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On the other hand, we've seen again and again that rationally analysing Apple's decisions doesn't really equate to their success.
There are a great number of people who already knew they were going to order a 5s on launch day regardless of what it was like.
Similarly there are those who just go - "oh a pink iPhone! Must have!"
Not if they so "No", no.
If a mugger says to you "Unlock the phone or I'll cut your fingers off and do it myself" are you really going to say no??
(especially since you know that once you've been mugged you can use "Find My iPhone" to lock down the phone remotely and send the police to the muggers location)
And I know the difference between "loose" and "lose", I just typed it wrong.
T'was just teasing - it's one of the commonest spelling mistakes on here (along with brakes/breaks).
New phone announcements are all a bit 'meh' at the moment
Yeah I think they've now reached the point that PCs reached where they are mostly "good enough" and there isn't much to draw you to new versions.
(Still using a 4 and a 4S here. I doubt I'll upgrade to a 5S. Looks nice but the new features don't outweigh the hassle and cost for me).
legend - Member
Shit just got real! Imagine if it was a child with a face recognition phone!!
😆
Great post. For me, I would add storage to the list of requirements, along with price/battery life. To still have the base capacity at 16GB seems such a strange decision. Especially given the price non-drop.
Is there anything new in iOS then?
Looks like it's been designed by a 5 year old with access to pastels. I guess that's new.
I wanted 128Gb of memory for my music collection. I've got about 90 so far.
I suppose 650(G)b would have done.
ohnohesback - Member
Thinking more about this it's my opinion that Apple have both confused their offering with so many models and done their 'premium' image some damage by introducing cheaper versions.
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Is there anything new in iOS then?
Fundamentally the same, but a new look and a few new features.
But older iphones will support [i]most[/i] of the good stuff anyway so iOS 7 doesn't provide a compelling reason to upgrade by itself.
Sell me a phone with a battery that can go for 2-3 days of hard use and performs as well in 2 years time as it did at the start of the contact and I'll consider that real progress!
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Ok, the iOS update does definitely look worth having even if the new hardware is meh. From what they're showing, it really just looks like they are bringing important/frequently used settings closer to the home screen ala Android of course - but still definitely a good move
But older iphones will support most of the good stuff anyway so iOS 7 doesn't provide a compelling reason to upgrade by itself.
This was being floated in the press this morning as one reason why the new iPhone might not sell well.... Basically if you already have a 4s or 5 and iOS-7 runs smoothly on it when released then why would you pay to upgrade just the hardware?
It's a sentiment that makes sense but history tells us all new iPhones sell like hot cakes regardless!
Has anyone else pointed out that both the 5S and 5C are true world phones? They can both support every band on GSM, HSPA+, LTE, etc. Might benefit world-travelling STWers.
they are bringing important/frequently used settings closer to the home screen ala Android of course
Or ala the various quick settings apps on jailbroken iphones:
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http://lifehacker.com/how-to-get-the-best-features-of-ios-7-right-now-512425022
indeed, but I don't believe I should have to jailbreak my phone just to make it work as it should
Or ala the various quick settings apps on jailbroken iphones:
True dat. I have finally stopped JB'ing, and gone official, as Apple have stolen/copied/employed the tweak designers of enough of the functionality that JB'ing brought.
indeed, but I don't believe I should have to jailbreak my phone just to make it work as it should
...and that's why no-one roots Android phones.
iOS7 is good. been using it for a couple of months.
nothing radical but lots of nice features.
Got 12 months to go on my contract so it'll be an upgrade to a 6 for me.
I always think the various jail break iPhones I've seen are great, the hackers genuinely seem to lead the way in this respect.... Happens with Android too, various Cyanogen OS features have slowly made it into official Android.
Looking at those jailbreak iPhone screenshots it's not hard to see where Mr Ive found 'inspiration' for iOS-7!
indeed, but I don't believe I should have to jailbreak my phone just to make it work as it should
No me neither - just pointing out that saying they are copying that feature from Android doesn't ring true.
SBSettings (and BossPrefs prior to that) offers most of that functionality has been available for jailbroken iphones [url= http://thebigboss.org/the-future-of-bossprefs ]since at least 2008[/url] (i.e. prior to Android's first release).
Is there anything new in iOS then?
Control panel (similar to SBsettings), easy access to settings
AirDrop - Wifi/Bluetooth sharing between ios devices (iPhone 5+)
VPN compatability
iTunes Radio
Siri now works as it should've the first time around
Repeat. Get a 128Gb memory chip in there now Apple.
igm - Member
Repeat. Get a 128Gb memory chip in there now Apple.
but thats too close to their 160gb ipod and apple have always been very clever about making sure you have a reason to buy more of their products
So, I can't see that I need to upgrade the 5, which I'm pleased about.
I'm always a little disappointed with the latest phone release, and I think it's because I want the jump in functionality that I got going from a standard phone to and Iphone 3G, and with the amazement of something like 'around me' app, but my mind just can't comprehend what these things are.
I think i'll stick with apple for now though, and upgrade when the software makes the 5 a little too slow.
And I love Nokia's advert this morning poking a bit of fun
That seems to be their marketing thing at the moment, when samsung launched their phone/camera hybrid, nokia ran an ad that said "but it didn't see this coming". Likewise, nokia blogged a picture of a SLR lens blue tacked to the back of a phone as a mockery of Sony QX lens add ons for their phones.
Personally, one frustration i have with apple phones was the change in connector. I have couple of apple products and they connect to the car or home hi fi via a dock. Now an adaptor is required, which is no biggie but its annoying.
Personally, one frustration i have with apple phones was the change in connector.
Yeah - I can see why they needed to do it - the old connector was fragile and had a lot of unused legacy stuff on it - but the connector and change in size are both now (minor) obstacles to me upgrading.
I've got old style connectors all over the house/car/office in various chargers and docks - so I'd need loads of new cables and adapters.
Likewise I have various cases for my 4S, including the waterproof one mounted on my bike - so I'd have to get new versions of them too.
It's not a biggie - but it's just enough friction that a new iPhone has to offer something more compelling for me to be bothered with the faff.
I think the 5C is very cleverly priced to make you go for the 5S. Whats the difference, £80 or something?
There's some worthwhile improvements to the camera which are always welcome. My fear is that iOS7 slows down the old phones and developers start making Apps that use the power of the new M7 and A7 chips which run like a dog on the old A5 and A6 chips. The Facebook App was appallingly slow on my iPhone 4.
Personally, one frustration i have with apple phones was the change in connector.
Yep, I've got two iPad/iPhone stands and a couple of clock radios with the old connector. One reason I've stayed with the 4s.
Can you pop the back off to change the battery like normal phones?
Can you pop the back off to change the battery like normal phones?
Define normal?
The Facebook App was appallingly slow on my iPhone 4.
i'm not sure you can blame poor coding by Facebook onto apple.
New connector was a pain to move to but actually a much better design.
I thought the 5C was created largely to tap into emerging markets, where users didn't necessarily have the cash for the premium model, but still wanted the cachet of an Apple phone? Time will tell whether the pricing is correct, I guess, although its difficult to compare prices across markets due to contracts.
Assh - that's a design decision. Batteries are vulnerable and dangerous if physically damaged. Make them replaceable and you need to make them sturdy enough to handle/pocket. You also need connectors etc.
Integrate them and you get more space for the battery itself - not the packaging. The downside is you then can't pop it off.
A choice has to made.
And in answer: No. I've not seen any mention of a replaceable battery, which would be big news for the iPhone.
Can you pop the back off to change the battery like normal phones?
Yes, just undo the two screws.
i'm not sure you can blame poor coding by Facebook onto apple.
It was never about blame. It was the observation that as processors become faster, developers take advantage of that performance to make their apps "better", rendering them slower at best and unusable at worst on older platforms. Facebook were the (very) obvious example.
Personally I like the new phones, but it's interesting/disappointing that the iPhone 5 has in essence become obsolete in 1 year. When the 4 came out, the form factor did not change until the 5 came out. If you had a 4, it still looked like the latest iPhone even when the 4S came out, so it had a long shelf life. Not a good strategy to encourage upgrades, but it was a big plus point for iPhones.
After 1 year the aesthetic of the iPhone 5 is dead, yet the 4 lives on in the 4S. My wife's 3 year old 4 now looks more current than my 1 year old 5.
stilltortoise - you clearly worry too much about keeping up with the joneses.
On the other hand - surely the new 5s looks nearly identical to the 5?
Much more importantly: separated at birth?
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Apple are banking on people buying the 5C hence no pre-order for the 5S.
They have clearly manufactured more 5C handsets due to the China market and most likely can't support 5S pre-orders.
I've been on IOS7 for a few months with my test phone and to be honest it looks appealing but does bring some good features. Problem is those features have been available for ages on Android and jailbreak.
I prefer a larger screen so I'm selling both my iPhones to get a HTC One X and then I'll move to the 6 next year.
At this point I'd just like to point out that Apple are WAAAAY ahead of HTC and most other phone companies in terms of ethical sourcing of Tantalum. Less people are going to die/be enslaved for the minerals used in an Apple phone.
Less.
http://www.enoughproject.org/news/intel-hp-rank-highest-conflict-minerals-nintendo-htc-lag-behind
(Cough) Foxconn (cough)
stilltortoise - you clearly worry too much about keeping up with the joneses.
I don't worry about it, but I do care about it. It's the reason I don't buy big brand mountain bikes, because the graphics become out of date within a year.
On the other hand - surely the new 5s looks nearly identical to the 5?
To someone who is colourblind perhaps 😉 To be fair, the black - sorry, "Space Grey" - looks the same in the pictures I've seen
[i]After 1 year the aesthetic of the iPhone 5 is dead, yet the 4 lives on in the 4S. My wife's 3 year old 4 now looks more current than my 1 year old 5. [/i]
You're taking this phone thing waaaaaaaay to seriously.
I have a 5 and I'm gutted to hear the aesthetic is dead, gutted.
As you should be Gary, as you should be 😉
Foxconn is a good point.
Who doesn't use them?
Pages and Numbers free with iOS7
[url= http://www.techradar.com/news/software/applications/apple-makes-iwork-free-on-ios-1179764 ]http://www.techradar.com/news/software/applications/apple-makes-iwork-free-on-ios-1179764[/url]
That's going to please some customers who have 'just' paid for them 😉 😥
silly Q, Will iOS 7 run (crawl) on a 4s?
Pages and numbers is only free with new handsets.
Everyone gets ios7 free.
silly Q, Will iOS 7 run (crawl) on a 4s?
Been running it for a couple of months... Not slow yet... No doubt once app developers use all the new features it will be slow.. Facebook takes 6s to load currently.
Been running it for a couple of months... Not slow yet
some good news at last
[tinfoil hat]
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^^ 😆
If you've been to the US in the last 10 years or so, your finger print scans will are held by the NSA, GCHQ, etc etc...
I see they have been sneaky by not offering the 5c in all black so people will know you're a cheapskate as you have a coloured iphone.
I guess there will be replacement cases from china out pretty quickly though. If it is cheap enough to compete with mid range android phones I'll probably get one and as anything has to be an upgrade from this thing I am currently using:
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Even if Apple did somehow sneak out the fingerprint data without anyone spotting it being transmitted, would a hash of a partial fingerprint of one finger actually be of any use whatsoever to the NSA, GCHQ or other shadowy groups?
As footflaps points out, such groups have far better ways of getting full high quality fingerprints of all your fingers if they really want them. I believe many banks in the US fingerprint you when you open an account for example.
Will iOS 7 run (crawl) on a 4s?
Running it on 4. Quicker than v6, but it does have several features missing, like all that parallax nonsense...
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....and other hardware dependant features.
I guess there will be replacement cases from china out pretty quickly though.
Less than an hour after the announcement:
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I disagree with the fingerprint paranoia (and I'm a tin foil hat kinda guy) and doubt that the fingerprints will leave the device. However:
As footflaps points out, such groups have far better ways of getting full high quality fingerprints of all your fingers if they really want them. I believe many banks in the US fingerprint you when you open an account for example.
This isn't a very good argument. While I agree with you on the "if they really want to" case, to me this case isn't the issue. The effort and cost involved in the above is vastly greater than the effort and cost involved in aggregating data collected from a phone which knows who you are, where you are and what you're up to. The fingerprint thing could represent the establishment of a method that [i]systematically[/i] achieves the fears of the paranoid with minimal economic cost. This brings it within reach of those wishing to perform mass surveillance, as opposed to targeted surveillance. Seeing as all the ethical problems of recent months arise from the deployment and aggregation of systems designed to create and store data from untargeted mass surveillance, I hope you can see why this could be considered a serious problem.
Your point about the application of this data for nefarious purposes still stands, I just didn’t want anyone to lose sight of the issues at hand.
I hope you can see why this could be considered a serious problem.
with an incredibly simple solution. don't buy one.
with an incredibly simple solution. don't buy one.
lol.
damn DX are good!
I did mean the rear casing though and not the slip on cover. I quite like the glowing apple logo backs that you can get for the Iphone 5, they even have all the CE logo etc on them like a real case.
edit: another solution - stick something over the scanner, maybe a bit of tinfoil 😉 and turn the feature off.
**** Me! Are you guys seriously worried about fingerprint data, if so, are you 00 agents or something! You guys had better wear bandanna's and go around in wheelchairs too, there's a lot of camera's about and gait surveillance. 😆 Paranoia!
Once the phone is JB'ed, developers will be able to test the Fingerprint Scanner to make sure it isn't being transmitted or hacked.
I think I must be missing something the paranoid guys are seeing... IF they could get my fingerprint, what can they do, as apposed to stealing my iPhone with my fingerprints all over it?
Haha good point. If you've ever looked a phone that's just had it's lock pattern input you'll see you can copy it from the grease on the screen 90% of the time 🙂
The effort and cost involved in the above is vastly greater than the effort and cost involved in aggregating data collected from a phone which knows who you are
Really??
You think the "effort and cost" of a government security agency like the NSA accessing the records of another gov agency like Passport Control is somehow GREATER than the effort and cost of secretly conspiring with Apple to breach international privacy and data protection laws and secretly develop the ability to covertly transmit fingerprint data without hackers, competitors or foreign agencies ever noticing?
Even if that were true, all they'd get for that effort, cost and risk would be a simplified hash of a partial fingerprint of one finger or thumb and an idea of who it might [i]possibly[/i] belong to.
You think the "effort and cost" of a government security agency like the NSA accessing the records of another gov agency like Passport Control is somehow GREATER
They already have. They've also got all the finger print scans from all the countries they've sold the same system to eg Kenya.....
with an incredibly simple solution. don't buy one.
Or buy one and disable the finger print unlock, and just use the old method!
but what if THEY secretly enable it...
but what if THEY secretly enable it...
They don't need to. It is ALWAYS enabled. EVEN when you turn it OFF.
The S in NSA stands for Switcheroo.
but what if THEY secretly enable it...
Well, they couldn't because
a. it needs training to recognise a fingerprint
b. theres no guarantee it would be your fingerprint they are capturing since you could allow anyone to use the unlock code.
Disabling means you must have something to hide, so they will just secretly enable it AND flag you as a possible terrorphile.
Disabling means you must have something to hide, so they will just secretly enable it AND flag you as a possible terrorphile.
I think the latest revelations show that the NSA considers everyone as possible terrorphile, hence their universal snooping of pretty much everything....
You think the "effort and cost" of a government security agency like the NSA accessing the records of another gov agency like Passport Control is somehow GREATER than the effort and cost of secretly conspiring with Apple to breach international privacy and data protection laws and secretly develop the ability to covertly transmit fingerprint data without hackers, competitors or foreign agencies ever noticing?
No, I don't. I'm arguing against the following line of reasoning:
"This privacy concern is invalid because this privacy can already be violated if person A does X Y and Z"
on the grounds that the new privacy concern potentially skips steps X Y and Z and makes it more economical to violate the privacy.
As for your little situation you made up - I'm not for one moment suggesting they'd do it, let alone secretly 🙂
If you are thinking of buying a 5C or 5S then read this article on The Register - particularly if you are thinking of sneaking on in from the States.
International 4G is a proper PITA and what works in Merka may well not work here...
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/09/11/apple_launches_10_new_iphones/
Cheers
Danny B
No doubt the scallies have already found a way of cracking the fingerprint lock.
There are many reasons not to buy one. The fact it is an Apple product being by far the greatest.
No, I don't. I'm arguing against the following line of reasoning:
"This privacy concern is invalid because this privacy can already be violated if person A does X Y and Z"
on the grounds that the new privacy concern potentially skips steps X Y and Z and makes it more economical to violate the privacy.
And I'm arguing that you've got it completely the wrong way around 😆
My line of reasoning is actually more like:
"This privacy concern is invalid because it requires W, X, Y and Z to be performed illegally and in secret for a possible lead on a tiny part of private data when a complete and verified copy of that data is already available legally to the agencies that want it."
No doubt the scallies have already found a way of cracking the fingerprint lock.
Someone once said (I forget who) that the trouble with fingerprint verification is that it is essentially a password that you write in plain text on every surface that you touch.
It would probably be more useful for them to know your phone unlock code, on the basis that there's a fair chance it's the same code as something else to which they might like access.
As I said before - unless the tech for the fingerprint reader is new, it's easy to overcome.
"essentially a password that you write in plain text on every surface that you touch."
Though with most modern sensors, it's not - they read subdermal layers.
I really wish the mobile phone had never been invented.
I really wish the mobile phone had never been invented.- Sent From My iPhone.
I really wish the mobile phone had never been invented.
- Sent From My iPhone.
😆
😀
From a desktop...but it is a mac.
"novelty" fingerprint scanning + GPS + inbuilt security backdoors present in pretty much every operating system, including iOS/Android = no more hiding places.
Why you might want to hide, I have no idea, but just because you don't need to shouldn't mean you don't get to.
Not sure how Nokia can claim Apple are copying their phone with the multicoloured 5C when the multicoloured gen 5 iPod Touch predates that and coloured iPod Nano's and Shuffles predates that - see the pattern?