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Deciding atm whether to do CBT and get a cheap 125 for a year then do the big boy test or just go straight for a ‘big’ bike and get something 600ish from the start…
You'll have to complete a CBT whichever route you take, it's mandatory.
FWIW, I just did the CBT bit and pootled around on a 125 for a year (mainly just to test the water) before passing my full licence (back end of last year).
With hindsight, I should have just gone straight for my full licence and not bothered buying a 125, but I was keen just to get riding (even if it was *just* as 125).
The general advice seems just go for full licence via DAS. My MT-07 is easier to ride than my 125.
@GlenQuagmire
Thank you!
I did a cbt, probably did 4 rides, felt vulnerable on a slow & small 125.
Did DAS and felt much happier then.
Shouldn't have wasted the money on the 125, agree, bigger bikes are easier and you can get away with poor technique with the small bikes so bad habits could form.
Wiggles, there’s no right and wrong answer, only what will suit you best. If you’re commuting through towns, and never get up past 60ish mph anyway, a 125 can be the right bike anyway... Some of them are a bit boring, but a Grom or a Monkey bike will be a barrel of laughs and cost sod all to run!
That said, most of the guys I have known who bought a 125 did so because they were impatient. Buying the 125 made them realise not only how vulnerable they were with so little power, but also that the experience was nothing like that on a bigger bike. I’d argue that any of the current crop of DAS bikes used by learner schools (SV650, MT-07, that sort of thing) are so much easier to ride than a 125, that learning on a 125 can put people off... Riding a 125 does teach good skills though, you have to plan further ahead as not only have you got much less power, but you’ve got much less grip/brakes/stability too. I nearly bought a Grom for my work commute (about 8 miles each way, half of that through town), but decided I’d feel too vulnerable on the open roads where the cars typically exceed the 60mph limit anyway. I’m not saying don’t buy one, but if you are keen to get on a big bike ASAP, you’re probably better off being a bit more patient and doing DAS.
The other thing with 125’s, is due to the core audience, buying the right one can be critical to 2nd hand value... A 2-3yr old Grom that has done very few miles will probably be £2k or so, but lose little value in the time you own it. A less desirable model bike may be over £3k new, but worth a fraction of that inside a couple of years. Motorbike values aren’t about what’s sensible or practical (for the most part, thank god!) but what all the cool kids want to ride...
No practical reasons for buying a bike just want it for fun so I think money spent on a 125 would be better spent on the DAS... I'll probably buy some ropey 90's Japanese bike keep myself busy making it work while I'm sorting the rest of it. As tinkering with things is half the fun for me anyway
4-Stroke 125s or horrifically slow at everything over 30mph, although in the period you're planning on owning one, you won't lose money on it - buy now, sell in the spring/summer after your DAS.
Don't bother with a 2-Stroke unless you're a masochist, as they are: 1) Not legal for learners if they're de-restricted (and frankly why would you ride a restricted one, you may as well have a 4-Stroke.) And 2) They eat themselves with alarming regularity, and are often mistreated by their teenage owners. Finally 3) They are also old now, and thus have all the issues arising from owning a "classic" bike. Finally finally, the prices on them are going up quick for reason 3).
sobriety
4-Stroke 125s or horrifically slow at everything over 30mph...
But it's a lot of fun wringing their necks to extract the last ounce of oomph.
Or you could get one of these:
I like decent sized bikes but that looks like a barrel of fun. 🙂
EDIT: just found this https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Skyteam-Ace-300-Cafe-racer/264206151340?hash=item3d83e9eeac:g:fvEAAOSwAvFcbXNZ
Someone has crammed a 300cc engine in. Even more goodness...
I agree, but not as much fun on L-plates as an air cooled 100cc two stroke, of which I have one sorted (well, it will be again once the fork stanchions come back from the chromers) and another being done as a cafe racer by my Dad, just for shits and giggles, we're wondering how much of a grenade my home portin' with bastard files and dremel has made the motor into...
Id love a 2 stroke TBF but as you say expensive,unreliable,potentially illegal... Sounds like a lot of my recent Jap cars haha
Probably just get a 600 as I'd like to think I'm sensible enough, not gonna be riding around thinking I'm invincible like I would of 10 years ago. Lots of bargains about if you don't mind doing a bit of work which I enjoy doing and bikes are a lot more space friendly for having one hanging around etc
I may have one or two* 125cc two strokes, they are glorious fun, and the least practical things ever, but for me half the fun is the engineering on them.
*2 on the road and several in boxes.
**which is why I'm finally doing my DAS, too much nervousness around police cars on them on L-plates...
My mate rides a *cough* restricted bike that is some how the same speed as the other non restricted bikes and had a few close calls like that, so I'd rather do things properly from the start.
So, just had my hours test ride on the KTM Duke 790. Did around 45 miles in and around Perth/Crieff/Gleneagles.
It's quite good. It's quite good indeed. Basically a Duke 390 on steroids. Amazing to ride, so nimble, sounds properly meaty even with the standard exhaust, I managed 69mpg taking it fairly easy so almost as frugal as the 390. Auto/clutchless up- and down-shift took a bit of getting used to but I think probably a game changer. New screen with loads of info, comfy seat, strangely minimal wind buffeting.
In short, it's ace and I'm getting one.
Suzuki GSX-S 125 is the one I will consider as I might need to commute by bike ... arrghhh ... the last time I rode a motorbike was in my late teen so so long ago .... Bloody council is trying to charge old cars for entering the city here in the North East.
Like this ... in the far east they have 150CC and plenty of underbone motorbike but
This is Suzuki Raider from the Philippines which is much more practical.
@The Flying Ox
The Duke 790 looks superb and the reviews are great - seems to pip the Triumph Street Triple as well, enjoy!
My 2018 Yamaha MT-07 is going well, and have managed to get quite a few miles in recently with the better weather. Soooo looking forward to some summer trips out on the bike 🙂
Might look at the Duke next year....
Picking up my new (to me) Suzuki V Strom 650 tomorrow 😊. Can’t wait.
Looks like it’s gong to be a good day for it as well.
Passed my test when I was in my early 20s, but haven’t ridden for years. Took a refresher course a couple of weeks back.
790, I have one. So do several mates.
If you'll jump on any KTM forums I'll be abiut
Thanks Ox,
I think I’ll be testing a 790 very soon, and it looks like a winner, but I also want to try a SuperDukeR and that might just be irresistible...
This could get very spendy!
At least the weather is playing ball now, got some lovely warm miles covered lately, but screw in front tyre has halted play😒
Picking up my new (to me) Suzuki V Strom 650 tomorrow 😊. Can’t wait.
Looks like it’s gong to be a good day for it as well.
Very nice 🙂
That new bike feeling is great - I've still got it and I bought my bike in November! Hopefully going out today...
@ Flying Ox
Test rode a Duke 790 last summer, had it for an hour, thrashed the absolute nuts off it (chicken strips were over an inch wide when they gave it to me, had completely gone when I gave it back) the entire ride and it still returned 58mpg according to the clock! I haven't ridden a bike as rewarding for just getting on it and giving it an absolute hiding in ages, handling was first rate, engine was great, only minor weakpoint was I felt though they were quite effective, the brakes could have done with more feel, but that was it...
Until I got to the insurance quotes...
For some strange reason, the Duke 790 is down as a massively high risk ownership proposition! I was ready to downsize from the MT-10 I had, but they wanted to almost double my insurance stepping down from a 160bhp 1 litre bike to a 105bhp 800cc bike! According to some of the forums and facebook groups, I'm far from the only person that has been put off Duke 790 ownership by the insurance costs... I was paying about £600 a year fully comp on the MT-10, they wanted over £1k for the Duke 790! I now have a KTM RC8 1190 Superbike, and that's only just over £400 a year to insure! Go figure...
Shame, as it's an absolute belter of a bike, perfect for the UK roads, just the right balance of engine/chassis and importantly, a lot of fun!
I wanted to like the Duke 790, but I couldn't, just didn't float my boat aesthetically in the end so I've got a pre enjoyed (1900m) Street Triple RS for the same money. It's amazing and only cost me £123 fully comp for the year too!
790 insurance, that's weird, mine is £150 with 1 years NCB as I'm using my big one on my zx6r,
Blazing, needs picture! Congratulations!
[url= https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7893/46534460715_c56ef7b71d_k.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7893/46534460715_c56ef7b71d_k.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/2dU6gWc ]2019-03-23_04-51-52[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/152318156@N08/ ]Steve Weeks[/url]
Well teen2 and I both completed CBT with Ace training of Surrey. Lots of fun, although his road test was on a 50cc moped. Not great for an 87 kilo six footer. Mine was on a ubiquitous cbf on a later day.
So a rather nice white four year old Yamaha YZF R125 has joined the bike stable. He’s commuting to work on it and I’m just practicing for direct access. Not that I’ll be buying anything bigger for some time. Mrs TiRed won’t be riding bikes any day soon, but perhaps she’d be happy to tour on the back of a nice BMW.
The insurance for Teen was frankly daylight robbery! The kit wasn’t cheap either. Alpinestars short jacket, Kevlar jeans and a White Shoei helmet to impersonate a 17yo. I think my speed gives my age away. It’s a great bike for heeding speed limits 🙂
I traded in my RSV4 factory for a Street Triple 765 RS at the weekend. Its eventually going to replace my track bike when I convert it in the autumn for next year. I have had a few 675's before, however I had forgot how much of a riot the street is. Its so light and easy to ride, such a laugh 🙂
I still have the XR for more sensible touring duties and the Tuono APRC for the odd blast. However I think I will miss the Street on the road when it gets converted to track duties 🙂
I had forgot how much of a riot the street is
Love my 675R,reminds me of a big 350LC
hello not read all the post and can't comment on the licences thing as got mine abroad but :I would personally get the licence with the most comprehensive trainning.
As said a 500 like an ER-5 or a CB500 are easier to ride than a 125, can be found for cheap and have been designed with commuting in mind.
I would however do a couple of things :
Once I got my overall budget I would buy the best equipement money can buy. Might not seems like much but good gear will outlast many bikes and will make the experience of riding much more enjoyable. Then I would buy my bike.
If it's really for commuting purposes I would get a top case. Yeah they are ugly but hell they are so convenient.
Hope this help.
BR
Juan
Well teen2 is bound to 125s for at least another year or so. Commuting is only 7 miles but he needs motorised two wheels to get through the heathrow tunnel and park up. All he needs to carry is a pair of shoes really. If that when he has his locker. But the bike needs an underseat disc lock and there is really no room for much. His kit cost even more than mine, Helga all weather jacket, Kevlar jeans and a Shark helmet with lights on I.
Having ridden it, it rides well and feels a good size and I like the position. I’m not that big and used to riding road bikes. The feet up feels a bit odd, but I like the planning and execution to get the best out of it in traffic. Then once I’ve become smoother on it, I’ll go direct access.
Failed my hazard perception due to clicking too early on the hazards and scores 43 with a median of 4.5 per hazard! Pass mark is 44. Apparently this is common with experienced motorists! Theory was 49/50. I’ve read the how to pass web tips now. Click, count to two and click again to make sure. Bah!
Theory was 49/50. I’ve read the how to pass web tips now. Click, count to two and click again to make sure. Bah!
Same score on theory as me and that tip was given to me by one of the instructors when I did my direct access last year.
Even he failed it when it first came out, due to that very same thing. Download the Hazard perception test from the DVSA and just keep practicing.
Apparently it's set up for snotty 17 year olds who don't recognise a hazard until right at the last minute, whereas experienced drivers spot them much earlier. Not really fair, but unfortunately we can't alter it. 🙁
Which all feels a bit ironic really doesn't it, for a hazard perception test. Was similar when I did mine. 49/50 on the theory test but was closer to fail line on the hazard perception test. Still, a pass is a pass and I took it but that was the trickier part of it for me.
Echo much of what has been said in here. If you are a driver and have been driving for a little while then go straight for the full license. I didn't go a 125 (even though they were great fun to trundle around on) just passed the test and went straight for a big bike. So far all been good, not that I have ridden a massive number of miles. Definitely feel more vulnerable on the road and I find I get more tired riding due to the increased observation and awareness of everything around you.
Just had a quick look for insurance on the 790. I'm getting £200 fully comp for 6000 miles with only 1 year ncb, so no idea how the £1000+ quotes are being calculated.
Mod 2 was this morning, in the pissing rain.
Had someone pull out on me, a closed road on the indepentant ride where I ended up taking the examiner on a detour, as I knew the area so could nip around it, then right at the end I missed the entrance to 20mph zone and went too fast....
And somehow only got a minor for it, **** yeah! I think the examiner was being kind as I was perfect up to then, apparently.
Well done, 20 years ago when I did the direct access test, instructor commented that there wasn’t yore so much need to ‘Chuck it about’ as had scraped the pegs round a righhander, still got a pass 😉
Well done on passing sobriety
Definitely feel more vulnerable on the road
Same here, especially when close to 40foot truck on the motorway :-0
Passed the Theory and Hazard Perception this morning after learning how to pass the test (not what a hazard looks like!). Another theory 49/50 - bah - scored 50/50 for both practice tests yesterday, and 61/75 on hazard perception compared with 43/75 for early clicking (three zeros) and no confirmation click last week. Median score was 5 🙂 and I could be a driving instructor now...
Now to get out a bit and practice on the 125, if I can wrestle it from Teen2. Then Direct Access when I feel a little more comfortable with the controls. Engine braking still feels odd compared to cycling!
well done on passing, there won't be much engine braking on a 125 compared to when you get on a bigger bike, that much I can tell ya 🙂
Congrats 🙂 nice work.
Mod 2 was this morning, in the pissing rain.
Had someone pull out on me, a closed road on the indepentant ride where I ended up taking the examiner on a detour, as I knew the area so could nip around it, then right at the end I missed the entrance to 20mph zone and went too fast….
And somehow only got a minor for it, **** yeah! I think the examiner was being kind as I was perfect up to then, apparently.
Congrats 🙂
It was my MOD 2 on Tuesday. It pissed it down the whole time. It was all going tickety-boo until approaching a give way junction I was asked to turn left. I had good visibility of the road so just slowed, kicked down the gears and went to pull out. However, instead of selecting first as I though, I'd managed to get neutral (this, on a bike that selecting neutral is very hard). Went to pull out, realised my mistake, had a wobble, put my foot down. Instant fail! A real shame as I only had one minor.
The most annoying thing of all (apart form the massive damage to my pride) was phoning SMC in Sheffield to tell them I wouldn't be picking up my new Duke 790 that afternoon after all...
I'll pick it up for you!!
Ahhh, commiserations, I hit neutral on my test turning right out of the test centre, but I'm so used to doing it on my learner bikes (the RS has a false neutral between 5th and 6th and the little suzuki has them bloody everywhere) that I just swore at it, banged it into first and carried on!
So to wrap up my contribution to the thread (until my next one), I went and looked at some new KTMs at dealer open day and was put off by the price and the "melted transformer" styling, so didn't bother with a test ride in case I liked it 😉
But I did go and have a look at a 2003 Triumph Sprint RS that popped up on the FB classifieds, as it was local and cheap. Guess what's now sat in my garage?
Yup, £1000 worth of Hinckley Missile.
Guess what’s now sat in my garage?
Didn't happen without Piccies 😉
Oh go on then 😉
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Not quite in the garage, it needs a going over with scotchbrite/wire wool to clear back some of the surface rust, but it's only cosmetic.
nnniiiccee 🙂
Saw a Norton Dominator on the way home from work in my car the other day... well, I heard it first.
OMG.
ta11pau1
... well, I heard it first....
That'll be the big ends...
Oh, there's a new one?
That Triumph is fab. £1000? Bargain! They are fast and comfy.
That’ll be the big ends…
Oh, there’s a new one?
Yeah was one of the new ones, was on an 18 or 19 plate.
I'm 99% sure it was one of these https://www.teasdale-motorcycles.co.uk/shop/new-motorcycles/norton-dominator/ but with the race pipes as in the video, sounded exactly the same.
Where did you see the Norton Ta11pau1?
My mate has a Dominator Naked. It’s a very pretty and noisy thing.
We were out today but he didn’t have his Norton as it’s too uncomfortable for anything more than an hour.
Those are amazing, the sound of it, one of my first purchases after a lottery win.
It was coming off the A229 at Maidstone (bluebell hill) onto the M20, coast-bound. At about 6pm either thursday or friday.
Ah ok, wasn’t him. But still a nice thing to see one actually being used and not just being parked up and looked at.
My mates is one of the last Domi Nakeds they made, full Ohlins suspension, megaphone exhausts, polished tank and carbon fibre parts, all alloy parts polished aswell. Has had a few “teething” problems with it but seems to be running ok for now.
I think the Norton Dominator is the best looking bike you can buy new at the moment.
Back last night from a weekend riding in Wales, 6deg in Llanberis, thank god for heated clothing 🙂
Great little warmup for Pyrenees trip in May.
Congrats 🙂
It was my MOD 2 on Tuesday. It pissed it down the whole time. It was all going tickety-boo until approaching a give way junction I was asked to turn left. I had good visibility of the road so just slowed, kicked down the gears and went to pull out. However, instead of selecting first as I though, I’d managed to get neutral (this, on a bike that selecting neutral is very hard). Went to pull out, realised my mistake, had a wobble, put my foot down. Instant fail! A real shame as I only had one minor.
The most annoying thing of all (apart form the massive damage to my pride) was phoning SMC in Sheffield to tell them I wouldn’t be picking up my new Duke 790 that afternoon after all…
So, following on from a cancelled first MOD 2 and a failed second MOD 2, I'm pleased to say I passed on Thursday morning. 2 minors - stalled pulling away from one of the many "pull over on the left when it's safe to do so" and accidentally beeping the horn in the kerfuffle getting started and pulling away safely...
Anyway, with a smile plastered all over my face, I headed over Snake Pass to Sheffield Motorcycle Centre in the afternoon to pick up my new Duke 790. Happy bunny!
Well done! And nice bike, mine is still waiting on the bits I ordered to give it a routine service before I go out on it again.
I was out on the Aprilia over the weekend, and 2-1 lane merges are so much easier on a 955cc four stroke than a on a 125cc two stroke!
I have one just like that but orange...
Congratulations
https://www.ktmforums.com/forums/
https://www.ktmforum.co.uk/forum.php
Nice one. remember its now that you actually start to learn to ride., If I were doing it again I would get a post test lesson in motorways and cornering and stuff
If I were doing it again I would get a post test lesson in motorways and cornering and stuff
I'd book Donington GP 🙂
Nice one. remember its now that you actually start to learn to ride., If I were doing it again I would get a post test lesson in motorways and cornering and stuff
I'm back into riding after about 20 years. I got myself a 650 v Strom. I had a few refresher lessons before I started looking properly so I could test ride with confidence. So glad I did. I would also consider so e advanced riding lessons now. Money well spent.
@Furious Well done and that's a lovely bike 🙂
I had great fun over the Easter holidays - lots of biking and in general, things are progressing quite well for me - the occasional wobbly moment but that's to be expected. Taking things very steady but gradually trying to lose the "driving a car" mentality while keeping things very safe.
Out of interest (and may be of use to me in the future if I decide to try and get an A2 licence) why is putting a foot down an instant fail? Is it not the same as putting a foot down when you come to a stop sign or a Give Way when there's traffic coming?
It's putting a foot down to catch the bike following a loss of control. It's not putting a foot down when stopping for junctions, etc.
By loss of control, this might be stopping rather quickly while turning and the bike leaning, missing a gear unexpectedly and the bike slowing resulting in a stop. Basically, if you hinder traffic if any way, that's not a good thing to do. You need to control the bike at all times, rather than the bike controlling you.
OK, understand that, noted.... thanks 🙂
Nah probs - it's all part of the learning process (and beyond as I'm finding....).
Lots of peeps on here can offer better advice than I can (passed MOD 2 last year so still very much new to all this but happy to pass on any knowledge).
Out of interest (and may be of use to me in the future if I decide to try and get an A2 licence) why is putting a foot down an instant fail? Is it not the same as putting a foot down when you come to a stop sign or a Give Way when there’s traffic coming?
It’s putting a foot down to catch the bike following a loss of control. It’s not putting a foot down when stopping for junctions, etc.
By loss of control, this might be stopping rather quickly while turning and the bike leaning, missing a gear unexpectedly and the bike slowing resulting in a stop. Basically, if you hinder traffic if any way, that’s not a good thing to do. You need to control the bike at all times, rather than the bike controlling you.
Yep, GQ hit the nail on the head. I was already rolling out of the junction so I wasn't in full control of the bike. A foot down during a maneuver is a fail on MOD1 and MOD2. Seems harsh on the surface but understandable in context.
Super excited, after 6 months of loving my Duke 390 the time has come to say farewell. New bike Friday has arrived!
Pictures or it didn't happen @Bianchi-Boy 🙂
Just back from a soggy five day Almeria Euro track trip. The rain in Spain does not just fall on the plain 🙁 While you guys had the best weather for ages.
Morning all... New bike Saturday for me last week.
Nice Tootallpaul! 👌👊
That's a nice looking motorcycle.
Proof that it did indeed happen!
Nice. I had a matt grey Street Triple R, such a fun bike
Good thread now 🙂
Tootall, XSR700 or 900 ?
Bianchi, shiny Striple 🙂
MY 790.
[url= https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/40730123903_11a159d022_k.jp g" target="_blank">https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/40730123903_11a159d022_k.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/254bwPz ]2019-04-25_03-16-32[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/152318156@N08/ ]Steve Weeks[/url], on Flickr
Also my ZX6R
[url= https://live.staticflickr.com/7882/47435537721_13885d7f01_k.jp g" target="_blank">https://live.staticflickr.com/7882/47435537721_13885d7f01_k.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/2fgHwJD ]2019-03-21_04-27-26[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/152318156@N08/ ]Steve Weeks[/url], on Flickr
XSR900 - Traded in my Tracer 700 for her.
Just passed my test* and picked this up and heading to Donington park for a trackday Monday
[url= https://live.staticflickr.com/7832/32558245107_6c74be4d98_b.jp g" target="_blank">https://live.staticflickr.com/7832/32558245107_6c74be4d98_b.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/RB4vXz ]Untitled[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/153018338@N03/ ]Tony H[/url], on Flickr
*Not really
I picked my Triple up on Friday morning, went for a little ride around on the way home and then parked it in the garage. It has not stopped raining since!
Nice bike Bianchi Boy,here's mine
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The Street triple forum is a good source of knowledge on all things STR
Got out yesterday with the intention of doing the Northumbria blood bikes 360 challenge. Did the first hundred miles down to Teesside and headed back up to Corbridge via Eggleston. On the moors south of Stanhope a mate got a puncture. Cue 4 hours of misery while we pillioned into Stanhope to get signal and waited for the RAC in the smegging rain. Normally I always carry a plug kit and a tarp. But not today. Pooh!
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Just back from completing my CBT at the ripe old age of 55!
Slightly nervous beforehand but had a great time.
I was thinking if buying the new Honda Monkey just for pottering around on - and I still might - but the instructor gave me a go on his Honda CB500X which was a bit of an eye opener!
Plenty to think about now 🙂
Glad you enjoyed it, I felt the same when I completed my CBT 🙂
Do you go the 125 route? Hmmm. I did, had mine for about a year before going for the bigger bike licence.
Looking back with hindsight, was it the correct thing? Not sure, probably not. Bigger bikes are no harder to ride so just go for it (but I did quite enjoy my time on the 125!).
I went out this evening for a quick blast on my MT-07 and wouldn't want anything smaller... 😉
Well, this morning was interesting. My commute takes me up a 50-limit single-carriageway. It's wide and straight with good sightlines. This morning, I was riding along there at around 60 (I know, tsk), when about 500m up the road an oncoming white crew van with a yellow light is moving into the right-turn refuge. I look at him. He stops. I get closer. He continues to be stopped. I carry on. He turns. At this point I am less than 100m away from him.
I seem to remember people saying things like "swerve, don't stop", so I try and aim behind where I think he'll be when I get there. Yet now, finally, he sees me and slams his brakes on. Now I am aiming straight at the passenger door. I have to swerve the other way. In the end, I miss him by what feels like inches. All the time I have been avoiding slamming on the brakes because I don't want to lock up and go in a straight line, so I am still doing about 45 (I'd guess). The whole thing happened in about 2 seconds.
The weird thing is, I saw him ages (ok, maybe 10 seconds, I wasn't counting) before the "incident", and something in my head told me "Watch him. Keep watching him very carefully." and I did.
Now I need to go have a little sick.
BTW, congrats on all the passes recently! It's not all like this, a lot of it is great fun!