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OK, tasked with finding a <5KW wood burner for a low energy new build house. Don't want to ruin airtightness by putting a standard floor vent in, so looking for a ducted room-sealed type.
Where better to ask for recommendations?
Small tub of Bum Butter for 'finders fee' (new and unused :?)
Know a passivhaus designer. Will email him later if you want.
<5Kw doesnt need extra ventilation?
http://www.yeomanstoves.co.uk/stove/cl3-multi-fuel-stove/
I've got this which comes in at 3.75kW nominal but in a very not airtight 1885 house.
mine might have come with that option, it's got built in closed combustion, is that what you mean?
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Yes please Bear - aiming for passivhaus sort of standards
jambo - may not need it, but it will draw air from somewhere and affect airtightness testing. I'll add yours to the list, Ta.
B.A.Nana - correct
Oxygen cylinder in the corner?
Ok, so mine is Westfire uniq35, but I suspect most or all the westfire range will be the same closed combustion option. uniq35 is 4.3kw and ideal for a smaller room because it's genuinely 4.3kw rather than just a nominal figure like a lot of the claimed 5kw stoves are (to get past requirements in building regs). westfire do a big range, also look at westfire series1, uniq17, uniq23.
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have a look on [url= http://www.eurostove.co.uk/productrange ]eurostove.co.uk/productrange[/url] looks like a lot of mendips stoves are closed combustion as well.
but as someone has already pointed out, a claimed 5kw or less stove and you don't need to have air duct / vents.
<5Kw doesnt need extra ventilation?
This - it's why pretty much all but the very big stoves are rated such.
Can someone point out where it states that a stove lees than 5kW doesn't require ventilation, because I don't believe that to be the case.
In a house designed to Passivhaus standards there should be no adventitous ventilation therefore you are very likely to have very poor combustion and possible high levels of CO build up.
http://www.stovefittersmanual.co.uk/articles/do-i-need-an-air-vent-for-a-wood-burning-stove/
Depends on how airtight the house is. For some reason, new builds are considered more air tight than older ones according to this.
Not sure I agree TBH
New build houses are very airtight compared to something built more than twenty years ago - thats one reason why condensation is such a problem these days.
Take a look at Rytons or Seldek.
The kit that comes with contura stoves is also very good, it should be available separately.
Our Rais 500 is room sealed and stupidly efficient.
Vent needed if house built from 2008 onwards.
its called direct air supply. iirc, all new builds without that will need an airvent, regardless of size or air permeability. here's a good link http://www.stovesonline.co.uk/direct-air-supply-stoves.html
I can recommend aarow as well made and not too dear. the broseley 5 is a 5kw stove...however, if you're using direct air, there's no regulations on vents/size.
We were told that even with direct air the installer might insist on a room vent (6kW nomimal). Fortunately they didn't when they saw the site. Ancient draughty house anyway.
B.A.nana, is there something between the CD player and the turntable? looks a bit precarious
Our clearview has a duct that goes outside, its an 8kw though so not sure if they have the same option for smaller stoves.
Boba Fatt - Member
B.A.nana, is there something between the CD player and the turntable? looks a bit precarious
just the turntable legs, the deck is clear perspex so perhaps looks a bit strange. It's quite old, don't think they're made anymore.
Not all stoves with a direct duct from outside are room sealed, many of them still draw secondary air from the room and in that case are most likely to need a vent as well as the duct.
A good tip is to check manufacturers installation sheet, if it says it shouldn't be installed in a room with an extract fan then it isn't a room sealed appliance.
You think modern homes are just as draughty as a 1923 design with a flue in each room?Depends on how airtight the house is. For some reason, new builds are considered more air tight than older ones according to this.Not sure I agree TBH
Take a look at Dunsley stoves, made in UK and can be fitted with a vent.
Box - Heta is a name that has been mentioned, and look for stoves with German or Austrian approval as their air standards are higher than ours apparently.
I still read Doc J as saying for a stove in a building with air permeability of >5m3 then a permanent vent of 300mm2 for first 5kw of appliance rated output (taken from Table 1 page 29).
And unlike gas, on solid fuel you work to whichever the standard is more stringent, therefore manufacturers instructions do not over rule BS unless the have special dispensation I believe.
Pick a direct air supply stove that you like, it does not matter the size being more than required you don't have to run it at full blast all the time.
Not sure I agree with that, running our stove cold is a bit of a struggle, it's easy for it to go a bit smoky. Certainly glad I didn't go with the standard room-size recommendation which were ridiculously high.
Correctly sized stove is definitely the best option, or not massively oversized. Burning too cold can lead to deposits in the flue.
As for the German standards, they are much more stringent than ours, the only stoves they accept as being fully room sealed are ones with self closing doors so they can't be used with the door open. I believe this comes from an incident when an elderly woman was overcome by CO while refuelling her stove. I believe HETAS standards are being raised to reflect this but not sure of the details.
I lot of people complain about having to add vents but the safe combustion and risk of carbon monoxide poisoning are the reason vents are required. A fully room sealed stove isn't only safer, it's also more efficient. I'd certainly be fitting one if I was building again.
There will be a lot of different opinions out there about this, mostly based on what the retailer offering the advice happen to sell.
Generally, as already mentioned <5kW doesn't require venting.
However, in a sealed house, you need to get the air for combustion from somewhere, so assuming it's a house and not a warehouse, a good supply of air will be needed, so vented will make a lot of sense to get a good burn.
Makes good practice to run a stove at it's upper end, so best to pick something that won't overheat the house as it is far more efficient. Only downside is small stoves require piddle logs, which is a pain.
Our Burley has an option to run room sealed.
A passivhaus will have a heat recovery ventilation system which will provide the necessary ventilation and enough flow for a 5kW stove that draws air from the room.
Makes a lot of sense, house would smell of fart if it was sealed and the only ventilation was opening the front door a few times a day.
Ventilation via heat recovery won't provide ventilation to a stove. It is a balanced system and only supplys the amount of air it extracts. A poorly commissioned heat recovery system may even create negative pressure making the situation worse.
The amount of ventilation needed for a small stove isn't that large even you don't go room sealed. Probably equates to a fixed open trickle vent
And just a side issue, passivehaus standard isn't the high standard it is made out to be. An A rated house in SAP is likely to be more efficient. The German standard doesn't include thermal bridges in layers and at junctions that are included in SAP. It's still a good standard, just not as superior as the sales pitch would have you believe.
You're right, I'm wrong, Hyrikal. This is important so I'll quote you:
A poorly commissioned heat recovery system may even create negative pressure making the situation worse.
However, it's easy enough to have a heat recovery system with a positive pressure if you have a stove. [url= http://www.envirovent.com/home-ventilation/about-envirovent/useful-resources/positive-heat-recovery-ventilation/ ]positve heat recovery ventilation.[/url]
I've got a Contura 51. Superb scandi quality build, 5kw output and intake vent ducted outside so sealed from the room. Went in just before Christmas and very impressed. Not cheap but I have been very impressed.
Heat recovery systems are way different from providing combustion air for an appliance whatever the fuel.
Seek proper advice.
Totally agree, heat recovery should never be relied on to provide combustion air. The amount of poor advise out there is frustrating.
Indeed positive pressure can be created when heat recovery is installed but with so many variables such as clean filters, user adjustability, power failure etc they are not designed to provide combustion air.
We digress from the original question however. I would presume a pressure test for the dwelling of less than 5, most recent builds are. With that being the case you need 550mm2 of vent per kW. Given that a normal trickle vent is 4000mm, if you have a non closable trickle vent then that will cover you up to 7kw stove. Job done.