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As a cop if I may offer a point of view.
For a fair number of law abiding folk, this is the first time they have had contact with the Police.
Normal law abiding folk have been told "nope, you can't do that, its very very naughty..."
So poor old Mrs Miggins goes out and gets stopped by the fuzz. She gets questioned by a very stern officer and told to only get the essentials.
Mrs Miggins feels upset as she feels she has done nothing wrong, and feels upset that the nasty brute of an officer had spoken to her sternly. Oh dear!!! She gets home and writes a letter to the Daily Mail!!
Normal law abiding folk don't like being told what to do or how to behave.
What has happened is unprecedented, and the world has had to respond to an unusual and challenging situation.
Unfortunately, the normal law abiding folk didn't think they would be effected and tried to carry on as normal.
Unfortunately they couldn't, so the nasty stern Police Officers had to stop them going about their normal daily lives for a few weeks.
The Police had to do it, because imagine what would happen if the military did it, thus allowing the Police to continue to deal with all the normal rubbish we have to deal with. (although Friday nights have never been so Quiet!!)
So give us a bit of credit for going out there, without any PPE and continuing to deal with the drug dealers, criminals and Mrs Miggins of the world, whilst each night coming home and wondering if the gobsh~~ who spat on me might just have passed something nasty over before I went home.
The "two people gathering" rule confused me as well, as it is specifically separate to household members.
So it implies you CAN meet a friend for a chat or whatever, which is contrary to the main guidance.
I've tried not to pick holes otherwise but that bit really sticks out.
+1 for blokeuptheroad.
The principle of policing by consent is massively important.
People shouldn't be dicks. Most aren't.
Police shouldn't be dicks. Most aren't.
The dyeing water stunt is not impressive and I'm not convinced about using drones for shaming either.
The “two people gathering” rule confused me as well, as it is specifically separate to household members.
Yep I interpreted that as I could walk dog, mrs take boy for run/ride but all 3 couldnt run/ride together. Seems most didnt see it this way.
People not letting the facts on the water dye story, as a couple of us have already tried to point out, get in the way.
Well said, monkeysfeet.
they asked to see his shopping list and shopping bags, he had neither, they apparently told him to go home or he would be fined.
Nah, that's bollocks. Unless it was the eco-police having a go coz he wasn't reusing his shopping bags.
When it all shakes down, you can see on this thread and thousands of others that the advice is "Stay Home"
And everyone seems to think that pushing the definition of this is them being heroic for stopping the UK becoming a police state
Other than claims of police dying lakes and apparent neighbour stories do we have any other proof of heavy handiness?
Monkeyfeet keep safe, chin up and thank you.
People not letting the facts on the water dye story
You also need to let the cops know about the "facts"
In a Facebook post Buxton safer neighbourhood policing team said: 'This is due to the picturesque location and the lovely weather (for once) in Buxton. However, the location is dangerous and this type of gathering is in contravention of the current instruction of the UK Government 'With this in mind, we have attended the location this morning and used water dye to make the water look less appealing.'
The police are equally unused to trying to enforce these kinds of powers as we are living under them. By all means criticise them if they are obviously acting in bad faith, but, like the rest of us, the vast majority of them are trying to do the right thing under difficult circumstances.
When you introduce legislation without consultation or Parliamentary debate, overnight, chances are it will be poorly phrased, contain loopholes or introduce restrictions which go beyond the scope of what was intended. It will be refined over time, guidance will be issued, and police resources focused at those areas which are likely to cause greatest public nuisance.
In the meantime, have patience with what was already a very thinly-stretched police service.
People not letting the facts on the water dye story
See also... https://edition.cnn.com/travel/article/instagram-siberian-maldives-toxic-intl-scli/index.html
You also need to let the cops know about the “facts”
The Police were well aware of the facts, given the amount of times the emergency services pulled people out the water with various chemical burns and occasionally drowned. That "beauty spot" had blue coloured water for entirely non natural reasons.
And I'd put money on the Police seeking advice from appropriate authorities before colouring the water.
Officers stated that this is a regular tactic used to reduce antisocial behaviour.
You missed a bit.
In a Facebook post Buxton safer neighbourhood policing team said: ‘This is due to the picturesque location and the lovely weather (for once) in Buxton. However, the location is dangerous and this type of gathering is in contravention of the current instruction of the UK Government ‘With this in mind, we have attended the location this morning and used water dye to make the water look less appealing.’
Quote continues:
"This is a regular tactic that we use to reduce anti-social behaviour and we work in partnership with High Peak Borough Council and Derbyshire Fire and Rescue Service.
"However, as things stand, it has never been so important to discourage these types of gatherings."
Weather warms up, idiots turn up, pond gets dyed, as usual. It has been reported without context as an example of police overreaction, which it isn't.
The one thing this has shown me is that people hate to be told what to do. Everyone is like "of course people should stay home but *I* absolutely *need* to be able to drive to [x] and ride my bike on the gnar for <insert bullshit reason why I am special>.
Of course everyone should stay home and not see people, but I NEED to [do x activity and see x people] because <insert bullshit reason why I am so god dam special>
No one likes to be the plain old general public. Everyone needs to be someone special. People also seem to like to think they have 'got one over' the man/the system... clear indication of being a lame person with a lame life.
Just stay the f home, go out for a walk/jog/bike from your house once a day. Minimize your shopping trips to as infrequently as possible. Personally I have serious reservations about the worlds /UK government's approach, but even if you think this is all a total waste of time, going for a picnic down the local park isn't a good way to challenge this.
And if you are a key worker or other worker who has to still work outside the home - thank you.
My family are front-line medics in the covid epicentre and things are not fun and games for them at the moment. I'm sure it isn't any fun for the police, bin men, shop workers or any other people out there dealing with hard situations on a day to day basis, to try and keep society functioning, safe and well.
I imagine they define their interpretation of the law, which can then be challenged in court.
Missing the point somewhat, your remarks were god help us if NPCC define law and approach for their members, I pointed out they do this quite regularly, it’s one of their functions and they employ legal types to do this. Of course it’s their interpretation, if there’s no legal precedent it’s always going to be that. I have no issues with public and press interest in it, but to paint the NPCC action as some sort of extraordinary event is inaccurate.
I live somewhere where, up until last week, people had been driving too to exercise/walk their dogs.
The police politely requested that people don’t do it, for very good, obvious reasons
Some tinfoil-hat-wearing social inadequate then took to the local social media groups to say he was having his human rights curtailed by the police.
A few people pointed out that that was a ridiculous assertion
He then invoked Godwin’s law within 3 posts when he compared the head of the local constabulary with Goebels, complete with quotes from the Nuremberg rallies.
Other than paranoid conspiracy theorists, I think we’re all agreed the police are doing a very difficult job, but doing it with the best of intentions... to keep us safe.
They’ve now put barriers on the car parks to stop bell ends like him
This is a regular tactic that we use to reduce anti-social behaviour and we work in partnership with High Peak Borough Council and Derbyshire Fire and Rescue Service.
Thanks, and here's the link to save others googling.
https://www.derbytelegraph.co.uk/news/health/toxic-derbyshire-blue-lagoon-dyed-3994938
Missing the point somewhat, your remarks were god help us if NPCC define law and approach for their members, I pointed out they do this quite regularly, it’s one of their functions and they employ legal types to do this. Of course it’s their interpretation, if there’s no legal precedent it’s always going to be that. I have no issues with public and press interest in it, but to paint the NPCC action as some sort of extraordinary event is inaccurate.
I think you're missing the point, or perhaps I wasn't clear enough - I pointed out they don't "define" law, nothing else. Of course they interpret it and produce guidelines for the police, I never said they didn't!
I do think some people on this thread seem to assume you can't respect the police at this time and simultaneously keep a critical eye on them. They're not exclusive.
However, the location is dangerous
The water burns your skin.
It looks super inviting for exactly the same reason you absolutely should not go in it.
Famous Instasnap location in recent years.
They normally dye it later in the year… but people seemed to take the stay at home message to mean summer holidays have come early, so intervention had to happen at an unusual time of the year.
Well i cycled to a monument about half a mile from home yesterday, its got some nice natural trails and a steep incline, so great to keep my mtb fitness up. There were 10 plus cars in the car park, all people who had driven there to walk dog/baby buggy on in the case of a couple of guys, smoke a couple joints looking over the cliff view. People are just not listening.
People are just not listening.
A tiny minority of people are not listening. I've seen maybe 30 dickheads since this all started. In contrast the roads, towns and trails are deserted so thousands are staying home. This is working a treat and we all need to stick with it.
The water burns your skin.
It looks super inviting for exactly the same reason you absolutely should not go in it.
They normally die it later in the year… but people seemed to take the stay at home message to mean summer holidays have come early, so intervention had to happen at an unusual time of the year.
See how much difference a bit of context makes!
For others who thought the lake was dyed spontaneously by Derbys Police as an over reaction, do you honestly think that "lake dye" is regular issue for any officer anywhere that suddenly decides to deter dickheads from bodies of water?
There were 10 plus cars in the car park, all people who had driven there to walk dog/baby buggy on in the case of a couple of guys, smoke a couple joints looking over the cliff view. People are just not listening
Driving a short distance to somewhere quieter than your local park or streets could well be less risky in terms of transmitting the virus. A short drive once a day on quiet roads is also unlikely to add to the burden on the NHS.
And of course there's a sampling error here. What you didn't see on your bike ride is the millions of people in their houses.
That lord whosit is just being a twerp
You don't think if a retired senior judge raises his head above the parapet to point out an inconsistency between the practice on the ground and the law that it is worth at least trying to understand his concern? His point seems to be straightforward, the police exist to uphold the law not to enforce ministerial advice. If ministers had wanted this to be law they should have made it so (I'd argue that they have - the reasonable excuse is to take exercise not to travel to take exercise - but they could have done a better job).
So it's decided then, we consult Holly!?
Driving a short distance to somewhere quieter than your local park or streets could well be less risky in terms of transmitting the virus. A short drive once a day on quiet roads is also unlikely to add to the burden on the NHS.
Did you miss the footage from 2 weeks ago from the Peak District and Lake District? It wasn't locals driving a couple of miles, it was car parks overflowing with people who'd come from all over and were completely ignoring social distancing guidelines.
If people don't want to be treated like idiots, then they should stop acting like idiots. People had their chance for acting responsibly but chose to ignore it and act like a gang of dickheads instead.
The police are only enforcing the rules because people have demonstrated what happens when they don't!
We have a government who are naturally libertarian and are obviously still preferring to issue recomendations and guidelines, trusting people not to act like ****s, rather than bring in legeslation. Thus acting in the exact opposite manner than the hysterical 'police state' claptrap would have us believe
His point seems to be straightforward, the police exist to uphold the law not to enforce ministerial advice.
They can inform you of the advice and ask you to act accordingly.
People are not being locked up, or beaten with truncheons, there has been no overreach.
You don’t think if a retired senior judge raises his head above the parapet
He’s on TV every other week making similar points. He often makes very good points as well. But he’s someone who ‘raises his head above the parapet’ for money and attention. And why not.
stevemuzzy
Member
Well i cycled to a monument about half a mile from home yesterday, its got some nice natural trails and a steep incline, so great to keep my mtb fitness up. There were 10 plus cars in the car park, all people who had driven there to walk dog/baby buggy on in the case of a couple of guys, smoke a couple joints looking over the cliff view. People are just not listening.
what makes your particular interpretation of the guidelines any less valid than theirs?
what made your short cycle there less risky than their drive there?
Did you miss the footage from 2 weeks ago?
I'm not talking about two weeks ago and neither was the post I replied to. Try to keep up! 🙂
The police had to act because of what happened two weeks ago. Their actions have helped get the message across, to most people. Now people are moaning about the police, when they should be thanking them.
I’m not talking about two weeks ago and neither was the post I replied to. Try to keep up!
Oh... ok. I didn't realise that from just glancing at a car any police officer could immediately tell how far it had just travelled?
Thats quite a skillset. They're almost like superheroes. Do they have any other useful superpowers?
“once a day”.
For the avoidance of doubt (etc...) the legislation in Wales *does* specify once a day for exercise:
8.—(1) During the emergency period, no person may leave the place where they are living without reasonable excuse.
(2) For the purposes of paragraph (1), a reasonable excuse includes the need—
(a)to obtain [...]
(b)to take exercise, no more than once a day, either alone or with other members of the household;
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/wsi/2020/353/regulation/8/made
I think a distinction needs to be drawn between going off on a jolly to the Peak, Snowdonia, or wherever and driving a couple of miles to a local park, woodland, open space, etc. This seems to me to be fully within the spirit of taking exercise close to your home, and has got to be better than everyone wandering up and down the street outside their houses (both from the virus spreading point of view and the mental health point of view).
Rule 1 applies in any case.
what makes your particular interpretation of the guidelines any less valid than theirs?
This is the nub of the issue. They're guidelines and as such people interpret them differently. The problem is that too many people are too quick to criticise those whose interpretation is different from theirs. Yes, some people are taking the piss but it's a small minority and getting wound up about what others are doing isn't healthy.
and has got to be better than everyone wandering up and down the street outside their houses
No, everyone exercising locally, rather than driving from various locations to a ‘quiet spot’, will reduce the spread.
what makes your particular interpretation of the guidelines any less valid than theirs?
Because they are making unnecessary car journeys against the clear advice. Cycling is specifically allowed.
The advice isn't a buffet, where you just pick the bits out that suit your palate.
Oh… ok. I didn’t realise that from just glancing at a car any police officer could immediately tell how far it had just travelled?
Thats quite a skillset. They’re almost like superheroes. Do they have any other useful superpowers?
I also wasn't referring to the police, I was responding to stevemuzzy's observations about other people's behaviour.
It's definitely better to read posts before you respond to them and respond to the point they've actually made rather than the one you think they've made.
Are you new here?
Wheres the fun in that?
😉
Anyway... I don't see what the difference is. We already know how people act. Like sheep. So if someone thinks that its ok to drive 2 miles, then why can't someone else drive 4 miles? Or 6? What defines a 'short drive'?
The guidance is 'essential travel' only.
It’s interesting that Lord Sumption chose to highlight that “Police State” in his mind refers to not some vast scope of draconian powers given to the Police, but in fact vague powers hastily drawn and interpreted by the Police in the way they think that a Govt would like.
Nick is right to highlight this*
So what? It’s a national catastrophe. We’ve all consented to temporarily live under house arrest for a period of time under rules that in any other circumstances would be widely ignored (and if enforced would lead to the government being forcibly overthrown).
The crisis will end within a year or so. There’s near zero chance the rules will stay in place once the crisis ends and if they do there’s 60 million people who will forcibly ensure the rules end and the army and the police force will be on ‘our’ side.
Really? Just be careful, because if martial law is invoked it may be quite difficult to undo:
*Martial law
Martial law is the imposition of direct military control of normal civilian functions by a government, especially in response to a temporary emergency such as invasion or major disaster, or in an occupied territory.
Typically, the imposition of martial law accompanies curfews; the suspension of civil law, civil rights, and habeas corpus; and the application or extension of military law or military justice to civilians. Civilians defying martial law may be subjected to military tribunal (court-martial).
Martial law will only be invoked if people show they can’t act on advice.
So what is it?
Are you new here?
Wheres the fun in that?
🙂
Oh… ok. I didn’t realise that from just glancing at a car any police officer could immediately tell how far it had just travelled?
To be fair, there is a sequence of numbers and letters on it which gives you a fair idea where it normally lives.
Driving to the Peak District for exercise is not a reasonable excuse. Go for a walk from your door.
Except... I was chatting to a friend last night who lives in South West of Sheffield. If they go down the street or to local park and woods they pass dozens of people (they stopped counting when they hit 100 yesterday). Families, dogs everywhere, kids on bikes, you name it, they are there.
They drove a couple of miles to Peak, parked on edge of road and walked around a slightly unusual path / woodland track. They saw one person.
And the two police officers when they got back to their car who were insistent that they walk only from front door.
My friend questioned this and was told no travel at all, and that any travel should be in a car - he pointed out he is consultant haematologist who doesn't have access to a car as his wife who is physio is not drafted in as a nurse and uses car to get to hospital so he rides (and has done for 10 years) from Sheffield to Rotherham. They said he should go out and buy a second car....
Yes we should all do our bit - but common sense says 'our bit' may be different from others.
Sadly for everyone who 'gets' this balancing act, there seem to be two others who do not get this...
I would also add - I have huge respect for police in this - they are responding to something unprecedented, with a lack of protective clothing, with too many folk being numpties and with a general guidance, not black and white clarity..
Except…
Risk infecting people in your area… or risk spreading it to other areas.
The police are attempting to get the message across that you should not risking spreading the virus because you think you situation is somehow special.
They need our help and support, not have our sense of entitlement thrown back at them.
No, everyone exercising locally, rather than driving from various locations to a ‘quiet spot’, will reduce the spread.
You missed off the first part of my post where I said a couple of miles - I *am* advocating exercising locally. Whether this involves a car or not is irrelevant, and may actually *reduce* the chances of transmission as exemplified in matt’s post above.
Less frothing, more thinking.
People driving a couple of miles to the spot from all directions gives a pretty wide spread that would not occur at anything like the same speed if all those people exercised from their door.
To be fair, there is a sequence of numbers and letters on it which gives you a fair idea where it normally lives.
Maybe they could have drones with numberplate recognition technology like on Hunted, which could deploy stngers to take out any vehicles outside a certain range of their homes without authorisation?
Or maybe they could have a reasonable expectation that people don't act like self-entitled pricks who are somehow exempt from the rules, as theyre so 'special'?
I've never seen one before, no one has, but I'm guessing it's a white hole.
Less frothing, more thinking.
This. And a bit of tolerance and acceptance that you can't control the behaviour of others.
And a recognition that most people are doing what they need to do.
Yes. Think. Drive to places for exercise and you will counteract the efforts being made by everyone else, including the police, to slow the spread.
Maybe they could have drones with numberplate recognition technology like on Hunted, which could deploy stngers to take out any vehicles outside a certain range of their homes without authorisation
I prefer the ones martial law will invoke.
I’ve never seen one before, no one has, but I’m guessing it’s a white hole.
A white hole?
RM.
I prefer the ones martial law will invoke.
Really? Just be careful, because if martial law is invoked it may be quite difficult to undo:
You reckon? The entire armed forces of the Uk would fit in a Football Stadium and many of them are overseas. In spite of all their equipment I doubt they could hold their own against 60 million people. The army has 227 tanks I bet not many of them are in the UK right now - I reckon the USA, and various European nations would cheerfully blow them all up in a day to help us regain control.
...and that assumes the Army want to turn the uk into a police state. I have a few friends who are army officers, I'm sure you do to. Get the feeling they want to end democracy and take over?
So the Police, then? We have plenty of Policemen posting on here. Get the feeling they're itching to take over?
We postponed elections in WW2 and things reverted right back to normal at the appropriate time. These extreme laws will go the second the crisis is over. The state don't have the desire or the capability to do anything else.
Yes. Think. Drive to places for exercise and you will counteract the efforts being made by everyone else, including the police, to slow the spread.
Last night I drove 8k, parked my car in a deserted car park and ran up a wee hill with no one else on it. Even if there were other people the tracks are wide enough to give 2m distance and there are no gates to open that might spread the virus through contact. If the car park had been busy I was ready to turn around and go home.
Meanwhile, the places I could have gone from the door were busy, involve opening gates and have narrow paths which make 2m distance very difficult.
I accept that this is an unnecessary journey but I'd like to know how it counteracts efforts to slow the spread.
Maybe they could have drones with numberplate recognition technology like on Hunted, which could deploy stngers to take out any vehicles outside a certain range of their homes without authorisation?
This is another problem that self-driving cars will solve. Siri will just refuse to drive you anywhere except Budgens.
To be fair, there is a sequence of numbers and letters on it which gives you a fair idea where it normally lives.
Until the UK adopts a similar system to Switzerland, where every canton has its own registration office and when cars are bought on one canton and moved to another it has a new reg. for that canton, this is not really going to help.
For example, I bought my car in Swansea so has a CP prefix, but I live in Herefordshire which should have a VX or VN prefix. On our road there are LB, SH,AJ, LX, MK, GL prefixes. Are we going to be stopped simply because of our plates?
They drove a couple of miles to Peak, parked on edge of road and walked around a slightly unusual path / woodland track. They saw one person.
YES, because few other people are being dicks! If everyone else behaved like your mate it would be heaving and they'd be spreading the virus like crazy.
It's like chucking you MCDonalds packaging out of your car window. If one person does it it probably doesn't matter that much. When thousands of people do it we end up with crap everywhere.
Most of all if it's only a couple of miles WALK IT!
Every action has an equal and opposite reaction. A black hole sucks time and matter out of the universe, a white hole returns it
Until the UK adopts a similar system to Switzerland, where every canton has its own registration office and when cars are bought on one canton and moved to another it has a new reg. for that canton, this is not really going to help.
Yes, but I suspect that they can use ANPR to spit out registered keeper addresses fairly efficiently.
Yes, but I suspect that they can use ANPR to spit out registered keeper addresses fairly efficiently
I was perhaps also thinking of the self-appointed folk who wish to comment about people driving further than they think appropriate.
powers hastily drawn and interpreted by the Police in the way they think that a Govt would like.
What Lord Rod Hull doesn’t mention is that with any new legislation, it’s not just the police that are left to try and interpret how it should be used, it’s the courts as well. There may (or may not) be guidelines but they never cover every situation. It’s only when cases get to court that this interpretation is tested by legal argument and so on, and one factor the court considers is what was the government’s intention when it wrote the legislation. So if the courts consider the governments intentions when making rulings and case law and so on, it’s not in principle much different to the police trying to understand what the government’s intention is when they start using new legislation. The correct interpretation is only established down the line once courts have ruled on it.
Less frothing, more thinking.
Or Less listening, more thinking it doesn't apply to you
thinking of the self-appointed folk who wish to comment about people driving further than they think appropriate.
The government?
The police?
Do you know who I am?
I'm special
The rules are there for other people
People driving a couple of miles to the spot from all directions gives a pretty wide spread...
Only if they get close enough to each other to pass the virus on, in which case, it would / should fail the definition of a "quiet spot".
What you're arguing is that it is better to take exercise in a busy street where it's difficult to maintain social distancing than in a quiet spot, local to your house where there is almost no risk of transmission. The whole car thing is irrelevant.
So if the courts consider the governments intentions when making rulings and case law and so on, it’s not in principle much different to the police trying to understand what the government’s intention is when they start using new legislation.
but even the government don't have a common position on this. Or at least if they do, they haven't communicated it (well enough)
Putting dye in lakes and using drones in such a manner is unacceptable no matter what.
Kind of agree. I have no way of knowing whether folk videod had walked from their house or driven in. Similarly, dye in lakes is just a weird thing to do that can't really be justified.
This doesn't mean I don't think it's understandable that people have reacted this way, nor that I think people should ignore the advice. I don't think anyone's saying that. And the police are free to have a word with people, which at this point is probably as effective as anything else (particularly as the first fine is £30.)
@kelvin is correct. If you need laws to tell you what is right then you're a muppet.
The true anarchist is law-abiding, because he doesn't need laws to act correctly in the first place - thus negating the need for the x-archy in the first place.
Just to give you some perspective of the types of folk I have been dealing with recently - ( I am sure my fellow cops will agree)
We don't deal with the great british public, normally.
We deal with people who call the cops because they have had an argument over the TV remote
we deal with people who call 999 because Maccy D's is shut
We deal with people who leave a toddler in charge of a baby whilst they go out shopping
We deal with people who go out every 5 minutes because cigarettes are essentials
We deal with the two drug dealers stopped out and about delivering their stash
We deal with the local feral youths who still think hanging around in gangs of 6 or 7 is still ok.
We deal with the two youths who are carrying knives in the above group.
If the public break the (lockdown)rules they will be dealt with, usually with a warning or a ticket.
If the local drug dealer/crime lord/pickpocket/thief whatever wont accept the social distancing rules/lockdown rules- because lets face it- they are such law abiding citizens. then they will be arrested. simples.
Police state. Nope
Martial Law. Wont happen. Unless the poop has really really hit the fan.
Rules to keep everyone safe. Oh yes.
What you’re arguing is that it is better to take exercise in a busy street where it’s difficult to maintain social distancing than in a quiet spot, local to your house where there is almost no risk of transmission.
Almost. What people are arguing is that's it's better for us all to follow the simple guidelines. If we do that there may be some rare cases where that will reduce social distancing but, on balance, there will be far less social contact [1]. In contrast, if we all freestyle it according to what we deem a good idea for ourselves we're going to end up with carnage.
[1] https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/four-graphs-that-show-the-effect-of-social-distancing-in-the-uk
Similarly, dye in lakes is just a weird thing to do that can’t really be justified.
The water looks very inviting, and is great for photos, and burns your skin, and is in an unsafe quarry. People were (in previous summers) travelling to it for instagram photos, and generally hanging out, and, insanely, swimming. Go and read about why they have to make it less inviting for public health reasons, both in normal times and recently.
This drone shaming. I may have missed it but did it personally identify people or was it used as part of the message about people travelling in to places for exercise / pleasure? The only thing I saw was a loose correlation between 'people on Curbar' and 'cars at the Gap car park that were registered to addresses not in the Hope Valley'. Were personally identifiable information or pictures shared or is the shaming just more broadly messaging that the authorities were aware people were doing it and that they could be readily identified should the motive be there? There is a need whether you like it or not to use quick, novel and sharable methods and messages to discourage certain types of behaviour and for me, I think the campaign worked very well.
Thanks for carrying on monkeysfeet. Stay as safe as you can.
Having said that @Kelvin - freedom is the ability for idiots to make stupid decisions. Including swimming in toxic water.
If we treat everyone like babies then those of us who are intelligent enough to make use of their freedom is just a slave.
Sorry @Monkeysfeet - whilst I agree with your sentiment (and the actions you describe), it's the po-po's job to enforce the letter of the law, not interpret it for the greater good and enforce those interpretations.
So, that thing's spewing time back into the universe?
If we treat everyone like babies
Let me guess… “elf ‘n safety gone mad”.
it’s the po-po’s job to enforce the letter of the law, not interpret it for the greater good
Are you calling for stricter laws, rather than allowing the police to “interpret” and asking the public to simply follow “advice”? We shouldn’t need that. But I fear we might.
Also, only babies say “po-po”, especially when addressing a police officer, even if only on a forum.
This drone shaming. I may have missed it but did it personally identify people or was it used as part of the message about people travelling in to places for exercise / pleasure?
Nope. Number plates and faces blurred. I have zero issues with it, got the message out very effectively.