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So it’s arrived, nice reassuringly solid bit of kit.
Realised I should have already asked for a recommendation on router bits for it, so I can have a play with it at the weekend! My std go to for this kind of stuff is the ‘trade rated’ stuff from screwfix.
Also need to get a book on making units / furniture as I’ve got to make some units for the house to account for some odd angles. Unless I can make do with YouTube.
Woop woop! I just bagged a Makita rp2301cfx/2 for the bargain price of £178 from Amazon. Used but acceptable it said... Missing the dust extraction attachment but think I've got that for £2.50. We shall see when it arrives.... If it's no good it can go back
I finally joined the tracksaw nation, with pretty much the absolute cheapest one you can get, a Silverline 624327, for £80. And I am in love. I'm kind of a bodger and I like to work as I think, and this is the first time I've really been able to cut big bits of wood in a way that really suits that slightly random-brained approach. Just mark, line up and bzzzzt. We just finished clearing out my mum and dad's place and I aquired a load of beaten up old furniture, and now 6 wardrobes have met their demise and been turned into shelf after shelf...
Next, a load of really big storage boxes, also made out of wardrobes. I could do it all with a circular saw of course or even by hand but I almost certainly never would, the speed of it just opens up possibilities and practicalities. Cheers STW thread!
Still to figure out track compatibility for it but tbh it's no hardship to live with the 1400mm for now.
Gahhh! Router looks amazing, no visible damage, can't see the marks on the case they described... Get the guide assembled, give it all a check over... Where is the collet? Not in the box...hmmm, I'll get on to Amazon as it wasn't supposed to be missing and get one sent out... Hang on, let's see if it's the shaft and not AWOL.... Undo nut... bollox, bollox bollox. Collet is shattered and a large piece is, I assume stuck in the shaft. It's going back then. I reckon it got bought, pulled out the box and set up ready to go then dropped/fell from the work bench onto a hard floor by the bit, breaking the collet and the (described as missing) dust extraction attachment.... And doing possibly lots of unseen internal damage. The naughty first purchaser then boxed it back up and returned it. Amazon discovered the missing dust extraction attachment and listed the router as 'used, acceptable' but no. Lesson here kids, Amazon aren't that thorough at checking for damage on returned items. Oh well, Hermes will collect and return it, Amazon pay for that.
Having handled it...I want one for sure now!
Neilneville they are £258 at toolstop and there’s 5% off your first purchase!
Cheers, yes I pulled the trigger there. £80 more than Amazon, but delivered in one piece and working!
Resurrecting this thread, rather than creating a new one.
My lower back problem has come back with a bloody vengeance, all solveaable but takes some time, so need to get some trestle tables that are height adjustable, so I can raise the work area, bending over is trucking painful at the moment.
Anyone recommend some trestle tables that are height adjustable, have slots that take 2x4 and don’t take 20 minutes to assemble every time I need to set it all up ?
I have a pair of Toughbuilt saw horses which are height adjustable and can take 2x4 or 4x4s to make a bench.
I also have the Toughbuilts, C700s too.
Seem very good bits of kit to me. I wouldn’t however say the height adjustability is anything special, they’re either at full height or too low. I’m 6ft 1 for reference.
@footflaps @piemonster thanks, had a look and ordered, seems to be the best of the bunch.
What are the options for “cheap” dust extraction?
I’m currently al fresco with a good mask, but frankly, crap weather days are good days for making stuff.
I think I’d be plugging whatever is extracting onto multiple power tool one at a time. Low volumes too.
Space is very very limited.
Cheap dust extraction usually means a Henry. Only really good for one tool at a time but you usually only use one tool at a time. I've got mine plugged into a remote control so it's easy to turn it on and off. I keep looking into 'proper' dust extraction but they are way bigger, more expensive and often no better for hand held tools.
What are the options for “cheap” dust extraction
I bought the Aldi wet dry vacuum with the power tool switch when it was last on - last year I think - at £40 IIRC reliable, works well and cheapest I could find.
Not as good or anywhere near as big as the proper dust extraction kit, but I’m also limited on space.
Looking on eBay you often get second hand / reconditioned ‘Henrys’ that are the simpler commercial models (no retractable cord) going very cheaply
I've got a titan Wet n Dry vac after my old Nilfisk died. 30ltr version, and it takes an age to get the thing full. Loads of power. Makes a huge difference to cleaning up (or not having to clean up) after cutting/sanding etc.
I'd suggest the smallest one that still has a PTO socket for tools.
I have a Titan one too with a power tool take off.
It's got loads of oomph. Very good.
I fitted a Festool hose to it though as the rubber end tends to play better with most tool outlets.
It's also supposed to be anti static, but I'm forever getting static shocks off it.
Does me nut.
Anyone know how to reduce static?
Annoying as the Festool hose is specifically meant to be anti static.
It’s also supposed to be anti static, but I’m forever getting static shocks off it.
Does me nut.
A hose in itself can't be antistatic unless it's earthed in some way. All it really means is that it's conductive so the charge will flow but it needs a route earth. Does the festool vac have some sort of continuity between the hose and vac that you're missing?
When we hook up temporary hydrocarbon hoses you basically have to electrically bond them all together and then to earth somewhere so no section of hose can build a charge.
It’s also supposed to be anti static, but I’m forever getting static shocks off it.
Does me nut.
Needs to be a vac designed to work with that kind of hose. The Fein vac I use has little copper doodahs in the socket the the hose pushes into that presumably connects to earth. I think the festool ones the plastic itself is conductive.
Another vote for Titan vac. I bought mine when fitting a kitchen, done another and several other very very very dusty DIY jobs, does well. Mine doesn't have the PTO so I just got one of the eon plugs.
Anyone bought the Benchdogs rail hinge for MFT tops?
Cheers all, that’s given me a start, and some possible end points.
Not short of irony as I have to make quite a bit of stiff before I get somewhere to store it.
Peter Millard reviews the Workzone one...
Cheers, I watched that this morning.
Not currently on the Aldi website but the Sheppach labelled one seems readily available.
I can certainly find a home for something that size and shape already.
Im sure you can upgrade the hose easily enough to something longer, but side by side the £60 affair is a very good deal.
Lack of take off power is the only thing that lets it down. Festool are let down as ever by being as tight as a Highland Scotsman by only giving you a single bag.
There’s another Millard vid about the power take off, he bypassed it by using an “Intelliplug” (or something like that)
It was designed to power off devices that normally stay on stand by.
In this case, it’d send power to the extractor a few seconds after starting a tool, and switch it off a few seconds after the tool is stopped.
Although I'd be a bit more concerned about over working that plug than he is.
Anybody recently bought a Bosch plunge saw ?.
Im in the market for one but just deciding on the 240v or the cordless(already got batteries on the drill)
Reason im asking because previously a few years ago there was a bit of warping on some Bosch plunge saw bases, and im wondering if they've sorted that out, or is it still hit or miss. Needs returned, delay,delay,delay.
In solving dust extraction, noise, size and portability became my next problems. I had a £40 shopvac that sounded like a 747 taking off attached to an Amazon bought far-east cyclone and a blue food keg. To set up in any location you had to disconnect stuff and trail sawdust from thither to hither before joining it all up again. Remote start I fixed with an Ikea Tradfri plug and switch (magnetic) set. (I tried the E-ON plug but it was unreliable and you need an override for general work area cleanup, not just when the tool is running)
Matching it to tools I used one of the Cen-Tec sets from Amazon and the pipework between the cyclone and he vac was pvc drain pipe pieces. The cheap shopvac didn't have any kind of pleated filter - just the bag and a bit of foam so I was still breathing filthy air and a layer of dust would settle on surfaces.
But... the separator really worked well. Hardly anything in the shop vac itself and full suction all the way to full. The final problem was that you had to open the keg to see how full it was.
I stretched this setup to the limit, using it for a thicknesser and working with scaffold boards. This would clog up the hose reliably if you took thick cuts but it did work if you were sensible. The separator did its thing but even with 30 litres of keg, it would fill up in minutes and would create a real mess if you let it get over-full.
I've since given in to the green-eyed monster and have a Festool setup. It has turned out to be wife-friendly expenditure; it is quieter; it is properly filtered; it attaches reliably to tools. The Festool pre-separator (an extravagance) isn't very good, losing a lot of suction and letting a lot through to the vacuum bag if it gets reasonably full; its usable capacity is therefore much lower than the advertised 20 litres and using it with plastic liner bags (Festool recommended) is pathetic and useless.
So for me, the sweet spot for cheap and compact would actually be a large size (30l) shop vac with a power take off and a HEPA filter... or a compact vac with a separator rig integrated on top of it. I wouldn't use a compact vac without a separator.
My future probably has me rigging up another cyclone setup on top of the Festool.
The Festool pre-separator (an extravagance) isn’t very good, losing a lot of suction and letting a lot through to the vacuum bag if it gets reasonably full
wrong tool for the job really - the volume of material generated by a thicknesser really requires a chip collector rather than an extractor. The stuff coming out of a thicknesser isn't dust and theres too much of it for any kind of extractor with or without a pre-separator.
The final problem was that you had to open the keg to see how full it was.
I've made boxes to use with those cyclones rather than use a bucket/drum - with a couple of perspex windows set into the sides so you can keep an eye on how full they are getting
Anybody recently bought a Bosch plunge saw ?.
I did about 7 years ago.. not had any problems with it (240v version). No where near as sophisticated as a Festool etc. I also have a Mafell now and just use the Bosch for ripping sheets.
For assembling carcasses, are band clamps useful?
I did about 7 years ago.. not had any problems with it (240v version). No where near as sophisticated as a Festool etc. I also have a Mafell now and just use the Bosch for ripping sheets.
No chance of buying the festool. Im not working professionally any more so just cant justify such a price.
But is tthat you have one spare 😀 😀 😀
Care to part with it ?.
Not really, they're best for clamping up round or hexy shaped things. The dont really apply a great deal of pressure.
Stick to using sash or parallel cramps.
I hadn't thought of a cyclone/pre separator. For 20 quid on eBay plus the bin/barrel and hose that must be a good shout. Cheers.
For assembling carcasses, are band clamps useful?
Yes and no ime.
You can apply pressure, but whether you can apply it where it's needed is another thing.
Sash clamps allow you to direct force where it's needed by subtle angling of the clamps.
Clamping up is very much an art in itself.
Sometimes you'll be gluing up a carcass that you find isn't sitting square (measure the diagonals) sash clamps allow you to force the carcass square whilst also closing the joint.
Usually you have to make up clamping blocks specifically for each task.
It's not just about protecting the surface, again, it's about being able to put the clamping pressure where it's needed.
Whenever I glue up anything, I always do a dry run first, getting everything completely as I need it minus any glue.
As soon as you put glue anywhere near your work, everything will go Pete Tong 😂
The amount of students I used to get that you'd see putting glue on everything, taking their time and you'd ask if they had all the clamps they needed and had done a dry run?
Um....no.
Cue a mad dash by me to make sure they didn't completely screw up all their hard work while clamping it up 😳
I very rarely use band clamps to clamp up a rectangular carcass, but on the rare occasions I have, I've usually had to supplement them with other methods to make sure the carcass is pulled square.
It's very important to be extremely stressed when you glue anything up 😉😂
It’s very important to be extremely stressed when you glue anything up 😉😂
Goes with the territory 😆
HOUSE IS ON FIRE !!..... sorry, cant deal with it,I'm gluing up.
One of my classmates made this as his final piece. Gerrit Rietveld sideboard. It was the devil to glue, and he had to loosen joints off and redo them as some of them only required small spots which dried really quickly. An exercise is patience.
I'll take a hard pass on trying that
Anyway, cheers both, sash clamps ahoy
Rutlands is good for Sash clamps.
Their Record copies are pretty good ime.
Jesus, imagine dusting that bastard
I've got a load of the Irwin quick grip sash clamps in various sizes up to 50" I think. The big ones clamp really tightly - as in no need for any more force. They also all double as spreaders which is handy - although the bar will bend under any heavy load.
https://www.screwfix.com/p/irwin-quick-grip-xp-bar-clamp-50/40434
Back to the routers, this little jig just turned up from Etsy - fits the Bosch 600W 1/4" router to the Bosch track saw rails, with integrated dust extraction port!
[url= https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52015957123_f801609d01.jp g" target="_blank">https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52015957123_f801609d01.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/2nftnQX ]Bosch mini router jig[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/brf/ ]Ben Freeman[/url], on Flickr
https://www.etsy.com/uk/listing/1182011113/skf-600-rail-base-bespoke-adaptor-for?ref=yr_purchases
https://www.powertoolworld.co.uk/v-tuf-vtm1-m-class-mini-15l-800w-dust-extractor-inc-accessories
Any particular reason not to?
I’m limited on space. I’m also not a heavy user, this is solely intended for dust collection.
Which I may or may not change my mind on at a later date.
They're supposed to be good those, but they've not got a power take-off have they?
It's very handy to have.
I have the Titan one like this. It's good. Very sucky.
I've have looked at those, but the size is a big issue for the space itll live in.
Yeah, if you're not bothered about power take off then I expect it'll perform very well.
I've also got a Festool ctl sys which is small systainer size. Lives under my bench.
Obviously that's not got as much capacity and is expensiverer.
I wouldn't get one without power take off. Not since getting one.
I've got the evolution one R15vac which is about £85-90, has the power take off. Seems to work OK if you want a compact kind of thing. Power take off is game changer it just means I use it more. Works really well with the plunge saw.
Functionally only gripe is the hose is fairly short so will probably replace at some point. Definitely budget end tool wise so cables and finish reflect that.
I can’t see a filter rating for that Evolution R15, I’ll be cutting sheet materials including MDF so believe I really want Class M?
It comes with L but you can buy L or M filters.
I'm a DIYer and I figure the L provides a makred improvement over none so I'll go with that. Also once the filter is loaded with mdf I'm not sure what the real world difference would be between thoe two options.
I’ve also got a Festool ctl sys which is small systainer size. Lives under my bench.
Obviously that’s not got as much capacity and is expensiverer.
Seem to be amazingly expensive now. I bought the smallest wheeled CTL thing a few years back - think it was around £250 back then. They all seem to start around £500 now. I fancy the Systainer thing to sit under the chop saw, but not at £500+.
If the power take off isn't an issue then I think the £45 Titan is a newer version of mine. Cheap and lasted long enough that I'm very happy.
I've got the Titan too: seriously battered in 6 months but it wont die. It is big. I will replace it with something smaller. And yes: PTO is just great! I wouldnt go back.
I got the Titan with the PTO for Xmas. I got it for cleaning up swarf from my mini lathe. I didn't think I needed the PTO but it's been really useful e.g. sanding my 25 year old knife block before oiling it, instead of the garage being a dusty mess there was just sawdust in the can. Highly recommended if you can make some space.
I can’t see a filter rating for that Evolution R15, I’ll be cutting sheet materials including MDF so believe I really want Class M?
It comes with L but you can buy L or M filters.
M Class machines aren't necceassily filtering to a finer degree - in most cases L class and M class machines have the same filters inside. The difference between L and M (apart from a few hundred quid and a sticker) is that an M class machine has is an alarm to tell you that suction has been reduced - pretty much to tell you that the bag is full... thats it really.
I fancy the Systainer thing to sit under the chop saw, but not at £500+.
The whole point of them is they're really portable - they're for carrying in and out of job sites- kind of defeats the point to hook them up to static tools at home. A friend uses on because he travels to jobs by taxi so he needs to carry his whole workshop with two hands. They've got bugger all capacity - unlike most extractor they dont have wheels so although they''re portable in the sense that they're easy to carry when not in use - they limit your movement a bit when they actually are in use
I fancy the Systainer thing to sit under the chop saw, but not at £500+.
It's not £500, its £275. (If thats the mini extractor in a systainer you're meaning). Has power take off, quite handy i thought. OK expensive, but everything Festool is expensive. Holds its price though, works as it should and gives years of service.
I’ve gone it’s the V Tuf mini, mainly as the dimensions are a perfect fit for the available space.
I’m going to try and sort a remote control plug for it, a few of the tools it’ll be used with are cordless too so not sure PTO can be made to work with those, certainly not with the tools I have.
Is there a standard way to handle inside corners? That last bit on both cuts the track saw leaves - was assuming ubiquitous YouTube instructions but not found anything yet.
Japanese saw is okay, not yet tried turning over the wood to plunge from t'other side...
Is there a standard way to handle inside corners?
Depends how fine you want the finish - the chippie doing all the birdmouths on our roof timbers finished off with a battery powered jigsaw.
Obs for cabinetry you might want a nicer finish and use chisels / or a router etc.
I tend to finish it with a jigsaw away from the edge I want, then pare down to a crisp corner with a chisel.
So that'd be tracksaw with finish side up and then turn over for jigaw? Cut away from intended edge as are no precise lines, then turn back over and chisel?
I tend to finish it with a jigsaw away from the edge I want, then pare down to a crisp corner with a chisel.
^^ As above.
You shouldn't need to turn it over. If you use the jigsaw far enough off the line, it wont be effected by breakout. Besides a jigsaw cuts on the down stroke, so breakout should be minimized anyway.
Thanks! Off to the shed...
If you mess it up its Kayak's fault 😉
I will check which my my jigsaw cuts 😜
I use one of these switches and a cheap 1500w titan from screwfix. Great for battery powered tools or if you don't want to spend too much. I have the vacuum set up under my workbench with the hose clipped on to the side of the bench and the switch is clipped in to it's bracket next to the hose. The switch can be unclipped easily for doing work away from the bench. I have the same again in my van for the big saws, routers etc. 2 vacuums, 2 switches were approx £110.
Jigsaw blades are usually "cut up" meaning they leave a ragged cut on the upper face. This is a safety feature: the saw is pulled into the workpiece. A cut down blade, BR101, in the hands of an inexperienced user will bounce off and cause all sorts of damage. You need to apply constant pressure. I used to have some blades that had a cut up section at the very top and the rest was cut down. It left a neat cut both sides but I've never found any since.
Bosch T101 AO cut perfect both sides, good for laminates etc. Excellent for tight radius circles also. They are shorter than usual blades but I have never had a problem with that.
The Bosch T308BF are the blades which cut on the upstroke underneath the wood, and on the downstroke on top of the wood, good for laminate worktops.
Thanks for the find!
Is there a standard way to handle inside corners?
It will depend on what you are making and what finish you want. A sharp corner isn't usually a good idea. If it is just rough I use a pull saw or jigsaw, if it is a finished edge then I usually aim to have a radiused corner. Clamp on a template corner and follow route it. Having a radius makes adding a pencil rad or chamfer much easier too.
Is there a standard way to handle inside corners?
It will depend on what you are making and what finish you want. A sharp corner isn’t usually a good idea
Good point actually.
Always difficult to clean up sharp corners well.
I quite often drill a nice hole with a forstner bit so it spans the corner, then tracksaw up to the apex on each side.
You get a lush corner that way.
You still have to wisp the last bit away with something but it works well.
Like this router jig for a finger pull, but a corner instead of a cut out.
Concealed hing jigs, any in particular worth buying?
Or just buy that Krek one!
Soss hinge or kitchen hinge?
I've never used a jig for kitchen hinges apart from an old tatty bit of mdf withe 3 pilot holes in.
Soss hinge will definitely need a jig
Kitchen hinge, im ham fisted so dome sort of jig will be needed. Even if it needs making.
Just make your own some hinge manufacturers differ by a few mm. Get a cutter with a depth stop built in
Kitchen hinge, im ham fisted so dome sort of jig will be needed.
I've been using one of these:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B07XM1PPZ3/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_image?ie=UTF8&psc=1
and one of these
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Concealed-Hinge-Mounting-Plate-Drilling/dp/B077DWKH6P
More questions…
I’m building a cabinet (actually 2 stacked) the cabinet is going to be heavy when built and used.
The cabinet is going into a corner with a 30cm high skirting board that also protrudes about 3cm (I’m really done with old houses…)
Is there a good way of fitting this close into both walls in the corner? I can’t think of anything that doesn’t compromise the strength of the basic box/exceeds my abilities. I don’t want too many things fixed to the walls.
Or am I better adding a bit more space to the side wall to make a usable space, either that or just scribing a fillet(?) to hide the gap.
And cheers all for the hinge guidance 👍
How about a cabinet from skirting up then a drawer unit besides the skirting? Unless this doesn't go with the current design theme. Whatever gap is left can be filled with a face frame.
I have a similar challenge for my living room cabinets either side of the fireplace. In my case I think I'll keep the cabinet away from the wall to give cable space.