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Note SNP have increased their support
No I hadn't, which poll are you referring to? The one I linked doesn't seem to show any increase in support for the SNP.
Anyway for a change let's not, important as you think it is, focus on the less than 10% of voters who happen to live in Scotland. Instead let's look at the other 90%......who are they supporting?
It was a poll you posted a week or two ago. It shows that folk will vote for a pro Europe party given given the chance.. iirc it showed the SNP despite all their woes would take back most of the seats they lost to labour
My point is that all labour are offering is tory or reform lite. Chasing racist votes does not work when you are easily outracisted.
I know a good few former labour voters who will never vote for a brexiteer immigrant demonising benefit scrounging haters labour patry
For those on the right why vote for a pale imitation when you can vote for the real thing? Chasing reform votes will never work. They need to counter reform not kowtow to them
It shows that folk will vote for a pro Europe party given given the chance..
So why hasn't support for the LibDems increased then? More people have a chance to vote LibDem than they have to vote SNP, and yet their support has remained remarkably static and it is still half of what it was 15 years ago.
And lib dems have zero chance of ever being a government nor have they been pushing a pro Europe agenda keeping silent on it until a few quiet wispers recently.
Mind you greens have a increase on a very pro Europe stance
Closer ties with Europe invluding CU is a popular position. Polling shows that. A majority even in Farages seat
So why hasn’t support for the LibDems increased then?
Because of our antidemocratic electoral system. There's no point voting for your preferred party if they aren't close to winning the seat.
Also, plenty of people are (still, remarkably) utterly delusional about Labour's supposedly pro-europeans instincts. With Starmer in charge, they don't have any.
Also, plenty of people are (still, remarkably) utterly delusional about Labour’s supposedly pro-europeans instincts.
Although the most delusional are the ones opposed to it.
Which is the flaw of the "playing into Farages" hands argument. He just lies about it anyway and those inclined to oppose believe him vs those who are in favour who seem more likely to realise its false.
Might as well commit to it since labour will be accused of it anyway.
I wonder what happened 15 years ago to the Lib Dem’s which has resulted in them no longer being trusted by the electorate…
I wonder why the Lib Dems are the only party that voters seem bothered about holding to account. The truth is that the Lib Dems somewhat diluted the extremes of what the Conservatives wanted to do in that parliament, and yet in a sea of broken manifesto promises from every party ever in power they are the only ones who have this broken promise thrown back in their face time after time after time.
And lib dems have zero chance of ever being a government
Wow, you dismiss the lack of increased support for the LibDems because you claim they have zero chance of ever being a government, and then you point to increase support for the Greens as proof of how popular pro-EU parties are!! Talk about being selective!
The Greens received 7% of the vote at the last general election, they are currently polling about 7-10%. Yes it represents an improvement which is hardly surprising considering what a disappointment Labour has been for a good many people, including on environmental issues, but no it does not prove that EU membership is the driving issue behind the increase.
These days I strongly back the Greens, I don't think you doubt my opposition to the EU. Like most people I see EU membership as a nonissue right now in UK politics. The reason that support for the Greens has increased in the last six months, if it indeed has, has nothing to do with EU membership and everything to do with the direction Starmer's government has taken.
Provide evidence that pro-EU parties are gaining support at Labour's expense because of the issue of EU membership, so far you haven't and yet you repeatedly make that claim as if it was obvious, it isn't.
And btw despite your dismissive attitude there is in fact a very good chance indeed that the LibDems could be in the government after the next general election, it just depends on how the arithmetic of first-past-the-post pans out. And there is no reason why under the current political situation voters would not be aware of that.
I wonder why the Lib Dems are the only party that voters seem bothered about holding to account............they are the only ones who have this broken promise thrown back in their face time after time after time.
So what is your explanation? I agree btw, I find it frankly astonishing that voters have such a long memory with regards to the LibDems.
They say that a week is a long time in politics and yet 15 years later many voters still haven't forgiven the LibDems for enabling a Tory administration and enthusiastically supporting austerity, the principle reason why we are in such a mess today.
Despite currently backing the Green Party nationally I actually supported the LibDem candidate in my constituency last general election because he had by far the best position on the issue of Palestine than any other candidate. As far as I was concerned if your moral compass doesn't include opposition to genocide I don't want you to represent me on any issue.
I wonder why the Lib Dems are the only party that voters seem bothered about holding to account
This video probably helps to explain why voters expected far more from the LibDems than they expect from Labour and the Tories.
It's not a spoof, although considering what happened shortly after it was broadcast you could be forgiven for thinking that it was.
I wonder why the Lib Dems are the only party that voters seem bothered about holding to account.
You mention "The truth" but, to put it mildly, thats only truth in the most optimistic telling.
The Libdems had several problems.
The starter for ten is obviously both the tories and labour want to put the boot in. Which means the right wing press shares the same opinion and, if labour are suitably "centrist", so does the guardian leaving not much of the media to fight their corner.
Another is, unfortunately, the 2010 election was a perfect storm with the right wing "orange book" lib dem leadership/mps losing out to their membership on a vote on student fees (plus a few others) and so had to have an idea in their manifesto that they hated. Sadly though instead of going silent on the subject they decided actually it would be a vote winner which indeed it was.
The problem came when it was time to discuss policies for a coalition and Clegg and co happily surrendered on those policies whilst not being hardline enough on others eg the vote referendum where the ****wits allowed Cameron to decide on AV only and have a free hand (honestly if we are blaming people for brexit I rate Clegg high up the list since his stupidity on this referendum I think helped convince the ****wit Cameron that he was a PR genius and hence would easily win the brexit referendum).
tl:dr
Whilst the libdem membership had complex positions the libdem leadership aka clegg and co were pretty hardcore free market ****wits and hence were happy to accept the tories position on way too much. Perhaps if the leadership had matched the party things would have been different.
As a side note the paymaster behind the orange book lot is now bankrolling gbeebies. Possibly something for the self declared adults in the room to consider when lecturing others.
Like most people I see EU membership as a nonissue right now in UK politics.
In your little englander corner maybe. Its the elephant in the room.
As for evidence. The recovery of the SNP who are yhe only major party who arr actually telling the truth on brexit. The SNP should be being smashed to bits given the shambles they are but instead after a ahite GE they have recovered strongly on an openly loud pro EU stance.
Thr other data is the ever increasing majority for rejoin in polls despite none of the Westminster parties pushing it
Public opinion miles ahead of Westminster
GB news today's interview with a Fisherman hasnt helped their brexit argument.
GB news is definitely attempting to separate itself from its previous pro brexit stance. Same as Farage, refuses to take any blame for his part in pushing that issue.
What we need is something like a large visible poster showing the quotes(and results) of farages and the pro brexiters lies. Where peoples concerns were treated with sarcastic replies
Blame where blame is bloody due.
Number of people thinking Britain right to leave EU hits record low, at 30%, poll suggests
On Friday it will be the fifth anniversary of the day the UK left the European Union. YouGov says the number of people who thnk that was the right decision is down to a record low in its polling, at 30%.
Has Brexit been more of a success or more of a failure? All Britons More of a success: 11% More of a failure: 62% Neither: 20% Leave voters More of a success: 22% More of a failure: 32% Neither: 38%
Most Britons support rejoining the EU % who support... Closer relationship with EU, without rejoining it or components: 64% Rejoin EU: 55% Rejoin Single Market: 50% Rejoin Customs Union: 48% Status quo: 27% Loosening ties further: 19% https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/51484-how-do-britons-feel-about-brexit-five-years-on
The fact that 1/3 of the country is still opposed to rejoining worries me (vs 55% that support). That is still a very divisive split.
Then I wonder whether actually I'm still in that camp - that the whole effort, division, cost, and likely worse conditions we'd get capture some that say 'that boat has sailed'. If that weren't the case then yes, I'd be in but the reality is that you play the ball as it lies. And given how the ball lies, the safe shot is the better one.
And so now I'm more in camp 2 - we're out and that's something to accept for now, but we absolutely must be seeking agreements that give us better accesses, etc. Like this for example https://sciencebusiness.net/news/horizon-europe/uk-launches-fresh-push-drum-horizon-europe-interest - with the benefit that 'only' 15% of the country oppose that vs 64% that support it, much less divisive.
I know you'll say that with that majority then who cares, and look where 'don't spook the horses' has got us so far and I'd find that very justified. Maybe I'm just a scaredy cat.
Number of people thinking Britain right to leave EU hits record low, at 30%, poll suggests
The problem with these sorts of headlines is that [like most] it lack nuance. Once you get into the weeds about which age group and what party they vote for, the fact is that as folks age and become more right wing they become more content with Brexit. So vast numbers of left leaning millennials and gen Y'ers think it's been a disaster, (surprisingly enough) most Gen X'ers are spilt more or less 50/50 and most Boomers - especially right leaning, think it's all fine. Thing is, it's only the Gen X'ers and Boomers that tend to go and vote.
Thats a poor excuse for inaction. Those are the numbers with all the main parties being hard brexiteers and the lib dems being quiet. Imagine jow much they would move with a decent campaign.
Its also a significant majority of leave voters.
Public opinipn in all age groups and a leave and temain voters is massively in favour of some form of teturn.
The only real sticking point is Starmets cowardice in admitting he got it wrong.
Imagine what being on the side of such a huge majority
Of public sentiment would do for labour's popularity
Yup, Sir Ed is being very quiet about it, this is currently on the front page of the BBC.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ckgxz0zjnk4o
The Lib Dem membership is now pretty much dominated by people who joined after 2016 directly due to their Pro-EU stance and who will never ever forgive the Tories for Brexit. It's a very different party from the coaliton days.
So what is your explanation? I agree btw, I find it frankly astonishing that voters have such a long memory with regards to the LibDems.
Broken promises are routine (and in many case no bad thing; politics is terrible about reviewing and changing decisions) but this was a core pledge thrown away so that the party leader could jump into bed with David Cameron. It was dropped purely for one man's personal gain and that was supported by the other elected members.
Mind you, they might get another opportunity now that Starmer is basically positioning Labour where Cameron had the Tories in 2012.
Like most people I see EU membership as a nonissue right now in UK politics.
.
In your little englander corner maybe. Its the elephant in the room.
You managed to contradict yourself in two consecutive sentences. It very obviously wouldn't be "the elephant in the room" if it was an issue which was of concern to voters.
It would be a topic that was constantly and openly discussed, you know like other issues that make the headlines..... cost of living, environmental issues, the NHS, etc.
The results of opinion polls with regards to the importance of an issue are totally irrelevant. An opinion poll out last week actually showed a similar level of support for capital punishment as for EU membership, over 50% supported the reintroduction of capital punishment whilst about 30% opposed it.
Is this proof that capital punishment is a big issue with voters, is it the "elephant in the room" that no one wants to talk about? Of course not. Some people got a phone call from a pollster and they answered a question, it doesn't provide any proof that the issue is important or urgent to them.
I am happy to be corrected though, provide me with credible evidence that the issue of the EU is recieving the same level of concern as the economy, the NHS, transport, the environment, etc.
As for evidence. The recovery of the SNP who are yhe only major party who arr actually telling the truth on brexit.
Putting aside the suggestion that there is nothing else to attract voters to the SNP than its position on the EU, more than 90% of voters do not live in Scotland, if the burning issue is EU membership to them then why do approximately 75% of UK voters support the Labour Party, the Tories, and Reform UK?
Or is support for political parties only relevant when it backs up your narrative and completely irrelevant when it doesn't?
Apologies fir the rubbish typing. Im doing this in the dark without my reading glasses
FFS calm down, debating EU membership on stw isn't that critical and urgent....... turn the lights on and find your reading glasses.
It would be a topic that was constantly and openly discussed, you know like other issues that make the headlines
There's the problem, unless it's in the headlines it doesn't make the news. I wonder why that may be?
There are too many in the news media who don't or won't understand the bind we are in as a result of our collective act of self harm. Mr "bin-juice" should be regularly asked when the benefits of withdrawal are going to be seen by the person on the "Clapham Omnibus". He has no answer other than it's a good wheeze for him and his mates to bleed the rest of us for cash.
In the light of the ongoing 'bit of a mess' the other side of the pond we need a big ally that is not capricious. The trade team for the EU are ferociously professional as Melon and Trump are going to find out. Data rights in the light of the unsanctioned/insecure(?) servers hooked to the government systems this weekend are due to be enacted with no export out of contiguous EU being permitted.
UK is currently in a very perilous place and we're next on the fascists list.
Let's hope Lord Far Far protects our freshly won sovereignty.
the fact is that as folks age and become more right wing they become more content with Brexit.
That’s not what your next points (which I’m not disputing) show - they show that older people are more right wing now, not that the younger ones will age towards a more right wing tendency.
It was conventional wisdom but I am given to understand that it’s not necessarily true going forward.
a topic that was constantly and openly discussed
It is. Politicians are avoiding it though. With good reason. But the public? It’s always coming up. Trump winning and looking to punish other countries with tariffs has increased discussion around the obvious… clubbing together in Europe has benefits for all the countries of Europe, and many of their partners without the size and influence of the biggest countries… and those benefits increase as the leaders of USA, Russia and China threaten our interests for political advantage at home.
It is. Politicians are avoiding it though. With good reason. But the public? It’s always coming up.
So how about providing some evidence to back up that claim? And the idea that politicians are the only people who decide what gets constantly and openly discussed is just silly. Although I am sure they would love it if life was that easy for them.
the fact is that as folks age and become more right wing they become more content with Brexit.
Unless they want to retire in Spain and live ‘The Dream’ 🙂
Probably more worrying was that the tik-tok gen seem to think having a dictator run the U.K. would be good 🙂
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2025/feb/02/shocking-finding-gen-z-democracy-isnt-perfect
Anyway what was that urgent political party broadcast about That fartage was on about democracy being stolen, TBH I thought he’d got his countries mixed up 🙂
It’s not an excuse, it’s reality. There isn’t a 70% pro re-join majority, and its foolish to think otherwise
I think my main worry is that a rush to rejoin to the EU ends up being a major election point on the betrayal of the Brexit,that gets milked by Reform and the Tories and the massive misinformation engines get fired up again, there doesn’t seem to be a current way to counter attack this.
The trade team for the EU are ferociously professional as Melon and Trump are going to find out.
Yep, didn’t go well for the Trumpster or Harley D last time
In 2018, the Trump administration imposed additional tariffs on EU goods, with a 25% duty on steel and 10% on aluminum, aimed at boosting U.S. domestic production.
In response, the EU retaliated by imposing additional customs duties on certain U.S. products under Regulation 2018/886. Among the list of products were Harley-Davidson motorcycles.
Background of the case
Harley-Davidson motorcycles became subject to additional EU import duties of 25% in 2018, followed by another 25% in 2021. The total import duties for Harley Davidson motorbikes are therefore:6% for the standard import rate plus,
25% additional duty in June 2018 plus,
another 25% of additional duty in June 2021.
In the end the tarif didn’t go up another 25% but HD did try to get around it by making them in Thailand but that ended up causing another problem as the EU said that was Tax avoidance, it had been shelved as both the US and the EU set about negotiations on steel and aluminum tariffs.
I’m not sure what the current state of duty is on a Harley but 56% would have decimated their sales.
So how about providing some evidence to back up that claim?
I’m speaking about the conversations I hear all the time. I’m not recording them for internet debating points. Get your head out of the sand and wake up to the fact that Brexit was self-defeating for the UK, and most people know that now. The big question is how we make sure the con artists that tricked us into it don’t trick us again. Trump’s second presidency has got more people voicing their concerns recently.
And the idea that politicians are the only people who decide what gets constantly and openly discussed is just silly
Well, as I didn’t say that, and I don’t think that, I don’t know why you brought it up.
I think my main worry is that a rush to rejoin to the EU ends up being a major election point on the betrayal of the Brexit,that gets milked by Reform and the Tories and the massive misinformation engines get fired up again, there doesn’t seem to be a current way to counter attack this.
Arguably there are good reasons to worry that misinformation will be much better amplified, and there is even less chance to counter it. The main Social Media platforms would most likely have changed how they operate for the worse, for example. People who are up for the war of ideas and information happening anytime soon I fear are underestimating how the battles would play out, by placing so much faith in how people currently view Brexit while it’s not a key headline voting issue.
I’m speaking about the conversations I hear all the time. I’m not recording them for internet debating points.
Well that's hardly a convincing argument that backs up TJ's claim that the number one issue with voters currently is the EU.
Obviously I can understand why you might have come to that conclusion if you based it on political conversations on STW threads, but STW is very far from being anywhere near representative of the wider voting public.
Reform UK now enjoys roughly the same level of support nationally as the Labour Party does, the combined Tory-Reform support is equal to approximately twice that of Labour. And yet despite that I don't think you will find one single obvious Reform UK supporter on any STW political thread, nevermind double the amount of Tory-Reform supporters to Labour supporters!
The LibDems have an undisputable commitment to the European project dating back to its Liberal Party days. If LibDem politicians choose not to talk about rejoining the EU then it is purely because firstly they know that voters do not treat it as a priority issue, and secondly because they are perfectly aware that it is not currently a vote winner for them. It is certainly not because they lack a commitment to the EU.
Get your head out of the sand and wake up to the fact that Brexit was self-defeating for the UK, and most people know that now.
I love the idea of someone who appears to base their perceptions of what most concerns voters on the narrow views expressed in an echo chamber telling me to get my head out of the sand!
What I personally think is utterly irrelevant to what the wider voting public prioritises. You could convince me that leaving the EU was the worse thing to have ever happened since the 1066 Norman invasion and it would not change by one iota the fact that the issue is currently of little importance to the average UK voter.
Wake up, get your head out of the sand, and look at what the polls are telling us.
that backs up TJ’s claim that the number one issue with voters currently is the EU
I never said that
I never said that
You have repeatedly claimed over and over and over again that voters are deserting Labour because of Labour's stance on the EU and instead backing pro-EU parties, without providing any convincing evidence.
If you are not claiming that it is the number one issue what then are you claiming?
A new mega-poll :
The analysis of who is being attracted to Reform UK is particularly interesting and it certainly reflects very similar shifting patterns in Europe and the United States :
Its analysis of almost 4,000 voters currently minded to back Reform found that one in five were “moderate, interventionist” voters who were unlike those who had backed Farage at the last election or supported Ukip or the Brexit party in the past.
They were quite positive about immigration and in favour of a strong state, but disillusioned with the ability of the main parties to deliver.
The analysis comes with some of the most senior figures in the Labour party focused on the threat posed by Reform, which many see as the result of a collapse in the belief that the mainstream parties are able to improve the lives of ordinary people.
Nick Lowles, chief executive of Hope Not Hate, who analysed the findings, said that there was a clear and present threat to Labour should it fail to deliver the improvements to living standards and public services that Starmer has promised.
“Strong anti-immigration views were dominant among those who voted Reform in the 2024 general election, but those who have begun to support the party since then have far more diverse views.
“This includes a sizeable group of voters who are actually quite positive towards the benefits of immigration and multiculturalism but increasingly feel the main parties have failed and it is time for something new.”
Personally I don't think that the current Labour Party will step up to the challenge because the centrists who control the party lack any motivation or understanding of how to tackle the failed neoliberal experiment and instead offer a radical alternative.
I suspect that they will resign themselves to accepting what they see as the inevitable - a Tory-Reform government. In much the same way as the last Tory government resigned themselves into accepting an inevitable Labour landslide.
The Tories didn't change course and this Labour government won't either, both were/are incapable of doing so welded as they are to neoliberal orthodoxy.
I doubt that they even care that much as firstly they probably believe that a Tory-Reform government won't personally effect them very much, and secondly because many will not have entered politics as conviction politicians.
They will probably shrug their shoulders and deny any responsibility claiming that the electorate suddenly and inexplicably became racist, that seems to be the preferred excuse for centrists when discussing the disconnection with voters.
It was conventional wisdom but I am given to understand that it’s not necessarily true going forward.
It was never true but often used alongside that false Churchill quote and mutterings about "sixth formers".
There is some evidence peoples decisions become more fixed as they get older but thats in whatever direction you already were.
In addition if there is a significant shift in a social/economic position over a generation or two which isnt shared by all parties which could result in the older generation clustering towards the party which still holds the older view. It isnt that they have changed parties but that the parties have moved.
Lest it sounds that I am putting ALL the blame on the centrists where are the radical left in response to the growing threat that the far-right poses?
Sure many got hammered and driven out of the Labour Party but they can't keep licking their wounds forever. Even if it is from a position of great weakness there is no reason why they can't start organising and fighting back - the threat is real enough.
If Nigel Farage can start a movement which looks as if it is in the process of effectively challenging 200 years of Tory right-wing dominance then there is no reason why the left cannot start to challenge the dominance of Labour.
I honestly don't know what the **** the left are doing apart from **** all. I no longer understand what is so great about Islington North not having a Labour MP. It's not exactly as if there is all the time in the world, politics is unpredictable and changing at an alarming rate.
The fact that 1/3 of the country is still opposed to rejoining worries me (vs 55% that support). That is still a very divisive split.
66.6% in favour of rejoining is a much more decisive majority, unlike the 51% majority that took us crashing out.
Half of the referundum con was the 'simple majority' .. the other half of the con were all the lies that were peddaled to only get 1% over the line.
If it was an official referendum, rather than advisory, the bar would have been higher, and theres no law that says a UK government has to impliment the resulsts of a non official referendum.
The entire thing was a hatchet job from start end. Well, not 'end' as we've hardly implimented anything yet, we (as a counrty) just seem to be going round in circles for almost 10 years now... total insanity.
That's the problem with implimenting vast, sweeping changes from a microscopic majority from an advisory opinion poll, which is all the brexit vote was, legally speaking.
66.6% in favour of rejoining is a much more decisive majority, unlike the 51% majority that took us crashing out
It's not 66.6% in favour of rejoining, I thought it was clear it was 55%. There's 12% that don't care/don't know.
So exclude them and it's more like 60:40 - still substantially better than 52:48 but also still a very divisive issue.
And you're right that we have still to implement a lot, but equally we also 'left' and can't just go back to how everything was. That's why despite being pro-EU I'm on balance not for an immediate rejoin, rather in favour of accepting where we are and trying to get closer ties that can be achieved and can be beneficial.
But sure, produce a magic wand or a time machine, that gives us back what we have lost without having to go through the paralysing process of another referendum and then negotiation to still get nowhere near to where we were, and I'd be firmly with you.
Call me a brexiteer if you like, but we're out and our best course is now to seek stepwise alignments and closer ties.
What would be the point of 'rejoining' at this juncture?
Who do you think we would be returning to the European Parliament as our representatives?
If we were to have elections to a European Parliament, 'right' now, who do you think would benefit from that?
Until we can sort ourselves out, they're well rid. Why would they want us?
Who do you think we would be returning to the European Parliament as our representatives?
I don't think many people in the UK realised they could vote for our MEPs until Farage became a representative for fisheries and did (checks notes) absolutely nothing. On full expenses. And then complained very loudly that none of his European counterparts were listening to him in (checks notes again) the meetings he never bothered to turn up to.
It wasn't something that was really publicised, unlike local elections and general elections.
I suspect there would be a little bit more public scruitiny and interest in who our MEPs are, today.
No, no he doesn't. He's already shat on the country getting airtime in the US and there's no reason not to believe he can keep on doing that and still see support for Reform continue to grow.
People _will_ see his message (immigrant's fault, not racist, but...) as why there are so many problems and fall for it in exactly the same way that people will see what is happening in the US and still think Cheeto Benito is a disruptive outsider that will make their country leaner, better and with cheaper petrol than before.
rather in favour of accepting where we are and trying to get closer ties that can be achieved and can be beneficial.
Impossible to have anything of significance witout the 4 freedoms
Its a lot bigger majority than you say acvoding to the stuff i posted and that is with the Westminster parties all toeing the hard brexit line bar the lib dems with a tentative pro euope voice
Its a lot bigger majority than you say acvoding to the stuff i posted
I took the numbers directly from the link you posted https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/51484-how-do-britons-feel-about-brexit-five-years-on
Hopefully this doesn't get lost into formatting, to avoid retyping stuff take ++ to mean strongly support, + means support, - means oppose, etc.
"Britain having a closer relationship with the European Union, without rejoining the European Union, the Single Market, or the Customs Union
++ 24
+ 40
o 20
- 9
- - 6
"Britain rejoining the European Union
++ 39
+16
o 12
- 8
- -25
If you can turn that into anything other than 55% for and 33% against rejoin = 60:40ish then pls explain. And my point is that it's very divisive; the ++ and - - being the most confrontational, and also the largest factions. Put another way almost 2/3 of people feel strongly about rejoining; the third in the middle are the ones that would have to try to glue it together.
64:15 on a closer relationship has far less negativity and more than 80:20 in favour
Well Nigel Farage will be happy with this, the latest seat prediction claims that if there was a general election right now he would get an extra 170 MPs, one more than Labour, although three less than the Tories.
https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/blogs/ec_vipoll_20250207.html
Bearing in mind that Farage undoubtedly had some sort of control over the Reform UK candidates standing in the more winnable seats last July, I cannot begin to imagine what sort of muppet is likely to stand in the 175th most Reform winnable seat. I guess that we might eventually find out 😕
It's certainly interesting, I'm just hoping that the man frog manages to keel over before the next election kicks off. Not having the charismatic (the mind boggles) figure head would hopefully crash their support.
Well farage is going full nazi
"Strength through joy" i believe was the phrase
Are you sure that praising “Judeo-Christian culture” is going full Nazi?
Apologies fir the rubbish typing. Im doing this in the dark without my reading glasses
FFS calm down, debating EU membership on stw isn't that critical and urgent....... turn the lights on and find your reading glasses.
Clearly, otherwise they’d be taking all the care you’re suggesting, putting the light on and wearing their reading glasses.
The fact that they aren’t tends to suggest they’re pretty calm and they don’t feel it’s critical or urgent.
🤷🏼♂️
Is this the Lord Far Far that has specifically targeted European Judeo Christians to stop them coming to our country, while other faiths remain unaffected?
Is this the Lord Far Far that wants to remove my right to worship a Judeo Christian god by taking away my European Human Rights?
Nij-Al Farage ,the scourge of Christianity.
Are you sure that praising “Judeo-Christian culture” is going full Nazi?
Well, it certainly seems to be working for the Evangelical Nationalist Christians in North America, who are really only one stage from replacing the stars on the American flag with swastikas - it’s basically ’The Man In The High Castle’.
For those unfamiliar with the book, or who don’t read science fiction…
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Man_in_the_High_Castle
I see Liz Truss was touting her poisonous rhetoric on GBTv recently as well - can’t we truss (ha!) her and Farage up, chuck them into the hold of a transport plane and airfreight them to Arsehole, Indiana, without documentation and dump them somewhere?
I’m sure they’ll feel right at home.
On the four freedoms stuff - am I allowed to want my freedoms back? I liked having more freedom.
In fact, when it happens don’t call it the rejoin party call it the Freedom Party.
Are you sure that praising “Judeo-Christian culture” is going full Nazi?
Did you just not get which one TJAgain was referring to? There is a strong hint in the phrase used.
Although speaking of "Judeo-Christian". Didnt Jesus and family seek political asylum for a time (depending on which version you use) so maybe Farage will take a sudden switch in positions.
Are you sure that praising “Judeo-Christian culture” is going full Nazi?
Full Nazi, not exactly. Full racist dog-whistle, absolutely.
Apparently Nige is refusing to do Media, must be a first. i wonder what might have prompted this....
Did you just not get which one TJAgain was referring to? There is a strong hint in the phrase used.
Absolutely. I based my comment on this phrase which TJ used :
"Strength through joy" i believe was the phrase
That is obviously a historical reference to a slogan used by the Nazis in Germany.
The Nazis took the Judeo out of Judeo-Christian culture. They scrapped the Old Testament and rejigged the New Testament so there was no references to Jesus Christ being Jewish. In fact according to the Nazis Jesus was a Nordic Amorite who heroically fought the wicked Jews.
I think even Donald Trump would struggle to come up with something like that!
Other parties should be making more of the implied support of all the crazy stuff coming out of the US at the moment, by the honourable member for Clacton D.C.
I haven't seen any Farage or Reform responses to the latest pro-Russia craziness from the Orange Toddler. It's interesting that the right wing press in the UK and the usually rabid commentators underneath their articles are generally pro Ukraine. Presumably they feel they own this war after giving it government approved status so early on.
And the reality is that Ukraine is an issue of genuine cross party support, on which the various parties have broad agreement. It's Farage's closeness to trump that marks him out, and should be used to expose and embarrass him in the view of voters. The right wing media have an 'interesting' tight-rope to walk between trump-loving conservatism, and some of the unassailable facts. Will the Mail repeat its own inglorious past and become a parrot for a proto-fascist in the form of Trump and the Maga-b@stards? They will do if they follow them on their current trajectory...
I haven't seen any Farage or Reform responses to the latest pro-Russia craziness from the Orange Toddler.
He's been very quiet hasn't he. He's now emerged from whichever rock he's been under to state that we shouldn't take anything Trump says literally. I suppose thats his diplomatic toadying way of saying that Trump is talking complete bollox, as ever
Ed Davey probably summed it up best...
As ever, he made those defensive comments from...Washington.
always worth remembering Russian agents killing people in the UK, at least you know Farage is happy for this to happen.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-wiltshire-64742249
It's a ****ing sad day when Ed Davey is looking like the wise political statesman....
Blimey, I sincerely hope that Ed Davey is wrong. The very last thing that the Ukraine War (and Europe) needs is an escalation and more countries to be directly involved.
The whole idea of the UK sending "peacekeeping" troops to Ukraine where they are likely to come in direct contact with Russian troops is madness. Starmer has already pointed out that would need air support from the United States, something that would clearly not happen.
The UK and France are in no position to decide the outcome of this tragic conflict, to stand any chance of doing so would require at the very least United States involvement, if not a full-scale NATO attack.
Bearing in mind that Russia is nuclear armed, has vast territory sprawling a huge area of the world's land mass, and the lessons of Afghanistan and Iraq, it would be lunacy.
The Russian-Ukraine War is horrific and absolutely tragic, it needs to stop. De-escalation is the way forward, not pouring more petrol onto the fire. However unpalatable it might feel it will require concessions on all sides.... Russia, Ukraine, and NATO.
Russia's security concerns need to be addressed, Starmer's public announcements of the inevitability of Ukraine's NATO membership does nothing to help achieve that. NATO should have been wound down after the end of the cold war, not expanded. Now that seems even less feasible.
Still, we know that governments need a constant potential threat, real or unreal, to rally voters, and justify military spending.
Russia's security concerns need to be addressed,
Russia needs to get the f*** out of Ukraine, executing prisoners of war, of deporting children, look at Syria, at North Africa, Central Asia, at the cyber attacks on the Baltics. Sadly there is only one end, Western Tanks in Red Square.
Even a ceasefire today only means Russia rearms and comes back again. This war started in 2014, it has seen civilian airliners shot down.
Russia's security concerns need to be addressed,
Lols
Russias 'security concerns' have always been the flimsiest of pretexts for grabbing more land
After what happened last time you'd have to be incredibly naive to think that they won't use a truce to re-arm and come back again for mote. Which is why Ukraine need the sort of guarantees provided by peacekeepers of some sort, but with more backing than last time.
Russia's security concerns need to be addressed,
Russia's "security concerns" amount to hating the fact that all their former subjugated neighbours reject Rússkiy mir and look towards the West.