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Aye - cockers has toughened them up a bit but a bit toothless from Scarlets. Worst game I have seen for a long time. thud and blunder!
Scarlets dont have the players to be that great when Wales squad players are away.
Edinburgh are missing around 15 players I think. We even had to drag Barcs out of semi retirement.
edit - Eight missing on international duty, a couple more only playing a half because they are going to be on the bench or playing next week
Yet you can still rely on a number of quality Mercs like Matta, Schooman and a few van der somethings, Scarlets dont have the budget.
Hogg scored a cracking try for Exeter last night.
Started the move and dismissed it...made sure the ball was firmly in two hands!
Wasps were shit today. Tigers were slightly bless shit.
Scarlets have the same budget or very similar to Edinburgh. Its how you spend the money that counts. Want too much even if you are a Scotland star - go away. 1/4 million is being spent on AWJ for a max of 10 games for example. ( plus what he gets paid from the WRU). No one in Scotland earns as much as the top welsh players - that leaves you not enough for a deep squad
AWJ doesnt play for Scarlets, it should be noted also that Wales have won some stuff over the last 15 years Scotland have won?
Shit - its the other Wyn Jones isn't it! You should not have two players with the same name bar a hyphen in a different place. It confuses folk
the lack of budget is an excuse that does not stand up. Its spending your money wisely that counts.
Ospreys finally get a win!!!
the lack of budget is an excuse that does not stand up. Its spending your money wisely that counts.
Its not their money its the WRU's and they have prioritised the Wales team. Like I said swings and roundabouts but at least Wales have won stuff without being able to look after the players Wales wouldnt have donecas well.
Meanwhile Scotlands best player has played this weekend for Exeter and there other best player has ****ed off to France cause he cant stay off the beer.
Indeed -and a deserved one with some fine tries, good discipline and dogged defense.
I thought they were going to blow it!!
I thought they had blown it, worked hard for that win. Well done ‘spreys 👍
The idea that a pro team can win with Gardner and Price playing almost all the 80 is astonishing!! Lydiate is still a monster if people run at him!!
They talk about player safety watching Exeter glaws. Second half some big boys swap and almost immediately glaws 19 instead of supporting his teammate in a drive into contact gives him an almighty shove. Meaning he hits the tackle all out of shape and even harder than he would have done. He also didn't look like he was expecting it.
Its a current bug bear of mine, pushing your own players into the tackle and supporting players binding before contact. I thought at least one was illegal but both should be.
No Makko for England this weekend; he’s had to return to Tonga for family reasons.
Well that escalated quickly, 7 red cards!!
Irony is not dead!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/51550491
The team who has made a specialty about being "clever" at scrums and who has a coach to coach "cleverness" at scrums complaining others cheat!
That game with all those red cards/ handbags they should just call it off when it gets to that stage. 0 points each. Everyone goes home and the fans get their money back on the tickets.
The team who has made a specialty about being “clever” at scrums and who has a coach to coach “cleverness” at scrums complaining others cheat!
What now? They have a coach in addition to the normal scrum coach(es)? And I can't say that I've noticed Wales being any more 'clever' at scrums than anyone else.
TJ hates Gatland, just let it wash over, he clearly has failed to realise that Wales were a very clean team under Gatwards and gave away very few pens.
Adam Jones - the master of "cleverness" at the scrum! I am still smarting from a 6N game a few years ago when the wales scrum clearly conned the ref into giving penalties when its the welsh that were cheating.
Oh - and for what its worth I don't decry Gatland as a coach - just I dislike some of his methods and tactics
Adam Jones – the master of “cleverness” at the scrum!
He's not part of the WRU coaching team, is he?
Adam Jones – the master of “cleverness” at the scrum!
Hasnt played for Wales for about 5 years has he?
I am still smarting from a 6N game a few years ago when the wales scrum clearly conned the ref into giving penalties when its the welsh that were cheating.
Must be cheating because they beat Scotland!
I don’t decry Gatland as a coach – just I dislike some of his methods and tactics
So other than his methods and tactics what else is there, his hair style?
Do you have an opinion on his methods and tactics he's currently employing with Waikato?
Wales team to play against France:
Wales: Leigh Halfpenny; George North, Nick Tompkins, Hadleigh Parkes, Josh Adams; Dan Biggar, Gareth Davies; Wyn Jones, Ken Owens, Dillon Lewis, Jake Ball, Alun Wyn Jones (capt), Ross Moriarty, Taulupe Faletau, Justin Tipuric.
Replacements: Ryan Elias, Rob Evans, Leon Brown, Will Rowlands, Aaron Wainwright, Tomos Williams, Jarrod Evans, Johnny McNicholl.
Looks good to me. North has taken a lot of stick recently, but I don’t have a problem with his playing, I just hope they replace him if needed.
All the games are difficult to call with any degree of certainty this weekend. I’m hoping for a home team win in all games 😁.
Moriarty over Wainwright is a fair call, I think Wainwright will be a better player but seems a bit below his world cup performances. Tomos dropping out at 9 needs to learn to tackle, when he does that he's above Davies. Surprised Watkin didnt get picked at 13, Tompkins was poor v ireland, allowed his opposite number to over power him he needed to be a bit smarter in defence. North needs to show some form, lose this game and we can go full experimental and bring in Gog Dammit.
Will be interested to see Rowlands get a run out.
France: Bouthier; Thomas, Vakatawa, Vincent, Fickou; Ntamack, Dupont; Baille, Marchand, Haouas, Le Roux, Willemse, Cros, Ollivon (capt), Alldritt.
Replacements: Chat, Gros, Bamba, Taofifenua, Cretin, Serin, Jalibert, Ramos.
France look strong, might be vulnerable on wings Thomas is poor in defence and Fickow is a great centre but could maybe be under pressure on wing.
Tompkins has to face the tank that is Vakatawa, needs to press up fast and go low not try for the hits that failed v Henshaw
Tompkins was poor v ireland, allowed his opposite number to over power him he needed to be a bit smarter in defence.
The technicalities are beyond me, but I (who has never played) would presume it might take a few games to settle into the way Wales play? I presume that training is quite different to actual play, in that however much you try to predict what the other team might do, the realities can surprise you - which if correct, with the way France are playing could be scary!
This was interesting:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hUzabD1UY30
Ps with regards to Tompkins, he did appear very ‘hyped’ during both games, obviously really keen to do well. I presume he’ll relax once he’s played a few games more - I’ve not seen anyone else mention this, si I may have imagined it.
I’m going:
Scotland, France, England
40% Italy (Scotland 60%)
48% Wales (France 52%)
56% England (Ireland 44%)
If Wales and England win, the competition will become super exciting!
The technicalities are beyond me, but I (who has never played) would presume it might take a few games to settle into the way Wales play?
True, but he got bumped going high into a much bigger opponent, thats all on him..
Squidge discussed that at 3 min into the video above I believe. As I say, I do not feel qualified to make judgement.
As I say, I do not feel qualified to make judgement.
you must be new here
Squidge discussed that at 3 min into the video above I believe
One instance yes, he went high for Lamours try too. Still I expect he'll improve and its not like Watkin is great anyway!
you must be new here
😁 I am aware that most people in this thread are far more knowledgeable about rugby than me. I appreciate their tolerance in letting me spraff.
I am aware that most people in this thread are far more knowledgeable about rugby than me.
I wouldn't count on it. *waits for AA rebuff*
I think Italy will beat Scotland. Once again Toonie has ignored G Horne who is a very special talent and on fire right now. Brought the guileless Harris back into the team and no strike runners! McGuigan on the bench FFS. Where will Scotland get tries from? Italy are playing a good fast expansive game and look like they will score tries against anyone
Italy are playing a good fast expansive game and look like they will score tries against anyone
Cough 42:0, cough, Italy are shite you should win, Parisse playing though isnt he? Might inspire them!!
I wouldn’t count on it.
Finally something we can agree on!
Italy looked dangerous last week
Italy looked dangerous last week
When France got well ahead and lost their shape/got tired. I'm hoping the later and that they will blow up v Wales, just hope Wales can hang in there for 60mins!!!
Or niggle , work the ref, and hope one of their pack gets a bit elbowy
If Wales and England win, the competition will become super exciting!
Maybe for Welsh and English. Or if you really like dominoes.
No slams, and points difference v Italy to decide placings.
If France and Ireland win it leaves the possibility of two teams going for the slam against each other in the last game of the tournament
Harris has had some good club games making an impact. Jones might be carrying a tweak.
Although maybe Eddie is very clever i cant see it. So now we have Joseph on the wing and persist with no specialist 8 vs Ireland. Sigh.
15 Elliot Daly (Saracens, 41 caps)
14 Jonny May (Leicester Tigers, 54 caps)
13 Manu Tuilagi (Leicester Tigers, 41 caps)
12 Owen Farrell (Saracens, 81 caps) C
11 Jonathan Joseph (Bath Rugby, 49 caps)
10 George Ford (Leicester Tigers, 67 caps)
9 Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers, 97 caps)
1 Joe Marler (Harlequins, 69 caps)
2 Jamie George (Saracens, 47 caps)
3 Kyle Sinckler (Harlequins, 33 caps)
4 Maro Itoje (Saracens, 36 caps)
5 George Kruis (Saracens, 43 caps)
6 Courtney Lawes (Northampton Saints, 83 caps)
7 Sam Underhill (Bath Rugby, 17 caps)
8 Tom Curry (Sale Sharks, 21 caps)
Finishers
16 Luke Cowan-Dickie (Exeter Chiefs, 22 caps)
17 Ellis Genge (Leicester Tigers, 16 caps)
18 Will Stuart (Bath Rugby, 1 cap)
19 Joe Launchbury (Wasps, 63 caps)
20 Charlie Ewels (Bath Rugby, 13 caps)
21 Ben Earl (Saracens, 1 cap)
22 Willi Heinz (Gloucester Rugby, 11 caps)
23 Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs, 27 caps)
still farrell and ford as well!
Parisse moves about as quickly as an eBay auction for a Max Boyce CD. Unfortunately he isn't playing.
I don't get it. I just read Eddies book, where he states his best 2019 defensive set is Farrell at 10, Manu, Slade. Now, I appreciate Slade is coming back from injury but why not start that way vs Ireland who have some great carriers to go at Ford?
Instead we have a weak defensive 10, Farrell-not-a-12 and Manu at 13. I can only think we'll see a repeat of the kick chase, but then with JJ at 11 it rather isolates May as the go-to man and therefore is easy to mark.
This may be a close match, made more exciting by Irelands play but I am nervous for the loss.
I don’t get it.
There’s quite a lot I don’t understand, particularly at the moment.
Before the World Cup, I got the impression a large number of Ireland fans were optimistic they could beat any team on a good day, bar England. At that time they seemed very pessimistic about playing them, perhaps due to the convincing England win in last years 6 nations and that World Cup warm up game. What has happened to England that they appear so disjointed? Ireland fans must be optimistic if not confident.
I don’t understand the different roles and skills required at 6, 7 and 8. Eddie Jones has said, if I understood correctly, that there is no need for a specialist no. 8 anymore. So, why is Curry needing to learn how to play at 8; if it’s taking that much time to learn (I guess he’s not really had long) then isn’t that an argument for a specialist 8?
England supposedly has a huge player pool. Is EJ playing people out of position because they are so much better than anyone else, or because it takes too long to learn the ’England way’, that you cannot just bring new players in quickly?
Well, international rugby / sport is a step up from anything else, bear in mind you are playing the best of the best. It takes time not only to learn the tactics and systems but the pace, guile, intensity and physicality of the game at that level.
George Furbank is a good recent example of that - someone who's excelled at Premiership level but made to look very ordinary / new at International level recently. Some players never adapt. To bring them in too early exposes the loss of the game, but also the team and the players confidence - bear in mind public as well as sporting scrutiny - so I guess there's a careful balance to be had.
I think we always assume a player is most skilled at their day to day position, but some coaches and especially Eddie likes to see things differently. E.G. I don't think Joseph is there as a wing but to add bulk in the defence vs Stockdale & co and we'll see Daly in there for attack. I can only assume that with 6.7 & 8 he wants those players on the field at all cost, and not to remove one for a player thats never played at this level - Donbrandt - again despite his form, We could potentially see Dombrant in the 2nds during Autumn or even vs Italy.
I don't know, perhaps a balance of good international players out of position vs good Premiership (uncapped) players in position is what this is, with Eddie favouring the former to keep the win ratio up a bit.
Thanks K.
Thanks K.
Don't thank me yet, I'm only posting what I'm assuming as I'm no expert because I was in the Backs at 13 and its well known that its the Forwards that play the proper Rugby 😉
EJ seems to have lost the plot since we were manshamed by SA in the final. In 2019 we seemed to have found a way to play that suited the squad and one they bought into. After it failed against SA, it looks like no matter who the opposition is that we will try and play that way. We don’t have monster towards like they do.
Lawes again at flanker? FFS. Why? He’s a good lock but not a great flanker. Curry should be left to do what he does best. He’s not a number eight, doesn’t have the size or power to carry like an eight and offer sweet FA treat from the base of a scrum. The back row doesn’t look balanced.
What we really need are some more locks in the squad. How is Ewels winning another cap? He’s shit. He offer nothing off the bench.
Farrell hasn’t really played well this 6N. I’d have been tempted to bin him off. JJ isn’t a sodding winger and to top it off there’s only two backs on the bench.
Looks like we’re going to try and out muscle Ireland. It won’t work. To be honest I’m starting to think that I want us to get humiliated on Sunday to try and shock Eddie back to his senses although he so pigheaded that he’s carry on (see the Curry example). It’s starting to feel more and more like he’s run his course and it’s time for a new coach but the RFU coffers are bit empty these days so I doubt they can afford to pay him off. Great.
England have quite a lot of players who to my eye (I’m basing this on playing against Wales mostly) burst onto the scene and seem unstoppable/unplayable. I dread us playing against that player, they were so good. And then once they become a regular, whilst they remain decent (and I presume that’s why they remain in the team) seldom maintain that wow factor.
Ps I’d love for Gatland to go to England. Have them play some fantastic, creative rugby, since he’d have the players. And create ‘the greatest rugby team ever’.
England have quite a lot of players who to my eye (I’m basing this on playing against Wales mostly) burst onto the scene and seem unstoppable/unplayable. I dread us playing against that player, they were so good. And then once they become a regular, whilst they remain decent (and I presume that’s why they remain in the team) seldom maintain that wow factor.
I always think England players are usually older and wiser when they first get capped whereas the Welsh players learn the game in the internationals. Take as example Adam Jones a really top class tighthead but it took him years of being out of his depth in internationals to get there and then all the braying tarquins take years to understand that he is now quite good, with Adam it was after he rescued the Lions.
On the itherhand I can only really think of May as being an England player who has really improved under Eddie. He used to be a useless, fast headless chicken who would run lateral a lot into touch. Now he's about the best winger in Britain and Ireland... still looks like a great athlete playing rugby rather than a rugby player but I will grudgingly admit he's good.
I agree AA
Saw an interesting stat during the scotland 10 debates. at 27 russell has 50 caps, at 27 Sextons was really just making the starting spot his own
Dunno how true that is but we certainly end up capping players much younger than other countries - certainly recently. Ickle Jonny, both Fagersons, Russell, G Horne, all capped as teenagers
The problem for Scotland is that if you aren't on a pro contract by the time you're 19 then you aren't going anywhere. Until the Super 6 came along (and we've yet to see how that works out) there was almost no way to make the step from club game to pro.
I think that's why we end up playing so many youngsters.
That gets them into the clubs - I think for the national side its more that this is a good crop of players and if you are good enough you are old enough.
I think English coaches have traditionally been more conservative age wise when it comes to caps.
I think having a large player base fuels this too. It seems hard for our U20’s for example to break into the main room team.
In another note, Wasps are actually winning a game, humping Salarycens.
Edinburgh with another comprehensive win. What is going on? 41:14 on a dreich night
2 penalty tries and ends up 13 v 12 players!
Another good game for Tigers tonight!! 🙄😭
Predictions for this weekend?
Ireland, France, Italy all to win. Note my usual record!
I don’t understand the different roles and skills required at 6, 7 and 8.
6 and 7 generally have the job of being the first defensive positions up to make a tackle following a set piece, and also being first at a breakdown to try to win turnover ball from the tackle. The openside (6) binds on the side of the scrum with the largest area of the field, and tends to be quicker, while the blindside is often bigger and bulkier.
8 has the job of controlling the ball at the base of the scrum and linking with the 9. They are typically big ball carriers so they can pick the ball from the scrum and make a break.
Hopefully that is mostly correct...
Predictions for this weekend?
Ireland, France, Italy all to win. Note my usual record!
I think Scotland will win and will Wales (France have looked good at home but don’t travel well) and Ireland. I want Ireland to do a number on us just to bring some changes in mentality.
Tough calls this week, I'll go with 3 home wins.
Way hey. Here we go. I’ll be happy whoever wins this first match, just hope we get some fast, open play, without loads of errors.
Surely Scotland will be a tad more relaxed and won’t suffer ‘white line fever’.
Scotland looking poor in general, but what a try from Hogg!
The first 20+ minutes was a bit ‘headless chickens’ from both sides. But Scotland are settling down. It’s Hogg’s kicking that impresses me.
Surely Scotland will be a tad more relaxed and won’t suffer ‘white line fever’.
Quite the opposite. Looked absolutely desperate and trying too hard but Hoggs try settled them a bit
Could captaincy be the making of Hogg? Turn him from a decent international to real world class?
Could captaincy be the making of Hogg? Turn him from a decent international to real world class?
Gatland made him a Lion, what more needs to be said.
This is worse than watching paint dry!
This is worse than watching paint dry!
Indeed, it’s got steadily worse and worse. Game over now though.
Mind you, I wouldn’t be surprised now that Italy are down to 14 men, for Scotland to score a couple more tries. Then for years to come we’d hear about their 20+:0 win away to Italy 😂
Hastings poorest display of this year's 6 nations. We need to improve all round and rapidly or France could beat us by a barrow load
To paraphrase TJ.
“Scotland really are a steaming pile of mince”
At 48 minutes Scotland had turned Italy over 12 times and had only managed to score twice.
I gave up and went to wash the windows. Just turned up to see the third try. Things really haven’t improved.
Things really haven’t improved.
What do you think Townsend will say?
Let’s hope the next game is better than that!
Townsend will talk up italy to make it sound like a great win. Will talk about endeavour and fighting to the end.
Gaaaaa - its so frustrating 4 of our best players were uninjured and did not start. Russell, G Horne, Big Ritchie, Jones
#With all that possession we should have walloped them Ended up flattered by the score.
Only positives seeing Watson and Ritchie working so well in tandem.
McGeechan always comes across as a thoroughly nice bloke.
Poor George, he was looking lively. Hope he’s okay.
That could be him done, sad to see.
Wales shite so far!
Wales shite so far!
Really? I thought they’d been good at some things, just France more so.