You don't need to be an 'investor' to invest in Singletrack: 6 days left: 95% of target - Find out more
just checking to increase the thread
More like a Senior Hitter
lets see what colour this is...?
Hey, Perchy, he means us! Does that make us Big Hitters?
Probably not, but does that mean they are trying to you both? Is adding colour to the forum going to do that? If so, I'm going with ominous rather than interesting for now...
correct...
First they took those with a green badge but I did nothing. Then…
I was all up for the little P to see who was contributing but this is getting slightly sinister
Oops
Have we done the data sharing notification every time the main part of the forum is visited then? Excellent. Good to see the new hamsters are getting stretched.
Hmm, this reminds me I need to update the expired card for my sub details.
couloursz
It’s a shaming thing.
It’s a shaming thing.
I was just thinking that what this forum needs is more division.
Can see those developers on their Zoom meeting, pics of Tomac on the wall behind them. So what do we need to make the forum better? What about that really useful thing where you could hover the mouse and see who the last poster was? or that other useful thing where you could reliably click to the last post?
Nah, sod that COLOURED BLOBS! is whats needed!
There’s some people hear with lifetime Grey I’ve never heard of. Did you have to buy that, there was a promo a few years ago IIRC?
https://singletrackmag.com/shop/singletrack-mtb-magazine-lifetime-print-digital-subscription/
So are we all green now?
So are we all free now?
Please not grey...
[edit] Yay!
Has to be done
Red - that's OK, matches my eyes.
So what colour am I?
Red.
So what's that mean?
You lose your money. Hopefully black will come up next spin.
Posted elsewhere so know that I'm red, but just can't resist the temptation to join in.
What!!!
So does this mean that if your a different colour your opinion is more valid in the larger threads ? 😉
while the forum geeks are looking in is there any way the site could scroll a couple of lines less than a full page when you hit the space bar rather than 'just' a bit more than a page please? ta.
red. woo, and indeed, hoo.
That's your browser not the site, Shirley?
So does this mean that if your a different colour your opinion is more valid in the larger threads
a) Only if you're Binners
b) Edukator thinks so, yes 😉
c) TJ says he's right.
*hoping for green*
I've only looked at pages 1 and 7, did anyone explain what the colours mean?
What colour am I?
<edit>Turquoise? What's that for?</edit>
That’s your browser not the site, Shirley?
It'll be scrolling a full page... but part of that is obscured by the sticky header. It's a developer thing, not his browser. Don't know the fix... as I'd hide the sticky header when scrolling a full page.
That's as may be but it has to be related to the browser at least in part as it's absolutely fine on mine.
Regardless, randomly mentioning something in the middle of page seven on a thread full of random bollocks is not an effective method of submitting a bug. There's a form on the help page expressly for that, go use it.
I think everyone should just agree and move on, what do you reckon?
[ makes note not to try and help ]
scroll a couple of lines less than a full page when you hit the space bar
Ha! Didn't know you could scroll with the spacebar! But FWIW my browser (Firefox, Windows 10) does scroll a bit less than a full page.
...randomly mentioning something in the middle of page seven on a thread full of random bollocks...
I thought that was the generic STW modus operandum...
does scroll a bit less than a full page
Yeah, it should normally result in the last line at the bottom of the page becoming the first line at the top of the page. All explained in that link I posted.
[ makes note not to try and help ]
Being helpful is always helpful. Posting (anywhere) in the forum about bugs or feature requests is not. Tech do not read the forum so it'll either go unnoticed or generate extra work for us.
it should normally result in the last line at the bottom of the page becoming the first line at the top of the page.
I've just realised, on mine at least it's a coincidence. On STW it pages up and down almost perfectly (to within a few pixels of overlap). On other pages your "last / first line" scrolling overlap is about an inch which is the same depth as the STW header. This is on W10 Chrome.
Tested it on Firefox and it actually seems to dynamically alter scroll distance according to viewport size. It does the first line / last line thing regardless of static headers.
Other browsers may vary. Is this Safari being special again perchance?
Oooh 7 pages of 'lets see what colour logo we have' - top thread 🙂
Just checking my forum profile colour 😃
It's green 😅
I’ve just realised, on mine at least it’s a coincidence.
Yes. If you happen to have the right combination of font size, window size, view scale etc, then the bit that disappears under the sticky header will be the same size as the bit that's supposed to sitting at the top of the page that was at the bottom of the page when you hit the space bar.
Other browsers may vary. Is this Safari being special again perchance?
Doubt it. Chrome looks the same to me. Pass it on or ignore it... let's leave this thread to the important posts about guessing the colour codes...
https://wharferj.wordpress.com/2011/04/19/peter-saville-new-order-colour-code/
Digital and print subscriber here. Red?
Yup, red.
while the forum geeks are looking in is there any way the site could scroll a couple of lines less than a full page when you hit the space bar rather than ‘just’ a bit more than a page please? ta.
Ooo, I had no idea you could do that. Ta 🙂
I see we can now add icons we can't understand, especially if we're colourblind, to text we can't read. It's like ticking off WCAG guidelines one by one, but by putting actual effort into failing them rather than passing them.
Honestly, STW Towers, you know we all love you, but as a UX/UI professional, every time I visit this site it makes me want to climb into the loft and sit behind the water tank drinking neat gin.
Holds breath and ...
I see we can now add icons we can’t understand, especially if we’re colourblind, to text we can’t read.
I’ve mentioned the colour thing few times in the forum problems thread. It gets ignored.
Have you reported it to Tech in the manner I've suggested a) in the FAQ sticky on the front page, b) on this very thread a page or two back, c) in the thread you mentioned and d) literally every time anyone complains about anything ever in every thread for the last few months?
Tech don't read the forum. You might as well say that you put up a card on the noticeboard in Tesco and were ignored.
We've changed the old 'p' = premier icon for a new one that matches your membership level.
Green = Free membership
Blue/Cyan = Digital
Red = Print+
Black/Grey = Life member
In that order they are Green, Blue, Red, Black
Trail grading colours.
https://singletrackmag.com/membership/
I'm going to bed.
and yet here you are... 😉
it wasn't so much as a fault, or problem, as a niggle.
other sites don't do it. ars technica for instance scrolls a couple of lines short.
sorry. you could have just ignored it. or posted a link to the form. i'll go find the form...
chrome, win10 FWIW. thanks.
found the form. submitted report in the prescribed manner. cheers.
you could have just ignored it. or posted a link to the form.
On the former, you'd have been no nearer. On the latter, I have repeatedly.
There's a "help" link bottom left corner on every page.
Have you reported it to Tech in the manner I’ve suggested a) in the FAQ sticky on the front page,
Yes. Now where do I report that the sticky is no longer on the front page?
In that order they are Green, Blue, Red, Black
Trail grading colours.
Doh!
To be fair not many on here ride, you’d be as well grading the membership on models of Jura coffee machines.
Tech don’t read the forum
I suspect this may be part of the problem. You would think they would take a passing interest. Assuming they are at least a little bit computery/tech/geeky they might actually like it. In fact does anyone from STW Towers use the forum?
We’ve changed the old ‘p’ = premier icon for a new one that matches your membership level.
Why? What is the purpose of this?
Given they make amends to the forum (which does have quite a lot of traffic going to it), you would hope they would monitor the forum for several days (5-10 days) afterwards to see what fall out is going on.
Certainly when we make amends in our place, we monitor everything for a few days afterwards to make sure everything is sorted and it is all working for the users.
If what Cougar is saying is true, then that suggests they are lobbing what they think are fixes/improvements in to the ether and hoping it is working (which really can't be the case).
Site is working for me though other than the Privacy agreement every time I go to the homepage as my first page (I don't sit with this site open all day) - doesn't matter if it is a new browser or a new tab in an existing browser that has already been to forum homepage, each first visit gets the Privacy request. None of the other sites I use do that. I have reported it via the Help link though - I had spotted Cougar's pleas and thought I'd best do that if that is the right process.
There’s a “help” link bottom left corner on every page.
Thanks, I had no idea that was there, and wouldn’t have guessed what it was even if I had noticed it. Used it to report that the icon below it is a dead link.
Except I cannot see the links at the bottom of the page as they are underneath the forum thread/post, about 1/3rd of the way down the page...
Have reported previously via email.
It's in the side bar on the left..
<
...can you see that? The icon looks like one of those life saving rings they have on a pier to throw to drunk people who've toppled into the brink. There's a hammer/gavel below it.
It’s in the side bar on the left..
<
…can you see that? The icon looks like one of those life saving rings they have on a pier to throw to drunk people who’ve toppled into the brink. There’s a hammer/gavel below it.
On mobile it only appears when you press one of the icons in the top right, can't remember which one, but they look more or less the same.
Is this the right place to say that the Youtube links in threads don't currently work for me?
Oh.. The Sidebar... Providing links to stuff either duplicated elsewhere on the page, or with obscure non-standard symbols that are pretty much indecipherable. That also disappears when you are looking at the classifieds. I can see that, but I do not look at it as it's useless as a quick reference and the symbols don't obviously look like what they represent. It also doesn't appear by default on mobile, so for half my browsing time isn't visible.
And every other website I commonly use has such functions at the bottom of each page, not in a semi-permanent, semi-visible side bar.
I also have a mild objection to the request for donations - STW is not a charity, it's fundamentally a business (that I love and support) but donating to a business just feels wrong. If STW converted itself to a charity (not sure if possible) then it would be fine, and I didn't mind the "donate to keep the classifieds running" option on the old classifieds, but now that has been monetised with boost adverts, i have an issue with asking for donations. It feels wrong.
09:27: Edited for typos
Think of the donations as "pay what you want".... it has nothing to do with charity.
I don't like change. Also I'm colour blind. Nevermind.
Requesting donations seems reasonable to me, as long as it's not pushy. Most businesses are having to adapt at the moment and if their customers value them they may wish to help out.
Most businesses are having to adapt at the moment and if their customers value them they may wish to help out.
This x100.
I took out a print subscription but asked them not to bother posting it TBH I don't like the magazine. I do however like the forum and from what I see of their interactions with the world I like the staff. So I subscribe and buy stuff from the store.
Would I give them a donation other than that? Unlikey, maybe they should go down the Patreon route.
Tech don’t read the forum.
Is that because they have difficulty reading the text? 😉
Yes. Now where do I report that the sticky is no longer on the front page?
Fourth line down in your screenshot?
obscure non-standard symbols
The help symbol was changed to something more standard. It's reverted with the last update, I've logged this as a fault.
And every other website I commonly use has such functions at the bottom of each page, not in a semi-permanent, semi-visible side bar.
I was going to say "as does this one" but it looks like that's been reverted also. I'll flag it.
Requesting donations seems reasonable to me
That's been there for months and was requested multiple times in the "direct appeal" sticky.
Fourth line down in your screenshot?
The closed sticky thread?
Nah, it wasn't that one...there was a thread (maybe created by Mark after a forum update) and it was stickied...lots of feedback and interaction with Mark and one or 2 Devs...a number of the things got resolved. It then wasn't a sticky but a week or so later it went back to being sticky, it hasn't been a sticky for a couple of months now, I don't think.
The closed sticky thread?
Does that prevent you from reading it?
Nah, it wasn’t that one…there was a thread
There was a thread soliciting feedback on the new upgrade, yes. Feedback was gratefully received, it was all collated and put into a ticketing system by Tech and your lovable, hard-working and devastatingly handsome moderators. The thread was then closed as a) the upgrade was no longer new, b) the reports eventually became "I've not read the whole thread so don't know if this has been mentioned before but [thing that has been mentioned every fifth post for the last 12 pages]," c) a big long list of bugs and feature requests front and centre isn't a great advert to new visitors and d) traffic dried up to a trickle.
I do not believe that regular readers do not know by now how to report issues. There's a post in the FAQ; there's a Help link in the sidebar; you can always email tech@; there is a Contact Us link at the bottom of every page which contains amongst other things a "website problems" paragraph; and if you still can't work it out, moderators explain all this in posts on the forum on a regular basis. Like I did just now, again.
Do we have a video?
Bored bored bored bored bored.
I do not believe that regular readers do not know by now how to report issues.
I did. I posted about colourways there. I have not bothered reporting anything since as I assume that that is how the techs want it to be. The reporting mechanic has changed since I last used it. Parroting "there is a link on the front page" when there isn't, doesn't help.
The reporting mechanic has changed since I last used it.
The advice to email Tech@ with any issues predates me being here so that's at least ten years that it hasn't changed. Anything else has been additional to try and make it more convenient.
If you can find anywhere on this site in the history of ever that says "in order to effectively report a problem, start a thread complaining about it" you can have my bike.
Parroting “there is a link on the front page” when there isn’t, doesn’t help.
I've never said that.
I have not bothered reporting anything since as I assume that that is how the techs want it to be.
I think this is a 'managing expectations' issue.
Proposed changes get entered into what for convenience I'm referring to as a "bug tracker" but is actually much more than that, it's essentially a roadmap for the site. Looking at it now, I can see committed changes from version 2.7.0 up to 2.7.9 which is current, then proposed changes for 2.7.10, 2.7.11, and for 2.8.0 thru 2.8.5 inclusive.
Point is, just because you report something and it doesn't get implemented inside of 30 seconds doesn't mean it's been ignored. Rather, everything has a priority. It could easily be on the list for a version which is months down the line.
While I appreciate feedback needs to be prioritised, and updates can only be delivered at certain times and in certain orders, it just grates that new colour/logos for contributors gets implemented ahead of basic site functionality/usability.
We're all here because we want to be, and find it frustrating that tinkering and beautification appears to be delivered at the expense of functionality.
A brief scan up the thread indicates that the majority of feedback is coming from paying members of the site, so we are the customer just wanting to have a competent, usable forum that we all love.
To be honest, I don't think any upgrade has actually brought the user experience back up to what it was in the "coffee and cream" days of the pre-2008 hack. Sure there were issues posting images, and quoting/fonts we dodgy but in the 12 years since, I don't think the forum has ever reached the same level of simple functionality it had back then. It was basic, and I don;t really think it needs to be anything more.
We come for the bikes but stay for the company...
... find it frustrating that tinkering and beautification appears to be delivered at the expense of functionality.
That's because it isn't just "tinkering and beautification" for the sake of it. The change is necessary as part of a wider project.
This is part of the problem, it's a perception issue. I quite often see people bemoan "I don't understand why..." and the answer is "correct, you don't." Mark has - well, had, pre-coronavirus - an open invite for anyone who wants to know more to pay them a visit. I used to think exactly the same way until I spent an afternoon at STW towers. I try to bring a bit of transparency where I can but I'm not always privy to everything.
In any case, as much as you say that, you're looking at an 8-page thread of which maybe a quarter of the content is people arguing about whether one of the new icons is the wrong shade of blue or not. This was such a compelling issue in fact that someone started a second thread about it.
It was basic, and I don;t really think it needs to be anything more.
You may well think that, but unfortunately it has no bearing in reality. A "basic forum" does not pay the salaries of a dozen staff. The simple look of the site betrays its complexity.
Have a look at https://builtwith.com/singletrackworld.com
The site might run a hell of a lot faster, consuming a lot less server resources if it wasn't running half that shit 😉
Thanks Cougar but that link means literally nothing to me! I'm a civil engineer, not connected with web design/IT in any way.
I'm not saying it isn't complex behind the scenes, but a clean simple functionality is currently lacking with icons and menus scattered around the page, and adverts (either external for non-payers, or merchandise for subscribers). I'm also aware that the "old" forum as a total technical hack/bodge, and had limited upgrade potential, so change was required and the 2008 hack was a major impetus in overcoming the inertia.
The reason there's so many posts about it, is that we care about the forum. If there is this long pipeline of improvements/upgrades to come, that will implement changes at seemingly random orders (but for perfectly justifiable technical reasons) then why not share it with your committed, educated, informed and invested primary user group to create feedback, or at least to inform that user group?
The site doesn't even have consistent menus between classifieds and forum. It feels like there's no overall control or direction of the development, and when changes/upgrades appear (to the end user) randomly and change elements of inconsequential value, it feels like there is no regard for us as users.
I've said this before on these threads, maybe I should email the comments directly as you suggest, but as its not bug reporting of technical issues, I thought putting it on the forum seemed an appropriate place. Maybe not.