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Someone was saying in the royal yacht thread about the ostentatiousness of modern superyachts, all gaudy and tasteless chrome and marble.
This is different, completely different. so simple, so elegant. Words just cannot describe.
It's also built in Britain, not fabricated in a yard off in Taiwan.
That is a very Lovely Thing.
The key to its real beauty was in the phrase - "For the owner to sail"
so simple,
It's a beautiful thing but it's not "simple".
Sure, it's a lot less gaudy bauble than a lot of the others you see, but really, so what? I mean, no one needs one of these ridiculous things. It'll still end up as the plaything of some ostentatiously rich dickhead. Perhaps some spectacularly tone deaf executive will spend the next pandemic holed up in it?
Don't understand the slavish fascination TBH, you may as well swoon over a converted 727, or some other "**** you" to the plebs.
nickc - Why the resentment of other peoples choice? Is this a carry over from the school playground where the dickhead kid had better trainers than you?
I have a car but I have parked next to nicer cars. That doesn't make my car worse or the other driver a dickhead. What happens when someone with a worse car than mine parks next to me, do I suddenly change from being the virtuous poor to a dickhead?
Sure, it's pretty but not sure it's very practical. Pretty sure there's a reason why you don't often see semi-circular benches in a cockpit of a boat that heels over.
Its a beautiful boat to be sure, has really captured the lines of a classic daysailing boat, but massively scaled up.
But therein lies the problem, sizing up a standard bermuda rig to such a scale has certain issues that makes it in some ways just as much as an ostentatious show off as a triple deck gin palace.
I only flicked through the video with sound off, how deep is the keel? Big draft is going to struggle to run up the Thames, get int Monaco etc.
nickc – Why the resentment of other peoples choice?
I resent the existence of billionaires. Every one should frankly as they are parasites. It has nothing to do with envy, I'm completely content personally but the sort of folk who have enough money to buy one of these, is also at the same time buying all sorts of other political gifts with their money, and in any remotely sensible world; that these people should have been taxed out of existence should not be a controversial thing to say.
These folk haven't had to "work hard" to become this wealthy (there's a stat somewhere that says even if you earned $5000 a day since Columbus landed in the Caribbean in 1492, you'd still not be a rich as Bozos) They've generally not earned their wealth, so catering for the folk who between them own more than 50% of the rest of the world...shouldn't be a thing.
WCA+1. Nickc always seems to comment negatively on things just because he'll never be able to afford them. Some sort of reverse snobbery? Jealousy? Or just a massive chip on his shoulder? Who knows?
That is a wonderful piece of craftsmanship. So what if it's bought by some 'dickhead' millionaire. Its sale will pay for the 1000s of hours of skilled labour that's gone into designing and creating it, surely that's a positive thing?
And being built out of wood and powered by wind, it's about as environmentally friendly as you can get😜
They’ve generally not earned their wealth, so catering for the folk who between them own more than 50% of the rest of the world…shouldn’t be a thing.
If you refuse to fall in line with the unquestioning adulation of this sort of ostentatious spaffery, you sir are just a damn commie.
Its very pretty, like a J class. I would imagine a bit more freeboard, but was still looking wet at some points!
Interior looks a bit to "art gallery" for me.
how deep is the keel?
Draught: 4.05m (13ft 3in)
you sir are just a damn commie.
If by commie you mean "Not a gullible suck-up impressed by a toy built of wood and stainless steel" then yes, I'm certainly that.
"The depth of water (7 meters along the quays and 9 meters along the pier in front of the swimming pool) allows berthing of vessels up to 135 meters in length."
Perfect, you can be seen watching the GrandPrix in Monaco
I would like to point out to the grumpy members(ok im one sometimes 😆 ) that 99% of all marinas in the UK are chock full to the gunwales of PLEASURE CRAFT, ergo playthings, toys if you will.
some people here ride bikes that cost many thousands of pounds, far more than other members can afford. Does that lessen or cheapen their interest and love of cycling somehow 😕
It’s a beautiful thing but it’s not “simple”.
It's simple in its interior design. bare, minimalist if you will.
AJW - it’s a smidge over 4m draft which isn’t going to make it trivial to take to lots of places, although at nearly 60 tonnes she’s not going to be sitting on the visitor moorings in many of the amazing places you might want to sail her.
Theres some discussion forum somewhere in the third world that has just discovered that people in the west ride bicycles purely for fun, rather than necessity of transportation, and such bikes (which are wholly impractical for anything else) run from $2000 to $10000. And then someone posts a picture of a new Orange Alpine.
"Sure, it’s a lot less gaudy bauble than a lot of the others you see, but really, so what? I mean, no one needs one of these ridiculous things. It’ll still end up as the plaything of some ostentatiously rich dickhead."
That is a wonderful piece of craftsmanship. So what if it’s bought by some ‘dickhead’ millionaire.
It was commissioned.
Its sale will pay for the 1000s of hours of skilled labour that’s gone into designing and creating it, surely that’s a positive thing?
This. Better than hiding your fortune in the markets.
stw rules
it's ok to flaunt your wealth as long as it's tasteful and not gaudy
it's ok to be a racist as long as you're witty and entertaining.
any more ?
"Not a gullible suck-up impressed by a toy built of wood and stainless steel”
How about an expensive toy made of steel or carbon fibre?
How about an expensive toy made of steel or carbon fibre?
If you're going to try to justify a superyacht by comparing it to a mass-produced bicycle, then we've truly fallen though Alice's looking glass.
How is that falling through Alices looking glass? Just the same thing on a difference scale but not different relatively speaking? If you have more money then blowing a few hundred million on a yacht is the same as any of us blowing a few grand on a bike.
What is your real problem? Don't you understand there is lucrative global industry worth about 24 billion dollars in these things? From the boat designers and craftsmen who build them, to the crews that crew them providing a lucrative lifetime career for hundreds of thousands of people globally?
These yachts are often businesses and leased out as the owners rarely use them...and if there is one thing millionaires hate it is wasting money. So they like to 'sweat the asset' and make it earn them money rather than cost them money.
Or would you rather throw a 24 billion dollar business out because you hate a handful of the millionaire buyers you despise despite not knowing them or anything about them, and throwing hundreds of thousands of people out of jobs overnight?
Just the same thing on a difference scale
This is a common misconception about the exceptionally wealthy that many fall into. That they are somehow the same but with more money than the average. They are not. They damage everything; from the environment, to democracy, to jobs, communities, and nature. Billionaires and multi-millionaires shouldn't be allowed to exist. That they do signals that we've failed as a society even one as rapaciously capitalist as the one we live in. Superyachts and the businesses that surround them are just the parasitic bottom feeding that damages the rest of the world's ability to get on do the things we should be doing.
That you're quoting there's a $24 billion dollar industry serving the arrogant wants of a few thousand people rather than support your argument; somewhat makes mine all the more vivid.
Superyachts and the businesses that surround them are just the parasitic bottom feeding that damages the rest of the world’s ability to get on do the things we should be doing.
I do get the point about disproportionalte consumtion for the purposes of showing off, maybe those boat builders would be better off building commercial shipping vessels. But should they only be able to ship food and medicine? Or can they bring you your latest smartphone?
Where exactly is the cut off of industries that are good, and those that are bad?
Where exactly is the cut off of industries that are good, and those that are bad?
Well, for a starter for ten: You have $24 billion. Would you rather spend that money on making floating palaces for a few thousand people to try to pretend they can escape the real world...or well, just about anything else really?
Look I'll admit; by any measure that yacht up there is empirically good looking. But superyachts represent everything about billionaires and the singular world they're allowed to inhabit that's ugly. Most (if not all) superyacht purchases reflect all the worst traits of these people: Hubris, personal greed, an over-aggressive need to compete and a total contempt and disregard for the world they inhabit with the rest of us.
So what's the cut-off for the amount of money you're allowed to have without being a parasite?
Yes is pretty, yes it costs a lot of money, people will always hate stuff thats not theirs..
Time to move along
Oooooh, can we do expensive reliced guitars next please. 🙂
*backs quietly out of the thread*
even if you earned $5000 a day since Columbus landed in the Caribbean in 1492, you’d still not be a rich as Bozos
Made me ponder. He's apparently got $190 billion so you'd have needed to earn $1 million a day to match him.
So what’s the cut-off for the amount of money you’re allowed to have without being a parasite?
If the limit on personal wealth is up to me, frankly I wouldn't get voted in. I'd want to tax anything over a million in earnings very heavily (90-95% levels) and restrict the very wealthy's ability to both donate to political parties and probably even vote. I'd have 100% inheritance tax as well. But honestly if we're taking "If I ruled the world" levels of imagination, then there wouldn't be that problem to sort out in the first place. I'd make poverty impossible, and that world can't exist while there are billionaires and their like in it.
people will always hate stuff thats not theirs..
I'd imagine this probably goes a long way to explaining why the billionaires who currently don't have a toy-boat will at some point order one, and why the industry keeps churning out ever more grandiose ones.
He’s apparently got $190 billion so you’d have needed to earn $1 million a day to match him.
Anyone seen the job advert? I fancy applying.
If the limit on personal wealth is up to me, frankly I wouldn’t get voted in. I’d want to tax anything over a million in earnings very heavily (90-95% levels) and restrict the very wealthy’s ability to both donate to political parties and probably even vote. I’d have 100% inheritance tax as well. But honestly if we’re taking “If I ruled the world” levels of imagination, then there wouldn’t be that problem to sort out in the first place. I’d make poverty impossible, and that world can’t exist while there are billionaires and their like in it.
Oh and can I point out that we've done this very boat in a thread earlier (or maybe even last year).
Interesting thread. I've generally thought that terrifically witty "Commie" putdowns for anyone who dares question the more extreme implications of capitalism was a uniquely American trait, reflecting the legacy of McCarthyism. But it seems its another thing we've imported. Goody :-/
If you’re going to try to justify a superyacht by comparing it to a mass-produced bicycle, then we’ve truly fallen though Alice’s looking glass.
Except that on a global scale you're always going to be someone else's richest 50/25/10/1%.
Even just taking job seekers allowance (currently £93/week) that would put you in the top 30% globally.
The living wage then puts you in the top 5%!
I'm with nickc on this.
Except that on a global scale you’re always going to be someone else’s richest 50/25/10/1%.
Even just taking job seekers allowance (currently £93/week) that would put you in the top 30% globally.
The living wage then puts you in the top 5%!
So; you'll be perfectly happy on £93 a week then won't you? Crack on.
Perhaps if some people on here had actually experience genuine poverty, such as that experienced by millions globally, where you suffer malnutrition, illness and educational deprivation, they wouldn't be quite so quick to defend the rampant unchecked capitalism that has created billionaires with more power than actual democratically elected govenrments...
Fall in line, proles!
I'm curious as to the term "sailing yacht." Are there other forms of non-sailing yachts?
Motor yachts?
Land yachts ?
So what’s the cut-off for the amount of money you’re allowed to have without being a parasite?
Tell you what, for the sake of (very simplistic) argument let's consider wealth in the context of the individual global average carbon footprint required to keep our planet's temperature increase below 2 degrees C by 2050. That's around 2 tonnes each. If you could have, say, a modest £100 million, what are you going to do with it? A big house, a big car, manufactured goods in general, foreign travel and all that good stuff will absolutely cane your 2 tonnes allowance, and you've still got food and drink to buy. Aside from just piling up some art, what are you going to do with your wealth that won't have an adverse impact on every other person on this planet?
Given that the average person's annual carbon footprint in the UK is currently about 12 tonnes it's going to be a real struggle for us not to be parasites of one sort or another. But to show I'm one of the good guys I'm going to state categorically that I'm forgoing a super-yacht, even one made of wood and powered by wind.
Sailing yacht
Motor yacht
Land yacht
Mega yacht.
Hold my beer...
If you could have, say, a modest £100 million, what are you going to do with it?
Likely buy a nice tract of land to rewild, build a passive house, give away as much as possible to charity and die penniless, with the land left to JMT.
I understand hating the super rich, but that doesn't translate to the appreciation of an object
I can't bring myself to hate the Taj Mahal, the Trevi Fountains or Versailles because their commissioner was loaded.
Likely buy a nice tract of land to rewild, build a passive house, give away as much as possible to charity and die penniless, with the land left to JMT
Sorry to break it to you, but you really don't sound like the kind of bloke who's ever going to have £100 million.
And your passive house is only passive once it's built.
@bridges
So; you’ll be perfectly happy on £93 a week then won’t you? Crack on.
Been there, done that (when it was only £73), couldn't afford the t-shirt.
So yes, I can confirm it's shit.
[i]Been there, done that (when it was only £73), couldn’t afford the t-shirt.[/i]
I was made redundant back in 2008 from a ridiculously over paid job and I remember it as £69.20 per week. I went to the Job Centre each week and showed that I had applied for approximately 40-60 jobs a week but was struggling to pay to get to interviews. It cost £130 to fill the car with petrol at the time.
They said they would pay for travel but when I submitted a request for tickets to Paris for one interview and Dubai for another they refused. I had an interview in Manchester and they suggested I take a series of bus trips from Southampton rather than a direct coach ticket as they would only fund bus tickets.
I have lived rich and poor. Neither make you happy unless you want to be happy but it is more comfortable being rich and miserable.
Been there, done that (when it was only £73), couldn’t afford the t-shirt.
When I was homeless in London, given you've no address you have to fill out the claim forms each and every day, wait around till mid afternoon and be handed the princely sum of £4.
There is not a great deal you can do on 4 quid in London, even in the 80's.
I was once told I was getting an extra payment as there had been an underpayment. Felt quite happy about that till i saw I was getting a giro for....£0.14p
I thought I should keep it, though I didn't have a wall to put it on 😆 and in the end I cashed it and bought a packet of biscuits. Raspberry creams.
If you’re going to try to justify a superyacht by comparing it to a mass-produced bicycle.
How about a custom made bicycle costing around £15,000 for the frame?
If the limit on personal wealth is up to me, frankly I wouldn’t get voted in. I’d want to tax anything over a million in earnings very heavily (90-95% levels) and restrict the very wealthy’s ability to both donate to political parties and probably even vote.
I think you’re probably far too young to remember the last time a government tried that jolly wheeze, everyone pissed off abroad, taking their money with them, thus losing the exchequer huge amounts of money.
Or are you advocating taking passports away from the very rich and placing a travel ban on them, as well as taking away their democratic right to vote?
Because you’re teetering on the edge of a very slippery and steep slope at the bottom of which resides the likes of political leaders of Venezuela, Hungary, Poland, India, and a former President of the United States.
The politics of envy are certainly not indicative of a free society.
Nothing can touch a J-Class under sail…
“If I ruled the world”
I’d have 100% inheritance tax as well
you definitely wouldn't get voted in.
Beautifully crafted boat, great to see such craftsmanship.
Good on the lad who has made his millions in his mid 30’s and provided lots of employment for others.
everyone pissed off abroad, taking their money with them, thus losing the exchequer huge amounts of money.
well, no. Not everyone, a handful of people at most, and I'd have been at Heathrow waving them off frankly and it sort of demonstrates that folk don't get how marginal rates work. In my fantasy world, you get to keep you first million at normal rates of tax, same as now, it's just after that the rates go bonkers. And here's the thing; those tax rates did nothing to stop the Beatles making music (the thing they actually did, rather than make money) All their best music came after the "supertax"...
as well as taking away their democratic right to vote?
If you end up with so much money that societal changes have little to no benefit or loss to you, if you're so insulated by money, should you be allowed to have a say in how the rest of us sort ourselves out? Maybe I'd let them voted locally, certainly I'd offer the very wealthy a choice....Voting rights or extreme wealth, but not both.
you definitely wouldn’t get voted in.
If any government is serious about redistributing wealth, then we need to talk about inheritance tax, which in reality is an unearned windfall. If we agree that VAT is regressive and effects the poor disproportionally harder, and we're all (mostly) OK with a tax on our income, then why is hoarding unearned wealth OK?
The politics of envy are certainly not indicative of a free society.
We live in a society where people are bound by economic forces, and where the illusion of 'democracy' is sold to us by those who have a vested interest in maintaining a status quo of ruling elites and worker drones. A society where money talks, where wealth = power. The point nickc is making, which is being missed by some, is that we need to work against a system that allows few individuals such power over others.The likes of Bezos might enjoy incredible wealth and 'freedom' to do whatever they want, but that comes at a cost of exploitation of billions of others, globally. Just because you have the relative 'power' of being able to spend £5k on a bicycle, still doesn't mean you have any real say in how society is being run. It's just a little trinket to keep you satisfied and distracted.
Good on the lad who has made his millions in his mid 30’s and provided lots of employment for others.
And lo, the myth of 'providing employment'. The same could happen, without the company owner/CEO/etc taking a massive salary for themselves. Why not distribute the profits more equally, to ensure everybody has more, rather than just an elite few? Amazon warehouse workers are on what, MW or barely above, whilst Bezos 'earns' millions per hour? Please explain how he's working so much harder than everybody else?
Wealth is largely the product of luck; whatever anyone says about 'working hard'. Nurses work ****ing hard, harder than almost anyone else, and they get paid shit wages. So forget that bullshit. That's just there to make people slog their guts out, in the desperate and forlorn hope they might someday get lucky...
Sailing yacht
Motor yacht
Land yacht
Mega yacht.
What makes a yacht a yacht then, as opposed to a 'boat'?
I think it's one of those "Everyone understands what it is, but no one can define it" things...
I think if the passenger bit has a lid, and it's X* long it's a yacht as opposed to a dingy or a boat...
*some measure that's indistinct, movable and may or may not use some weird nautical term like a "yard-arm or fathom"
What makes a yacht a yacht then, as opposed to a ‘boat’?
https://www.backcoveyachts.com/yacht-or-boat-w/
The same could happen, without the company owner/CEO/etc taking a massive salary for themselves. Why not distribute the profits more equally, to ensure everybody has more, rather than just an elite few?
Cant be bothered to figure out the amazon numbers, and there is a difference between a salary and his huge theoretical worth.
His annual salary from Amazon in 2020 was $81,840, which qualifies as a middle-income wage in his home state of California. In 2020, he took no bonuses, stocks or options, however, he earned $1,600,000 from “other types of compensation,” according to the website Salary.com
I remember from last year there was objections from the peanut gallery about the Tesco CEO getting a salary of 6.4million.
"why doesn't he work for free" they asked, "give that money to the poor minimum wage employees".
Distributing the £6.4million equally amoung the 423000 Tesco employees gives them a life changing 29 pence extra per week.
Nothing can touch a J-Class under sail…
is the correct answer except ofcourse...
Nice boats, but this seems to have moved onto a conversation of wealth.
This was a good visualisation (and quite shocking) of how rich, rich people really are:
If any government is serious about redistributing wealth, then we need to talk about inheritance tax, which in reality is an unearned windfall.
I agree with this. You can now pretty much inherit £1m tax-free; that is ridiculous.
Distributing the £6.4million equally amoung the 423000 Tesco employees gives them a life changing 29 pence extra per week.
What about all the other high paid Tesco execs? all the various managers etc? You don't have to give every single other employee a share, just cut the wages of those at the top, and pay those at the 'bottom' a bit more. Those at the top wouldn't suffer in any way, but those at the bottom could benefit a lot.
Cant be bothered to figure out the amazon numbers, and there is a difference between a salary and his huge theoretical worth.
He can afford yachts that cost $500million. Whilst some Amazon employees are pissing in bottles because they're too scared of being sacked for taking a toilet break.
Amazon don't want unions representing workers:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-53998201
Why are you defending Bezos?
A friend of mine worked at an amazon warehouse & found it a very dehumanising experience added to above is why amazon don't (to my knowledge) don't get any of my money.
Surely if it is a beautiful thing in it's own right then good on the guys that crafted it, saw it as a project to completion, and enjoy seeing it function, that is some journey, the owner just bought it and deserves zero credit in this story other than being able to buy something.
Quoted 😉
" There is no nailed down definition of what makes a yacht a yacht, but most boaters consider a yacht to be any type of sea vessel that is used strictly for recreational or pleasure purposes like cruising, entertaining, water sports, fishing, or year-round accommodations "
This was a good visualisation (and quite shocking) of how rich, rich people really are:
It's incredible.
But only set to increase though isnt it as decades roll on. Might be less than ten years before the richest are worth a trillion.
I'm kind of with Bridges on this one.
Interview with the owner.
Owner
Love the boat. Sounds like the owner intends to use it for what it was built for.
These people have money, lots of money. No point getting upset when they spend it. We should encourage them to spend lots of money.
“Do you need another boat to keep in the Caribbean, sir?”
On the subject of disproportionate wealth off the back of exploitation and a tilted playing field.
99.6% have a refrigerator outrageous
This thread is quite revealing of character.
Nowhere for a cup of tea and a book alongside the bed... That really is form over function!