[Closed] MPVs - tell me your stories good or bad

We have a Grand Scenic 1.9dCi. Owned for 10 years. Only thing that's really gone wrong was the EGR valve earlier this year. Road tax is cheap(ish) towed our caravan and now trailer tent happily. Van like with middle row of seats removed, big with them folded.

if you use the 3rd row of seats boot space is limited (smaller than my wife's golf) but they fold into floor.

access is easy and legroom good. you're up higher than a car so driving is easy.

No complaints really.

Oh, it's not going to set your soul on fire as a driving machine but you knew that 🙂

Zafira will do what you want, not the most exciting car to drive but fairly good vfm

Mate has a Galaxy, fabulous bike vehicle. Can swallow huge amounts of kit with some/all of the seats removed. The ones you are looking at are much smaller.

I've posted this a few times but we had an older Rav 4 and those models you could remove the rear seats. Big load carrier with them out, great for bikes etc. With the seats in you still have a decent boot. More expensive to buy/run but a bit more interesting than normal/small MPV

When we needed a 7 seater we went with the big 4wd's (Shogun etc) but they are expensive on fuel and a bit big to negotiate the multi-story at the weekend.

After bad experiences with gen I and gen II Scenics I was convinced that I would have been done with them.
However I could not really get any good trade-in offers from any other brand so had to choose Grand Scenic III with small diesel and double clutch auto. Surprisingly it has been nearly faultless, only one extra trip to dealer due problem with electronic handbrake controller in early production run.
II series could be considered if the dashboard has been replaced, handbrake fixed, that valve thingie changed and set of dogbones and brake disks are changed recently and you can get one so cheap that you can keep +1000£ reserve for that bad day.

Driving with these is a different thing compared to real cars, on the plus side most normal cars feel like racers after these. 🙂

Galaxy

I lot more expensive than the Citroen/Renault/Mazda brigade I notice.

Driving with these is a different thing compared to real cars, on the plus side most normal cars feel like racers after these

This is what worries me. I've gone from an Elise to a Boxster to a Mazda 6 and now I'm looking at MPVs!! Do the slippers come FOC? 🙁

stilltortoise - Member

This is what worries me. I've gone from an Elise to a Boxster to a Mazda 6 and now I'm looking at MPVs!! Do the slippers come FOC?

Zafira VXR? Really fast slippers.

(I am projecting my own weaknesses onto others here; I don't want to sell my car but there's a VXR on ebay near me and I just love the stupidity of the things. Even with fwd and a pretty flawed seat setup.)

[i]Do the slippers come FOC?[/i]

My wife has a Golf GTi and I have a 7 seat mpv.

I've no idea how we ended up in this position but it's clearly [i]her[/i] golf and [i]my[/i] Renault.

Sometimes I weep gently as I drive on my own in my car along country roads.

^ 😆

I have been spoilt having gone through 3 or 4 car purchases since my wife last got to choose. It is her turn really. I'm surprised she wants an MPV cos she's as much into nice cars as I am and was really disappointed when I sold the Boxster. I think the arrival of child number 3 is making her soft 😆

Hired a Galaxy 170bhp diesel once. Plasticy, but a lovely drive, powerful and fairly good on fuel too. 46mpgon the airport run, but knock off 10-15% for the Ford lies.

Have a look at a Toyota Corolla Verso
The 2.0 D4D engine is bullet proof, no DPF, no cam belt

http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/carbycar/toyota/corolla-verso-2004/

Elise > Seat Cupra FR > Toyota Corolla when I stopped kidding myself 🙂

Have an S Max now. As a family carrying vehicle you can't knock it, it's almost entertaining to drive (alone) too. 45 mpg ish on the 1.8TDCi and it doesn't look too bad. Found a rare full leather version, 40K on the clock for £8K which is as much as I'd want to spend on an MPV 😀

The Toyota was better, but too small for the 3 boys and all the gubbins (usually take 5 bikes, 2 surfboards on hols.. wouldn't mind a kayak either...) else I'd have got another. 2 kids it'd be well worth looking in too.

Have a weird ass issue though - sometimes, it'll just start juddering and missing under acceleration. Seems to be mainly when warm, supermarket fuel seems to make it worse .. suspecting a filter or EGR valve or injector but no idea how to diagnose, and it's irregular so I'm not sure a garage could reproduce it. Any ideas out there?

[i]not sure a garage could reproduce it[/i]

a read of the ecu may give a diagnosis even if the fault isn't occurring there and then.

Thought about a 6 seater? Honda FRV? I swear by Honda's, very reliable and well made IME. We had the 2.0 petrol, it was juicy, but couldnt afford the 2.2 CDTi. If you can, go for the diesel. Its wide, so I think you could get 3 boosters in the back. There is always the front middle as well.
No DPF or cambelt either.

superfli beat me to it. I've had my FRV for over 8 years and I honestly can't think of any reason to move it on for something newer. Easily the most reliable and best built car I have ever had. You will have no problem with 3 boosters across the back (or 3 proper child seats for that matter)

On our second Grand Picasso, both have been the 2.0ltr fully automatic ones with the self levelling rear suspension which is good with four bikes on the tow bar. First one did 100,000 miles before we swapped it and this has done £60,000. Great as a family car and for getting the bikes about. Ours also gets us to the Alps on an annual basis and is a pleasure to drive on long and short journeys. Loads of room inside.

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Pretty happy with our Scenic Mk III, no worries so far (4 yo), only downside is the 1.5dci which is a distinctly old school 106 hp (?) (in a 1.5 ton car), more modern versions have a new 130hp unit which should make accelerating distinctly less sclerotic. Once up to speed it's quite happy to cruise all day at European motorway speeds. Flappy seats in rear are for kids only really, as is the case in most 5+2s - small boot space with seats down. Also looked at C4 Picasso which I actually preferred but Missus preferred the Scenic as it was more car like. Lots of Picassos available ex-Motability (well there was when I was looking at them)

I think I need to look at some of these in the flesh. The FRV looks expensive to be honest and I'm not sure the boot will be big enough. I need to be able to fit this trike in AND a push chair. The trike does split into two but is still pretty wide

I'm expecting 1st babba and am trying to convince wife we need a Passat estate. She want's one of these things though as she says an estate is too boat like in dimensions.

Opinions?

My experience so far is if you want to carry stuff an estate is better. These are the main advantages of MPVs as I see it:

- (potentially) more than 5 seats
- more upright driving position
- better visibility
- more cubby holes to lose toys in
- sliding doors (on some) - I'm sure this is a God-send in car parks

you get a lot more height to load things in too with an MPV, so overall boot volume is pretty huge.

We've got a VW Touran - which was 4 years old when bought at the top end of your budget. Great as a smaller MPV with 3 proper seats for childseats - twins mean't the car HAD to be able to get 2 Class 0 & 1 Class 1 seats in. The seats in the boot fold flat into the floor - and thus no spare tyre, but no reduction in boot space. Need to be a child to sit in them though!
We test drove the Galaxy - and it was a close run thing. Galaxy has more space but Mrs Sheeps didn't like the ride (felt bigger?!).

BUT (and don't hate me) but 3 years into 3 children and bikes and camping kit etc. we're thinking of going down the T5 route!

you get a lot more height to load things in too with an MPV, so overall boot volume is pretty huge.

I think a larger floor space and lower ceiling is more useful than smaller area and higher ceiling, unless you're delivering white goods 😆

go and look at some - you'll be surprised how much floor space there is - particularly as you'll be able to slide seats forward a bit if you have younger children.

Bloke I knew back in the day used to swear by the Ford Galaxy. He was heavily into surfing and got one as a company car because it was huge and, if push came to shove, he and his GF could sleep in the back of it.

I guess the modern equivalent of this is the S-Max which a friend at work swears by. Repeatedly. At great length. Constantly.

Large floor space and a high roof in ours, we looked at every one out there before choosing. It also has the advantage that you can lower the back end to get in heavy loads and the rear sill is in line with the floor, disadvantage is that there is no spare wheel as that's where the seats go

I've a C-max

+ it's a car, don't get excited. It's better than crap cars and "drives like a car" T5's, but it's still dull (my othr car's a Midget, maybe I'm biased).

- it's shorter by a smidge than an MK1 focus estate (the mk2 which the C-max is based on is apprently smaller but I've not had one to compare). you can still sleep in the back though with the seats out.

Given the choice I'd have had either the estate or a berlingo, the C-max isn't good enough at either being big or car like to be worth the comprimise.

Reliability of my 1.6 petrol has been fine, does 39-42mpg and tyres last 20,000 on the front, 40,000 on the back and it's needed nothing else between 30,000 and 75,000miles I've had it.

I have a Berlingo, dog ugly but I don't think you will get a more practical car for your money. The combination of boot space and sliding doors is brilliant. Take your trike and pram and try a few different cars. I like the fact I don't really care about it.

Mazda 5 mpv.
Sadly the most powerful engined, sporty low profile tyres is also an mpv!
It is brilliant with the sliding doors in tight car parks.
Nice car too drive with decent stuff in it.
Mrs is happy to get work.
Some great camping trips ticket!
Petrol engine is quiet and refined (I drive a van so most things are).
Only 1 BIG PROBLEM!
IT CAN'T TAKE A BOOT MOUNTED BIKE RACK!!!
I have a brilliant Exodus boot rack from Halfords and its been on everything but the Mazdas boot spoiler and plastic boot panel have rendered it useless.
Fog lamp is in the middle of the rear bumper so no tow ball option.
Only option is is roof mounted bike racks, but now I gotta fork out for all that.
I'm not a fan of rooftop stuff after a mate change the shape of his rare Kona Titanium beauty under a low bridge, his car came off worse!!
Thats my only niggle.
A great car.

Fog lamp is in the middle of the rear bumper so no tow ball option.

It would be a quick and easy job to install a fog lamp elsewhere

Just get a T5 or similar and all the future worries will be resolved re space, kit, practicality etc etc.

Can't fault my S Max.

Mazda 5 mpv.

Test drove one a couple of years ago. Lots to like, but with the rear seats in place the boot space was tiny as I remember.

I have a Berlingo, dog ugly but I don't think you will get a more practical car for your money.

I mercilessly ribbed my brother for buying one of these, but you probably speak truth.

Take your trike and pram and try a few different cars.

Yep, this is the best idea

with the rear seats in place the boot space was tiny as I remember.

They are all like this.

They are all like this.

They're not. That's what surprised me about the Grand Scenic. With the kids seats in place there was still room in the boot for a buggy and some bags of shopping.

had a Pug Partner (Berlingo) before the current C4 Picasso. Pug was pretty sparse in terms of features but I would get another one if/when circumstances require a 2nd car. You can get a massive amount in with seats down, and ours had a nice plastic boot thing which meant we could just chuck in bikes, rubble or any other crap we wanted to cart about

C4 has been nothing but trouble, the lights go every 3 - 4 months (one bulb fell out and melted through the front bumper somehow) and it seems to need something doing at every service.

That said it's done 120k miles so it's getting on a bit.

We're looking to change and at the minute the SEAT Altea XL is winning (iTech has lots of kit for the money) as the wife and kids really like it.

(I only drive it at weekends and the odd evening, so I can't really force my choices on her, SEAT Leon ST FR was lovely, but she's not a fan of estates for some reason)

They're not. That's what surprised me about the Grand Scenic. With the kids seats in place there was still room in the boot for a buggy and some bags of shopping.

How may kids have you got? Are you likely to use the 3rd row often? The Grand Scenic is pretty big for day to day, is it you who will be driving it in the main or your wife?

We only got 7 seats as a useful option for club runs etc. - our three sit in the middle row of the S Max and we still have a large boot in normal use.

MPVs really score over estates when you have child seats - much easier to get the blighters in and out. Plus you can fill the floorspace by the big seats with yet more kit. A few friends have Passats, no way do they get more gear in than the S Max .. but then it is a bigger vehicle overall.

The Mazda 5 is very nice, sliding doors are great, but what killed it for us is that it's 2+2+2 so with 3 kids you end up without enough luggage space for camping hols.

Although I have to agree, a T5 with crew cab is probably my most practical option 🙂

Our Touran, 05 1.9tdi.
Good bits: mega practical, good mpg, drives OK, comfy enough, we have done 140k in it it so far. Still goes.

Bad bits: it has gone wrong more than expected, some really duff design costing a fortune to repair when needed, parts cost silly money (like all modern cars), and overall I am 'meh' about it. We have had wheel bearings, DPF, Clutch and DMF, ABS sensor, suspension (x2 lots of arms/struts), boot gas strut issue to repair, A/C etc etc etc.

Are you likely to use the 3rd row often?

Good question. Sometimes we need to shuttle more than 5 people around. At the moment that involves using 2 cars, so the idea of pop-up seats for those occasions holds some appeal. Whether it is a big enough selling point of an MPV over an estate remains to be seen.

is it you who will be driving it in the main or your wife?

It depends. Officially it's a replacement for my car, but my wife is the one more often than not shuttling the kids about, so I may end up adopting her car as my main car.

On our second Grand Picasso

I hired a C4 Picasso I think, and it was awful. Some absolutely bonkers design features in it.

Firstly, the pedals were offset and too close together, just like the only other Citroen I'd driven. Then the gearstick, whcih was on the dash, was too far away requiring me to lean forwards to get 1st and 2nd and I'm not short or anything. But most of all - the heater controls are on the door side of the driver down around knee height. Wt actual f? Not only does it mean that the passenger can't change anything, but you have to take your eyes right off the road and crane your head to even see them. Incredibly daft.

7 seats but the rear two fold away in seconds into the floor when not needed leaving a big boot area.

Interesting reading this as our Octavia estate will be changed next year. Always taken the view that height in mpvs is wasted compared to tbe ease of loading an estate, plus much harder for normal sized people to get stuff on the roof.

Next car will need to do the next 8-10 years, by which time both kids will have been through their teenage years, and we will have to transport grandparents as they will be too old to drive. So an mpv kind of makes sense [b]if[/b] you can fit teenagers in the back rear seats.

Suspect an estate will still be a better option, MrsMC will just have to get over her aversion at taking two cars if we need to take more than 5 people.

Apologies for rambling and thinking out loud.

Had a Toyota Lucida (Import Previa Diesel) and that set the scene, as when that eventually died we got a Renault Grand Espace.
Frankly it's huge, even with all seven seats in. Even with five seats in, I've managed to get five people and five bikes (wheels off etc) inside. It is so practical as all seats other than the front two can be removed or reconfigured, so in effect you have anything from a mini-bus to a van. Due to it being french and old, I can now strip clean and refit the EGR valve within an hour and a half, I made and fitted some sill replacements a few MOT's ago, but the body is mainly plastic so not much upper body rot.
Given your budget you'll avoid the older rubbish and have some nice MPV's to look at.
We will probably have another MPV, or some sort of crew cab pick.......so I'm told.

marcus7 - Member
Zafira will do what you want, not the most exciting car to drive but fairly good vfm
POSTED 20 HOURS AGO #

This is certainly a very good option.
2014 pre-reg models are getting discounted heavily, - pushing second hand prices down too. good value, decent cars.

Have just been through a very similar process - eight thousand budget, need for space and car seats, occasional need for 7 seats when visiting and taking out gramps (fold down flat when not needed to give estate style/size boot), preference for diesel (some long drives), and not a lot to spend on maintaining.

Went for a Kia Carrens.
Ticks all the boxes, and they extended their warranty period from 5 to 7 years in Jan 2010. Buy one newer than that and you're still well within the warranty period.
For your budget, you'd get a decent spec 7 seat MPV, good diesel engine, low mileage, and with 3 or 4 years original manufacturers warranty. Well worth looking into.

Only prob is there's not so many of them round to find, but they do come up at main dealers.

Next car will need to do the next 8-10 years, by which time both kids will have been through their teenage years, and we will have to transport grandparents as they will be too old to drive. So an mpv kind of makes sense if you can fit teenagers in the back rear seats.

Suspect an estate will still be a better option, MrsMC will just have to get over her aversion at taking two cars if we need to take more than 5 people.

Galaxy with a tow bar looks best option for me. Friend has the s-max but I'm not blown away by the usable space in it.

MrsMC needs it to be an automatic though. So that adds a thousand to tbe cost/knocks a year off a second hand one.

Don't know how close you are to London but you could consider an ex Addison Lee Galaxy. Dunno that much about the others but always found the Galaxy a great car to drive.

They sell off their cars after 2-3 years at prices between £8-10k. The cars are pretty basic (steel wheels, cloth seats, only come in black etc) but will have been serviced every 3000 miles (note that an Ad Lee car can do that in a month)and anything that fails is always replaced as part of the service routine. It does take some of the risk out of buying a higher mileage car.

They are all 2.0TDI with automatic box, air con, leccy windows etc. do decent MPG and will swallow up to 4 bikes without removing the wheels. Will take 5 adults with all seats used.

They have a car lot by Mornington Crescent station in Camden.

edit - re the servicing. Ad Lee fines drivers if they miss their service so the intervals are always followed to the letter (or in the case the mileage!)

I wanted to like the C4 Picasso but the steering is very electric and the suspension very wallowy- will too light/soft for my taste.

If it was a large MPV I'd go with a Toyota Previa.

(Sadly) I'd avoid the Touran and by extension the Altea as I've heard too many bad stories about the Touran. Pity as its not bad looking over the past few years.

Had my fiat doblo for 10 months now and it's not put a foot wrong so far, but it is a chore with the 1.6 multijet engine as it lags a fair bit. I'd look at a 2.0 multijet one in future and a remap (165bhp out the exact same engine elsewhere) or a Peugeot Partner Tepee (not as big but supposed to be more agile) and revel in not giving a hoot !

Had my touran tdi dsg for 6 years and 100000 miles. It's been brilliant. Turbo went 5000 miles ago but other than that it's been perfect. I've literally just got back from holiday in the south of France this morning. Another 2400 trouble free miles in the last 10 days.

c max 2ltr tdci,lots of fun to drive and fairly quick with loads of torque.probs a bit small for your needs though so i would suggest an s max.one thing to bear in mind with vans is single carrage way national speed limit roads you are limited to 50mph and 60mph on duel carrage ways

[i]I think I need to look at some of these in the flesh. The FRV looks expensive to be honest and I'm not sure the boot will be big enough. I need to be able to fit this trike in AND a push chair. The trike does split into two but is still pretty wide [/i]

In your position get the biggest vehicle (e.g. Galaxy or the like), or something far smaller and trailer.

100k in a zafira here. Pros:-
Very cheap to buy.
Economical (50mpg fully loaded towing a trailer on a run)
Cheap servicing
Very reliable
Powerful engine so gets up to speed nicely
Comfortable (as its not Avis spec)
Not too horrible to look at
7 seats can be useful.

Con's
Its not very good for bikes. With the middle row folded forward there's not really that much length. Folded down and the floors not flat and you loose a load of height. They cannot be removed either.

The boot has been squared off between the arches to make it look nice, but you loose a lot of space that's handy when squeezing bikes in

Considering how cheap they are, they really are very good cars if you need the extra seats, but a big estate or a berlingo would probably be more practical load lugger.

On the CMax and Corolla Verso are any/some/all of the rear seats entirely removable? That's one handy feature of the Rav...

Not sure here. We have an old style 04 zafira, last of the first shape. Done 145000 miles, things have worn out, but overall it's been good and cheap to run. It's a 1.9 tdi.

I love my zafira, it fits all our kit, and some. We have managed 2 kids, 2 adults, full ski hols kit incl 4x skis and 2x snowboards INSIDE the car last winter. Kids were 13 and 10. Seats in the boot slide under the second row leaving more space in the boot than in the touran. Height in the boot is great, giving loads of options, but then I do love a good game of luggage Tetris!

My brother in law is our mechanic, and he says it'll make it to 200000 without too much trouble, so we decided not to replace it.

As a replacement we were looking at a touran, as according to my brother in law the newer shape (not newest) zafira diesels have fiats bits (or something) and we are not allowed to buy one as it'll be too much trouble. This only really left the touran, as we wanted a car with 100 kg roof load for our bikes. I sat and drove a few priced at £9000-£10000 and did not think they were much nicer than my good old zafira, hence we decided to keep it.

We used the seats in the boot a lot when my boys were smaller, saves taking 2 cars. The seats are too small now really, apart from short journeys, so we don't really use them anymore. We decided to replace the old girl with a Volvo v70 when the time comes. Much nicer car, 100kg roof load and middle seat folds down for skis.

Getting extra seats does mean you will forever be giving people lifts we found!

Perhaps spend £1000 and get an old zafira! Loads about, and we keep seeing them on the ferry on the way back from the alps, which must be a good sign....

Now the electrical gremlins have been sorted I am very happy with my S max. Was thinking of swapping it out for an estate car but couldn't find one that does everything the smax does.

Mine is also a 203bhp petrol version so although it's not as good on fuel as the diesel it's a lot better to drive in a spirited fashion should you want to.

For your budget you should be able to get a nice 2.5turbo petrol titanium spec.

Berlingo's are piqueing my interest atm. Obviously totally magoo to look at. But being able to remove a seat and stick a complete xl 29er in the back does appeal. Especially when dismantling the beast to thread it Into the back of a golf.

On the Zafira- not the latest (new) shape. Ive heard good things. Yes there are some horror stories about the 1.9tdi but its MASS/I.e many thousands+ out there on our roads. The 1.8 petrol has been around forever too.

I'd also check out some Japanese import MPVs, particularly the Estima (Previa over here) or if you're after something a bit different/bonkers a Nissan Elgrand or Toyota Alphard. You can pick up 10 year old but low mileage Estimas for £3-4k, will easily last another 10 years, the petrols may be a bit juicy but total cost may well be cheaper bearing in mind the low initial cost

MoreCashThanDash, if you're not blown away with the useable space in an SMax you won't be blown away with the Galaxy. They are the same car, the only difference being that the Galaxy has a squarer back end to give adults in the 6th and 7th seats a bit more headroom. So no more usable space than an SMax. More useful for bikes in the back if you've got the internal rack system as with the SMax I have to remove the seatpost or lower the dropper. In a Galaxy I'd probably not have to.

I'm struggling to think of a larger car-based MPV than the SMax/Galaxy in terms of interior space.

Test drove a couple of MPVs this weekend: C4 Grand Picasso and S-Max.

Grand Picasso was a nice place to be with lots of gizmos and gadgets. Fold down tables for the kids were a nice touch as was the huge windscreen. I wasn't sure of the build quality and the EGS gearbox wasn't very smooth in either auto or manual mode. A quick Google suggests this is a common grumble, which doesn't instil confidence.

The S-Max was a much nicer drive. It felt more like a "normal" car and definitely had more poke and better weighted steering. What puts me off is that they seem to be very expensive for "just" a Ford. For my budget I can get a Picasso with 30k on the clock or an S-Max with twice that!

I still want to try a 5 Series 😉

None the wiser 😆

The BIL has a Grand Picasso it just needs and ice cream sign on the top to make it complete

* other mpvs and opinions are available

Whilst this thread has probably long since expired, I thought I'd share the latest...

Test drove a 5 series estate last night. Loved it. The build quality puts things like the Picasso to shame and unsurprisingly it was lovely to drive. I want one.

Unfortunately it is simply too small. The tailgate slopes too much and the boot floor is quite high, making the boot too small for what I need to get in it. Space across the back 3 seats was tight too. I'll have one, just not yet.

So, back to the MPV dilemma. I really can't get on with the Citreon EGS gearbox yet, but the Picasso looks a great place for my kids to be. S-Max a much nicer drive but a lot more money. Am I sacrificing too much of what makes me enjoy driving just to get a family bus? 😆

I was contacted by the Ford dealership who sold me my SMax 5 yrs ago as cars of the spec and mileage of mine are rare and saught after, so I said I might be interested in doing a deal on a new version with the 2.2TDCi engine i've currently got with the Powershift (i.e. double clutch) auto box. They had a less than year old one in with 3k miles on the clock, full spec for just under £23k (a bit over my buget unfortuntely). I looked at what equivalent Audi A6 Avant or BMW 5 Series Touring i can get for that cash and it was mid spec at best three or so yr 30k mile cars. You pay a hell of a premium for that brand. I wouldn't mind so much but they're not exactly leagues ahead of Ford for build quality or reliability these days. You've got to really want one.

As to the enjoyment of driving, that's what the wife's car is for. The family bus is a functional tool - and is a very good drive for just driving normally, but if I want a fun blast I take the wifes car. Unfortunately she's got a dire Fiat 500 which I loath and detest and takes motiring back 40yrs in terms of refinement and performance, but i'm talking her round to a BMW1 series.

I'm on to our second smax. Surprised to see a complaint about usable space and I think they are huge. Much more usable space than my Santa-Fe that we just got rid off and that was a much bigger vehicle

We headed down south last week with a outwell montanna 6 person tent which is huge, all of our camping stuff (my wife likes buying camping accessories) clothing, toys etc in the boot and could still see out of the rear view mirror. Three kids all on separate seats, great drive and averaged 48mpg. Really cannot complain at all.

I like the S-Max. The only reason I'm looking at other MPVs is that Fords are expensive in comparison to the Citreons, Renaults, Vauxhalls etc

Am I sacrificing too much of what makes me enjoy driving just to get a family bus?

i think thats what makes MPVs so good, you need to forget the driving experience its all about practicality and simplicity. What your looking for is something you can just open the boot and throw stuff in, particularly a pram.
We had a Fiat Multipla as our last car, and its probably my favourite from cars i've owned. looks where dodgy, had no extras inside, but hugely practical. now have a volvo v50 estate, with all the extras, and would change back to a multipla again without hesitation.

I think any of the suggestions above will probably make a good car, i'd probably go for whatever ones offers the best deal at the time.

^wise words. Practicality and cost and the priorities. I need to remember that.

You can get a Grand Picasso with a 160hp full automatic gearbox. There are a few out there

our 55 Grand Scenic has been awful this last year

Bills probably 3 times its value

Timing belt, service and water pump (thats a service not a repair)

Then Exhaust gas resurculation thing

Then we needed a new turbo

Mate has an 04 which he calls his clown car. Amazingly he has spent more than us. Window motors, electric hand brake etc, dash black out..

But I have heard that the mark three is better

My conclusion was when it goes pop again its a Toyota Verso

The Fords command a premium over the French stuff as they are a lot more reliable and easier to work on when and if things go wrong.

Ive just changed the rear discs and front and rear pads for £135 all in for quality Pagid stuff.

Plus they look better to...........

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In an unexpected turn of events we decided not to buy outright but instead we're going to lease a VW Sharan...

....if any of you give a flying wotsit any more 😆

We've just bought a 12 year old 2.5v6 petrol Bongo.
Fuel consumption is horrendous, but it has sleeping, a big rack on the back for bikes, a fridge, a gas stove, and when I fix it water in a sink.
...and we might manage to get away from work at least one weekend every month.