[Closed] My daughter's gone off nursery

Thanks Graham but I have it under control.

Yep, and it does sound like you do (to me anyway).

It's really hard to answer any parenting questions without upsetting folk. It is very easy to take any comment, no matter how well intentioned, as a slight at your parenting.

But I don't think that means we should stop asking them. Just ask away but bear in mind that the people responding don't know you. (if it helps I've been called various names and accused of child neglect on other parenting threads 🙂 )

As I said earlier I've got a 2.5 year old going through the same thing so I can only sympathise and offer what has (partially) worked for me. That's about it.

Eating vegetables, cleaning ones teeth and going to bed are fairly black and white - they have to be done and there will be clear detriment if they are not done.

Nursery or even mainstream school - not so much.

Homeschooling can work, but I really think a kid (particularly a single kid) will miss out on so much by not socialising with others of her own age. Unless I lived way out in the middle of nowhere, or the schools round me were *really* bad, no way.

Well I don't have kids so my advice is probably worthless. However I did go to school with a LOT of totally spoiled princesses who had never been made to do anything they didn't want to do in their lives. Until they grew up and discovered the rest of the world didn't consider them to be at it's centre. It got ugly in some cases. She is testing her powers, if you give in too much you risk winding up with a promiscuous teenage drug addict. But as long as she is happy and has her individuality, I am sure that's OK.

Oh, and FWIW: despite never giving in on going to school, our 8 year old kicked off about it a couple of weeks ago. She soon got over it.

She is testing her powers, if you give in too much you risk winding up with a promiscuous teenage drug addict. But as long as she is happy and has her individuality, I am sure that's OK.

On the plus side, you'll soon be grandparents! 🙂

Will you be trying cigarettes with her when she's 15 or so? Maybe drinking cider with her when she's at a party?

What you do now in terms of setting boundaries, in terms of teaching her how to cope with the adult and not-so-adult world is important, and you only get one go at it.

I'm quite sure that you are more than capable of being the best parents she could ever wish for, but as a Dad of 3 I think keeping a weather eye on the future is vital.

Haha Molly, YOU don't know what you want half the time, let alone your baby daughter!!

[i]They **** you up, your mum and dad.
They may not mean to, but they do.
They fill you with the faults they had
And add some extra, just for you.

But they were ****ed up in their turn
By fools in old-style hats and coats,
Who half the time were soppy-stern
And half at one another’s throats.

Man hands on misery to man.
It deepens like a coastal shelf.
Get out as early as you can,
And don’t have any kids yourself.[/i]

A bit of wisdom from Philip Larkin.

A bit of [s]wisdom[/s] bitter moaning from [s]Philip Larkin[/s] a miserable old git.

😉

Will you be trying cigarettes with her when she's 15 or so? Maybe drinking cider with her when she's at a party?

Is that what you think friendship is all about?

Haha Molly, YOU don't know what you want half the time, let alone your baby daughter!!

On the contrary emsz, I know exactly what I want. Problem is, it doesn't fit in with the things I find myself having to do 🙂

A bit of [s]wisdom[/s] bitter moaning from [s]Philip Larkin[/s] a miserable old git.

Oh dear.

Well it's hardly a life-affirming positive message is it DD? 😆

Well it's hardly a life-affirming positive message is it DD?

I guess the third verse isn't. First two are very true though. 😐

On the contrary emsz, I know exactly what I want. Problem is, it doesn't fit in with the things I find myself having to do.

Oh the
[img] [/img]

😆 😆 😆 😆 😆 😆 😆 😆 😆 😆 😆

Really Molly?

Wow, you mostly give the impression on here that you flit from thing to thing with no real idea of what you want or how to get it!

Ever seen the Princess Bride? There's a bit where one character says " you keep saying that, I don't think it means what you think it means"

Sound familiar to you?

Incontheivable!

Sound familiar to you?

Inigo Montoya says it to Mr Inconceivable (can't think of his name right now) when they're on the boat being pursued by the Dread Pirate Roberts. (I think).

Saddos 8) 😆

Favourite.
Film.
Ever. 😀

(Someone got me the 25th anniversary DVD for my birthday) 😳

Especially when you are FREQUENTLY obliged to force one of the parties to do something they don't want to do. Like eat their dinner

Going off topic, why do you have to force kids to eat their dinner?

You'd never force an adult to eat dinner, you'd just offer a dinner, and it'd be up to them if they ate it, depending on how hungry they were, how much they liked the food, how tired they are etc.

I don't know, personally we don't force any particular eating, because that seems weird (and because I was always forced to eat and hated it), we just make sure that we provide healthy meals (and a couple of healthy snacks) and it is up to her what she chooses to eat. Seems to work okay, and is a whole lot less hassle than having a fight if for some reason she isn't hungry. I don't think she eats any different amount to other kids her age - all kids I know have some meals where they eat everything and others where they et nothing, the onl' difference I can see is that they have more arguments.

Same with finishing first course before puddings - sometimes I'm not savoury hungry and have a tiny first course and devour a ton of cake. That's because my body is telling me that's what I need. I feel it is only right to respect that everyone has different needs and let her work out what she needs right now. Seems to work fine - she's usually more of a savoury person now, but has the odd meal in the wrong order, or skips the main course.

We do have one rule about food, which is that if you don't want it, daddy can tidy it up. Tht serves two purposes - firstly I'm a greedy bugger. Secondly, it makes her consider whether she actually wants to et something if she has got distracted by something shiny.

My advice stands; stop trying to be her friends, start being her mum and dad

I don't consider them exclusive, certainly not at this stage.

I think it is really, at that age kids are a bit like dogs. They need to be shown where the boundaries are and they are always trying to push it. Giving in to them on something like this (unless there is a fundemental issue with the quality of the nursery) is just being wet and storing up all types of trouble for the future. Wait to be friends until you have them trained.

 

That's because my body is telling me that's what I need. I feel it is only right to respect that everyone has different needs and let her work out what she needs right now.

Hmmm.. in our case our little un's body clearly tells her she needs choc chip brioche, ice pops and "bitey cheese" (aka Grana Padano). 😀

So, have you spoken to the nursery yet?

just take control of the situation and stop being such a wet-arse about it

Favourite.
Film.
Ever.

I agree with Darcy twice in this thread. Bugger.

*shakes fist* look at what your faffing about has done, molgrips! LOOK AT THE DAMAGE YOU ARE CAUSING!!!

Hmmm.. in our case our little un's body clearly tells her she needs choc chip brioche, ice pops and "bitey cheese" (aka Grana Padano).

Ours is more of a "whatever you're having" kind of girl - the guaranteed way to get her to eat lots is to give her nothing, and let her steal off our plates 🙂

(probably going to get criticized for that)

Ours is more of a "whatever you're having" kind of girl

Yeah we get that - even when what we're having is exactly the same as what she is having, for some reason it is always tastier from daddy's plate 😀

I've got a genuine question for the adamant disciplinarians.. crikey, tootall et al..

How do you know that the method of parenting that you're prescribing is the best and how are you certain that nothing else could be more effective..?

What sort of person are you intending to create with your 'system'..?
How have your own children faired under your guidance..?

kids are fickle and manipulative, they know what they want, but not what is good for them!

Sounds like she will wrap you round her little finger for the rest of your life !

[i]adamant disciplinarians[/i]

[img] [/img]

Less adamant disciplinarian, more able to recognise that the function of a parent overrides the immediate desires of the child. It's worked very well thanks.

I only ask as I'm sure there are plenty of hugely successful and happy people in the world, making amazing contributions to society, that had very unconventional childhoods..

How do you know that the method of parenting that you're prescribing is the best and how are you certain that nothing else could be more effective..?

You can't be. All you can do is what you [i]believe[/i] is best for your child.

I believe that teaching my child about boundaries and discipline, whilst still giving her choices and free reign when it is suitable, gives her the best grounding for a stable, happy life.

That belief is based on my own observations of kids brought up that way and seeing how they fair compared to kids that were allowed to do whatever they want.

What sort of person are you intending to create with your 'system'..?

Same as any parent I suspect: a person that enjoys life and is happy and successful.

One of the biggest realisations I made when becoming a parent was that my parents had no more of a clue what they were doing than I do.

Love your kid, unconditionally - everything else will work itself out.

Hmmm.. in our case our little un's body clearly tells her she needs choc chip brioche, ice pops and "bitey cheese" (aka Grana Padano).

We still have charge of the cupboards and the money to take to the shops though, so she doesn't get to choose exactly what she wants, she just can not eat things. If she chose to only subsist on babybels, which she'd happily do (we're obviously less posh than you!), she'd get hungry pretty quick as we only buy them when we're going on journeys.

So I guess I'm in favour of some control, but just not in favour of forced eating.

I've got a genuine question for the adamant disciplinarians.. crikey, tootall et al.. How do you know that the method of parenting that you're prescribing is the best and how are you certain that nothing else could be more effective..? What sort of person are you intending to create with your 'system'..? How have your own children faired under your guidance..?

Same is true for us hippy wasters too though to be fair. Personally, I was brought up forced to eat food and ended up a super fussy vegetarian, hence my hippy waster ideas about not forcing food. I can't pretend I have evidence for them, just that I find them easier and more relaxing to apply, and with my child it seems like she is just as good an eater as any other child I know.

I only ask as I'm sure there are plenty of hugely successful and happy people in the world that had very unconventional childhoods..

Yep, I've noticed that on various interviews and biographies that many of the most interesting and successful people had very unconventional upbringings (fleeing from nazis, being orphaned at a young age, being sent to boarding school by parents that didn't want them etc etc).

I suspect a degree of adversity like that builds character in those that it doesn't break.

Doesn't mean it is a good template though.

If she chose to only subsist on babybels, which she'd happily do (we're obviously less posh than you!)

Actually I originally had babybells on that list (or "cheesybell" as they get called in our house) but I edited them out for fear of forum scorn 😀

I think there is a fairly blurry, wide, and probably woolly edged 'norm' for bringing kids up in this country. My kids would sit comfortably towards the liberal, not-that-strict, able-to-make-many-of-their-own-choices edge, but I'm equally sure that when they were young my job, my role was to place recognizable boundaries for them, to allow them to make choices within there own capabilty.

What would you do with a child who has asthma who refuses to take preventative medication? A diabetic child who rebels by refusing insulin?

Some decisions have to be taken, some choices have to be made, that's my job when my kids are tiny.

How do you know that the method of parenting that you're prescribing is the best and how are you certain that nothing else could be more effective..?

What sort of person are you intending to create with your 'system'..?
How have your own children faired under your guidance..?

I'm not certain that other things could be more effective. I have done little more than insist that molgrips talks to the staff at the nursery. You know - those adults he hands his treasure over to every day - rather than take at face value the (limited) words of a 3 year old. I have also echoed the words of others who say that 'parent' is what is needed, not 'best friend'.

We are intending to create a person who is best equipped to deal with the world that she will be faced with. To do this, she needs to use the system to her best advantage (which we, as parents, take the decisions about for now) until she is in a position to forge her own way. This means the best experiences (which may vary from parent to parent), the best education (which is probably not best left to parents), flexibility, sporting participation and the ability to mix successfully with her peer group.
As her parents, we are not her peer group. We know this and don't try to be her best friend, because a 3 year old with a 41 year old male best friend isn't really right and proper. To be able to deal with her peer group, she goes to classes, activities and pre-school 3 days a week. he won't be shocked by society because we've insulated her from it (as we've seen with one or two of her friends).
We had a really bad few weeks with tears and wailing at every drop off at pre-school. Speaking to the staff, she was all fine within 3 minutes of my departure - it was her testing us and trying to exert control (a known development from 2.5 years on). If I had listened to her (a la molgrips), I'd have got the wrong story and suffered.
She is shining in all activities right now, loves pre-school and everything else - except salad and tomatoes. I can live with that.

I'm no disciplinarian - I just know that kids want their way and parenting isn't always about taking the fun path.

High fives Princess Bride buddy. 😀

Oh, I thought you might like one of these winners from dog photographer of year, 2012. Brizzle photographer no less.
[img] [/img]

We had 3 of them growing up. Bassets are awesomeness on a set of short legs.

So what did Ms Molgrips decide she was going to do?

A nation awaits. What happened next?

He's busy sorting his POS car out at the moment. Education can wait when there's an ECU to be fixed.

Ok, so on the following day Mrs Grips hung around to observe for an hour. It's a Welsh nursery, and my daughter seems to have been having anxiety issues about the language. She was much more withdrawn than usual around the adults (she's normally the kind to talk everyone's ear off) and when they spoke directly to her she covered her ears!

We've often spoken to her in other languages at home and she's usually gone NO! NO!! and covered her ears then too. I think that's just due to the different-ness of it, she doesn't like things being different. She does understand different words for things though, she code-switches between British and American vocabulary seamlessly when talking to me or Mrs Grips.

That evening she brought me over a book to read and it was a kids teach-yourself-Welsh type book with lots of pictures, although it's really for like 10 year olds. How she knew it was a Welsh book without reading the title I don't know though 😯 but we went through it, and we went through the pictures looking for the ci, the cath and the mochyn cwta which went well. Next morning we over hear her practicing her Welsh numbers under her breath. So she's been working on it in her own way.. just like Daddy does 🙂

Anyway the day after I made this post she actually ran away from Nursery and had to be chased down by Mrs Grips and they had a heart to heart on the kerbside.. but now things have improved and she seems happy to go again. Hopefully she's overcoming her mental block about the language. We've got some picture books and learning materials ordered so that they can do more at home. She doesn't seem to like the full immersion much because she doesn't understand what's going on, but she seems willing to learn vocabulary within an English setting so hopefully that will help her get a foot in the door.

It's a Welsh nursery, and my daughter seems to have been having anxiety issues about the language.

Thank you for a fuller picture. Sending a child (at the 'control' stage of development) to a nursery that speaks in a foreign language is quite a thing to do. I'd be pretty freaked out if everyone around me was speaking in a different language and I was only just getting to grips with the one I was using on a daily basis.

She doesn't seem to like the full immersion much because she doesn't understand what's going on

I can't blame her one little bit.

you've a sterner heart than me..

No doubt she'll thank you for it one day

Sending a child (at the 'control' stage of development) to a nursery that speaks in a foreign language is quite a thing to do

It's commonly regarded as a good idea and it works well with most kids, but there are a few reasons why she has had trouble I think. One is that she shares her mother's tendency to run away from things she can't deal with immediately, and the other is my feeling that her language had already developed beyond the matching sounds to things phase and into a (relatively) good understanding of language and grammar so it was all difficult to understand.

She seems to be figuring it out now though with a bit of help.

you've a sterner heart than me.

Who, me? Why?

Does change the picture a bit, the immersion part.

But don't underestimate the adaptability of small kids, mine are bilingual and switch from English to Spanish without any problems. A lot of the local schools here are also bilingual*, friends' kids would come home with comments like "the teacher talks weird" but they'd soon get the hang of it. The usual tactic (from what I've seen and read) is to answer native language questions in the second language, with lots of signing and arm waving, and not force the kid to speak the second language... they soon pick it up.

* Bilingual state schools: send the teacher to the UK or Ireland for a month, and supposedly they're fluent in English... Listening to them talk can be pretty painful at times 🙄

I was just thinking about this thread. On Monday, at playgroup, Rose got scratched on the face by another girl in some kind of kiddy tussle, and for the rest of the week, she's been saying 'no playgroup today', all the time. So yesterday, when it was actually playgroup day, I popped her in the bike trailer and went round the corner to her friend's house and gave her and her best friend a lift to playgroup, so that they both got there at the same time. When we got to playgroup, they both raced to get in, and there were no problems.

So my new top tip for this kind of thing is if she already knows some kids who go there, to offer to give one of them a lift there with her, so that she doesn't have the 'going into a big noisy room on her own' thing. If she doesn't, maybe it's time to make friends with the parents and see if they'd like to bring their kids over to yours to play.

It's commonly regarded as a good idea and it works well with most kids

It's an excellent idea, your daughter will be a lot better at learning other (more useful 🙂 ) languages in the future.

Something like 80% of the intake to this school is English speaking only kids. So the staff are well used to dealing with it. I think the issue is my daughter's personality, but she does want to figure things out - hence the practicing things under her breath etc and her willingness to learn with us at home.

Who, me? Why?

I'm not criticising, I'm envious in fact, because I couldn't bare to put my boy through the confusion.. I'm probably not smart enough to be able to steer him through it, or strong enough to make it seem less daunting..

me = big wimp

EDIT: slightly less daunting in light of your last post I think, maybe.. 😕

I couldn't bare to put my boy through the confusion

I see.. well going by the theory, the kids are ok. Where we live there are few native speakers, but lots of interest in the schools.

As it turns out she's had confusion, but I'm hoping that with a bit of help and support from us she can figure it out 🙂

It really does work well for most kids.

There was a big thread about this a while ago from Glupton in Scotland. I wonder how his boy's getting on..