I’m marvelling at the sight of the anti-brexit brigade wailing because the inability to pay uk and foreign workers a pittance is inconveniencing their lifestyle.
That's not exactly it...
are we taking bets on when the first raging explosion will occur as some idiot sparks up a Lambert & Butler in their garage?
At least it will be roast gammon for tea.
I’m marvelling at the sight of the anti-brexit brigade wailing because the inability to pay uk and foreign workers a pittance is inconveniencing their lifestyle
According to johnson ‘…we’re transitioning into a high skill, high wage economy’.
I heard that, Er what does it actually mean 🙂
How about using a toilet that has piss all round the seat
TBH sounds like my nightclubbing years.
I think the issue is that no-ones been arsed to do toilets that can take the abuse but be spanky clean for the next user. It all relys on people being considerate for the next user.
It all relys on people being considerate for the next user.
Exactly that . If a truckers shower / toilet is covered in shit and piss, its because a fellow trucker has shit and pissed on it.
(Assuming the general shitting and pissing public dont have access to said facilities of course)
According to johnson ‘…we’re transitioning into a high skill, high wage economy’.
It means we don't test drivers for their ability to reverse anymore, and pay them more for their services.
If you think the solution is importing cheap labour then you’re deluded.
The solution is to pay workers properly full stop. If you want more of the drivers here to be “local”, then fund their training… improve the facilities they use… don’t push them into insanely long hours… don’t deskill them by reducing the testing of their competency… we can do all this without telling EU drivers to go away. They’re not coming back anyway, they’ve got the message, they’ll be earning more, with better conditions, with better facilities, with more rights and support, in comparable EU countries instead. They aren’t coming here in any numbers this winter just because we wave a short time low rights visa at them.
Exactly that . If a truckers shower / toilet is covered in shit and piss, its because a fellow trucker has shit and pissed on it.
I don't think it's that simple. There's all kinds of variables but it mostly comes down to broken window theory. The person who walks in to a battered old, dirty toilet block and discovers a toilet covered in shit and piss, isn't likely to go out of their way to leave it presentable themselves.
It's that whole thing, if you go to a country and find it remarkable how clean it is, it's not because the people are inherently cleaner, it's because there is a lot of effort from authorities to make it so, which in turn makes people more inclined to preserve that.
It's not just a trucker problem, it's an infrastructure problem.
The solution is to pay workers properly full stop.
Almost everything I hear is around the working conditions rather than the pay. I have friends who are drivers and they're quite happy with the wages but less so with the job.
I work in IT and our company puts just as much emphasis on a positive working culture than it does wages, because they know how important that is for attracting the right people.
Sounds to me that truck drivers are being undervalued and wages are only a tiny part of that.
Agreed. As I said in the rest of my posts. Why do we have worse conditions and facilities for drivers in the UK than in comparable EU countries where these “not local” drivers can and do still work?
So the number of temporary visas has been capped at 5,000 with a (probable) time limit of 3 months.
I would be surprised if the take-up exceeds 1,000.
What a mess - of the UK's own making; aren't we clever.
johnson wouldn't answer a US journo when asked if he could live on UC; he would also decline to answer if asked whether he would work in a job which might force him to piss into a bottle, shit into a plastic bag, sleep in a truck, eat a cholesterol inducing diet, work massively unsociable hours, spend much time away from his family whom he undoubtedly loves (doesn't he?) - and all for no more than £50k pa.
He and his government are a shower of shit - and that's putting it mildly.
A good read:
Interesting how the “they need us more than we need them” (ie we buy far more food and energy from them than they do from us, which is not the same thing at all as anyone honest knew and said at the time) means that drivers often have to return empty. Add in the new hassles of crossing the borders, and making up for driver shortages using drivers based outside the UK now makes little sense for those operating those lorries. So it’s not just a lack of UK based drivers that are the problem, it is all the barriers to working across borders, and the fact we do really need the EU for our supplies more than they need us for ours, that leaves us in a pit of our own making.
Add in that we have a government totally and unwilling to act in a timely and planned manner to mitigate the mess they have made, and, well… Boris Johnson Broke Britain. Don’t listen to him when at the next election he inevitably claims he and his team of campaigners who can’t govern are the people to fix the mess they led us into.
What a mess – of the UK’s own making; aren’t we clever.
You’re just not believing enough.
Is it wrong to feel smug when cycling past motorists queueing to get into petrol stations?
it was never about anti immigration…just controlled immigration – a concept the remain side never actually grasped and still haven’t. And the Eu is part of the problem
Bullshit.
Are we really still having this argument five years on? It was always about immigration, that was the primary driver for brexit. We already had controlled immigration, we simply chose not to exercise that control and then lied to the population about it. Our domestic policy was **** all to do with the EU.
I’m marvelling at the sight of the anti-brexit brigade wailing because
And you can bugger off an' all. You've spent those self same five years bleating on here protesting (against self-evident signs to the contrary) that you were anti-brexit yourself. Don't come the raw prawn now.
Sorry Drac, I'll try to become a believer - promise.
So the number of temporary visas has been capped at 5,000 with a (probable) time limit of 3 months.
I would be surprised if the take-up exceeds 1,000.
Dunno I’d expect them to be very lucrative if they’re going for EU drivers but course you could go further afield and take advantage of lower wage economies.
Weren’t they saying they were 100k drivers short.
You’ve spent those self same five years bleating on here protesting (against self-evident signs to the contrary) that you were anti-brexit yourself.
Still very much anti-brexit. Not as much as I’m anti low pay though.
Is it wrong to feel smug when cycling past motorists queueing to get into petrol stations?
Not at all. I do it all the time - going past queues of cars, seeing the hordes on the bypass as i cross it on a bike ride. sometimes I even wave at them
Still very much anti-brexit. Not as much as I’m anti low pay though.
Whilst there's an opportunity, or perhaps an urgent need, to reform an entire industry, it stands to reason that the knock on effect and potential inflation could actually make things worse for the lowest paid.
Who knows, maybe it'll drive some positive change for our economic infrastructure, but migrant workers were never the problem.
FWIW I popped into the local petrol station just after lunch to buy the newspaper, just me and one other car there. No shortages in Madrid 👍
If you want to eat soup, you shouldn't spit in the pot.
Take all the emotion out of it. What does Brexit do?
It makes us more difficult to deal with. That means cost, supply problems and reduced choice. This was all explained before the Brexit vote, but enough people chose to be duped.
The whole thing is going to unravel. It is just a question of how much people are willing to take. A gallic shrug is all I can muster.
I’m marvelling at the sight of the anti-brexit brigade wailing because the inability to pay uk and foreign workers a pittance is inconveniencing their lifestyle.
There's something much more marvellous.
It's the sight of the pro-brexit brigade wailing because the inability to pay uk and foreign workers a pittance is inconveniencing their lifestyle.
🙂
So the number of temporary visas has been capped at 5,000 with a (probable) time limit of 3 months.
I would be surprised if the take-up exceeds 1,000.Dunno I’d expect them to be very lucrative if they’re going for EU drivers but course you could go further afield and take advantage of lower wage economies.
Weren’t they saying they were 100k drivers short.
European Road Haulers Association (UETR) have said they doubt many european drivers will be interested; very short term 'opportunity', unwelcoming environment, 'facilities' which are a long way short of european standards, maybe a bit more money.
Go further afield - language barrier, lack of acceptable qualification, limited/no experience of driving in europe or UK, darker skinned drivers at risk of being on receiving end of racist abuse.
Yes, the shortfall was reported as 100k; why, then, offer an 'opportunity' to only 5k?
The proposed end date is 24th December; shagger johnson saves christmas - my arse.
This is a pathetic attempt to do the absolute minimum and present it as 'taking decisive action'.
Flim flam designed to appeal to the hard of thinking.
There is every sign that this excuse of a gov and johnson in particular are showing clear signs of falling apart; he's a fraud and an incompetent.
I can't wait for his end to come - in every respect.
He’s got away with murder for the last 2 years, but if the Range Rover Evoques in the Home Counties can’t be filled up soon, he’s going to be in trouble
Telling different lies to different people is easy nowadays - a bit of targeted Facebook work and the job's a good'un.
Making those incompatible lies into reality is still impossible, though.
And fatso is running out of time - the bullshit can't disguise the real world effects of his actions.
Basically, **** him.
johnson has *ed multiple women, he's *ed the tory party, he's *ed the country so he might as well go * himself.
The Times is reporting ESSAR Group is on the point of collapse they own a few fuel stations and some oil refineries, one where the fuel strike started all those years ago and caused a fuel crisis.
Strangely when i passed by essar Stanlow last week very few tankers leaving the place with branded and un branded fuel tankers, usually loads leave every few hours.
Well done to all the panic buyers. My daughter who is a community paediatric nurse has now got no fuel to do her job tomorrow. No diesel in any of the local stations.
Frustrating is not the word
Surely you need a ticket beyond ‘HGV driver’ to unload 36,000 litres of combustible fuel?
I’ve just tried to get fuel - tried 15 garages between Redhill and Gatwick, all closed with no fuel left. Madness. Gonna be interesting getting to a work meeting in Derby on Monday with 30 miles range left…
The gov will do anything and everything required to keep Stanlow open irrespective of Essar's problems with HMRC.
It would be difficult to overstate the importance of that refinery as a strategic national infrastructure asset.
I think this fuel shortage may turn out to be a good thing. I thought people and businesses would have changed after the first lockdown when we learned that office workers could work from home. This has quickly been forgotten and congestion/rush hours and pollution is back.
This fuel shortage may change behaviour again. There are so many solutions like zoom meetings, public transport, cycling to work. But car culture is so strong in this country.
In reality it will only be a short blip. Normal service will resume soon and the car will be king again by this time next week. What a shame.
I’ve just tried to get fuel – tried 15 garages between Redhill and Gatwick, all closed with no fuel left.
I'm in Newcastle, working on a bike race tomorrow. The fleet cars we get as officials vehicles are almost invariably supplied from whatever car dealership is sponsoring that particular race with fumes in the tank so I was genuinely worried that we wouldn't get fuel - or at least that it'd be a massive pain - but actually there's a garage right next to the hotel with no supply issues at all. No queue, straight in and it wasn't an extortionate price either.
I do wonder what the locals might think though when they see a bunch of police motos and team cars all filling their tanks there. It probably doesn't count as "essential requirement" in the grand scheme of things...
Surely you need a ticket beyond ‘HGV driver’ to unload 36,000 litres of combustible fuel?
You need your ADR ticket (stands for Accord Dangerous Routier). Takes a fair bit of training to get and is not cheap. Also needed for carrying chemicals and anything else dangerous, if a truck has the orange plaque the driver needs it, so there is competition for qualified drivers for other goods too.
I’ve just tried to get fuel – tried 15 garages between Redhill and Gatwick, all closed with no fuel left. Madness. Gonna be interesting getting to a work meeting in Derby on Monday with 30 miles range left…
If you meet anyone that you know panic-bought and didn't need to slap them in the face. My sister had to take my mum to hospital Friday for an appointment as mum's car had the fuel light on and both local stations were empty. My sister had a full tank in their small car (hadn't moved for a week as she was WFH) so she took her instead. Mum didn't find it very comfortable so was in quite a bit of pain and discomfort on the journey back. If I meet anyone who boasts about being ok with a full tank and no real reason for it I'll be very tempted to show them the error of their ways.
I think this fuel shortage may turn out to be a good thing. I thought people and businesses would have changed after the first lockdown when we learned that office workers could work from home. This has quickly been forgotten and congestion/rush hours and pollution is back.
This fuel shortage may change behaviour again. There are so many solutions like zoom meetings, public transport, cycling to work. But car culture is so strong in this country.
Contrary to popular belief not everyone works in an office or sits in front of bookcase in a zoom meeting for a living.
People don't sit in front of a bookcase for a living.
frankconway
Full MemberYes, the shortfall was reported as 100k; why, then, offer an ‘opportunity’ to only 5k?
The shortfall is 100K but we've been short of drivers for most of the decade; in 2014 it was 40000 IIRC. Like just about everything else, government and business has looked at the ever-growing shortage and since it'd never yet become a crisis, decided to let it keep getting worse.
(this also fuels a lot of the public response, "all of europe has a shortage"- true, but they're mostly in the same place that we were for years, of having a shortage but not a critical one. It's the difference between being putting the last bog roll on the hanger, and wiping your arse with your blue passport)
Don't know how many drivers we need right now to push the shortage back out of crisis levels so that it can be ignored again for a couple of years. Not 100000. But of course it's not just the number of drivers, it's the fact that post-brexit we need more.
The local foodbank has asked whether my cargobike project can go and help out with deliveries with our e-cargobikes as their volunteers are too worried about using up their fuel to drive.
I’d say that’s a win for the environment right there.
Also, the smugness levels of filtering past a petrol station queue on an e-cargobike are off the scale.
Just think.
If enough people panic buy, none of the teachers will have fuel (see mrs_oab, working at rural school 40 miles away this next week) won't get in and they will all be homeschooling again.
Librarians do, kinda
Just think.
If enough people panic buy, none of the teachers will have fuel (see mrs_oab, working at rural school 40 miles away this next week) won’t get in and they will all be homeschooling again.
Copy that to A B De P Johnson (man of the people). Not only has he caused the shortage, his erosion of public confidence in the apparatus of the state for his own benefit is also coming home to roost as people don't trust a word anyone in power says any more. You can't give the impression that a system of government is utterly rigged and corrupt when it suits you and then put that genie back in the bottle.
This is unravelling fast and it is going to get worse before anyone important has the balls to call it for what it is. They're still running scared of the racists.
Yeah to deliver fuel you need and ADR just to carry it, then job training to operate the tanker, induction and loading training for the refinery and a PDP (petroleum drivers passport) in order to actually deliver the load and get anywhere near a refinery.
ADR is £500+, PDP I’m not sure about as it was always provided by the companies I worked for.
Experience is priceless in the fuel delivery business, 6 pots on a big tanker. All with potentially different products, all products flammable and do not put the wrong product in the forecourt tank.. major issues if that happens. Then there’s driving the vehicle, 36,000 Litres of fuel moves around a fair bit when on the move even with separate pots and baffles fitted.
I saw a fella in a small hatchback earlier with the boot absolutely full of large metal jerrycans, filling them all at the petrol station at the end of our street. Perhaps he is an unprepped prepper?
Experience is priceless in the fuel delivery business
There was a HGV instructor interviewed this morning who said that the very idea that you’re just going to rush someone through a test then stick them in the cab of an expensive artic, potentially delivering dangerous loads is absolutely preposterous
No employer will touch them and they wouldn’t get insured anyway
There is no short term fix to this. And no fleets of EU drivers will be arriving to sort it out either
This is all Borises Brexit bullshit unravelling before the eyes of even the hardest of thinking
Can’t argue with that Binners.
Bought a new car today, can't drive it because of the Muppets that have drained every fuel station for miles around. 🥺
Oh well I guess I can sit in it tomorrow and make Brum Brum noises (and figure out what all the buttons do I suppose!)
Worse things happen at sea!
I’ve been trying to work out whether the governments statement not to panic buy fuel was just a clever ploy to distract us from the shambles of a UK/US post Brexit trade deal calamity that BJ has been involved in ....or whether it was just simple stupidity on their part..
Ooh look, squirrel,,,
It’s just utter incompetence. They have no clue how to sort this shit out.
This is all the result of them winning a vote they never believed, or wanted to win
If you want an explanation for the mess this country is now in, then it is perfectly summarised by the look on the faces of Johnson and Gove on the morning of the referendum result.
Tells you everything you need to know
A look that says “oh shit!” Because they were now going to be expected to deliver the total cloud-cuckooland bollocks they promised
It’s been a total cluster-**** from that day on. And it’s only going to get worse. These clowns didn’t have a plan five years ago and they have no more of one now. They’re making it up as they go along, on the hoof, and unfortunately they’re a bunch of morons who literally couldn’t organise a piss up in a brewery
Exactly what binners said above, the look on their faces when the vote was announced was akin to asking them eat a shit sandwich with a side order of more shit followed by a shit drink then a dunk in the shit tank.
They thought a “failed” Brexit vote would merely split the Tory party into a movement they could manipulate for their own personal needs, they didn’t expect to win and thus had no ****ing idea nor any semblance of a cohesive plan of restructuring the entire uk supply chain never mind a passing consideration to the bit of a mess of other issues, they’ve had 5 ****ing years to come up with a plan and yet here we are…………utterly ****ed by this crowd of grifters masquerading as a government.
I need more whisky…………….
Edit : dunno where “the bit of a mess” comes from?, it’s not in my typed out text?
As far as the disaster capitalists who wanted (in fact needed, the clue is in their name ffs) Brexit and the chaos that would inevitably follow it are concerned - this situation (and what happened/didn't happen on the US trip) both show that things are going exactly as they planned don't they?
The UK has a highly resilient supply chain, which is why it hasn't falllen over sooner.
I find it most concerning that the short term cashhose is used to put out fires without adressing systemic problems.
how did you become bankrupt? very slowly and then all at once.
dunno where “the bit of a mess” comes from?, it’s not in my typed out text?
@somafunk it's filterese for fustercluck
I've said before my daughter works at a posh people's supermarket and used to get abuse for asking people to wear masks / one person only when she had to do door duty.
Her friend works at Sainsbury, and because of the fuel situation yesterday had to do the queue at the petrol station, explaining why there was no petrol and diesel was now being rationed only to emergency services.
Absolute dogs abuse apparently. 'Move those ****ing cones or I'll ****ing run you over' being a highlight from a particularly irate middle aged woman.
She didn't vote for Brexit, she was too young. She's had nothing to do with wages policy in the transport industry. She didn't make the decision to close the fuel station or arrange the rationing policy. She was just explaining to people why it's more important that ambulances can move about than your SUV is brimmed for the school run next week. As if it needed explaining.
Well done Britain, I'm so proud of what you've become.
Well done Britain, I’m so proud of what you’ve become.
Grass is greener and all that as I expect living in any other country for a length of time you would soon see those countries are full of ****ers too, but my guess would be UK and US would be at the top of the ****er league. Horrible countries.
Well done
BritainEngland, I’m so proud of what you’ve become.
Absolute dogs abuse apparently. ‘Move those * cones or I’ll * run you over’ being a highlight from a particularly irate middle aged woman
As terrible as this is, it's not really anything new.
I used to do stewarding when I was younger. Worked mainly at football stadiums, but also Lords, The Oval, Farnborough air show, Wembley stadium etc.
As soon as you told people they weren't allowed to go a particular way or do a particular thing the abuse would start.
And quite amazing how horrible & rude 'normal' people can be too 'the little guy'.
The funniest was the outrage from the posh cricket fans when you told them they couldn't take that mountain of booze into the cricket ground.
It always followed the same pattern too:
- I've always been let in before with this much. No you haven't. The qty permitted is clearly written on your ticket.
- Go on mate, just let me in. Nope, I'll get sacked.
- I want to speak to your supervisor. Ok.
- Followed by fruity language and abuse once they realised they weren't gonna get their way....
I'm in Premier Inn and the chef is very late because hes had to cycle in.
I think we are back to the 1950's with rationed fuel and food, electric milkfloats, working locally / home with dad reading newspapers over breakfast because there's not enough 'lectric to charge the ipad. Kids will have oranges for Christmas.
Thats progress for you.
Just think.
If enough people panic buy, none of the teachers will have fuel (see mrs_oab, working at rural school 40 miles away this next week) won’t get in and they will all be homeschooling again.
Oh or the doctor or nurse that might save your life when you have COVID
But the strange thing is people are happy to panic buy fuel when there is a shortage, but there is no panic about the shortage of doctors/nurses/hospital beds!
And no overwhelming public support to get them a pay rise
I was lucky enough to find a petrol station that didn't have a 30 minute queue yesterday. In and out in 5 minutes.
They were, however, rationing petrol to £30 per transaction.
I hate being told what to do 😏
Well done
BritainEngland, I’m so proud of what you’ve become.
Not sure Scotland is exempt?
And I see the British Army is driving the Scottish ambulances this week.
Go SNP!
I'll get my coat....
But the strange thing is people are happy to panic buy fuel when there is a shortage, but there is no panic about the shortage of doctors/nurses/hospital beds!
Good point
There was a HGV instructor interviewed this morning who said that the very idea that you’re just going to rush someone through a test then stick them in the cab of an expensive artic, potentially delivering dangerous loads is absolutely preposterous
No employer will touch them and they wouldn’t get insured anyway
Normal times would mean any new passes are stuck on the agency circuit for 12 months gaining experience and waiting for the company insurers to agree to them being on the books. In that 12 months you get all the crap jobs and the worst truck in the fleet. Even now that I passed just over 3 months ago and have been driving via agency that whole time am I starting to even be considered for a lot of companies, purely down to the fact I have 8 years as a 7.5t driver on top. Any new pass will really struggle to get any decent work for the first few months, let alone anything like tanker work.
This cannot be fixed with short-term visas and fast-track testing. This winter is going to be tough.
Not sure Scotland is exempt?
We're not, plenty of idiots up here as well.
How long before we start seeing fuel for sale by the Jerry can on FB Marketplace?
I wonder how many EV's have been sold on the back of this?
I wonder how many EV’s have been sold on the back of this?
Great. A rise in electricity usage when some of our ability to import is down, coupled with a 'hiccup' over nuclear not being built and a Conservative energy policy focussed on things like fracking rather than energy efficiency or renewables.
working locally / home with dad reading newspapers over breakfast
sounds quite nice, actually.
Not sure the EV owners will be too happy either when their elec supplier goes bust (as has happened to me this week) and the only tariffs they can find are double the price.
It’s really strange, we own 6 Shell petrol stations across the Midlands. Currently our deliveries are being made as per existing schedules.
The largest/main petrol station (on a busy road outside Oxford) ran out of fuel by 4pm on Friday. Delivery was made at 1am on Friday night. I’ve not checked stock levels as away this weekend, but CCTV has shown massive queues waiting to get on to the forecourt yesterday morning. Most of the people I’ve spoken to in the industry are doing what they can to keep the price down. We’ve also added a £30 max limit, but that’s tough for people who have large distances to travel.
I was in one of the Milton Keynes petrol stations on Sunday when a customer was kicking off as we had ran out of diesel, he said he couldn’t get any diesel in Milton Keynes and had to get home to
Manchester. Not sure why he thought it was our fault…..
At the moment we can’t add additional deliveries, just have to make do with what is scheduled. Even our smallest station (small village outside Peterborough) is still getting its scheduled deliveries.
My brother in law is a HGV driver, works for Waitrose, had a nice pay rise a couple of weeks ago, now earning £45k. He’s more than happy with that. My dad was also a HGV driver, worked on tankers for ICI, for 20 years he earned between £10 and £12k a year, retiring from driving at 55 y/o to get an easier job working for the council and paying a bit more. Growing up his HGV job was very unstable with constant takeovers and redundancies. Seems to be at last seen as an important and skilled job.
Not sure the EV owners will be too happy either when their elec supplier goes bust (as has happened to me this week) and the only tariffs they can find are double the price.
I’d still be paying less than I was for fuel.
Petrol tanker drivers have an ADR qualification as well as a HGV licence. They need this for them to drive fuel tanker lorries.
There is a shortage of HGV drivers. That's a true fact.
However, HGV drivers can't drive a petrol tanker lorry without having an ADR qualification.
The UK had ADR drivers last week. Nothing changed much in a week. Maybe some holiday or some sickness but not, I doubt a dramatic change.
The ADR drivers that were driving last week are probably driving this week delivering fuel so nothing changed much.
The petrol panic we are now experiencing is all down to media hype.
It's not because of Brexit, because all the EU drivers went back to Europe which is some of the reasons being banded about.
These EU HGV drivers left months ago, and yet the country was still getting fuel without problems up until today.So what's changed? NOTHING !!
Apart from the disgraceful media hype and scaremongering to make news to sensationalise the fact that a couple of petrol stations were getting a late delivery so they closed temporarily.
The result of the media scaremongering!!
Massive panic and chaos by everyone which is now causing a shortage of fuel until the ADR drivers, that we already had delivering fuel a few days ago, can deliver again.
The media should be fined and penalised, severely for publicising false news and creating the crazy situation that has been going on all today. Disgusting. They should hold their heads in shame.(Copied and re-posted for general info.)
I’m not sure I entirely agree with this. If the general public were not idiots too it wouldn’t be so bad
Yeah I’ve seen that doing the rounds. Of course brexit is part of the problem, it’s took longer for the effect as we’ve had 18 months of people working mainly from home and not travelling far.
Plus the settled status thing only recently kicked in which has caused a number of migrant workers to have to leave their jobs in the UK.
If I run out of petrol, it's a damn good excuse to work from home again. I could walk or ride in but I'm not telling work that.
If I run out of petrol, it’s a damn good excuse to work from home again. I could walk or ride in but I’m not telling work that.
One of the only good things about living in such a car-centric society is that if you fancy a day off you can just tell your employer you don't have access to your car. It's basically the same thing as losing the use of your legs for most people 🙂
It’s basically the same thing as losing the use of your legs for most people
One December it had snowed so much, that i had to abandon the car a third of the way to work (30 mile commute - car sharing).
We jumped on a train to make it the rest of the way, then made the last 1/2 mile trek on foot through a couple of foot of snow.
We were the only ones in .
Some people lived less than a mile from the office, but because they couldnt get their cars out they sacked it off....
Any excuse for some people
I’d still be paying less than I was for fuel
And crucially we have access to the energy at home.
