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I can't be alone in now thinking that the name change for the Brecon Beacons, which I was ambivalent about, is now a splendid idea. Massive own goal by the PM.
Am with you. It helps weed out the tossers, by filtering who is getting stroppy about it
I bet he still call Snickers Marathon bars. Bashturd.
He isn't Welsh and probably doesn't speak Welsh so it's not the incorrect name for him to use.
Let's face it, you'd all think he was [more of] a wally if he called Dublin Baile Átha Cliath wouldn't you?
Let’s face it, you’d all think he was [more of] a wally if he called Dublin Baile Átha Cliath wouldn’t you?
But Dublin is in a different country and Wales is part of the country he runs. It would be nice if made the effort to be inclusive.
Did any Australian prime ministers get stroppy about not using Uluru?
Seems a strange ‘ban’ to die on but that’s culture wars for you. He’s a bellend.
It's not like he's renaming the place and refusing to use the correct name. The English name (the language he speaks and, to be clear, they're legally required to use on signs etc in Wales) is still the brecon beacons, it hasn't stopped being that in English, it's just the national park have rightly decided that, as its a welsh place it should go by its Welsh name.
He doesn't speak Welsh so he should stick with the English.
Should he use Wrecsam or Caerdydd?
Dùn Èideann?
Etc.
If he's speaking Welsh and says Rwy'n mynd I the brecon beacons, yes, you're right, but in English it's still the brecon beacons which is sort of the whole point of having a welsh language, Welsh heritage and history. It's not English and it's a right to exist on its own and it needs to be recognised, used and supported.
Did any Australian prime ministers get stroppy about not using Uluru?
It's officially both Uluru and ayers rock in English though I doubt many use the latter these days, I seem to recall quite the fuss at the time uluru was added to the official name and I think that's why it ended up as both but it was 30 years ago and the other side of the world so my memory of it won't be great to say the least.
Double post
I’m definitely going to make more of an effort pronounce it properly now.
The Tories are determined to break up the UK by alienating everyone outside England. Idiots.
It's a double punch really, smart move politically.
Plays to the English nationalists, who'll vote for him. Winds up the Welsh Nationalists, who'll be more likely to vote Plaid Cymru instead of Labour as an eff you to the English.
Win win from Rishi.
The Tories are determined to break up the UK by alienating everyone outside England.
I think you're mistaken. They cgaf about alienating anyone who is unlikely to vote for them. Where abouts you were born is of little concern.
What an arrogant knob he is. I don't much like the name change but then again I don't live in Wales and have nothing to do with the area. Therefore they have every right to change it to whatever they would like. Great way of alienating the welsh by showing that London elite don't care what anyone else thinks.
...it hasn’t stopped being that in English,
Well, if he's talking about the national park then it officially has.
Well, if he’s talking about the national park then it officially has.
It'll be interesting to see how it's actually referred to in official paperwork.
It is very definitely Bannau Brycheiniog in Welsh and has been for a long time. Given by law it has to be referred to in both English and Welsh in official documents, if they drop the "brecon beacons" then it should have a direct English translation in place.
The business entity [of the national park] of course can perfectly reasonably call itself either both or neither. If they wanted to call it Picnic tedi bêrs or Bryniau gwlyb llwm yn llawn o ddynion gyda sachau teithio there's nothing to stop them doing so and not using a translation there of, the government dept though has to accept both.
Most of the point is to "reclaim" the Welsh name, doing that requires the recognition that it has a non Welsh name.
What an arrogant knob he is. I don’t much like the name change but then again I don’t live in Wales and have nothing to do with the area. Therefore they have every right to change it to whatever they would like. Great way of alienating the welsh by showing that London elite don’t care what anyone else thinks.
I do live in Wales, am Welsh, and don't care. He's not alienating anybody but nationalists.
Perfectly reasonable for anyone who wants to to call them the Brecon Beacons, the Brecons, the Beacons, the Bacons, them thar hills, bananaland or schminky mcfinkpants if they so want to.
If anyone takes offence, then they need to get out more 🙂
Bryniau gwlyb llwm yn llawn o ddynion gyda sachau teithio
Quality! That made I laugh.
"Man who gets most stuff wrong proudly declares he's going to get this wrong too"
It's only the national park that has had a name change, not the mountains...
They cgaf about alienating anyone who is unlikely to vote for them.
There are Tory seats in Wales.
For things he has screwed up today his attempts to control the press are a tad more concerning.
Quality! That made I laugh.
I appreciate its an unlikely marketing slogan but stranger things and all...
I’m definitely going to make more of an effort pronounce it properly now.
…bet you can’t type it into Google though when searching for accommodation!! 🤣🤣
There are Tory seats in Wales.
Yup, more in fact than Plaid Cymru, who I have long had much admiration for, especially during the Blair years. And I will always remember Leanne Wood's impressive performance in the TV debates last general election. I have never really understood why Plaid Cymru's social democratic policies have not enjoyed more support in Wales, although I appreciate that these days they have the formidable Mark Drakeford to contend with.
Anyway Rishi Sunak's comment was made in an interview given to discuss issues being raised at the Welsh Conservative Conference which is this weekend. Welsh Tories seem fairly united in their opposition to the name change. It was never an option for Rishi Sunak to embrace the change and claim that he would from this moment on only use the Welsh name. Unless he wanted to piss off Welsh Tories.
Edit: Just checked and Leanne Wood's impressive TV debate performance was in 2017, not 2019. Time flies!
Many first language Cymraeg speakers are naturally right wing and conservative (with a small c) but vote Plaid because of the language issue. Tories in Wales have been trying to build capital with these voters in recent years by woo-ing this vote. The Welsh tories pledging 1 million Welsh speakers by 2050 was part of that effort. London based Tories pulling Cymraeg place names into a culture war makes absolutely no sense in Wales as the party probably most uncomfortable with this issue is Labour - many of whom... especially in the most left wing valleys constituencies are vehement in opposing Welsh language inititives.
The Tory ambivalence to Welsh language spin is a really bad look for their key targets in Wales
I don’t care what people call them just as long as it’s not “The Brecons”.
A couple of people have said this. (In the same way that some people get really butthurt about The Peak being called "The Peaks" (although I've not seen any definition that incorporates the White and Dark Peaks).
So why do you care?
Brecon Beacons? Brecons. It's a nice English shortening tbh. Quite natural.
Because it’s wrong!
The Lake District is an area of lots of lakes*. Hence the shortening is The Lakes rather than The Districts.
The Brecon Beacons are the Beacons near Brecon. It makes sense to shorten this to The Beacons because there are many of them. There aren’t many Brecons; there is just one.
It’s just wrong And it’s weird it’s even a thing.
*yes, I know there’s only 1 ‘lake’
*yes, I know there’s only 1 ‘lake’
Oh, not again........ There a loads of bloody lakes in The Lakes (definition: a large area of water surrounded by land). Only one includes the word lake in it's name. Locally they were called meres or tarns (depending on size and position) - count them..........
Is a mountain only a mountain if it has Mount in it's name?
Just so long as Rishi doesn't call the NP between Manchester and Sheffield The Peaks......
Locally they were called meres or tarns
What's Brotherswater?
Just so long as Rishi doesn’t call the NP between Manchester and Sheffield The Peaks……
He might be a talentless out of touch arsehole, but he's not quite that bad surely....
But there are several peaks* between Manchester and Sheffield no?
Even then there's the light and dark ones, does that not count?
Ahh you mean some nonsense about the tribe of people who [would have been multiple groups not just one] used to live there when the English language wasn't a thing and are best translated to peaklanders - with an s as in multiple peoples - which would mean if it's the land that was their territory peaks' or at least peak's district is probably more correct than peak which would be akin to "John house" at which you would rightly be aggrieved.
Of course it's all broadly irrelevant as it predates the standardisation of modern English spelling by a good millennium and a bit.
*which is precisely why the peoples who lived there were called peak dwellers, they're named for the peaks they inhabited not the other way around.
chevychase
Full MemberBrecon Beacons? Brecons. It’s a nice English shortening tbh. Quite natural.
It's much like shortening "the bike riders" to "the bikes"
Christ on a bloody bike, not this again 🤣
I'm sure most folk on here would argue with their own shadow given half the chance 🤣
I don’t much like the name change but then again I don’t live in Wales and have nothing to do with the area. Therefore they have every right to change it to whatever they would like.
Again, for the hard of thinking, the ONLY change is to remove the English name as the main title when referring to the Park. Bannau Brycheiniog has always been its name in Welsh, its just that historically English was forced onto Welsh children as their first language, to the point of being punished for using Welsh, in much the same way that children used to be physically abused, ie punished by having their hands struck if they used their left hand, which was considered unacceptable to the teaching establishment.
I don’t understand why you don’t like the name change, as it hasn’t changed, just the emphasis has changed.
I guess you don’t much like the change to Aotearoa from New Zealand either, just those uppity Māori throwing their weight around to piss off the English colonials…
Once again chevy throws them out and you lot gobble them up like hungry carp.
Ahh you mean some nonsense about the tribe of people
No, I really didn't. You're trying to rational the not very rational. Having lived there for years, only visitors add the 's'. There's only one peak anyhow - Chrome Hill. Everything else is a rounded lump, but the Moor District ain't selling.
Bannau has a much nicer sound than Beacons or Brecons imo.
Shutlingsloe doesn't like the way this thread is moving.
"I'm going to keep calling it the Brecon Beacons"
I wonder if he's ever had reason to refer to that area in the past or if he ever will in the future outwith the renaming saga?
I assume hel continue with Bombay and Peking etc.
The snag with the "the mountains name hadn't changed they are still called the Brecon Beacons" is that the mountains are called the Brecon Beacons, Black Mountains and the Black Mountain. It's become a colloquialism to refer to all these as the "Brecon Beacons" over the last 40years since the national park was established as shorthand for all the park area. That "Brecon Beacons" shorthand for all the mountains in the park area now makes no sense.
Parkhouse Hill is looking at Chrome Hill's new status with envy
Peakhouse Hill, Chrome Hill - it's all just the Buxtons.