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I have decided that I need to cut down quite significantly on beer as I have been slowly ramping up on wet days versus dry days culminating in a 2 week holiday, and then holiday drinking levels continuing when I returned home.
I would say I have gone from 3/4 dry days a week down to 1/2 and I am talking completely dry not a sneaky half or a G&T. So this is the situation, it isn't bordering on a visit to AA I realise that, but I am finding it harder and harder to not grab a beer each evening. A habit is definately forming. Tonight I can't have a drink as I have to pick wife and daughter up from the airport at 11pm but I thought about it at 5.30pm when the last meeting finished.
I then decided that distraction was the way forward so went to fit a new dropper post on the bike, I then realised that bike maintenance time was an activity that involved me, planet rock, and a beer or two, so an association has built there as well. There are other situations which have become associated with a beer such as a post ride beer, a Thursday night beer etc. etc. I am sure you all get the picture.
What I don't need is for everyone to tell me how great they feel after ditching the booze. I ditched the booze for 100 days back in 2018 as a challenge with a mate, I didn't loose any weight, and I didn't feel like a new person, I did have more cash though 🙂 What I am asking is what people have done in the past that has been successful in breaking the associations. I just want to find that reset switch so the moment I relax in the evening it isn't done by reaching for a beer.
I almost wish I liked tea rather than coffee but I really don't like the stuff. I tried AF of many varieties but it just sucks.
Any real time successes?
Don’t have it in the house, then you need to make a conscious decision to have one, rather than just being able to lift one willy nilly.
Don’t have it in the house, then you need to make a conscious decision to have one, rather than just being able to lift one willy nilly.
This.
When you say have a beer are you having a beer or several?
Don’t have it in the house
When I saw guys buying single cans of beer in a supermarket I used to think it was a cost issue but now I realise it's a control issue. That's what I do as if it's in the house I am likely to drink it
Exeter Universities Food Trainer App worked for me, basically just gets your brain to associate alcohol with something you dont 'select'
Takes a couple of minutes once a day, its free, you dont really have a lot to lose by giving it a shot.
I am now clear of having it in the house as I consumed the final 3 last night so stage one complete.
In answer to the “is it one or a few” question. It varies but I wouod say one usually leads to 2 or 3 as it breaks the self control that was minimal in the first place.
I will download the app and give it a try.
Thanks for the tips, keep em coming peeps.
Have you considered switching to wine? I did this for a year or so. Great for my waistline. Thing is, tolerance creeps up and before long you're having a few bottles of red instead of a few ales.
Or you could substitute for weed? Not so great for your waistline.
Have you tried enough of the AF ones? I only drink real beer twice a week now and very happily have the odd AF during the week. But because it’s not as delicious as real beer it breaks the habit weirdly…
Best AF beer I have tried is Guinness, or if lager then Freedam or Heineken. All the crafty ones are a bit shit.
kill two birds with one stone by making sure Thursday is alcohol free so that you're fresh for Friday.
Go for a bike ride on Thursday evenings so as to avoid post ride beers.
How many units a week? I would suspect you might well be a high functioning alcoholic from the description you give. I have known a few
Only a suspicion and i could easily be wrong
Not much help in the short term but I've noticed that as I've drunk less since I stopped being a student my tolerance has gone down which means I drink less so my tolerance goes down more
It's a virtuous circle if you can get it started.
None in the house and AF stuff worked for me. The trick with the AF stuff was to get it really cold and put it in a nice glass so it at least looked like beer.
Not having it in the house is a good option. You might fancy a beer but the effort if going to buy it will out you off. I like trying various beers as I'm primarily in it for the taste. As a result, buying just a couple of different cans or bottles with the weekly shop is about my upper limit. I'll still have 2 or 3 pints after an evening ride with the mates but that's every couple of weeks. Not having much in-between times means I feel the effect of them and so don't normally drift past that intake
Like you, I've drifted in the past to drinking weekday evenings, or when the intended 1 beer becomes 2 or 3 ...
A mental determination to just drink weekends (Fri, Sat, Sun) has helped me. Will also have a couple of beers after a night ride with mates, but as that tends to only be once every 3 or 4 weeks, doesn't massively affect the 'drink only at weekend' plans.
AF has helped sometimes. It partially satisfies that desire for something cold, refreshing and beer(ish) tasting, eg when pottering about doing bike maintenence mid week. And as someone else said, because it's not all that nice, or rather it's a pale imitation, the desire to follow with another few is much reduced. Erdinger is pretty good, as is Guiness, both of those, for me, would suffice if I wanted beer but decided not to drink alcohol.
Not having it in the house helps. So, by all means buy what you'd intend to drink on Fri/Sat etc. But once it's gone, don't buy any more until you decide its your next drinking night.
Good luck.
The easiest way is just to stop buying it. If you haven't got it you can't drink it.
The not having it in the house works for me and sugary food, if there were biscuits I would eat all the biscuits.
However, I bought a pineapple since my resolve is much stronger in the supermarket so I'm having fruit instead.
Maybe try making smoothies? Taste nice and are good for you
How many units a week? I would suspect you might well be a high functioning alcoholic from the description you give. I have known a few
I used this to describe myself to a friend when talking about it but after a bit of research we decided I hadn’t reached that status yet. The key is I am not dependant on it, I have just got into a habit of associating it with more situations. Units vary from 10-20 spread across the week. Last week was a bad one at 21 which kicked me into action.
Yes, I have tried many AF beers and surprisingly ice cold Heineken AF was probably the best. I prefer IPA’s or craft beers/lagers and just can’t find anything in those ranges that deliver anything better than Heineken. Haven’t tried Guinness AF yet though
Get a job driving a bus load of kids to school. It stops you drinking the night before anyway.
Works for me.
It sounds like the not in the house rules may work for you. Then just buy one or two beer on a day when you fancy one, don't fall for the multi pack deal or the I'll buy 6 pack because that will do Friday and Saturday night.
It's easy for me to say as I like trying loads of different beer so buying one / two at time is no bother as I am not interested in the big packs of Corona, Stella etc.
Another tip mate told me was when he goes to parties he now takes a pack or normal beer and a pack of AF. Then alternates his drinking, that way he doesn't get drunk the same but still feel in the drinking groove so to speak.
I am not sure I would benefit from the mixing of AF with normals. I really really like the flavour and mouthfeel of the good craft beers and I think it would be just as effective to have a glass of water in between, also a lot cheaper 🙂
Tonight has gone surprisingly well just being distracted by this chat, so thanks all for humouring me. Tomorrow night I will see if I can steal a bus and ferry people from stop to stop.
I finally admitted I have an intolerance to it, if I drink 1 I get bloated and gassy, it ruins my sleep and I spend loads of the next day in the bog. Not an option for everyone, but as much as I love beer, I prefer not feeling like crap!
As for habit forming, you are likely like me, you can break the habit, you just have to want to enough.
Do you drink much water / squash / etc during the day?
I find that slaking my actual thirstiness with a pint of squash helps with the craving for the post-work beer. Doesn't eliminate it but reduces it, especially the tastier ones like the Bottlegreen/Belvoir ginger and lemongrass cordial rather than bog standard orange or ribena.
You could try mixing af and real beer.
Just buy 1 of each, then blend them together in a pint pot.
That way you end up drinking 2 pints of say 2% beer of an evening and thays it.
If that doesn't sound like a plan try posh soft drinks. San Peligrino is nice, add ice and lemon and its lush after a ride. Or traditional lemonade or ginger beer, sugary though so domt go mad on them.
I binge drink, so 10 to 12 uniits once a week but got fed up with the 24hr recovery afterwards so have stopped totally for now.
Alcohol is addictive even on a casual level, in my experience.
If I start drinking regular, I crave it. Doesn't matter if its in the house or not, I'll be itching to go to the shop and make excuses to go - maybe I need some bread... Even just a couple of glasses of wine at the weekend, I'll crave them through the week and count down the days.
If I've not had any for a while, it doesn't bother me, no temptation or interest in it whatsoever. It's more than a habit. If you want to reset I would suggest stopping completely for at least a month.
very similar to you OP. i'll go through phases where i'll only have one or two beers in he week (obviously excluding weekends) to having 3 or 4 beers every night
tried AF free beers and tired pretty much most of the more easily available ones - they were all pretty grim. the only ones that were ok were big drop brewery (the IPA tastes fairly indistinguishable form 'normal' stuff) and the best larger AF i found (well 0.5%) was the Guinness open gate brewery 'pure brew'
what o found worked best, but isn't really 'not drinking', is buying low alcohol beers - theres a few decent 2-3% beers around. one or two on an evening that you feel like a beer ticks the boxes, but it keeps the units down, didn't effect my sleep and wasn't fuzzy headed the next day. however it kind of goes against the 'not having them in the house advice (which does work) as you indefinitely have to buy them online / in advance
Similar to the OP, found I was drinking more nights of the week than not drinking. So since 1st June stopped drinking apart from special occasions.
We don't have any booze in the house which helps. I did hanker for a beer at the start, mostly prompts similar to yours. To address that I bought some AF beer, which is good enough to scratch the itch but after one or two you don't get the moorishness of real beer.
Did drink on holiday a couple of weeks back and found that I didn't enjoy it as much as I used to, so something is obviously working.
Have you tried Brooklyn special effects? It's by far and away the best AF I've tried. Ymmv.
I'm very interested in this post. Have a similar relationship with beer. Me and the missus don't take much encouragement which means we're bad for each other.
We now don't drink mon-thurs nights. It's a rule we stick to. Helps massively to not have it in the house. Occasionally have a hankering for a midweek beer and allow ourselves some AF. Usually Heineken. Perfectly pallettable if you get it ice cold.
One of my other hobbies is home brew. So always have around 90 bottles kicking around at various stages of conditioning. Was always difficult to not just grab one when I kept a suppmy in the fridge. I keep them in the spare room for first two weeks conditioning then move to the shed for storage. They need 24hr in the fridge to dissolve the co2 prior to drinking so, again, don't have them in the house. I pop them in the fridge thrurday night so they are good for the weekend.
Fizzy water and fruit juice
Tonic, elderflower cordial and ice ( recommendation from in here, really good 👍)
I did dry January years ago and it was a great way to break the habit. A month off, and it would probably have been the most I hadn't had beer for 25 odd years, showed me how much better I felt mentally and physically and how much I would try to fit beer into most free time. Going out for dinner - few beers, bike ride - few beers after, sitting down to watch something - few beers, few days of work - have a beer. Anyway it broke the back of the habitual stuff and whilst I'm not tee total I drink less in a year than I used to in a month and I feel I appreciate it a whole lot more.
As for af beer, I like erdingers but I don't drink them to fool myself that I'm replacing an alcoholic beer, it's just a different drink. They actually taste very nice after a bike ride.
Reducing Beer Intake – Any Tips?
Have a glass of wine instead !
The Erdinger labels always make me smile as they have ‘Isotonic Drink’ on them 🙂
Lots of good support here people thank you. Will invest in some soda water/tonic water/posh cordial and try and beat the temptation to buy gin to go with it 😉
The only solution I've found is, do not have any booze in the house. It's so easy to have drink if it's just a few steps away. Not so easy if a walk to the local offy is required.
I've recently been introduced to Kombucha, they're very refreshing after a ride.
I find that having beers in the house meant I'd get in from work and have one with my supper, then probably another one or two after that.
More or less broke that habit now. So it's another vote for don't have beers in the house.
johnjn2000
Full Member
Units vary from 10-20 spread across the week. Last week was a bad one at 21 which kicked me into action.
5-10 beers a week? Jebus someone phone the polis the man's out of control! 😆
Eventually you’re going to have to bite the bullet and quit the booze completely.
I’ve never met anyone whose been a long term drinker and not a jakey.
Current thinking is that drinking alcohol causes inflammation of the brain, possibly resulting in Parkinson’s disease, etc.
Alcohol is like a bullet ricocheting through your body, affecting all kinds of functions.
It doesn’t just go in and out discretely.
It might take years of abstinence for your body to regain its equilibrium.
I don’t know if alcohol-free beers will break the link with your cravings.
Hopefully this doesn’t sound too patronising, but I hope you can find something of use, here.
On the plus side, you’re aware of that it’s a problem, and quitting the booze will have as much of an impact on your cycling as quitting smoking.
I was always quite amazed as a young adult, just how detrimental alcohol is to one’s fitness.
Very best of luck👍
Keeping a cube of blu-tak or a fidget spanner to hand might help with the cravings.
You’ll need something to do with your hands. Some kind of musical instrument?
Maybe it’s the just the fizziness that you crave? Plenty of of chilled soft drinks, maybe with a scoop of ice cream.
When you’re that ‘gassy’, there’s less room for beer.
Whenever anyone quits the drink, they find they have a craving for sweet things.
So, I’d keep on top of dental hygiene. Tongue brushing too.
I’m guessing it’s a self discipline issue for you OP.
15 years ago I decided to not drink on weeknights and unless there’s a celebration, holiday or something similar I stick to that.
Set a rule. Stick to it.
I rarely don’t have any beer in the house and it makes no difference to me.
Eventually you’re going to have to bite the bullet and quit the booze completely.
Many of us manage to sustain a low intake. Plenty already posted on this thread.
Similar to yourself, I was drinking 1 or 2 most nights, never really more and can't rember last time I was drunk or had more than 3. Only drank Cider with an odd gin, no other spirits or wine. It was a habit I had got into and the weight was creeping up (you know, that bag of Crisps or biscuits with the drink).
Back in April I got covid and couldn't get out to buy drink so that broke the habit for me. Drank again for 1 or 2 weeks but asked myself why I drank and decided to just stop for a bit to loose some weight. I have not had a drink since April (including a holiday) and not missing it. I may drink again (I have 6 bottles sitting untouched) if I want but for now I am happy without and dont see the point of it. TBH I am a bit scared if I start again it may become a habit again and I don't want that plus I am saving a few bob and lost some weight.
I found drinking a bottle of water on the way home from work stopped me being thirsty when I got in and reaching for a thirst quenching one. I also got into tea leaves. I liked picking a nice bottle of cider and sitting enjoying it and relaxing, as I say it was a habit. Now I like trying different types of tea and the ritual of brewing a nice cuppa instead as it distracts me from thinking about a drink but still gives me something to do (a new habit I guess).
What on earth is a "Jakey"?
Scottish for alky,
Think junkie but for booze
What on earth is a “Jakey”?
Scottish slang for a homeless alcoholic. Think drinking Tennent's Super in the park.
i recently gave up booze. Not due to drinking too much, but because i became a weapons grade bellend if i had one too many.
I poured away my last cans of cider and pretty much havent touched it since (i have had a few lager shandys).
I do enjoy the 'hit' of a nice cold one still, but get that from the AF beers out there. Obviously we are all different, but i have tried a few now and they are all pretty good. AF Stella tastes better than regular Stella (not hard... i hear you say).
But in your quest for help, i just echo everyone else, dont have it in the house. Just buy one or two cans when you do go shopping. Get some AF or an alternative 'special drink'. Keep yourself busy during the periods of time when you do get the cravings.
Could have typed the OP out myself a few months ago.
As a regular drinker I was getting through a fair amount - couple of cans* five nights a week often a third or a spirit top up on two or three of those nights. Started realising how much of a problem it was when I was starting to have a can while cooking or a nip of rum before bed on the dry days.
I’d started to move away from the spirits quite well earlier this year and had knocked one weeknight almost completely on the head. Then covid came along and stole my taste for a month. Alcohol tasted universally awful for a while and I managed to kick my consumption into touch. Now It’s a Friday, Saturday and occasional Tuesday thing and as often as not it’s only one decent craft thing. So yea, get covid, loose taste, problem solved 😀 But seriously, not having beer as an option is what really solved it for me.
(Apart from the issue where the only thing I could taste is cadburys dairy milk so started unhealthy consumption of that instead)
* My cans are generally 440ml & over 6%
5-10 beers a week? Jebus someone phone the polis the man’s out of control!
I know it was said in jest, but the attitude that makes this sort of comment a joke is why as a nation we have such a problem with alcohol.
Have you considered switching to wine?
I did the exact thing as this.. For me all it did is switch one dependence for another.
I'll blame it on my wife who is a teacher, she'll grab a bottle on her way home from school have one glass and I'll finish it off. Like the OP said it's not at a level for AA, but at times depending on my mental state can easily kick start weekday binges. Summer months are not too bad as I can distract myself by doing stuff. The long dark winter evenings are a different matter and its difficult to break the cycle.
Thanks for posting this up as I suspect it affects quite a lot of us in the forum.
I'll give the app a go.
’m guessing it’s a self discipline issue for you OP.
15 years ago I decided to not drink on weeknights and unless there’s a celebration, holiday or something similar I stick to that.Set a rule. Stick to it.
I rarely don’t have any beer in the house and it makes no difference to me.
This. Jeez there are some right handwringers on here.
I’ve never met anyone whose been a long term drinker and not a jakey.
What's a jakey?
Edit: Answered above. Honestly it's this sort of pious bullshit that doesn't help. The issue not whether you're dependent on alcohol either physically or mentally, but whether being so has a negative effect on your life.
OP have you tried not worrying about it? 10-20 units a week is nothing to be concerned about, and if it helps you wind down of an evening and you enjoy it then what's the problem?
Lots of great comment thanks, and the one about 10-20 units not being very much, well I had a look at the units in the types of craft beers I drink, and it is more like 25-30 on some weeks. Not that it is a competition of course! I also think that the comment about why we have such a problem as a nation is spot on, we really do have a poor relationship with alcohol. It was apparent when I was in Beligium with work and I was handed the beer list, I had to do everything in my power not to drool. So much nice stuff but a lot was 8-10%ABV or more, when I pointed this out to the Belgian colleagues they didn't understand my issue until we got into the way we drink in the UK. That first pint in the pub hardly hits the sides on its way down, in Belgium it would still be sat there with half left after 45 mins.
Anyway, off topic, not the point. Going to try filling up on gassy water and cordial, and some adult soft drinks over the next few nights and see where that takes me. I would love to reach Friday night (coaching session in FoD during the day so beer needs will be strong in the evening) and then have 3 beers, enjoy them, and then not have another until one day next week. I am so glad I didn't ever get into smoking as a youngster, I would have been hooked for life!
Apply the same attitude as one should do to everything in life, why go to all the effort of drinking it now when I can put it off until tomorrow. 🙂
Find something else to fill that particular void. It sounds very trite but I quite like a fruit tea of an evening.
I am very strict on myself - I only drink Friday and / or Saturday because otherwise I could happily drink a few beers most nights. And if I did that I’d get fat and it’d cost loads, not to mention the adverse health effects of all that ethanol.
I think this thread has demonstrated a lot of normalisation of borderline harmful drinking and ‘risky’ / dependent behaviours that could easily slip into problem drinking. So well done for recognising it.
Have you tried tonic water and ice ? I find this useful as you don't drink fast like beer
Also keep trying as many different AF beers as you can and keep going back to the ones you previously discounted, by the time you've drunk lots of them you may well adjust to the taste. Keep in the fridge and drink from a glass definitely improves them, lets face it warm beer that has alcohol in it is also minging
google AF beer club, they do selection packs
Cider?
Jokes aside Could you try moving on to stubbies
Do you like Lager (does anybody, really?)
https://www.tesco.com/groceries/en-GB/products/292915750
These little things are:
Cheap (4 quid for 10)
Weak (3.9%)
Small (250ml)
Not so nice that you need to have one after another
But they are also:
Nice enough (or tasteless enough)
Wet
Refreshing
Fill the hole in your hand as easily as anything else.
well I had a look at the units in the types of craft beers I drink, and it is more like 25-30 on some weeks.
That's still not a lot in the grand scheme of things. By all means cut down if that's what you want, it won't do any harm and will help your wallet, but it's not something to be particularly concerned about IMO.
Is there anybody else close to you who may be doing similar and would be willing to join in with reducing intake?
With 2 or more of you working together to reduce intake then you've got a team effort in keeping each other on track. Alternatively, use this thread as a challenge to report back on how you are getting on. Almost holding you to account but without unnecessary pressure.
What on earth is a “Jakey”?
Someone's never read an Irvine Welsh novel 🤣
5-10 beers a week? Jebus someone phone the polis the man’s out of control!
I know it was said in jest, but the attitude that makes this sort of comment a joke is why as a nation we have such a problem with alcohol.
It was said in jest, yes (though I appreciate it might not come across that way). I'm not one for telling anyone what to doing with alcohol, but I just thought it funny in the context of the drinking culture that surrounds me. Me, personally I'm a binge drinker, will easily tan the OPs amount and a shed load more on a session, but that's just the culture about here. Albeit one I've partaken in less and less as the years roll by.
Ultimately with the OP, you'd struggle to class it as problem drinking tbh, but what the OP has recognised is they are developing a taste for it. I've always been lucky in that I've never developed an addiction and take it or leave it is easy for me. But, if you are doing something every night, it's a habit that has potential to develop into something a bit more serious.
So yeah, fair play to the OP for recognising that. But you sound like you are far away from being an alcoholic, but the signs are there if you have the urge, so no need to be too hard on yourself, just work towards changing the habit. (Reason you don't see benefits others do when giving up alcohol, is more than likely due to the quantities other people are drinking.)
I know all about the urge, auld man also has it, but mind you he'll easily put away the OPs 10-15 units a night 7 days a week. He's an auld school irish drinking grafter though, you know the types, my granda was the same, still working and drinking beyond retirement, it's just a way of life and will continue till they drop.
But aye, fair play to the OP, a little can turn into a lot very quickly, given the tolerance levels for alcohol go up very quickly. So something to definitely raise an eyebrow at. And good you've noticed it before you develop a serious problem.
I would recommend a book called atomic habits explains how habits are formed and can be broken.
To break habits you need to understand the 4 phases, cue, craving, response and reward.
To break the habit you need to make the cue invisible (not having beer in the house), make the craving unattractive and difficult (having to leave the house to get it) and make it unsatisfying (the health benefits might be one, extra cash, losing weight, enjoying riding more)
[ looks at boxes of Tiny Rebel just inside front door ]
Step one is probably to stop buying in lots of beer.
[ to be fair to Kelvin past who ordered those boxes, this delivery is more than half alcohol free (reduced at Tiny Rebel at the mo, and tastes good) ]
The stubbies plan is a good one though. You used to be able to buy 2.5% ones, and they were ideal for "just having one" on a warm evening. Not seen them in the shops for a few years though.
seems a bit odd that folks are saying 20 plus units a week isnt bad, when the NHS say anything over 14 units a week is a risk to your health.
Feels a bit like willy waving?
Dont get me wrong, drink as much as you like, but be under no illusions its bad for your health, wallet and beyond.
v7fmp
Free Member
seems a bit odd that folks are saying 20 plus units a week isnt bad, when the NHS say anything over 14 units a week is a risk to your health.Feels a bit like willy waving?
Not really willy waving just that the 14 units a week is miles away from alcoholism or reality for a lot of people.
Buying a hardtail frame as a project bike build has helped me. I can't afford bike parts and spend money on beer. Beer is a spendy thing to piss away.
I am glad you corrected the number of units. First step is to be honest about the amount you drink. I calculated what you said as being 30 units a week and that along with what you said about your attitude gives me concerns about the effects on your health. Its certainly into physical damage territory imo.
As above i have known a few high functioning alcoholics. Ones now dead at 50 and one is now into a serious physical and mental health decline and still denies being an alcoholic.
seems a bit odd that folks are saying 20 plus units a week isnt bad, when the NHS say anything over 14 units a week is a risk to your health.
NHS limits and reality are far apart in my experience. Yes I have no doubt that over 14 units is bad for your health. So is working, walking down a city street, driving a car, eating shit food and all manner of other things.
Feels a bit like willy waving?
Nope just honesty. Most people vastly underestimate or lie to themselves about how much they drink rather than the opposite. I know exactly how much I consume, what the potential health effects are and how much it costs. I also know the benefits. As always it's a trade off.
Oh... that tonic water and ice tip is also good one for the summer... I do that one as well.
Evening drinks that aren't alcohol are helpful. Some people swear by a green tea in the winter... that one didn't work for me. Hot Vimto does to an extent. As does AF beer (see above).
I calculated what you said as being 30 units a week and that along with what you said about your attitude gives me concerns about the effects on your health. Its certainly into physical damage territory imo.
@tjagain, Damn these alchemists that have made beer much more desirable than the Fosters draft on offer when I was younger. Someone gifted me a 4 pack of Fosters last year, no way at all I would bother buying beer if it was all like that. It's these lovely thick and juicy craft beers like Pupa and Stobe Sap from Vibrant Forest, sooo nice.
But to your point on the units. Yes it has crept up to an unacceptably high number to me since my 2 week holiday, totally agree with you regarding the health implications. Pre holiday I think I was probably on 10 units on a good week and 20 on a bad week coming down to 5 or zero if I had a race. So it isn't a regular thing, just need to catch it now and get out of the habit due to my addictive nature. Thanks for the input, you sound like you might have some healthcare background?
@dazh - my apologies for misinterpreting.
I do wonder why you would dismiss the NHS guidelines or feel they are far from reality?
And you are absolutely right about all the other risks that we take on a daily basis. It makes you wonder why people smoke, eat rubbish food or drink too much when its clearly bad for your health (physical and or mental).
And just so there isnt lost context, i am by no means looking for an argument or to dismiss your comments, i am genuinely interested in your outlook on things.
Although we do digress from the OP's immediate concerns about cutting back.
I do wonder why you would dismiss the NHS guidelines or feel they are far from reality?
I don't dismiss them just think a limit which not many people adhere to (I don't know the numbers but personal experience tells me this) is a bit of a pointless guideline. Maybe I just hang around loads of alcoholics but I don't know anyone who drinks less than 14 units per week who isn't already abstinent.
i am genuinely interested in your outlook on things.
I think my outlook on things is to be honest about both the pros and cons and try to put them into context. It's a personal thing though so you can't apply your own experiences to others very well. For me, at this point in time and for my entire adult life if I'm honest, drinking has more positives than negatives. That equation will no doubt change as I get older, but even if I have health problems then I'd have to weigh them against a lifetime of generally positive experiences. It's not as easy as 'drinking is bad, therefore I should do less of it'. I wish it was!
Dazh - fair play, that makes total sense and clearly works for you. I wish my mindset was a bit less worrying about tomorrow and living for today.. but thats a whole other can of worms!! 😀
I run a shop that's attached to the house so alcohol is always available, but I've not had a (alcoholic) drink in years. I had a charity ride at the end of the summer 2015 and reduced my alcohol in the run up, then thought I'd see if I could continue to Christmas, made it through Christmas so did the same to new year and it stuck ever since. I guess I'm saying some kinda goal helps with the mental process.
I agree with TJ, my first thought was that you could be alcoholic. You don't need to drink all the time to be dependent on something so the fact that you have X dry days per week and Y wet isn't conclusive either way, but that you need to measure dry days versus wet suggests to me that you don't have a healthy relationship with alcohol. If you are counting dry days to help justify wet days then you might have a problem, for example "I've been dry for three days, I deserve a drink" - I'd bet you spent those three dry days looking forward to your reward, that's not healthy. Not making assumptions here, just giving examples.
The stigma attached to dependency of any kind is reducing every day, I think the younger generations are far more open to seeing it for what it is rather than either a badge of honour or something to be ashamed of.
@tonyd, I think you have a good point here. It is almost like in the younger days of late teens to early 30's you would be going out on a Fri/Sat to meet friends and a bi-product of that was beer. Now, through the introduction of children, more serious work responsibility, mortgages, bills, and bike parts, it seems to have turned to I am looking for ward to that beer on Friday and there may or may not be friends involved. So we are looking at the short term dopamine fix that beer gives you to relax rather than the focus being on a social meet up.
Interesting to ponder. Still quite comfortable that I am not an alcoholic however I am very aware that I could easily become one if I put enough work into it 🙂
NHS limits and reality are far apart in my experience. Yes I have no doubt that over 14 units is bad for your health. So is working, walking down a city street, driving a car, eating shit food and all manner of other things.
That's a bit misleading though.
More recent research shows there's NO safe amount of alcohol. A small amount doesn't offset it's own effect's with reduced stress related illness, tannins, or whatever else. The argument is pretty much at a stage tobacco was in the 50's with "Physicians smoke Luckies" adverts, just substitute Lucky Strike for Red Wine.
So if someone drinks 10/15/20/30 units a week and want's to cut down, that's certainly going to help health risks. Even if those risks aren't the same almost certainties that even heavier drinkers face.
It's SSUK this weekend, so I'll be drinking, probably cloudy beer and some homemade blackcurrant whiskey.
seems a bit odd that folks are saying 20 plus units a week isnt bad, when the NHS say anything over 14 units a week is a risk to your health.
Because the 14 units limit was set by "temperance zealots".
https://velvetgloveironfist.blogspot.com/2019/04/the-drinking-guidelines-were-set-by.html
Don't forget there is plenty evidence hat moderate consumption is beneficial at the level of one or two drinks per day.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/22229788/
So if alcohol is harmless or beneficial at 14 units a week I'm fairly sure I wouldn't worry about doing 21 units (the old guideline) or a bit more depending on circumstances. For example the guidelines are the same for everyone. But logically someone of bigger than average build will have a higher safe threshold all else equal.
I'm well aware of the dangers of excessive alcohol consuption. My brother in law drank himself to death in his 40s. A good friend choked to death on his vomit while in a drunken stupor. That is far away from the OP though. They were drinking probably 20 units a day.
Johnjn2000
A healthcare background but not much in this field. Also was in a similar situation to yourself a decade or more ago tho i didnt drink.in the house but in the lovely pub over the road. My couple of pints a couple of times a week had become several pints several times a week. My weight had gone up significantly and my sleep was disordered to the point of affecting my work.
I just cut it right back and now hardly drink at all. I can go weeks without a drink.
Because the 14 units limit was set by “temperance zealots”.
At first I thought Poes law...... then
Don’t forget there is plenty evidence hat moderate consumption is beneficial at the level of one or two drinks per day.
Nope, there's not. Even your 'we've had enough of experts' style ranty link concedes that (seriously, that website looks like it was designed by a red faced gammon on the free computers at the library).
https://www.thelancet.com/article/S0140-6736(18)31571-X/fulltext
Don’t forget there is plenty evidence hat moderate consumption is beneficial at the level of one or two drinks per day.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/22229788/
/blockquote>And to quote the other link (did you even read it?):
Although some form of a cardioprotective association was confirmed in all strata, substantial heterogeneity across studies remained unexplained and confidence intervals were relatively wide, in particular for average consumption of one to two drinks/day.
A cardioprotective association between alcohol use and ischaemic heart disease cannot be assumed for all drinkers, even at low levels of intake. More evidence on the overall benefit-risk ratio of average alcohol consumption in relation to ischaemic heart disease and other diseases is needed in order to inform the general public or physicians about safe or low-risk drinking levels.
Which in plain English is "results were at best neutral, and varied wildly".
NHS advisory limit went from 21 to 14 (for men) a few years ago for not much reason really, 21 isn't an awful lot if you're a reasonable-sized man. I reckon I must be quite close to that, sometimes over, not by much and not always though. I don't believe I'm anywhere close to being an alcoholic, I drank much more as a student for several years on the trot, and I'm still very fit in my 50s. I can do without very easily for several days in a row, but I don't abstain often because I like beer and I like the relaxation of alcohol (in moderation)!
Not trying to claim alcohol is good for me, just I don't think it's very bad....
To reply more directly to the OP, one approach that may be useful is to have alcohol-free beers in the house, and pick up one of those instead of a strong drink. I did that a few times over lockdowns when I felt I was tipping towards a bit much....