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Having an 18 month old at nursery full time is'nt cheap.
I signed for a letter last night when collecting the boy. They have increased the fees by over 20% FFS!!!!!!!!!!!! New fee will be £1278 pcm.
The letter gives no detail other than waffle along the lines of 'increased government legislation'.
A quick survey of some other parents on a Whatsapp group and we were paying less than others, but are now firmly the most expensive.
I'm just wondering how this compares and if anyone else has felt a big price increase of late?
How long for, how many days a week?
I think we were paying £37.50 per day I the end that was 7 years ago.
*Googles, how to get in to the kids daycare business*
£1275 a month ?
😯
It'll likely be because the 30 hour free childcare contributions from the government barely cover the staffing costs, let alone all the surrounding costs associated with looking after future generations.
is this a result of the changing legislation surrounding the number of available free hours of child care increasing? There was significant news about that a couple of weeks ago with care costs projected to rise for some providers.
EDIT:beaten too it.
is there a feeling that they are taking the piss? i can t imagine they would be, as the costs must be pretty high for running a well resourced child care centre. where are you in the country out of interest?
our little one is in the nursery attatched to my wife's work- a leading NW private primary school- but the costs are fairly competitive for 4 days a week- its by far our biggest out going around £800 a month. think there's a handsome staff discount for us? nope- not until the child is 2 years old! Number 2 is on the way too.. fml.
Don't put your kids in the nursery full time.
From 8-6pm. On the plus side it is rated outstanding and he is very happy there. It is a few minutes walk from home so we can deliver/collect him and get to and from work ok.
But a 20% hike in fees is crazy
could be worse ours was closed down with 1 weeks notice!
theyd been struggling financially and had already raised prices once but lost some customers so guess they couldnt do any more
also downgraded by ofsted & council threatened to remove funding of free places (increase to 30 hours is a bit cost to local authorities)
Just offer to take some for a drive in the country?esselgruntfuttock - Member
*Googles, how to get in to the kids daycare business*
Our breakfast club/after school club have decided they are no longer taking childcare vouchers, because they haven't a bloody clue what their doing.
Bellends.
Although that amount up there is more than my annual bill... 😯
Having an 18 month old at nursery full time is'nt cheap.
Ain't that the truth, everytime I pay the bill I wonder what I did with the £700 a month before she came along.
I'm not sure there's been any new regs, I know it jumped up a couple of years ago when they changed the max number of Children per Carer, but that was 5-6 years I think.
Ours has just started part-time school nursery so we're finally seeing the light at the end of the tunnel.
We never had full-time thankfully, but full time fees at our old Nursery was £900 a month, it was one of, if not the most expensive Nursery in Cardiff - I'd expect to pay more in the South East, but not elsewhere.
Our Childminder is £42 a day including food, £28 a for half-day with drop off or pick up.
It'll likely be because the 30 hour free childcare contributions from the government barely cover the staffing costs, let alone all the surrounding costs associated with looking after future generations.
Ah... I think that's restricted in Wales, Mrs deals with that side of things, but I'm sure the 'free hours' thing is only available if you can't get into a School Nursery and even then it's only 15 hours.
£6 an hour? Thats pretty cheap if you ask me. There are statutory regulations about the numbers of staff per child, facilities they must have etc etc..
Our 18 month old costs us £35 a day for an outstanding nursery. I'm reading this thread feeling very lucky indeed about these costs. My wife and I both work compressed so I have Thursdays off with my little girl. This is beneficial for our finances but also gives us both the chance to bond further for a whole day a week until she goes to school. I did the same with my 6yr old and I absolutely adore that time with her. Also as Baby sleeps for an hour and a half in the pm this is invaluable bike faffing time.
Sounds like you’ve found the most expensive nursery.
*Googles, how to get in to the kids daycare business*
You know that of adage about how to make a small fortune owning a bike shop? Start with a large fortune.
Applies to childcare too. No ones getting rich.
http://champagnenurseries.co.uk
🙄Don't put your kids in the nursery full time.
btw where is the OP? London?
Applies to childcare too. No ones getting rich.
Not everyone.
The owners of the one where my child went to did very well, they sold it in recent years and did extremely well from try sale.
In the past maybe. Not anymore.
Edit: I have a vested interest in a nursery currently for sale. There is no market at the moment as a result of the 30 free hours debacle.
The nursery we were using in Bristol was about £70/ day. Micro Ransos is now at pre-school so gets the full 15 hours for free. I suspect they can only make it work because its within an existing school building so a lot of costs are shared.
Don't put your kids in the nursery full time.
🙄
Ok, might not have been too helpful a comment, but it costs a bloody fortune.
My wife and I both dropped a day at work each meaning we only had to put kids in nursery 3 days a week, also meant we got to spend more time with kids.
You may say the OP might not be able to afford to drop days at work, but if it's gonna cost that much they might save enough to make it worth while.
We didn't mind losing a bit of money for the extra time off work work and extra time with the kids. 4 days a week at work is better for the head IMO.
My wife and I both dropped a day at work each meaning we only had to put kids in nursery 3 days a week, also meant we got to spend more time with kids.
Which is great if you can afford it and your employers agree to it.
Which is great if you can afford it and your employers agree to it.
Well yes as I said, but at £1278 a month they'd be saving over £500 by dropping a couple of days a week.
If they are putting kids in nursery that charges that much full time they are hardly on the bread line are they.
Employers yes I'll give you that but you never know until you ask, it's not as bad as it used to be.
Well yes as I said, but at £1278 a month they'd be saving over £500 by dropping a couple of days a week.
Maybe, maybe not. I know our nursery has a 'full time rate' for 5 days a week and if you want less than that you have to pay a 'day rate' which is a lot more (on a per day basis)
Employers yes I'll give you that but you never know until you ask, it's not as bad as it used to be.
This is true to an extent- it is of course highly variable. I work as one of 6 empolyees in my role and losing one person is a not inconsiderable deficit for my boss to contemplate regardless of his duty of care to my child care needs. Its probably not helpful to speculate on the OP's finances either with statements like "hardly on the breadline" a 20% increase of around £250 - per month- is a significant alteration.
You’ll never regret spending more time with your kids. I’d rather change jobs to spend more time with them. Seems crazy to work and spend all the earnings on outgoings to enable you to attend that workplace.
I have half my team work hours to suit childcare needs, they love it. One person on 4 days a week, one on 3, one does term time working only, another compressed hours. Works really well.
A good friend setup a nursery business run from a relatively cheap council facility which was unused weekdays (i.e. a sports clubhouse). She closed it down after 5 years as it was impossible to make money, i.e. pay herself a salary. So she just "got a normal job". Government regulations, health and safety, employee costs and taxes etc.
Op the way to look at nursery costs (IMO) is that it keeps you and the wife in fairly normal full time employment so that when the kids go to school full time you are still earning the same sort of money. If one of you stops whilst kids are little you will go back to much less well paid work or none at all. So even if income is less than costs now it's about the future.
You’ll never regret spending more time with your kids. I’d rather change jobs to spend more time with them. Seems crazy to work and spend all the earnings on outgoings to enable you to attend that workplace.
if only life was that simple. I might very well have to look at this solution in the coming years based on our income but its not a decision most would take lightly or on a whim. Severing a career path at 34 in my case to spend time as a FT stay at home dad- i would assume would affect my earning potential significantly when the time came to return to work. My heart says yes, but I don't want to live in a frikkng yurt and be all righteous. Frankly, I want to remain with a house over my head and a good education for my children.
Op the way to look at nursery costs (IMO) is that it keeps you and the wife in fairly normal full time employment so that when the kids go to school full time you are still earning the same sort of money. If one of you stops whilst kids are little you will go back to much less well paid work or none at all. So even if income is less than costs now it's about the future.
yes this!
So the Nursery are charging £60 per day?
That's about the going rate in my area (in fact, slightly less than we pay for TP Jr.)
Are you using Childcare Vouchers or Tax-Free Childcare? Depending on whether you or your partner are a higher rate tax payer, you may be able to reduce your costs by switching to Tax-Free Childcare.
Just to put this in context - its a first world rich folk issue. What you are paying is more than a full time salary for a staff nurse ie most workers could not afford it
That is blooming pricey!
We've been looking at the nursery vs child minders costs and the difference is massive. In York from what the other half has been told, we're late to the party looking for nursery spaces around May next year when she goes back to work, we'd be looking at 3 days @ £46-48 per day with a Nursery. Child minder on the other hand would be £30 for a full day and is on the way to work for me, the nurserys are all well out of the way for us both.
I know you mentioned the nursery you use was super useful as its only a couple of mins away but are there any child minders in the area which would reduce the monthly costs greatly?
I have half my team work hours to suit childcare needs, they love it. One person on 4 days a week, one on 3, one does term time working only, another compressed hours. Works really well.
Yep! Missus and I both work part time for much the same reason. Nursery fees were such that the money lost from going P/T was offset by the money saved on childcare.
These days the kids are at school, but I still work compressed hours (36 in 4 days, instead of the standard 39 in 5) so that I can have Fridays off.
Remember that the money "lost" is less than you;d think after you consider tax and NI (so dropping 1 day in 5 [i]doesn't[/i] actually mean dropping 20% of your take home pay)
Employers yes I'll give you that but you never know until you ask, it's not as bad as it used to be.
They are obliged to at least consider an application for flexible working and deal with it in a reasonable manner:
https://www.gov.uk/flexible-working
I recommend it!
Just to put this in context - its a first world rich folk issue. What you are paying is more than a full time salary for a staff nurse ie most workers could not afford it
If valuable members of society such as staff nurses can't afford childcare then it's very much not a "rich folk issue".
Ours is around £50 a day for 3 days a week.
Friends who have twins have a full time nanny as it works out significantly cheaper than putting both kids in nursery - which seems ridiculous.
They do need to make it affordable as we are seriously talking about dropping hours / one of us leaving paid work as we have a second at 6 months. It means people are dropping out of work at most likely their prime productive time, not because they want to, but because the costs are prohibitive.
ransos - Member
Just to put this in context - its a first world rich folk issue. What you are paying is more than a full time salary for a staff nurse ie most workers could not afford it
If valuable members of society such as staff nurses can't afford childcare then it's very much not a "rich folk issue".
The point is that most folk in the UK would not have the option of using a nursery. They alter their working hours, they use family and friends etc. I know a couple who work opposite shifts so they can look after their child. Nurseries are not an option for most folk
We are really lucky. We found a good childminder who is flexible and helps us out. Costs £3.50 an hour. My wife and I both work full time. The little guy goes to the child minders all day on Mondays and Tuesdays and goes to pre-school Wednesday through to Friday (which the childminder drops of and picks up for us). With the 30 hours free care for term time I pay between £80 and £130 a month for childcare (depending on holidays etc). It has only just got to this situation though for this term and the wife only started working full time this term.
If that £1278 a month covers 200hrs of care then it seems like a bargain. How much would you charge?
Maybe, maybe not. I know our nursery has a 'full time rate' for 5 days a week and if you want less than that you have to pay a 'day rate' which is a lot more (on a per day basis)
Yep, plenty of people want 3 or 4 days a week so there's not a big saving in many nurseries to drop a day - nowhere near 1/5th of your fees.
As well as the 30 hours stuff, there's also a higher rate of minimum wage now for over-25s, which is where a lot of the more experienced nursery staff are. Very difficult for the smaller nurseries who aren't able to spread fixed costs around so much.
£1278 😆 would be nice to pay that little. Only a few more years until the youngest goes to school...
The point is that most folk in the UK would not have the option of using a nursery.
So your point is that the OP shouldn't complain about nursery fees because "most folk" can't afford nurseries??
[b]The point is that most folk in the UK would not have the option of using a nursery.[/b] They alter their working hours, they use family and friends etc. I know a couple who work opposite shifts so they can look after their child. Nurseries are not an option for most folk
Precisely! So it's not a "rich folk issue", is it?
FFS TJ what total bollocks. Both of us are busy parents, working hard to make ends meet in the south east and live in a small terraced house. Neither of us are higher rate tax payers (or nurses). No car, no big holidays (26" wheels 🙂 etc just feeling the pinch.
I need to look into Tax Free Childcare/Vouchers thanks, but too busy working my nuts off currently, reduced hours not really an option sorry!
Its not bolloxs. You are paying the equivalent of the national average take home pay for childcare - an option not available to the majority of people in this country because they don't earn enough. How much less is the nursery fees than the lowest wage of the two of you?
All I was trying to do is put it in perspective
Just to put this in context - its a first world rich folk issue.
what an asshat.
care to share your child care experiences TJ?
We have 3 sprogs and it worked out marginally cheaper to get a nanny. It's also much, much simpler logistically. We have her for 3 long days and pay is c 10 ph.
Fwiw we interviewed several potential nannies and one of them was working for a nursery - she wasn't being paid anywhere near minimum wage and they seemed determined to keep her as an apprentice to facilitate that.
Another example of people with no understanding of what life is like for tha majority of people. I say it again. You are paying an amount for childcare that is out of reach for the vast majority of the population
To be able to pay that much puts you in the richest section of society
All I was trying to do is put it in perspective
And getting it completely wrong. If, as you say, a lot of people can't afford childcare, then that tells you why comparatively good earners struggle to make ends meet.
Another example of people with no understanding of what life is like for tha majority of people.
It's very clear that you have a deep understanding of what life is like when raising young children.
Maybe he was sensible and looked at the costs of having a child then giving that child away to someone else for 10 hours a day and decided it was not a good move.
do you have children tjagain?
You’ll never regret spending more time with your kids. I’d rather change jobs to spend more time with them. Seems crazy to work and spend all the earnings on outgoings to enable you to attend that workplace.
Don't know about that. Some people might truly feel that but there are others, myself included, that don't agree. I love my 15 month old boy to bits and love spending time with him, but it can be hard work. Outsourcing the constant monitoring required for a small child for a proportion of the time does wonders for my sanity and helps me to enjoy the time that I do have with him. The best part of my day is when I pick him up from nursery - always greeted with a massive smile and a hug. He loves it at nursery and the chance to interact with other people/children/toys and do activities different from those at home makes him happier.
Furthermore, some people (again myself included) just can't afford to not work full time and statements like that quoted can make people feel guilty (not me included). We might spend a proportion of the extra income on extra childcare, but we earn more than the childcare costs so it is a net gain that does actually make a difference to our lives.
We are extremely lucky to have my wife's parents down the road who look after our boy 2 days a week, which allows my wife to only work 4 days a week, but if that weren't the case then he would have to be in nursery full time.
There's more to bringing up a happy child and doing the best for them than just spending as much time with them as possible.
Its not bolloxs. You are paying the equivalent of the national average take home pay for childcare - an option not available to the majority of people in this country because they don't earn enough.
????????
Surely the fact that this option is not available to the majority of people sort of backs up the OP's point that childcare is really expensive????
A couple's combined income exceeds the national average take home for one person, thus allowing them to afford childcare. Hardly "a first world rich folk issue" 🙄
TJ - of course it's a poor person's issue too. Just like it is when the cost of new BMWs increase. After all, the poor can't afford them either.
I guess the solution would be for the state to provide free childcare. Of course, that would mean a big increase in taxes - probably for the higher earners.
Ta Scotroutes.
I feel for all you baby makers
s you say, a lot of people can't afford childcare, then that tells you why comparatively good earners struggle to make ends meet.
Doesn't that mean he's actually correct? If you're saying comparatively good earners struggle then obviously the masses under the average wage will struggle even more / not have this as an option as TJ suggested. I have no kids if that makes any difference.
There's more to bringing up a happy child and doing the best for them than just spending as much time with them as possible.
+1
still waiting to find out if TJ has kids or not.
What this helps to highlight is the ridiculous mess we've got into whereby folk could be forced into making a decision not to have children based solely on the costs incurred as both parents need to work full time to keep up mortgage/rent payments, especially in areas like the SE.
What this helps to highlight is the ridiculous mess we've got into whereby folk could be forced into making a decision not to have children based solely on the costs incurred as both parents need to work full time to keep up mortgage/rent payments, especially in areas like the SE.
true. however, Tj will be along in a minute to tell you that folk in the SE are rich enough to cope though so...
Don't people use their parents or even grandparents any more? Thought that's what they were there for. But then whadda I know 🙄
I guess the solution would be for the state to provide free childcare. Of course, that would mean a big increase in taxes - probably for the higher earners.
Free or heavily subsidised childcare is the norm in Scandinavia, and its my understanding that its normal for women to return to work after maternity. Then the returnees start paying tax again.
Doesn't that mean he's actually correct? If you're saying comparatively good earners struggle then obviously the masses under the average wage will struggle even more / not have this as an option as TJ suggested. I have no kids if that makes any difference.
If a lot of people struggle to afford, or can't afford childcare, then it's a problem for a lot of people.
Don't people use their parents or even grandparents any more? Thought that's what they were there for. But then whadda I know
yes. most do i would say. MIL had to re negotiate her work contract to facilitate one day a week to give us a financial break- the bigger picture is of course, she shouldn't have to, nor should we look to her for that help. That's an OT/political debate.. but yes many like us are lucky to have that, even a single day a week covered is a £200 monthly saving for us. My entire family live hundreds of miles away so its not a resource we could rely upon initially when planning a family.
We've got a place at one nursery to start December that £67 a day - my wife works for a company that the nursery is attached to so she can pay gross out of her salary for it.
However we're rethinking it as her work is the other side of the City and it gives us less options around drop off / pick up if she has to travel with work.
Went to visit a similarly ofsted rated nursery local to us and it's about £55 a day and they could squeeze out daughter in there. Might go with that option for convenience.
We're lucky in that both sets of grandparents are recently retired and love our daughter to bits so they're going to have her 2 day a week each, plus my wife's work are going to let her go back 4 days a week. So only 2'daysnof nursery a week to pay for - but it's still a huge amount of extra money to pay. The wife wants a 2nd child too - trying to delay that slightly at the moment- imagine paying for 2 kids in nursery
The wife wants a 2nd child too - trying to delay that slightly at the moment- imagine paying for 2 kids in nursery
that is my reality in t-minus 6 months.. i dont have to imagine it.
Don't people use their parents or even grandparents any more?
We would but the six hour drive every day would get pretty dull.
The wife wants a 2nd child too - trying to delay that slightly at the moment- imagine paying for 2 kids in nursery
I don't have to imagine it! Luckily, we're now through the other side.
We would but the six hour drive every day would get pretty dull.
Quite. My parents are great, but it's a 200 mile drive from theirs so we only ask them to help out a few times a year.
Don't people use their parents or even grandparents any more? Thought that's what they were there for. But then whadda I know
I find it hard to believe that is a serious post (or is the eye-rolling supposed to indicate that?), but I'll bite anyway.
Some people don't have parents or grandparents. Some people don't live anywhere near their relations. Some people don't have the luxury of choosing where they live due to availability of work (or other reasons). Some people's relatives are not capable of looking after children, or are just not willing to. Some people don't get on with their relatives.
Very easy to judge people's choices without having any idea of their personal circumstances.
Back to the OP's original question - we pay £40 per day. It is likely to increase as the nursery has only just opened and are trying to keep costs low to attract people. It is attached to a very popular school, so no doubt prices will go up once they've established themselves.
Don't people use their parents or even grandparents any more? Thought that's what they were there for. But then whadda I know
No, they're dead and infirm, so cannot look after our child.
It's this simple TJ...
Mrs Weeksy used to earn £1300 a month after tax.
Our childcare bill was £950 a month....
If Mrs Weeksy gave up work, we're still £450 in the red.... so despite it being the best part of £1000, it's still less than she earned.
I expect in the OPs context it's the same.... it may only be a few hundred quid over the childcare costs, but it's still a few hundred quid needed to be found.
Don't people use their parents or even grandparents any more? Thought that's what they were there for.
Seriously???
Don't people use their parents or even grandparents any more? Thought that's what they were there for.
Can’t ask too much of the baby boomers. They earnt their early retirement 😉
Mine are close-ish (45 mins away) but like a lot of retirees quite happily fill their days with various activities. If we need a particular day it needs arranging weeks in advance and not clashing with yet another holiday or un-moveable appointment.
Very common arrangement though to lean on grandparents for extra support - the family we were neighbours with as kids seem to use them like a nursery, every day of the week there's a couple of them with granny for the day.
In the South East. I earn ‘ok’ from a national perspective but it’s damn hard here. Partner has given up work altogether to care for the kids.
What would make a MASSIVE difference and possibly solve this is if the tax free allowance for individuals could be shared between couples for let’s say, the time until kids are 10. We would actually be financially better off each month if I quit my public sector job and we both worked in Starbucks. Obviously long term this isn’t what is best for us as a family or probably for the country but its so bloody hard at the moment making ends meet.
Don't people use their parents or even grandparents any more? Thought that's what they were there for.
to be fair,there is a twisted logic here to that post, and some uncomfortable truth, but it's a one dimensional view of the problem that goes back to the ancient times... As others state- its not a resource to be cashed in when you drop another sprog out even if you are lucky to have capable elders close by.
only one out of both families is in anyway capable in our situation based on a number of factors. Interviewing my MIL for the job was a frosty affair though let me tell you but 'rules are rules' as i tell my wife.
TJ's got a point about the cost issue but I'm not sure he's entirely right about the numbers. The mean salary is around the £24k mark, but the mean household income is more like £32k I think. Either way, the take home pay after tax is a lot more than £1200, being £1700 for £24k and considerably more for houeshold income. You also need to keep in mind that the mean figures vary considerably by age; household income is a more accurate number to use to evaluate how affordable childcare is for the average household.
£1200 for one sounds about right. Have another child through and it gets a bit sill especially if one of you works shifts.
Our child care bill is £2100 a month as the pattern of work my wife and I both keep requires us to employ a nanny. We even have both kids in school now and still need to keep her on full time if everything is going to work during times like holidays and what not.
For the record, our nanny is brilliant and worth every single penny.
weeksy - so what most of my friends and colleagues did is stop full time work and do a little part time work at times the main wage earner wasn't working to make up the shortfall. win / win. better off overall and the child is being raised by its parents
being £1700 for £24k
simply wrong. I earn £30 000 a year and take home £1600 ish
simply wrong. I earn £30 000 a year and take home £1600 ish
Wow, our nanny earns £25,500 and she takes home £1690 after student loans and pension contributions.