[Closed] Probably been caught speeding .. minor whine

You know the highway code on designated a 30? Basically always assume 30 unless it tells you it isn't. And re read the highway code.
It's also a worse offence not knowing the limit as that is it taking enough care or paying enough attention.

No point contacting the police on signage mate. You'll probably be offered a course if your not going too near 40.

You know the highway code on designated a 30? Basically always assume 30 unless it tells you it isn't. And re read the highway code.
It's also a worse offence not knowing the limit as that is it taking enough care or paying enough attention.

Didn't know that .. I'll be sure to bear that in mind in future! Kicking myself really...

Really? Normally taught a lot. Sounds like re reading the highway code would be a good thing see how many other things you missed.

I did [b]exactly[/b] the same thing 2 weeks ago.....got the notice on thursday.
33 in a 30 (non residential road past an industrial estate).First ticket ever at 44.
Shit happens.

Seems like you spent quite a while driving along thinking about what the speed might be, but still couldn't work it out.

I think a speed awareness course would be a good thing for you. You will learn how not to make the same mistake again.

(Not being patronising, I've done the course myself)

If it's a built up area and the side roads don't have 30 signs you're in a 30 zone.

This is *almost* always true. And you won't die where it's not.

P.S.
Pigsy is a pig - Sandy is a river monster 😉

I do have a vague recollection of it but I thought it was only residential areas. It was on an A road that was skirting near a town (I've just checked Google maps and there are street lights but no houses etc hence my failed assumption of 40mph). Anyway I've no-one to blame but myself I'm just annoyed that's all.

I think a speed awareness course would be a good thing for you...

I think you're probably right...

36 in a 30 in an area that had just had its speed changed.

I did the speed awareness course. I actually found it very good.

If in doubt do 30 until you know better.

The new fines for speeding are scary!

My grumble is that if they want idiots like me to do a particular speed they need to help us out as much as possible and make it really obvious what that speed is. I guess I'm conditioned to speed signs everywhere else, and I take the point of "30 unless indicated otherwise".

It's just my behaviour would have changed in this scenario if I knew it was a 30 meaning in theory everyone would have been safer as a result.. silver lining is I won't make the same mistake again wrt highway code.

I saw the van from miles away,looked at the speedo and thought 'it's fine I'm doing less than 35 in a 40' (I drive like an OAP at the best of times).
The camera van was parked obscuring the 30 sign as I went past it.
Shit happens.

Last time I read The Highway Code was 1974, has it changed much? ❓

probably best read it, ignorance isn't a defence

[quote=esselgruntfuttock ]Last time I read The Highway Code was 1974, has it changed much?

Only one way to find out...

The thing for me here is that you don't know what speed you were doing, nor did you know what limit the road was. That's not a great combination. Was it 35 or 40 you were "pootling" at? Sounds to me like an awareness course is a good idea.

That said. ACPO guidelines for the course is 10%+2, so in a 30 zone you should be offered the course at 35mph or under. In a modern car, an indicated 35-40 is probably around 30-36. So there's every chance that a) you'll get away with it and b) if you don't you'll be offered the course.

Google Maps link if you'd like us to be more judgemental?

Maybe I should always assume a 30 if I don't know the speed limit .. was that my mistake?

One of the bits of my speed awareness course was pointing out the 'obvious' things that indicate it's likely to be a 30.

Streetlights. No repeater signs. No signs on entry to side roads etc etc.

The reason that local authorities don't have to put repeater signs in 30s is that there are an awful lot of roads in towns that would require them.

Last time I read The Highway Code was 1974, has it changed much?

Well I imagine the current Highway Code has less emphasis on the dangers of running over your flag man and the importance of carrying a crank handle for your starter 😉

Seriously though, I'm sure a fair bit has been changed since 1974. The national speed limits have changed at least once since then, and the "default 30" being discussed above wasn't introduced till the 1984 Road Traffic Act.

Maybe not a bad idea to re-read it and see what's changed for yourself? [url= https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway-code ]It's available free on t'internet[/url].

(one of the many reasons I support periodic re-testing for all drivers)

These two roads, the A420 (top) and the A4 (bottom), are on opposite sides of town, one is the Bath Road, the other the Bristol Road. I got done for doing 40 about where the viewpoint is on the A4, just where it exits a railway bridge, and at that time there were no buildings on the left, just a derelict house and overgrown garden, with just residential on the right, as it is now. The A420 hasn't changed at all.
Anyone care to tell me what the difference is?
Just to be clear, where the red car is, with the traffic island and all, that didn't exist, it was just a straight road, until it met a junction further on.
[IMG] [/IMG]
[IMG] [/IMG]

Both would be default 30 unless signed otherwise?

Someone flashed me and I thought "accident or speed trap" .. no bother I'll carry on.

I'd be kicking myself if I got warned and still got caught.

I thought it was safe to assume a road with streetlights but without signage would have a 30mph limit?

Without being [i]too[/i] sanctmonious, this

Last time I read The Highway Code was 1974, has it changed much?

And this

there goes a 20 year unblemished record.

IMO play a signifcant part in what is wrong with driving standards in this country. Driving a car is one of the most hazardous things you can do, in terms of immediate risk fo 3rd parties. To be allowed to drive around in tonnes of speeding metal with only a partial understanding of the rules is crazy if you step back for a minute.

Policeman standing out with a speed gun rather than a camera van? You weren't stopped at the time? You'll hear no more about it.

Good advice above but try to ignore some of the sanctimony on some of the posts. All of them are very decent guys on here but sometimes this place is a a little 'preachy'! 😉

You've made a mistake and have been caught. All of us have made them before and not been caught - even the driving instructors above - if only some of them would admit it.

Don't beat yourself up too much, you are clearly looking to avoid the same mistake and learn. That is most definitely to be lauded.

It's simple.

124
You MUST NOT exceed the maximum speed limits for the road and for your vehicle (see the table below). The presence of street lights generally means that there is a 30 mph (48 km/h) speed limit unless otherwise specified.
Law RTRA sects 81, 86, 89 & sch 6

What Drac said.

Streetlights? It's 30 unless there are signs to the contrary.

All of them are very decent guys on here but sometimes this place is a a little 'preachy'!

A little?

You, sir, do a nice line in understatement.

Cougar - Moderator

That said. ACPO guidelines for the course is 10%+2,

Remember they were only guidelines and ACPO hasn't existed for years 🙂

Preachy? Please forgive those who have to share the road with errant motorists having an opinion on road safety....

Remember they were only guidelines and ACPO hasn't existed for years

A pointless guideline at that.

Street lights present assume its 30. If it's anything else there will be a big sign, but also small signs (repeaters) at short intervals. So if your unsure slow to 30, if you see a repeater saying 40 after 100 metres you can speed up.

I believe the street lights have to occur at a certain regularity to qualify as a 30. Those pictures above, bottom yes, top maybe and maybe not.

Also the tolerance before a fine has changed just recently I think? News was saying about potential to be fined just for doing 31 in a 30 and a heavier fine. Though could be typical exaggerated news.

Anyway, if there's a cop with a speed gun then likely it's a place where many aren't aware of the speed and a nice revenue generator. If they're that concerned about accidents there they'd stick big signs up and slow down markings.

As thegreatape says, a cop with a handheld speed gun would have either flagged you down or sent his mates to get you. You haven't been done, but this may be a good reminder to sort out the rules of the game before you play.

Also the tolerance before a fine has changed just recently I think? News was saying about potential to be fined just for doing 31 in a 30 and a heavier fine. Though could be typical exaggerated news.

A bit of both.

Was it 35 or 40 you were "pootling" at?

I feel your pain. I've seen some real inconstancy in 30 limits applied around the country:-

apparently its ok to go through [url= https://www.google.co.uk/maps/ @51.9383151,-5.1259877,3a,75y,76.78h,97.7t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1shB2t1vaFbfLgZY_fJc9ZzQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656]here[/url] at 50

But [url= https://www.google.co.uk/maps/ @51.0093003,-0.9976449,3a,75y,113.22h,79.34t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sThD9YAnqLQxLXHjau46XdA!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo2.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3DThD9YAnqLQxLXHjau46XdA%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D58.843994%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656]here[/url] only 30 would be considered safe.

For me all the guidance about looking for 'indicators' such as speed limit signs on side roads, repeaters or lack there of, and the distance between lamp posts is just a workaround for poorly applied logic to speed limits. The op is right - after 20 years you should be able to 'feel' what is the right speed for the road and the sign should be there just for confirmation. I'm not sure I want drivers casting about for signs on side roads and the like - I'd rather they were focussed on avoiding each other and bystanders as their primary objective.

However if in doubt slow down would not be an unreasonable rule of thumb.

I don't think these days anyone can expect to maintain a clean driving career. We're all human so the possibility of making errors exists for us all, nobody is perfect and with the increase in the means and methods to be able to catch people speeding at any given time so much more effective now it really is a case of when not if for most people.

I got a few minor misdemeanours when I first passed my test, as case of typical early driver being a D-head, then I knuckled down and had a pretty trouble free driving career until a few years ago when I got clocked at 36 in a 30 - again all the usual excuses, but ultimately its only ever the drivers fault, you can't blame anyone else.

But i'm glad I did the speed awareness course. It was very valuable, taught me so much more than I ever learned from my learning to drive days and so much more than what's in the HC. The HC just lists some minimal rules that we should abide by - most of it isn't law its is just a code, but there is so much more that isn't even in the HC that you will learn if you do a speed awareness course or more advanced driving courses.

I all in favour of everyone having a speed awareness course type of course every 10 or 15 years to maintain their licence. However it was a bit depressing to see the attitude and sheer mix of arrogance and ignorance of some of the knuckle draggers on the course. Their attitude was shocking. There are so many people who just need their licences revoked immediately.

I went to my Speed Awareness Course (66 in a 60) expecting to know it all, pretty quickly realised I didn't, heard some interesting stuff and took the opportunity to come out of the place with a better attitude to driving generally, which I like to think I've kept even a few years later.

apparently its ok to go through here at 50

But

here only 30 would be considered safe.

Again the limit not target, it may not be safe to go through either at 30mph in some conditions.
As proven by this thread many people are unaware of the rules of the road while others choose to ignore them.
Currently sat in Victoria Oz where if you want to flaunt the rules you need deep pockets, it does help and we will be heading up the main highway towards Sydney in the morning and I reckon 95% will be at or close to the limit in good conditions with very few making progress hard.

This week they are out with long lenses catching people on their phones. Enforcement should just be that, it's not revenue generation.

I don't think these days anyone can expect to maintain a clean driving career. We're all human so the possibility of making errors exists for us all, nobody is perfect and with the increase in the means and methods to be able to catch people speeding at any given time so much more effective now it really is a case of when not if for most people.

This is true.

I have, so far, managed to keep a clean license through partly luck and partly knowledge of the local speed trap locations. I was a much faster driver in my youth (we probably all were) but have definitely calmed down over the last decade or so.
I'm actually waiting to be caught at some point! This is despite me having regular driver training and assessment with work (I'm also a driving assessor for new starters) but I count that as being offset by the amount of business miles I do. My assessment reports always come back as very good, majoring on observation skills - I blame that on learning to read the trail on the bike. But then I don't claim my clean license is a sign of my good driving skills. I have one colleague who always just scrapes through his annual assessment, normally he drives without a seat belt, has poor lane discipline, uses his phone regularly, doesn't really care for speed limits (he's also a biker who likes speed) and regularly puts dings and scrapes in the works vans. But he also has a clean license so by that measure we are both as good as each other.

I think that's a long-winded way of saying I like the idea of regular retests/assessments for people who hold a driving license 😳

Again the limit not target, it may not be safe to go through either at 30mph in some conditions.

I am not sure of the relevance of this statement. I think anyone with a brain (and I know I am discounting a sizeable minority) know that speed limits are indeed what they say they are and not some target which one must drive at. My argument illustrated with the two examples is that in the former I don't think there would ever be a time of day or weather condition that would make 50 an appropriate speed so the limit is too high whilst in the latter it is arguably more restrictive in some conditions and times of day than necessary. Which leads to unnecessary confusion and otherwise good drivers with good instincts fannying about looking for 'indicators' to check for the speed limit.

Those of you going on about streetlights might want to refresh your knowledge. 183 m apart is your clue 😉

Maybe I should always assume a 30 if I don't know the speed limit .. was that my mistake?

My wife got caught doing 40 in a 30 zone, she was accelerating into a national speed limit area. The road also slopes downhill

From here (left lane same as the little peugot)

[img] [/img]

to here

[img] [/img]

Far be it from to suggest the police just sit and collect revenue at this spot, but that's exactly what they seem to be doing.

My wife got caught doing 40 in a 30 zone, she was accelerating into a national speed limit area.

Ahh, that's not something I have quite so much sympathy for. We used to live opposite a village primary school and the national speed limit sign just became visible about the point you went past the school. There was definitely a perception of some 'frequent flyers' on that road that accelerating hard once you can see the sign was fair game irrespective of the fact you were still going past the school.

Was she driving towards the NSL in the lower pic? With the t junction there which as a driver joining would be really helpful if the traffic was doing the advertised limit or at least being consistent. Looks like the NSL signs are there for good reasons and hence enforcing them is a good idea. The gem from a driving course through work was they NSL's are not magnetic...

I got done for doing 40 about where the viewpoint is on the A4, just where it exits a railway bridge,

Can't agree that 40 (or probably slightly more) would ever be appropriate just after exiting [url= https://www.google.co.uk/maps/ @51.4518314,-2.1322661,3a,75y,260.14h,66.89t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1suBoITJ4NDzd4ZkRPvUrL1g!2e0!7i13312!8i6656]this underpass[/url] in a residential area.

You can always find plenty of examples of roads where the limit needs to go down, but I doubt there will as many where a lower limit has been put there with no justification whatsoever.

Take your A272 example. Your argument makes some sense from the angle you've presented, but drive from the [url= https://www.google.co.uk/maps/ @51.0100424,-0.9878073,3a,75y,329.2h,71.88t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1si3WupUKJTkqLZ0-6VSyObg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656]opposite direction[/url] and the reasons for some kind restriction are totally obvious. Blind bends and crests just before junctions, playground sign on right etc. I'd wager that if you look into the archives you'll find some nasty accidents on that stretch. You could argue that 40 might just be OK, but I'd say 30 was about right.

mikewsmith

Was she driving towards the NSL in the lower pic? With the t junction there which as a driver joining would be really helpful if the traffic was doing the advertised limit or at least being consistent. Looks like the NSL signs are there for good reasons and hence enforcing them is a good idea. The gem from a driving course through work was they NSL's are not magnetic...

Yes, driving towards the NSL. I get your point, however hiding in a lay bye targeting people leaving town doesn't really do anything to proactively protect or ensure the safety of people at that T-Junction. To find out two weeks after the fact. As you can see there's a climbing lane on the same side of the road as that T-junction and then you are straight into a 30.

She's obviously going to do the speed awareness but I think doing 40 as you leave the 30 going into the NSL is far less agregious than the people doing 60+ well into the 30 (and these would be the main revenue source for the aforementioned hidden police).

Where I got done was M4 run up to the tolls after the bridge into Wales. Goes 70 to 50 and runs for a long stretch at 50 up to the tolls. Everyone just starts to slow down until they get to the tolls. Cops sit on the bridge behind a gantry and collect a fortune there, detecting speeds half a mile away down the road.

In my case I was going 63 and slowing down just a little after the 50 sign, several cars speeding past me at the time also.

Sure, I'm still in the wrong and took the speed awareness course (was useful), but that one definitely seems more about revenue than safety, considering everyone is aware of the tolls coming up. Plus they could do a lot more to slow people down if that concerned instead of a 50 sign that you could blink and miss.

Your argument makes some sense from the angle you've presented,

Yup a very selective photo.

My wife got caught doing 40 in a 30 zone, she was accelerating into a national speed limit area.

The second part of that sentence is not needed.

hiding in a lay bye targeting people leaving town doesn't really do anything to proactively protect or ensure the safety of people at that T-Junction.

Depends. If they nab a load of locals/commuters who make a habit of doing this, it may well change their behaviour in future and reduce the problems for the poor buggers who have to turn right out of that junction. I take it your wife won't be doing it again?

I agree that 40 probably wasn't the worst case they had that day, I imagine that they put the van there primarily to get those accelerating a lot harder from a lot further back.

I mean if there was only some way to avoid these speeding taxes.

Drac

The second part of that sentence is not needed.

Well she's a person not a Tesla, people make mistakes and when they do it can be useful to review them to figure out why. I can see from the first page of this thread that most of STW is populated by driving robots who can quote the Highway Code, chapter and verse and who presumably have never sped or made a mistake driving, but thank **** I'm not married to someone like that 😆

martinhutch
imagine that they put the van there primarily to get those accelerating a lot harder from a lot further back.

No they're mainly targeting people who don't slow to 30 as they come off the climbing lane.

Well she's a person not a Tesla, people make mistakes and when they do it can be useful to review them to figure out why.

It happens with increasing regularity as you come to realise it's a government cash cow, you'll get offered the course which by and large is a massive waste of a day and costs 80 odd quid which is a lot for a minor infraction, but you'll take something from the course. Thirty in third seems to have stuck with me and locally I'm hardly ever out of third gear, even in forty zones where I have now become one of those irritating drivers that still does thirty ish.

I always used to push my luck, time was I had three sets of 12 points in a row, but not these days that annoying course pushed a couple of buttons and now I'm embarrassingly well behaved and a bit better informed than I was, since I passed my test in 1965.

I find the gimzo that reads speed limits (displayed on dash and speedo) on our car is very useful as an additional aid to checking the speed limit you are currently in.

people make mistakes and when they do it can be useful to review them to figure out why.

Far be it from to suggest the police just sit and collect revenue at this spot, but that's exactly what they seem to be doing.

Seems like you've reviewed your wife's mistakes and blamed the police.

There aren't many on this thread who are claiming to be perfect. The only difference is those who choose to suck it up and admit their punishment is totally justified, and use it as a learning experience, and those who think it was all terribly unfair.

Yup a very selective photo.

apart from the 2nd link being to a location almost 1 mile from mine.....

Although I agree in your location a 100-150m stretch needs a bit of protection. Not sure what the shortest speed restriction from NSL can be.

Well she's a person not a Tesla, people make mistakes and when they do it can be useful to review them to figure out why.

They do her mistake was thinking you needed to speed up before reaching the NSL.

If you start it entering the village, you may as well keep it until the final junction has been passed. Can't see any problem with that limit, TBH, or the stretch of 40 after it.

I'm genuinely puzzled by the streetlight thing, and it's something I've tried to understand in the past. Am I right in thinking that if a road is [b]marked with a national speed limit[/b] sign, and you enter a section with streetlights (a certain width apart), it then becomes a 30mph limit enforceable by law? There is no need for 30 signs anywhere?

The repeater thing I don't mind, and always assume 30 if there are none. But the streetlights are way too confusing if my understanding is correct.

My wife got caught doing 40 in a 30 zone, she was accelerating into a national speed limit area.

I grew up on a 30 limit road, couple of hundred metres before it changes to NSL. And the amount of people who speed up to 60 or 70 through the end of the village is ridiculous. I can reel off loads of accidents - some are incomprehensible. People crashed into our house, our neighbours house, our neighbour, our neighbour's grandchild (almost died). Literally dozens, on a perfectly straight road. At least one fatality right outside the door. I very much doubt any of them would have happened had they not sped up before the NSL, or failed to slow down before they reached it.

Drac
They do her mistake was thinking you needed to speed up before reaching the NSL.

Ah yes. It's either black or white. She either was speeding or wasn't therefore she was either going too fast or she wasn't. I mean it's irrelevant that she exited a side road from a hospital on to a stretch of road 90 miles from where she lives which has no speed limits indicated and without carefully watching the speedo the car would easily roll down the hill at 40mph in that section. She's still a menace.

Less of a toss could I give that she's going to have to spend her money and her time doing a speed awareness because she didn't have her eyes glued to a speedo on an unfamiliar stretch of road, or that she didn't spot the cops hunkered down behind an unmarked van, just keep scoring your internet points there. You're winning 😆

I'm genuinely puzzled by the streetlight thing, and it's something I've tried to understand in the past. Am I right in thinking that if a road is marked with a national speed limit sign, and you enter a section with streetlights (a certain width apart), it then becomes a 30mph limit enforceable by law? There is no need for 30 signs anywhere?

No, there is always a sign where a speed limit changes.

Am I right in thinking that if a road is marked with a national speed limit sign, and you enter a section with streetlights (a certain width apart), it then becomes a 30mph limit enforceable by law? There is no need for 30 signs anywhere?

There are lots of places in London that would be assumed to be 30 according to the rules but are now actually 20. It's very easy to miss the sign (being at junctions where you have lots going on) but there are repeaters. I doubt it will be policed but it would be hard if you were using a telematics box.

I mean it's irrelevant that she exited a side road from a hospital on to a stretch of road 90 miles from where she lives which has no speed limits indicated

Yes, it is. And half the content of this thread is about the 'indications' which help drivers work out the speed limit in the absence of repeaters. Sounds like the speed awareness course (where they go over this kind of boring, useless information) might be quite handy. It certainly was for me.

Your wife was speeding and got caught. No internet point winning here but your wife has won some points. Same as when it happened to me, I was speeding and got caught. It was my fault I was speeding on a pretty empty dual carriageway 250 miles from home. Not sure if it was near a hospital.

There is no need to stare at your Speedo I'm not sure why people use that one.

I mean it's irrelevant that she exited a side road from a hospital

on to a stretch of road 90 miles from where she lives which has no speed limits indicated

she was accelerating into a national speed limit area

because she didn't have her eyes glued to a speedo on an unfamiliar stretch of road

Stop whining; she was inattentive and is paying the price

No, there is always a sign where a speed limit changes.

It's not always clear.

There's a section of my commute which goes from 40 to NSL to 30. The 40 is a built-up area, the NSL bit is a country road and then the 30 applies just before buildings appear again. After the buildings have been passed, it goes back up to 50.

As you get signs when the limit changes, the only logical limit for the NSL is for it to be a 60mph limit. Yet, there are regular street lamps which could imply a 30.

Rule 124 of THC (emphasis mine):
[i]
You MUST NOT exceed the maximum speed limits for the road and for your vehicle (see the speed limits table). The presence of street lights generally means that there is a 30 mph (48 km/h) speed limit [b]unless otherwise specified.[/b][/i]

So despite the presence of street lights, it's indicated as NSL, so it's 60. If you'd missed the first NSL sign though and was looking for clues, you'd assume 30. (I can't remember offhand if there's repeaters.)

It's broadly an irrelevance anyway, most drivers in front of me on that 40-60-30-50 stretch do 40mph through the lot. The 30mph section is a favourite spot for mobile speed cameras.

her mistake was thinking you needed to speed up before reaching the NSL.

Once on a motorcycle lesson, I got shouted at by my instructor for [i]not[/i] doing this. WTF? Needless to say, I ignored her.

They were expected to notice the change or they would "fail". But the point is that all drivers are expected to know.

Surely there's no such thing as an unsigned road. There will always be a sign you've most recently passed.

Once on a motorcycle lesson, I got shouted at by my instructor for not doing this. WTF? Needless to say, I ignored her.

Was it Mrs Jimjam?

But the point is that all drivers are expected to know.

But how do you know??

For example, the road I grew up on (described before). Once you hit the NSL, there are still street lamps all the way. Are they less than 183m apart? I've no idea, and would never know that without measuring. I think they'd be somewhere in that region.

It makes more sense that a change in speed would always be marked. And I'm going to assume that from now on, and that NSL is not 30 when streetlit. I think the main confusion has come from the fact that this has been described to me as national speed limit. When in reality we're talking default limits for all roads if we were to remove signage, and that's a different thing - nothing to do with NSL at all.

Some good points made in this thread regarding recognition of limits.

It's amazing how many people look at a road and choose a limit due to the features of the road, houses etc. I have a lot of students who will think they are in a 40 when they are in a 30 due to the houses being further apart. I always have a joke with them that they " see a bit of grass and think it's a 40 "

Around my area, there is a lot of areas with missing repeater signs so, for test purposes, if they miss the 40 and carry on at 30, they will fail. Not a massive problem when you have passed apart from annoying people behind.

A good one to ask motorists is what speed they should drive at when they see the national speed limit sign. You will get answers from 30, 40 but rarely will anyone get it correct that you can drive a car at 60 in a national.

I don't think it's been mentioned so far but the only time you will get 30 mph repeaters is when there are no street lights.

A good one to ask motorists is what speed they [b]should[/b] drive at when they see the national speed limit sign. You will get answers from 30, 40 but rarely will anyone get it correct that you can drive a car at 60 in a national.

There are countless roads around here that are NSL where you most definitely shouldn't drive at 60 mph. Maybe you want to rephrase your question?

A good one to ask motorists is what speed they should drive at [b]when they see[/b] the national speed limit sign. You will get answers from 30, 40 but rarely will anyone get it correct that you can drive a car at 60 in a national.

That's what got Mrs JimJam into difficulties. 🙂

The one that I hadn't realised is that a dual carriageway simply refers to the separation between the carriageways, not the number of lanes on each side - so you can do 70 on a single lane highway as long as the carriageways are separated.

A good one to ask motorists is what speed they should drive at when they see the national speed limit sign. You will get answers from 30, 40 but rarely will anyone get it correct that you can drive a car at 60 in a national.
There are countless roads around here that are NSL where you most definitely shouldn't drive at 60 mph. Maybe you want to rephrase your question?

Ok. " what is the national speed limit for a car and if safe to do so, what speed can you get upto ? "

rarely will anyone get it correct that you can drive a car at 60 in a national.

The correct answer is up to 70, depending on the road type.

Ok. " what is the national speed limit for a car and if safe to do so, what speed can you get upto ? "