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I've thought long and hard about posting this. I've come close a few times recently for obvious reasons but have held back I think mostly because I do not see myself, nor want to be seen as, a victim. Something happened today that makes me realise it's time to be honest and so I'm about to click submit and hope this doesn't back fire. Here goes.
There was a point in my life, around my mid 20s, where I was so desperate to be loved by someone that I found myself in a relationship that can only be described as abusive. To be clear, what I am saying here is that I have been subject to we all know and understand to be ‘domestic abuse’ including violence.
It’s important to understand that at the time it never occurred to me that what was happening was wrong; even when the abuse became physical, the only thought process that went through my head was ‘how can I prove to her that I love her and am worthy of her’. The worse things got, the more I tried to prove my worth to her.
The relationship followed a pattern of abuse that began as slightly controlling, slightly obsessive behaviour, progressed into the very definition of coercive controlling behaviour and culminated in actual physical abuse. I should qualify that last part by saying the physical abuse was slapping, usually around my face but never rough enough to leave marks. That aspect of it was, like the coercive controlling behaviour, not about inflicting pain, but rather about power and control. It was a symbolic slap as much as it was a physical one; it said, ‘I can do this to you and there’s nothing you can do about it’.
The particular circumstances of the relationship are relevant. This was someone I worked with. She initiated the relationship, which started as her trying to seduce me on various work nights out and in response to which I denied her for several months. I did this because I knew she was in a long term relationship. But she was incredibly attractive and very persistent and I was desperate to be wanted and loved by someone, so in the end I got together with her on the understanding that she would break up with her boyfriend after they got back from a pre-existing holiday four month in the future.
Needless to say that she never broke up with him. I spent 18 months with her hoping she would and being subject to a constant tirade of denigration, belittling, accusations, jealousy, manipulation etc, all based around me being a bad person and not capable of being either faithful or loving, which is kind of ironic really. She would question where I had been, who I was with and what i was doing. I wasn't allowed to be with certain people who were my friends at the time and if I did something she didn't like, she would fly into a violent rage and scream and spit at me. That was when the slapping also started.
The end result of this is that my mental health really suffered. I started getting crippling headaches that got worse over time. I ended up having scans to check for anything physical and it was only when they came back as all clear did the consultant then end up diagnosing this as being stress related. The relationship ended about that time and I managed to move on and get closure from her even though I still had to work with her. At that time, she also ended up in a relationship with another work colleague. Rather tragically I think, she ended up marrying the guy she had been with the whole time.
While people were aware that I was in a difficult relationship at that time, I’ve never told anyone about the true extent of what really happened. The timing for coming clean about this now is not entirely coincidental given that I’ve become very vocal on the subject of gender recently. This post isn’t about proving anything other than the fact that far more men are victims of domestic abuse and violence than people are prepared to acknowledge. In my own close circle of friends I know of four other men who have had experiences like mine and some far worse besides.
All abuse of any kind, casual, domestic, stranger or otherwise, is abhorrent. It should all be condemned, it is all a vile corruption of the humanity and respect we are all capable of and that we should aspire to. I am categorically not a victim and do not want nor need sympathy from anyone. But what I do want, is for other men to feel that they can admit what might have happened to them also, maybe not here on this thread, but to themselves and perhaps to their close friends.
Copy the text to notepad or something first, then paste in here. Should get rid of the word stuff.
Brave post. Thanks for sharing.
I read about another man's similar (ongoing I believe) situation on Pistonheads.
You're right - control and abuse of power is at the heart of these things. You'll never change someone like that so well done for getting out.
Props for sharing and well done for standing up and getting out.
+1 for the OP's bravery in posting.
As correctly pointed out, an abusive relationship is always about power and control. While not quite as terrible as the OP's situation, I've bailed from a couple of relationships in the past which were bordering on being abusive and have never looked back.
Well done for sharing, this place can be great for telling randomers stuff you hardly tell anyone...
I've been there, was controlled and cut off from most of my friends for years. She would ring me and demand I came home work for some stupid reason and if I said I can't she would ring my works number 50+ times just hanging up when someone answered until I phoned her back so she could threaten me...
only ended last year and we have kids together so I still have to see her which doesn't help.
I'm much happier now without her but the worst part is as I have the kids and there are ongoing court proceedings over that she has told everyone I was the abusive one and that was why she left (she was seeing someone else was the real reason)
I hope that you are able to get some catharsis from posting that geetee. I have a friend who seems to have had a very bad childhood and while he hasn't explicitly told me that he's been in abusive relationships reading between the lines I strongly suspect this is the case. He was forced to leave his job because he rejected the advances of one of his female collegues and was then bullied and ultimately assaulted by his next employer after that and I feel as though there is something in his personality that makes him vulnerable to people who would abuse him, either physically or mentally.
Not saying that's the case with you, but I'm often reminded of him when I read your posts and it helps to bear in mind that we shouldn't make sweeping assumptions about people.
I think men need a type of #metoo moment but I don't think society is there at the moment. I find it unfortunate that the male rights movement just seems to be an anti-femanism movement, rather than the equality for all movement it should be. The very fact that men can be subjected to domestic abuse seems to be denied by so many. Well done for speaking out and moving on with your life.
Fascinating insight, i know someone who i am a bit concerned about. A few telltale signs and i have asked a few open questions but got nowhere. It must be incredibly hard when you love someone to admit there is a problem. Strangely i know both husband and wife and its probably cognitive bias but i can see the suspect traits in both.
Good luck op btw.
I feel as though there is something in his personality that makes him vulnerable to people who would abuse him
Well I would say two things to that.
The first is that it is well documented in the experiences of female victims of DV that this does indeed happen. I could be wrong about this, but I think there is some research that shows if a woman has been a victim once, there is a significantly increased risk of it happening again. Since I do not believe the problem of DV is uniquely specific to either gender (which is not the same as saying that the frequency is equally distributed, though it might be) it seems logical to suggest that the same increased risk applies to men as well as women.
Secondly, as I've mentioned on here before, this isn't my first experience of 'abuse' though it is my first experience of 'domestic abuse'.
Of course, we need to be very careful in discussing that lest we end up in the realm of victim blaming.
It sounds like you dated someone with narcissistic personality disorder and / or a psychopath.
Someone on here recently recommended the book 'The Body Keeps thee Score' by Van Der Kolk. It's absolutely brilliant in its surveys of the experience of abuse and advise for dealing with it, get it.
I don't think there's any danger of victim blaming. If someone male/female/other has personality traits or tendencies that someone sees, then takes advantage of, either by bullying, mental, physical or emotional abuse then that makes the abuse even more egregious.
To elaborate briefly the "something" in my friends' case , superficially at least, is that he's very easy going and doesn't cope well with conflict, even disagreements. I could see a mile away that he was being exploited, even bullied by his boss and I pestered him for a year to come to my brazilian jiu-jitsu club - not to defend himself, rather if he was confident in his ability to strangle his boss unconscious he might be able to stand up to him.
I never imagined that he would actually get attacked and beaten up by his boss when he finally stood up for himself that's exactly what happened. At the time I considered starting a thread here but since it wasn't my personal experience it didn't feel right to do so.
Sorry to hear you went through that GT. Sounds horrible.
Not anywhere near as bad but I think my relationship with my ex-wife ended up becoming abusive on her part. Strangely I don't think she's a 'bad person' as in she has good intentions and is generally a moral person, but she's very irritable/angry/hyper-critical of anything that isn't exactly how she wants it to be, and generally refused to accept this, blaming it all on me. Either it was my fault she was angry, or she denied being angry and accused me of being over-sensitive etc.
The level and frequency of criticism and some pre-existing self-esteem issues meant even though we would argue I just pretty much accepted what she said internally.
She would strongly deny all this of course.
Not anywhere near as bad but I think my relationship with my ex-wife ended up becoming abusive on her part.
Well I think it's important not to frame things along the lines of one person's problem being worse or more deserving of sympathy than another's; your experience sounds like it was hard for you and it's important to acknowledge that.
I don't know at what point a difficult relationship becomes abusive though; perhaps as men we're less likely to reach that conclusion and end up putting up with a lot more abuse than we admit to ourselves, which is one of the reasons why I think acknowledging your/our/my experiences is important.
But what you describe is a pattern of experience/behaviour I've heard a lot from other people.
I hope you're in a better place now.
Really brave post geetee, well done for opening up about it.
A lot of blokes have had relationships with controlling partners and it's a fine line before it tips over into abuse, either emotional, financial or physical. But it seems harder for men to speak up about it.
Well done for speaking up Geetee. It makes me realise that I was probably emotionally abused in my 1st marriage. You know, the one where you can't have a discussion about something important without it turning into an argument where she gets 'upset' & I get the silent treatment for 3 days?
12 years I put up with that shit!
It gets better though pal, don't worry.
I suspect that abuse of make partners (more mental than physical perhaps) is more common than society is currently willing to acknowledge. I too suffered in my first marriage - mostly her belittling me in front of her friends in various ways, but backed up by other behaviours too.
I doubt that will be of much solace to you, though it might just help your own state of mind to know that "it's not you".
Well done geetee for sharing this.
I was emotionally (and physically) abused by my first wife, it went on so long that I considered it normal to be attacked with a kitchen knife.
she regularly told me that she could easily find someone else but that I couldn’t because. I believed it of course.
eventually, after a decade of accusations of cheating (ive never cheated on any of my partners) she had an affair with a guy she knew.
we split up, and tbh it was a relief.
14 years later, im married to a very nice woman who I met at work, we’ve barely had a cross word in the 13 years we’ve been together and life is basically good.
Nobody, regardless of gender/age/ethnicity/religion or anything else, deserves to be abused, whether its physical or not.
Well done GeeTee. Must have been difficult.
Psychological/emotional abuse is now classed the same as domestic violence and can result in a prison sentence.
Well done OP. I have a mate that went through it, and even worse, had kids. The missus tried her best to poison the kids against him. It's starting to work out again for him and he has re-married and the kids are realising what a horrible person their mum was.
Having worked with DV victims its not really the case that male is undereported [ anymore than female is] and whilst we are having this cathartic moment lets remember women are much more likely to be the victim than the perpetrator [ 85-15%]
IME the vast majority of male perpetrators solved all conflict/issues/problems with violence[ including domestic ones] and were just violent people. How they treated their partner was largely how they treated everyone.
not my experience at all and i am not sure why you said /feel like this.The very fact that men can be subjected to domestic abuse seems to be denied by so many.
respect to Geeteee makes some of your posting make sense
I would imagine every person has had a shit relationships and we can all think of examples within them , and at the end, that were "abusive".
Well done for sharing fella.
I was in an abusive relationship for about 4 years and can relate to 95% of that post. Never realised until I'd got out, looking back it's hard to believe I was so blind to it.
The only real difference is that it was rarely physical, except once late on in the relationship. I was knelt on the floor sorting computery things out whilst (naturally) having an argument, I confessed to kissing another girl and she took a golf swing at my head with the keyboard. Damn near knocked me out. Granted I wasn't blameless, but I think she finally realised that she'd actually gone too far that time.
Very well done for posting. As a society we need to talk about this shit more. Men are socially programmed from an early age to suppress their emotions and being on the receiving end of domestic abuse rather than our more traditional role gets swept under the carpet.
Thanks for posting geetee1972. I think this happens more than people realise and threads like this help. I had an abusive and controlling girlfriend many years ago and it took some considerable time to be open about it - in fact long after I ended the relationship...
Having worked with DV victims its not really the case that male is undereported
How can you measure something that someone doesn't tell you? For your next trick are you going to disprove god?
I don't know about "denied" or "under-reported" but it is most definitely under-discussed. There's a stigma attached to it. How much of a 'man' are you if you're getting abused by a woman? Quell those emotions, MTFU. Of course women being on the receiving end is more common, no-one is saying otherwise, but that doesn't mean we should just ignore the 15%.
I'm genuinely surprised at you here JY. For someone who's worked with victims, I'm stunned that your immediate reaction to a thread on the subject is to start picking holes in what's being said (especially given that no-one's said it's under-reported, though I was about to). Do you want to go out and come back in again?
probably need to read the bit in parenthesis to fully understand
I did not mean to derail the thread into a STW bicker so i will comment no further.
All sounds sadly familar
recently divorced from mine, she also insisted that I was the abusive one, even got legal aid!!! as she had bruises on her wrists from where I'd held her as she was attacking me as i left. Courtwas a joke despite repeated reports from professionals saying she was intentionally poisening the kids against me she still gets them and i don't see them, i have to hope that as they grow up they'lll see her true colours.
Hopefully the house sells soon and I can take my 20% and start over somewhere.
Still I'm riding my bikes loads more now 🙂
>Cougar
I’m genuinely surprised at you here JY. For someone who’s worked with victims, I’m stunned that your immediate reaction to a thread on the subject is to start picking holes in what’s being said (especially given that no-one’s said it’s under-reported, though I was about to). Do you want to go out and come back in again?
You're surprised??????? Just to bring you up to speed Cougar, men's rights is a right wing topic. If you're a man, especially a white man, and really especially a white middle class man in the western world you cannot be victimized in any way because of your white privilege . If you disagree you are obviously right wing. Which makes you alt right. Which means you're a Nazi. Sorry. Seems hyperbolic but that's the new reality we live in. I guess you haven't noticed the way he attacks every thread, poster or topic that disagrees in any way shape or form with his political world view like a rabid animal? A kind assessment would be to use a term like troll, or provocateur but they're not really applicable since he actually seems to believe what he posts. What was it he posted recently, Jordan Petterson is mental because he links feminism to Marxism? Words to that effect.
It's hard to see where lies stop and the delusion starts. If you haven't noticed this I guess you must be drinking the same Koolaid as him, which is worrying.
The fact that he couldn't resist sticking his political oar in, to contradict, belittle and provoke even on a thread about such a personal experience shows that there's no depths to which he won't sink in order to attack or bully people who he sees as his "enemy" politically.
women are much more likely to be the victim than the perpetrator [ 85-15%]
A sizeable portion of that 85% will also themselves be perpetrators of DV. This can be lost in the statistics as they are not as good at inflicting injuries as their (mostly) male partners. When such an incident occurs it is normally marked as the woman being the victim, not both.
Full respect to GeeTee. I couldn't be the first to bring that up, I can only follow,
I get pushed about by my missus, not physically but there's little I do that is not dependent on her approval. The way she "controls" me is not even a blatant thing. I love her and she's one of the very few people whose opinion of me I care about and it's the disapproving sounds, gestures and lack of interest in my plans that sway me. There's also the fear, yes fear, of something she assumed me to mean/want/be hiding being brought up days/weeks/months later to try to shut me down. Yeah it sounds pathetic but our situation is an odd one. She has just started working from home after many years of me fully supporting her following a serious head injury. She still suffers from it and probably will for life and so I give her slack but it's never enough.. I have lost my temper with her many times and did strike her once, it wasn't for control or to establish dominance, it was pure rage at her behaviour towards me. When I do lose my rag she says she needs a man not a boy, that sorta stuff, as if an outburst is more childish than mind games.. Someone's going to get hurt and I need to prevent that. But I can't chuck her out, she's not a citizen and can't support herself neither physically or financially. It is up to me though, one of the few things that feel like they are.
That sounds really tough going lazlowoodbine. I think you need to go have a chat with someone professionally to see what your options are. I don't think anyone should sacrifice their own happiness for others.
Post deleted, copying from an Apple note fail
Yes I do, as does anyone in a similar situation. Please be more proactive than I am.
men’s rights is a right wing topic
"Men's rights activists" are generally right-wing nutjobs who are a threat to their own swiveleyesation. People who don't understand the difference between equality and equity. But that's got the square root of **** all to do with anything on this thread.
Seems hyperbolic but that’s the new reality we live in.
It might be the reality you live in but it's a fiction.
Brave post OP. Other than my therapist (and that took a long time) I've not been able to tell anyone what happened in my relationship. It's cost me my mental health, my career and my friends. Hopefully one day I'll be as strong as the OP and be able to tell people what was happening - until then it's one day at a time and trying to rebuild a life. Despite the progress I've made since leaving there's still a long way to go.
Why are you (OP) “categorically” not a victim, when you describe as such other people who have the same experience?
Want to say so much more, but well done.
Men need to open up and talk about so many things and not be embarrassed.
Here is a good place.
Write here OP but please feel free to message me.
I can be a sounding board for most things.
Writing things out can help.
You’re surprised??????? Just to bring you up to speed Cougar, men’s rights is a right wing topic...
and here goes the STW bickerathon JY gracefully ducked out of the thread to avoid happening. Dare I suggest that's a bit of a Pavlovian response from you there jimjam?
You snowflakes have to stick together eh?
Did I miss something?
Jimjam complaining about JY sticking his oar in, by sticking his oar in...
same old same old.
Why are you (OP) “categorically” not a victim, when you describe as such other people who have the same experience?
Because being a victim is a state of mind and it's not my state of mind; the experience was horrible but I still today don't feel like I'm a victim because of that any more than I feel that what happened to me in primary school makes me a victim. It happened, it was horrible but it didn't kill me and I learned something very important from it. This might sound very odd but I actually feel I learned a lot from the experience even if I rather it hadn't happened.
Jimjam complaining about JY sticking his oar in, by sticking his oar in…
I get where JimJam is coming from and am obviously sympathetic to it; my own position on this subject is very well documented but hopefully it is now more apparent that when I say anything that looks or sounds a bit MRA, it's not because I want to denude women's rights or empowerment, it is entirely because I feel strongly that there are things that affect men because they are men and we don't take them seriously enough as a society.
Junky much as we've had extreme disagreements in the past I still would value your engagement and respect what you have to say. I think you've been incredibly gracious in your response here but would encourage you to speak up.
Cougar
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</div>men’s rights is a right wing topic
“Men’s rights activists” are generally right-wing nutjobs who are a threat to their own swiveleyesation. People who don’t understand the difference between equality and equity. But that’s got the square root of **** all to do with anything on this thread.
Thanks for reinforcing my point for me.
[quoteSeems hyperbolic but that’s the new reality we live in.
It might be the reality you live in but it’s a fiction.
I obviously meant political reality/current affairs culture but thanks for deliberately conflating that and turning it into an ad-hom. I see my point was well made, perhaps you genuinely were surprised by Junkyard being Junkyard. I guess I shouldn't be surprised.
A sizeable portion of that 85% will also themselves be perpetrators of DV. This can be lost in the statistics as they are not as good at inflicting injuries as their (mostly) male partners. When such an incident occurs it is normally marked as the woman being the victim, not both.
Source please and evidence- I assume you have seen some research you can link to
One factual point if i may-
Jordan Petterson is mental because he links feminism to Marxism? Words to that effect.
I said anyone who thinks like this is a loon[ colloquial sense not a diagnosis] . Despite the number of personal attacks on me no one chose to defend this, including you, as an accurate account of reality.Do you want to this time or just ad hom me again?
I will never use words I hate, like the trendy and artificially constructed words "zhe" and "zher." These words are at the vanguard of a post-modern, radical leftist ideology that I detest, and which is, in my professional opinion, frighteningly similar to the Marxist doctrines that killed at least 100 million people in the 20th century.I have been studying authoritarianism on the right and the left for 35 years. I wrote a book, Maps of Meaning: The Architecture of Belief, on the topic, which explores how ideologies hijack language and belief. As a result of my studies, I have come to believe that Marxism is a murderous ideology. I believe its practitioners in modern universities should be ashamed of themselves for continuing to promote such vicious, untenable and anti-human ideas, and for indoctrinating their students with these beliefs. I am therefore not going to mouth Marxist words. That would make me a puppet of the radical left, and that is not going to happen. Period.[69
whatever the transgender movement is [ IMHO an attempt to get people to be treated with respect and dignity] is not a radical marxist ideology and you are not a puppet if you call someone by their preferred term. If you think it is you dont have the greatest perspective as your radical right wing political view clouds your ability to see reality. No one defended what he said but plenty attacked me for simply quoting him- it is the STW way- even on another thread days after.
broken irony meter picture goes here.thanks for deliberately conflating that and turning it into an ad-hom
That is a lie my post made four factual points and none of them were political, any of which you could have chosen to address rather than get personal, at all. I have no idea how it could be seen as bullying. Good job I did not do what you did eh you would be apoplectic with rage. So many on here do what they are complaining aboutThe fact that he couldn’t resist sticking his political oar in, to contradict, belittle and provoke even on a thread about such a personal experience shows that there’s no depths to which he won’t sink in order to attack or bully people who he sees as his “enemy” politically.
FFS let it go man let it go.
thanks but even when leaving some seem determined to discuss me rather than your important subject so apart from this defence and a Mleh I think its best if i dont feed jim jam. I doubt that will stop him critiquing me personally- probably still due to my flaws and not his 😉I think you’ve been incredibly gracious in your response here but would encourage you to speak up.
FWIW GT i see you as on some sort of very public route to "recovery" as you explain the reasons for your views publicly. I think its very brave of you to do so and positive that men can discuss emotional topics openly. Man hugs all round as i dont agree with you but i do respect you.
Well done mate. Brave post.
Once again this place brings out the best in people.
Man hugs all round as i dont agree with you but i do respect you.
I appreciate that thank you.
I am however convinced that you and I will agree on far more than we disagree on. Really I do.
Courtwas a joke despite repeated reports from professionals saying she was intentionally poisening the kids against me she still gets them and i don’t see them, i have to hope that as they grow up they’lll see her true colours.
And that is why I suspect a lot of people put up with situations that otherwise they wouldn't dream of.
Perhaps there needs to be a #mentoo campaign – quite often abuses of men goes unreported.
When such an incident occurs it is normally marked as the woman being the victim, not both.
I've no idea if this is true, but it sounds plausible to me because of this: I had a psycho-girlfriend girlfriend for a while at Uni. One one occasion she full on attacked me in a jealous rage. During the encounter I did nothing except try to hold her arms to stop her hitting me. At the end of the encounter I had some very minor finger nail scratches and a bruise on my arm. In contrast, she had a massive black eye where she'd bashed her eye socket on my skull.
As it happened some of her friends and mine were present to witness the whole thing so there was no dispute over what happened. If there hadn't been and the Police had been involved I'd guess they would assume I was the aggressor. I've no idea if it gets noted down as such, but I'd guess it sometimes could, otherwise every wife beater could just claim to be the victim who just happened to come off better in the encounter.
Because being a victim is a state of mind and it’s not my state of mind
I knew what you were implying. Being a victim is not a state of mind; feeling victimised is. You already know this as you'll comfortably refer to as victims people who have been through something similar. You can't change the fact that you have been a victim of something, that you allowed something to happen to you and/or that you were powerless. Acknowledging and metabolising that is a significant part of the healing process, and it seems from most of your posting history that you've missed it out. You're saying the words you think you should be saying - "I am not a victim" - but your expressions/actions do not agree. I wonder if you've forgiven yourself.
I've said this before - ironically, you laughed at it and had it deleted - but you have to be very, very careful when you choose to go down such an extroverted, egoistic route to some sense of recovery, using others to fight your way to or defend conclusions - it's like people who hang around in shopping areas to convince people that they need Jesus. I sincerely wish that you make it to a place where you feel your history is resolved, just don't forget that you have a responsibilty to others, and indeed yourself, to arrive there alone.
This might sound very odd but I actually feel I learned a lot from the experience even if I rather it hadn’t happened.
Seriously? It would only sound odd if I'd never experienced anything in my entire life and was also completely unaware of even the concept of experience.
You already know this as you’ll comfortably refer to as victims people who have been through something similar.
Yes fair point but I do that out of respect for not knowing how they feel about it; I don't want to deny the right to feel like you're a victim or be regarded as such just because I don't feel it applies to me (or want to be seen that way).
There's something in the (male) psyche though that almost certainly resists the title anyway and that's something we should talk about; my reluctance to see myself as a victim is tied up in many things; the belief that it's not OK to be male and a victim, the sense that being a victim is associated with being helpless and that's not compatible with masculinity, that it's associated with being weak for the same reason, that I lerned at a very young age to be self sufficient, self reliant etc, again these are likely to be masculine traits. It's all important to discuss so this isn't a polemic, this is just important debate.
but you have to be very, very careful when you choose to go down such an extroverted, egoistic route to some sense of recovery,
Well I'm not doing it for that reason but that's OK because of course it might look like that. I'm saying these things because other people aren't and look at the response on this thread; this will be just a fraction of the stories just like this that aren't getting told. There is a massive untold problem out there and I'm sick to the back teeth of being told by people that it isn't a problem (which does happen). This personal confession is also very cathartic though.
it’s like people who hang around in shopping areas to convince people that they need Jesus.
I might have read your suggestion wrong so forgive me if I did but it sounds like you're suggseting that what I am doing is attention seeking and that's not usually a good thing. I'm sure you're not saying that though so I must have misunderstood you.
Nevertheless, isn't this public expression of our experiences and the wrongs we've been subject to precisely what's happening right now with things like the #metoo campaign; and isn't that an important process?
I said anyone who thinks like this is a loon[ colloquial sense not a diagnosis] . Despite the number of personal attacks on me no one chose to defend this, including you, as an accurate account of reality.Do you want to this time or just ad hom me again?
You continually refer to being insulted where no insult is given while you infer that someone else is a lunatic. You've posted the same quote (and your assessment) at least five times by my count, and despite the fact that every time you do, you are reminded that Petterson has spoken at great length making the correlation and you can just watch some videos or read some of his words to find an explanation but you just continue to ignore this and re-post the same thing. Ignoring replies you don't want to hear isn't the same as not getting a reply.
If you think it is you dont have the greatest perspective as your radical right wing political view clouds your ability to see reality
Pray tell, what are my radical right wing views? I suppose from the perspective of a marxist ideologue everyone is "radical right wing". Or you're just trying to attack me and make sure that if anyone's reading this who isn't aware, I'm a bad person. Right? I mean, there are synonyms for people who hold radical right wing views...I can't remember any off hand though. What are they again?
That is a lie my post made four factual points and none of them were political, any of which you could have chosen to address rather than get personal, at all. I have no idea how it could be seen as bullying. Good job I did not do what you did eh you would be apoplectic with rage. So many on here do what they are complaining about
FFS let it go man let it go.
I have no desire to engage with the opinions you posit as facts when your reasons for posting are more illuminating than the post itself. If a woman or a transgender person made a post about suffering emotional or physical abuse would you have chimed in to ensure everyone knew how statistically unlikely or likely their abuse was? As Cougar puts it
Men’s rights activists” are generally right-wing nutjobs who are a threat to their own swiveleyesation
so you simply couldn't let the discussion continue normally. It's a perfect illustration of how you're more concerned with dumping on anyone or anything that even hints at contradicting your world view. I wasn't remotely surprised by your post, merely the fact that Cougar was.
FWIW GT i see you as on some sort of very public route to “recovery” as you explain the reasons for your views publicly. I think its very brave of you to do so and positive that men can discuss emotional topics openly. Man hugs all round as i dont agree with you but i do respect you.
I guess there's no point checking your replies to his previous topics to see if that's what you really think.
I guess there’s no point checking your replies to his previous topics to see if that’s what you really think.
Jimjam I would suggest that whatever has been said before is less relevant than what is being said now. The debate is what counts, as is respect for opinions and a willingness to listen to those.
Most importantly, whatever else has been said or is said, and irrespective of the degree to which I or others agree with those things, I truly believe that Junky and everyone else is almost certainly a good person with good intentions. Since I've never met him or others, I cannot be 100% sure, but I choose to believe in the tendency towards the goodness in people (whilst still also being very aware for the potential for malevolance).
<span style="color: #444444; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; background-color: #eeeeee;">I have lost my temper with her many times and did strike her once, it wasn’t for control or to establish dominance, it was pure rage at her behaviour towards me. </span>
This was one of the things that I found particularly upsetting. I never got physical with my ex but would occasionally get extremely angry, shouting at her and breaking things etc.
I’m not proud of that at all and would apologise afterwards, but she found this anger of mine totally unacceptable/disgraceful while she would always deny the constant drip, drip, drip of lower-level anger she displayed towards me.
She would almost never apologise for it, always claim it was me being over-sensitive and occasionally admit it but explain it was all my fault anyway and she was right to be angry, and anyway there were lots more things I did wrong she could get angry about too, so in fact she was being generous with me.
Why were you so desperate to be loved by someone?
What did you get from this relationship?
You knew she was a cheat and a liar when you first started seeing her, so why would you think she would be any different with you?
You had no shared obligations, no kids, no house etc. So why carry on in a cheating relationship for 18 months?
You obviously had no respect for the other bloke either.
You were physically stronger and if your often quoted IQ score is correct, then probably more intelligent.
I guess the lure of sex with a "hot bird" can make people do the strangest things.
I know I will get flamed for this but it's one of the lamest stories of "domestic abuse" I have ever heard.
Your life seems to consist of a series of difficult encounters with the opposite sex.
geetee1972 Trust me, posting on here helps even if it's just to get it off your chest. I could have forwarded you onto my on posts on here but I had to get Cougar to remove them because the abusers next victim was using them.
Have a read about narcassist relationships, you may have just survived one. My ex has split from her current husband, after bankrupting/destroying him, and has moved on to the next guy. The speed at which she opperates is staggering while telling everyone she's the victim.
I don't know whether I've a duty of care to warn this guy as I didn't for the last one and feel a bit sorry for him now his life is in tatters. But then again I don't think he'd have believed me if I had. Unfortunately because of our children I still have to maintain a functioning relationship with her. Which is really, really hard to do.
Why were you so desperate to be loved by someone?
Because I'm human
What did you get from this relationship?
Hard to say with hindsight, but at the time the sense of being wanted by someone.
You knew she was a cheat and a liar when you first started seeing her, so why would you think she would be any different with you?
Hope and naivety.
You had no shared obligations, no kids, no house etc. So why carry on in a cheating relationship for 18 months?
See above.
You obviously had no respect for the other bloke either.
I never really thought about it but probably you're right.
You were physically stronger and if your often quoted IQ score is correct, then probably more intelligent.
I'm really not sure how that's relevant?
I guess the lure of sex with a “hot bird” can make people do the strangest things.
Well there's lots of things that make people do lots of strange things so go figure.
I know I will get flamed for this but it’s one of the lamest stories of “domestic abuse” I have ever heard.
You think?
Your life seems to consist of a series of difficult encounters with the opposite sex.
I have no idea where you're getting my life story from.
<span style="color: #444444; font-size: 12.8px; font-style: italic; line-height: 15.36px; background-color: #eeeeee;">Your life seems to consist of a series of difficult encounters with the opposite sex.</span>
<span style="color: #444444; font-size: 12.8px; line-height: 15.36px; background-color: #eeeeee;">I have no idea where you’re getting my life story from.</span>
If you're a heterosexual male it was a safe bet.
If you’re a heterosexual male it was a safe bet.
LOL that's too funny. It applies if you're bisexual as well though.
"series" is quite a big assumption on that basis though
I have no idea where you’re getting my life story from.
From your posts on here.
You were physically and verbally abused by a group of women at a fairground and felt really scared. Poor little lamb.
You have multiple issues with your "role as a modern man".
Don't know how you should touch/talk/interact with women in your workplace.
I'm not totally sure what your agenda is but looking for sympathy because you were shagging some fit bunny boiler from work, behind her boyfriends back and she was nasty to you, really?
I know I shouldn't say this in 2018 but FFS MTFU.
.
"Why were you so desperate to be loved by someone?
What did you get from this relationship?
You knew she was a cheat and a liar when you first started seeing her, so why would you think she would be any different with you?
You had no shared obligations, no kids, no house etc. So why carry on in a cheating relationship for 18 months?
You obviously had no respect for the other bloke either.
You were physically stronger and if your often quoted IQ score is correct, then probably more intelligent.
I guess the lure of sex with a “hot bird” can make people do the strangest things.
I know I will get flamed for this but it’s one of the lamest stories of “domestic abuse” I have ever heard.
Your life seems to consist of a series of difficult encounters with the opposite sex"
This sort of response is one of the reasons why people are so reluctant to open up about domestic abuse.
gobuchulI know I will get flamed for this but it’s one of the lamest stories of “domestic abuse” I have ever heard.
Deservedly so, what a ****ing stupid thing to say. I mean totally ****ing idiotic.
****
I’m not totally sure what your agenda is but looking for sympathy because you were shagging some fit bunny boiler from work, behind her boyfriends back and she was nasty to you, really?
My agenda was to acknowledge what happened to me in a public forum (especially one that has such a high male population) in order to encourage other men to talk about their experiences and hopefully raise the profile of the problem where it exists.
I guess what you've just done with your post Gobchul is to also show the rank hypocrisy that often exists in even acknowledging this problem and the barriers that this subsequently creates to others sharing their experiences. Good job with that.
GT - You started an affair with a bizarre agreement, that she would continue sleeping with her original partner for 4 months and then go on a holiday with them, then dump them.
If that didn't set any alarm bells ringing then what would of?
Then you carried on for 18 mths.
Also, although you realised she was a psycho, you never told any of the other blokes.
Personally I think ramping this experience up to "domestic abuse" stops a lot of people taking the subject seriously when it is a real issue.
You were never in any real physical danger, got called a lot of names, which, due to the nature of the affair, made of been quite appropriate at the time.
You showed no remorse for the damage you were doing to the other bloke either.
As you may of noticed, zero sympathy from me.
I know a woman, who has developed Parkinsons in her 50's, which is linked to the repeated beatings she took to her head from husband. When he wasn't throwing her and the 3 kids out in the street, in the middle of the night.
Her son committed suicide in his 20's.
So you whinging about the office bike slapping you when you were in your 20's doesn't really cut it mate.
So you whinging about the office bike slapping you when you were in your 20’s doesn’t really cut it mate.
OK well maybe, you might have a point and I respect your opinion, we should debate that. By the way, before we do anything else, let's just be really clear about something.
I don't want your's or anybody else's sympathy. I specifically said I don't want sympathy and I clearly stated that I don't regard myself as a victim, so let's engage in debate with that clear ok?
OK good let's move on.
As far as I can tell what you're effectively doing by questioning my specific set of circumstances is challenging the definition of 'domestic abuse'. It seems to be that you equate domestic abuse with being a) just physical vilence, and b) only enough physical violence to cause serious physical injury.
It sounds very much like you're saying the recent widening of abuse to include 'coercive controlling behaviour' or other psychological manipulation is a nonsense and doesn't count.
It also sounds like you're saying that a bit of slapping is acceptable, as long as the recepient isn't in any real danger.
Have I got it right?
I think Gobby is suggesting that on the scale of domestic abuse, your experience is rating fairly low. Not that that devaluates you obviously.
You also go to some lengths to disassociate yourself from being called 'a'victim, though surely the one receiving the abuse is, by definition, 'the' victim.
It sounds very much like you’re saying the recent widening of abuse to include ‘coercive controlling behaviour’ or other psychological manipulation is a nonsense and doesn’t count.
No. Not at all.
Regarding the slapping, why didn't you stop her? Was she stronger than you?
If you had wanted to beat the shit out of her, you could of.
That's the major difference in the vast majority of domestic abuse cases and why it's still a much bigger problem for females than it is for males.
Physical abuse generally goes hand in hand with the controlling behaviour.
In your case, I have already said, you basically put up with a nutter because you found her very attractive and her method of control and manipulation has been used by females since the very beginning of time. Pussy whipped could be the non-PC term?
Technically it was an abusive relationship, however, calling it that is like describing a cold sore as herpes.
<span style="color: #444444;">Regarding the slapping, why didn’t you stop her? Was she stronger than you?</span>
Ever tried stopping someone slapping you? It's pretty hard without hurting them, and if they keep trying then you either have to tie them up or something, or run away.
It’s pretty hard without hurting them
If you are significantly stronger and grab their wrists then they can't do much.
If it hurts them, tough. Completely reasonable force.
It’s pretty hard without hurting them
If you are significantly stronger and grab their wrists then they can't do much.
If it hurts them, tough. Completely reasonable force.
<span style="color: #444444; background-color: #eeeeee;">If you are significantly stronger and grab their wrists then they can’t do much.</span>
Hmm. Knees? Forehead? Ever been in a real fight? Sure, a larger stronger person will usually be able to overpower a smaller person, but usually not without significantly hurting them if they're determined enough, and maybe he doesn't want to do that.
Ever been in a real fight?
I grew up in the NE in the 70's and 80's.
It was on the curriculum.
but usually not without significantly hurting them if they’re determined enough, and maybe he doesn’t want to do that.
Again, use reasonable force, if they get hurt tough.
A sizeable portion of that 85% will also themselves be perpetrators of DV. This can be lost in the statistics as they are not as good at inflicting injuries as their (mostly) male partners. When such an incident occurs it is normally marked as the woman being the victim, not both.
Source please and evidence- I assume you have seen some research you can link to
I have seen research but I don't have it saved to link to, I will have a look later. From memory it was near 50% of all abusive relationships (heterosexual) where the abuse was reciprocal. Of these cases of reciprocal abuse, men were much more likely to inflict greater injury than the women and also the injury received in reciprocal abuse was on average greater than that received in non-reciprocal abuse.
That’s the major difference in the vast majority of domestic abuse cases and why it’s still a much bigger problem for females than it is for males.
That right there is why I posted what I posted, because that's how so many people think and what is so wrong with our culture. It's ignorant, biggoted and hypocritical.
Me and geetee have hardly seen eye to eye on here generally but honestly can’t believe how heartless and mean-spirited some of you are.
Some absolutely textbook victim-blaming going on too.