You don't need to be an 'investor' to invest in Singletrack: 6 days left: 95% of target - Find out more
We received a letter anonymously today saying that we have young children over every day (we don’t) and that they are really noisy and causing a disturbance (we are a normal family, no shouting, banging, loud music etc). The letter goes on to say that a number of other neighbours think its ‘terrible’ and that they are keeping records and will report it to the council if it goes on. It also says that ‘maybe isnt the right area’ for us.
Now upon reading this my wife (seven months preg with Brick no. 2) was very upset and got very stressed out. She’s been ill with chicken pox for the last fortnight and hasn’t seen anybody. She immediately wants to sell up and move etc..
I pretty much know who the letter is from and whilst the letter is not using abusive language, should I inform the police about it? For records sake in case it escalates? I realise they probably won’t spring into action and arrest the perp.
I rang the council who are sending the ASBO team round to talk to us, as they said its malicious behaviour.
I’m not sure what else to do, any ideas?
I wont be owning with bombers (strictly a Rock Shox man) nor weeing in their shoes!
poo in their shoes ?
where do you live....I'll come round and own them Kung fu panda stylee 😉
Go nuclear on their asses
To be truthful if anyone had upset my pregnant wife they would be scraping up the pieces
Firstly, re: noise complaint - playing children are exempt from any enforcement that council may want to do.
I'd co-operate with the ASBO team, ask them to visit whoever you think this is and let them explain the situation to them.
I might also consider putting the letter you have received with a covering note saying that you don't believe you are being excessively noisy but if anyone wishes to discuss it with you you're more than happy to do so. I'd wait and see what ASBO team say, though - no point in escalting too soon.
Noise is a very emotive subject and you have my sympathy.
That is harsh and it sdoes sound like gentle middle class bulying to me
Use the authorities as you have noted and as it is anoymous I would ignore it as the words of a coward who wont stand by their opinions [ assuming you are not a violent psycho]
Look after your wife and can yo get the neighbours onside about this, act all concerned and stuff and ask if it does annoy them? Explain how upset your heavily pregnant wife is with this sprt of hate mail etc. turn the tables so to speak
Spill the beans as well as there sounds like there is more if you have a suspect
personally, i would start and live up to the neighbours expectations.
paaarrrtttttyyyyy................ 8)
Survey your neighbours??
Politely of course... take them a pie if you wish.
Small-minded twerps are best ignored in my opinion.
Its nice to live in an area surrounded by nice neighbours but its also pretty easy to spend your whole life completely ignoring them, too. They can go through the proper channels and get the council/noise control involved but its a long drawn out process and I doubt they'll do anything anyway. On the other side are you definitely not causing any issues? It would be odd to complain over absolutely nothing and lots of parents have an ability to filter out any unruly behaviour by their children.
suddenly id find metal to grind up and start cutting sticks for the fire with the chainsaw - at social hours mind - im not a "complete" cock 😉
the sound of happy playing kids will be bliss to them then !
Put a note up on a lamp post stating you have forwarded the letter to the police and that you know your rights with regard to when noise is a nuisance .
Were the senders never children themselves for Christ sake? I'm assuming (maybe wrongly) that the note is from a pensioner/older person.Happy children make noise it's just part of growing up.
It takes forever for the council to do anything about noise nuisance in Leeds at least.We were keeping records for a couple of years(genuine noise nuisance) and still nothing got done.
Ignore them and carry on with your life.
Easier said than done, but it's likely to one miserable person who doesn't like kids (rather than include a 'a number of other neighbours').
It could be worse...it could be your neighbour who's noisy, now that's annoying.
Do you have a lot of retired people living near you?
That ^.
Rip it up, try and forget about it and carry on as normal. If someone isn't man enough to discuss any issue to your face then **** em.
Open dialogue, it's the only way. Be excessively nice, even if you don't like who you think it is.
Feuds are never any good.
Go round and knock on your neighbours doors. Ask them if they wrote the letter and whether there is a problem. Be polite, curteous and approachable. And be really really really firm on the point that YOU have the right to LIVE in your house and garden, not merely exist for fear of annoying someone.
Take the initiative. I bet they are fizzers.
also can be an issue when you come to sell, you're supposed to mention any disputes you've had so if you start getting people involved on your side that could create issues further down. I'd do a quick call around the houses, expressing surprise that they think you're too noisy, but what in particular is the concern and you'll see what you can do about it.
You'll probably find that they haven't got a problem and the anonymous coward that wrote the letter hasn't got anyone on his side after all.
I would invite every single person you know with kids over on Saturday for a slap up barbie, plenty of laughing screaming kids about the place. See if you can rent a bouncy castle or a trampoline.
Some people are miserable shits.
This is horrible passive agressive bullying and if there is one thing that make my piss boil it's a bully.
The sarcastic legal advise is move bad neighbours can't be changed to good neighbours by any agency be it police council or courts.
My personal suggestion is to make a copy of the letter for every neighbour you have. Personally visit each neighbour and have a low key chat, saying something to the effect that you have received the letter you are very concerned if they are upset or inconvenienced and you want to talk things through with them if they have any problems. That should give you some peace of mind and the poison pen author a sleepless night. If you do have a prime suspect I'd go to them last but hope they see you going to all the neighbours houses.
If you cannot beat them join them
Send out your own random complaining letters to all my neighbours & watch the fireworks start 😉
LOL @ ski 😀
So the note is anonymous, does it name you at all, or identify you by house number?
If not, drop it in the letter box of your main suspect unseen. They can't take the matter up with you without immediately giving away that they sent it or knew who did!
Send an anonymous letter to the neighbour you suspect that you've seen him peering through the window at children and that there are a number of neighbours who think its worrying.
leave it to the ASB officers - discuss with them what the options are but don't inflame the situation. It's amazing how many anti-social complaints we get that are incredibly pathetic (complaints re kids playing in the kids play park, playing football on the football pitch etc) - if your neighbours had a genuine complaint then they would have gone to the authorities themselves. In the meantime just go about your lives as per normal - it's probably some pathetic person who has no life of their own that is jealous of the fact that you have a life!
ski - Member
If you cannot beat them join themSend out your own random complaining letters to all my neighbours & watch the fireworks start
Posted 1 hour ago # Report-Post
Photocopy the letter, and add a note to the front of it saying that a faceless neighbour has been sending this letter round to you, dont put your name or address, but state the matter is now being handled by the police and the council, who are well aware of the writers address.
Alo sstate that your neighbours may be on the recieveing end of malicious mail in the future.
I would get a new vent for the house
http://arbroath.blogspot.com/2006/08/new-house-design-either-cactus-or.html
I'd wander round to your suspected neighbour and those near you who also might be impacted by the 'noise and disturbance' and politely ask them if they have an issue - be prepared to listen to and debate their issue - hopefully to some mutally agreeable solution if folks do identify an issue.
I have a daughter and her friends come round and play in our back garden and in the public areas - quite often noisily - but they also never venture onto others property and we also guide them to be considerate of others.
However sometimes folks don't consider or care about the impact of their actions on others and this is when it can get silly and out of control. Your kids have a right to play, but your neighbours also have a right to be comfortable in their own homes.
However, the neighbour with the issue should just have first talked to you about it....
I'd wander round to your suspected neighbour and those near you who also might be impacted by the 'noise and disturbance' and politely ask them if they have an issue - be prepared to listen to and debate their issue - hopefully to some mutally agreeable solution if folks do identify an issue.
+1
As can be demonstrated here, people have much larger balls when they can hide behind a screen or anonymous letters. No need to be confrontational. When everyone has denied it, problem gone.
+1 what crankboy said if it's upsetting your wife:
My personal suggestion is to make a copy of the letter for every neighbour you have. Personally visit each neighbour and have a low key chat, saying something to the effect that you have received the letter you are very concerned if they are upset or inconvenienced and you want to talk things through with them if they have any problems. That should give you some peace of mind and the poison pen author a sleepless night. If you do have a prime suspect I'd go to them last but hope they see you going to all the neighbours houses.
rockshox!! 😯
Posting the letter is wrong and the contents are unnecessary.
However, as someone said above, noise is a tricky issue.
Where we used to live noise travelled very easily and just having people talking at a normal level outside our house was aggravating at times.
Our neighbours were very nice and they were just going about their life in a normal way - kids in the garden, chatting with friends as they left in the evening. Nothing unacceptable at all.
It was still annoying to us though.
Open letter. Wipe bum with letter. Post letter back to prime suspect #1. Voilla 😛
Cheers for all the responses, boss let me go home early as i was distracted! -I've been round to a few neighbours and all are really nice and have no complaints (not to my face anyway). Still got two to do, and these are the two i suspect may be gossiping and in it together. Wife has calmed down and i'm of the opinion that i'm just going to carry on as normal. I'm def gonna speak to the last two though and mention i've told the old bill and council (which i have). Council were less than useless though.
I'm def gonna speak to the last two though and mention i've told the old bill and council
Nice one 🙂
What sort of area do you live in? Rural with older people? I'm surrounded by retired people and they're really friendly - and my 1 yr old son ain't too quiet.
Noisy people never think they are noisy - they always think they are normal. Did it ever cross your mind you are bad neighbours?
Write a letter back to your neighbours. Say that you received a letter from one of them anonymously and tell them what the ASBO people say or said to you. People that didnt send it may well out the other person....
visted my mates house last week and noted the noise his two 'little terrors' (6 and 2 years old) made when playing in their large back garden
actually really felt quite sorry for their elderly next door neighbour (they have a semi), but tbh his kids are just doing what kids at that age do
but i can't say i'd that chuffed at having them as a next door neighbour myself!
the screaming, shouting, laughing and crying **** me! the noise was unbelievable! (yep i don't have kids) - i'd never use my garden if my neighbours were that noisy and disruptive
obviously the letter has had a big impact on your pregnant wife, i'd go round to my neighbours and nicely explain the pain the letter has caused and that the council has been informed
its not really an ASBO thing though is it? seriously?
Personally long before I ever had kids I've always loved the sound of kids playing, kind of frees you from the shackles of the Victorian work ethic. Either way the OP has as right to have noisy kids and I hope the nasty neighbours get their comeuppance. All power to you Brick, I hope it works out well, you need to be calm and think tactically.
I am no fan of noisy kids but I do understand there are reasonable noisy kids and unreasonable ones. Kids got to be able to play outside but should not spend 12 hrs a day shrieking at the top of their voices.
so that to me is the crucial aspect - all kids will be noisy but are your kids unreasonably so?
actually really felt quite sorry for their elderly next door neighbour (they have a semi), but tbh his kids are just doing what kids at that age dobut i can't say i'd that chuffed at having them as a next door neighbour myself!
the screaming, shouting, laughing and crying **** me! the noise was unbelievable! (yep i don't have kids) - i'd never use my garden if my neighbours were that noisy and disruptive
it [b]is[/b] difficult. My two lads are 3 and 4 and they make a racket in the house and out in the garden too. Our neighbours seem pretty sound about it and claim that they 'can't hear anything' which is obviously bollocks. I think the reason they are sound is becasue they see and hear us actively trying to keep the disruption to a minimum and ensuring that we don't spend every weekend in the garden to ensure they get some quiet time over the weekend.
so that to me is the crucial aspect - all kids will be noisy but are your kids unreasonably so?
kids are all different. My eldest is a noisy little bugger and his little brother far quieter - when they are on their own. Together they sound like a viking horde. And actually which is worse? Kids being noisy or the sound of adults continously bollocking their kids for being noisy?
.Either way the OP has as right to have noisy kids
Hmm, I live in a semi (new ish and therefore thin walled)and had a similar debate about this with my neighbours recently. I had a few people round one evening (I hasten to add for the first time in 18 month living there), there was a bit of music and a bit of chat, nothing overly load but clearly load enough to be heard next door, it went on until about midnight. They complained and said that it wasn't acceptable and that it disturbed their 6 month old twins. I wasn't chuffed but I understand, it was a bit load and any distrubance is annoying.
However, apparently, those same twins waking me up at all hours of the night and day, generally followed by the parents arguing over who would feed/change/settle them is perfectly acceptable and not the same at all.
We have agreed to disagree...
hmmm they cannot actually choose to shut the twins up. You can choose to keep the noise down.
I love party but I also love my sleep and I will always make a point of making life easy for my neighbours, if you cannot empathise with them then you will always have trouble I'm afraid.
Sign the neighbour up for hardcore gay European pron.
hmmm they cannot actually choose to shut the twins up. You can choose to keep the noise down.
you are right but it works both ways.
he does not go round and complain about the twins and they should let one party per year go IMHO.
Sign the neighbour up for hardcore gay European pron
you liked your subscription then 😉
toys19, I agree. With hindsight it was a little loud, though it is obviously not a regular occurance. I also agree keeping the twins quiet is, at best, a challenge.
I suppose what I am saying is that it is not quite as clearcut as my neighbours would believe. I can live with the twins crying but it is the louder adult voices arguing that seemed to wake me up.
toys19 - Member
hmmm they cannot actually choose to shut the twins up. You can choose to keep the noise down.
Hmmm, Toys, I think we've done this before.
Why should your right to kiddy noise automatically trump my respectable murmmuring Bridge party?
Thing is, if you have 'six month old twins' and a very near neighbour, you've got a real brass neck to moan about a bit of noise from next door knowing full well, the kids will be making noise regularly and frequently through the night . Fair enough if it were Thrash Metal at 3am but...
It's called give and take not take, take, take.
Speak to the offending neighbour & try to sort amicably. Best way in long run.
Otherwise, Bombers!
Well I don't think he has a right to complain about the twins, do you think the twins parents want them to wake up in the middle of the night? So does anyone knocking on the door complaining help or make things better for any party? NO. In fact if I was the twins parents I would be pretty effed off with anyone complaining about it.
So when I finally do get them off to sleep the people next door has a party. I think I would complain too.
Lunge
I can live with the twins crying but it is the louder adult voices arguing that seemed to wake me up.
This would eff me off royally too, when my kids were doing nocturnal wailings we made a point of being dead quiet and often buttered up the neigbours to aplogise (although no one ever complained, we have 26 houses in our street 19 of which with kids under ten...)
Agreed. I think both parties might feel aggrieved but in the circumstances, would be better off keeping their grievences to themselves assuming it were a few friends once in 18 months.
Personally I wouldn't moan if it was my kids, but I would also apologise profusely if it was my party, a little bit of niceness goes a long way. So if my neighbours moaned at me I will always apologise and try to make good even if I think it was unjustified as a friend is better than an enemy.
Regardless of who's right or wrong anybody who sends a letter like that rather than having a quiet, polite word is a k**b. I'd go round and have a strong, firm but polite word and put them in their place, your going to have to accept that you'll never see eye to eye on this. You can't reason with the unreasonable.
Come on Brick whats the outcome?
Always two sides.
My in laws are moving house at the moment and taking a massive financial hit to get away from noisy neigbours. The noisy neighbours from my perspective are just loud families with boisterous kids who behave like boisterous kids. They do scream across the garden fence at each other (they have sets with kids either side) but there is nothing personal about it.
But.. my in-laws are typical retireds and a bit out of touch with living around children. They also chose to buy a house in a road that was obviously going to be full of families. Should they feel the right to relax in their garden without getting a headache - of course they should. Should the kids in the area be allowed to be kids and do kids type stuff - yes too. Consideration and putting yourself in the other's shoes is only way to a harmonious steet.
With regard to the "bullying letter" - having not read it, it is difficult to say but could the actions of a boisterous neighbour not be considered intimidating or bullying if they are older or quieter? Maybe they feel too intimidated to talk face to face. I'm sure you are not but from their perspective could you be considered the bullies?
actually really felt quite sorry for their elderly next door neighbour (they have a semi)
That's disgusting!
Hmm, I live in a semi (new ish and therefore thin walled)and had a similar debate about this with my neighbours recently. I had a few people round one evening (I hasten to add for the first time in 18 month living there), there was a bit of music and a bit of chat, nothing overly load but clearly load enough to be heard next door, it went on until about midnight. They complained and said that it wasn't acceptable and that it disturbed their 6 month old twins. I wasn't chuffed but I understand, it was a bit load and any distrubance is annoying.However, apparently, those same twins waking me up at all hours of the night and day, generally followed by the parents arguing over who would feed/change/settle them is perfectly acceptable and not the same at all.
I dunno if it's like our house, but our 1790s house shares wooden beams etc. with next door, the two houses interlock. You can basically hear most stuff. They (infrequently) have loud parties. My opinion on it is that up till about 11 is cool on a school night, and up till maybe midnight on a weekend evening. 2am at the 17 year old daughter's birthday party on a school night had me round complaining to the dad the next day (he'd stayed over somewhere else, leaving a bunch of kids to drink and take drugs, play loud music and swear at the neighbours!)
We have a baby too. I think that babies are just a fact of life, so I don't think it is okay to have a problem with babies waking up at night, but we would ourselves be as quiet as possible when going to her, and also go to her pretty quick, because we know the walls let a lot of sound through.
why would they say children are visiting your house if they arent?
it doesnt add up
Well I don't think he has a right to complain about the twins, do you think the twins parents want them to wake up in the middle of the night? So does anyone knocking on the door complaining help or make things better for any party? NO. In fact if I was the twins parents I would be pretty effed off with anyone complaining about it.
of course not everyone has a remote control for their kids [ 4 & 6 so yes they make some noise]. think they also sais the parents arguing and shouting at each othe rover whose turn it was also woke him more than the kids so they may have a point tbh.
I can hardly complain if my neighbour has a party once every 18 mths if my household wakes him up twice per week. Like he said it was a"quiet" party that ended at 12
Give and take tbh in my book.
The letter we received was, frankly, boll*cks. It claimed that we had had children over every day the last two weeks and then 'parties' on both sundays. My missus has had chickenpox the past two weeks and has seen NONE of her friends. The week before she was rough too and the week before we were away on hols. Whatever they are recording, if anything, is a fiction.
We did have my in laws over last weekend for a barbie and so had one child (my two year old)in the garden. Last weekend we had some old friends round and they have a four year old boy (noisier than ours and not as well behaved) who did scream a bit admittedly, and a nine month old who isn't talking yet and slept most of the 5 hours they were over. Maybe this is what the fuss is over. The neighbours were in their inflatable pool all afternoon. If it was noisy it would have been easy to say so.
Whenever wifey has friends over in the week its normally a wednesday and from 2pm (after 2 year olds' nap) until 4pm, usually to give wifey time to put the tea on etc. This is the extent of the garden usage most weeks. Most of the time wifey takes daughter out to playgroups or classes.
I can't emphasise enough how this has shocked us, because of how much bullsh1t it is full of.
one poster above mentioned his neighbours who were mid fifties or whatever and had lost touch with the realities of having kids; this is exactly what i think has happened here.
Even so, i don't think there is any excuse for what was written in the letter. its pretty nasty.
I'm going to ask the final two neighbours if they have 'heard' any other neighbours complaining about noise from us. Maybe they will fess up to the letter. If not i'll just carry on as if it never arrived in the first place but i've asked all the neighbours if there's a problem. Hopefully that'll be the end of it.
Noisy people never think they are noisy - they always think they are normal. Did it ever cross your mind you are bad neighbours?
Possibly this.
However possibly mistaken ID? I got a note from the animal welfare people telling me there had been a report of barking and ill treated animals kept at my home. I don't have any animals and I'd only lived there a month or two lol.
The neighbours were in their inflatable pool all afternoon.
Clearly not middle class bullying then 😀
I'm going to ask the final two neighbours if they have 'heard' any other neighbours complaining about noise from us.
... with the gambit of "well, I just don't understand why they didn't say anything!" - I doubt anyone will 'fess up if they didn't sign it in the first place, but it might encourage them to speak up next time rather than behaving like schoolchildren.
Anonymous letters are always unacceptable and should be considered both sinister and threatening, specially when they contain stuff like "we're keeping records" and "we don't think this is the right area for you".
The OP's behaviour is not the issue here imo.
Clearly not middle class bullying then
lol
They ( the neighbours ) are comitting assault ( remember boys and girls, it doesnt have to be actual physical violence to be assault ). I'd inform the police, just so its on file with them, let the ASBO team do their thing then take it from there. Having been on the end of such behaviour, I wouldnt stand for any nonsense.
They ( the neighbours ) are comitting assault
How's that then?
I have next door neighbours that have noisy kids. Asian family with two young boys around 3/4/5ish. They are regularly screaming, yelling and banging doors at 11pm onwards and their parents seem to let them get away with it. I can hear screams of "No No No No!!! from the little darlings and i've seen them (over the fence) run out into the garden with no pants on and pee in the yard right outside their back door.
All came to a head when i heard a banging noise outside when i had the back door open. Went outside and couldn't see anything, then heeard it again. The little sods were in their bathroom throwing rubbish (used batteries, empty cans etc) into my garden and at my cats.
I went and had a stern word about it, telling them that any damage, any vet bills would be paid for by them (to the parents obviously) and that it really had not better happen again.
I live alone, so i'm quiet as a church mouse most of the time and because of work i'm up no later than 11pm. If the noise gets too bad though, the stereo comes on...
I'd put a fair amount of money on no other neighbours have thought it was 'terrible' or have indeed noticed anything. They'll have been assuming their thoughts are indeed the representation of the populous (bit like STW people then... :P)
The worrying part of the letter is the hint to move out.
How to deal with feuding neighbours:
to do deal with feuding neighbours:
+1 @ Ernie
Turn your place into a clubhouse for the local Hells Angels chapter.
thegreatape - MemberThey ( the neighbours ) are comitting assault
How's that then?
Fear of attack.
It's the battery that forms the physical component.
Probably somewhat inaccurate, A Level law was a loooooooong time ago.
But to assault someone you have to do something that causes them to fear immediate unlawful violence. So you can't assault someone by letter - that's not immediate. Furthermore, going by the first post, there isn't anything in the letter that could reasonably be construed as a threat of violence.
Well, the letter was written with the blood of their beloved cocker spaniel
😯
My apologies, I overlooked that 😳
My one comment here would be not to tell the suspects that they have upset your wife, its possible they really do want you out of the neighbourhood and it may encourage them to know they have caused harm, sadly bullies tend to get off on upsetting victims.
Ever since we spoke to the last of the other neighbours, we haven't seen hide nor hair of who we think sent the letter. We're assuming word got back about the rozzers and council involvement and has ruffled their feathers somewhat. Or they are ashamed of themselves (as they should be).
Glad to hear that, some people can really be spineless little *****