[Closed] question for moderators- swearing on STW.

You should have opted for the Swearing Awareness Course they run....

*reported for foul language*

The first rule of swearing club....

Along with the "don't question the unquestionable course".
You may receive further bans you silly **** 😆

just type the word. If it's replaced with *'s that's not avoidance if it isn't then you're good too.

Was the context of the avoidance a personal insult against another poster rather than just a general railing at how shitty the world is?

In 20+ years of forum usage

this enforcement seems draconian, flawed and a complete lottery.

You can be an Old Hand or Naive.
Not both.

Along with the "don't question the unquestionable course".
You may receive further bans you silly ****

indeed, its a dangerous game i'm playing (it would seem) but i mention it with good intentions. I was pretty surprised to be banned that all.

a week! that is disproportionate.

It's weird. You can use shit, piss, arse, bastard, bollocks, fanny and cock but ****, **** and **** are all starred out.

****s 😆

I've found the best thing to do is just type it out, it'll asterix itself if its not allowed.

I got a slap on the wrist for swear filter avoidance once, and it was only my own modesty that made me star it. **** it.

I was pretty surprised to be banned that all.

All the best posters get banned. I'm still serving a life time ban for a post saying that the forum search didn't work (no swearing or rudeness at all). This was on another MTB forum! I even got a personal email from the then STW web designer, complaining about my complaint.

Was the context of the avoidance a personal insult against another poster rather than just a general railing at how shitty the world is?

It was not directed at another individual. The swear was an 'exasperated statement' used in agreement with the OP of the thread that triggered the ban.

As you're already living dangerously, ask them why they close threads when bike companies are being stroppy

just type the word. If it's replaced with *'s that's not avoidance if it isn't then you're good too.

confused

Does it hurt the swear filter's feelings or something to be avoided like this? 😛

You can be an Old Hand or Naive.
Not both.

Explain brexit voting demographics then.. 😉

wwaswas - Member
just type the word. If it's replaced with *'s that's not avoidance if it isn't then you're good too.

Wait so you're allowed to have a word automatically replaced with stars but if you type the stars in the first place that's swear filter avoidance?

Wait so you're allowed to have a word automatically replaced with stars but if you type the stars in the first place that's swear filter avoidance?
confused

this is exactly my confusion

a week! that is disproportionate.

quite.

Top spongepokery. 🙂

[img] [/img]

Well, someone had to.

I'd like to pretend to swear by using stars as I dare not post actual swears as I'm on a work system.
Just don't post rubbish poetry, they hate that and you will get a ban and chips will pop round your house to adminster a chop smack!

You can be an Old Hand or Naive.
Not both.
Explain brexit voting demographics then..

'Hand' presumably refers to some level of proficiency.

Therefore both old and naive is a goer. Can get fooled again.

for the record, I was told this was not my first offence for swearing. I received a email polite reminder some months ago to not mention the use of certain popular browser extensions which i was NOT aware was verboten. I was guilty in that instance. I was then banned for 7 days for 'repeated swear filter avoidance'. No evidence was supplied of my errors. I was just left confused as to what constituted avoidance.

replies above, have clarified this. thank you.

I am likewise confused. Asterisking out a word doesn't sound like [i]"swear filter avoidance"[/i] it sounds more like [i]"doing the swear filters job for it to make sure it doesn't accidentally slip through"[/i]

e.g. There's been a long tradition of replacing swears with symbol characters (Grawlixes) in comics and cartoons.

[img] [/img]

To me "swear filter avoidance" is when someone modifies the word so the filter misses it but everyone can still clearly read it, like replacing one S with $.

Basically doing the job of the swear filter is not allowed, i.e. using your own asterisks, even if the result is the same.

Though was puzzled at getting a whole post deleted because of it.

'Hand' presumably refers to some level of proficiency.

i am good at swearing, is this what you mean?

/s

as others seemingly are pointing out, there is a flaw in how this banning is metered out in relation to 'swear avoidance'

If i knew I could have just typed out the entire swearword, and not more onerously substitute letters for asterisks, then i would have done that. To my knowledge this is not detailed anywhere.

Banning for 7 days for swearing when actually typing the swearword in full would not have instigated a ban is weird and irksome.

Does seem odd, but then there are plenty of descriptive words in the English language more apt at describing frustration other than swear words.

But a well placed swear word does indeed add gravity to the sentence.

Don’t question nor try to avoid, type what you mean and let the swear filter do it’s wiggle.

How long will this thread last? If any of the others on the same subject are to be considered then not that long.

Nah, it's things like replacing some letters with numbers and special characters.

I$ th@t jv$t f0r $w€ar1ng 0r i$ 1t a g€ner@l d1$lik€ 0f $uch t0mf00l€ry?

I struggle with long sentences 😉

I have no useful contribution to make

Just write as you would normally - properly bad swearwords will get starred out, and if you've got too many of them then you maybe ought to rein it in IRL too.

Just make up a word that will be understood as a banned word by its context.

Eventually it will catch on and then those words will be banned.

Its like an arms race but with harmless words 🙂

Belgium

Fudge you Trimix!

a la Billy Connolly?

geddafur ya basser!

But a well placed swear word does indeed add gravity to the sentence.

that's all it was, genuinely.

I am aware it was lazy language, Im not in school anymore. But to be honest i use a forum about bikes and nonsense to unwind like i assume most here (i know, the irony..) not to have my language pithily deconstructed by some one who loves a bit of finger waggling.

Before someone else does!

Wait so you're allowed to have a word automatically replaced with stars but if you type the stars in the first place that's swear filter avoidance?
confused

the filter replaces any filtered swear with four stars, regardless of the size or shape of the word its filtering. Applying your own censorship but retaining the -ing or the -ed or keeping the initial f, c, w or whatever circumvents that filtering by alluding more to whats being self-censored than the filter would do.

[s]If i have caused offence[/s] I wholeheartedly apologise

Fixed that for you.

Muddy funsters

[i]not to have my language pithily deconstructed by some one who loves a bit of finger waggling[/i]

That Cougar loves a good finger waggle.

I'm told.

[img] [/img]

This thread needs a song.

(Contains bikes, so sort of relevant for this parish.)

He's gonna wake up in a smoothie

If i have caused offence I wholeheartedly apologise
Fixed that for you.

"finger wagging"

exhibit A.

🙄

retro83 - Member
[img] [/img]

this enforcement seems draconian, flawed and a complete lottery.

To an extent, it [i]is [/i]a lottery. We're a team of individuals and there are no hard and fast "if x then y" rules. What I might moderate one way someone else might not, and vice versa. I'll hold my hand up that it's inconsistent, and some people interpret this as bias, but it's simply a case of whoever picks something up first deals with it however they believe is correct.

FWIW, I rarely moderate language as it feels somewhat hypocritical of me, I'll usually just quietly edit a post if the filter's missed something (it's a bit of a blunt object) and only issue a warning if someone appears to be deliberately circumventing it. Getting a warning for self-censoring shouldn't happen (I'm not saying it doesn't, but it shouldn't). The general rule of thumb as others have said is just to let the filter do its job, though portmanteau swearing is problematic.

I've just reviewed your history Nick, as that does sound draconian. You've received three "swear filter avoidance" warnings since June, the third one at the end of October stating "Next time will result in some time off from the Forum." That will be why the ban was issued.

I'd concur that a week may have been harsh, I'd probably have given 48 hours if it were me.

No evidence was supplied of my errors.

Sorry, but that's not true. The emails provide both a link to the offending post and in three out of four of them also contained a copy of the post in the body of the email. How much evidence do you need?

**** loads!

In the interest of transparency, can we get a league table of who hits the 'Report' button the most?

the filter replaces any filtered swear with four stars, regardless of the size or shape of the word its filtering.

Not quite. The filter is basically a search and replace, it swaps $swearword with whatever text has been entered against that word to replace it. It replaces -ing with four asterisks because that's what happens to be entered against that particular word. There's no practical reason why it can't be ****, or *ing, or Christopher Biggins.

EDIT: Actually, I've just checked back, and I'm wrong.

The filter will search and replace as I described. If no alternative is entered, it will default to four asterisks.

[img] [/img]

Close, but doesn't look outraged enough

I take it the "pre-filtering" that's at the heart of this is the use of letter substitution rather than typing asterisks? I.e. '@' in place of 'a' or '1' in place of 'i'.

I like the Bearbones swear filter, things like: "Rapha" gets changed to "Expensive hipster brand". Much more adult 😆

In the interest of transparency, can we get a league table of who his the 'Report' button the most?

No. Even if we wanted to share that information, it's not something I can easily calculate.

I could make a fairly good guess as to who the prime candidates might be, mind. (-:

So is it, or is it not, okay to replace a swear with asterisks yourself?

Because if it isn't then that seems a very bizarre rule that punishes people who are trying to do the right thing, while rewarding people who just swear away and may not even be aware that the filter caught it.

I like the Bearbones swear filter, things like: "Rapha" gets changed to "Expensive hipster brand". Much more adult

Oh, there are a few Easter eggs in ours too (as a couple of posters on the previous page have demonstrated).

Big brother watches us. 😯
We need to go moar like Mumsnet 😀
In fairness the Mods here get a fair bit of grief, maybe the rules need looking at? How about warnings/3 strikes before an outright ban ( which seemed a tad harsh this time round) (justsayinglike)

Wear your banhammer scars with pride I say.It's the reason why the bighitters are all so horribly malformed (I think).

Oh, there are a few Easter eggs in ours too (as a couple of posters on the previous page have demonstrated).

No, i really do struggle with long sentences.

Judging by the recent picture of TJ you may be on to something there
😆
(Sorry TJ)

How about warnings/3 strikes before an outright ban

It's broadly what we do (and the OP had four in this case), though it can be useful to have some wiggle room. Sometimes hard-and-fast rules aren't appropriate. Do we deal with someone who's had three "strikes" in the last month in the same way as someone with three in the last year, or over the space of the last five years? How about someone who launches into a massive tirade vs someone who makes a simple slip and who we know is having Real Life difficulties? Black & white moderation (in so far as that's even possible) has its advantages, but also its disadvantages. It's always going to be subjective to some degree.

I got warnings for this at first, before I realised what I was doing wrong.

It's replacing letters with things that look like letters so the filter doesn't star it out, e.g. you $illy s0d.

You've received three "swear filter avoidance" warnings since June, the third one at the end of October stating "Next time will result in some time off from the Forum." That will be why the ban was issued.

yet:

Getting a warning for self-censoring shouldn't happen

hmmm.

Anyway, Cougar thank you for the response, it sheds light on the issue i had. I hope you can see where i was coming from regarding the inconsistencies in how your filtering works.

The fact that '****' is preferable to display to forum users as opposed to 's*ear f*lter a*oidance' (for instance) is still puzzling to me but there you go. I hope it proves useful if and when this is reviwed.

FWIW, I only have recieved two emails from Singletrack moderators over the last year. Having looked at my inboxes again, they all went into 'junk' as a suspected mailing list email(s) and I think previous emails were auto deleted as i never saw them in time.

When i reference 'no evidence' I should clarify, that it was not made clear to me what swear filter avoidance was. I was told i had avoided a swear filter in posts that contained (or were surrounded by) other swear words in plain sight as i understood it. I emailed for a response on the day of the ban highlighting the apparent hypocrisy and my confusion here, but did not receive an answer. I want to use this forum but this has been poorly handled and been confusing- as above comments reflect.

I should clarify, that it was not made clear to me what swear filter avoidance was.

Ah, fair point. There's a bit more info on the [url= http://singletrackmag.com/terms-and-conditions/ ]T&Cs[/url] page.

[i]"There is a swear filter on the site that will capture what we consider to be the most offensive vocabulary but any attempt to evade this swear filter will result in that post or thread being deleted. Repeat offenders will be banned. Our swear filter is not exhaustive and the moderators reserve the right to moderate any language regardless of its inclusion or otherwise in the swear filter library."[/i]

[quote=nickhit3 ]The fact that '****' is preferable to display to forum users as opposed to 's*ear f*lter a*oidance' (for instance) is still puzzling to me but there you go.

I'll see if I can help - if you type swe@r it's still really obvious what you mean and that level of "self censorship" isn't really self censorship at all, pretty much all it accomplishes is to defeat the filter. **** on the other hand, well I'm sure people can imagine what you mean, but any more sensitive souls will just imagine it's "dang" rather than anything more fruity.

Having looked at my inboxes again, they all went into 'junk' as a suspected mailing list email(s)

Yeah. This is another reason why we sometimes have to issue temporary bans. If people aren't receiving emails, it's the only other way we have of getting their attention. We can at our discretion reactivate the account if there are mitigating circumstances.

In the interest of transparency, can we get a league table of who hits the 'Report' button the most?

A bedwetter's league table would be interesting.
Don't think I'd feature on it, I think I've only ever reported one or two people for being complete ****s, and one chap who accidentally pasted a link with his full real name it (It was the location on his PC, and not the first person who has revealed they keep a folder of links for the specific purpose of arguing on STW). 🙄 😆

I'd like fruitier language to be allowed, but contrary to the OP's claims the mods have always made it clear which language has been unacceptable.

perchypanther - Member
No, i really do struggle with long sentences

[img] [/img]

If you can't do the time.......
🙂

Pretty much that aracer, changing one letter does not make a real difference opposed to **** which makes it a lot **** harder.

Ah, fair point. There's a bit more info on the T&Cs page.

"There is a swear filter on the site that will capture what we consider to be the most offensive vocabulary but any attempt to evade this swear filter will result in that post or thread being deleted. Repeat offenders will be banned. Our swear filter is not exhaustive and the moderators reserve the right to moderate any language regardless of its inclusion or otherwise in the swear filter library."

Indeed. As it happened, I had plenty time to retrospectively read this and other gems within the T&C's over the 7 day ban. I hold my hand up to not reading the T&C's of the site after creating my account whenever that was, and took my lead from the generally adult tone of the discussions i have read over many hours on STW- that contain swearing on a regular basis.

If I may, I would politely suggest coalescing your approach to this issue. By your own admission it is all over the map and you struggle with limited resources running the site which has my sympathy. Warning emails which were innocently filtered in my case were missed and auto deleted, a PM via the site would have been immediately visible for instance (I don't know if this is possible), and a shorter term ban would have made more sense. I want to be constructive here, as it seems others above share my confusion.

If people aren't receiving emails, it's the only other way we have of getting their attention.

If only there was a PM function on this site... 😉

I'll see if I can help - if you type swe@r it's still really obvious what you mean and that level of "self censorship" isn't really self censorship at all

I honestly don't know the reasoning behind it, but I'd bet my bike that you're right. Because, how exactly do you even begin define an appropriate level of acceptable obfuscation? S**** is fine, swe@r isn't, what about swaer or sw*ar? It's impossible. The only practical way to police it is to say "don't do it."

The whole thing is a pain in the arse if I'm honest. I think it's madness that a jumble of letters can cause offence (and I'm inclined to defer to Steve Hughes here), but I can understand why it's necessary to restrict it. Look at mumsnet.

but contrary to the OP's claims the mods have always made it clear which language has been unacceptable.

have they? can you link me to this list? I'd be keen to see it.

PM’s aren’t immediately visible they are tucked a way on you profile page, you do get an email to inform you have one though. 😀

Rorschach - Member

Wear your banhammer scars with pride I say.It's the reason why the bighitters are all so horribly malformed (I think).

monkeysfeet - Member

Judging by the recent picture of TJ you may be on to something there

(Sorry TJ)

🙂

If only there was a PM function on this site...

... which emails you. 🙄

The PM function needs work to be more visible on the site really. Hopefully that should change soon.

have they? can you link me to this list? I'd be keen to see it.

Sure, it's:

*
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*
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*
*
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****
Richard Stilgoe

The PM function needs work to be more visible on the site really. Hopefully that should change soon.

PM’s aren’t immediately visible they are tucked a way on you profile page

Yeah, UI fail there I think. Should be a much more obvious banner across the top or something. But PMs might provide a useful [i]additional[/i] way to contact offenders.

Incidentally what's the uptake like on the PM feature? Are people actually using it? How many people on this thread even know it exists?

I called Gregory Porter a **** on another thread and wasn't punished at all. He is though. Stupid big shitty hat wearing ****.