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I’ve always thought that the best way to be rich is to reduce my outgoings rather than increase the amount of time I spend at work.
That's a fantastically privileged position to be in though. Most people are muddling through.
I've tried to get the balance right over the years, sometimes erring towards more money, less time, but for the last 12 years definitely been sacrificing salary for time. What has made me more anxious about money is not myself, but my teenage daughters. Trying to make sure they get through education to get a reasonably well paid job and being able to afford their own home at some point is a major financial responsibility for parents. Many of us are probably from the generation that did better than our parents, but for most nowadays it is the other way around and probably getting worse with each decade, as inequality grows.
I've got my own ideas about holidays I've enjoyed or not so I've asked Madame for an alternative view. On the basis of her replies there's an inverse relationship between fun and cost. She cited visiting relatives with junior, cycle-touring with junior, skiing up the local hill with junior and top of the list visiting junior in Paris and cycling home on Bromptons (you may have noticed a trend there). 50e each for the TGV to Paris (it would be 69e today), accomodation already paid for as we were paying junior's flat, then cheap campsites or hotels up to Reims and back to Pau. About 700e more than if we'd stayed at home for a three-week holiday.
One of my favourites: Fill a rucksac with minimal camping gear, lock up the house and start walking, stop at Compostelle and get a bus home. Cost about 20e a day and a 50e bus each.
That’s a fantastically privileged position to be in though. Most people are muddling through.
It is.
1. I wish I'd had the courage to live a life true to myself, not the life others expected of me
2. I wish I hadn't worked so hard
3. I wish I'd had the courage to express my feelings
4. I wish I had stayed in touch with my friends
5. I wish that I had let myself be happier
I earn much more now than my sweet spot, but it will always be my time as a Corporal. T'was a perfect time of job satisfaction, with solid responsibility but free of bullshit politics and a wage that gave me a comfortable life.
My life as a civvie isn't bad, but it's not quite where i'd like it and I'm not sure I can get the balance that right again.
1. I wish I’d had the courage to live a life true to myself, not the life others expected of me
2. I wish I hadn’t worked so hard
3. I wish I’d had the courage to express my feelings
4. I wish I had stayed in touch with my friends
5. I wish that I had let myself be happier
Add another one.
6. I wish I was not stupid (me that is) or wish I had been wiser. (same thing just negative or positively framed)
7. I wish I could do it all again
My personal experience spending a lot of time around various folk is:
UHNW Richie rich people that work 25/8 usually enjoy it and life, even if they have 3x wives and 7x kids.
Champagne socialists living frugally working 0-25hrs a week to focus on their family usually love life.
The comfortably poor working 80hrs a week in the middle of the mid-high 40% bracket are usually miserable.
Basically working silly hours in the wrong industry, in the wrong role, for bad people, for average pay is the killer.
Spending 100k on a holiday shouldn't make anyone unhappy. Imagine someone saying all in to Whistler, pay for mates, with bikes, guides and uplift all paid for. How could that in itself make anyone unhappy if they could afford it?
I think there is an attitude to risk angle here too.
Some might be able to afford at this current moment in time to work less or get a better car, big holiday etc but will keep that money to pay the mortgage or mend the boiler etc in case they lose their job or interest rates shoot up. Others in the same position not worried about the future in the same way crack on and splash the cash.
This worry about money (or lack of it), rational or irrational can then impact how much of the mill you put yourself through with a job.
If he's spending a year's salary on a holiday, he could retire earlier, he just prefers not to.
My dad nailed it. Worked hard from leaving school. Engineer apprentice. Ended up a a partner in a civil engineering firm. At age 53 the work situation was that he either had to move from Scotland to London or quit. So he quit. Never worked for anyone again. Did a bit of travelling. A bit of consulting and played a lot of golf. Bit of local activism. Made it to 90 and was golfing into his late 80s. A few years after he left his firm was bought by a multinational. He would have been wealthy if he had kept going. On the other hand he had enough money for a simple lifestyle and got to see his grandkids because they lived in the same town not 400 miles away.
Me? Still working part time in my early 60s. Low stress job though with an irregular shift pattern. So irregular that while I knew I was off the rest of this week I just checked the calendar and I'm not back at work until March. Off to the highlands for 3 days walking later this week. I'll think about something to do next week at the weekend.
Golfing into late 80’s sounds good, nice to hear stories like that.
Not long after I left university, twenty years ago, I was working three days a week in a call centre. I had a lot of time on my hands to do fun stuff and no money. I was earning £600 a month and trying to pay rent, run a car and buy food from that. My mate from the same course had gone straight into a 'proper' job at Heathrow and was earning £40k, which for a new graduate twenty years ago was great. We worked out that he was spending longer every week commuting than I was actually working! I don't care what they were paying him, it's not worth that.
The other thing is I couldn't afford to do anything, but I'd do it anyway. I drive to the hills on my four-day weekend in my old broken Peugeot, which I slept in because I couldn't afford a hotel, and eat out of supermarkets. I had a great time riding bikes and running and whatever. My mates who could have driven up much more comfortably in their fancy cars, stopped in a posh hotel and eaten in the fancy restaurants couldn't come because they were at work...🤷 You can do most stuff on a shoestring if you don't have the money, you can do nothing if you have money and no time.
I've now got a mortgage on a wee flat with a garden and more bikes and a newer van, I earn pretty much the median wage, but even so I've turned down higher paid jobs to stick with my twelve mile commute (with an EWS stage on the way home if I fancy it) and four and a half day week and little stress. I can afford maybe two trips abroad each year and plenty of weekends away. I eat well but otherwise have minimal outgoings, I don't need to earn any more and am not prepared to put the time and effort in to do so, the time to do things i enjoy means a lot more to me. I'm happy
As far as I can see the only advantage to working harder and earning more is that you get to retire earlier, but anything could happen between now and then so I'm going to enjoy myself while I can
“Might get you a week at Centreparks……”
My family of five did a week at Center Parcs in December for £500! Obviously there was the diesel and the tunnel and some food on top of that but still…
Kramer - I’m not dissimilar to you. Airline Captain and I choose to work a 50% roster because whilst I enjoy my job, I also enjoy my family and my hobbies.
Im lucky, and will retire in 10 years at 60, with a deferred RAF pension and a decent DC pension from my 30 years in commercial aviation.
I am far happier spending £4k for a proper sailing holiday than 40k being fawned over on a gin palace. Many people I fly with want the big house in the Home Counties and private school for their kids. I’m happy with my choices. I get every Saturday off in the summer to play cricket, coach the kids and ladies teams, cycle with my mates, walk the dogs, take an active part in my village, and most days am a house husband. I do sometimes feel guilty with the salary I’ve given up, but it passes quickly!
I also echo with Relapsed Mandalorian - my carefree younger military days as a Flt Lt flying C-130s were wonderful, but definitely a uojng man’s game.
Just remember, no regerts.
I’d regret that choice of font, even if it’s spelled right! 😖
Walt Disney World with all the added billy big bollocks option boxes ticked.
So family all in matching Tshirts AND Trump Freedom Hitops?
not sure what the OP’s real question is now after reading the last few pages.
you pay your money and you take your choice. If you’re fortunate enough to do so.
I still recall doing a job I hated for several months back in the early 90s. That was no fun at all. And while it paid OK it wasn’t generous. A chance encounter with an old friend set me on a weird path that ended up with what I do now. Which, most of the time, is great.
More money please. It's not about me, I've got three dependents, the cash isn't for me, but I'd love to be able to go on a holiday together, it's out of the question currently. I can suck up quality of life inadequacies. I may well be making such a decision soon.
I'm curious what the perfect 'tipping point' is between comfort and money and a job which isn't too intrusive on your life.
I know I've gone beyond my own personal tipping point although it doesn't feel like a comfortable home and a relatively new (but second hand) car in the driveway are GROSS extravagances (I guess having a child was though 😂), but I still feel a guilty twinge, like I deserve a job which constantly stresses me out because of my lavish expenditure on a used Hyundai Tucson and a 3 bed new build in the middle of nowhere 🙄
Unfortunately in my industry they effectively need everyone to be their own managers, so you can't really just clock in and clock out having done an honest day's work every day because there is no way to shake the feeling that you need to do more, there is no yardstick against which to regularly compare progress and your time to get things done is constantly at the mercy of new tasks, new meetings etc. etc. but when things DON'T get done, you're accountable.
Just thinking out loud really, have been wrestling with this one for a while. First step is paying off the CC and then at least I can 'afford' a £5k paycut, not sure if that will let me step back in to a better QOL though...
Not far off my total take home pay for a year.
Jumping to lots of conclusions then they are doing private practice and therefore routinely working 7 days per week, and actually very few weekends off in a year
So yes your mate might be spending big , but actually how often does he actually just have a weekend off, I bet it’s rare
Mrs FD is a consultant surgeon and loves her job. She works long hours in the week and occasional weekends. Family wish she was home a little more at times but she enjoys it. Her job has given us holiday opportunities we wouldn’t otherwise
IMO the more you spend the less you do ie everything is done for you and you don’t need to think or move. Thats nice for a little while
Best holidays I’ve had though tend to be cheaper where you do have to think , and do stuff yourself
If he’s spending a year’s salary on a holiday, he could retire earlier, he just prefers not to.
I agree, but there can be a huge societal pressure to maintain a lifestyle.
We live in a large, draughty old house. We have 2 grown up children who don’t live with us and a 3rd who will be going to uni in the next couple of years. My view is that we should downsize fairly quickly, we then have more flexibility to change career/reduce hours or whatever. My other half is taking some persuasion, not just my choice.
And I see this x10 with wealthier family, a significant drop in lifestyle just isn’t on the cards for some.
+1 13thfloormonk, although I don’t have the debt I’ve become a bit obsessed with saving for the future. I like to think I’ve evolved into balanced life, good income, heavy on the savings but thoughtful quality purchases where needed.
I had an engineering job between school and college. Turn up, do work, bit of banter, clock out and get paid cash at 4pm on a Friday - most favourite job ever.
Now I’m facing a decision to chase a pinnacle of my career, or fade into relative mediocrity. I’m not good at big decisions.
I have always had too much time to sit and stare. Never worked more than 37 hrs a week and probably averaged 25. I made enough money for my lifestyle. I had loads of time to do stuff
I've retired at 60 on an income most of you would scoff at - but I am time rich to do stuff.
No regrets
I( strongly believe a lot of the unhappiness folk deal with in their lives comes from striving too much, working to many hours, not getting enough downtime / fresh air / exercise. Work to live don't live to work
As an observation as well - the families I know where both parents worked long hours the kids grew up with more issues than the families where one parent ( or both) cut their ambitions to look after their kids despite the second sort of family having a lot less money. The happiest kids where those who had a parent only working part time or not at all
i was asked the other day if i was planning to go for my bosses role when she leaves next month, i scoffed at it,
pay the taxman more money and get the extra stress and full calendar for probably less than £100-200 a month,
i already bought holidays to reduce my tax bill, i want to cut down to 4 days, be that no lunch those days and an extra 1/2 hour or just take the 7.5 hours off. i dont care
Can you have too much time to stop and stare. If you like it it's great and if you don't easily solved.
Can you have too much time to stop and stare.
too much in terms of it stopped me ( among other factors) having a successful career ( in many folks terms) but to me it was time well spent
On the basis of what you've posted here your career was one of the most successful on the thread. You did a job that improved people's quality of life rather than facilitating their greed or baser instincts and made enough money to enjoy life. Apart from a few issues you had with management you seemed happy in your job. Carers like teachers spend 90% of their time caring or teaching rather than doing dealing with company politics, admin, idiot colleagues... .
My view is that we should downsize fairly quickly, we then have more flexibility to change career/reduce hours or whatever.
Yeah I have had a similar conversation with my wife – she is of the view that we should remain in our 4-bed house for life – not particularly because she likes it, but simply because she says it would give the kids a larger inheritance. I am of the view that we should downsize and pay off our mortgage so we have more financial freedom. Even if we did what I think is the best approach, the girls would potentially end up getting around £250k each as inheritances (at today's prices) which is more than enough.
Money in your life is like oil in a gearbox. Too little and things don’t work, but once you have enough more doesn’t do much good. And you need to be happy it’s clean.
And even in reduced hours, you’ll spend a long time at work. So do something you like - though for reasons below don’t do something you love.
I never chased money, I’m still with the company I joined after university, but I enjoy work and enjoy sorting things and moving to the next challenge. I’m an engineer not because I studied engineering but because I’m a numerate problem solver and engineering is just a good application of that - it’s what I do and what I am.
Pretty senior these days, but my family are way ahead of the job and I have been very clear with the CEO about that. I coach cycling, I’m playing at learning French, I’m finally learning guitar, we ski/board together, we cycle together.
Money is not where it’s at, though I’m not averse to it. If I won the lottery tomorrow I’d be back in work the day after.
I want to keep working after I retire (albeit probably lower hours) because I like the rhythm, the challenges, the successes.
My father’s job was his passion and I never want that. When he eventually retired he went downhill fast because he’d lost the core of who he was.
As an observation as well – the families I know where both parents worked long hours the kids grew up with more issues than the families where one parent ( or both) cut their ambitions to look after their kids despite the second sort of family having a lot less money. The happiest kids where those who had a parent only working part time or not at all
Controversial view, but you might have a point.
believe a lot of the unhappiness folk deal with in their lives comes from striving too much, working to many hours, not getting enough downtime / fresh air / exercise.
+1
Posted before, but I'll pay again as I feel it is relevant to a lot of people....
The happiest kids where those who had a parent only working part time or not at all
The happiest kids come from families that cherish love and value them, it doesn't matter what the parents do for a living. I've known families that are equally unhappy with stay-at-home mums as those that have parents that work all the hours.
Just an observation from a statistically insignificant sample 🙂
The happiest kids come from families that cherish love and value them, it doesn’t matter what the parents do for a living. I’ve known families that are equally unhappy with stay-at-home mums as those that have parents that work all the hours.
I agree with this – my dad worked long hours when I was a kid (full-time job, working 5.5 / 6 days a week and had a part-time business on top) but we still managed to have lots of happy family memories and mum & dad always made sure family time was well spent. I just hope my kids end up with as many (or more) as I have.
If I won the lottery tomorrow I’d be back in work the day after.
Gloating sin't good. 😉 Back in to collect anything with sentimental attachment, say goodbye and disappear. Because lottery winners don't keep up the day job, they just don't.
Anyhow, the washing machine has finished so it's time to hang out the washing and blow some tyres up, Madame is on holiday.
I had a job I hated in my teens. Used to dread going to work. It's the worst feeling in the World. Just feels relentless with no end in sight.
Made a change at 21, a lot of luck at the timing and circumstance. Travelled the World, made good money and had a lot of fun.
Slight change in my 30's which led me to a very well paid, (IMO) but much more pressure. High risk projects and massive pressure to deliver.
Made a decision to step away completely just after COVID, for various reasons. When I made the decision it felt like I took a heavy rucksack off. Didn't realise how much pressure it was putting on me even when I wasn't there.
Me and the Mrs now run 3 small business. We work 6 days a week sometimes 7 in season but it's low pressure. We don't set an alarm, we get up when we wake up. In high season we start at about 10 or 11 and finish at about 5. We might have a few days that go longer.
We also live in a beautiful part of the World, have no commute, it's 10 minutes if we walk it. 2 minutes drive if we need to take stock etc.
There's a lot to be said in being your own boss.
Also, we have a very good income, similar to what we had when I worked full time but with much less pressure on us both.
I feel very lucky we are where we are. It's not for everyone but we love it.
If I won the lottery tomorrow I’d be back in work the day after.
Yeah, I think I probably would be too, for various reasons. Of course it's difficult to predict for sure how we'll react until we're actually in the situation.
If I won the lottery tomorrow I’d be back in work the day after.
If I won the lottery I would be in work only for as long as it would take to plan a succession, then I'd be getting an artist studio in my garden and re-learning to paint/draw and volunteer for the local hospital as a driver for Patient Transport. I have thought about this many, many times.
If I won the lottery tomorrow I’d be back in work the day after.
I'd go see my boss with a brand new MTB or 2 and that'd be the end of that... i'd still ride with him at weekends though when free... I may at a push email him a resignation 😀
If I won the lottery I would be in work only for as long as it would take to plan an extravaganza of C & H
ftfy
When I was working if I had won the lottery I would have worked my notice and thats it. Work to live. I couldn't wait to finish working even tho I had a good rewarding job - it was just that a job. a means to an end. If I didn't have to work I wouldn't hence retiring at 60 on a meager income. (I know its hugely privileged and I do have a financial cushion)
I don’t think that’s quite true. Money can certainly buy life saving operations, and rich people do live longer because they can afford better quality care.
I was listening to the Leading podcast, I think, the other day and the guy they were interviewing pointed out that yes, there is some correlation between actual wealth / social class and longevity / health outcomes, but only from memory, something like 25% of the discrepancy between the very rich and the very poor was down to this. Actually more important was people's perception of their social status, I think the general conclusion was that stress from being basically downtrodden and low status was a major factor rather than just stuff like healthcare, diet etc.
In other words, if you believe you have a high social status, even if in statistical terms, you maybe don't, you will still have better health outcomes than someone with the same resources who believes they are of a lower social class. I don't know absolutely how true this is, but it's certainly interesting.
I have thought about this many, many times.
Yup I'd be out volunteering with Chiltern soc & suchlike a few days a week clearing footpaths, cycle paths & pavements. I may already do some of this but working 4* days a week to make ends meet, limits my progress against the mighty bramble.
* Went down to 4 days with corresponding 20% pay cut 18 months ago now, any less probably wouldn't work with my employment, but calculated that days worked overall is same as full time & retiring at 67 if I stick with it till I'm 70 😕
Interesting topic. I grew up very poor, but even so we knew how to 'budget', and always try to have a little 'surplus'. Sometimes emergencies would eat up that surplus. But at other times, that surplus might run over and accumulate, offering a little nest egg for something nice. As I moved into adulthood I saw many of my peers living pay cheque to pay cheque. Very often, they'd be tapping me up for a loan near payday. And would routinely need to get into debt. Some just stayed in perpetual debt. They'd have the same nice things and holidays, but suffer a lot more stress.
I'm now incredibly lucky to have a lifestyle some way beyond my upbringing. But even now, my wife and I always live well within our means. We know some very wealthy people, but with greater expenditure comes greater pressure of course. The closer you are to your margins, the more stress you will suffer. We know some very wealthy people; some sail so close to the wind, they are constantly stressed and worried about everything. Big house, big car, big problems. I don't understand it. It's so much nicer to have a more modest home, less flashy lifestyle, and far less worry and stress. I really don't get why more people don't adopt a similar mindset.
. I really don’t get why more people don’t adopt a similar mindset.
Capitalism 🙂
Sure, but people must be able to see beyond that cycle of work and debt?
We have neighbours who earn a lot more then we do, have quite expensive holidays, run a completely unnecessary car, always seen with new clothes and shoes, have spent a fortune on interior decor, 800 thread count Egyptian cotton bed linen, massive TV, all sorts of lifestyle gadgets etc; constantly needing to take out loans. Sure, it gets paid back, but when we needed a new roof, they had to 'borrow' the money from us and pay it back in instalments. Yet they were still having the nice holidays, buying the nice clothes etc. It's all about a missive sense of entitlement; 'we earn this much, so we deserve a corresponding lifestyle'. No sense of self-awareness, social responsibility or obligation. They could have paid us back a lot sooner had they simply foregone the luxury. People won't though.
Capitalism conditions people to consume. Some folk the conditioning does not take 🙂
Lets not go down that rabbit hole tho 😉
When I was working if I had won the lottery I would have worked my notice and that's it
This 100%.
If my numbers come in i'll be resigning the following day and counting down the hours until i've finished work forever.
I'll easily find enough to fill my time - cycling, cooking, travel, volunteering with a few local worthy causes.
If my numbers come in i’ll be resigning the following day and counting down the hours until i’ve finished work forever
If my numbers came up, I wouldn't even bother with notice periods or any of that shit, the worse that can happen is 1. you don't get paid. Who cares? and 2. They'd give you a bad reference. Again, who cares?
Everyone has their own set of values.
I suspect when the time comes, I'll regret not having enjoyed the money I've had more.
If my numbers came up, I wouldn’t even bother with notice periods or any of that shit, the worse that can happen is 1. you don’t get paid. Who cares? and 2. They’d give you a bad reference. Again, who cares?
I wonder if they could sue you for breach of contract, especially if they could prove materiel loss which would probably be difficult but not impossible.
Personally I would go in late every day and be annoying (or more annoying than usual) ignore my managers etc until they walked me off the premises. Probably quicker than working my notice with less chance of being sued. Although following on from that logic, quite a few of the people I indirectly work with could already be lottery winners and are yet to be escorted offsite, so my cunning plan could backfire.
If my numbers came up, then I would switch our businesses to not for profit and have them run for the benefit of the local community.
I wouldn't be doing a lot hands on, just the Chairman of the trust.
It would be more beneficial to employ people rather than do the work myself.
I wonder if they could sue you for breach of conract, especially if they could prove materiel loss which would probably be difficult but not impossible.
Personally I would go in late every day and be annoying (or more annoying than usual) ignore my managers etc until they walked me off the premises. Probably quicker than working my notice with less chance of being sued. Although following on from that logic, quite a few of the people I indirectly work with could a;lready be lottory winners.
I don't think any employer would want a dis-interested lottery winner working for them.
Proving any significant material loss is almost impossible. Even if they did, it wouldn't be more than a few thousand.
We have neighbours who earn a lot more then we do, have quite expensive holidays, run a completely unnecessary car, always seen with new clothes and shoes, have spent a fortune on interior decor, 800 thread count Egyptian cotton bed linen, massive TV, all sorts of lifestyle gadgets etc; constantly needing to take out loans.
I’m amazed anyone would go to that level of detail telling their neighbours their spending/shopping habits and financial position.
800 thread count Egyptian cotton bed linen
Are you a stalker?
On reflection I think that it was that for me it triggered some deep seated fears about the life choices I've made.
I'm very much in the "play the hand that I've been dealt" school of thought.
For various reasons I've never settled down with someone and had kids, and because of that I've never had to take on large amounts of debt to pay for somewhere to live and support a family. I share the costs of a car, and get around mostly by bike and public transport.
I'm quite happy, but am aware that this puts me out of sync with a lot of the world. I stopped actively dating purely because of the discrepancy between the expectations of the women I was meeting online(Ooh a doctor!) and the reality. Also the dating pool is really thin around here and at the end of the day it's a numbers game.
My friend telling me this was a bit of a shock, and if I'm honest, I think he was looking for a bit of validation by telling me, and it just made me reassess my life choices.
I have recently made a change in regards to this. I get paid quite a bit over the odds for what I do and I was saving quite a decent amount, bought a house with it and a bunch of nice other toys and generally sustained quite a carefree lifestyle. My work was making me utterly miserable in some respects though and my mental health was really starting to suffer - to the point where I was just too tired and unmotivated to do anything about it like I dunno find a new job.
I spoke to my work after much back and forth, time off with stress etc, and it was decided I would do just 3 days per week - not compressed, just at 60% pay. I am *very* privileged in that this still works out as a very liveable amount, though I have had to cut back on luxuries to save and have to think about purchases more. I didn't think too much before about dropping a few hundo on something cool I wanted whereas now I would have to be careful with that and save for things.
However, the quality of life increase is phenomenal. The house is cleaner all the time, I am more motivated for exercise or whatever, and I am doing some learning in my free time and getting all my neglected life admin in order. I am in good form today because I know I essentially only have one more day of work this week and it is not tomorrow. The company is also pretty happy with it too, as things are not looking so great financially as they did in the pandemic and other staff are having some hours cut.
Only issue is that I still don't super like my job - although it is much easier to handle mentally. I don't want to get too used to working 3 days a week because when I do find a new one that's 5 it will feel brutal for a while.
Three days a week is brilliant. I look back and wonder how I fitted everything else in round full time 45+ hrs a week working. Obviously not everyone can do it though. Even if a decent number of hours is required 3x12 or 4x10 hr days is hugely better than 5x8. There must be many organisations that could do that sort of thing.
800 thread count Egyptian cotton bed linen
That's actually an investment, and a quality of life improvement... a bit like good shoes, a good matress, a good office chair etc. It might cost more but it's so much nicer and will last so much longer.
I wouldn't buy cheap bed clothes again, not that I will need to, any decade soon, and I'm not a higher rate tax payer.
800 thread count Egyptian cotton bed linen
It's a bit like a really good duck down quilt.
Once you have had one, you would never have anything else.
The GF often says "we're too poor to buy cheap".
As such we will often not buy the cheapest option.
But then we generally buy what we need and not just because we want.
I’m amazed anyone would go to that level of detail telling their neighbours their spending/shopping habits and financial position.
It’s not hard to work out. Their behaviour betrayed them. Point is they maintained their lifestyle and spending levels in spite of having to borrow money. Me, I’d pay my debts off before having expensive holidays and buying lots of new stuff etc. Especially if someone had been nice enough to help me avoid an expensive bank loan. Different ethics.
It’s not hard to work out.
the thread count of their bed sheets? Must be some bladdy good binoculars, not to mention the high vantage point, you have.
"Must be some bladdy good binoculars, not to mention the high vantage point, you have."
In fairness it could be from going through their bin. Not direct surveillance.
Especially if someone had been nice enough to help me avoid an expensive bank loan. Different ethics.
I don't know how much of it is different ethics vs different priorities. Were you hurting for not having the money? Had you expressed that you'd like then to pay it back in a given timeframe? Presumably they did pay it back.
We need a bit of C-Jay in this thread for understanding of Happiness - very chilled, spoken word starts at 3min in.
And perhaps this,
In fairness it could be from going through their bin. Not direct surveillance.
I laughed 🙂
I went down to 4.5 days when my kids were at nursery age. Has been amazing to spend time with them growing up. They are now art school and i get a few hours on my own pootling about.
If i could afford it i would go down to 4 days
I suppose being not being overly enthusiastic about paid work has its drawbacks: a staycation, cold left-over pizza and cold water for lunch, ageing 26" Decathlon mountain bike, Lidl helmet.
If I need to do paid work I will, till then... .
Especially if someone had been nice enough to help me avoid an expensive bank loan.
I don’t know how much of it is different ethics vs different priorities. Were you hurting for not having the money? Had you expressed that you’d like then to pay it back in a given timeframe? Presumably they did pay it back.
When the works were first proposed, they agreed 100%, as it was very necessary. Then, when it actually came to needing to book the work in, they started pleading poverty. So we offered to cover the costs, and they could pay us back later. We proposed a timescale, but they said this would be very hard for them to fulfil, so we agreed to extend that period. Some time later, the works having been done, they then said they'd need more time to pay. So we agreed again. And then we noticed their conspicuous consumption (it didn't involve furtively going through bins or looking through bins). They had three foreign holidays in that time. And they bought a motor scooter (which has sat unused outside ever since). Had we waited until they could 'afford' to pay for the works, the price would have gone up by a significant amount. So we did them a massive favour. Whilst they continued with their affluent lifestyle. I think if your 'priorities' are all about spending money on yourself, whilst owing money to others, then that does fall into pretty selfish behaviour imo. It's not something we'd even dream of doing. I was raised to pay my debts asap, or better still, not have any. If I couldn't afford something, I wouldn't have it, simple as that. Some obviously want to have their cake and eat it.
Some people prefer to live within their means, have less stress, have to work less, retire earlier, have a more comfortable life. This seems to be an increasingly alien concept to many.
Sorry for the thread distraction, but.... @brownperson.... Why didn't you have a contract written up and signed by them? With interest and/or penalty for delayed payment?
Some people prefer to live within their means, have less stress, have to work less, retire earlier, have a more comfortable life.
Absolutely.
Fulfilling Wants vs fulfilling Needs.
Sorry for the thread distraction, but…. @brownperson…. Why didn’t you have a contract written up and signed by them? With interest and/or penalty for delayed payment?
In hindsight, that might have been more prudent. They effectively had an interest free loan, to help subsidise their lifestyle. But they're actually really nice people, and in their defence, I just don't think they actually realise how selfish they are. Such is entitlement and privilege. I'm just happy to have been raised better.
The GF often says “we’re too poor to buy cheap”.
As such we will often not buy the cheapest option.
I missed this earlier. This is wisdom. This is how I tried to live when I was a man of lesser means. A decent pair of shoes is better than multiple pairs of crap ones. As a result, I had better stuff for longer, and actually spent less over time.