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It's not new news that I like a pick up. Disco 4 Commercial is on 150k and won't go forever, so going into semi retirement. Might make it into an overlander.
New work truck collected today after a train ride to Liverpool. Points if you can name the car park - it's somewhere between Liverpool and Bakewell and I'm currently having a pint. Not included the iconic view that would give it away...
Car park at the trails behind the Halifax building?
castleton car park, and youre having a pint in the george
Edale car park?
It looks like the Bull in Foolow.
If it's not go there next time for a lovely pub lunch
Monsal head
Always fancied a pickup, but bought a van with fancy seats. Easier to camp in and keep the bikes toasty. Although not so sure I'd be happy with a mucky MTB in there.
you can see the timer ticking on the wet belt 😉
you can see the timer ticking on the wet belt 😉
You can't, because it's the 3l V6 with a chain. It's a Jaguar Land Rover engine, so many, many things could possibly go wrong, but wet belt it won't be 😉
It's a Jaguar Land Rover engine
Suddenly the wet belt seems the better option
It's a Jaguar Land Rover engine
Suddenly the wet belt seems the better option
🤣🤣🤣
In fairness, I've had three over the past 6 years amassing circa 230k miles with no issues. The D4 that's going into semi retirement accounts for 150k of those
2.5t of environmental damage, pedestrian and cyclist danger bought due to a soon to be closed tax loophole and the fact you “want” it.
Despite being a diesel it somehow still manages less than 30mpg and puts out 270g/km of CO2 (!!!) which if taxed as a car (which a double cab should be) would be £2700+ a year due to its horrendous emissions, but is only taxed at £335 as it’s a “light goods vehicle” ridiculous.
But if you buy a big camper van half of stw would be splaffing all over it. iirc the OP needs this style of vehicle for off-road site work.
2.5t of environmental damage, pedestrian and cyclist danger bought due to a soon to be closed tax loophole and the fact you “want” it.
Probably has more safety systems to spot cyclists than anything you drive and just for your info, I'll quite happily sit behind a cyclist for a mile or two with a queue of traffic behind me, or as long as it takes that I can safely overtake fully on the opposite side of the road.
My work vehicle that it's replacing, but I'll consider a Tesla next....
All that said, I have a Discovery for personal use too, (see another thread) and that is because I 'want' amongst some other reasons. Blow me 😘
Blow me 😘
I suspect people are less turned on by the size of your car than you were hoping for.
Maybe try a different car park after dark if that's what you're after.
lolol!
Blow me 😘
I suspect people are less turned on by the size of your car than you were hoping for.
Maybe try a different car park after dark if that's what you're after.
🤣 I've been on here long enough to know that a big diesel truck isn't going to give many people a hard on. But thanks for the tip - do you know of any locally?
Does it have a rufty tufty sticker on the back that says Barbarian or Invader or the name of a dinosaur or something?
When the wife sees a pickup on the road she likes to put the word 'anal' before whatever model name is on it. So you're driving along and she'll come out with "Oh look, there's an Anal Trojan" or something. It also works with caravans.
Has it got the 'leccy' slatted cover on the back ?
I had the 2.0 BiTurbo back in 2020 , which I ran trouble free for 18 months. Excellent workhorse for shifting gear to and from site.
I had a gearmate slide out bed in mine , which lost a bit of payload, but made it so much more usable. Its deceiving just how high the sides are when you stood next to it, so the ability to slide the contents out for access was great.
Even managed not to knock anyone over, or off their bike during that time 😜
Does it have a rufty tufty sticker on the back that says Barbarian or Invader or the name of a dinosaur or something?
Nothing so 'exciting' - Platinum
Has it got the 'leccy' slatted cover on the back ?
Yeah
I usually fit a set of sliding drawers in whatever vehicle I've got
Insults back and forth aren't required. But the fact that the vast majority of these "commercial vehicles" spend a significant amount of time doing normal family/day to day stuff and that the manufacturers and purchasers aren't significantly disincentivised not to do so is really a total pisstake for everyone else who's paying their way or trying to do their bit.
There're probably 5-7 of these gargantuan trucks now doing the school run at our local school. Too big to fit in normal parking bays, too tall to even see a child on the pavement they're trying to park next to, with such large tyres and suspension that they easily mount the curb whilst parking, pumping out vast amounts of CO2 as they do so and contributing less than everyone else to the maintenance of the roads (I know this isn't really how it works, but you know what I mean) and the taxes meant to deliver a better future.
A Discovery 4 "Commercial" is purposefully just as luxury as a Disco 4. What badge did you say it your ranger has? Platinum? "Commercial" huh? If these things were as utilitarian as they're taxed to be, far fewer people would be using them as a daily driver.
Let's face it - would you have bought this version if you were paying £3000 a year road tax? Are you paying for fuel or is the company? If in order to get your tax lower, you had to have more emissions limits which limited your acceleration and top speed, would you be happy to still have it? If you were ONLY allowed to use it for commercial, would you still have this version?
"Oh look, there's an Anal Trojan"
Yeh. I mean, Anal Platinum just doesn't have the same ring to it...
IGMC
I'm not normally one to try and suck the jam out of anyone's doughnut, but this....it just kinda sucks. It smacks as living off the good graces of other peoples real tax payments, constraints and attempts to make a difference. I'm not trying to single you out specifically for this TAFKASTR, but it's a crappy system and it's really being exploited.
My employer has stopped buying these. The wet belt ones do the wet belt thing and the V6 ones mashed their auto boxes.
Swapped to Hiluxes which just boringly get on with it if a little less finished.
Our truck was clean once upon a time.
Would look cool with 3 bikes hanging over the tailgate.
A Discovery 4 "Commercial" is purposefully just as luxury as a Disco 4. What badge did you say it your ranger has? Platinum? "Commercial" huh? If these things were as utilitarian as they're taxed to be, far fewer people would be using them as a daily driver.
Also, not being intentionally snippy to you, but to answer your statement
Can one not have something for work that's also a nice place to sit to do a lot of miles in, or does it have to be rattly old Transit?
If I need a vehicle that's going to get a bit beaten up primarily for work, I've no qualms with getting a tax break on its personal use. I'm not arguing against the fact that a lot of people do abuse the system though. But that's all been done in the Pick-up BIK thread
I often have another vehicle for personal use anyway as my work vehicles get that ditched you don't want to get in them wearing nice clothes.
Let's face it - would you have bought this version if you were paying £3000 a year road tax? Are you paying for fuel or is the company?
Possibly, if there were other tax breaks. BIK wise which is the current hot potato, I'd buy a Defender Commercial which is still classed as a van under the new rules. Or at a push a Transporter 4motion. If ridiculous rfl and bik became such an issue, I'd probably be forced to buy a vehicle that wasn't really suitable and cope with the inconvenience
Had pick-ups for work mostly over the past 15 years apart from when I've had a couple of Disco's. Needed a new vehicle and looking at the options thought I'd have one last pick up while I can workout being taxed to death on it.
Company pays for fuel, why would I pay for it? I get taxed as such on fuel benefit though if I'm using it for personal. It's a Ltd company with the only 'employees/beneficiaries' being myself and Mrs STR.
I'd assume anyone who was in a similar position and didn't somehow make the most of tax rules (without evading them) to be a bit daft, have a crap accountant, or be lying....
So, the truck is through the company (tax break) but is also used for personal use - that’s not a commercial - that’s a company car, but I’ll bet that’s not how it looks on your accounts. I’d wager that all the fuel, regardless of what it was used for is also ran through the company? So another illegal tax break? And as it’s not used strictly for commercial use, the VED tax break also shouldn’t apply?
We have lots of commercial vehicles on site - they are just that, 100% commercial. These are what the rules are intended for and if you were abiding by them fully, that truck for you and for many others wouldn’t look nearly as economically inviting.
All the rules intended to improve air standards by taxing heavily polluting personal vehicles are circumvented by creative application of commercial vehicle rules through small limited companies.
Would look cool with 3 bikes hanging over the tailgate.
Really ? I always look at pickups with bikes sticking out the back of them as someone lacking self confidence and really should buy a vehicle more fit for purpose
As to OP, fair enough not a vehicle I would choose but I don’t go off road for work.
Are these types of vehicle about to get a lot rarer anyhow as the tax changes on them, I assume that will only effect brand new ?
Arn
So, the truck is through the company (tax break) but is also used for personal use - that’s not a commercial - that’s a company car, but I’ll bet that’s not how it looks on your accounts. I’d wager that all the fuel, regardless of what it was used for is also ran through the company? So another illegal tax break? And as it’s not used strictly for commercial use, the VED tax break also shouldn’t apply?
You're waffling now and making stuff up.
The truck under HMRC rules has up until now been classed as a van/commercial. If you use it for personal use (just the same as a company van), you get taxed at the appropriate rate - circa £500 year rather than £xxx/month. This is how it is, regardless of how YOU perceive the vehicle to be used/classed. This is exactly how it looks on my accounts thank you
From April anything (double cab pick up and now extended cabs have been added) bought or ordered after April 6th will be classed as a company car for BIK purposes. This has been bought in March and will get whatever tax breaks HMRC deem right and proper. If you don't like that, it's not really my problem, take it up with HMRC
You can put fuel through the business that you use for personal use. You get taxed on it, just as you would if you have a fuel card for your company car. I'm not sure what you think is illegal about that
It's not my perception and neither am I making anything up. For it to be a commercial - it has to be 100% commercial use only. This affects both VED and TAX. IF you bought a that Ranger for personal use through salary sacrifice or as a company car, your BIK would currently be capped at £4k, but you'd also have to pay £2800VED a year. Under the new rules (2025) you'd pay £9k a year BIK(40%) and then £2800VED + the luxury tax. As a commercial, you pay what? £4k Bik and then £0.4k VED?
You then put all the fuel (regardless of personal or business - which IS illegal) through the business, which is then ALL listed as a business expense which you claim tax relief against. It essentially lowers your EBIT.
All this means you can run a hugely inefficient vehicle at a fraction of the cost you should pay were you actually adhering to the law.
It's not just you. The sheer volume of new petrol and diesel Defenders I see on the road cannot be financed by salary sacrifice. The BIK rate is 37% on a £70k car. They're being ran as commercials through small ltd companies. I know of 3 locally (within 3 miles) who do this and of one who has ordered the Phev version, but plans to never charges- he has it purely as the BIK value is 16%(?) rather than 37%.
It's all a scam.
For it to be a commercial - it has to be 100% commercial use only
Not true in the eyes of hmrc for a double cab pickup, In the eyes of hmrc it needs a payload of over 1 tonne, and that's it. How the vehicle is used doesn't seem to come into it (at present), again this is for DC pickups, other vehicles types have different rules.
https://merrantiaccounting.com/the-tax-consequences-of-buying-a-double-cab-pickup/
If he was telling HMRC that he was just using the vehicle for work only, then jaunting off in it at weekends with the family , then there would be an issue.
If , as I understand it, he is paying BIK on it , and also BIK on any fuel he is using ( can’t remember the rate , but you pay the same about whether you do 20 personal miles or 20000) , then he’s not doing anything “illegal”. As mentioned previously , HMRC class it as a commercial, therefore he only needs to pay the commercial rate of BIK. Yes, they are fairly “luxurious” inside compared to a farm truck , but I found they are not as practical for a family of 4 as you might like to think.
Do you get as upset about “luxury “ EV’s too ? I can buy a £130k EV , pay literally FA BIK , and claim 100% of its value against my corp tax . All perfectly legal and above board
Do you get as upset about “luxury “ EV’s too ? I can buy a £130k EV , pay literally FA BIK , and claim 100% of its value against my corp tax .
I would if I were buying a service from the company running such a beast. It would be my money, after-all, paying for it.
Do you get as upset about “luxury “ EV’s too ? I can buy a £130k EV , pay literally FA BIK , and claim 100% of its value against my corp tax .
I would if I were buying a service from the company running such a beast. It would be my money, after-all, paying for it.
Interesting , do you vet all companies you buy services from ? Check out how many holidays the directors have , and to where ? Do you like to check their home address to see how much it cost ? Don’t forget , you’ve paid for all that 😎
What if the service they provide is 10-20 cheaper than the competition, and quicker and more efficient ? Would you still be hung up about what car they drove then ?
Nice Truck, I like mine, 2L BiTurbo much nicer than the older 2.2tdi.
The Driver aids are great on a long drive but a it of a faf on the day to day drive.
Very comfortable, sorry should it have come with hard wicker seats, metal interior and an AM radio, so as not to offend anyone's version of the rules?
What size wheels did yours come with, mine is on 19" rims (I think) and didn't have many options for 4 season tyres when we got it 18 months ago..
Without wandering off back to the Pick Up BIK thread (it's all been done), I've accepted the new tax rules and I get to use a pick up for work (and some personal use), within HMRC rules for another few years and that will be me done with them, I'll decide what to get next, maybe a Defender.
Question for those so angry about people taking advantage - do you seriously think these three scenarios (the middle being one of my old trucks) should pay the same BIK? Personally, I don't and feel for the farmer rather than feeling sorry for myself (I'm really not), but guessing he will probably have a stronger case for saying it's business use only...
What size wheels did yours come with, mine is on 19" rims (I think) and didn't have many options for 4 season tyres when we got it 18 months ago..
20's
Took it straight to the tyre shop and had 275/55/R20 BFG AT KO2's fitted - Three Peaks Snowflake rated
Nice but it needs a pair of Border Collie's in the bed to finish it properly.
Interesting , do you vet all companies you buy services from ? Check out how many holidays the directors have , and to where ? Do you like to check their home address to see how much it cost ? Don’t forget , you’ve paid for all that 😎
What if the service they provide is 10-20 cheaper than the competition, and quicker and more efficient ? Would you still be hung up about what car they drove then ?
Ermmmm, actually yes. Well none of what you said because that was all stupid, but it was common to look at what company vehicles are used as part of bids because we got credits for sustainable practices. Both in absolute quantitative terms (limiting hotel nights, vegetarian site catering, electric vehicles, public transport use, renewable energy generation) and qualitative statements like the director used an electric car, the work van fleet had been reduced and better use made of outsourced logistics.
I can buy a £130k EV , pay literally FA BIK
That's not a tax dodge, it's an incentive. The govt has explicitly said you won't pay tax on it when used as intended because they want us to be driving EVs.
I'd assume anyone who was in a similar position and didn't somehow make the most of tax rules (without evading them) to be a bit daft, have a crap accountant, or be lying.
I was in that position, I did not minimise my tax or otherwise take the piss, because I have integrity.
I was in that position, I did not minimise my tax or otherwise take the piss, because I have integrity.
So, you were self employed, or a Company Director and didn't bother writing down legitimate items because you wanted to pay more tax?
because I have integrity.
I have integrity too. In spade loads . I pay suppliers / subcontractors as soon as invoices hit my inbox, pay my corp tax , personal tax when it’s due, collect VAT for the government etc. I look after my customers and provide a cracking service. If there are legitimate ways of reducing my tax burden , then I’ll take them thanks ( well, my accountant will )
I can sleep soundly at night, knowing I pay my fair share of taxes. Didn’t even moan when they raised corp tax from 19 to 25 % 😀
Interesting , do you vet all companies you buy services from ?
Yes and I've worked for a company where the vehicles we had wouldn't raise any questions from those buying our services. Parking a brand new Taycan outside the office when your service charges are high and the service is poor is a stupid thing to do. If you want a posh car don't bring it to work, use a beater for the two mile commute (the Taycan again). It's a rule one thing.
Do you get as upset about “luxury “ EV’s too ? I can buy a £130k EV , pay literally FA BIK , and claim 100% of its value against my corp tax . All perfectly legal and above board
As a matter of fact, yes. Same with folks who abuse the C2W scheme. Tax advantages seem to flow entirely the wrong way in this country.
Question for those so angry about people taking advantage - do you seriously think these three scenarios (the middle being one of my old trucks) should pay the same BIK? Personally, I don't and feel for the farmer rather than feeling sorry for myself (I'm really not), but guessing he will probably have a stronger case for saying it's business use only...
Depends - how much of its mileage is spent doing what that image shows? If its 80%+ and provable - probably not, but if it's not? 100% yes.
Why should you be allowed to run a gas guzzling tax break and pay LESS for it than anyone else? Why should they subsidise you whilst you pollute around them and make yourself feel happy? Same goes for Taycans and Q8, whatevers.
You want to run a gas guzzler for everything? Fine, but you should be damned well willing to pay for it and the damage it does. 270g/km from a diesel, FFS!
Again - not specifically directed at you TAFKASTR, in fact, I appreciate you contributions to the thread - this would've been a good pub debate.
If there are legitimate ways of reducing my tax burden , then I’ll take them thanks
This is part of my issues with it, the law makes it acceptable to some, but less so to others. Some people are interested only in the letter, some the spirit, but the latter often gets trumped when economics comes into it. We saw similar dichotomies during the pandemic. For some, it needed prohibition, for others it was about social good, for many it was just getting through it!
Parking a brand new Taycan outside the office when your service charges are high and the service is poor is a stupid thing to do
If your service charges are high, and service is poor , then that’s why I wouldn’t be using you, not because you have a Taycan parked outside 🤔
I have worked for a company in the past , where the director ran an old shed of a Volvo, but paid an extraordinary amount of rent for plush offices in the city centre. If I was a client , I would wonder how much of the hourly rate I was paying was going towards those offices. I couldn’t GAS what car he drove
2.5t of environmental damage, pedestrian and cyclist danger bought due to a soon to be closed tax loophole and the fact you “want” it.
Despite being a diesel it somehow still manages less than 30mpg and puts out 270g/km of CO2 (!!!) which if taxed as a car (which a double cab should be) would be £2700+ a year due to its horrendous emissions, but is only taxed at £335 as it’s a “light goods vehicle” ridiculous.
So what. If that’s what the op wants why not. When you’ve come back from your eco crusade having got China to stop building lots of new power stations and trump to stop drilling then we will talk.
As for the pedestrians I’m sure the op isn’t planning on running any over
We saw similar dichotomies during the pandemic. For some, it needed prohibition, for others it was about social good, for many it was just getting through it!
Fortunately, due to being involved in the Power Generation Industry during the pandemic, I was classed as a 'key worker' and again, fortunately the multi national I contract to were still building.
Had this not been the case, I'd have probably have had to declare myself bankrupt and possibly lost my house due to the shitty way small company directors were treated whilst everyone else got paid for doing nothing.
I was actually looking at doing Amazon deliveries - in my commercial vehicle 👍
When the wife sees a pickup on the road she likes to put the word 'anal' before whatever model name is on it. So you're driving along and she'll come out with "Oh look, there's an Anal Trojan" or something. It also works with caravans.
And as if by predictable chance I got close passed by a new Ranger on my way into work this morning. It appears their owner was self aware though as the model name was "DERANGED".
I was actually looking at doing Amazon deliveries - in my commercial vehicle 👍
Not sure you'd get enough packages in a bed that small to make it worthwhile at that mpg?
Only one of those appears like it might have 20" diamond cut alloys. 😉
Not sure you'd get enough packages in a bed that small to make it worthwhile at that mpg?
Discovery has a fair bit of room
Only one of those appears like it might have 20" diamond cut alloys. 😉
I've ruined diamond cut alloys on three of my past work trucks getting scratched up in mud 😉
Nice ute. Looks odd with those tyres on though. Like sneakers on a hippo. 😀
I seem to remember having my wages cut, whilst simultaneously having to fit in 7.5 hrs of work into the early mornings / late nights to accommodate home schooling my kids during the day.
I just got let go.
Furlough was optional, which really pissed me off with all the "self employed" bleating on about their hardship. The same sorts who'd tell you they deserved their lower rates of tax / higher daily rates as they were taking the risk 🤨🙄 and then they got the Self Employed Income Support Scheme anyway. So...............
But that's a different thread.
Nice ute. Looks odd with those tyres on though. Like sneakers on a hippo. 😀
Look half way down the first page, they got changed on its first day 😉
Took it straight to the tyre shop and had 275/55/R20 BFG AT KO2's fitted
Get your speedo updated?
Took it straight to the tyre shop and had 275/55/R20 BFG AT KO2's fitted
Get your speedo updated?
No, it still reads slightly under - about 1.5mph out at 65mph. Not sure what it was before.
When I went up a profile on my Disco 4 from 255/45/20 to 255/55/20 it made the speedo bang on prety much
What is the advantage of a pick-up?
Genuine question, not trying to start a fight. They all over the place, but I can only see the drawbacks (ie no roof on the back and shortened load-thru). There must be an advantage to having a large carry-all vehicle with only half a roof and a cut-in-half load space though?
What is the advantage of a pick-up?
5 seats, goes off road, nicer to drive than a van, has a loadspace - how useful that loadspace is depends on your requirements I suppose.
I usually have a hardtop on mine, but I'm more managing my sites now, rather on the tools, so minimising the stuff I'm carrying round all the time. It's definitely not as usable a space as a van, but I've managed for 15 years on and off using one. Might fit a hardtop to this one at some point, but if I've got a big job on, I can take the Land Rover
Artist, I can't recommend the Pegasus top I have.
First one was replaced as it wouldn't shut properly and numerous fixes/botches didn't work. Luckily they are in Bristol so not a massive inconvenience but a hassle none the less.
Second one is okay but nowhere near as well made as the Truckman I had before. I do like the side opening hatches in this one though.
Pickup good if you carry petrol tools and cans. If you have that sort of stuff in a van you are forever surrounded by a stench of petrol fumes. You don't get that with a pickup.
nowhere near as well made as the Truckman I had before
I've never been a fan of Truckman. Passed a few today and they just look like someone has attacked the fibreglass edge with a hacksaw. Not a fan of Pegasus either though.
Will probably be an RSI Smartcap Defender if I get one. No windows, but gullwing sides
