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I am the Executor for a relatives estate. A PCN dropped through the door over the weekend. It's for a Lexus. Absolutely no chance that it has was owned by anyone at the house for over 17 years.
There is a chance that a nearby neighbour has registered their car incorrectly i.e. the right postcode, but the wrong house number. I will go for a wander to look for it when I go back (not for a few days).
In the meantime, what nefarious deeds might be going on and what do I need to do to protect myself/the estate?
1) Report to the DVLA
2) Report to the Police (seems overkill, but I don't know)
3) Call the people that issued the PCN (that's bound to be fun, I am sure they have heard the 'not at my address' a million timse)
If relevant, its Euro Car Parks and is for a car park at a local retail park that has a KFC and a MacDonalds. The car was there for about 20 mins late at night so I can't even see why they have issued a PCN in the first place.
Totally ignoring it is not an option, I don't want any complications in what should be relatively straightforward Probate proceedings.
My gut feel is Step 1 or and then step 3, but I would be interested to hear others views.
4) Ignore it - Presumably it's not addressed to you?
I would just write 'not at this address' on it and send it back to them.
Maybe a letter to DVLA just in case but shouldn't be necessary.
If you start getting inundated with the things and speeding fines and whatever then option two.
It's not a proper Penalty Charge Notice if it's from some Parking Eye style scalpers. Ignore. If it's not addressed to your relative, technically you shouldn't really have opened it anyway.
If it's not in your relative's name, for a vehicle he doesn't own, then they can't get a CCJ anyway. So probate will be fine. Don't engage with them.
Yeah if it doesn't have your or your relatives name on ignore it. I engaged with a similar company after receiving a PCN for a car I had sold. I simply informed them that I no longer owned the car and they had the wrong details. They got very aggressive and threatening and I ended up having to track down the new owner and provide the details which was a nightmare
I've learned my lesson and keep details for buyers of my vehicles now but the way they dealt with it was appalling and I'd avoid getting engaged with them if possible, just contacting them is like showing weakness it seems from other stories I've heard
https://www.west-midlands.police.uk/your-options/cloned-vehicles#
Send back with explanation to the Parking co; I'd send recorded so you can prove they got it just in case.
Then report to DVLA and your local police as above.
Maybe in the opposite order so you can quote any reference number , include a screen print or whatever.
It's not a cloned vehicle though.
It's safe to ignore the PCN I think. You can return it as 'Not at this address' if you don't want another 10 letters with increasingly aggressive language but ultimately I don't see how they can do anything more than that.
I don't know where the PCN people get the data from but I presume it's from the DVLA somehow. I'd probably write to the DVLA explaining that you've been sent this in error and they may wish to amend their records accordingly.
P.S. Why is it OK that the DVLA gives this information away to third parties?
Completely ignore it. If it isn't addressed to you or your relative then you shouldn't really have opened the letter anyway, and having found that it it is not related to a vehicle owned by your relative then it's nothing to do with you. Also. If it is an actual PCN then report Euro Car Parks because they are not allowed to issue them.
It’s not a proper Penalty Charge Notice if it’s from some Parking Eye style scalpers. Ignore.
Rubbish advice and wrong. It is a legally enforceable contractual breach. Unfortunately for you some scum bag has registered their car incorectly. Get an appeal into Euro Car Parks asap. Believe it or not its not worth the private parking companies pursuing dubious PCNs, it costs with less chance of getting any money back.
Also inform the DVLA as this could be the least of your problems.
Unfortunately for you some scum bag has registered their car incorectly.
Not sure what it is you think the charging company can do though? They can't do anything against the OP or their deceased relative.
Who is the addressee? Should have a name on it? Not the occupier?
Sorry, was stuck on a long conference call.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing, I know I should not have opened it, but I am picking up large piles of mail some of which is critical, but I don't know until I have opened it so there tends to be a mass letter opening followed by a quick bin it or deal with it process on each visit.
For clarity, it is addressed correctly, but the name is not that of my relative. The number plate in the photos is very clear and very different from any cars associated with that address. The postcode checker shows ~15 houses sharing the same postcode, all in the same road so there is the chance of a simple mistake.
Just return it. Addressee not at this address.
Just return it. Addressee not at this address.
This - if the name on the PCN isn't anything to do with you, you can't possibly be liable.
Return it. If they send more with the "wrong" name return them. But not beat option as you shouldn't ignore it
Having opened it I suppose you could inform police and DVLA then parking co. Inform them of the "mistake" and you expect to hear no more. If you do and they are more forceful then a reply that the intimidation will be reported to the police.
Not sure what it is you think the charging company can do though?
They can cancel the PCN quickly and easily. Use their appeals process, don't just return it to sender. Absolutely they can't ultimately make you pay it but appealing it and getting it cancelled will probably be a lot simpler. It will get resolved eventually whether it's now or when the bailiffs turn up is up to you.
If you follow the MSE forums on these 'tickets' happens quite regularly. Ticket gets sent out, never arrives, escalates all the way up to actual addressee getting a CCJ which they find out about when they apply for credit / mortgage etc.
No risk to you. Just send it back saying not known at this address. Expect more correspondence but send it back unopened. Don't call them. Most of these companies are not much more than licensed 'clampers' and you won't get any sense trying to call / speak to them.
All the above assumes that the car *is* registered to your relative's address. Given that this sounds like the first you've heard of the car and you weren't sent the V5 or any tax reminders, I'd not be surprised if the DVLA or the Parking Cowboys had dropped the ball.
If relevant, its Euro Car Parks and is for a car park at a local retail park
Just reply saying post-Brexit they no longer have jurisdiction :p
Rubbish advice and wrong. It is a legally enforceable contractual breach.
Against the person named in the letter. Who isn't the OP's relative. Apart from that they've got a cast-iron case.
A quick google finds the following official advice:
https://www.gov.uk/driving-fines-letters-you-dont-own-the-vehicle
The key thing is "Return the fine letter to the organisation that sent it to you and tell them you do not own the vehicle. Keep a copy of anything you send."
It does mention writing to DVLA to confirm you or the addressee are not the registered keeper as well.
Thanks Superlightstu, I had just found that link while eating my lunch
Still reckon your best route to use their formal appeals process rather than just writing to them.
https://appeals.eurocarparks.com/Appeals/Default.aspx
Can't claim they didn't get it if you use their online portal, they will get a lot of incoherent letters.
Rubbish advice and wrong. It is a legally enforceable contractual breach.
Against the person named in the letter. Who isn’t the OP’s relative.
I was referring to the bit I quoted, not the extra part about it not being the OPs vehicle. Until Euro car parks have been made aware of that they will pursue it. Loads of people still think they can get away with ignoring the charges. Whether people like it or not the legal precedent for parking on private land was set in Beavis vs. Parkingeye as were what is considered to be a reasonable charge for non-compliance. By staying on private land you are deemed to have entered a contract with penalty clauses. You will get a consideration period (usually 10 minutes) for you to read the signs and decide whether you want to comply or not, you can't be charged in that period.
There's a group on Facebook called Fight Your Private Parking Invoice, join that and you'll get expert advice, there's even a bloke who will appeal on your behalf if you need to go down that route.
If the letter was for a complete unknown person, then under what legal basis can you start an appeal?
Seriously, send it back, and inform DVLA or whatever they call themselves now. Either the parking scammers have made a clerical mistake and it's their problem, or some random person has illegally registered their car. Get them both in the doo doo.
Fight Your Private Parking Invoice, join that and you’ll get
expert adviceunadulterated internet twaddle
FTFY
what legal basis can you start an appeal?
It's not a legal process, its just the way you initially make contact with the parking company to tell them there is a mistake.
Send it back as not at this address if you want but it's likely to get lost in the mail and take longer to sort out.
I am struggling to see the problem here, car never registered in your name, PCN not sent to your name, just ignore.
Its probably an offset error anyway - I've had other peoples amazon parcels addressed to my house. I called amazon and apparently sometimes the databases jump/offset so the name gets associated with the wrong address and then a whole load of people get the wrong stuff/letter/etc.
OP - ignore there is seriously no danger to you in any way.
Deviation of a theme, we moved into our house ~3 years ago, and about 18m ago we started receiving letters for a name not associated with us or the previous owner (who lived here for 40 years)
I returned the first couple with "not known" scrawled on the envelope, on the 3rd letter I opened it (I know I shouldn't) and found it was a debt recovery company.
We told them they do not live here, (At least in the last year and a half) and that wasn't the name of the person we purchased the house from.
They were very sincere and pleasant, thanked us for our time and patience and to ignore any further letters as there is sometimes a delay in the systems being updated and automatic letter sending.
I would call them, tell them they do not and (AFAYK) have never lived at that address.
Send it back as not at this address if you want but it’s likely to get lost in the mail and take longer to sort out.
So what?
It's not the OP's car, not the OP's name. Who cares? There's nothing to 'sort out,' send it back and fuhgeddaboudit.
I had something similar many moons ago when I lived in rented accomodation - any letter in someone else's name got "not known at this address, return to sender" scrawled on it and lobbed back in the post.
Eventually a very polite man from a debt collection agency turned up and asked me if I was "so and so", I said "nope" he asked if I had any ID to prove it, so I showed him my driving licence, he thanked me for my time and went on his way.
The letters stopped and I never had another debt collector on my doorstep.
Quick update in case anyone cares or finds them selves in a similar position;
- We wrote to the DVLA, but have not heard back
- We wrote to the Parking company, explained the situation and included a reference to the DVLA contact.
- We found the car! - It lives about 6 doors away, but is rarely there so we got very lucky!
- The parking company wrote back to tell us our appeal was cancelled as the real owner had paid - I have no idea how they found them, we certainly did not tell them where it was.
Hopefully that is the end of it.
So appealing direct yielded the best result, glad its sorted and not an open issue for you. Sounds like a genuine mistake when registering the car, correct post code, wrong house number?