[Closed] Police Commissioner Election

Totally pointless imo. I am reasonably 'politically aware' and I have absolutely no idea about any of the candidates, so I suspect most people will care even less.

John Prescott is standing...

We need a campaign for everyone to turn out and spoil their papers.

Seems a pointless waste of money just to get the police run directly by failed politicians

[quote=MoreCashThanDash ]
Seems a pointless waste of money just to get the police run directly by failed politicians
Thankfully, it's not happening in Scotland. We spend the money on things like free prescriptions for all instead.

I am going to help my fellow citizens set the record for lowest turnout at a vote.
Seems as good a statement as any to make.

I always, always vote, but won't be turning out to let a politician have a say in running the police, it's ****ed as it is, without more meddling

Couldn't agree more - lets keep politics out of the Police The cost is worrying but the thought that priorities will be set on the basis of short term electioneering is terrifying. I want the Police to be held to account on results and service not by someone looking for a 100k gravy train with absolutely no difference being made to the baddies

Scrap the scheme and let's look at a national FBI like set up to deal with the serious organised nasty people

MC*

*not a cop or vigilante

Total and utter waste of time

Agreed. I don't even know who's standing, and as above I tend to care about that kind of stuff

Don't the tories want fewer MPs? So why make a whole other set of politicians?

If a local voice is so crucial why not give the duties to local councils?

lets keep politics out of the Police

That's as likely as keeping the Masons out.

Pointless comment^^^^^

What concerns me is who these people are who are standing for election? Who are they and who chose them? Some posts are six figure salaries. More jobs for the boys from a corrupt political system.

I vote for Chuck Norris.

[i]I am going to help my fellow citizens set the record for lowest turnout at a vote.
Seems as good a statement as any to make.[/i]

This plus the policy of forcing candidates to pay all their expenses (normally they get free mailshots) means that only the large parties can field candidates.

It's a farce of an election for a post that doesn't need to exist.

Just part of the Tory policy of removing as much power over local government from local councillors as possible. I know who my local councillor is, I see her in the are fairly shortly. I've never even heard of any of the candidates in my area for police commissioner.

at least you'll know that none of them standing are Crim's... 🙄

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/aug/10/police-commissioner-candidate-withdraw-conviction

Think I'm going to spoil my vote - nothing like a worthless gesture to make you feel better

For the first time in my adult life I am not going to bother to vote. We haven't seen anything from the candidates, so obviously we are just supposed to trot down to the polling station and vote in the usual tribal manner.

Complete waste of time and money.

I find the billboard ads a ridiculous scaremongering nonsense. They seem to be saying that if we don't vote the police will give up trying to fight crime altogether

Got a couple of official voting reminder thingies that are now in the recycling. I honestly have no idea who is standing in our area. Seems like a massive non-event that, as others have said, will just result in a couple more snouts in the trough.

i agree with you lot.

it'll make no difference at all to anything other than the sales of Range Rovers.

Pointless comment^^^^^

Ooh, hark at the funny handshake geezer.

No. Just rather tired of irrelevant anti-police comments.

Sweet baby Jesus and the orphans!!! I've just had a look at our candidates.

A motley collection of failed politicians, who got slung out by the voters last time around, looking to climb back aboard the gravy train? All of whom list their priorities as 'tackling crime', though fail to expand on this. Brilliant! 🙄

Got a couple of official voting reminder thingies that are now in the recycling. I honestly have no idea who is standing in our area. Seems like a massive non-event that, as others have said, will just result in a couple more snouts in the trough.

+1, really don't see any point other than taking more money from front line policing and giving it to bureaucrats.

Just rather tired of irrelevant anti-police comments

Evidently. It colours your view considerably.

Are you saying Police heads are not influenced by or consider political matters; or that there is no Masonic presence in the rozzers?

I find the billboard ads a ridiculous scaremongering nonsense. They seem to be saying that if we don't vote the police will give up trying to fight crime altogether

I agree - especially given the money spent on these new managers will just mean less money for actual crime fighting....

I take it all back.

😯

I hope they got paid *a lot* of money for that humiliating experience...

I hope they got paid *a lot* of money for that humiliating experience...

I'm sure however much they got it was an excellent use of public money (on top of the video/music production costs). 😕

A motley collection of failed politicians, who got slung out by the voters last time around, looking to climb back aboard the gravy train?

Are you in Lancashire binders? Just had a look and the main qualification does seem to be 'I failed to get in at the last election'.

Seen the list of candidates in South Yorkshire, not changed my first thought to spoil my ballot.
Deputy Dawg is my "write in" candidate.

Aye i looked at the lancashire ones and it is startlingly uninspiring hence why I feel little inclanation to vote

Possibly the usual anti tory vote or an abstention but it is a pointless waste of time and money

Does anyone know WTF they claim it will do or why that there village of london is exempt?

Does anyone know WTF they claim it will do or why that there village of london is exempt?

Are they: http://www.theweek.co.uk/politics/49676/dont-bother-vote-police-commissioners-says-ian-blair

I come under Merseyside and follownig binners' lead I've done some checking. Each candidate has a profile page where they can say a bit about their campaign. so...

Tory - No introductory profile

UKIP - No introductory profile

LibDem - “A University Lecturer with a background in charities helping disadvantaged and deprived communities. I was a journalist and PR specialist. I want to see more people's voices heard.”

Labour - “I am an experienced and successful former minister. I want to use the role of PCC to pull together the whole criminal justice chain to ensure it works effectively for victims."

Independent - “With over 20 years’ experience campaigning on and working on police accountability I’ve become an expert with an international reputation. Control of the police should not be party political. When I served on the Police Authority it had balanced representation of a range of views. Now that just one person will do the job – it shouldn’t be a party figure. People before Party.”

English Democrats - No introductory statement

So of the 6 candidates only 3 can be bothered to put up some info. Of those we have an ex-PR person and an ex-minister. Awesome.

The third "People before Party" independent is a law lecturer and Lib Dem activist until he recently resigned from them in order to run an independent campaign. In his resignation letter he states "But personally I cannot trust Nick Clegg or recommend any member of the public to vote for him." Not all bad then.

Just having a dig around to try and find a[i]nything[/i] of substance about any of the candidates. Policies? Beliefs? Not a sausage!

[url= http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/9623068/The-secret-US-lobbyists-behind-Police-and-Crime-Commissioner-election.html ]This[/url] is quite interesting though. So... lets privatise the police and... you're going to love this bit... we can dress it up as democracy in action

I won't be voting as the election is using Alternative Vote PR, you know, the system that was rejected 2:1 in last years' referrendum.

ScottChegg the thread is about Local Police Commissioners. The point was made that voting in elected officials is politicisation of policing. You decide to chirp in with an irrelevant comment about Masons, insinuating some sort of impropriety. You take every opportunity to broadcast your anti-police views. Get over it. It's boring and juvenile.

Has anyone else had a look at their candidates? I can vote for a Labour, a Tory or a Lib Dem. No independents. All of whom failed to get elected as an MP. Their statements either say nothing at all, or just parrot Westminster rhetoric.

It couldn't possibly be less inspiring. Pathetic!

i have a labour family law solicitor, a tory barrister, a lib dem former council leader and a former police super intendant standing as an independent. The badger party have pulled out.

I have no idea what any of them stands for, oh sorry they stand for whatever there party leader tells them to stand for!!!

So what is the point, other than paying someone 65k per year?

Up to £100k apparently. Plus whatever they claim on expenses, which if they're anything like MP's - and lets face it, they've all tried and failed previously to be elected as one - should easily double that

How low a turnout can you get before you cannot call it democratic ?

So I take it everyone from across the political spectrum is in agreement that this is a stupid waste of money?

Seems like it. With the added dimension that we can eagerly await our countries police force now being used as a political football, for pathetic political point scoring

Does anyone in the country, outside Westminster, believe that that is actually going to have a positive effect on policing?

I have a horrible feeling that this is one of those policies that has 'disaster' not far up the road, written all over it

From a very long list Grum. A very very long list! 🙁

I think that anyone who votes for a party political appointee, of any party, for police commissioner, is an idiot.

that does not however undermine having a check and balance on the police of a directly elected representative with power.

if we looked at two examples:

i) Taser - who on the force is issued it
ii) PCSO powers

At the moment, both these are local policies decided by the chief constable - if the chief constable decides that he's going to arm all response officers with Taser, then he can (and in some areas thats what is happening, in other areas its restricted to, for example, firearms teams)

But at present the Chief Constable answers to the local Police Authority, much of which is made up of elected councillors and the role of which is as below:

1.Your police authority is a group of 17 local people (slightly more in some areas) who hold the police to account on behalf of communities.2.Your police authority consults with local communities to find out what you want from your local police.
3.Your police authority’s job is to make sure that the Chief Constable (or Commissioner in London) delivers a police service which balances both national priorities and the concerns of local people.
4.Your police authority hires and, if necessary, fires chief constables and senior police officers – and also checks on complaints against police.
5.Your police authority publishes an annual plan, based on consultation with local people, setting out the services your police force should deliver in the year ahead, and the targets it should achieve.
6.As part of the annual policing plan, your police authority sets employment targets to ensure your local police reflect the diversity of local communities.
7.Your police authority holds the police budget. It consults with local people before it sets police council tax to ensure you get value for money.
8.Your police authority has a legal duty to promote equalities and good relations between different groups of people. As part of this, it ensures people know their rights if they are stopped or searched by police.
9.Around 10% of police authority members are from minority ethnic backgrounds and around 30% are women.
10.Your police authority makes sure the police service does everything it can to keep improving policing for your community

http://www.apa.police.uk/your-police-authority/what-they-do

All good stuff (apart from the need for more women and more ethnic diversity)

So if you don't like how policing is being done, join the authority, or speak to you elected councillor or your elected MP or the elected Home Secretary.

The PCCs are not needed, there's plenty of 'democracy' in the system already.

At the moment, both these are local policies decided by the chief constable - if the chief constable decides that he's going to arm all response officers with Taser, then he can (and in some areas thats what is happening, in other areas its restricted to, for example, firearms teams)

you could argue that maybe some things should be set nationally? consider having speed limits set by the chief constable and the mess that would result.

I'd rather have an unelected chief constable making decisions like that tbh

Remember when the 2 female officers were recently gunned down in Manchester. The first thing the Greater Manchester Chief Constable did was make a statement saying defending the status quo, and immediately quashing calls for the routine arming of the police.

Now just imagine the same situation occurring 6 months down the line, with rival political factions having a pissing competition about who can appear the most hardline politically, all while being egged on by foaming-at-the-mouth tabloid headlines, which we all know politicians hopelessly pander too

Its not a good prospect is it?

Have I actually managed to start a thread on which everyone on STW agrees?

Blimey! 😮

Andy

Have I actually managed to start a thread on which everyone on STW agrees?

Blimey!

Andy

I think this might be the end of the internet.

Binners - I hadn't thought of that, but it's an excellent example of why this is just such an utterly ridiculous idea.

Remember when the 2 female officers were recently gunned down in Manchester. The first thing the Greater Manchester Chief Constable did was make a statement saying defending the status quo, and immediately quashing calls for the routine arming of the police.

Now just imagine the same situation occurring 6 months down the line, with rival political factions having a pissing competition about who can appear the most hardline politically, all while being egged on by foaming-at-the-mouth tabloid headlines, which we all know politicians hopelessly pander too

Its not a good prospect is it?

The counter argument of course being police tasering a blind pensioner and the police carrying on 'as usual' without anyone trying being held responsible...

Well Chorley police are presently being sued by said blind bloke.

You raise a good example though. If we had a politicised, tabloid influenced police force, I have no doubt whatsoever we'd have routinely armed police by now. And said blind bloke could presently be resembling Charles De Menezes.

The point about Greater Manchester Chief Constables response to the shootings was that it was so calm, considered and measured. Not words you associate with politicians. In fact: Knee-jerk reaction, is what I do associate with them

I can't see any conceivable way in which less people will be tazered, and shot under the proposed system. Can you?

They think less than 20% are going to turn out to vote..wow that's a democracy. I don't think I habeas met one person who agrees with PCC, s how are they independent when affiliated to a political party? What is wrong with the police authority? A collection of people making decisions surely that makes more sense? I should show more of an interest as it may well affect me but again I still know nothing. Received no information about candidates, policies etc shocking.

Just seen an article on BBC West to-night, living in Wiltshire I can chose from 6 candidates

Liberal Democrat town councillor and businessman; Conservative accountant who is also a trustee of several charities; Labour union official; UKIP can’t really work out what they are doing at the moment (apart from being a candidate); and 2 Independents, one who works in IT/telecoms and the other is a civil servant.

I feel so honoured at least there is one winner who will trough up £70 or £80k a year in salary 🙁

Note to self: give up working for a living and climb aboard the gravy train

Spoiled paper for me - with a brief summary of why I'm not voting. Not voting may be taken for apathy rather than a positive rejection of the policy.

+1 to binners. It's a bad idea.

+2 binners

41 of these people will exist (should anybody vote!) at figures mentioned we are probably looking at £5m per year after cars and perks and expenses etc, of course they will each need staff and PA and driver and whatever else they can wangle, so after all that another £5m per year.

£10m a year, effect on crime and justice? negligible.
Effect on once failed councilors or politicians, nice little earner.

There's a new sheriff in town!!!!

*bump for election day*

I was the 7th person to vote at our polling station today, after it'd been open for 1 1/4 hours. Doesn't bode well for a large turnout.

I was the closest I've every been to just spoiling the ballot, as it's a botch job of an election for a post that doesn't need to exist and as such is a colossal waste of money.

But I couldn't bring myself to spoil the ballot paper, so voted for the least bad candidate.