[Closed] Right knee pain - running out of options to help?

Have you had you foot and hip checked to make sure they are not part of the problem?

Purely anecdotal and my pain (in the same place but probably not the same league) used to come on after an hour of cycling. Went when I put the seat forward and learned to spin. Right foot pointing a little outwards helped too.

I am a little bit qualified to comment on this given I suffered for around 11 months with this and it pretty much put an end to my modest running career (sorry)
I wouldnt suggest surgery and in my case I did what you have done in terms of treatment and a Cortisone injection. I even had an MRI scan and there appeared no issue but I had depilitating pain 10 minutes into every run. Not 9 minutes, not 11 minutes but within a few seconds of 10! I kid you not. I had no other pain and when I stopped the pain stopped immediately, no ongoing soreness or stiffness,
I think with hindsight it just cleared up on its own. I am not saying that there arent treatments out there and good practitioners etc but I suspect mine just ran its course and settled on its own.

I am not saying its all bad news just that you are not unusual in the length of time that you have had the injury. I would recommend you try to find a good "sports focused" physiotherapist and go form there.

I've been "enjoying" ITB since the beginning of December, it's been slowly getting better since January or so - treatment has been physio (painful massage), stretching, weights and ibuprofen when it was at its worst.

Basically there are three stretches that have helped:

Hamstring
[img] [/img]

Psoas:
[img] [/img]

Most import, glute:
[img] [/img]

In this last one you hook the ankle of the bad leg over the opposite knee, and pull on this knee (you thread one arm under the bad leg).

The important thing is to be consistent, every day once in the morning or after exercise, and once in the evening before bed.

Thanks Guys, I have just reposted on the same topic!

Unforts pain is still there after a key hole surgery 4 weeks ago. I didn't want to do it & kind of regret it but the consultant recommended it. At least I know that there is no structural damage - meniscus or cartilage tear (are they the same thing?)

I think I need to properly rest, loads & loads of ice & some good physio

Cheers
Geordynige

Have had your leg manipulated?

(My wife had similar, she stumbled on the stairs and had to get physio, a fantastic benefit of the manipulation as treatment she received was the pain from running & cycling (but spookily, not skiing) she previously experienced also disappeared)

Go and find yourself a good Osteopath mate, we deal with these types of symptoms on a daily basis, you need some hands on work not just stretches recommended by most physios.

To add, Longmover is right, quite often the dysfunction is often to do with posture or other parts of the body such as pelvis, hips, knees, ankles and not just where you are experiencing the pain. You need someone to look at you as a whole not just treat the area alone.

surfer - Member
I am a little bit qualified to comment on this given I suffered for around 11 months with this and it pretty much put an end to my modest running career (sorry)
I wouldnt suggest surgery and in my case I did what you have done in terms of treatment and a Cortisone injection. I even had an MRI scan and there appeared no issue but I had depilitating pain 10 minutes into every run. Not 9 minutes, not 11 minutes but within a few seconds of 10! I kid you not. I had no other pain and when I stopped the pain stopped immediately, no ongoing soreness or stiffness,
I think with hindsight it just cleared up on its own. I am not saying that there arent treatments out there and good practitioners etc but I suspect mine just ran its course and settled on its own.

I am not saying its all bad news just that you are not unusual in the length of time that you have had the injury. I would recommend you try to find a good "sports focused" physiotherapist and go form there.

+1. I've basically given up running after many years due to really bad ITB pain.
Used to run for years and years (club, school & county level). Gave it up a bit after uni and started cycling instead (which I think has tightened my hips & glutes massively, as well as weakening my hamstrings).
I've tried several times for years to get it sorted - it was less expensive when i had private health care though work. About the only thing I didn't try was cortisone and surgery (thought cortisone was only a temp solution and the knee specialist I saw thought there was no need for surgery)

As with surfer's case, mine is very time dependant - it used to be 22mins to within 30s or so; didn't matter on terrain/pace or anyting else. Just time.

I think that using a foam roller and lots of stretching may help me, but I never seem to find the time on a frequent enough basis to sort it out. Have you tried this?

Great stuff guys, will get checked out by an Osteopath - any particular type?

Any decent Osteo should be able to help you, try and look for reviews and recommendations locally and just make sure they are registered with GOsC, it is like any profession really, there are good and not so good. If you are anywhere near Stoke On Trent you could pop into our clinic.

Excuse my ignorance, but what does an osteopath do? I've considered going to see one quite a few times to see if they could help, but after numerous attempts at getting my ITB issue sorted through various physio's and specialists I have always tended to baulk at throwing more money at a problem no one has been able to correct.

Is it a case of massage? Analysis of body mechanics to look for the source? Crunching bones about to get them re-aligned type stuff? Could be tempted to have another go, if I could get a bit more info about how they could help.

Some sports physios are also Osteopaths.

So basically we treat the whole body as a unit and look at bio mechanics, musculoskeletal, life style (such as profession, hobbies) also looking at medical history and basically looking at the patient as an individual as opposed to simply treating one specific area of pain which is quite often the way some other manual professions treat.

The basis of the treatment is various soft tissue techniques like MET (Muscle Energy Techniques), NMT (Neuro Muscular Techniques) Articulation of joints - all of the above is aimed at improving blood flow and drainage of fluid. We also look at innervation (nerve supply) to muscle groups to help release pain or blockages. There are more extreme techniques like manipulations (HVT's or High velocity thrusts) which help align structures to help improve healing.

Sometime Physios do learn some Osetopathic techniques but might not have been training in Osteopathic medicine which is why they cannot call themselves Osteopaths, they must be registered to the governing body GOsC, we do however have many physios at our University who are training for their qualification. (4 to 5 year degree to qualify)

Hopefully all of the above makes sense but if you find a good one it will be money well spent.

Cheers

Mark

^ Interesting. Thanks.

Might look for a local Osteopath and have a chat.

Not much to lose, prices seem to vary between £35 - £70 depending on location. It is a process though and can take more than one treatment to see long term benefits, hopefully you will find someone who can work with you in a partnership. They quote a months treatment for every 12 months that someone has had an chronic condition, more acute issues can be treated a little easier.

Thanks Franco,
Really great advice. I am getting a bit down about the whole knee issue as I have now seen:-

3 different physio's
1 Rheumatologist specialist (Addenbrookes NHS)
1 Knee consultant (Addenbrookes NHS)

None of them have been able to identify the real problem or where the pain is coming from!!

Yesterday I went back to the first physio that I saw, from Progess (Spire Health) - so £50 for 30 mins! & the best he could come up with was taping it up using Kenesio tape.

I have found a Osteopath in Cambridge - http://www.stockleyosteopaths.co.uk/?page=About_Stockley_Osteopaths

Thanks again
Nigel

sounds like a patella imbalance, light and controlled leg extensions with heels together and toes facing ouwards (ten to two feet) every 4 days sorted mine out, HTH

geordynige - Member
Thanks Franco,
Really great advice. I am getting a bit down about the whole knee issue as I have now seen:-

3 different physio's
1 Rheumatologist specialist (Addenbrookes NHS)
1 Knee consultant (Addenbrookes NHS)

None of them have been able to identify the real problem or where the pain is coming from!!

Yesterday I went back to the first physio that I saw, from Progess (Spire Health) - so £50 for 30 mins! & the best he could come up with was taping it up using Kenesio tape.

Sounds annoyingly similar to my problem and lack of a solution.
Sounds like you are close to Cambridge?

First NHS physio recommended taping under my knee, which made no difference. I got the impression she would have recommended this for any knee related ailment.
I then tried a recommended physio in Cottenham who said I had 'lazy quads' and stuck those pads on that twitch your muscles to 'reactivate them'. Didn't go back there.
I then went to a physio on Regent street in Cambridge who I was referred through through my work BUPA scheme. He reckoned the ligaments in my knee weren't holding my kneecap in the right place, did loads of painful massage and gave me some balance/stability exercises to do. They made no difference.
Then tried a physio recommended through a Cambridge running club. He gave me some stretches and exercises that I did for weeks and weeks but there was no sign of improvement.
Gave up at this point.
Got the name of a physio from a mate of mine who had an injury sorted just before a marathon with great results, so decided to give him a go. He reckoned it was caused by tight hips as well as weak glutes and hamstrings (he seemed to make the most sense in terms of what he was telling me). He gave me 6 weeks of exercise & stretches which I did religiously, slowly built my running up and again it made no difference once I started getting up to 22mins of running.
Decided to try & sort it again a while later and was referred thorugh work healthcare package to the private place in Impington (Spire? Used to be Bupa) and I saw a consultant who is apparently a knee specialist. She did ultrasound on my knee and reckoned it was inflamed even though I hadn't been doing any running, so it must be quite a severe case. Sent me for MRI scan which showed up nothing. Had gait analysis and some temporary orthotics which didn't help and gave me really bad blisters (this wasn't included in the private healthcare package). Ended up paying around £200 for that. Consultant recommended cortisone injections as a temporary solution, but I didn't see the point in that. I then had several sessions of physio with a bloke who is/was physio for Middlesex Cricket Club (can't remember his name) who did some deep tissue massage, joint manipulation around my hips and gave me more strengthening exercises as well as stretches. Again, did them religiously but made no difference.

Gave up at that point and haven't tried since....
Hope you have better luck than me!

Might give an osteopath a ring - I found a local one advertising the other day.

Thanks Lawmanmx,
Could you send me a link to a video of the exercise that you are doing?

Cheers
Nige

Hi Stumpy,
Yes live in Cherry Hinton and used to ride with CAMMTB until Sept last year

Cheers
Nigel

Hip and core strengthening.. That's what helped mine. Will try and dig out a good exercise vid I used on YouTube. Also those stretches posted by mogrim are good.

I'm no expert but have had lots of sports injuries from running, football etc and had knee ops, seen osteopaths/sports injury therapists along the way.

In my experience, with one particular hip injury that just wouldn't heal despite seeing a variety of professionals who seemed clueless.....I found rest was the one thing that worked. I could run but not sprint flat out, so I gave up football for a year, stuck with running, did the Snowdon marathon and a year later went back to football and never had the problem again.

Therefore, my advice would be to try that before anything else. Obviously very frustrating, so try and find something you can do for 6 months and see if that helps.

Thanks Rockape,
I haven't ridden a bike in earnest in over a year so feel that I have really rested the knee.

I also had a good 4-6 weeks of doing nothing at all when my new baby arrived so doing nothing didn't really help either.

I have looked for you Nige but can find nothing of any use, all I can say is if you do a standard leg extension it doesn't help your problem, what you need to do feels very unnatural compared to normal leg extensions, you need to put your heels together but point your toes away from each other as far as you can (ten to two feet) if you know what I mean? then lift the (light) weight up so the weight is on your leg muscles up to full contraction and hold for a long second then lower half way back down (maintaining the weight on your legs for the whole set) .... if your toes are pointing directly up to the ceiling then you are doing it wrong and it just won't work, your feet Must be errrm Chalie chaplin style as the exercise is performed, Lol
Hopefully that is understandable to you pal 😉

[i]I also had a good 4-6 weeks of doing nothing at all when my new baby arrived so doing nothing didn't really help either.[/i]

Oh dear....that is very dispiriting! Just thinking how the body works...I just can't see how stretching would be of any help, but then I suppose you need to try everything if rest doesn't work. 🙁

Just a thought have you tried using a knee support?

I am convinced that the issue with my IT band is tightness in my hips/glutes.
If I sit on an office chair and put my right ankle on my left knee, it is fairly easy and my lower leg sits almost horizontal.
If I do this with my left ankle on my right knee I stuggle to get my ankle up there in the first place and then when I do, my lower leg won't sit anywhere near horizontal; my knee is pointing right upwards and there is no way I can get it down. All the tension and resistance feels like it is around the outside of my hip & into my butt.

I have mentioned/shown this to numerous physio's over the years and it always gets dismissed, but there must be a large imbalance somewhere to cause this lack of symmetry.

I have tried to do a prolonged course of regular stretching/foam rolling and strengthening, but struggle to fit it in around other committments and keep doing it. But, I do wonder if that is what I really need to do to solve it!

Have exact same issue. Physio not helped.

Had a cleanout op last summer without any benefit. Surgeon said I have a bruised bone, but also problem with the femur so knee cap rubs on it.

Suggestion to me was "pain management" i.e. dont do anything that hurts. At the moment, that's being awake so I am going back to see the surgeon next month (hopefully).

Its coming up to 2 years without any forward progress and as im only early 30s cant get a replacement knee (which might otherwise be a solution).

Chin up for now and hope it improves.

It is all well and good everyone trying to help you and advise various stretches that helped them but the fact is we are all very different in terms of our bodies and how they work, what works for one probably will not work for another. Your injury is specific to you based on your height, weight, muscle tone, bone length, posture, profession, habits etc etc.

You need to go and see someone who understands the bio mechanics of your body and what is actually causing the issue not just giving you exercises or various different treatments like ultrasound for the symptom, you also need to reset your expectations that seeing a specialist or manual therapist only once or twice will fully solve your issue, it may take many months of treatment until you start to see positives. Our bodies will change the way they work by compensating for certain regions that are weak, muscles will change their whole make up and flexibility the longer the dysfunction exists.

I hope that helps.
Mark

^^

That's sound advice. If you have a chronic problem expect a long time to sort it out. Just think long term and try and stay positive.

Thanks everyone, it looks like an osteopath might be my last option. The biggest annoying thing is I don't know how it started in the first place. I didn't get any shooting pains it just got gradually worse after a really good summer of riding last year. My last ride was at an XC race in Essex, sport class where I finished 6th out of about 60 riders. The pain was slowly starting but I could still ride but thought it worth going to see the physio and it has got gradually worse ever since.

I haven't ridden further than 3 miles since last August and I am sorely tempted to see what a 20 min ride would feel like?

Mark, what should I be looking for in an Osteopath as I do not want to waste any more money on treatments with a person who doesn't know what he is doing or is going to help me?

I suffered for ages with ITB pain in one leg and went down the route of MRI, which also showed a little wear of the joint (age). A surgeon's answer is normally surgery, which I declined. Instead I looked at my saddle position. It was too high and far back, causing the tendon to rub on the outside of my knee and hence the intense pain after an hour or so of cycling.

A TP foam roller to massage just the one leg, and moving my saddle forward 1.5 cm and lower to 0.88 of my inseam, cured all ills and I have ridden 30,000 miles without any issues since. I ride 200 miles a week now, and ITB pain is the least of my concernts.

If it is a chronic problem, it is likely that you are continually doing something to cause the inflammation. Try position first and see what you find. It is a lot cheaper and easier than surgery!

Hi Nige, What area do you live in ? I am guessing Cambridgeshire way based on your last link.

There are 3 or 4 Osteos in that region, Phillip Stockley looks like he has many years of experience and discusses the knee on his site, it looks as if he is a keen cyclist too so could be a good place to start. It's hard to say who is good without referral and reviews, training 25 years ago is much different to the modern age. If you were Cheltenham way I could help you out as I know the area and who's who.

Perhaps sound him out by giving him a call in the first instance.

Hello all. I have a similar issue, with me it starts to manifest itself at around an hour nor so's worth of cycling and slowly gets worse and worse until I can't even turn the pedal.

I saw a physio who reckoned that my flat feet were causing an imbalance in my posture that was putting pressure on my back and leg muscles, that in turn were causing the pain I was experiencing. As a result I'm off to get some implants made at Salford University (you can get their students to do it for a tenth of the normal cost).

I'd certainly recommend a good Osteopath, as said above they treat the body as a whole. I've been seeing one on and off for a few years regarding my back (slipped disc 10 years ago) and he's great. Hadn't occurred to me that my knee issue would fall within his remit as I've always associated them with backs.

In fact I'll probably pop along to see him before I start messing around with my feet!

Good luck guys, hope everyone gets sorted! Given what people are experiencing above, I'm counting myself lucks that I sometimes get up to two hours in the saddle before the 5h*t kicks in 🙂

I am convinced that the issue with my IT band is tightness in my hips/glutes.
If I sit on an office chair and put my right ankle on my left knee, it is fairly easy and my lower leg sits almost horizontal.
If I do this with my left ankle on my right knee I stuggle to get my ankle up there in the first place and then when I do, my lower leg won't sit anywhere near horizontal; my knee is pointing right upwards and there is no way I can get it down. All the tension and resistance feels like it is around the outside of my hip & into my butt.

I have mentioned/shown this to numerous physio's over the years and it always gets dismissed, but there must be a large imbalance somewhere to cause this lack of symmetry.

I'm pretty much the same - right ankle on knee is easy, the opposite not so much. But despite that I'm inclined to agree with your physios - as mentioned above I've had problems with my ITB, but it's the opposite leg...

I have tried to do a prolonged course of regular stretching/foam rolling and strengthening, but struggle to fit it in around other committments and keep doing it. But, I do wonder if that is what I really need to do to solve it!

It's certainly the first thing I'd try - it's a lot cheaper than a physio / osteo / whateverio, and certainly preferable to surgery. But you really do need to do it regularly.

I am convinced that the issue with my IT band is tightness in my hips/glutes.
If I sit on an office chair and put my right ankle on my left knee, it is fairly easy and my lower leg sits almost horizontal.
If I do this with my left ankle on my right knee I stuggle to get my ankle up there in the first place and then when I do, my lower leg won't sit anywhere near horizontal; my knee is pointing right upwards and there is no way I can get it down. All the tension and resistance feels like it is around the outside of my hip and into my butt.

I have mentioned/shown this to numerous physio's over the years and it always gets dismissed, but there must be a large imbalance somewhere to cause this lack of symmetry.

Blimey - that sounds exactly the same as me (except the other leg) - I thought I was just a freak and I've just been putting up with/managing the resulting knee pain myself.

This thread has convinced me to go and see an Osteo/sports massage type person and see if I can sort it once and for all 🙂

I hate to say it on this forum but am thinking of getting a road bike under the cycle to work scheme and paying to get set up properly and slowly starting to do some flat miles

mogrim - Member

I'm pretty much the same - right ankle on knee is easy, the opposite not so much. But despite that I'm inclined to agree with your physios - as mentioned above I've had problems with my ITB, but it's the opposite leg...

norbert colon - Member

Blimey - that sounds exactly the same as me (except the other leg) - I thought I was just a freak and I've just been putting up with/managing the resulting knee pain myself.

Well that's certainly interesting!! I thought it was just me!

mogrim - while I would love to trust in the physio's judgement.....everyone I have been to has given me a different 'reason' for the problem and none of them have cured it. I dread to think how many hours and hours I have spent doing their suggested stretches & exercises to no avail. At one point I was doing 100 reps of 5 different exercises on each leg, plus a load of stretches every day. It definitely strengthened my legs, but made no different to the IT band pain.

Yeah, I should dedicate 30 mins or so a day to doing some foam rolling and stretching. I have tried and it works for a couple of weeks and then I end up not doing it once, then twice and before i know it I haven't done it for a week. Will perhaps try to get something arranged and do it at a regular time - maybe first thing before work.

@geordie, I have been following this with interest. I agree starting slowly is key with some easy miles, when I bust my ACL the doctor recommended flat road riding (no standing to pedal) as a way to get started. Don't buy a new bike just get some hybrid/road tyres. Given what you're said you definitely need to take it slowly to start with as your knee doesn't hurt during excersize (ie say stop) but some time after. I recall I started with 5k, then 7, then 10. Little and often, eg ride one day rest the other.

Hi Mark,
Yes live in Cambridge and yes already spoke to Stockley as he is only down the road from me. I think I will give him a try as you say he is a keen cyclist but also as you say he may be a bit old school but if it works then all good!

There are so many different possibilities and structures that could be causing this issue, again I know everyone here is trying to help and give their advice based on their own experiences but believe me NO injury is ever the same, NO human being is ever the same, the way we heal is always different.

All of the following must be considered as part of the bigger picture - Hip flexors, adductors, hamstrings, quads,priformis,tfl, itb, glutes, psoas. Let alone various ligaments, tendons, fascia. Then looking at your calf muscle (Soleus, Gastroc) down to Achilles, ankle, foot, SIJ joints and probably other structures that I haven't even mentioned. Lower back muscles spring to mind, erectors etc.

Honestly, take my advice. Find a good manual practitioner, it doesn't matter if its a physio, osteo, chiro or whatever but find someone who can help you and actually listen and understand your issue, not someone who is looking to make a quick buck. Again, be prepared to be in it for the long run, not just a few treatments. You effectively need someone to reverse the effects this dysfunction has caused over a sustained period of time otherwise you will never solve the root cause, most people at this point opt for surgery which is not always the best answer.

Hi Mark,
Thanks for your advice, I have tried 3 different Physio companies in Cambridge and none of them have really helped. If anything I think they may have made the situation worse.

I will go and see Mr Stockley and explain my history and hopefully build a relationship with him so he can help me get back on my bike.

I miss riding my MTB so much

Having had patella tendonitis for a year and calf problems which have stopped me running for four years i started a pilates class in January of this year, it was cycling specific and small classes, so had lots of one to one. The results are no knee pain, I'm back running (half marathon next month), and much less back ache on the bike; my glutes are stronger and iITBs much looser.
Pilates really concentrates on your core stability, with lots of stretching, i can feel my core stabilising when I'm working hard. Its not a quick fix, but the results are amazing. Would recommend but make sure you get a good teacher.

Hi Nige, good luck buddy, I feel your pain (excuse the pun). I too had to give up a sport I loved (football) at 31 due to a hip problem so I appreciate what it's like to not be able to do something you love because of your body but I'm confident you can find a fix with the right help and advice. I'm hoping mountain biking will be easier on my hip, new bike arrives tomorrow so fingers crossed.

Right knee pain? If you drive a lot look at that too. I get right knee pain if I am driving a lot (not necessarily when driving) and not now I am getting the train to work.

Clover, you have hit another point that I didn't mention! I did get a new car in July last year and this coincided with the increase in pain. Unforts current job is business dev't so lots of driving is required

We'll guys, a small update. I have booked to see an osteopath & am also seeing a Physio who specialises in Pilates. Am doing a one to one session and then joining her class once a week

Also,seeing the knee consultant again on Fri so will let you all know how I get on

Thanks again for all the help & encouragement, it has been a tough year 🙂

My ITB cleared up years ago but I did suffer from tendon issues in my ankle for months. I saw a local osteopath who was great. It took a while to resolve but the treatment made sense to me, the Osteopath is a runner/cyclist so understood what I was talking about and eventually resolved it.
I have seen a number of experienced and highly qualified physiotherapists over the years with mixed results. The Osteopath will be my first call when I next experience an injury

I went for a road bike fit recently. I was v impressed as he spent a large chunk of it checking me over for any kind of biomechanical "vagaries", range of movement etc.

My bike was pretty close to ideal for me already (maybe more luck than judgement) so no changes at all beyond cleat position and shims; but with these kind of problems it can give you a bit of an "MOT" bio-mechanically as well as helping get your bike set up to accommodate it or help address it.

Good luck

Bit of an updated again if anyone is interested.

Went back to the consultant at Addenbrookes last Friday to go through my arthroscopy results. Knee is fine!!! No tears, no synovial issues, no inflammation......

....so the diagnosis is - ITB Syndrome - which was the initial diagnosis a year ago!!

....lessons learnt here guys - don't have surgery unless absolutely necessary!!

...so back to the ITB exercises and see the new Osteopath tomorrow to see if we can get this fixed once & for all

Thanks for your advice, I have tried 3 different Physio companies in Cambridge and none of them have really helped. If anything I think they may have made the situation worse.

Have you tried Tom at Core Cambridge? He has worked with professional cyclists.....

http://deltamsk.co.uk/category/all/

Going to see these guys tomorrow !!!

lessons learnt here guys - don't have surgery unless absolutely necessary!!

Ask them about training aids like the one below or a wobble board

[url= http://www.66fit.com/66fit-advanced-wobble-balance-cushion-pump-dvd-35cm.html ]link 66fit[/url]

Yes went to see Tom at core Cambridge which is now called MSK - he was really good and he reckons that it is all related to the nerves in my back!!

He also said that the arthroscopy was a complete waste of time so yes a lesson learnt - do not have surgery unless you necessarily have to!

I am hoping that in a few weeks time I will come back and tell you my knee pain has gone 🙂

Could foot flaps say what his name is as Tom asked who he was recommended by?

All interesting stuff this. I'm off to see my physio tomorrow to try and sort out _another_ bout of ITBS on my right knee. It's great this, the gift that keeps on giving, especially ten days before a half marathon. *grumble*.

In the past I've been told that it is tight, but weak hip muscles and been told to foam roll, stretch and strenghten up the hips/glutes (not in that order). I guess it worked, but I've had a few weeks off this and when I went out for a run last night, it was painful from about 6.5 miles onwards. The last mile was, to be honest, really quite tough and I am now hoping that emergency 'brufen will help me out.

I'll see what my physio says about it tomorrow, but it looks like I might be binning the half. I just don't think that I will be able to finish it as I am now.

I blame working in an office.

@ Willard
Get your physio to look at your body as a whole and not just the knee!!!

I went to see MSK yesterday and they believe my knee problem is caused by trapped nerves in my back!! He also said that the key hole was a complete waste of time!!!!

Only time will tell but a big lesson learnt is to find a physio you trust and get them to assess your whole body & not just the knee.

I could be being led down another wrong path but at least this guy & the company seemed to know what they were talking about.....