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The article of grim a walkers perspective obviously but... Based upon the fact that I now vehemently believe cyclists should be allowed on footpaths as long as they dont break rule 1, I thought I'd post this.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-67937253
Absolutely agree regarding it being a funding issue.👍
Just thought it would be an interesting article for some of STW.
Purely down to a severe lack of funding (plus cost of contractors simultaneously sky rocketing) and staffing for LAs.
Add to that the nightmare of trying to get LA legal departments to take action, because again it costs a fortune and takes an age to go down the legal route with notice serving, courts etc.
Funding, difficulty, not seen as important, take your pick. Could Apply to all sorts of things council's should be doing but don't.
Where enforcement is being carried out by councils it should be at a minimum self funding, so planning breaches, blocked ROWs, fly tipping, parking offences etc. should all carry a fine that at least covers the cost of enforcement, then the excuses disappear.
Why should the rest of us pay when people don't follow the rules, most of us never get ourselves in these situations.
But fines for these things generally aren't self funding and are set in law (laws written by the land owning classes).
Any fine that can eventually be secured is massively swamped by the officer time and costs and legal costs and then paid back at some means tested rate of 50p a month.
The cheapest way to resolve most of them, where it's not just a belligerent land manager who just says no, is to do the work to clear the paths and avoid legal costs, but there just isn't the staff or finance.
They're not excuses they're reasons. LAs see social care and education as needing more protection than paths in the countryside, and don't forget even those services are suffering badly too die to decades of real world cuts to funding.
At the bottom of the BBC article it mentions Monmouthshire councils work with volunteer groups which seems a pragmatic way forward, in the Chilterns we are lucky to have the Chiltern society that help keep the network open & I'd happily work with the local council to keep rights of way clear.
I've encountered a few farms in the last couple of years who seem quite content with blocking off ROW, even building stables and barns to make them completely impassable. Pi55es me off when I'm doing a run on OS Maps only to find I have to add on a couple of miles to get myself back on track. Spoke to a farmer in Cheshire last year and he really didn't give a sh1t.
in the Chilterns we are lucky to have the Chiltern society that help keep the network open
Albeit their tenancy to put up 'no bikes' tabs on signposts gets my goat. Mainly because it causes me a small pang of guilt for all the footpaths I use. Most of the paths in my area to the north of Reading are pretty heavily used but it's amazing how quickly the brambles will take over a less used path.
It is sad to lose them and I think it is more than neglect and lack of funding but landowners going out of their way to stop people using ROWs and footpaths on their land.
There are many examples near where I live but one landowner in particular is a nightmare. Last spring I reported a tree down blocking the ROW to local council, council contact the landowner (as the tree came from his property) to get him to remove it. He has 3 weeks to do this so after 4 weeks I chase up the council who chase up the landowner who says he has been up and down the ROW and he can't see a tree down. It has now been 5 weeks but I give exact location and a photo to council who pass it on to landowner. Another month goes by and I chase it up again, landowner tells council that tree has been cleared so council ticket has been closed. I ride the ROW, tree hasn't been cleared and as request is closed, it cant be re-opened so I need to open a new one, 3 weeks...etc
The end result is he eventually cleared the tree about 3 or 4 months later, by this point the ROW was overgrown with stingers and brambles as it has been used for so long so most people don't use the ROW.
That's just one example, I could list 5 or 6 just with this one farmer.
I guess they know they are very unlikely to be asked by anyone in authority to unblock and remove structures. Obviously any land owner who builds across these ROWs isn't going to give a toss about any member of the public complaining.
Its got to the stage where I now just walk and ride where I want. The only thing that stops me is if it will actually disturb other people using the land or if its environmentally damaging. Otherwise I just crack on - breaking bylaws works both ways.
Just thought it would be an interesting article for some of STW.
Worth tagging @stwhannah in just in case STW want to do an article on it at some point, I know they've published similar in the past.
All the comments about the funding are entirely correct and it's worse because councils can only enforce up to their legal boundary so any path that goes between parishes / council boundaries etc is mired in further legal crap about who should be doing what. Same with landowners - if you have a path that goes across two lots of land, that's two landowners you need to talk to and agree things with and quite often the landowner is absent anyway (some sort of tenancy agreement with the people actually using the land).
What it really needs is one national authority with the power to walk in and enforce it there and then. It'd get rid of all the issues with multiple councils arguing that they're not responsible and cut out months of costly court orders for farmers / landowners etc who mostly don't care and sometimes are actively quite hostile. Keep your RoW clear or we'll walk in and clear it for you and then bill you for the work.
But of course even the current situation is way down the priority list, trying to improve it is never going to happen. 🙁
So yeah, carry on riding wherever and whenever, abide by Rule 1.
Spoke to a farmer in Cheshire last year and he really didn’t give a sh1t.
Yeah, I was up in North Yorks last autumn, and the amount of PRoW that were obviously blocked off by farmers/landowners was more extreme than I'd seen anywhere else. It's partly why I'll ride where I want, these ****ers don't give a shit about access rights, why should I?
I used to be fastidious about only cycling where I am allowed to.
As I’ve found out more about our inadequate access laws and processes I really don’t give a shit, especially when I hear ignorant people spouting off about it.
Not least of which, modern mountain biking didn’t exist as a sport when our access laws were written.
Worth tagging @stwhannah in just in case STW want to do an article on it at some point, I know they’ve published similar in the past.
Ditto this - if your reading @stwhannah and the rest of STW towers. I'd like to see this as something that gets explored/investigated by us as a community through this year and going forward.
For what its worth - I am in Selby, so right at the bottom of North Yorks and adjacent to Leeds City Council who I've also dealt with.
I have, on occassion, reported the odd ROW issue - misleading signage put up deliberately by farms, obstructions etc, temporary closures overunning the planned and authorised dates. And to give them the credit that is probably not often given to any council dept, I have found that the ROW dept do respond, investigate and follow up where required. There is a definite case for US as a community putting some effort into actually reporting these problems, and then there is a fighting chance of getting some action.
The home for all issue across North Yorks is here, including the link to the 'definitive map' - North Yorks Right of Way Homepage
And the page to report an issue is here - Reporting portal
Take photos, use the definitive map in order to get the correct ROW references, and just give them the information.
We also have a new MP in our area, doing the usual 'tell me what your issues are' stuff quite heavily for now. I'm tempted to write in on the subject of access and rights of way, and see where they stand - not quit sure how to angle it or what detail to include though.
There is a definite case for US as a community putting some effort into actually reporting these problems, and then there is a fighting chance of getting some action.
Agree completely, I always make a point of reporting the bigger stuff. By this I mean a tree down big enough to need a chainsaw and telehandler to shift, smaller stuff I'll just head back with a folding saw and deal with myself. Too many people locally moan on the local facebook group about something when the same effort could have been used to log it.
There is a definite case for US as a community putting some effort into actually reporting these problems, and then there is a fighting chance of getting some action.
Yeah, sort of, maybe, but no, not really. We just identify ourselves as the group to be ignored or dis-invited. Just ride where you want. Until our representatives (the MPs) get off their arses and give folks access like there is in Scotland, most of this this stuff is just delaying tactics by land-owners. Pragmatically speaking, I haven't got the time or inclination to get involved with people who've no incentive and no face real penalty for keeping riff-raff like me on their land.
**** 'em
Agree completely, I always make a point of reporting the bigger stuff. By this I mean a tree down big enough to need a chainsaw and telehandler to shift, smaller stuff I’ll just head back with a folding saw and deal with myself. Too many people locally moan on the local facebook group about something when the same effort could have been used to log it.
Always ask the landowners permission, this is where even more issues can arise, if you just wander on to someones property and cut up a tree, or other stuff, sounds petty, but there's been a couple of instances of this nearby where landowners have used it as further evidence of closing down access!
Whilst it’s not a problem I experience regularly, I do go back with a folding saw and secateurs to clear overgrown, little used RoW and also report it. So far, in 30+ years - I’ve not been challenged doing this.
We just identify ourselves as the group to be ignored or dis-invited. Just ride where you want. Until our representatives (the MPs) get off their arses and give folks access like there is in Scotland, most of this this stuff is just delaying tactics by land-owners. Pragmatically speaking, I haven’t got the time or inclination to get involved with people who’ve no incentive and no face real penalty for keeping riff-raff like me on their land.
I also ride where I want too. I regularly ride on 'cheeky'. Your missing my point massively.
Report things. We can piss and moan and grumble and get annoyed that nothing happens when you follow the official channels. That as cyclists/MTBers we dont get listened to, that we are ignored, or that the accesss rules are antiquated and dont suit us or the times we live in. But the absolute worst thing we can do is nothing.
I'm not saying your council will suddenly fix everything and have a team of MTB'ers on the payroll scouring the county and maintaining trails and paths.
But if we dont report things, using the official channels, then guess what happens.... Nothing.
Whether it does, or doesnt, is, I agree, questionable. (my experience is that it can help, as I posted, but I understand that wont be everyones experience).
What I am 100% guaranteeing, is that doing nothing, achieves nothing.
(See also - "my car got broken into, I'm not going to report it, whats the point, theres never any police about")
Well if councils and landowners won't comply with their statutory obligations perhaps large groups of civic minded people are needed to reclaim blocked rights of way.
I am in deepest darkest Shropshire / Welsh Boarders. Most ROW just get too over grown as no one uses them.
Also as above farmers appear to be able to do what they like either completely diverting ROW or blocking them.
Agree completely, I always make a point of reporting the bigger stuff. By this I mean a tree down big enough to need a chainsaw and telehandler to shift, smaller stuff I’ll just head back with a folding saw and deal with myself. Too many people locally moan on the local facebook group about something when the same effort could have been used to log it.
I have some sympathy for landowners where it’s a one off event like a tree fall as it’s a royal pain to get it shifted as it’s likely to be remote.
Our way in the Cotswold it’s more of an issue of lack of regular clearing, drainage management, temporary rerouting due to change of crop and locks on bridal ways (usually combo’s). Always report everything no matter how small as it reminds the landowner of their responsibilities.
I'm going to play devil's advocate here. From the BBC article : Standing on a footpath tucked into the folds of the Tamar Valley, Mrs Wilson points up at a sheer muddy bank, topped with a thicket of brambles. That's where the path should go," she says. "You can't see anything. It's just gone.
So, the RoW is so rarely used that it's completely overgrown by brambles, which grow quickly but not that quickly? Should the council be putting time and money into clearing a track which is obviously used by a tiny number of people? If Mrs Wilson had spent some time clearing the brambles off that path - or even walking it - instead of training as a lawyer to fight for access she might be able to use it. In fact, she could do both.
Yes, I've been there plenty of times. You follow a RoW and end up in the middle of impenetrable brambles or thorns or whatever and have to fight your way through, ending with scratches and torn clothing. It's frustrating but very much not a new problem. Most of the riding groups around here pitch in and keep 'our' routes clear, sort out drainage and fallen trees. I've never seen our local walking groups do the same.
Just to make it clear, my comments are about overgrown paths, not deliberately blocked paths, which is where I think councils should be concentrating their efforts.
Yeah, sort of, maybe, but no, not really. We just identify ourselves as the group to be ignored or dis-invited. Just ride where you want. Until our representatives (the MPs) get off their arses and give folks access like there is in Scotland, most of this this stuff is just delaying tactics by land-owners. Pragmatically speaking, I haven’t got the time or inclination to get involved with people who’ve no incentive and no face real penalty for keeping riff-raff like me on their land.
I understand your point of view, but it's ultimately self defeating.
We need to report officially, keep records and photos, involve MPs, and if a landowner is a repeat offender, local media are always looking for a slow news day story.
Don't break rule 1? That's 'no officer above the rank of mess sergeant is permitted to go into combat with pierced nipples ' I think ?
What I am 100% guaranteeing, is that doing nothing, achieves nothing.(See also – “my car got broken into, I’m not going to report it, whats the point, theres never any police about”)
At a Neighbourhood Watch meeting that my Mum went to, the local police were astonished to be met with a barrage of complaints about theft of parcels from doorsteps and minor car crime. They pointed out that [street] was very safe because there were no reports of any crime and the residents said they never reported it because the police never bothered and were never around.
The police pointed out that they didn't go along the road because it was considered a zero crime road because...there were no reports of any crime.
So yes, always report. Eventually, the council will get bored of the repeated reports and actually do something, even if it's just to get you to shut up. I wouldn't expect miracles like appearing on a remote FP with diggers and helicopters but it does all help to build a picture of the local area, the resources needed, the grants they should be applying for and so on as well as identifying "problem" landowners.
Funny this should pop up now. I've spent two days this week investigating alternative routes for sections of the Millennium Way and its associated circular walks for which I am a warden. The paths are closed because of dangerous bridges. One of them is on a Sustrans route. Those bridges are unlikely to be repaired or replaced in 2024, and I wouldn't put any money on it happening in 2025 either. This is purely a funding issue, which makes it yet another thing that the Tories have broken in their 13 years of catastrophic misrule.
The paths are closed because of dangerous bridges. One of them is on a Sustrans route. Those bridges are unlikely to be repaired or replaced in 2024, and I wouldn’t put any money on it happening in 2025 either. This is purely a funding issue,
Which makes it even more insane that a charity is responsible for maintaining RoW access.
Imagine that a bridge over the M6 broke. Do you reckon there'd be no funding for that? Or that people would drive up and find a sign saying "road blocked, find another route" but with nothing signosted?
There'd be engineers working round the clock to get it fixed and it would be the responsibility of National Highways (or Network Rail for a railway bridge).
The situation of having a charity (in fact several charities, all trying to peck at the same crumb) looking after cycling and walking, RoW issues etc is an insult.
Ah but "we're a nation of drivers". Sorry Tories, I forgot that, carry on as you were....
but it’s ultimately self defeating.
Probably, I prefer to see myself as pragmatic. The rules are stacked so heavily in favour of landowners, and TBH, I sort of get why. Hoi Paloi can be a complete PITA. Somewhere in between Gert oorrrfff moi Laaaannd, and the sorts of routine acts of vandalism of burned out cars and beer cans and camp-fire litter that we've all seen; are the rest of us trying just to get into the countryside occasionally. I'd just prefer to be left alone to do that is all.
Really interesting.
I'm currently objecting to a temporary permitted detour that a farm has had in place for 5x rolling 3 -month periods. They've done it to keep people away from their farm area but the detour is unwalkable terrain and so far that I can't walk to school with my son.
What tends to happen is they claim a walker's dog killed a chicken and they are free to change the footpaths/ROW how they like.
Imagine that a bridge over the M6 broke. Do you reckon there’d be no funding for that? Or that people would drive up and find a sign saying “road blocked, find another route” but with nothing signosted?
Hammersmith bridge would like to enter the conversation!
We just identify ourselves as the group to be ignored or dis-invited. Just ride where you want. Until our representatives (the MPs) get off their arses and give folks access like there is in Scotland, most of this this stuff is just delaying tactics by land-owners. Pragmatically speaking, I haven’t got the time or inclination to get involved with people who’ve no incentive and no face real penalty for keeping riff-raff like me on their land.
I also ride where I want too. I regularly ride on ‘cheeky’. Your missing my point massively.
+1. Life's too short and precious to give a fu** about who 'owns what land'. Ride/Walk/Explore anywhere (except military areas). Leave no environmental trace, however.
Looking at the dreadful financial situation Somerset Council is in, where public facilities like toilets, sports and other facilities available to the public, plus a whole raft of other facilities are being threatened with almost certain closure, it seems that RoW are going to be at the furthest end of a very, very long list of things that aren’t going to be done any time in the near future.
I reported 2 ROW problems with paths shown on the Definitive Map in Carmarthenshire - one over grown and tree-blocked; the other simply does not exist past half way. I mentioned to a friend who worked in the Council that I'd not heard anything back a few weeks later. He said "I'm not surprised. We haven't got a Right of Way officer." So there's not much chance of anything happening around here. I've cleared another local path myself with a bow saw and secateurs...
Clickbait aimed to rile the lefties here. Makes it sound like every RoW in the country is rammed full of blockages.
Monmouth have a nice habit of closing or downgrading as well.
Culture warriors should remember that an attempt to do a Beeching on the rights of way network in the mid 1980s was quietly dropped due to local opposition from all those village dwellers who provides the 5 figure Conservative majorities. The pushback from the grass roots was so strong that an attempt at "opening" up moorland was made. This led to the formation of the Moorland Association to oppose this and it too was dropped. Even the pathetic 2001 CRoW act was miraculous.
Slightest reported obstruction - a shoogly bridge on a jumpable stream, and Herefordshire just close the path. Meet a closure on nearly every visit.