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Prosecutor asks the question, defendant replies to the Judge instead.Is that normal? It'd wind me up. I'd say listen you loathsome little shitehawk I'm the one speaking to you- answer to me.
It would be perfectly good etiquette here to do that.
Has any of the prosecution bothered checking the size of the bathroom window and asking him why he thought a burglar might get a ladder and squeeze in there rather than taking the easier route via the patio doors?
Prosecutor asks the question, defendant replies to the Judge instead.
Is that normal? It'd wind me up. I'd say listen you loathsome little shitehawk I'm the one speaking to you- answer to me.
The judge decides, there is no jury, and the prosecutors job is to not believe you. I know which one I would be trying to convince whether what I was saying was true or false.
convert - MemberThe mi lady bit does tickle me!
Indeed, a high profile white, (by all accounts) arrogant afrikaner male being super deferential to a black female judge is rather satisfying to hear!
Indeed. I can imagine generations of ethnic Africans totally understanding Pistorius's POV, erm... well possibly not.
I do wonder what the appetite of the African peoples POV is in this case for a conviction, a conviction whether he's guilty or not.
Maybe its designed to flatter, to make her feel important. Incase shes wavering, unsure she'll then find him not-guilty?
This reminds me in some ways of OJ Simpson. Different parallels but a celeb defending himself. One we KNOW did it and one we know did it..the only thing that seperates them is premeditation?
He's been well directed, that's all.
Direct all submissions and remarks to the bench and not the opposing advocate.
Just normal court etiquette.
I guess, I suppose in some way he's belittling the Prosecution by not refering his answers to them, but the Judge.
Mi Lady. 😉
Maybe its designed to flatter, to make her feel important.
She is the judge in the biggest trial in her country. She has probably worked out she has been judged as highly competent in her area of expertise. The prosecutor probably realises he is quite highly regarded as well given he was chosen
Who would be anything other than polite to the person who could put you in jail for 30 + years?
his story seems to be unraveling under pressure from the prosecutor, his "I shouted to her to call the police" when she was only feet away was not met with a reply! not even a "hang on, wait till I've finished on the loo"
He addresses the judge in the same way that British MPs address the Speaker, not each other.
Either she's an extremely astute and respected judge or she's a political appointment for the reasons mentioned above - a white man of the discredited Afrikaaner tribe causing havoc in what is now a black African country deserves to be judged by a black judge.... or it was thought that a white male judge would be unlikely to be seen as impartial... who knows, but it's interesting.
The only time I was in a quasi-judicial situation I addressed the bloke in charge as "sir", so I'm not sure what is so odd with what he says.
Have we done this?
http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/closeread/2014/04/oscar-pistoriuss-trigger.html
Interesting analysis, and he doesn't come out of it well.
emsz - MemberYour in bed, you hear something that wakes you up, next thing "everyone" does is roll over and shake the person next to them " wake up did you hear that?"
That's not his version of events, though- he says he was out of bed when he heard the "intruder"
Thanks for the NYer link
Has no one called him Pistolrius yet?
Knock, knock
Wh....BANG BANG BANG BANG
Oscar Pistorius
[url= http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/mark-johnson-burglar-captured-after-3406014 ]... just sayin'[/url]
I do believe he is most likely guilty on the other hand in an African context especially south African context his explanations don't seem that daft.
I have lived in several african countries and on two occasions in South Africa and have visited at least many times when not living there.
I had someone coming in through the tiny bathroom window(all the others where protected by metal bars) and ended up with a knife against my troat.
I have had armed guards in front of the house, seen people with sticks and knives under their pillows, used to have a panga under my desk in the office. Have stayed behind 15 feed electric fences.
I cycled with peper spray tied to my handlebars and trained on grabbing it quickly, many friend ride with it and or knives some with guns.
Withe South africans are scared to a certain degree rigtly, guns are all around and not seen as strange. As a result on many attacks and often a stap or shoot first policy from robbers people don't wait it can cost your live. Many have already lost their lives meaning quite some are scared senseless living on the edge and pronen to nervous over reactions. Family members have been shot before been mistaken by intruders.
You learn to live with the constant fear, you try and learn to ignore I know hear them again but I would just sleep through gunshots as it was just a daily thing and rather normal and most likely 500m or one 1-2k away so wouldn't get to me. Its a beautifull place Africa and in specific South Africa but some parts of it are so bedly messed up.
I call bullshit on scaredypants link
Officers quickly pursued his Citroen Picasso on a high-speed chase
I do feel sorry for the shop at the Bespoke bike show - not sure of their heritage but having Pistorius all over your shirt might lead to some odd conversations.
Ouch
I'm off work tomorrow, planning to watch tomorrows hearing from start to finish, with muchos baked goods, and lots of coffee 😀 anyone else?
Still doesn't have a leg to stand on.
He's getting totally ripped apart, arguing a lot and coming across poorly. Nell's really pulling out all the stops, inconsistency after inconsistency.
Hows he holding up to the chain of events and the screams heard?
I think the sequence of screams and shots will get him though...
Has no one called him Pistolrius yet?
going by his story it's oscar preposterous
He's broke down in tears already when asked what he shouted when approaching the bathroom. Oh dear!
Basically the stress is making him forget his story? When will he properly contradict himself then?
Whats the latest?
Gone for a blub
where are you watching it? My feed keeps freezing.
Sky news free view. channel 82. Just adjourned for lunch.
He's broke down again for the third time.
Ended on asking him why didn't he fire a warning shot in the shower cubicle? OP said it would ricochet. Nell said it would ricochet if shot in the toilet cubicle. Op keeps changing story, says he can't remember, doesn't know, and broke down.
Very interesting, just watching a few minutes of this live.
The question of why he did not look for Reeva anywhere else after shooting the "intruder" in the bathroom was quite a big reveal. Not sure that Nel is asking quite the right questions, but the whole things does appear to be avery flaky and inconsistent defence.
I lasted a few minutes until him saying 'My Lady' and the end of every sentence got to much. The judge should just tell him to stop, she must find it annoying too.
I think he should be found guilty on the grounds of having an annoying whiny voice. The prosecution rests.
What he said does not make sense.
I will judge him guilty and death by Zulu spears the traditional ways.
Can't imagine a situation when i would wake up, hear a noise in the loo, not notice my wife wasn't in the bed and assume it was a burglar nicking my toilet brush so shoot 4 rounds off without warning/checking.
How I bet he wishes he lived in Los Angeles County
If he does get found innocent it will say something fairly dreadful about the place - somewhere where you can be so fearful of a lethally violent burglary that you could could make that rash a decision to fire off a gun and that be OK.
Think of a time when something traumatic's happened to you. Did you clearly remember every detail? Would you appear convincing under aggressive crossexamination a year later? Now imagine that the traumatic thing was accidentally/negligently killing your girlfriend. Fair to say that'd mess up your day.
Lots of folks on here seem keen to make black and white judgements, "his story is inconsistent- he must be guilty" There's lots of reasons his story could be inconsistent or inaccurate, not wanting to face up to the facts doesn't mean he murdered her.
Also I think it's pretty hard to really put yourself in his place- mate of mine grew up in south africa, he's more understanding of the "**** someone's in the house, shoot them before they shoot you" approach than I am. And no denying he's more vulnerable than an able bodied person so maybe reaching for a gun becomes more reasonable, and the level of fear/panic/paranoia required to pull teh trigger on someone you've not seen becomes less insane.
The stuff about his dodgy firearms history has been pitched as an attack on him but to me it seems to back up the accidental death defence- he likes playing with guns, that's consistent with being too quick to use one in "defence"
Seems pretty certain he's guilty of being an arsehole and a danger to others. Not sure he's a murderer. I'd be more suspicious if he had a perfectly rehearsed tidy story with no weaknesses- and really, does this strike anyone as a good way to murder someone? Having said that he's an arsehole, so maybe it did.
+1 Northwind. It's unclear.
Can't imagine a situation when i would wake up, hear a noise in the loo, not notice my wife wasn't in the bed and assume it was a burglar nicking my toilet brush so shoot 4 rounds off without warning/checking.
As above, if you haven't lived in this kind of environment why would you be able to imagine it?
I'm sure my first thought would be for my wife and kids, but if I were a vain self-obsessed arsehole shagging a pretty woman as a trophy, perhaps it wouldn't be. No-one's saying he's not a thoroughly unpleasant bloke, and such a bloke could easily accidentally shoot someone I think. It's going to be hard to prove either way imo. I think the prosecutor should easily be able to get a conviction for murder I reckon - he's done enough to convince STW already!
It's simple, he killed her, and needs to go to jail. If he murdered her, he needs to go to jail for longer.
I have lived in South Africa if that better qualifies me to make that statement.
Also I think it's pretty hard to really put yourself in his place- mate of mine grew up in south africa, he's more understanding of the "**** someone's in the house, shoot them before they shoot you" approach than I am. And no denying he's more vulnerable than an able bodied person so maybe reaching for a gun becomes more reasonable, and the level of fear/panic/paranoia required to pull teh trigger on someone you've not seen becomes less insane.
Then you'll understand that hes being tried in the right place by people who also live in such an environment and are more likely to view/treat him fairly no?
If he had done this in any other country trying to argue his background, for many factors it'd be a different kettle of fish wouldn't it.
It's simple, he killed her, and needs to go to jail. If he murdered her, he needs to go to jail for longer.
Of course. We know he killed her, we know he's going away, but they are trying to decide how long. That's the non-simple part.
Whatever happens I dont think he should ever be allowed anywhere near guns again. Especially if they go off miraculously as he claimed on Friday.
Oscar who?
Oscar who?
You may know him as Oscar the Grouch.
hora - MemberThen you'll understand that hes being tried in the right place by people who also live in such an environment and are more likely to view/treat him fairly no?
Yup. I'm commenting on the court of singletrack here you understand.
It's natural and understandable that he can't recall every detail. His problem is that he is either guessing or making the answers up on the spot. This makes it easy for Nel to tie him up in knots, make him look like a liar and so destroy his credibility. The correct answer, when you don't know or can't remember, is 'I don't know' or 'I can't remember'. Honest answers make you look like an honest witness which gives the rest of your evidence more credibility.
Knock, Knock
Who's th...bang, bang, bang, bang
Its Oscar, I thought you were in bed 😆
Where does one acquire a gun that senses when you are terrified and then fires itself [s]accidentally[/s] automatically without the bearer's input (and responsibility). Isn't technology amazing.
Lower down the page is a pretty good 3D image/layout of the flat. I didn't realise just how close he was when getting the fans to his bed etc:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-27018395
Whatever happens I dont think he should ever be allowed anywhere near guns again. Especially if they go off miraculously as he claimed on Friday.
Exactly, so if he applies to join the prison shooting club they should just say Oi Pisto get stuffed you nutter
Another twist...
[url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-27405303 ]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-27405303[/url]