[Closed] Motorcyclist protesting helmet laws dies in bike crash while not wearing helmet

I can't imagine the level of smug, bilious, pathetic righteous indignation I'd find on the other side of that link.

We all die. He died doing something he enjoyed. It doesn't get better than that does it?

[i]I can't imagine the level of smug, bilious, pathetic righteous indignation I'd find on the other side of that link.[/i]

actually, the story sticks to the facts - didn't scroll down to see if there was a comments section.

What a moron. Hope he hasn't left too much devastation and grief behind.

Funnily enough it says "Comments (0)"

We all die. He died doing something he enjoyed. It doesn't get better than that does it?

Hmmm, don't know about that. I enjoy mountain biking but I'd rather not die doing it. I'd rather live a long and fruitful life and continue to do the things I enjoy and die peacefully in my sleep when I'm an old man.

C'mon guys... this isn't STW if one idiot doesn't come along and say they're glad he died for being stupid or something...

Seeing as this happened in America, it is a good lesson in the meaning of "irony" for them (if the clichés are to be believed).

It's his choose. He would have been safer in a car. Maybe he should have not been riding a motorbike at all.

it is a good lesson in the meaning of "irony" for them

Like rain on your wedding day 😕

How long before this descends into the usual "helmets should be worn v helmets do nothing debate"
End of the day motorbike riding is a dangerous activity, the consequences of bike accidents are usually worse than car accidents! Probably due to the fact you're just sliding down the road or through the air when you come off!

Like rain on your wedding day

Exactly, like ten thousand spoons when all you need is a knife, really annoying.

That's not ironic! Fool! I meant like...

Meeting the man of your dreams... and then meeting his beautiful wife.

That's ironic. Don't you think?

We all die. He died doing something he enjoyed. It doesn't get better than that does it?

With all due respect, a ridiculous way of looking at it.

We all die. He died doing something he enjoyed.

So did Elvis.

Just goes to show that life has a funny, funny, way of helping you out.

So did Michael Hutchence.

Life has a funny, funny way of hummm hummm hummmmmm things hummm ok.

traffic jam - **** it I'm already late

So did David Carradine

What a moron.

Hmmm, don't know about that. I enjoy mountain biking but I'd rather not die doing it

So did Michael Hutchence.

Well there we go - to quote TJ it's all about risk assessment, and whether it's wearing a helmet or biting the satsuma, we all make different assessments of risk.

Doesn't make everyone who participates in 'dangerous' activities a moron however, and to judge the deceased (RIP) with the limited facts of the article, makes the the 'moron comment' even more moronic. 🙄

We all die. He died doing something he enjoyed. It doesn't get better than that does it?

I disagree. You could do something you love and NOT die, then you could continue to do it more.

🙂

Doesn't make everyone who participates in 'dangerous' activities a moron however

now your putting words in my mouth! its moronic because he didn't wear a helmet and everyone with a brain knows that wearing a helmet whilst motorcycling is a good idea.

He was pronounced dead at Upstate University hospital, where doctors said he would have survived if he had been wearing a helmet.

So they very thing he was objecting to would have saved him

Baldspot

Not putting words in your mouth - you said he was a moron (and by definition, you included any other person who takes 'risks') without knowing any of the facts other than a helmet would probably have saved him. My point is that he may well have been highly intelligent and had fully assessed the risks before making his decision not to wear a helmet.

ps. the helmet/risk assessment thing has been done to death on numerous other threads, so I'm not going there.

and by definition, you included any other person who takes 'risks')

no i didn't! 😯

I saw this DM article too but didn't read it as I didn't want to read any smug comment to a sad occurence.

I'm a motorcyclist & would feel horribly vulnerable riding without a lid but I guess this guy did indeed make his choice. I know it ultimately cost him his life (perhaps) but other than the work for the medics & associated costs he wasn't hurting anyone else by his choice (unless we consider the risk of taking urgent paramedic support from another perhaps less selfish victim).

I guess it's the same as wearing a seatbelt in a car argument & finally this also comes down to the costs of both immediate & potentially long-term medicare.

With all due respect, a ridiculous way of looking at it.

Oops Bez that backfired didn't it

Now who's bigoted 😉

well that is a shot in the foot for the anti helmet group he was with.

but other than the work for the medics & associated costs he wasn't hurting anyone else by his choice

What about his family and friends?

Dying of old age really isn't as much fun as it sounds

Neither is dying too young, by the sound of it. Might as well go for a bike ride now and shoot yourself, otherwise..?

well that is a shot in the foot for the anti helmet group he was with.

Neither is dying too young, by the sound of it. Might as well go for a bike ride now and shoot yourself, otherwise..?

That's worth the risk and none of the governments business

It is when they are closing roads and paying someone to clean up the mess they are leaving

It is when they are closing roads and paying someone to clean up the mess they are leaving

I'd prefer to die skiing or mountain biking rather than a large piano falling on my head whilst I am sat at a desk at work.

Old age dying isnt all the fun some people above appear to think it is either... unless your very lucky!

Might as well go for a bike ride now and shoot yourself, otherwise..?

It's not just helmets. Riding a motorcycle is a dangerous thing to do. Drinking alcohol is a dangerous thing to do. Smoking fags is a dangerous (and really disgusting) thing to do.

The list is endless. It really is nobody else's business, particularly if you're putting yourself at risk and not others.

I'd prefer to die skiing or mountain biking rather than a large piano falling on my head whilst I am sat at a desk at work.

Ohh I dunno. That sounds grand to me!

[i]I'd prefer to die skiing or mountain biking rather than a large piano falling on my head whilst I am sat at a desk at work.[/i]

You'd probably get in the news for the latter which some might consider to be a plus.

I'm not sure it's about how you die, more what you did with your life beforehand, though?

So if you were not wearing a helmet and say ended up a vegetable locked into your own brain with no outside communication indefinitely, how d'you think you'd feel?

Would you be thinking 'ah well, what a great ride that was, glad I wasn't wearing a helemt!'

So if you were not wearing a helmet and say ended up a vegetable locked into your own brain with no outside communication indefinitely, how d'you think you'd feel?

Would you be thinking 'ah well, what a great ride that was, glad I wasn't wearing a helemt!'

He died doing something he enjoyed. It doesn't get better than that does it?

Note: I knew the outcome.

Alright then - what would you be thinking as you lay on the road in a pool of blood with the lights gradually dimming.. would you think 'I'm so pleased I've died young' or would it be something along the lines of 'wait, I'm not finished yet.. what about my wife and kids (or whoever)? I'll never go on another bike ride again! I never got to do x, y and z?'

You can come up with as many different scenarios as you like, it doesn't change what I said in context or the sentiment.

"Oh crap, I left the gas on."

What I was trying to say is that the prospect of an early death might seem benign when you are all fit and healthy running about, but when it's actually happening to you your point of view might be somewhat different - then it'll be too late.

I know what your trying to say but this is something that happened.

Two of my colleagues have died of cancer in the last 5 years, both their 40s. Dying on a motorcycle in your 50s is better.

Now, not dying on a motorcycle, or not dying of cancer and living forever would be better still, but that's a wish, not a comment on an actual event.

So we can conclude that having a motorcycle crash and not dying is better than having one and dying?

There is perhaps a valid question as to whether or not the govt should make us wear helmets or not. Actually not wearing one is daft though, to be fair.

I think we can conclude that everyone dies. The question is whether one death is better than another and whether how long you live matters.

He was an American and a knob - what more do we need to know?

BTW just come back from 2 weeks in India; never mind no helmet, most of them there ride in flip-flops too.

HALE is the important thing surely

If you enjoy something, you'd think you'd want to do as much of it as possible before you died. So from that point of view a longer life would be better for most of us.

If you enjoy something, you'd think you'd want to do as much of it as possible before you died. So from that point of view a longer life would be better for most of us

Living forever would be even better.

Yes.. I know he has already died.. but I'm trying to move on from that as a discussion of the issues that his death raises.

b r - Member
He was an American and a knob - what more do we need to know?

BTW just come back from 2 weeks in India; never mind no helmet, most of them there ride in flip-flops too.

A lot of the holiday makers (and locals) over in Greece were like that as well.

jeezus wept - some guy has died and so far he has been called a moron and a nob purely because he is American and wasn't wearing a helmet.

Some of you guys need a reality check and some sense of basic decency 🙄

[i]If you enjoy something, you'd think you'd want to do as much of it as possible before you died.[/i]

Of if you enjoy something, you'd think you'd want to enjoy it in its purest, most undiluted form, even if that carried a very slightly greater risk. Ask a TT rider whether they should stick to the speed limit because it's safer.

If wearing a helmet doesn't detract from your enjoyment even slightly then the decision is simple: more is better. If it does, then you're into value estimation and risk assessment and it's far from a straightforward calculation.

[i]jeezus wept - some guy has died and so far he has been called a moron and a nob purely because he is American and wasn't wearing a helmet[/i]

I've ridden m/c on the road for 30 years - anyone who thinks its safe to ride without a helmet is a knob IMO. I could never understand the 'hero-status' of Fred Hill when I was younger either.

http://wadmag.mag-uk.org/fred_hill.htm

It IS moronic not to wear a helmet whilst riding a motorbike. It's in the same league of stupidity as driving without a seat-belt or skydiving without a parachute.

Are some of you stupid enough to think that wearing a helmet will make you invulnerable to head injury and/or death? It may reduce the injury you suffer in a crash that is all. Could be the difference between dead or alive or just the difference in how much of a mess your wrecked body is to clear up & shovel into a coffin. Same goes for wearing leathers & other safety gear.

It is a matter of risk & everyone has their own idea of what is acceptable. Should you wear a helmet or seatbelt? Should motorcycling be allowed? Cars aren't risk free, should everyone be on trains.....I guess you just pick where you want to draw the line then tell everyone who thinks differently that they are wrong.

Its not cut and dry is it though. If you were riding around town at low speeds the extra viability and peripheral vision might be better for avoiding an accident in the first place.

I don't ride without helmet, gloves and leathers but sometimes I do think I would be more comfortable and less distracted if I was not.

I could never understand the 'hero-status' of Fred Hill when I was younger either.

Skydiving without a parachute is as stupid as riding a bike without a helmet......yeah right 🙄

If you protest about having to wear a helmet and you die doing this with a head injury what would you expect people to say?
Told you so may be distasteful but it is also accurate and it kind of proved the point as to why people think you should wear one.
Nothing is risk free but somethings massively increase your risk.

Woody people are suggesting you wear a helmet on a motorbike no one is suggesting a ban. Why not deal with that issue rather than some highly unlikely outcome of enforced helmet wearing

[i]It IS moronic not to wear a helmet whilst riding a motorbike. It's in the same league of stupidity as driving without a seat-belt or skydiving without a parachute.[/i]

If you're suggesting that those things are equally "stupid" then you clearly have no understanding of risk whatsoever.

Skydiving without a parachute is as stupid as riding a bike without a helmet......yeah right

If you're suggesting that those things are equally "stupid" then you clearly have no understanding of risk whatsoever.

i said the "same league" of stupidity, people, not that they equate. Do try and keep up! 😉

[i]i said the "same league" of stupidity, people, not that they equate. Do try and keep up![/i]

If you want to get into pedantics over semantics I'll rephrase my post so that it's clear: If you're suggesting that those things are [i]in the same league of stupidity[/i] then you clearly have no understanding of risk whatsoever.

Clear now?

Nothing is risk free but somethings massively increase your risk.

For all we know he could have been riding/cruising at the same speed as someone on a pushbike. There is a vast difference between someone cruising down a boulevard at 30mph and someone on a sports bike pushing it on the 'twisties'.

I take it all those posting that he is a moron/knob would be in favour of a compulsory helmet law for pushbikes?

Same league... your statement is up there vying for the stupidity title at the moment.

If you protest about having to wear a helmet and you die doing this with a head injury what would you expect people to say?

I'd expect opinion to be divided. Some will say it is your own fault for not wearing a helmet, some will say at least you were doing something you enjoyed and others will say what a shame, condolences to your family.

I will mostly be trying to avoid coming off in the first place helmet or not.

I take it all those posting that he is a moron/knob would be in favour of a compulsory helmet law for pushbikes?

It'll never get through parliament Junkyard 😉

[img] [/img]

If you want to get into pedantics over semantics I'll rephrase my post so that it's clear: If you're suggesting that those things are in the same league of stupidity then you clearly have no understanding of risk whatsoever.

Clear now?

Not really. I would say they are all stupid things to do. Some more stupid than others but all pretty stupid nevertheless. How do I then not understand risk?

If you protest about having to wear a helmet and you die doing this with a head injury what would you expect people to say?

If you go on a ride to support the wearing of helmets whilst wearing a helmet, and you die doing this with a head injury what would you expect people to say?

If you go on a ride to support the wearing of helmets whilst wearing a helmet, and you die doing this with a head injury what would you expect people to say?

Not quite the same thing tho CM. Someone doing that would be campaigning for completely different reasons than the poor deceased.

EDIT Ah bugger my quotes are now stuffed up as per TJ's thread.. shoulda kept my mouth shut.

Always sad when someone dies like this, however, I recently lost a much loved nephew in a M/c accident....all properly kitted up and everything, but thats not the point. We used to have the conversation about risk and the dangers, (I stopped riding after a spell at speedway which woke me up to my own mortality, so have a slightly negative view of it all). His response was along the lines of "I want to go with my boots on doing what I enjoy". All fair enough, apart from the fact he was out of it afterwards. His mum Dad, fiance and family were the ones left suffering and still are. So frankly IMHO people who are careless of their own safety are at best unthinking, and at worst selfish.

It'll never get through parliament Junkyard

Well, Cameron seems o have gone over the top with safety there. Ican't see how that big yellow seat belt will do him any good at all!

+1 BB.

b r - Member

He was an American and a knob - what more do we need to know?

Well I'd like to know how you justify that offensive bigotry.

No hang on ......... I don't really want to know.

I blame the teachers for going on strike.

Has anyone blamed Thatcher yet?