil, pecans, spinach and jalapeños on a bed of Antojito slow cooked shoulder and a pulled pork chilli burrito on the side, with coleslaw, homemade chilli jam and beetroot chutney. He looks like a talented footballer who could play four or five sports, but might need to focus on rugby fundamentals first.
Huw Jones is ‘tablet:’ sugar, condensed milk and butter cooked together until crystalised, with a shot of whisky. He’s a baby-faced killer, with sweet offloads, and delectable lines.
His midfield partner, Horne, is just a vinegar-doused fish mixed with fluffy chips and brown sauce. Punching above his weight; a good man to have in the squad—a bit like Ryan Crotty?
Sean Maitland held off Papier long enough to set Jones and Horne free on their miracle gallop. He’s an Landamp;P drink, taller than you think, and a bit more sour, but effervescent and easy to down.
Tommy Seymour is a Scotch Pie, served hot or cold, it makes no difference. He’s double-crusted, and full of mutton. Ready to eat, carry, throw, or save for later.
Hogg is a battered Mars Bar, which is for some reason all the rage in Edinburgh. Stick a chocolate bar in the deep fryer. Bite it and all of the melted stuff oozes out and sparks a rush of endorphins.
<h3 class="sp-story-body__cross-head">Scotland team:</h3>
Stuart Hogg; Sean Maitland, Huw Jones, Finn Russell, Blair Kinghorn; Adam Hastings Greig Laidlaw (capt); Alan Dell, Fraser Brown, Simon Berghan; Grant Gilchrist, Jonny Gray; Jamie Ritchie, Hamish Watson, Josh Strauss.<b>Replacements:</b> Stuart McInally, Alex Allan, Willem Nel, Sam Skinner, Ryan Wilson, George Horne, Alex Dunbar, Byron McGuigan.
The Toonbola strikes again!
Hastings at 1o and Russell at 12 Kinghorn on the wing. Surprised Gary Graham is not on the bench for a 5 min cameo to confirm him as a Scotland player
Otherwise pretty much our best team I think
Nothing to see here, no citings, no cards.
Cipriani must be ****ing fuming!
Im willing to put £10 on the fact well see Cips in the 6n.
I would be very, very surprised unless there are a lot of injuries between now and then. If he does feature it will be in a very Ej way like as a replacement at the end of a dicking so Jones can say "told you he was rubbish, look how much we lost by now stop mentioning his name every two seconds!"
Is that really the ‘Scotland ‘ team? Pichot doesn’t think so
https://rugby365.com/countries/argentina/world-rugby-vice-chairmans-tweet-causes-uproar/
He does have a point. the other thing I would like to see is players who have played for tier one nations being able to play for a tier two nation after they are no longer being capped for that tier one nation - so Visser for example could now go and play for the netherlands
Some of the "scots" would be very angry to be told they are not scots - Hamish Watson for example. Denton says he was always taught he was of scots descent and always wanted to play for Scotland not SA.
Strauss? Nel? Both have made Scotland their home but are they scots?
Others are a bit too mercenary for my liking.
Doesn't Strauss live in Manchester?!?! I met him after a match last season......sweet frigging lord he's a beast! His hands are genuinely like shovels!
I think the British teams are bound to have a lot of people born in other parts of Britain. Like North for example.