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Embarrassing, but I've recently had a referral to orthopaedics in relation to knee osteoarthritis and potential knee replacement knocked back due to my BMI being too high. Also for being too young (54) but thats another battle as my other knee was replaced 6 years ago, but I was 5/6 stone lighter.
Anyway I'm desperate to lose the weight as soon as I can to get a re-referral as even a recent steroid injection hasn't helped as much as I'd hoped. I have already restarted MFP and do as much as my knees and joints and other health issues allow at the gym for strength and ebike when knee and weather allows.
I am a well built stocky guy with size 13 feet so BMI has never worked for me anyway, but regardless I do need to lose a shit ton of fat.
Any experiences?
Ta.
You've managed the biggest battle which is having a good, identifiable reason for losing weight. That's what gets you through the tough times as losing weight is tough. If you don't have that it can be easy to give up
For me I didn't have a huge amount to lose but I used MFP over a week to baseline how much I actually took in each day. I then took 500 cal/day off of that total and that helped me lose around 500g/week. 500g/day isn't too bad really and I did it without changing any diet, mainly stopping snacking. You end up a a bit hungry but in a manageable way and the weight comes off slowly but reliably. Try and lose much more and it seems you start messing with your basic metabolic rate and you then have to start doing other funny things to counteract that effect.
slow and steady for me so it's a lifestyle change rather than a short weight loss then back to normal.
Cheers, appreciate that input, but I'm just after experiences of the weight loss injections. I know what to do in terms of weight loss, and I know slow and steady is the way, but I really want to get through this BMI road block to see orthopaedics as soon as I can. I need to lose 17kg as a minimum I think, ideally 27kg for BMI of 30.
My weight has rocketed due to being out of work with a number of health conditions, so other than when I can get to the gym or out on my bike I'm largely stuck in the house. Load bearing kills after no time, push the trolley around the supermarket and I'm in lots of pain and needing the sofa when I get home. Ironically my biggest love (other than cycling) has always been walking/hiking and has been my 'profession' before health issues stopped work.
I've set my daily calories at 2300 which is probably atleast 700 cals below maintenance for me.
I've researched this a lot and have come to the conclusion that it works.
I'm happy to go through my situation but for the sake of the OPs question, I think you'll get great results from it given your circumstances.
However, the NHS won't just put you on it without trying regular weight management protocols first - these can last 12 weeks to 12 months before they send you up a tier and onto the drugs.
I'm 52 and currently going through the NHS - very early stages so nowhere near drug referal.
If you want to use it privately, there seems to be plenty of places offering it for around £200 a month after what are probably some 'easy' questions.
So in short, I'd expect the drug to work for you - getting it is another matter.
I dated someone who had used it very successfully. Didn't sound like there were any downsides.
On another note, did the GP offer to refer you to a weight-loss programme at all?
My employer provides these in various parts of the country and they can be very helpful. You often don't even need a referral. They are free to the end user BTW.
Cheers.
No GP didn't offer a referral at all despite some discussion, and tbh at the time I was a bit in shock/upset so not thinking straight with other questions about what i could do for my knee . I have search my NHS trust and there's possibly a clinic they can refer to but it's basically a 2 hour round trip and then other delays as you say with referrals and other programmes first. They did have some other local clinic but doesn't look like it's still running and my BMI is too high for that 🙄
BMI is 39 as of this morning, apparently when they weighed me about 5 weeks ago it was 40.5, but that was in clothes (thankfully minus size 13 shoes 🤣)
We're prepared to pay the £200 for a handful of months from savings if it gets me near where I need to be. I was looking at it on the Superdrug online doctor thing.
I have ordered some knee sleeves that should help for when I go to the gym or shopping/out and about, and looking at re-organising my gym routine to not load my knees (no deadlift/bent over row/RDLs standing presses/ (box) squats, but do some machine leg work.
Be great to hear from anyone (or S.O.) who's used it to see if they felt ok on it, side effects etc.
Asda Online will prescribe wegovy if you meet thier criteria which I think is either BMI of over 30 or 27 with a weight related health issue, there's a few questions to answer (general health) and I think prices start at £169 for a 4 week course of 0.25 injectables. If you have diabetes or kidney issues you may get rejected though.
Does it work? Broadly yes, some pts I know at my practice have reported experiencing diarrhoea and nausea , stomach cramps and so on, and some folks don't tolerate it it, but as a single weekly injection I've seen committed pts lose a shit tonne (technical term) and they say it's convenient, easy and works.
Cheers Nickc,
Didn't realise Asda did it, might be more convenient as the nearest Superdrug to collect from is 2 hour round trip, though they do post with a special courier.
No diabetes or kidney issues, blood pressure is fine. Mainly just have knackered joints, ME/CFS, sleep issues.
If you're comfortable sharing which local authority you are under (who you pay council tax to), I can have a quick look for you?
We certainly offer remote sessions to people in many of our areas.
I think this would be your local provider:
https://www.nhstayside.scot.nhs.uk/OurServicesA-Z/NutritionandDieteticService/PROD_361040/index.htm
Looks like you may need a referral from GP, or perhaps a nurse at the surgery could do it.
Good luck with the injections. It will be interesting to see how well it works
Cheers 👍
Well I've ordered the Mounjaro from Superdrug as it's supposed to be more effective still than Wegovy, the order has been approved. You also have to send photo of yourself from the front and one looking down at the scale with the weight on it, as well as some general health questions.
It should be here tomorrow, but probably won't start it until Monday as I'm away next weekend and they're weekly injections that need to be stored in the fridge.
I'll update my experiences here for any one else.
they’re weekly injections that need to be stored in the fridge.
Do you do the injections yourself? Are they the single shot clicky type things?
Yeh you do them yourself in to your stomach, front thigh, or upper arm. I had to do blood thinner shots in my stomach after my other knee replacement, so I know what to expect, not great fun, but not an issue.
Apparently it's one injector pen with 4 x weekly doses in it. The first month is 2.5mg a shot, then it increases each month upto 15mg per shot maximum depending how it goes for you.
Didn’t sound like there were any downsides.
There certainly are - I listened to an interesting podcast on Ozempic, etc recently (Science Vs) and the main one is muscle loss and possibly bone density - much more so than if you were to lose weight in a more gradual way. Definitely something to be aware of. They also mentioned the nausea/vomiting issue but that doesn't affect everyone the same apparently!
and the main one is muscle loss and possibly bone density
But if you're exercising regularly, that shouldn't be an issue. I did read an American study that pointed out this very thing, but the study was based around very elderly folks taking weigh loss injectables. How much of an issue it would be for a n active 50 year old is probs moot.
Didn’t sound like there were any downsides.
There certainly are
I meant there weren't any downsides for the lady in particular, it had been overwhelmingly positive.
I know very little about the drugs myself, but perhaps they're like vaping as a harm reduction tool - massively better than smoking but not without issues.
Obviously there are potential side effects with any medication, the main likely ones with this being some nausea, diarrhea or constipation which apparently eases as you get used to it. As with anything a long list of other possibilities.
This one isn't ozempic but tirzepatide which uses a couple of different hormones to control appetite. Tried to copy and paste the details but it all went a bit crazy and CBA typing it.
Yeh I'm doing strength training at the gym and part of my diet is ensuring plenty of protein too.
I'm intrigued by these drugs and I am tempted.
As a Novo Nordisk share holder I think they are great.
They have a tablet version of Wegovy in development that's is a couple of years away, I reckon once it's available it will be very popular.
They have a tablet version of Wegovy in development that’s is a couple of years away,
More than that I think. There are some huge hurdles to overcome to get these drugs to work in tablet form, but yes, if they do get to that stage, it'll be crazy popular.
The guy who runs a diabetes podcast I listen to (he's not a diabetic), has been using Wegovy. He's covered his his experience over a few episodes.
He seems to be very happy with the results.
Google "Juicebox Podcast Wegovy"
You may be better off calorie counting. Hard, potentially slow, but that can help build ‘eat less, move more’ habits that are sustainable.
once on any of these you will likely stay on them.
They seem to have an emerging set of associated benefits which may appeal.
and always read the label.
the black box warnings may be of interest.
https://dailymed.nlm.nih.gov/dailymed/downloadpdffile.cfm?setId=ee06186f-2aa3-4990-a760-757579d8f77b
https://dailymed.nlm.nih.gov/dailymed/drugInfo.cfm?setid=adec4fd2-6858-4c99-91d4-531f5f2a2d79
etc
I am calorie counting with MyFitnessPal and moving as much as my body allows (strength training and ebiking) as in the original posts. This is to help speed that up so that I can get my BMI low enough for a re-referral to orthopaedics sooner rather than later, as they knocked my referral back due to BMI being too high.
I know weight loss is 80% diet (or there abouts), but when you're not very mobile due to knee arthritis it's not so easy.
Will check out that podcast 👍
Apologies for the slightly wobbly source, and I'm not against the medication in any way (I know nothing about medicine) but isn't one of the concerns that if you want to keep the weight off, you have to keep taking the medication? Not that there's anything wrong with that - plenty of people have to take medication indefinitely - I am just mentioning/asking.
Well it's something I've wondered about as it does mess with those hormones, the same as when someone stops a diet and puts weight back on.
I am trying to sort my eating out too, so that I'm not relying only on the jabs to lose weight, it's an added help to get me to the BMI where orthopaedics will see me.
The hope is that I can get my BMI down enough to get my knee looked at and sorted out so that I can be more active which, along with better eating, with help keep it off.
How are these drugs working inside you to make you lose weight?
Suppresses the appetite?
Increases metabolism?
Can you carry on eating more than you should and still lose weight?
Google...
Mounjaro helps with weight loss by decreasing food intake and slowing down how fast food travels through your digestive tract (called gastric emptying). This may help you to feel fuller for a longer period of time and reduce how much food you eat. Studies show this action may occur in the brain.
Mounjaro is a single molecule that activates glucose-dependent insulinotropic polypeptide (GIP) receptors and glucagon-like peptide-1 (GLP-1) receptors. GIP and GLP-1 are both natural incretin hormones.
GIP has been shown to decrease how much you eat and increase your energy expenditure, which results in weight loss. When combined with a GLP-1 receptor agonist, this may result in greater positive effects on blood glucose and body weight.
Mounjaro also slows the movement of food from the stomach into the small intestine. As a result, you may feel full more quickly and for a longer period of time, so you eat less.
In this order; cut out all ultra processed foods and seed oils. Quit alcohol. Then gradually go low carb (keto). Over a period of say 3 months aim to get fully fat adapted before going full on carnivore. Beef, butter and eggs will do. No need for expensive cuts of meat like rib eyes. 20% mince is fine. Lidl do nice grass fed beef mince.
Ive done all this. Lost over 3 stone. Lowered my blood pressure and got rid of my arthritis. My weight to height ratio (not BMI) is bang on. Im developing a ‘six pack’ without any exercise other than walking as part of my day job. Im 53, feel 23, in fact better. No brain fog, no depression, no aches and pains.
What you eat is 95% of it. Good luck.
I don't drink alcohol anyway, nor fizzy pop other than the odd full fat coke on a long ride (but thats been a long time). Drinks are decaf tea & coffee, and fizzy water.
I did do low carb some years ago which worked and I'm heading towards that again, but I've no plans to go full keto or carnivore.
My doctor yelled at me about fizzy water. Said it increases the size of your stomach and reduces feeling of fullness, and is bad for teeth. 🙁
Surely its worth a go? Whats 12 weeks in the scheme of things if it deals with your ailments? If you try carnivore and it works you can if you so wish begin to slowly reintroduce other foods. Keep a food diary, if you notice symptoms returning you can then attribute them to certain foods which you can then cut out for good. I’d rather go without some foods and be pain free.
"More than that I think. There are some huge hurdles to overcome to get these drugs to work in tablet form, but yes, if they do get to that stage, it’ll be crazy popular."
It passed a clinical trial a couple months back, but its still a way off.
As mentioned above, losing muscle could be an issue as you won't want to eat anything. As this fellow found.
For the op to speed up weight loss this approach may help.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1H_tRpD9ZJ0
As James said the studies weren't done on people strength training and prioritising protein, which will help minimise muscle loss. Bear in mind that on any weight loss diet you likely to lose muscle too, and have a chance of putting it back on afterwards.
If it helps me not fixate on food and change that mindset (as some have noted it does ) I'll be very happy. I can't bear to throw away food, or not finish what I've paid for if eating out. Plenty have said the 'food noise' goes away and you've not got a constant drive for food, as it if retrains.your brain, and if it does I'll be over the moon.
But as I said the immediate priority is to get the stupid BMI number down as soon as I can to access orthopaedic consultation.
Anyway it's arrived, so we'll see how it goes...
I would be worried about what happens if you're taking it long term.
Perhaps over time you readjust and increase your food intake.
What happens when you stop taking it? Do you balloon up?
Looking forwards to the progress @longdog
Please keep us updated with highs and lows when you can.
I'm especially interested in what it does for hunger needs against hunger desires - eg habitual eating.
I suffer a lot with eating through habit, and if this helps take that away, I can see it being great and not as bad as it could be coming off the drug, once the habit is broken.
A good friend of mine is using Mounjaro, she has been on it for 4 weeks (5 injections) and lost a stone. She has said there is no hunger and her cravings have pretty much vanished as well. She was someone who always craved a sugar hit/adored chocolate but this has gone completely.
Be aware that there is an issue with getting the 7.5mg dose pen at the moment. You will have a few weeks before you are at that point, but it's proving difficult to purchase. The info at the moment is saying to stay on 5mg until the 7.5mg is available, however the feedback from other users is that the weight really starts coming off at 7.5 and above
Please dont take meds to lose weight. Just cut carbs and seed oils and the weight will go. No muscle loss if you eat healthy fats and protein. Most Drs in the UK get little to no nutritritional training so are not best placed to advise you as they simply dont know the facts.
Semaglutide tablets are available on the nhs and I’ve seen patients get really good results so possibly an option for your GP?
As the fat is lost quickly, the skin doesn’t always have time to shrink as with a gradual weight loss program. It can look like you’re in a skin bin bag…
Also worth doing some research into the mental health side effects as well.
FFS! Typed out along response and then the website did it's thing and poof! It's gone.
Those urging caution or not to use it. Be reassured I'm not doing it lightly and have been looking into it. I'm not happy that it's come to this, but hope it helps. I was after peoples direct experience/knowledge of the medication, not yet another diet thread. I've bought it,so will be seeing how it goes for the first month and take it from there.
I did the first jab this morning and can't say I've noticed anything particular one way or the other so far, but only 4 hours.
I was already feeling a bit fatigued and thick headed from the start of dieting (2300/day max) anyway with a massive drop of water weight (2.1kg in 4 days). Been drinking loads and taking electrolytes. Gym Friday and this morning was noticeably harder with the deficit and failed a lift. We'll see how it is once this 'kicks in', but I'm going to have to change it up somewhat to account for the energy.
See how I feel later today, but I wasn't feeling particularly hungry after the gym, just tired.
Roast chicken dinner for tea and plan to have a small amount as I know most side effects come from eating too much volume, or rich & sweet stuff due to it slowing gastric emptying.
I'll update how things go...
Good luck bud
Sounds like the feeling I get in the first 48 hours of a full Keto diet. Fatigue, headache etc, and top-end power reduced on the bike. If it's a similar thing, it does get better.
Oddly enough, no, but I have lost 5kg in two weeks, a big chunk in the first week being water weight and clearing out the system I'd guess.
Had two injections so far (3rd will be this Sunday) and had no side effects. The injections are a non-event the needle is so small you don't even feel it.
I'm limiting myself to 2300 cals a day max and do get a bit hungry at times as I try to save plenty of my calories for my evening meal with family, but I've had no cravings for crisps/sweets/cake etc even when I've gone to the shops for bits we need or after the gym.
Talking of gym, that performance has taken a hit, but I'm just maintaining the intensity with a bit less volume. That's hitting the ego a bit as before this my main lifts were progressing nicely. Sadly reducing BMI also means they're struggling and not increasing, but priorities...
At this stage I'm thinking I'll get another month (dose should go up to 5mg iirc) and see how it continues.
Sounds like good progress to me, keep it up. 5kgs is good going.
Cut out the carbs and seed oils and eat beef, lamb, butter and eggs instead. It really is [s]that simple[/s] bro science
eat beef, lamb, butter and eggs instead.
user name checks out
Mr Lambchop, losing weight is simple as you say - that's why civilised, intelligent people struggle with it and have done for many years, myself included.
However, this thread is not about dieting. It was not set out that way, nor should it be derailed by taking it down that road.
Apologies @longdog , but thanks for the update. All seems to check out so far as you say, with the expected 'side effects' associated in weight training.
Worth it for the end result I'd say. 🙂
I am no expert on these injections, but i am T2 diabetic, so discussion of these injections has been all over T2 FB pages and forums for a long time.
Consensus seems to be that it does the job well, but that it can't be the only thing, many place the weight back on when they stop them, and that there has to be a lifestyle move to go with it (not aimed at OP)
OP, if you doing it to try and get ready for medical assessment, i think you could probably bring down your daily calories to around 1800-1900 and wear a heart rate monitor, make sure then that you gym work and e-biking is mostly done in zone 2 so you're working in that aerobic zone, and trying to use fat as the predominant energy source in the short term.
Like most diets nearly all put the weight back on or even more when they stop, is this the stuff Sharon Osbourne is on?
If it helps me not fixate on food and change that mindset (as some have noted it does ) I’ll be very happy. I can’t bear to throw away food, or not finish what I’ve paid for if eating out. Plenty have said the ‘food noise’ goes away and you’ve not got a constant drive for food, as it if retrains.your brain, and if it does I’ll be over the moon.
IIRC it works on the pancreas like dulaglutide so you don't get that "hit" from eating sugary foods. You still have to not eat them though but it might reduce the cravings if you feel the need to regularly snack.
Like most diets nearly all put the weight back on or even more when they stop
I know someone who's been prescribed them for years because as soon as they stop their appetite just comes back with vengeance. Doesn't help that even when on it they're partial to multiple treats a day. So they're basically stuck on them for life unless they develop the willpower to not shop in Costco.
Like most diets nearly all put the weight back on or even more when they stop,
There was something about that this week:
https://www.healthline.com/health-news/slowly-coming-off-ozempic-wegovy-may-prevent-rebound-weight-gain
So health coaching and/or having an ongoing plan appears to be key.
Fascinating that it also apparently lowers risk of heart disease and stroke (regardless of weight loss) IIRC from the news this week?
I'm surprised at the frequent polarised views om this thread suggesting either drugs or diet. Both things can be correct.
The OP has made a well informed decision to try the drugs, good decision. But, as others point out, weight often goes back on when ending the treatment, so diet will be critical to maintain the weight loss.
For what it is worth, I have been following Keto diet for past 5 weeks and lost 8kg. Keto does work but I'm not for one second saying the OP is wrong to chose the path he has.
Well done OP for getting on with it! Losing weight is not easy, whichever path you take.
it does work, but the bulk of the rapid weight loss in the early days is water, not fat, which if you stop keto and carb up again will come straight back!!For what it is worth, I have been following Keto diet for past 5 weeks and lost 8kg.
Well I wasn't sure whether to respond to my latest shout out, but as there seems some more nuanced views I will.
When I last weighed on Tuesday I was 11.8kg / 26lbs down, BMI down to 35.6 I'm currently away from home as my mam's in hospital so probably wont be able to update that until Monday.
I'm now on 5mg a week, due to take my 3rd 5mg when I hopefully get back home on Sunday/Monday. When I went up to 5mg I was ok for the first half of the week and then had the most horrendous shits day and night for several days, truly a nightmare disaster pants situation! Never had anything like it for so long! Nothing could stop it! We only have one bathroom so I had to hide a bucket and loo roll in the garden just incase someone was in when I need to go NOW! and again NOW!!
Thankfully that's settled now. When I take my next dose I will be splitting it over the week to hopefully avoid that, so 2 half doses 4 days apart to avoid one big bit and then tail off (half life is 5 days). Half a dose is 30 clicks on the pen, full is 60, makes sense if you ever use one.
I'm still at a max of 2300cals a day, but been lucky to make 2000 most days unless I deliberately eat something extra before the gym. Exercise is push pull legs 5x5 plus accessories , and then whatever ebiking or hobbling about my knee allows. Not much of anything the last week though due to the disaster pants and now being away. Obviously HR will peak at times in the gym, but walking and cycling is essentially at Z2 anyway due to keeping HR down with heart issues I have.
I'm still not craving food or hangrily tied to meal times like I was. No cravings for sweets, crisps , biscuits, cake etc and have had no issue turning them down. Went to the pictures to see Fall Guy and had no snacks unlike family and was fine with that.
Other than that truly nightmare period of disaster pants it's all going great. Planning to return to GP when my BMI is just below 35 to request re-referral to orthopedics for my knee. Losing 26 lbs hasn't made any difference to it.
As for diet/ mounjaro rebound, obviously I'm well aware of the potential, and it's the same with any 'diet'. Also been looking into refeeding and reverse dieting to boost metabolism. Is the alternative not to lose weight? And my diet for the 2000-2300 is not a fad diet it's just normal healthy food in smaller portions and not eating the other crap. I'd say the biggest thing for me has been it killing the hunger, cravings and food noise.
Hope some of you find that update useful.
Sounds like it's going well.
Yea the squits is a feature from what I've heard 😂
Edited reply - missed point of post! Ignore!
As for diet/ mounjaro rebound, obviously I’m well aware of the potential, and it’s the same with any ‘diet’. Also been looking into refeeding and reverse dieting to boost metabolism. Is the alternative not to lose weight? And my diet for the 2000-2300 is not a fad diet it’s just normal healthy food in smaller portions and not eating the other crap. I’d say the biggest thing for me has been it killing the hunger, cravings and food noise.
Hope some of you find that update useful.
You don't need "diets", you don't need keto, you don't need fasting, or a "refeeding and reverse dieting (not even sure what that one is)", you need a consistent, well thought out calorie deficit that is sustainable to you day in, day out.
All diets are simply you eating less calories than you your body needs per day.
Keto advocates will go on about them, but it is still just a calorie deficit, but it is a diet that is high in saturated fat, low in quality low GI carbs and low fibre, that it is not healthy even if you lose weight, and i'll fight anyone on that argument!
Everyone is looking for the magic bullet, there isn't one, eat less and eat well, move more, stay hydrated and keep the "treats" in moderation.
Appreciate the update OP, well most of it 😀
Glad to hear it's doing the job for you.
You don’t need “diets”, you don’t need keto, you don’t need fasting, or a “refeeding and reverse dieting (not even sure what that one is)”, you need a consistent, well thought out calorie deficit that is sustainable to you day in, day out.
Everyone is looking for the magic bullet, there isn’t one, eat less and eat well, move more, stay hydrated and keep the “treats” in moderation.
Everyone knows this but people differ in their will-power/motivation to stick with a diet that has a calorie deficit. People aren't all thinking an ice cream and a mars bar is 2 of your 5 a day.
At the end of the day human biology and basic instincts haven't evolved at nearly the pace we have progressed as a species. The old hunter-gather lifestyle is a thing of the distant past for many people (and certainly a large majority in the UK and other developed countries). We're also bombarded with cues about indulging and over-eating.
Whilst I agree there's no magic bullet, these new drugs (if they turn out to be safe to consume over long periods) could be the answer some people need to keep their calorie intake under control whilst also succumbing to some of the indulgences of modern life. The alternative seems to be an ever-growing obesity problem, messaging about healthy eating clearly isn't working.
Keto advocates will go on about them, but it is still just a calorie deficit, but it is a diet that is high in saturated fat, low in quality low GI carbs and low fibre, that it is not healthy even if you lose weight, and i’ll fight anyone on that argument!
I tend to agree that Keto is, for most people, not sustainable in a healthy way over a long period. I found it very effective at managing appetite and cravings during a few months last year, then transitioned into a 'meat and four veg' type thing for the longer term, with a lot more fibre and reintroducing carbs here and there, but at much lower levels than before.
There's no one-size-fits-all diet, everyone is dealing with their own mix of hormones, metabolism and psychology/motivation.
The new drugs do seem almost too good to be true though. The holy grail is fooling the body into thinking that it's stuffed to the gills.
my sis in law was paying for injections for a while, she lost a bit of weight, but not sustainably, I think her downfall was booze tbh
Im not sure its the magic bullet it seems and like every medication from paracetamol to chemotherapy, different people have different genetics and the effects will vary
Im not doing it down, just not be aware theres still effort required on the users part
You don’t need “diets”, you don’t need keto, you don’t need fasting, or a “refeeding and reverse dieting (not even sure what that one is)”, you need a consistent, well thought out calorie deficit that is sustainable to you day in, day out.
I agree, someone posted a James Smith video up there and in between all the shouting he does occasionally explain some good ideas. e.g. start your calorie counting on a Friday. There's no point counting your weekly calories Monday to Friday then having a beer and treats at the weekend. Count your weekend properly, then spend the week trying to work off the inevitable debt.
He's also fond of pointing out that whatever it is, all successful diets boil down to a calorie deficit. Whether it's intermittent fasting, keto, slimfast, raw foods, paleo, or anything else.
There is a magic bullet but is considered batshit by most people. Mainly because most people have no idea what they’re talking about and it flies in the face of what we have been told for many years.
The holy grail is fooling the body into thinking that it’s stuffed to the gills.
I think the problem is modern diet and life has killed normal satiety for a lot of people, add in some work frustrations, family stress and money worries and eating healthily can be a problem that can be hard to cope with on those peoples day to day priorities.
These modern drugs look to take out that problem of satiety, bring people to normal levels that the shouty "just eat healthy" crowd already have.
I have been thinking about using them but also could do with perhaps talking to a councillor about the stress in my life.
I read an article in The Times magazine a few weeks ago and the conclusion from the sceptic author (who tried them and spoke to many specialists) was these type of drugs will be a game-changer for health.
They are at the very early stage in their development and the potential savings for healthcare could run into billions.
good work!
I thought it was supposed to suppress appetite/make you feel full? 2000 cals seems like a lot compared to most on it! How much were you eating before?!I’m still at a max of 2300cals a day, but been lucky to make 2000 most days
I’m still at a max of 2300cals a day, but been lucky to make 2000 most days
I thought it was supposed to suppress appetite/make you feel full? 2000 cals seems like a lot compared to most on it! How much were you eating before?!
Blatantly 2000-2300 calories isn't a lot FOR ME, otherwise I'd not have lost all that weight would I? Everyone is different, maybe if you were a well built large framed guy you'd be losing like me on 2000-2300 a day? How do you imagine I'd be functioning if I was on only day 1600 cals, and how sustainable would that be? With the meds I'm comfortable at that level, and hope that when I've got to the weight I want I'll be comfortable at around 2600 a day at that weight.
MSP I have previously done work with a therapist on my issues with food and exercise. It was very useful, but not a total 'cure', though 54 years of issues wasn't going to be an easy cure.
Refeeding is taking a day or two a fortnight while on a calorie deficit to eat at maintenance levels of cals (around 3000 clas for me) with higher levels of carbs to jig up the appetite hormones and metabolism. Google and read Lyle McDonald if you want to know more.
Anyway no more diet discussion for me; that's not why I started this thread.
Thanks longdog, keep up the good work and updates when you can, I am very interested to hear about your progress with this.
Thanks longdog - very interesting to hear your experience and it seems to be going well for you. Good luck
When I last weighed on Tuesday I was 11.8kg / 26lbs down,
That's an amazing achievement in such a short time, even if it's made little difference to your BMI [so far] its still going in the right direction. well done!
Yes, well done on your progress to date, please keep this thread updated with your progress
Cheers folk 👍
All diets are simply you eating less calories than you your body needs per day.
No they are about using more energy than you are able to obtain from your food and calories are really not that good an indication of what energy any one individual can obtain from any particular food. Like BMI they can be useful but you do need to be aware of the limitations.
I've eaten a mainly plant based diet for near on 40 years. When I first thought why am I eating this shit aged 19 I really cut out totally all things like crisps, sweets and chocolate. After a good long period of that I found I could happily eat them occasionally but I can take them or leave them. A bar of chocolate can last me weeks. I really enjoy it still but don't get cravings.
I think the great thing about these drugs is that they can give you a window to change your overall diet and make that shift a lot easier. If you don't do that then you'll probably need to be on them forever. It's also important to think about are you eating enough good things rather than just fixate on if you are eating too many "bad" things.
I think the great thing about these drugs is that they can give you a window to change your overall diet and make that shift a lot easier.
This is the nail on the head for me! I honestly cannot remember a time in all my 54 years when I have not had thoughts of food at the forefront of my mind all the time along with non stop cravings. I've hated it and hated myself because of it. Only as an adult on my late 20s did I suddenly realise that when someone puts a plate of biscuits out they're are just a selection for if you want one, not something that you need to finish off or even eat at all. I've hated buffets or if I had to go to an all you can eat place with people for years because I know I just cannot get a sensible plate of food and leave it. I can't stand wasted and left over food and would be that bin that dealt with it.
Unless this is you, you just simply cannot understand it.
With this injection the cravings have gone, the 'food noise' has gone, other than because of me thinking about food to plan ahead so that I can eat sensibly and healthy. This is that window of time where the noise has gone and I can hopefully retrain my mind to lose those life long ingrained habits so that I can lose the weight I need, and then keep it off with a total shift in my relationship to food.
Yeah that is my thoughts as well.
Is it prescribed on the NHS in the UK?
Here in Germany I can only get a private prescription for it, and it costs about 300 euros a month. Si if I am on it for 12 months that would be 3,5k. Which is pushing the limit of what I can afford, worth it if I can carry on that lifestyle change afterwards, but that financial commitment does mean I really want to make sure.