[Closed] Road rage video

I think there might be some more to this than we can see.

I'm not saying it's in any way justified but antagonise stupid people in cars and they'll come after you, that's from experience. I reckon for the guy to stop and jump out so quick (and they actually meet three times) he's either being making plenty of hand signals at him or they have history.

It's pretty appalling that they haven't pressed any charges though. That assault is completely and utterly damning evidence and yet nothing? Christ.

hmmm - from what I can see...

cyclist attempts ill-advised undertaking manoeuvre between van and reversing car. ends up cutting in front of van from undertaking position.

cyclist obviously set up for confrontation with helmet cam and stupid little compressed air horn.

hey presto - idiot van driver rubbed up the wrong way

100% avoidable

not quite clear to me why the bike went past the parking car before the van could - he'd chosen to "filter" and then his way was blocked. IMO it was the van's road first, not the biker

Also, getting pwned by a oompaloompa ? 🙄

[i]IMO it was the van's road first, not the biker[/i]

Agreed. However, Grown ups simply don't behave like that when something annoys them. The problem is allowing children in men's bodies to operate heavy machinery. Make 'em ride a bike until they can pass an adult test of some description and then they'll be allowed to drive a car. 😉

It's pretty appalling that they haven't pressed any charges though. That assault is completely and utterly damning evidence and yet nothing? Christ.

would be interesting what the longer term consequences are though. The guy's business works with schools - a caution for assault would have show up on his CRB, I'm not sure what a 'Local Resolution' is so whether that would show up or not I'm not sure.

IMO it was the van's road first, not the biker

the van didn't have anywhere to go though - except half a car length to a queue of more stationary cars. The cyclist was filtering past him and might have surprised him by doing so but it wasn't scoring any advantage by it.

Oh yeah, the oomploompa was in the wrong for overreacting. I just wonder whether biker was doing "something" to make the van wait while he pulled out in front of it

sadly extreme vehicular tetchiness is pretty much standard human behaviour, isn't it ?

In my head* I'd like to think that if it was me, the moment a driver jumped out of the car at me, I'd jump off the bike, stash it out of the way and tidily incapacitate the driver before he took his first swing.

All of these kind of videos seem to end in a bit of ineffectual handbags followed by the lycra-crad biker sitting on top of a mangled bike whining for the police. surely your average cyclist must have a decent bit of strength, determination and short-burst anaerobic capacity over typical white-van-man?

*in my head I said. I'd probably sh!t it too....

You'll never win unless you go toe to toe with twunts like that! He'll just keep doing it to everyone who marginally upsets him until someone puts him clean on his arse!

Why didnt the cyclist just pummel him? Taught him a lesson, the **** wouldnt do it again.

I think there might be some more to this than we can see.

So what? I agree with others that the initial riding of the cyclist where he goes on the inside of the van and gets stuck behind the parking car is pretty poor and does inconvenience the van (even if the van was only driving up to the back of the queue), but that doesn't excuse the subsequent behavior of the van driver at all - if anything I'd argue that behaving in that way due to that sort of provocation (or maybe hand gestures if there really were any) is just as bad as a completely unprovoked attack.

As for

cyclist obviously set up for confrontation with helmet cam and stupid little compressed air horn.

🙄

I have to admit I hadn't realised the "one bite allowed" rule applied to assault as well as dogs - personally I think I'd have gone for the caution, as that does at least go on his record (and as discussed would screw up his job). It does seem somewhat baffling that he gets credit for admitting the offence given that he only does so when presented with the weight of evidence, having previously tried pretty hard to deny it.

cyclist obviously set up for confrontation with helmet cam and stupid little compressed air horn.

Although thats true. Setting himself up, then acting like a whining little prick when the guy in the van has a go.

Should be ashamed of himself. Not a ****ing roadie, thats for sure. A little commuter bitch.

What would Hinault do!?

Setting himself up, then acting like a whining little prick when the guy in the van has a go.

😕 so only big hard blokes who can handle themselves should be allowed to use helmet cams?

Hinault wasnt tall!

Never pick a fight you can't win. I think that's roughly the core of most books on tactics.

Should have knocked him clean n his retarded arse as soon as he showed any sign of agression.

He would not have been expecting it, as he probably goes through life bullying people, and probably pissed his pants.

However OK have your cam but why in this case, if you were assaulted or threatened and you have sufficient evidence go to the police, if they fail to do their job escalate. But I he should lose the bloody air horn!

Video now at

(I presume the perpetrator, his wife or one of his friends got the original taken down - there's no way this actually breaches youtube terms).

Oh and what's with all the negative comments about the cyclist - what exactly did he do to deserve that?

The guy was riding like a bit of a twit but he didn't deserve that.

Aggressive little shits like that need putting in their place. I don't think it's very fair to label him a whining little prick, not everyone can handle themselves in a fight...I can to an extent and I don't think I'd have any problem with that little scouser...but people shouldn't be looked down upon because they can't.

Gentle folk are what makes the world go round, even if some meek little git annoys you on the road....I think it's utterly shameful to just get out your van and start smacking them. You should only pick fights with other people who are looking for a good fight, not with people who clam up like that.

Some shaved head 30 year old bloke stopped his car and had a go at my old man when we had to pull over because of a loose bike on the back. With things like "****ing come over here so I can slap you mate"...my old man looked a bit shocked...so I get out and scream "Alrigt..you ****"....start walking towards him starng him down... and the little **** chickens out and get's in his car and drives off.

I've had three run ins with aggressive shaved head white guys who've seen a 50+ year old guy in the car and thought they could have a go. Can't stand them, most people are bullying cowards and only fight if they think they can win.

@bwaarp

For what reason have you concluded he is a scouser as he does not have a scouse accent.

Manc? Sounded scouse with the speakers down low! I'll listen again!

EDIT: Headphones, I apologize. Brummie sounds almost like a yamyam to my untrained ears.

Regardless of whether the cyclist was at fault. The drivers response was totally OTT and deserves prosecution regardless of any provocation.

Can't say the cyclist did much wrong, OK slightly impatient but he waited a few seconds after the car reversed in and the van had plenty of time to pull around if he wanted to as there was no on-coming traffic at that point.

WHy couldnt the cyclist simply ride away from the short little angry man?

It is totally obvious he is going to stop , get out and have a word.
He has a passenger , maybe a colleague / family , to impress with his macho ways.

Let him stop and get out the van then turn round and ride off in other direction?

Cyclist did nothing wrong, so WVM needs a talking at by the police for that handbags incident.

First rule is only run if you are sure you can get away. If not stop get off your bike, if necessary pick up the bike and get it between you and the idiot.

Regardless of the final attack surely the bit where he carves in front and opens his door on the cyclist is enough for a due care/dangerous driving shout?

I really dont see the issue I would have made the same manouver. I permanently carry bombers so would have owned him ;). Mr van driver clearly has issues and his actions are shocking. I do like how the bus just sits there watching.

Meh handbags on both sides but no-one deserved a pummelling for it.

SPD shoe swiftly interfacing with WVM's bawbag is what's required there...in theory, of course. Wouldn't condone such behaviour etc.

Brummie sounds almost like a yamyam to my untrained ears.

Yamyam [b]is[/b] Brummie ?

Bloody ridiculous little man!
Absolutely no patience.
See it all the time on lanes round here - I have a right to overtake cyclists, irrespective of other traffic or road conditions.
There is absolutely no reason for the physical assault whatever the rider has done wrong.

Videos been removed again. Someone's obviously getting twitchy..
Sorry embedded video not linking now but it's still there.

I can't see why the cyclist jumps on his horn when the driver goes past?

To me it's 2 massive over-reactions from the 2 people involved, it was inevitable that they were gonna end up in some kind of tussle, even if wasn't with one another on that day.

Well whatever he is he isn't a scouser which is such an easy target and when listened to "with the speakers down low" you might expect someone would like to validate and verify their assumption rather than jump too conclusions.

It doesn't change the fact that the driver was a tool even if the cyclist had agravated him in some way its a lot easier to just be a little annoyed and g about your business rather than starting t use your vehicle as a weapon.

The brummie/wolves accent definitely adds comedy value. Unessacary air horning and way ott violence.
Not sure why the cyclist who is wearing a helmet doesn't defend himself with his fists?

Two people being a bit silly is one thing.

But giving chase and jumping out your car to chase after a person you feel has 'wronged you' is quite another. If you have that little self control its a bit scary.

Silliness is not illegal. Common assault is.

I had a very similar situation a couple of years ago. I had dared to offer an open hand gesture (what are you doing type thing) to a 4x4 driver who clocked me in his mirror, saw me slowly (like walking pace) flittering up the inside at a traffic island queue - then put his left hand down to drive towards the curb. I had to stop and get on the pavement to avoid being driven in to.

He then caught up with me after he had driven the wrong way down a one way street and jumped out his car. I avoided him there but he finally caught up with me, in the end I decided to stop near a bus stop with people at it (witnesses) because the next road I was going on was fast dual carriageway and no way did I want to be encountering him at speed.

He ranted at me while I stood astride my bike asking him calmly to get back in his car. He swung at me and gave me a feeble right hook, which I blocked. I shouted at him at this point again telling him to get back in his car and go away, at this point I got off my bike and this was sufficient to get him to go.

He then proceeded to do a 7 point turn in his 4x4 while I borrowed a pen from a lady at the bus stop. Wrote down his number plate, and the distinctive sticker on his car.

A call to the police, a statement he was arrested and admitted hitting me. He took a caution for common assault. The police didn't even want the details of witnesses they took my report at face value.

I work will people with Learning Disabilities and challenging behaviour. So I'm used to people exhibiting disturbed and or aggressive behaviour. We are well trained in how to manage this safely. Don't get me wrong I'm no hard man, far from it, and I don't like conflict or violence. Also happen to know the law as it relates to self defence and what is reasonable force.

Videos been removed again.

The link I gave is still there, just doesn't embed (I think you realised that, but just to point out for anybody else).

To me it's 2 massive over-reactions from the 2 people involved, it was inevitable that they were gonna end up in some kind of tussle, even if wasn't with one another on that day.

Using a horn when somebody overtakes too close is directly equivalent to thumping somebody? 🙄 I suspect in the absence of an idiot in a white van who drives badly and uses his fists too readily the cyclist wasn't going to get into any sort of tussle at all.

annoying move by cyclist, but not outrageous - should have waited or gone to outside but irrespective of any horn blowing / verbals / gestures - white van man chasing him down, running across road and hitting him is the sort of violent act that is an unacceptable reaction
bus driver was presumably a witness

as to day to day - i try to ride like my hands are gaffer taped to the handlebars - plenty of angry and violent people around who will react and its not unpredictable behaviour - my guess woukd be the guy has history - its in the swagger at the end

The white van driver had already been blocked and probably annoyed by the parking car. Squeezing through then giving him the horn wasn't a wise move; I'd have sat back and waited for the situation to sort itself out. The driver himself is short in stature and short guys are somtimes aggressive - it's called a Napoleon Complex.

So does this guy work for [url= http://weirdnwonderfulltd.co.uk/index.php ]Weird 'N' Wonderful Ltd[/url] or is the info in that youtube video wrong?

The driver was not charged. He was brought in for interview and initially claimed provocation, that I kicked his van and kicked him in the chest. He changed his story when told there was video evidence. He still claimed I kicked him and the van and only after the officer pointed out that she couldn't see any of that, on his solicitor's advice he finally accepted full responsibility.

Because he had no police record and admitted to the offence, under the ridiculous scoring system imposed on the police he was eligible for a caution. As the victim I was given the choice of the driver receiving a caution or I could accept a local resolution, the terms of which that I would receive an amount in compensation and a written apology. I'm far from happy about it but reluctantly accepted the resolution. *I don't think the police are to blame* but the decisions made by Government departments that govern them. This was a violent, unprovoked attack that has no place in society and I'm very disappointed and angry that the driver will not face criminal consequences.

I was cycling along the A435 in Birmingham on 16 March 2013 and the driver pulled out ahead from a shop forecourt, straight into a queue. Held up by another driver making a hash of his parallel parking attempt I filtered through and went into a side road, eventually followed by the van. Due to parked cars on both sides and oncoming traffic the driver could not safely overtake. He passed too closely while gesturing at me and cut in sharp so I used my AirZound. He stopped in front of me and I, not wanting a confrontation, carried on and was almost taken out by his door as he got out.

He then tailgated me up the road. I'm never going to outrun a motor vehicle so attempted a U-turn in the next road where he caught me, landing blows across my back and neck as he dragged me across the road and eventually off the bike to the ground.

It's bad enough that he did this to anybody at all but while wearing the company logo of Weird 'N' Wonderful Ltd to somebody recording their ride, this was particularly stupid.

FP07 KJN: WHITE, 2007 VAUXHALL COMBO 2000 CDTI 16V MPV

[img] [/img]

Logo on his top seems to match the one on the website

I was the victim of an almost carbon copy attack a couple of years ago. Except I hadn't done any slightly dodgy filtering. I was riding along on a quiet suburban road, (short!) bloke overtook too close across double solid white lines over a humpback bridge, as he came over the crest of the bridge he saw a car coming the other way so veered left and hit me.

He thought I'd kicked his car so stopped in the middle of the road as per the van in this vid, so I went around. Heard him revving after me so hopped onthe pavement to let him through. He got out, I was still astride the bike so unable to do anything when he launched himself at me. I fell, legs tangled in the bike, one arm trapped under my body while he punched me in the head and face seven or eight times.

I went to the police with the headcam footage (clearly I was asking to be attacked by using a cam.... 🙄 )

That was also West Midlands Police, and wasn't even given the choice of a caution. It was just "We can get him to write a letter saying sorry, but we won't bother doing any more than that. Also, there's nothing wrong with the driving."

It's an absolute disgrace.

[i]Oh and what's with all the negative comments about the cyclist - what exactly did he do to deserve that?[/i]

No-one has ever suggested he deserved it or it was an appropriate response. The only comments I can see about the cyclists behaviour is that there are things he could have done that would have avoided this confrontation. Personally I didn't think the horn blowing was a problem but he does say something to the van driver at the start and as I suggested, for all we know he was riding down the road making constant hand signals at him.

Yes, he should be able to vent his spleen without any physical retribution, I totally agree, but the point of the matter that everyone else seems to understand is that we share our world with people like this who can't control their anger. You can continue to try winding them up and accept that sometimes it'll go wrong or spend as little time worrying about them as possible.

I don't have a commute but if I did I'd have a helmet cam. There's no shortage of angry people out there with insufficient self control or regard for civilised behaviour. Shame the cyclist wasn't a martial arts type or off duty copper....

Cant see the video was it removed?

The camera gives you balls. You cycle along for two weeks and don't record any incidents so you start to court conflict. When that doesn't work you fit an air zound and then stop and argue with people in cars rather than just keeping out of trouble and letting morons get on with their lives.

edit: Plus, when you have a near miss you rush home to watch the footage, ever so excited that you can show it everyone and on the camera it just doesn't look that bad.

The camera gives you balls. You cycle along for two weeks and don't record any incidents so you start to court conflict. When that doesn't work you fit an air zound and then stop and argue with people in cars rather than just keeping out of trouble and letting morons get on with their lives.

Edit: actually, do you work for west Midlands police? It would explain the daft aattitude.

That was also West Midlands Police, and wasn't even given the choice of a caution. It was just "We can get him to write a letter saying sorry, but we won't bother doing any more than that. Also, there's nothing wrong with the driving."

There does seem to be a trend here. I went to my local police to complain about a driver (the car came too close, I instinctively moved left, which is a good job as otherwise I'd have been hit by the caravan - though it was their insistence that I was in the wrong rather than them when I caught them up which led me to report). My local force is West Mercia, however when they checked on the driver it turned out he lived in the West Midlands police area. I was told that if he was in our police area they'd pay him a home visit, but not worth bothering to pass on to West Mids as they'd ignore it.

There must surely be a means of complaining about your police force failing to take action? Am I correct in thinking that if somebody punched you in the street they'd pay more attention and that it's being a cyclist which makes you a lower life form not deserving of protection?

The Weird N Wonderful Ltd Twitter and Facebook pages have both disappeared since this went round on Twitter earlier...

http://weirdnwonderfulltd.co.uk/
https://twitter.com/wnwltd
http://www.facebook.com/WeirdNWonderfulltd

The original video has been taken down but it's at [url= http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JepRJC1DVCM ]FP07KJN - Road Rage Assault on Cyclist FP07 KJN[/url] too.

[i]You're an idiot. [/i]

Fill me in then fella, why? I before you do that, go search on youtube for Londoncyclist and his ilk and watch them shouting at everyone who they see.

Cant see the video was it removed?

I presume the driver or his wife (who owns the pet shop) complained and got it removed - though it doesn't actually break youtube conditions at all, hence it's been reposted - here's the link I gave earlier (though this one doesn't embed)

www.youtube.com/watch?v=ehqBtcjOIc8

You can continue to try winding them up and accept that sometimes it'll go wrong or spend as little time worrying about them as possible.

Sorry, but that's nonsense. At what point does the cyclist wind up the van driver? So far as I can see, the cyclist is 'just riding along' and from the way his camera moves it's clear he's very aware of his surroundings. The undertake is slightly embarrassing, but nothing more. A decision made on the hoof. No biggie.

Fill me in then fella, why? I before you do that, go search on youtube for Londoncyclist and his ilk and watch them shouting at everyone who they see.

Read my post on my assault. Was that my fault? Do I have an airzound? Do I pick fights?

Ever thought that the only people with cams you notice are the shouty ones? The ones who just quietly get on with stuff don't put everything on YT after chasing down drivers so you don't see them. Likewise, the shouty idiots without cameras don't put anything on YT because they haven't recorded it, so again you don't see them. You only see the ones who are shouty AND have cams do your wrongly assume that every person with a cam is a shouty idiot.

The camera gives you balls. You cycle along for two weeks and don't record any incidents so you start to court conflict. When that doesn't work you fit an air zound and then stop and argue with people in cars rather than just keeping out of trouble and letting morons get on with their lives.

Looking at the channel of the original poster of the video ( http://www.youtube.com/user/BlackCountryBikeCam), he does kind of live up to the stereotype of the camera-toting bike commuter.

The only comments I can see about the cyclists behaviour is that there are things he could have done that would have avoided this confrontation.

Ooh, how about:

You cycle along for two weeks and don't record any incidents so you start to court conflict. When that doesn't work you fit an air zound and then stop and argue with people in cars

They sell those hoodies on their website, so it doesn't mean that angry shorty bloke is an employee, he could simply be reptilian in his own time.

Ooh, how about:

You cycle along for two weeks and don't record any incidents so you start to court conflict. When that doesn't work you fit an air zound and then stop and argue with people in cars

That was a general point Samuri made, not specifically about this video. Although, it's a pretty good description of some of his other videos...

Im not sure horns are a great idea they do atract the wrong kind of attention sometimes but that guy just has the look of someone who would start a fight with anything that moves, he also seems to have lost two carpets somewhere judging by the way he walks 😀

[i]Sorry, but that's nonsense. At what point does the cyclist wind up the van driver?[/i]

Precisely, this is what I said at the start, there's more to this than we know. Think about it. From what we can see, the cyclist hasn't done anything to wind the guy up. We see an undertake of stationary traffic which is hardly likely to cause major offence and then the next step is he blows his horn. That guy was out of his van in a shot. He hasn't suddenly decided to do that, something has wound him up to that point.

And as Mike says, I've actually looked through his other videos. This is what he does. Again, I don't see anything like this as acceptable behaviour towards the cyclist but if you'd researched, you'd see that he does exactly what I said above, he fitted he camera and it appears to have given him balls.

There's more discussion of this incident, including by the victim, at http://www.birminghamcyclist.com/forum/topics/assaulted?id=3004025%3ATopic%3A97062

Driver. Cyclist. Happy to share the road as either.
Why would you have that in your (about me) section of a profile?

something has wound him up to that point.

None of these excuse his behaviour. Totally unacceptable, no question.

I still don't see the relevance of anything the cyclist did. Normal people don't jump out of their vehicle and go and assault somebody no matter what hand gestures they make. Or are you suggesting there's something else we're missing which has been cunningly edited out?

I don't think anyone's denying that the driver's a dick.

Either he's standing on a box or she's about four foot.

[i]None of these excuse his behaviour. Totally unacceptable, no question. [/i]

And I totally agree with this. The point is there are idiots/people who are on edge/don't like cyclists out there and you should avoid coming in contact with them as best as you can in a basic risk avoidance approach.

This cyclist doesn't take seem to that approach.

Precisely, this is what I said at the start, there's more to this than we know. Think about it. From what we can see, the cyclist hasn't done anything to wind the guy up. We see an undertake of stationary traffic which is hardly likely to cause major offence and then the next step is he blows his horn. That guy was out of his van in a shot. He hasn't suddenly decided to do that, something has wound him up to that point.

I can say from personal experience that the van driver's reaction is entirely believable. A small % of people simply have an incredibly short fuse, some of those people will inevitably end up on the road.

Yes, some of his other videos seem a bit OTT but that has nothing to do with this attack.

little angry man ,driving litle white insignificant van, gets angry with fit cyclist.

SHOCKER.

[i]I can say from personal experience that the van driver's reaction is entirely believable. A small % of people simply have an incredibly short fuse, some of those people will inevitably end up on the road.[/i]

Must be a southern thing then. I ride 30 miles a day, every day and while have had many incidents, I have never seen anyone get that wound up that quickly with no provocation.

My experience of living on this earth is if you get involved in handbags with van drivers you need to be prepared to stop and stare them down or run like **** and dont get caught. This bloke did neither.

Looks like the meeting of two dickheads to me. Van driver was out if order and the cyclist has no consideration for other road users as can be seen from his helmet cam that not once does look to see if he needs to give way to other road users just tunnel vision and sod everyone else.

Looks like the meeting of two dickheads to me.

Yeah - see how the cyclist gets stuck into the van driver.

His behaviour was unacceptable. It could have all ended a lot worse.

To be fair though, you could have waited a second more for the parker to park rather than cutting on front of the van. And the guy in the van overtakes you so you slam on the air horn.

Both as bad as each other.

Also can't see the point of dragging the van drivers missus into the argument?

Even if the drivers wearing the company livery of her business?

Even if the drivers wearing the company livery of her business?

Does she use her wedding photos as her business logo? Naming and shaming's all fine and well, but if it's been dealt with by the police, then it's between the police, the cyclist and the van driver. Trying to bring down the womens business is hardly in the interest of the case.

Having had a look at the other videos, the cyclist is not exactly sticking to all the laws of the road either.

Perhaps if cyclists AND drivers concentrated on being less confrontational during one of these incidents rather than having a willy waving competition to see who can get the last word in, they wouldn't become violent or threatening

Both as bad as each other.

Really?! Filtering and using the horn when someone makes a bad overtake is just as bad as chasing someone down, dragging them off their bike and punching them?

Could the cyclist have done some things that would have meant this didn't happen? Yes.

Was he as bad as the van driver? No.

Would any reasonable human being behave like the van driver given the actions of the cyclists? Absolutely not.

We can all be dickheads from time to time.

Not all of us are violent thugs though.

The law is as big an ass as the driver. The driver lied to the police, then backtracked when told of the video evidence. Double guilty, should be banned from driving and sent to anger management course at the very least.

Not sure that the posting of the wedding pic really adds anything, after all as was said earlier he must be standing on a box if its the same guy. I would be surprised if the owner of the shop wants to be drawn into this or would condone this behavior no matter who the individual is. After all if they sell those tops on line it could be anybody not necessarily associated with the business.

if it's been dealt with by the police, then it's between the police, the cyclist and the van driver

What if it hasn't been dealt with (properly) by the police, as is the case here?

Not sure that the posting of the wedding pic really adds anything, after all as was said he must be standing on a box if its the same guy. I would be surprised if the owner of the shop want to be drawn int this or would condone this behavior no matter who the individual is. After all if they sell those tops on line it could be anybody not necessarily associated with the business.

Er, the point of the pic was that the chap in the pic is the chap in the video, the chappess in the pic is the owner of the shop who's hoody he's wearing in the video. Incidentally they also both share a surname. Oh, and the van was pulling away from in front of the shop during business hours. You're right - it could just be anybody not associated with the business.

I agree that a witch hunt against the business is out of order, but maybe she should state that such behaviour is unacceptable from people associated with her rather than try to claim the bloke is nothing to do with her (as she did on the business FB page before closing it).

Is it just me for whom the op's link says "video removed"?

Really?!

Yes, really.

This is just another case of polar opposites with the same "this is my bit of the road and **** everyone else" attitude that escalated into violence.

The cyclist is as much of a dick as the van driver.

My honest opinion going by some of his other videos. Sit and pick it to bits of you want.

No al - try the other video links I've given.