[Closed] Petrol Prices........

Take the total resources in the world and divide by 9000000000. That's what we should have each.

Small scale subsistence farming, with first world healthcare, for all?

People living in truly rural area's have NO option but personal transport.

Agreed, so rather than shrugging our shoulders we should be looking to subsidise public transport now so these lifestyles are viable for the next 100 years too.

or would rural sheep farmers children be taken into care to ensure they can get an education in your socialist utopia?

My sister grew up in rural Australia, perhaps 15 miles from the school and up a **** off mountain. There was a school bus which picked her up from the end of the lane. I don't think she was ever taken into care 😉

Or we could put our effort into developing and expanding cleaner more efficient forms of personal transport that don't rely on hydrocarbons, instead of trying to turn back the clock to the stone age and restrict peoples liberty and freedom of choice.

move forward, not back.

restrict peoples liberty and freedom of choice

Most of the rest of Europe seems to have managed to retain subsidised transport

Yes, that's right. However the rest of Europe is a different place. Different population distribution, different patterns of economic activity, different economic and political history.. Doesn't really make sense to compare. Simple geogrpahy in many cases makes a difference.

My sister and her family live 7 miles away from the nearest small town. They run stupid low mpg cars and complain frequently about the costs of fuel and having to drive everywhere

And for another side of the story - my mate when I was in school lived in the village, his parents drove an ancient Fiat 125 that was given to them. His dad was a builder and had to drive to get work when he could. They were living hand-to-mouth. Fuel prices must've really hit them hard.

There is no "Right" Answer just a series of compromises to choose between.

as an environmental measure constantly bumping fuel up above inflation is a reasonably good way of costing excessive use out of peoples reach, you could look at it as a very efficient form of polution tax you will be taxed very highly for every Litre of petrol/Diesel you burn, so think carefully before you burn it...

But lets be honest this isn't motivated by Dave and Nicks Love of polar bears and ice caps, it's all about the money, Tax revenues, it's in their interest to put it just inside your ecconomic reach to own and drive a car to and from work, to the shops, everywhere it puts money in the tresury, doen't win votes though and reduces peoples ability to do other economically useful things like spend on the highstreet, pay their bills or save...

Maybe the solution is not to make petrol expensive but cars Really expensive if you can't afford a vehicle to burn fuel in, you won't buy any fuel, perhaps throw some unreasonable taxes on the puchase of a new or used car for personaly use, a bit like stamp duty... that means the Government can generate revenue passively, they don't do anything to generate it... Yeah I like that one... again though probably not a vote winner is it?

Government investment in alternatives to hydrocarbon fueled Cars is pretty invisible, by alternatives I mean anything from new forms of propultion to better public transport to improved communications technology - anything which reduces the cost and/or polution of a vehicle on the road, or allows people to work and live without the need for putting a vehicle on the road. I suppose the Boris bikes fall under the second heading, does anyone know (per bike), just how many fewer taxi journeys there are now as a result of these? I'm not sure the impact has been epic has it?

Essentially every measure and justification you can consider seems to have equally ecconomically or environmentaly negative outcomes and these days the ecconomic trumps the environmental in most debates... ultimately the status quo chuggs along as if ruffles the least feathers...

Network problems causing double post...

People always say that we can't go backwards, we have to go forwards. But what if we're walking to a cliff? Do we keep going forwards, off the cliff, or do we make a turn, then keep walking forward? I don't think the large scale abandoning of cars would be a backwards step. I think it would be an amazing step forward in a different direction. I don't drive, and never have, so maybe it's easier for me to imagine, especially as I'm still in my mid twenties. I can imagine a world were most journeys are taken by bike, and train for longer ones. I can imagine a world where people chose to live close to friends and family, to their work, where vast retail zones no longer exist. I think too much of the debate here is simply a failure of imagination. Like JTD said, seeing without motor-centric eyes is liberating, terrifying and exciting.

Kim Stanley Robinson's book Pacific Edge [i]presents a California in which ecologically sane, manageable practices have become the norm and the scars of the past are slowly being healed.[/i]
Its a bit folksy but has some quite good ideas in it, and nowhere near as odd as Walden Two...

restrict peoples liberty and freedom of choice.

That cuts both ways - people's liberty and freedom of choice are restricted by the dominance of the car.

Exactly - look at Meyer Hillmann's writing on the way that motor vehicles remove options and quality of life for everyone - even those who do the motoring (even though most of them don't appear to realise it).

I made it to 34 without learning to drive, relying on public transport to get around. It is surprising what you an achieve without a car, but every year things seem to go in the wrong direction, you need somewhere to live no car means you are restricted as to where you can actually link home, work, life together, and being a tenant i am at the mercy of others actions.

Do i wish i didn't have to drive yes, do i think it is possible to do without a car altogether? at the moment the way my life is no.

I can imagine a world where people chose to live close to friends and family, to their work

You don't need to imagine it, just look in the history books. Those were the times when people lived and died in the same town and never got to experience life anywhere else.

I'm not pro-car, don't get me wrong, but many of us would be giving up a hell of a lot to live in the world you describe. We have more than our ancestors did. This is usually a good thing.

The challenge is to have more without wrecking everything - not just do without.

But that's where trains come in. I'm not saying no one should move anywhere ever, just that there might be nicer ways than the motor car.

Or we could put our effort into developing and expanding cleaner more efficient forms of personal transport that don't rely on hydrocarbons, instead of trying to turn back the clock to the stone age and restrict peoples liberty and freedom of choice.

Don't think they had buses in the stone age...

Your solution simply doesn't address the other side of the issue, that personal transport makes it possible to live 50 miles from your workplace. That's not a great situation. We should be asking WHY it takes 3 times longer for certain journeys at certain times and trying to do something about it. I'm in total agreement that ramping petrol to £5 a litre is not the way to achieve this btw.

Trains can help, but as above there's the cost factor.

Remember, when these things were built there was a far greater difference between the rich and the poor. So the rich elite could employ scum for peanuts to do all the backbreaking work, and most people could only afford one trip a year, and then make their money back charging other rich people lots of money.

I made it to 34 without learning to drive, relying on public transport to get around.

I'm 34 and don't drive.

When finishing uni and getting married, we made the decision to live near to our families. We couldn't afford a car, so we didn't have one, so we only applied for jobs that were reachable by public transport.

We do have a car now, but if fuel hit £10 a litre tomorrow it could happily sit on the drive and not get used.

Friends who made the decision to move to the new town just down the road, because it's "only a ten minute drive away" and you get more house for your money are now trapped as a two car family who have to drive everywhere.

TBH if the last 3 Tory Governments hadn't spent all their time selling off all our public infrastructure companies to the French, Spanish and Germans we might have a more integrated transport system more attuned to our requirements without the tedious vertical dis-integration that currently exists.

If I worked in the town I now live, I'd be earning half what I do now. We can't really afford to move or take 50% salary cut.

It's quite hard to make sacrifices, sometimes.

But those factors are always shifting molgrips. Maybe you would have rejected your current home if travel was more expensive. Indeed perhaps more suitable jobs would be on offer there if equally skilled people could not cheaply commute to your town.

We can't really afford to move or take 50% salary cut.

When you work out the [url= http://karlmccracken.sweat365.com/2011/11/17/the-true-cost-of-commuting/ ]true cost of commuting[/url], can you afford not to move?

the train isn't *that* fuel efficient either though. Train efficiency according to here

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuel_efficiency_in_transportation#Passenger

varies wildly - but taking a medium figure (say 0.4mj/passenger km) - that's about the same as a chevvy volt (in full electric mode) with 2 passengers in.

With that in mind, more economical cars may be the future (say smaller 2 seaters to reduce weight/increase efficiency) - don't seem far behind trains

I can't afford to move becuase I don't have enough equity in my house. Trust me, it's off the cards for a good few years.

The choice of house was made due to other factors.

My job is not in one location. Most of the work is in the South East so I could move there but that is DEFINITELY far too expensive. It would mean we would both have to work like slaves and hardly see our kids like many people seem to do.

But this is not a lifestyle whinge - I'd give our lifestyle a B - I am just trying to point out that things are not always as simple as the 'just move closer' brigade point out.

It's about priorities and sacrifices. I have not yet found a way to get what I want without doing some driving. I would love to be in the position of working from home but that's hard to achieve.

Mike: Me and Mrs Grips could afford to do a 16 mile a day commute fairly easily and still live where we do. You are telling me that we should now be able to afford a £750,000 house?

Don't talk shite!

That article makes the utterly flawed assumption that people only have cars for commuting purposes. And they put depreciation as a running cost - which I do not agree with. Plus it assumes that if you weren't driving home you'd be working the extra hours which is again rubbish. Few people are able to work overtime at will, ime and get paid pro-rata for it.

5lab: but it's not just fuel efficiency we're talking about here. There's all the social problems cars generate, the thousands dead, the congestion, the fractured communities, the out of town shopping centres and closed village shops, the road rage and stress, space wasted for car parks.

With that in mind, more economical cars may be the future (say smaller 2 seaters to reduce weight/increase efficiency) - don't seem far behind trains

It depends how you look at it. From a governmental/ planning point of view, the argument that trains aren't much more carbon efficient than cars has merit. But from a personal point of view, the train's running regardless of whether you're on it or not, so your carbon emissions for that journey are close to zero.

It's also worth noting that there's huge potential for improving train efficiency.

When you work out the true cost of commuting, can you afford not to move?

I just did.
According to the methodology they employ on that website, it appears that it would be cheaper for me to ditch the bicycle and drive to work 😀

5lab: but it's not just fuel efficiency we're talking about here. There's all the social problems cars generate, the thousands dead, the congestion, the fractured communities, the out of town shopping centres and closed village shops, the road rage and stress, space wasted for car parks.

but if you removed all private transport, a lot of those problems would escalate. People would be forced to move out of rural communities as there's no work there (towns with train stations would be fine, those without would be screwed). That would fracture communities.

I don't see why closed village shops are a bad thing compared to out of town shopping centers. Out of town centers offer a range of choice that village shops would never be able to cope with, I'd prefer to keep that.

Time lost to congestion is nothing compared to time lost waiting for trains, if it was the only way of getting around

There's all the social problems cars generate

They do solve some too though. Like how we find work...

There's a nice trail leading up the valley opposite the A470 as it comes down from the Storey Arms to Brecon. It's called the Miners' path, because people from Brecon used to walk over to Merthyr to work in the mines. Something like 12 miles. I bet their quality of life was improved massively by not having cars. How badly do you think they needed the work that they'd walk for three hours, work down a mine all day and then walk three hours home?

Not really relevant today but I am struggling to think of more ways to make the point that sometimes you need to travel to work, and sometimes there's no public transport available. And that there isn't always GOING to be public transport.

I think people underestimate the sheer scale of social revolution that would be required to achieve these things.

I am struggling to think of more ways to make the point that sometimes you need to travel to work,

No one needs to commute - its always a choice. those who don't have a fixed base obviously do need to travel to work but commuting - always a choice.

I fully understand the scale of the social revolution - the scary thing it is coming and there is nothing that can be done bar adapt to it. preferably in a planned and controlled manner IMO but this thread shows both the resistance and the sheer denial going on.

Its within living memory it was not like this.

...No one needs to commute...

i'm buggered if i'm sleeping at the lab.

sorry - commute long distances that need a car

Sorry TJ but you are wide of the mark there. Most people do need to commute, it's a question of how much is justifiable to the individual. The real issue is that people have started to feel that 1-2 hour commutes are normal. It may have been normal for those miners but I'd hope we've moved on from that. I vaguely remember a Japanese man in a documentary whose commute was 8 hours daily!

Why do people need to commute? long distances that need a car?

boss: you've got to work in the leeds office for 6 months.

employee: but, it's a long way, and not exactly easy by train/bus

boss: and?

choice - " sorry boss - no can do"

Worker: I refuse to work in Leeds 😉

i tried that - i got made redundant.

I agree thats a difficult one and sometimes the choices are hard .

Government: we will tax your business relative to the commuting distances of the staff.

Boss: Maybe I'll employ someone from Leeds 🙂

Government: we will tax your business relative to the commuting distances of the staff.

Boss: Maybe I'll employ someone from Leeds

Unions - STRIKE! 😉

boss you can have your job but the company is moving to Chester, can't do as other half has a job and job market is crap.

Now i have a new job but it is 16miles away from home. I ride more than i drive but couldn't do the job without the car.

There is NO effective Public transport i could use if i wanted to. i guess i could get a 40 mile train journey which i don't think would arrive early enough. or a 30 mile bus journey which incidently is going to be hammered when they close junction 10 of the m5 next spring, but that wouls also see me late and having to leave early.

Mrmo - you have still made choices that put you in that situation - living somewhere with rubbish public transport is a choice.

I have never done a commute I could not do by bike - thats because of the choice sand compromises I made

I'm sure the young female nurse getting off shift late at night and having to get the night bus home, then walk to her tenement flat past the group of pissed up ned's on the street corner feels really reassured by that TJ, still, that was her choice, yeah 🙄

Ridiculous argument TJ. Houses aren't selling quickly, people change jobs (by choice or otherwise) and there are various other factors to take into account.

Are you seriously suggesting that people always have a viable choice as to whether they commute or not? Please note, I said [b]viable[/b].

so TJ, yes i made a choice, now lets hear what you would do?

I live in the same town as my family, as does the other half. we both worked in that town. If you add Cheltenham and Gloucester together, which you might as well considering how connected they are, your talking a population of c250-300k so not a particularly small town.

I was told the choice was relocate to chester, c150miles away, or take redundancy?

So the choice is either i keep my job or the SO keeps her job, but not both. I suppose we could have split up but is that really an option?

The current jobs market is crap, took me 18months to get the job i have, pay isn't brilliant but it is a lot more than i was getting temping. I can actually afford to pay the bills rather than use the credit card to cover things. But it does mean i have to commute across county boundaries, hence the appauling bus service, and beeching did for the rail line.

So what would you do? A very simple question and i would be interested to hear your answer.

That's a shit situation mrmo, I don't think I would have done anything different. Although I did move 150 miles once for a job, I'm still here 10 years later so it must have been a good choice. Is it really that easy for a company to up sticks and move 150 miles? Perhaps it shouldn't be.

richpenny, it made a lot of sense for the company and you can't argue the logic.

our main supplier was same group, they owned huge amounts of surplus land, the closure of the blast furnaces 30years ago sorted that. The site i was on was leased, our business was loosing money. Moving meant source materials were a mile away not 150, the rent was lower and intracompany not extra company....

so yes for me a shit situation but if they hadn't moved and gone bust i would have been in the same place.

Don't talk shite!

Tetchy.

When my father-in-law started work in the 70s, [url= http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?saddr=Wear+Valley+Junction,+Crook&daddr=Lingfield+Point&hl=en&sll=53.800651,-4.064941&sspn=15.006879,43.286133&geocode=FVFgQgMdjWHl_ymZVrIciSl8SDGfXXDtP-qf9g%3BFSoJQAMdh9Po_ylTGMApPJp-SDEeBB_3wFn09g&vpsrc=0&mra=ls&t=h&z=11 ]he lived in a tiny hamlet 17 miles from his work[/url]. He managed just fine without a car, because he caught the works' bus. When the works' bus was cancelled in 1978 or so, they moved to Darlington, because they couldn't afford a car.

There are probably scores of people making the same/similar journey today who "can't do it by bus". If workplace parking was taxed, would employers start running bus services again?

I used to work for a medium-large employer on the edge of the Cotswolds in a tiny town because the owner and senior management liked living there. The rest of us (over a 1000 mostly in are 20s and 30s) live in the surrounding cities and towns like Swindon, Cheltenham, Bristol and Bath. When I started 6 years ago everyone commuted on their own but as fuel prices rose every one started to lift share to save money. They did try to lay on a bus to Bristol but it wasn't popular as it you still had to get to the one bus stop and it added lots of extra time to the 2hrs spent commuting every day.
I questioned a director about whether it was sustainable once and they just dismissed it as not being a problem.
I'm so glad I don't do it anymore as there is better ways of wasting my time than being stuck in a car but they are a prestigious employer for many graduates who are not realistically going to want to live in the middle of nowhere. If fuel prices continue going up I can see it affecting their recruitment.

oh well i was hoping tj would come and give an opinion to the scenario i set out.

on the edge of the Cotswolds in a tiny town

Wotton?

Yes, that's right. However the rest of Europe is a different place. Different population distribution, different patterns of economic activity, different economic and political history.. Doesn't really make sense to compare. Simple geogrpahy in many cases makes a difference.

Yes Europe is different people there use their public transport and it goes through every one-horse dorp on the way to a town. It's maintained as a fantastic resource for everyone, regular public investment and renewal. There is a lack of will here to do what our neighbours do maintained by the "little Englanders" at the top.

mrmo,
presumably there were compromises you were unprepared to make to your lifestyle? asking 'what would you have done' is a bit disingenuous as we're not you!

Trains can help, but as above there's the cost factor.

Remember, when these things were built there was a far greater difference between the rich and the poor. So the rich elite could employ scum for peanuts to do all the backbreaking work, and most people could only afford one trip a year, and then make their money back charging other rich people lots of money.

hmm, but now we have machines that do a lot of the back breaking work. think it more likely that railway lines are now just hemmed in and that expansion requires either bulldozing lots of things or going the long way round.

i thought one of the biggest issues with our train network was that there were two 'pinch points' in the country that effectively throttle the flow everywhere else?

surely the fact that people commute from small villages/towns around big cities is proof that a commute is necessary. There simply aren't jobs where some houses are (in the countryside, outside of farms), and there aren't enough houses where there are jobs (in cities, which people commute to).

without private transport, how would you move a child up to university and back every term? carry all their belongings on the train?

surely the fact that people commute from small villages/towns around big cities is proof that a commute is necessary.

I think the counter argument goes that the jobs are in a different place to the houses because people can commute, rather than the people need to commute because the jobs are in a different place. Of course both viewpoints are by their nature simplistic generalisations which can be picked apart easily.

without private transport, how would you move a child up to university and back every term? carry all their belongings on the train?

I think it's reasonable to say that there exists some land between "No one's allowed to have a car" and "I should be allowed to drive anywhere for free". I'm guess what's being suggested is that many people (but not all) could drive a lot less without devastating their lives. For instance I have a neighbour who every morning drives 1/4 of a mile to another neighbour to then take that neighbour's dog on a 5 mile walk. This strikes me as slightly mental 🙂

ian what are you thinking of here being all reasonable and seeing shades of grey in tis issue - you will never be a big hitter with this type of attitude. Takes a position at one of the extreme poles and argue it to death.....you are letting the side down 😉
i agree with you FWIW people use cars for very short journeys. i always remember a neighbour driving her kids to nursery club and when i returned from walking my kids there i saw her park in her drive get the kid sout and confess she could not get parked anywhere closer - it was about 200 m away

Yes Europe is different people there use their public transport and it goes through every one-horse dorp on the way to a town. It's maintained as a fantastic resource for everyone, regular public investment and renewal. There is a lack of will here to do what our neighbours do maintained by the "little Englanders" at the top.

I do agree with this, however it is amazing to see that despite this alot of a european neighbours who we think of like this still have a higher number of vehicles per capita than the UK.
Clearly it is not just as simple as saying "better public transport"

[url= http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_vehicles_per_capita ]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_vehicles_per_capita[/url]

Sorry Junkyard!
I haven't had any coffee yet this morning, so I'm feeling slightly weak.

I think it's reasonable to say that there exists some land between "No one's allowed to have a car" and "I should be allowed to drive anywhere for free". I'm guess what's being suggested is that many people (but not all) could drive a lot less without devastating their lives. For instance I have a neighbour who every morning drives 1/4 of a mile to another neighbour to then take that neighbour's dog on a 5 mile walk. This strikes me as slightly mental

this is true, but your example is the sort of journey that will have very little effect from £5/litre fuel. a 1/2 mile journey, even from cold, probably costs around 10p to drive. Even at 50p, I doubt there is enough impact to make someone not want to make the journey

Yes Europe is different people there use their public transport and it goes through every one-horse dorp on the way to a town

And why is that? Because they are great and we are idiots?

No, it's because as I said - politics, history, geography and so on.

Public transport in Helsinki for instance is great but that's because cars are hugely expensive, and so is housing so most pepole live in high rise flats. This increases the population density, which is a critical factor in public transport viability.

EDIT very surprised by crispo's link and where Finland comes. Most of the older people I worked with had one car per household and the under 30s typically had no car. Perhaps that's just Helsinki tho.

without private transport, how would you move a child up to university and back every term? carry all their belongings on the train?

Erm, yes?

When I was at uni, my friend from Cornwall got the train up to Durham with their stuff. She thought asking her parents to make the 20 hour round trip six times a year was perhaps a bit cheeky.

or hire a car as needed...

I'm guess what's being suggested is that many people (but not all) could drive a lot less without devastating their lives

I don't have the figures to hand, but something like 50% of all car trips are less than 2 miles. Imagine how much more pleasant our streets would be if the only people driving were those who genuinely have to.

my mate cycled from germany with his stuff in a trailer to get to uni

My ex's Dad used to pay for me to hire a car to bring her down to Cornwall. Was great fun for me cos I didn't get to go on road trips very often.

mrmo

So what would you do? A very simple question and i would be interested to hear your answer.

Wisnae about,

As said above thats a shit situation really. Only you can make the right decision for you and I don't have all the info. However I would very much doubt I would do a 150 mile commute so it would be one of us quit or live apart - maybe weekly commute? Julie and I lived apart for work reasons for a while and did a long distance relationship but that ain't good either.

No right answer is there but I the biggest commute I have every done is 45 mins on a bike. Its a hugely important thing to me that I live in cycling distance of my work. It would take a lot to make me commute further

without private transport, how would you move a child up to university and back every term? carry all their belongings on the train?

Yup - seems normal to me I used to hitchhike sometimes.

surely the fact that people commute from small villages/towns around big cities is proof that a commute is necessary.

A lot of the time there is a two way commute - the people that work in the rural locations have been priced out of the housing market locally by commuters and end up living in the towns and cities and commuting to their rural jobs

this is true, but your example is the sort of journey that will have very little effect from £5/litre fuel. a 1/2 mile journey, even from cold, probably costs around 10p to drive. Even at 50p, I doubt there is enough impact to make someone not want to make the journey

Quite true. However what I was trying to highlight (and I guess failed) was the default action that many people have on opening their front door is to then open the car door. It can become so ingrained that it becomes a sort of learnt helplessness preventing them from exploring other possibilities. Having only relatively recently got a car I tend to suffer from it the other way round. Several times I've been sat looking at the weather thinking "don't fancy cycling to the shops in that rain", before remembering I have the option of the driving there instead 🙂

I don't have the figures to hand, but something like 50% of all car trips are less than 2 miles. Imagine how much more pleasant our streets would be if the only people driving were those who genuinely have to.

There was a pretty big study done in [url= http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=Darlington&hl=en&sll=53.800651,-4.064941&sspn=21.718578,39.506836&vpsrc=0&hnear=Darlington,+United+Kingdom&t=h&z=13 ]my little, average, parochial, northern home town[/url] a couple of years ago. They found that 1 in 3 trips made were less than 5 km, made by someone on their own who was physically capable of cycling [i]and[/i] owned a bike and who wasn't carrying anything heavy or bulky.

Nearly a third (32 %) of all trips are currently undertaken by motorised private modes because of “subjective” reasons – lack of awareness and negative perceptions of alternative modes. A change in these subjective influences would have to be achieved to produce a significant shift towards STM. Such a shift could be achieved
without any changes to the transport system.

The report's available at

and makes interesting reading.

on the edge of the Cotswolds in a tiny town

Wotton?

Malmesbury?!

I live in town and haven't had a car in 6 years. When I lived in a village though, it was essential. Nearest shop 3 miles, work was 25 miles away. 1 bus a day going the wrong way.

I often thought some sort of hybrid bus/taxi systems might be a solution for rural areas. Big eneough to take 30-40 people but flexible enough to change routes if you booked in advance on the internet.

A law making every bus capable of carrying at least 10 bikes would open so many more options too.

TJ, straight question i have given the details, to have the job i have i need a car, i wouldn't have the job if i couldn't drive, which would mean i would probably still be temping, as that is all that seems to be about at the moment, that would mean earning less than £15k as that seems the going rate.

The job market is crap at the moment. So whilst working a bit closer might be nice, not having to drive would also be nice, the choices i have been forced to make mean i have a job and have to drive. Go to the dole office and say i don't want the job because it is 45mins away and they will tell you where to go, read the rules on benefits.

I've just left my lovely bikey job because it meant I had to live in a tiny village with no facilities or public transport. I don't have a car, and this little village is the only place I could feasibly cycle to work from. I've been there 6 months, but my lease is up now, and I'm not struggling there for another 6 months. Car free in the countryside is hard. I'll never drive, and I've accepted that this means certain things regarding my life choices, certain compromises. I'm alright with that but I know our country could be much better in this regard.

I often thought some sort of hybrid bus/taxi systems might be a solution for rural areas. Big eneough to take 30-40 people but flexible enough to change routes if you booked in advance on the internet.

That's one (actually two) of the solutions to rural public transport needs that [url= http://www.transportforqualityoflife.com/ ]Lynn Sloman[/url] suggests in her book [url= http://www.amazon.co.uk/Car-Sick-Solutions-Car-addicted-Culture/dp/190399876X ]Car Sick[/url].

One system is for buses that are, kind of, like taxis. The other is for taxis that are, kind of, like buses. Great ideas.

that exists in pretty much any country that is too poor for private cars (ie Matatus in Kenya). In Cambodia they even have them running on the railway lines, which is an interestin solution