[Closed] Opinions on suitable punishments/lessons for wannabe thieving scrote

One thing the police were very keen on when I was burgled a few years back was to stress how it made me feel. Stress, upset, not feeling safe in my home, that sort of thing. Maybe that would help, get them to realise it affects people far more deeply than simply property loss / insurance.

If this is the first time then rehabilitate him but if he has done more than once then sterilise him so none of his gene is passed on. If he continues even after that then bury him alive in a box in the wood with straw tube for feeding and breathing ... after that think of Henry VIII punishment.

Sentence him to have to attend the Conservative party conference.

Fixed wheel in a workstand, get it wound up to speed then shove the little scrotes fingers into the chain dragging it into the sprocket, repeat till chain snaps or he has no digits left. If you get reoffending with prison sentences, can't see how they expect these to work, they know if they turn up, utter the right words they get away with it. Probably no help, but I just think it's another pile of social worker bullshit.

TBH mate, any party conference would do you in,

Challenge him to build a full length chain from 1 1/8 half link pieces.

Give him a day, lock the room, leave him a chain tool and a vice.

See what happens.

Or ask what his reasons for theft were and construct a hypothetical scenario designed to incite empathy and regret?

Ive tried to reply to this several times and deleted my post before sending each attempt for risk of sounding like a Daily Mail editorial

He chose a life of crime, how bothered is he that people get a bit upset when their home is violated by a scumbag and does he really give a toss how much anybody's bike is worth to them if he can get £30 for it down the old Dog and Duck? More to the point wheres the deterrent if having your collar felt leads to a touchy feely meeting with your youth justice worker instead of a good stretch in Sing Sing?

Sorry

EDIT - I agree with all the posts made above whilst I was busy repeatedly composing and deleting my own

so he can see what bikes mean to people and how much more rewarding they are than kicking about the streets being a nuisance

Do you know the motive for the attempted theft ? Occasionally skint youngsters will steal a bike for their own personal use rather than just to sell it. In which case pointing out how rewarding owning a bike can be might not be the best strategy.

Put a lenght of hosepipe up his bum.
put a piece of rusty barbed wire up the hosepipe
remove hosepipe.

Like chewkw says, if it is his first time whether that be first time caught or first time being a thieving ned then get him to do some trailbuilding followed by an afternoons riding/skills coaching to perhaps show him a way out of his current lifestyle, if he has loads of previous then break a finger for every conviction, if he's been a really bad boy he'll need help to wipe his own arse and feed himself for a few weeks which should teach him to never steal another persons property, if, after all that he gets caught again then start with a broken wrist and continue as before , if he still chooses to live as a parasite then fingers/arms/ perhaps kneecaps, continue till he's in a total body cast.

Now i'll try not to sound like a Guardian editorial [b]iamsporticus[/b] 🙂

There's a lot of people with a record whose criminality is a distant, disparate memory. A "life of crime" is not living as a criminal.

Lovely little scrote will have some support and will then be returned. Repeat?

Front of a human centipede for 1st offence,then move down the chain for futher offences.

There's a lot of people with a record whose criminality is a distant, disparate memory.

Yep, a lot of boys in their early teens have a lack of respect for other people's property, thieving is very common among boys at that age, most will grow out of it, although some might not.

Strip the branches off any trees along the side of biking trails and use the remaining trunks to impale thieves on...oh, how we'd laugh as we ride past them. Their stench would help improve our Stava times too! 😈

EDIT: I nearly got charged with some firearms offences when I was 15/16...it was the my local Youth Justice Team that stopped it going to court, they argued that I'd struggle to find a job if I'd been charged. I think my dad owning a local business may have helped my case, but I still take my hat off to them.

Really really depends
Having done Restorative justice with yoofs you get all sorts from the kids who done wrong once, the ones whose parents dont GAS and shout at you [ Ie I blame the parents], Kids who dont really GAS and are doing the bare minimum to avoid a stiffer sentence to kids going through tough times and making some shit decisions.

Personally I would try and find out which category they fit into and take some advice and guidance from the worker and act accordingly.

I saw victims do everything from bizarre Christian acts of forgiveness to being have to be removed for threatening them.
Overall if I knew which worked best I could have a massive impact on recidivism [ what a word that you can rarely use] levels in kids.

Dont expect an epiphany from them , that make take years to happen.

Ultimately its your call on whether you want to offer some attempt at redemption or just get cross at them.

Despite my bleeding heart credentials and desire to reform and rehabilitate its fair to say the majority were ****s and what the victim said had little impact.

There are some nicely appropriate punishments up there, ^, I'm particularly impressed with the hose/barbed wire one; very inventive! 😆

It's not his first offence. He actually told the police he had seen myself and my sons leave so knew there was no one else in the building and said that him and his mate had intention to get my bikes. Not clever as they could have only got him for criminal damage to the door but now he has been charged with attempted burglary.

Initially he wouldn't cooperate with the youth justice team so his slim chance of a second caution was lost entirely. But I can't see what is going to be that effective they say his background is pretty harsh. I don't say that as an excuse for his behaviour but if someone has come from a bad situation wait no positive parental guidance is there any chance of any 'punishment' actually making a difference

I guess as junkyard has already said there is very little hope of that

cuddles

There are some nicely appropriate punishments up there, ^, I'm particularly impressed with the hose/barbed wire one; very inventive!

Keyboard warrior.

As above, I suspect that any involvement from the would be thief will be carried out purely as a way of being seen to co-operate with the justice system and minimise punishment.

My teenage son will accept a punishment but I tend not to expect him to show a huge amount of remorse during the process so I think the OP's going to be spending some time with a sullen teen who won't make eye contact and communicates in monosyllables.

As for punishment - I'd go for anything that involves being outdoors, preferably where there's no wi-fi, 3g or phone signal. Electronic isolation is probably the thing that will 'hurt' the most.

yunki - Member

cuddles

With Garry Glitter. 😈

it's gonna be subjective..

My 4yo son is motivated almost entirely by a need to gain our approval, he absolutely revels in it..
My 18 month son could not give a flying monkey and is driven purely by fun, seeing discipline as a challenge to be thwarted..

I'm guessing that your average crim is likely to fall more into the second category, but it's going to depend a lot on what [i]his[/i] motivations for committing the crime were..

He doesn't exactly sound like a budding career criminal to have dropped himself in it like that though, so maybe he's a noob, only playing at it, or he's got an honest streak.. He might just be scared

We knew even at 12yo to keep schtum round my way, I guess the other alternative could be that he's not very bright.. Maybe he was desperate?

I guess the third option is that he's a ****.. Start by asking him if he's a ****

This is fascinating.

A forum full of (mostly) lefty bearded tofu-eating sandal-wearing Guardian-reading hippies is advocating policies the dodgiest Sharia state would be proud to call its own.

Why not find out why the lad tried to nick your bike? Rehabilitation schemes? Does he have mental health issues? Are his options limited by his family / peer group (ie, laughed out the house if he gets a job / further education)?

Are there any youth groups nearby that aren't airy-fairy primary school style ones, but perhaps run by ex-criminals who'll know how to deal with him?

Granted, I'd be royally pissed off if my bike was nicked and in all honesty, yeah, I'd probably lob the first stone, but society makes the criminal - especially so thanks to funding cuts to above schemes - and I'd expect the rest of you to be a bit more objective. We stopped deporting people for stealing a loaf of bread quite a long time ago.

A forum full of (mostly) lefty bearded tofu-eating sandal-wearing Guardian-reading hippies

It's threads like this that prove that oft written (or similar) canard to be so untrue. Or maybe the bleeding heart leftie liberals haven't got up yet while all the hard working backbone-of-the-nation eye-for-an-eye crowd are already sat at their computers. 🙂

It's threads like this that prove that oft written (or similar) canard to be so untrue. Or maybe the bleeding heart leftie liberals haven't got up yet while all the hard working backbone-of-the-nation eye-for-an-eye crowd are already sat at their computers.

Damn straight. Actually, I'm changing working patterns from earlies to lates, and today is officially a rest day.

Take him out on a bike ride.

[i][s]A[/s] [b]Some members of a[/b] forum full of (mostly) lefty bearded tofu-eating sandal-wearing Guardian-reading hippies is advocating policies the dodgiest Sharia state would be proud to call its own.[/i]

ftfy

Its an interesting one this. The only way you're going to get through to the scrotes is if they respect you.

A guy who I know who was a bit of a lad, to say the least, when he was younger. He sorted himself out (after a couple of stretches inside) and went into (unpaid) youth mentoring. He's a top bloke, who's experiences are grounded in real-life experience. He managed to turn a lot of these young potential career criminals around, as they looked up to him. So when he told them about the reality of prison, drug addiction etc it sunk in.

I won't repeat what he has to say about these schemes and the type of people who run them. The upshot of it is that these kids are alienated, and have been dragged up in some god forsaken hell hole. So guess what? Being patronised and/or lectured by those who they see as the comfortable middle classes (bleeding heart or otherwise) has precisely **** all preventative effect! In fact, a lot of the time it achieves the exact opposite.

It's threads like this that prove that oft written (or similar) canard to be so untrue. Or maybe the bleeding heart leftie liberals haven't got up yet while all the hard working backbone-of-the-nation eye-for-an-eye crowd are already sat at their computers.

Or maybe people can be left-wing on some issues and right-wing on others?

Stick and carrot is more effective than either alone IMO. Support for offenders where possible but serious consequences too.

Anyway, excuse me while I go and continue to power our nation's economic recovery by doing some work.

[url=

hours of nyancat[/url] ought to sort him out

Or maybe people can be left-wing on some issues and right-wing on others?

I don't disagree. I'm just saying that the liberal/sharia-law-supporting (wrt crime) balance is about the same here as anywhere else in life. It is a worry though that people are prepared to run a hosepipe up someone's arse and feed rusty barbed wire through it, followed by someone else creepily suggesting that it's an ingenious solution, for a property crime. I dunno, maybe they don't really [i]mean[/i] it though, or maybe they're happy to suggest, but not implement, in which case I guess they're keyboard warriors.

EDIT: Excuse me while I flagellate myself for using the phrase "just saying" 😡

Make him wear a sandwich board stating he is a sticky fingered thief. Ensure he walks round the town so every one knows who he is and his face. Much better than a small announcement in the paper where he one feel the humiliation.

The trail building idea is quite a good one. It shows something positive linked with bikes, and he might enjoy it. If he learns that bikers are good pepole he might repsect bikes a bit more.

All this nasty punishment stuff is just garbage, and is written by people who have no idea why people do the shit they do.

Make him wear a sandwich board stating he is a sticky fingered thief. Ensure he walks round the town so every one knows who he is and his face. Much better than a small announcement in the paper where he one feel the humiliation.

Surefire way of making a model citizen for the future there. Can we implement this nationwide?

<pinkoLeftyLiberal>

Build a bike together. Find a bunch of cheapy second-hand bits - I'm sure for a good cause Singletrackers would come to the party. I will.

Teach him the feeling of putting something tangible together for himself.

EDIT: He gets to keep the bike, of course...

</pinkoLeftyLiberal>

[i]EDIT: He gets to keep the bike, of course...
[/i]
Then have someone else steal his new, hand-built, much loved bike. Karma.

My only experience of restorative justice was when I got assaulted by a car driver after an exchange of words.

He got out of his 1 tonne steel box threatening to kill me before assaulting me because he felt threatened by the wheezing, overweight, middle aged fool on the mountain bike who had shouted back at him, apparently.

OK, officer, you give him a gentle talking to 'cos if you can't see that his story is a crock of shite and you can't be bothered to speak to any of the witnesses, I can't be bothered to waste my time pursuing it either.....

they say his background is pretty harsh

^this - morally its not his fault, but he is paying the price for being born of human scum.

Turn the other cheek, give him a hand up or leave him to see if he can get his own life in order.

I just hope he finds his way in life before he does something too bad that taints his life forever. I did, and I was lucky, very lucky.

Youth Workers - chapeau.

I think that the new value of the stolen goods should be assessed and converted into a community service order based upon the minimum wage rate.

The offender would then know how much honest graft is required to legitimately obtain the goods he took.

Any failure to appear for the work should result in a short custodial sentence and the remaining hours being increased.

I like the approach of doing Molgrips suggestion or if not then you do scotchegg's idea.

Any failure to appear for the work should result in a short custodial sentence and the remaining hours being increased.

Have you ever met any of these people? They don't give a flying one about a short custodial sentence. Its all part of the game, and offers no deterrent whatsoever. It becomes a revolving door. They get sent down for 6 weeks, they're out in 3, then literally the minute they're out, they're back nicking everything not nailed down again. Until they're collared again. Then the exercise is repeated. Again and again and again.....

I don't know what the answer is, but we need to start doing something differently, because all the Daily Mail, send-them-all-down frothing in the world is making eff all difference

are there any local bike building / fixing type voluntary work schemes he can do? Might install a work ethic and some pride / self esteem / self worth in him.

Take him out on a bike ride.

Great idea. It's a long shot, but it might just help him understand that nicking a bike isn't like nicking a television. And he may even have fun in the process and discover a new way to occupy his time rather than causing trouble.

Trail building was the OP's idea.

As for outing him as a thief, he'd probably be proud of that.

[i]he may even have fun in the process and discover a new way to occupy his time rather than causing trouble.[/i]

And then nick a bike to use for himself. Cos that's ok.

"I thought I could see the top of her left nipple eariler. I had to stand on a chair to be sure, but there it was. Absolutely shameful behaviour."

You looking it at wrong. It's not theft, it's urban scrumping. 😀

as someone who grew up with some very naughty young scallywags; the bleeding heart build a bike together and the joy of cycles and self worth will overcome years of negative behavior is total knackers IME and shows how unconnected to the real world some of you are. It's not your fault, it's just the circumstances you were raised in that have made you fluffy bunnies of peace and love.

[url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-24022774 ]BBC linky maybe worth reading[/url]

You could take him on a lovely bike ride or build him a lovely bike, it won't matter two shits if his parents are utter ****s.

Maybe take the parents on a bike ride off Snowdon.

oldbloke - Member
BBC linky maybe worth reading

Predictable really - shout at them, make them cry, sympathise with them, help them, advise them. Does it make a difference? Who knows?
Maybe it's more for the victim's benefit than the scrote's?

I was about to link the beeb story above. It seemed to work with that particular mugger: on impulse, decent parents, some hope of him straightening up.

Within that story, an anecdote tells of one victim who benefitted.

A forum full of (mostly) lefty bearded tofu-eating sandal-wearing Guardian-reading hippies

I think you were right first time:
A few weeks trailbuilding.

Might make him think, might be a lifechanger, he gets punished and
we all get a rebuilt trail.

All this nasty punishment stuff is just garbage, and is written by people who have no idea why people do the shit they do.

I don't want to know why, I just want the only people who are locked in at night to be the criminals not people like me who get up and go to work each day, and spend ages locking and unlocking there posessions they have worked hard to obtain, paying ever more insurance for when the inevitable happens.

Tough on crime, tough on the causes of crime, has got to be the biggest lie ever told by a politician. We have seen the social worker/liberal state allow ever more feral families to terrorise whole towns with their offspring causing untold havoc/crime sprees. It's not working, why can't we try three custodial sentences then it's time to be removed from the human race, that way we might get on top of reoffending. The carrot doesn't appear to be working so perhaps the stick or sticks formed into gallows might work.

Get him to teach you how to wheelie/manual.

Scrotes can do this from birth.

@ benji
I'm sorry but it's just evolution.. David Attenborough may have stated recently that human evolution has stopped but it clearly hasn't.. The human species is just branching as it has many times before throughout history..
These feral families that you describe are just adapting and exploiting the environment, trapping hardworking, law abiding folk into a life of servitude..

It will be interesting to hear the youth worker's suggestions tonight after reading these!

Unfortunately as i was relegated from a nice bit of Sheffield to live one of the worst, I suspect said scotes family are the lowest of the low.

The brief leaflet referred to written apologies, doing something for the neighbourhood. I seriously can't see either of those working.

There is a charity place nearby that renovates bicycles, but i am not sure he would get a real wake up call there (may just have articles from the Guardian read out in a stern but caring voice).

Ha ha - i don't consider myself a fluffy bunny of peace and love - or a believer in sharia law . . . . but it would be nice to come up with something fitting,

Does anyone on here have anything to do with the trails at parksprings in shef? is it feasible to rope him in to help - or maybe reinforce a jump with him - makes a change from patio footings if nothing else!

dd, lighten up, for heaven's sake, you'll give yourself an ulcer.

Oh, you were only joking? Just a keyboard warrior then. Moving on...

[img] [/img]

It's not working, why can't we try three custodial sentences then it's time to be removed from the human race, that way we might get on top of reoffending.

Well that's all well and good. At present we have a revolving door prison policy (as I described in my earlier post) .But it'd mean that we have to have a massive programme of prison building, that would cost countless billions (and would all be PFI's so would just hand over all those billions to G4S). Then have you seen what it costs, per annum, to keep someone in prison?

The last figures I can find are from 2008. Building prisons is said to cost £119,000 for each place created. It then costs £40,000 per person, per year

I think we're going to have to start being a bit more imaginative than that at reducing crime. Not that thats likely to happen

😆 @Yunki you may have point, it feels like it somes days, oh well end of lunch, back to the grind and misery 🙂

Three strikes and you're out has worked wonders in America.

Oh, ask if you can piss in his shoes.

As well as the trailbuilding.

adjustablewench - Member
Unfortunately as i was relegated from a nice bit of Sheffield to live one of the worst, I suspect said scotes family are the lowest of the low.

You've not moved to Whirlow?!!?!?! 😯

No, not whirlow - don't you have to be at the virtually comatose end stages of retirement to live in Whirlow?

take a good long look

then explain that you only agreed to the charade so you could get a good look at them.

leave it at that.

that probably wouldn't be as effective for me personally - maybe if i had a big scary looking man at home who could stare at him menacingly for a bit - but I think that may make me feel slightly more vulnerable as a single mum.

Get him to teach you how to wheelie/manual.

Scrotes can do this from birth.

steal his bike and see how he likes it 😈

I think from witness accounts he's a fairly chunky lad - i suspect he doesn't ride around these parts - or anywhere else for that matter.

Killing all criminals would be quite cheap if money is the issue.

Well that's all well and good. At present we have a revolving door prison policy (as I described in my earlier post) .But it'd mean that we have to have a massive programme of prison building, that would cost countless billions (and would all be PFI's so would just hand over all those billions to G4S). Then have you seen what it costs, per annum, to keep someone in prison?

The last figures I can find are from 2008. Building prisons is said to cost £119,000 for each place created. It then costs £40,000 per person, per year

I think we're going to have to start being a bit more imaginative than that at reducing crime. Not that thats likely to happen

No massive amount of prison building required, just a crematorium, third custodial, no nice cell, just a cheap injection followed by a cremation finish end of story.

And there goes a display of said imaginative thinking. Really creative that chaps! Well done you! Somewhere there's a think tank crying out for that type of creativity

Actually, depressingly... There's probably a few

deadlydarcy - Member

Three strikes and you're out has worked wonders in America.

Posted 4 hours ago #Report-Post

except it hasn't has it...."[i]America has around 5% of the world’s population, and 25% of its prisoners. Roughly one in every 107 American adults is behind bars, a rate nearly five times that of Britain, seven times that of France and 24 times that of India.
Its prison population has more than tripled since 1980.

Probably the biggest driver of this growth has been ever-harsher drug penalties.[/i]

[url= http://www.economist.com/blogs/economist-explains/2013/08/economist-explains-8 ]Economist Article[/url]

Get a friend to phone you midway through your meeting, and pretend to be a crime overlord severely reprimanding a member of your staff who has called you to advise that they've not fulfilled the task you'd set them. Use a lot of curse words during this conversation. Get really animated, maybe get out of your seat and pace the room. Threaten to cut their Jacobs off. Perhaps adopt a Cockney accent, but only for the duration of phone call.

At the end of your meeting with the youth, simply conclude by looking him in the eye and saying, "I'll find you."

Ha ha - like that, all though my chances of pulling off a cockney accent are slim..

Met the guy tonight who talked me through what may happen - I might get a chance to meet him and I might get a chance to send him somewhere to do a few hours work. But it all seemed very vague to be honest.

What ever you do he wont give two sh*ts, put his name in the paper and he will be a celeb among his brain dead moron mates, could tag him but again it will be seen a trophy,only real way is getting through to the so called parents, but if there not arsed then your just pis*ing in the wind I'm afraid

You could always try to go beyond many of the wet fart internet hard men on here and go with an open mind.

A few years ago I was asked to play a part in a reparation process for a local schoolkid that had gone a bit bad and done something stupid. Rather than the 'eye for an eye' Old Testament cobblers I decided to see what might be involved, what my part might be and understand some of the background of the kid involved. It was an interesting and informtive process that gave something back to the injured party (whom I represented) and gave the kid something to think about. From what I heard down the line, it did him some good.