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Seen a few clips of him recently and each time I'm impressed.
I think of he were up against the future PM incumbents then he would be having a massive impact.
Doesn't talk shit. Doesn't let the interviewer get away with pithy questioning.
I like the guy.
Agreed.
Which party?
Doesn’t let the interviewer get away with pithy questioning.
Get away with?
SPCS socialist party of common sense.
Talks much more sense than any politico of any party.
Politicians cannot handle statements of fact backed with hard evidence.
I think it's good that RMT membership is increasing - but deeply concerned that johnson's would be successors want to further emasculate trades unions.
Go Mick.
Which party?
Who f-in cares. Party of common sense.
Calls a spade a spade.
Laughs at interviewers questions (what's a picket line betont a good one).
He's not there for sound bits, but to put across his argument for every man, for the greater good. Would love to see him go up against politicians in a proper debate.
Sir K could do well to learn from him, but I fear it's too late.
I arrive at St Pancras, London, tomorrow from Munich and will struggle to get to my final destination.
I honestly couldn't GAF if it means it's an arse ache to get to where I want to go.
More power to the people.
Inflation is rising, the money in your pocket is soon to be worth sweet FA. Good luck, folks.
He has competition
Mick is awesome. I've seen him laying waste to various tory toffs on telly recently. He does exceedingly well.
Scotroutes - both Lynch and Dempsey learned a lot from Bob Crowe and now present with a slghtly softer edge.
Big thumbs up from me.
All Lynch and Dempsey do is use words as you find them defined in a dictionary. Who'd of thunk that that's all you have to do to communicate basic ideas.
Makes a change from the word scramble currently being dished up on Newsnight, (had to switch over to Big Zuu)
He also brutally exposed how RW our mainstream television media is as well, basically taking their cues from Murdoch wether they realise it or not.
At last , some opposition in this country.
Sadly fighting from a corner that a large proportion of the population doesn't agree with.... Essential, albeit Low paid, low skilled workers.
The embarrassed working classes won't have it. I bought an electric German car, I'm better than the skivvies. Besides they will be automated out in few years time, replaced by signs or vending machines.
Elon's amazing isn't he!
_1
He pwned the odious and sanctimonious Nick Ferrari on LBC today
Was listening to that earlier, Ferrari knew fine well exactly how much Dempsey was paid but decided to inflate the figure to a “six figure salary”, Ferrari is an odious creep.
Here’s Dempseys’ response to being sacked by Starmer, he won’t be anywhere near the front bench anytime soon which is a damn shame, Starmer needs a slap in the coupon to rouse him from whatever fugue blue state he’s found himself in.
Since covid, the corruption that exists in government was exposed. For me, the pennies started to drop and it became obvious that the Eton elite were stripping the public cupboards bare. It usually begins with Daves tenure and all the bad for the country decisions he put into place (Brexit, Green rubbish, austerity, public pension changes).
For most of the last decade I was on a zero percent payrise as I worked for the. Gov.
I now work in the private sector and Mick & Co have inspired me to join our union. They are exposing the corruption and galvanising PAYE tax payers to stand up against the 'sponsored' politicians who are robbing the country!
Power to the People!
Lynch has more knowledge about rail than anyone asking hime 'tough' questions and he is also very straight with them. I think he is great.
However, would need to know a lot more about him for PM or leader of a party. He is clearly socialist in mind so a good start but do we want to mention Brexit...
I'd love to see him in a debate with Grant Shapps along with a neutral 3rd party real-time fact-checking
Low paid, low skilled workers.
They aren't low-skilled, they are differently skilled and undervalued. You would be unable to do their job on day one of starting at their place of work. You would need to acquire the skills that those people use before you were effective and being of value your wage.
Requiring a "ticket" to do a job does not make the holder better than those that do not need one to do theirs.
Lynch for PM!
Really!
Would be in bed with Putin before you know it and the UK is the next Moscow suburb!!
They aren’t low-skilled, they are differently skilled and undervalued. You would be unable to do their job on day one of starting at their place of work.
You're correct.... I meant low skilled in the eyes of those they are ferrying around.
Obviously the drivers are not instantly replaceable.
Lynch for PM!
Really!
Would be in bed with Putin before you know it and the UK is the next Moscow suburb!!
Wait until you find out about Boris Johnson...
Wait until you find out about Boris Johnson…
I'd assumed it was satire.....
Pragmatic Socialist Party maybe
He stands up for his supporters, he argues with facts, seems to have no time for spin or sycophantic journos. He's also properly exposed Starmer for being more Tory than I'd hoped.
If only there were more of him.
What a weird thread title, i know Mick Lynch is doing well for his union, but he's able to say what he wants, when he wants without the issue of voters, he has backing from his members, and more importantly, the internal structure within the RMT, there is no translation to this against politics, especially in a country that has repeatedly shown itself to be right of centre, christ we're about to replace Boris Johnson with Liz Truss, yet folk still think the voting public are going to swerve towards the far left!
The more i read the political stuff on this site, the more i feel we're never going to get away from a tory government that panders to the right more and more.
They aren’t low-skilled, they are differently skilled and undervalued.
This is the thing that irks me, you could argue low skilled is something that someone with a reasonable amount of effort could achieve with a small degree of training.
Knowing a couple of drivers, the work they have to put in, they're not low skilled in the slightest.
It's a lazy and dismissive term that is overly simplistic.
christ we’re about to replace Boris Johnson with Liz Truss
Unless you are personally a member of the Conservative Party we are not about to replace Boris Johnson with Liz Truss.
There is quite a lot of evidence that the public very much appreciates straight talking politicians.
Which ironically is one of the reasons why Liz Truss is tipped to be the next Tory leader. However confused her political and economic policies might be it is precisely this clarity which she presents that appeals to many people.
And is likely to cause huge headaches for Starmer as he tries to maintain his strategy of not letting people know exactly what his position is on anything.
Knowing a couple of drivers, the work they have to put in, they’re not low skilled in the slightest.
The RMT strike is not about drivers pay, they are (mainly) in ASLEF anyway.
Wow that Mick Lynch interview was amazing.
He has the information at his fingertips, he believes everything he says, and he has common sense and can explain his points clearly and succinctly.
Definitely impressed with Mick Lynch and Eddy Dempsey. It really irks the 'journalists' that can't make two blokes talking sense be the bad guys.
Union membership in my place has gone up very recently. My full team are all members now.
Requiring a “ticket” to do a job does not make the holder better than those that do not need one to do theirs.
...and there are no qualifications needed at all to become a Member of Parliament,
Just a popularity contest, mainly the popularity of your party leader.
Would be interesting to see why he supported leave and if he is happy with how it's going.
Leave was only ever going to result in less workers rights.
If anyone could come up with a good reason for leaving it would make my day.
Would be interesting to see why he supported leave and if he is happy with how it’s going.
I'll wager it was along the lines of membership of the EU giving unrestricted access to cheap labour force suppressing wages for UK workers? He may well be happy for other transport workers (lorry drivers) in that respect.
I like him, but his basic USP seems to be a reputation for straight-talking truthfulness.
Unfortunately this means he can't be PM, because he is a Brexiteer and that instantly means he's going to have to tell some lies to someone somewhere.
Dickyboy, these strikes would seem to indicate that his wishes didn't come to fruition.
these strikes would seem to indicate that his wishes didn’t come to fruition.
He hoped that leaving the EU would end all class antagonism in the UK and the need to ever go on strike?
Blimey, he got that wrong - what was he thinking??
He hoped that leaving the EU would end all class antagonism in the UK
Jesus there's Inception levels of snobbery and general ****ish stitch-up behaviour in the UK, never come across anywhere else as bad. Everyone has snide opinions on everybody else and how they should and shouldn't live their lives and what interventions should be brought to bare.
Lynch: "I’m elected - and yet it's Viscount Rothermere’s paper that calls me a 'baron'"
Any relation?
hahah!
On LBC this morning... putting his members' case/position as well as ever.
Yep he still knows what he is one about and has more experience and knowledge of his industry than anyone trying to ask him 'difficult' questions.
The Govt try to portray the RMT as overpaid drivers, but as I understand it, most drivers are ASLEF, whereas RMT look after a lot of the lower paid staff.
Indeed. And, as Lynch addressed on LBC just now, the whole "other unions have accepted the deal" government line refers to small numbers of back office staff that don't work on the lines and aren't hit by the elements of the deal pushing for more unstaffed stations and single person operated services.
As others mentioned he is a great bloke, but a frothing brexiteer, for that reason I am out.
As long as he is representing his members best interests I don't care. Its Unionistas like Red Len who uses disputes for personal agendas that I can't stand.
As others mentioned he is a great bloke, but a frothing brexiteer, for that reason I am out.
He gets questioned on his support for Brexit below, I fully agree with the strikes, but he’s ****ing deluded on Brexit
https://twitter.com/lbc/status/1610607929333321732?s=61&t=JUTNusrwNAtz2iYSpI5lXg
To be fair, he does say he would have to see a new ballot on brexshit. I'm happy that he will change his mind, at least he is not a fixed opnioner. Still a bit of a frother though. Hmmm. I'm still a no.
but a frothing brexiteer
Leave was official RMT policy. I heard Eddie Dempsey, who is assistant general secretary of RMT, and imo an even more articulate speaker than Mick Lynch, speak at a trades union council organised EU debate, I don't recall much frothing when he made the case for leaving, just a class conscious critique of the EU and who it exists to serve.
just a class conscious critique of the EU and who it exists to serve.
Ha ha I am not falling for this or debating with any other frothers.
Well I have to tolerate the endless frothing on countless threads from ranting and inconsolable remainers. So I guess we all have our crosses to bear.
I have zero sympathy.
just a class conscious critique of the EU and who it exists to serve
And of course our government(s) and electoral systems are so beneficial to the working class...
You do get the feeling that they are willing to die on the hill of having a nationalised industry as a matter of principle, rather than what that actually looks like in practice.
It's almost like they have never heard of or are desperately trying to ignore government owned private companies. Sure, feel free to bid against the SNCF to run their services. I'm sure the French government will take your bid very very seriously.
Technically it's private. In practice it's nationalised. And no matter which right wing nutter government gets elected in the next French election, French people still aren't going to lose their EU guaranteed rights.
Politicians who are more interested in principles than the real world can get in the sea, as far as I'm concerned.
Politicians who are more interested in principles than the real world can get in the sea, as far as I’m concerned.
This, so much this, I may kiss you.
I have a question.
What do train drivers actually do?
In a world where we're increasingly frotting on about driverless cars, we seemingly can't work out driverless trains* and they're on rails. What controls are in a train beyond Stop and Go?
Sincere question and I mean no disrespect to any train drivers reading, I genuinely don't understand what it entails and I'm curious.
(* - aside from the DLR)
https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/what-do-train-drivers-do.86947/
I didn't read it all but apparently they don't even have steering wheels
I may kiss you
I've got Covid so there's not a queue at the moment.
I’ve got Covid so there’s not a queue at the moment.
You flirt.
Politicians who are more interested in principles than the real world can get in the sea, as far as I’m concerned.
100% this, evidence based politics please!
Mick Lynch may be a great union leader but on Brexit he's just being a useful idiot for the Brexiteers and their 'Singapore on Thames' project.
I have a degree of sympathy for those who voted leave in good faith but anyone sufficiently politically aware to be using expressions like 'class conscious' who still thinks Brexit will deliver any kind of tangible benefit for UK workers is a mug.
Has anyone here tried going through the selection process to be a train driver? It's the most thorough one I've ever tried.
They're looking for very particular people with a very specific skillset.
What precisely did Mick lynch find so objectionable about being able to take sausages on holiday?
I didn’t read it all but apparently they don’t even have steering wheels
Interesting read that, thanks. (I probably should have just googled it...)
It is to do with the idea that you cannot nationalise trains within the EU system.
He tne goes on to admit in fact each country can change the eu laws at their whim, plus he can't expalin france, spain, germany, holland, who all have a near as dammit nationalised system.
The more I read about him, the RMT and their brext stance, the more I am against the OP's idea of ML for PM. He is a great union guy, but he isn't any more than that. lets not undermine the brilliant work he is doing.
I want Bruce Wee for PM.
They’re looking for very particular people with a very specific skillset.
I know a driver who qualified two years ago, it sounded like a lot more professional training than I’ve had in my entire working life… before they got to even start driving. I suspect there’s good reason for that.
There is an attitude in the UK that everyone else has a easy job, most common with people who would never even entertain doing that job for a day, never mind setting out to prove their suitability for the role, commit to the training, and then hold down the job long term.
I suspect there’s good reason for that.
And at least part of that good reason will be the fact train drivers are strongly unionised and the threat of strike action has headed off any attempt by owners or management to water down driver training and cut corners in order to undermine their pay and conditions in the interest of profits.
Do you want corners cutting in a safety critical role?
He's a good union leader, but PM is stretching it a bit.
And at least part of that good reason will be the fact train drivers are strongly unionised and the threat of strike action has headed off any attempt by owners or management to water down driver training and cut corners in order to undermine their pay and conditions in the interest of profits.
That and the consequence them screwing up would be headline national news, I suppose.
Years ago I took over from a sysadmin who was leaving the company. One of his tasks was a monthly backup which required a load of moving this, copying that, deleting the other. It was fraught with potential for risk and took him half a day. I said to him, this is madness, why don't you script it? His reply was "oh, it's far too important to trust to a script."
I'm reminded of this after reading the forum discussion Ernie linked to. The narrative is that there is a huge scope for human error. Which makes total sense, there's a lot of variables and the consequence of error could be hundreds of deaths. A signalman got the junction wrong; it's raining that day; the train is unusually packed; etc. So why not seek to minimise the dependence on humans? Not necessarily to get rid of train drivers but to at least make the job less perilous.
I’m reminded of this after reading the forum discussion Ernie linked to. The narrative is that there is a huge scope for human error. Which makes total sense, there’s a lot of variables and the consequence of error could be hundreds of deaths. A signalman got the junction wrong; it’s raining that day; the train is unusually packed; etc. So why not seek to minimise the dependence on humans? Not necessarily to get rid of train drivers but to at least make the job less perilous.
In that forum some posters alluded to France and Germany being far more automated. It doesn't sound like it takes less time to train a driver in these countries but it does sound like a train driver is a train driver and they could probably all swap between routes or even parts of the country without too much bother.
In the UK it sounds like local knowledge is far more important and not knowing the peculiarities of your route is borderline dangerous.
In answer to Kerley wondering about his Brexit stance, he's just been interviewed by James Obrian, I'm sure you'll all find it if you google. Can't see why there's so much enthusiasm about him on here personally.
In that forum some posters alluded to France and Germany being far more automated. It doesn’t sound like it takes less time to train a driver in these countries but it does sound like a train driver is a train driver and they could probably all swap between routes or even parts of the country without too much bother.
In the UK it sounds like local knowledge is far more important and not knowing the peculiarities of your route is borderline dangerous.
Yup. And there seems to be a lack of consistency in standards, which is frankly terrifying.
It's ancient infrastructure and rolling stock that's the problem here, isn't it. They could automate the DLR because it's a relatively simple route and they got to start again from scratch.
Yup. And there seems to be a lack of consistency in standards, which is frankly terrifying.
This would probably explain why UK train drivers get paid so much more than their European counterparts (as well as when compared to other jobs within the UK rail network).
I would imagine the levels of training to drive a train on the continent is similar to that of the UK. However, the level of specialisation required for the UK is far higher.
A high degree of specialisation is a double edged sword. On the one hand, it means more money because you are so difficult to replace. On the other hand, if you are considered surplus to requirements you can't take your specialist knowledge with you and you and you run the risk of being completely out of work.
It's interesting because train drivers and therefore the unions have little incentive to standardise the system because it would almost inevitably lead to a reduction in wages. At the same time, a non-state owned private company has few incentives to upgrade infrastructure or standardise systems. The increased wages must be a pretty small price to pay compared to upgrading infrastructure.
Elected governments have little interest in spending money on infrastructure because any benefit is almost certainly going to be enjoyed by future governments.
It's almost like the only way to get a country to take infrastructure seriously is to put an entity in place that is only interested in the railways but whose majority shareholder is the people it serves.
Great as a union leader and all round spokesperson for the left but not PM material.
His Brexit position is similar to that of Jeremy Corbyn's, only Mick Lynch is honest about it. Corbyns tepid support for Remain did more to help Brexit happen than had he come out for Leave.
Sorry to bring the old fart into the thread but it's true isn't it, the hard left are as Brexit mad as the hard right and that's probably why the left are finding it harder to find a voice within the Labour Party.
Great as a union leader and all round spokesperson for the left but not PM material.
Definitely this. His message seems to resonate with a lot of ordinary folk, and you'd think would set the tone for Labour to put some clear water between themselves and the Tories.
In a world where we’re increasingly frotting on about driverless cars, we seemingly can’t work out driverless trains* and they’re on rails.
This has also been trotted out for London Underground drivers too. The big stumbling block is that tunnels have to be wide enough to get the passengers out safely. Our Victorian tunnels and such like preclude driverless anything on old infrastructure without spending a metric ****-tonne of money on enlarging things. It's cheaper to pay top dollar to the well-trained drivers.