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I'm currently a London based civil servant, living in the suburbs, commuting (other than this weird year) to central London. Typical family life, wife 3 young kids (eldest is 5), semi in a number street but pure suburbia.
My department is, like a few others, opening offices and moving roles out of London. All voluntary and very easily days but with the aim of a significant shift over the next decade.
Neither my wife nor I are in love with London and I think a move might be good. Not had much of a chat about a move with my wife, I think we both find it hard to think about as we know nothing about the two options which are Birmingham, or Leeds. I think I'm more open to the idea that London doesn't really work amazingly for us and willing to look at the options but.. How? How do I start to research the two city's and to make it seem more real, maybe enough to start to engage my wife in at least thinking about it could happen and at a certain point might be good to plan for? Who's gone through similar and how did you research it? I've moved cities before, so had my wife, but not as part of a family unit which makes things much harder!
I'd start on here, there'll be loads of STWrs living in those places with children who can give you some background.
Plus, there's usually 'obvious' areas to start looking. In Brum for example Solihull is a 'nice affluent middle class' bit, there are bound to be others, same goes for Leeds (up near Roundhay Park?)
Make a short list and spend a dirty weekend, sorry, research weekend in a B&B or similar. Have a wander around and meet the people? I wouldn't consider moving to somewhere if I hadn't at least had a good nose around.
Visit likely cities, get a feel for them, ask on here, then go back and look at possible areas to live.
20 years ago a chance move a friend led us to move from Sussex to Derby - we'd holidayed up here, liked the Peak District, but it was chance that gave us the idea to move. Best thing we could have done, could never have afforded our lifestyle on 1 and a bit salaries down south.
Civil service moving out will be a slow process but more departments will switch to it, and lockdown has given the experience that it can work.
Leeds is great. So good that I live in Bradford 😉
No seriously it’s a great city, but public transport infrastructure is poor and going to get worse before it gets better. There are rail links to the northeast via York; south via Wakefield; Harrogate; west via Bradford, Shipley or Morley. The main arterial routes in & out of the city by car are dreadful in rush hour. Obvious cycle routes are East - Aire & Calder, or west - Leeds & Liverpool canals.
The more affluent areas are north of the city & generally outside the outer ring road.
Two major sports stadia - Headingley in the north of the city is home to Leeds Rhinos rugby league and Yorkshire County Cricket club. South of the city is Elland Road, home to Leeds United FC
Very vibrant city centre with strong restaurant scene, not bad for music venues either.
Three universities, one of which is way out of town at Horsforth. The other two are just north of the city centre, Headingley is Student central
If you're going to move, don't move to somewhere and set yourself up with a big commute.
Oh, and often locals have totally emotional reasons of why one are is better/worse than others.
Leeds is a good example. We moved there in 1988 and at the time an equivalent house in north Leeds cost at least twice what one did in south Leeds. So we bought in Morley (Churwell). Got a new 3 bed semi for the price of a 2up/2down.
I’ve moved cities before, so had my wife, but not as part of a family unit which makes things much harder!
We have moved both city to city, city to rural Highlands, and Highlands to town, with three kids in tow.
Firstly, kids are resilient. Moving does have an impact, I think the older they are the greater that is. Having said that, they bounce back and in our experience are richer and more experience in 'the world' through having lived in a few places.
If you are moving out of the big London smoke, think about why. What could make life better in some way? What do you enjoy doing? Your choice of city should be based on this, rather than something odd like house prices. In my view all cities have cheap and expensive areas, good schools etc. The difference may be how close the riding trails or beach is....Our (extreme) move to the Highlands meant our kids have spent a decade growing up with mountains, bikes and canoes as 'normal' and it has stuck with them.
I would also say think about ease of travel back to family - we have accepted that family are a few hours away. Frankly, after a couple of hours, we may as well travel 8 hours, it is always going to be a weekend back to see the grandparents on both sides.
(
Before kids I mtb'd or rock climbed most of my weekends. I much prefer the outdoors to city type entrainment. That said I enjoy an occasional show or meal like anyone. Whith a 5 and 3yo, and now 6 month old life is very different but if possible I'd like to lunge somewhere we could enjoy outdoor life more than here..... From zone 3 London to anywhere outdoorsy is a bit of a trek before you start! Doesn't have to be MTB or rock though.... Beaches, hills anything really... Fingers crossed the kids would enjoy it given a chance. Wife similarly. She was a swimmer, a runner, enjoys exercise and sport... Although less 'extreme' stuff. As for commute... I'd hope to cycle so that puts a 10 mile ish radius from the office, but getting older and recognising i can't be selfish...I'd accept a train ride commute if it was good for the family....I couldn't face a long commute each way though.
If it helps, Leeds to all sorts of countryside from a 'nice' residential area isn't that far, same for a cycle commute into the city. It also is closer to bigger day trips to NYM, North Peak, Todmorden(!), Forest of Bowland, Dales, Pennines, Lakes, Scotland...
Birmingham feels (and is) a bigger place. I don't have direct experience, but it is further to 'better quality' greenspace. Brum is closer to Wales and only slightly further time wise to Lakes.
Just be careful you aren't just swapping expensive London suburban drudgery for slightly cheaper somewhere else drudgery.
Will you have to go back to Mon-Fri in the city centre office?
If not, that opens up a lot of options to live somewhere that you could commute into Leeds or Brum two days a week (or whatever).
If it were just between the two cities, I'd take Leeds personally. But still don't expect an MTB mecca.
^^100%
Used to work between offices in Birmingham & London. If commuting into city centre, I found both much the same, just one was cheaper.
I get the want to move into the countryside for better trails but to swap one city for another...
I moved to work in Birmingham over 10 years ago. We live near Solihull and I commute in by car/ bike/ train according to how I feel & what I need to do that day. I picked Birmingham purely based on the job and did not know the city at all - I think I just took the view that one city is much like the next. We had 3 kids similar ages to yours. We moved here from Melbourne, which was great but only ever for a year, and before that lived in Oxford, Manchester & Newcastle. I spent quite a bit of time in Leeds when I was younger and really liked it, but pre-kids is very different to post.
What dont we have here - a beach is what I miss the most having grown up on the coast. Apart from that you find what you need. We hardly ever go into the city centre but its fine if we want to. Rail/air travel links are good and only set to improve with HS2. I work in London 1 day a week and its so easy to get to. Flying abroad with work (obvs pre C19) involves a 10 min trip to the airport.
Lots of variety in terms of days out with the kids - we regularly travelled to Shropshire, Peaks, Cotswolds when they were younger (almost grown up now). They all ended up playng water polo as there is a big scene around Bham with lots of clubs (who knew). Lots of athletics too - middle child was a Birchfield Harrier. We live in a really nice village which feels safe and has decent local schools that the kids walked to. House prices are expensive here for the Midlands but not by London standards. Lots of really nice road cycling from the door, off road locally involves linking up canals and BWs. The Wyre and Cannock are both 40mins and have good riding. Shropshire and the Peaks 90mins for a bigger day out.
Just be careful you aren’t just swapping expensive London suburban drudgery for slightly cheaper somewhere else drudgery
This would be my thought.
I love Birmingham, and have spent time in Leeds and like it there too, but they're still both big cities with all the positives and negatives that brings.
However, if the move coincides with more flexible working (2 days in the office rather than 5) then what a move to either does enable is a move further out to open up the countryside and other parts of the country in general.
I can only comment on B'ham, but a 90 mins commute would be horrible 5 days per week but doable for 2. That'll put you comfortable into the Worcestershire Countryside, the edge of the Cotswolds and maybe the edge of The Peak District if you picked your trains carefully. Being central it also keeps most of the rest of the country within 2 hours as well.
I guess the first thing you need to decide is what you want from a move, and what (if anything) you're prepared to sacrifice. I'd then try and work at an area around those 2 cities that provides that blend (perhaps with the help of locals on here), then visit, drive around, go to the pubs, coffee shops, and the train stations and get a feel for the place. Heck, visit a few estate agents too, they'll sell you the dream but should at least know a few locations to look at.
And remember the general rule is that the west of a city is normally nicer than the east. You can think the Victorians for that.
I moved out of London c 20 years ago, was not sure if I would miss it and the move back seemed pretty irreversible, so sold the house and bought a flat as a fall back position. As it happens I have never really wanted to go back permanently and the flat has been let continuously since. Ironically the flat is on the same road as the old house, I never did venture too far looking at property.
I still go back to visit friends but stay in hotels, also nice if future family members need a London base to work or study.
Work out your parameters - your maximum commute, public transport or car, likely times of travel. Start picking out towns within that range and going to have a look.
Out of the two, I'd recommend Leeds, but that's without knowing much about what you'd go for.
All I know is that places like Skipton and Ilkley are a shortish train commute away, with good schools, a good standard of living, access to MTBing from the doorstep.
It's bull, obviously, I'm a right miserable bastard. 🙂
Move to Leeds and look at living in Ilkley or Otley, Ilkley has a train station though. I should imagine loads of biking within an hours drive, certainly more countryside than the majority of Brum.
In Brum for example Solihull is a ‘nice affluent middle class’ bit,
I live on the Worcestershire border of Solihull, we moved across the border a couple of years ago when I came back from Singapore. lots of greenery/walks etc from the door. And while it's a nice place to live it is crap for MTB - Road is ok if you can get out. I'm only living here because of my partner's family and if things drop in to place we're looking to potentially move to Colorado (new thread starting soon).
The Stourbridge side of Brum is nice, lots of small villages, and much better access to 'from the doorstep' cycling - there's a few groups to tag along with and the commute in to the city is a about the same. plus, you're on the right side of Brum to easily get out to the proper Worc/Shrop/Staff countryside.
Morecash, Indeed that's a bit how we feel... Life currently is ok but 'expensive suburban drudgery' isn't far wrong me. Partly just when 3 kids 5 and under its busy but also we find London big, hectic, impersonal, transient and while it had loads to offer the daily grind of commute, traffic etc etc drains the energy. We are both more city than rural people but somewhere a bit less hectic appeals. I lived in Bristol for a decade (back as a single guy) and my wife lived in Chester for a similar time.... Both a bit slower than London but big enough (Bristol anyway,.. Chester sometimes small perhaps). We'd not be looking for any magical life changes, but a slightly smaller and less hectic city with more friendly people and less transient relationships, plus more affordable and easier access to countryside. I tend to think Leeds could offer this but in reality I know nothing about Leeds.
Cha****ng, no one knows. The civil service will move slowly but I expect we will WFH more.... My guess would be we will still be expected in the office 3 or 4 times a week for a few years though.
What else do it want from a move? Well we will outgrow this 3 bed semi in SE19 soon. So a larger house in a nice area with good schools would be a priority. Beyond that I think I'm result pleased.. I tend to think home is just a place to eat and sleep, life is lived outside the house. Although...I guess having a family means 'home' and house are closer together.
The biggest things neither of us like about London are it's busy, hectic, impersonal, transient and expensive, even on a pretty decent salary it feels expensive.
I think a browse on right move might help a little.....other than Solihull and ilkey can anyone suggest a few other areas to investigate a bit?
Isn't Edgebaston quite posh too? Iirc I friend from university hailed from there... or 'Edge bar ston'.
Have a look at Leamington Spa and Warwick
Bit further out but both on the Chiltern line which works well
Possibly around Malvern too
We live in Dorridge
other than Solihull and ilkey can anyone suggest a few other areas to investigate a bit?
On the Birmingham front, with a focus South West as that's where I know:
Bromsgrove
Droitwich (a bit further out, but there's a train line into the The City)
Hagley/maybe Stourbridge
Rubery/Rednall
Alvechurch/Barnt Green
On the other side:
Sutton
Knowle/Dorrige (both close to Solihull but a little quieter)
I did a decent stint in Leeds - great city IMO.
The restaurant scene is banging, good bars, amazing clubs, each area has its own character. Much easier to meet up with friends because everyone lives within a 10 min drive of each other.... not like London where you can be an hour on public transport to get anywhere.
Live in Chapel A, Oakwood or Roundhay and you've got a really easy bike commute into town.
North Leeds v South Leeds... I'm firmly alleged to N Leeds 🙂
I love the size - big enough to be fun, small enough to be easy.
Shopping is decent as well.
Negatives:
- North Leeds isn't actually especially cheap and schools are over subscribed
- The weather is worse than London
- Culture and arts are much poorer than London
- There are not nearly so many things to 'do' as in London. In london there is always something free to go and do or see which esp with kids you might miss
- Car is king - forget walking and getting public transport
Do have a hard think about long term opportunities - will your children really thank you for moving them from London 'burbs to Leeds 'burbs? There are a hell of a lot more opportunities in London for teenagers and young adults which you could be overlooking because you're in the early years grind and TBH life is going to be pretty darn similar for you anywhere for the next 5 years....
Also think about your job opportunities - will they be limited if you leave London? Leeds is probably in the top 5 cities outside London in England for employment but it does not have the same quantity of employers as London.
Leeds + Ilkley/Otley would be my shout too. Leeds city centre is NOTHING like London. I like both, but London is MASSIVE even when taken piecemeal. Leeds is small, self contained and different areas are all walkable from one another.
The biggest things neither of us like about London are it’s busy, hectic, impersonal, transient and expensive, even on a pretty decent salary it feels expensive.
The only thing that is cheaper in Leeds than London is housing. I didn't see any tangible increase in other living costs when I did the Leeds>London move. Transport, food, going out - none of that is more expensive in London.
I'm not really sure if Leeds is less transient and impersonal - don't your children root you into the area in London and you have local friends through their school mates and an entry into a nice local community that way? And with primary catchments being so small you see everyone out and about at the local park etc?
I'm a Leeds born lad, now living in Bristol. You say you enjoyed living in Bristol and like living in a city. I would suggest the places to look at in the Leeds area are Horsforth to the north-west which has train line and easy access by bike to the city centre but also has a villagey/town feel to it - also good for access out to the Dales, airport and ring-road. Chapel Allerton and Oakwood are the current trendy areas and close to Roundhay Park, but a bit further away from the countryside. Adel, Lawnswood, Bramhope and Otley are all lovely with plenty of housing options but the downside is the nightmare congestion of Otley Road - though the first 3 are easy cycle commutes into the city centre. If I were moving back I would be looking at Horsforth if wanting to live in the city, or Ilkley, Skipton or Harrogate if wanting to live further out but in a town.
Which works best for the Wife?
I'm sure both have good areas and less good ones and proximity to office sounds reasonably important...
The one thing would put me off Birminham (unfairly) is I see it as the halfway place to get past before the traffic when going North/South for a weekend/week.
Having lived in central London then suburbia and finally outside the M25 there really is sod all I actually miss. I didn't really think that would be the case but all those things I thought I'd do or not find a substitute for I rarely think about anymore. They certainly don't bother me like I thought they would,
Kittyr, no it seems odd to us but at the school/ nursery very very few other parents even acknowledge you. Similar at various kids clubs. My wife has made a few friends but it's not uncommon for then to move on. I've lived here longer (she moved in with me) and I know virtually no one. Work colleagues can be spread all over so tend not to become close friends and the people I've met through clubs like climbing have been incredibly transient. Maybe I'm just pants at making friends, but I never struggled before London.
London's a strange place for making friends, a friends daughter worked there last year and lasted 3 months, she hated it as no one talked to her, she s good looking, young and had a good job so I suspect everyone thought she had her own life. London's too big and the roads too busy, my friends lived the other side of London and it took ages to go so we had to stay overnight, making spontaneous trips a non starter.
Now going back as a tourist is brilliant, loads of time to do everything I never got round to do when working there.
Having lived in/near both cities I'd suggest either N-NW Leeds or SW Birmingham.
We're currently in the countryside near Bromsgrove with a nice village centre and a 20min train journey to Brum. The NW Alps-style riding is close by as are the M5/M6, M42/M1 and M40.
Not got a great deal to add but as a father of older kids, 12 and 10, think the older your kids get the harder it will be for them ?
good luck
I lived and worked in Leeds; generally disliked it.
I'm surprised no-one has suggested the Calder valley; rural with lots of biking/hiking options.
Have never lived or worked in Brum; you mentioned Edgbaston - parts are attractive but, based on going to test matches, traffic can be horrendous.
Worked in Warwick, staying in Leamington Spa - quite liked both.
Cultural experiences in either Leeds or Brum don't compare to London.
Commuting in/out of Leeds is a ball ache; E-W rail services are stuck in the 1950's.
London’s too big and the roads too busy
Yes, please! C19 has temporarily put pay to our plans moving to London from a beautiful town in South Devon where we’ve had a great time for 20 years but it’s time for a change. Will now be heading there in the Spring for a few years for a change of scenery and lifestyle - and to spend more time with my Devon raised children who all live and work there and friends and family there. Lived in Sheffield, Manchester and Bristol so eyes open to city living. Really looking forward to it - horses for courses etc.
On the Birmingham front, with a focus South West as that’s where I know:
Bromsgrove
Droitwich (a bit further out, but there’s a train line into the The City)
Hagley/maybe Stourbridge
Rubery/Rednall
Alvechurch/Barnt Green
Kidderminster too, its got trains into Brum, most of the towns are a bit meh,. But the villages around are nice.
Brum is surrounded by other large towns, the urban area doesnt really stop for 25-30 miles in each direction apart from Barr Beacon.
I'd agree London is too big nd roads too busy. I walk and cycle as much as possible and loathe when forced to use the car. with the kids I'm forced to use the car a little more and can only see that increasing as they grow. with the faff of finding a parking spot a journey of a mile or 2 is often quicker on foot and my 7-8 mile commute to SW1a is quicker by bike than any car could manage!
Wife said earlier she didn't like Brum, I asked why that was and she said she thinks she went there once and didn;t like it... she's not really giving this much thought yet, that's fine, this is the start of what I'n sure will be a long thinking process!
I just had a peek on right move....wharfdale any good? just to get a feel. https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/84024883#/
looks fabulous and far more than our 1930s 3 bed semi! far more house I mean, not far more cost I assume Wharfdale isn't a scary slum.
You could come to Brizzle Neil. You’ll feel quite unique - you’ll meet absolutely nobody else who’s done the same move. 😉
Nah seriously, with the ages of your kids, it’ll be easier now than another few years down the road. I think you’d be pleasantly surprised by what yer London dollars (think how that floor will sell your house!) would get you here. Or anywhere outside London.
I like Leeds but the really important thing IMO is how you arrange your daily life, commute and schools etc. My experience is that if you can work that out ok you'll be happy, if you are stuck in traffic and/or unreliable public transport it will be a chore. I've always tried to live within biking distance of work and enjoyed a number of towns/cities in the UK and a stint in Japan (working at the edge of Yokohama, I could cycle in from a neighbouring town). Daily life is about having a workable routine. I do really like Leeds though and if I was a few decades younger would be happy to move there for a job.
Indeed Keiran. I enjoyed Bristol. I'm not in the same government Department I was when there but this one has stuff there and I could happily enough go back to the old Department. Leeds and Brum are where the current department is moving to, apparently along with others, and I could keep my current role and just move location....having only got promoted to this role 3 months ago I'm enjoying it and quite like the idea of a house move without the extra stress of a hage of jobs!
BTW, the floor is holding up well.
As mentioned previously, it’s worth spending time in both cities to get a basic feel for them. I know Leeds well but live in Birmingham. Both are similar in that they’re university cities and they’re both quite different.
In my eyes Brum is a divided city, commercial hospitality and chain restaurants to the north, much more independent to the south. There’s always stuff going on but you do need to find it, it’s a city that doesn’t reveal itself readily. We don’t shout about being Brummie’s but we love the place because “it’s not s**t!” There are affluent places to live although I’d give plenty of thought to what you enjoy doing when you go out. Solihull, Sutton Coldfield are affluent but uninspiring. Edgbaston and Little Aston are much more affluent but with little more than golf clubs for leisure.
As for riding, there’s plenty. Cannock Chase to the north (not just the Dog and Monkey), FOD, Shropshire. BPW is less than two hours. Countryside and parkland is never far away.
Everyone will tell you how great their city is but only you know what you’re looking for in a place to live.
I just had a peek on right move….wharfdale any good? just to get a feel. https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/84024883#/
looks fabulous and far more than our 1930s 3 bed semi! far more house I mean, not far more cost I assume Wharfdale isn’t a scary slum
Burley-in-Wharfedale is lovely. It's situated midway between Ilkley, Otley and Menston and very close to Ilkley Moor. It's got a station so easy access to Leeds. Also has the 'advantage' of have a choice of two congested road routes - A65 or A660 into Leeds. You would also be near the Ilkley branch of Booth's (a posh version of Waitrose) and the award-winning Lishman's butchers.
Quite a lot of comments about all the things to do in that there London. In reality how often do you go to a West End theatre or to one of the national museums? The North is not a cultural desert - Leeds has Opera North and the Northern Ballet, the internationally acclaimed West Yorkshire Playhouse, an arena, several museums including the Royal Armouries, and is easily accessible to York (Railway Museum etc.), Hepworth Gallery, Yorkshire Scuplture Park and Salt's Mill to name but a few. For the kids there's Harewood House with it's Bird Garden, Ligh****er Valley theme park, an open air lido in Ilkley, Diggerland in Castleford, loads of castles and ruined abbeys to explore. I doubt you or your family will be bored.
Brum is surrounded by other large towns, the urban area doesnt really stop for 25-30 miles in each direction apart from Barr Beacon.
I don’t know. Clent is 10 miles from the city, Lickey less than that. Once you’re at the other of those you’re into the countryside.
Sutton Park the other way is 6 miles I’d guess and you’re out of the city by then.
Kidderminster I didn’t suggest as IMO the town is a dive. Some nice places around it but as a town I’d avoid.
Kidderminster I didn’t suggest as IMO the town is a dive. Some nice places around it but as a town I’d avoid.
True but as you say some nice bits around it. Is it any worse than Stourbridge though?
I assume Wharfdale isn’t a scary slum
Burley-in-Wharfedale is lovely. £775k gets you [i]a lot[/i] of house. And it’s in Bradford district so council tax is cheaper.
Ilkley & Otley (either side of the village) both occasionally suffer from the river Wharfe flooding but I don’t think Burley has that problem. Further upstream from Ilkley & you’re into The Yorkshire Dales, in no time at all really.
Booths is a great little supermarket.
Don't move to Brum if you have any expectation to bike or climb. The midlands sucks for both. Expect 1.5 to 2 hour drive to anywhere good, although there are many options at that sort of distance. It really drains after a few years and imagine it would only be worse with children - I'm actively moving away for this reason, having moved to Midlands for my job post graduation!
John drummer, yes it's an awful lot of house! It's a totally different league to a 1930s 3 bed semi! For various reasons we would not be moving for a couple of years yet, but it was useful to just show my wife three house and start a conversation. I think she's more afraid of change and is now yet thinking about what we actually want and if this is a good opportunity for us, showing her an incredible looking house was a way to maybe spark and interest in considering the plus points that might be available to us too.
At 13-14 miles to central Leeds it's even cycle commute distance in good weather.
I'd not rule out Brum but I think the info here is making me lean towards Leeds of those 2 options.
There are lots of nice places like Burley-in-Wharfedale - price wise it's definitely premium for the area. Ben Rhydding is similar, but there are cheaper, but still nice bits of Ilkley to be found.
If you want your money to go further, Otley or Skipton, the latter has a 40 minute direct train ride into Leeds. Further down Wharfedale has some OK bits- maybe Menston or the surrounding area.
Schooling. Ilkley and Skipton both good - Skipton has two grammars, one of which is very good. South Craven School in Cross Hills also has a very good reputation.
Further down the Aire Valley is not so good - Keighley, Bingley (OK in parts), Shipley. Saltaire is OK, but a bit of an island surrounded by less nice areas.
Wife said earlier she didn’t like Brum, I asked why that was and she said she thinks she went there once and didn;t like it… she’s not really giving this much thought yet, that’s fine, this is the start of what I’n sure will be a long thinking process!
Either will be what you make of them and depend which areas.
Seems as good a reason as any to narrow the search?
Leeds and Brum are where the current department is moving to, apparently along with others, and I could keep my current role and just move location…
Large parts of Government are set to do similar over the next few years.
Commuting in/out of Leeds is a ball ache; E-W rail services are stuck in the 1950’s.
Yep, Leeds Station is soul-destroyingly awful and that's after they've done the place up! Heavily congested and it imports delays from all over the north due to the way the tracks are aligned, it's a bottleneck. There's scheduled to be a lot of work on it over the next 15 years or so as part of Trans Pennine route upgrade and Northern Powerhouse Rail assuming of course that they get funding. It can only get better but be warned, it's not great.
I'd be looking Ilkley way I think, but I'd be VERY aware of flood risks around that area, I remember Burley flooding a few years back. A lot of big hills drain into a few rivers.
Further down the Aire Valley is not so good – Keighley, Bingley (OK in parts), Shipley. Saltaire is OK, but a bit of an island surrounded by less nice areas.
You forgot to mention Baildon, it’s very nice here once you get away from the river, most of the village is high enough not to ever worry about flooding. Commuting into Leeds is easy & safe on the Leeds/Liverpool canal, Baildon has a train station but you’d need to change at either Shipley or Guiseley.
By car it’s either A65 or A657, which in turn joins up with either the A65 at Kirkstall or the A647 at Armley Ridge. Both roads clog up horribly in rush hour. Major roadworks on the A657 where it crosses the A658 at Greengates for at least the next 9 months.
Otley doesn’t have a railway station but there are shuttle buses running from the town centre to the railway station at Menston
Brum is massive - I don’t miss the traffic nor driving standards. As suggested, the west parts are better for mtbing - I used to live in Longbridge which is being regenerated, and had door rides to Licky and Clent hills and beyond. Nice villages as Barnt Green. Closer in Harbourne is nice, lived there for a few years. Stay a few years until your kids develop the accent. If they do, move to Surrey. When that accent develops move to er, Plymouth and find yourself speaking Janner within 2 years 😆
The other slight attraction to Leeds is it's closer to my wife's family in Liverpool. A journey from South London is hell, Brum would be a better journey but Leeds/Liverpool is almost quick as it takes to cross London!
I feel positive, even excited, by the possibility of a move and at least with the internet and time I can research at leisure. Maybe I'll have to book a week's family holiday in the dales and start sewing more seeds with my wife.
Wharfedale is rubbish - don't do it.
Not really - lived here for over 20 years after moving from the flat lands in the south. Use the Ilkley line train to Leeds (pre-Covid) on a daily basis and it's better than driving the A65. Riding from the area to the city centre is excellent if you know where to look as well. Plenty of legit and cheeky off road options.
In terms of local riding and climbing then you are spoilt for choice. Surrounded by steep hills on all sides with both natural and hand built tracks. And if you like gritstone then 3 key areas (Caley/Ilkley/Almscliffe) all within view.
Sister in Law lives in Brum and it's a very different place/experience. I recall driving to the Lickey hills from their house and thinking 'is this it'...
In the before times, the train to Leeds was 20 mins and opened up more than enough variety of museums, activites, restaurants and night life to keep me happy.
Not found anywhere else (in the UK) i'd choose to move to yet....
It sounds quite appealing to me. I hope my department starts to answer some more questions about the move, as that might affect costs and salary hence impact choice of house and location. I also hope I can make it seem a viable option worth consideration for my wife. I feel quite excited, so actually I'm glad she is more reticent and stops me being too rash.
If I do end up near Leeds I'll have to dig out the ropes.... And I guess learn a bit of trad. It's been easy to just clip bolts down south.
The other slight attraction to Leeds is it’s closer to my wife’s family in Liverpool. A journey from South London is hell, Brum would be a better journey but Leeds/Liverpool is almost quick as it takes to cross London!
You obviously got the M62 on a good day!
Train is about 90 - 120 mins on that route.
Otley doesn’t have a railway station but there are shuttle buses running from the town centre to the railway station at Menston
It's utterly useless as it tends to arrive at the station just after the train you want has left and leave just before the train you're on arrives. I live in Otley and work in Bradford so just drive as I can avoid the peak times. Cycling in is ok in parts but it's hilly and the standard of driving is the worst I've experienced anywhere. If I was commuting to Leeds I'd use a beater bike and cycle the couple of miles along the valley to get the train at Burley as it's flatter and you'll get a seat.
Otley is a nice place to live, there's plenty of decent pubs and places to eat, probably as it's fairly hard to get out of on public transport. All of the other villages in the valley on the railway line suffer from the easy access to Leeds and the greater choice it brings.