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Smashing little video that the met have released showing them just knocking criminals off mopeds in London! Some real big wallops in here. Good riddance.
"This year police drivers have knocked suspects off their mopeds or scooters 63 times, including sthose who have taken off their helmets."
Is this going to create a new Reddit category, MET or GTA?
It must be satisfying as hell to be paid to send people flying down the road grand theft auto style.
"Yeah, blud, if we take off our helmets the police will leave us alone......Oh. ****!"
Noice.
Was just about to post a thread on this.
i don’t know how I feel about it. I’m a supporter of the Police and hate the scrotes that use bikes for crime, however, if a scrote gets killed or seriously injured then the copper who was driving is going to be put through the mill, investigation after investigation, suing, compensation etc etc. There’s no easy answer to it, yes we need to be stricter on crime. Perhaps I’m just thinking the worst and worrying about the impact it could have on the Police driver or innocent Jo Public who runs over a scrote that’s been knocked off into the path of their car
There's a good argument to say that if they are already being chased and are not stopping then it is in the public's interest to stop them as quickly as possible, regardless of the risk to their lives. But yes, I can see some 'orrible scrote with a snappily-dressed lawyer going after them for this in court.
Still, if they think they have the right protections in place, I think I can live with them doing this. Certainly, it makes for some properly satisfying video footage...
As a victim of moped crime, having had a phone taken out of my hand in Holborn one evening, can i say I am appalled by the approach being taken.
Not once did they reverse back and then drive over their ankles to really teach them a lesson
Not long ago I got caught up in a chase between two scrotes on a moped and a police car, the moped trying to overtake me on a busy stretch of road to evade the police. Common sense prevailed and I pulled over and let them get on with it.
About 200m down the road the car in front of me slammed on his brakes and the scrotes went straight through his back window. Gave the driver a thumbs up as I went past.
i don’t know how I feel about it. I’m a supporter of the Police and hate the scrotes that use bikes for crime, however, if a scrote gets killed or seriously injured then the copper who was driving is going to be put through the mill, investigation after investigation, suing, compensation etc etc.
I don't like the police much and I don't like scrotes either so it's a win win for me,
in seriousness having read the article now and a bit more, the original MO was nabbing phones out of hands as they rode past but in recent times it has turned more to mugging with threats / violence (knives, etc.) with mopeds then being used as the getaway.
While being robbed on the street is not nice however you look at it, if they have no concern for threatening and potentially injuring their victims rather than 'just' removing their property, I start to lose concern for their wellbeing.
Simple solutions:
1/ don't rob in the first place
2/ if caught in the act and 'pulled over' by the police then pull over; you've been caught, face the punishment
If you still then think the solution is to try to escape, be ready for what follows.
I support the Police in this instance, better they knock the thieves off the (stolen) mopeds than create havoc in the surrounding area.
And it sends a message out to the thieves that thinking they’ll get away with the crime is the the wrong assumption.
👨✈️🦹♂️👩✈️🚓🛵🚓
living and working in London I have to say that I'm 100% for this
Sorry but if they remove their own helmet and try and escape the police, then they should automatically waive all compensation rights, and deserve what they get.
They should give the police powerful motorbikes and big chains, then film it.
Nudge Dread
(Carlton Reid)
Are the Met recruiting currently? I’m very tempted
All for it myself, they can have bonnet mounted tasers too, make sure the scrotes can't run away!
I got a letter recently asking for volunteers to catch speeding motorists. I hope they ask for volunteers for this too. I don't own a car, but I would buy one if I could do this. And a large bonnet mounted spike.
I like the cut of your jib brakes.
Just another day in Mega City One.
I think the observation we can take from this thread is that the general public is quite bloodthirsty.
I support the Police in this instance, better they knock the thieves off the (stolen) mopeds than create havoc in the surrounding area.
And it sends a message out to the thieves that thinking they’ll get away with the crime is the the wrong assumption
This.
I expect there are some pretty tough 'rules of engagement' to help both restrain andrenalin fueled officers and prevent counter suing.
It sounds very effective but Im not convinced its the best long term solution. How about paying a decent wage to young people so they don't go out robbing? What if they get the wrong guy and accidentally run him over?
Is that game called road rash?
I wasted hours on that!
On a serious note,in a civilised world finephilly would probably have a point....then again.
.
What if they get the wrong guy and accidentally run him over?
Reading an article on the subject, it's used to end dangerous high speed chases
Im not convinced its the best long term solution.
Hopefully it won't need to be long term, this type of crime has become so prevelent because they think they can get away with it.
The tactics have helped reduce moped crime in London by 44%, according to the Met Police figures.
Is that game called road rash?
I wasted hours on that!
Yes and me too
The police should dress as rockers #quadraphinia
I'm a bit disappointed they don't just run them over having knocked them off...
I suspect that the reason the Met is releasing this now is because Tommy Winsor is investigating this with a view to shafting the officers involved and they want to drum up public support.
And I fully support the Met here. I can't find a reference at the moment but there was a court case where the police were liable for third-party injuries caused by people they were chasing so it's a bold decision taken to protect the public despite being hamstrung by Theresa May and some parts of the judiciary.
Having encountered these people, the chances of mistaking a law abiding motorist for one of the balaclava wearing, iron bar wielding, footpath riding, speeding motorbikes with no number plates is fairly low. Seems to me if you stop when asked you won't have any problems.
I’m surprised how well these scum bags bounce.
Knock em off at will.
After I'd knocked them off I'd accidentally miss the brake pedal. Wastes of oxygen!
How about paying a decent wage to young people so they don’t go out robbing?
Haha. Get real 😂
I am all for paying decent wages to anyone that is willing to work, But most of the kids round my way doing this aren’t even old enough to work!
what planet do you live on.
Don’t the stats show that since they started doing this, there’s been an enormous reduction in scrotes on mopeds robbing people?
Job jobbed then.
Only thing that worries me about this is how it could grow... Like, in the case of violent crime, I don't mind the idea of a little harm occurring but how about nonviolent crime? Like, shoplifting with a scooter getaway, or joyriding... Or just plain failing to stop.
Nah **** em! Why do 99 percent of those who fail to stop, fail to stop? Because they're up to no good. Bonnet the lot of them!
Great example of a risk assessment done right. Well done Met, more power to your elbow.
How about paying a decent wage to young people so they don’t go out robbing?
Agreed, but it’s not an either/or situation. These individuals have crossed a rather thick line and are no longer worthy of assistance by society, having decided to viciously prey upon innocent people whilst (attempting to) cynically exploit our society’s decent, liberal human rights record.
I grew up with some mates who were proper wrong’uns. Up to all kinds of shit. In the days before mobile phones filming everything, they knew that an occupational hazard of this was getting a proper shoeing in the back of a police van.
It seems the Met are just going a bit retro 80’s
There's a bike path through Niddrie in Edinburgh. It's where lots of stolen motorcycles get taken and ragged about.
Fairly often there are wee shrines/bunches of flowers where they've crashed the bikes and killed themselves.
I'm not really sure how to feel about it....
I think the observation we can take from this thread is that the general public is quite bloodthirsty.
Old Testament justice - get medieval on their asses. Think of it as evolution in action.
*true story*
One of my best mates from school started to go wayward once we were 17, got his licence etc, he would drive us to nights out etc. On reaching 18/19 some of us went off to uni, he decided to stay home and Rob car stereos. It ended one night with him being bonneted by the police in a well to do village.
He got a big payout but couldn't spend it as he was at his majestys.
It's not a new tactic.
in seriousness having read the article now and a bit more, the original MO was nabbing phones out of hands as they rode past but in recent times it has turned more to mugging with threats / violence (knives, etc.) with mopeds then being used as the getaway.
Although the media only seem to report on the muggings, handbags grabs and the odd jewellery burglary, moped crime was far, far worse and far reaching. Motorbike theft in London is/was out of control, with mopeds being used most of the time. Not just parked bikes either, bike jacking on the roads in broad daylight. Of course there's no real 'victim' when a motorbike gets stolen, as insurance will cover it, so it rarely made the news.
Broad ****ing daylight, armed with a hammer and battery grinder, without a care in the world. People intervening have had acid thrown at them by these excuses for an intelligent life-form.
Run the ****ers over? Yes please!!! 😀 They deserve everything. It is awesome the police can finally do something about these scrotes. If nothing was done it would have spread outside London too, it already has been spreading to towns outside the M25 but near to London.
Well, if there's one thing you can trust the Met to do, it's use force against the right people, record it properly, and tell the truth to the media...
Im all for it.. live by the sword, die by the sword.
Its no different from riding an mtb down a hill imo.. may be youll get spiked on your head, break your neck and die. Misadventure. Go out robbing with with your mates on scooters.. get clattered off the peelers and spread down the road like patè. Misadventure.
The police have been too soft for too long down there and thats the reason theyre all running about stabbing each other and chucking drain cleaner in peoples faces.
How about paying a decent wage to young people so they don’t go out robbing?
Moped crime is relatively easy and requires no specialist skills. What job do you have in mind that can give you a few hundred quid in your pocket in two or three hours?
Can I get one of these jobs too?
Moped crime is relatively easy and requires no specialist skills. What job do you have in mind that can give you a few hundred quid in your pocket in two or three hours?
Can I get one of these jobs too?
Dealers Needed.
No experience necessary. Must provide own transport. Ideally something with 2 wheels and a small motor.
Well, if there’s one thing you can trust the Met to do, it’s use force against the right people, record it properly, and tell the truth to the media…
Yep. Although taking the helmets off makes it easier for the Met as they can then ensure they are only knocking off the black riders.
It is a bit too much Judge Dredd and an action not in perspective with the crime.
Fire up the Quattro...
an action not in perspective with the crime.
Really? Did you read about how it's gone beyond phone snatching and into mugging with intimidation / violence. And despite the rhetoric, they aren't being 'smeared down the road' but being knocked off in as low risk a way as possible as you can knock someone off with a car.
10's of thousands of robberies a year using this method.
This tactic has been used 63 times
and knowing that this method's in use seems to have already scared them into a substantial reduction.
It's not vigilante cops randomly running moped riders over, it's a well thought out and effective tactic countering a crime epidemic.
And yes, I get the social issues that create the situation where people turn to crime, but is that the cause in many of these cases or is it just greed? And irrespective, is the response then that because it's society's fault we let it continue without addressing both cause and effect?
Youngsters are paid more now than they ever have been. It’s not even part of the root cause of this issue. It’s about gangs.
if we’re serious about the police actuallly being effective at stopping criminals we’ve got to give thyme some powers to directly address criminals. And yes in one or two cases the criminal might be injured more than intended or a police man/woman might overstep the mark in terms of the ‘direct action’ they meter out, but we need to cut them some slack and not jump on them every time they do. The vast majority of police are decent. It’s a risky job and they need more ability to deal with violent criminals. We love to blame the police when crime happens and say ‘what are you doing about it? But then take any powers from them that would enable them to actually stop criminals.
of course prevention is better than cure so that is where most of our efforts need to be focussed. But i’m all for more powers being given to the police for being able to take more direct action against violent criminals.
If nothing was done it would have spread outside London too
It already has. I live in a village outside Leeds and we hear about it all the time locally.
It is a bit too much Judge Dredd and an action not in perspective with the crime.
...speaking as someone who has never been close to this sort of crime or affected by it in any way I assume?
I was a bit surprised the The Times has gone a bit Gruniad this morning, even quoting Diane bloody Abbott and generally taking a tone that suggest the Met’s actions are questionable.
No questions from my side!
Quote from another person: “Apparently the penalty for riding a moped in a way that makes it seem as if you are a theif, is death by police car”
Well, no.
1) no one has died. And most importantly:
2) if there is a police car chasing you at high speed, with lights flashing and siren on, clearly intending that you stop, you have a choice as to what happens next
no one has died.
Yet.
Given the amount of hyperbole on this here forum regarding cars being used as weapons against cyclists I'm surprised at the general acceptance of this tactic.
Excellent video, we all watched at work yesterday on the DM website and had a right laugh. The only criticism was they could have rammed the crims much harder.
Shame they're not using Hero 7. 4k HD of these little shits bouncing down the road would be great.
There should be little place for this sort of heavy handed policing in a modern, enlightened society. Whilst I can’t help but enjoy a load of behoodied scumbags getting their just desserts on the bonnet of a police car, I also can’t help but think that these tactics are going to further alienate certain segments of society and deepen the already massive divisions between the haves and the have nots. It’s hard to imagine anyone having sympathy for the scooter crooks, but the first one to end up in a wheelchair, or even get killed will probably end up as a local martyr. The ‘he was a loveable rogue, led astray, loved his kids/mum etc stories will be all over SoMe, and resentment of police will skyrocket, with the associated violence targeting police officers, and the vicious circle will accelerate. We should be working on unifying and bettering U.K. society, but it’s too difficult, so let’s endorse smashing up wronguns with police cars. It’s not hard to see what’s wrong with this tactic, even if it is initially gratifying to watch.
However, this is Tory UK, that ship sailed a long time ago. So as you were, let’s watch some more scumbags getting taken down for our enjoyment on youtube. It’s all a bit too ‘running man’ for me; posting the videos for entertainment feels like a line has been crossed.
The whole thing smacks of last-ditch desperation on the part of the Met. Funding cuts mean they have no means of tackling this via intelligence and community policing, so the only recourse they have is to punt them down the road with a car and cross their fingers that no-one dies or is seriously injured.
Sticking the videos up on Youtube for our entertainment is a desperate attempt to appeal for popular support in anticipation of getting sued. I wonder if they'll post up the first time they give someone a serious head or spinal injury.
The support for this from Londoners is rooted in pure frustration at the lack of policing, but that policing needs to be done at community level, not with the front bumper of a patrol car.
The support for this from Londoners is rooted in pure frustration at the lack of policing, but that policing needs to be done at community level, not with the front bumper of a patrol car.
Well Sadiq Khan was ridiculed in the press when suggesting this approach so I don't see much chance of it getting traction any time soon.
…speaking as someone who has never been close to this sort of crime or affected by it in any way I assume?
Yep, which puts me in a more objective and less emotive position which is always the best position to be in when judging things.
Really? Did you read about how it’s gone beyond phone snatching and into mugging with intimidation / violence.
And it is only the extreme cases where the police are knocking them off, do they know that or are they just another moped criminal of any sort? I don't really care what crimes are committed, I don't see this as the correct course of action as people are going to get killed so you are bringing back capital punishment by stealth with moves like this. Where has the persons fair trial gone?
However, this is Tory UK, that ship sailed a long time ago. So as you were, let’s watch some more scumbags getting taken down for our enjoyment on youtube. It’s all a bit too ‘running man’ for me; posting the videos for entertainment feels like a line has been crossed.
Well, hopefully the vids won't continue to be shown on national media for entertainment but I guess the initial publicity may serve a purpose
It'll be interesting to see what happens to policy after the first KSI
For those criticising this tactic, what's your alternative? Unrestrained violent crime? Give everyone an armed bodyguard (worked for the anti armed bodyguard Mr Corbyn)?
I believe the Met are aware that the vast majority of moped crime is carried out by a remarkably small number of scallywags. IIRC the Met stopped one group from operating and the fall in crime was disproportionate to the small amount of arrests. I don't see the present tactic being used by the Met as unreasonable as the scallywags have become emboldened as they believe they are untouchable. I'm sure the local communities are happy with resultant drop in moped crime.
I would like to think it isn't a long term solution but in the short term I congratulate the Met on their approach. It works.
"I don’t see this as the correct course of action as people are going to get killed"
People are already getting killed and maimed by these gangs.
This way criminals get killed not law abiding members of the public. It's their choice. As one judge said, by being a criminal one chooses to accept the inherent risks.
"Where has the persons fair trial gone?"
If they stop at the scene, leave their contact details and address, and turn up at the magistrates the next morning then you're absolutely correct.
But by speeding off down the pavement and driving head first into pedestrians they've sort of indicated that they aren't planning on turning up to court.
If they stop at the scene, leave their contact details and address, and turn up at the magistrates the next morning then you’re absolutely correct.
Is that what all other criminals do? You typically need to catch criminals, arrest, and put to trial in this country. You cannot choose to try and kill them just because you can't arrest them via traditional means.
As one judge said, by being a criminal one chooses to accept the inherent risks.
The inherent risk of crime is to end up in jail, fined, community service etc,. It is not getting killed deliberately by a police car.
stories will be all over SoMe
Yo! Dude!
The inherent risk of crime is to end up in jail, fined, community service etc,. It is not getting killed deliberately by a police car.
The problem with moped/motorbike crime in London particularly is there has been almost zero risk to the criminals of being caught.
There's no way to identify someone in a helmet. And until now the police have have been unable to stop them on the road. So its become worse and worse to the point where london was becoming a no go zone for motorbikes unless you wanted acid throwing in your helmet and your bike nicked.
All this achieves is to tell the would be criminals, is you can run, you can hide, but at least now we will chase you.
Who do you think is worse off, a violent thief with some road rash, or the next victim of the violent thief that gets away.
where do we stand on the use of physical restraint then? That hurts.....my BiL is a prison officer and a quick demo from him demonstrated effectively how it could disincentivise resistance. Could easily lead to injury if you continued.
Or police dogs - I mean being bitten by an alsatian isn't healthy.
These guys aren't being randomly punted down the road willy-nilly. Stop, comply and face a fair trial, or run for it - but be aware that you might be proactively stopped.
The purpose of putting the videos on the news and in the media isn't for titillation, but to demonstrate what may happen. And in that respect, and the reduction of this type of crime....seems to have had an effect.
It's been used 63 times compared to ca 20,000 moped crimes. And with minimal harm to the criminals involved, based on the (lack of) reports. They aren't being summarily killed by vigilante coppers, far from it.
"The purpose of putting the videos on the news and in the media"
There are four officers currently facing Gross Misconduct charges because of this. Their actions will almost certainly have been signed off at the highest level and they are being made scapegoats.
I would bet that this media campaign is, in part, to stop Tom Winsor destroying the lives of four people who were only trying to protect the public from violent criminals behind closed doors. Or if he does succeed then we will all know who to blame for the next acid attack or stabbing.
"deliberately by a police car"
Nobody is being deliberately killed by a police car. Not even in Met land. You'd have to be on the far fringes of conspiracy theory to believe that.
if there is a police car chasing you at high speed, with lights flashing and siren on, clearly intending that you stop, you have a choice as to what happens next
I often watch vehicles with blue lights and sirens on trying to make their way along motorways. It’s amazing how oblivious so many drivers are to their presence.
I often watch vehicles with blue lights and sirens on trying to make their way along motorways. It’s amazing how oblivious so many drivers are to their presence.
But that is dick heads in their own little worlds, probably on their phone. This is criminals getting away from performing a crime, I suspect they will be paying a little bit more attention to their surroundings and notice the police car.
This is a tricky one and hard to justify but you have to consider the alternative outcomes:
1. Don't chase them, let them get away. Crime continues, innocent people affected and maybe seriously injured or even killed if they try and resist or killed on purpose in gang situations.
2. Chase them and let the speeds get silly high, they then come off at high speed and split themselves in two on a lampost or them and their scooter crash into some people waiting a bus stop or families queuing to meet Santa this Christmas resulting in live changing injuries or death to innocent people.
3. Wait for an opportunity to knock them off at low speed and in a low risk to others area bringing the chase to an end. There is the risk of (2) the longer you let it go on but that is when they have to use discipline and restraint.
Anyone trying to outrun the Police has already accepted, in my mind, that that might end up with them losing control and crashing. Hopefully this will now give them another, bad for them, outcome to think about before they get on that moped and commit a crime.
I’ve witnessed moped riders:
- robbing families walking in our local park at 10:00 on a Sunday morning
- terrorising drivers on local roads for several years now - swarming round cars, kicking in the panels, trying to smash windows etc.
- chasing deliveroo riders to steal their bikes
- dragging cyclists off their bikes on shepherds bush roundabout in moving traffic “for fun”
- coming along our street several nights a week to see what they can steal
- riding round with battery powered angle grinders strapped over their shoulders - presumably for grinding through bike / moped locks.
They are complete scum and deserve no mercy whatsoever.
I personally think the police should be given a choice of flamethrowers or some kind of smart / guided harpoon gun so they can deal with the moped risers without having to risk damage to the police cars or the mopeds.
If the moped riders are injured in the process that’s great news and I’d just like to see public services joined up so that’s when they find their way to A&E the door is slammed shut in their faces.
kerley claims....
The inherent risk of crime is to end up in jail, fined, community service etc,.
I have to disagree with you on this, as you appear to completely disregard the victims.
Crime effects the victims. Loss of property, physical injury, psychological damage and even serious life threatening injuries or death. It was not the choice of innocent members of public to be a victim of these moped gangs.
The scallywags involved with this crime are prepared to throw acid in peoples faces, threaten with hammers, knives and even machetes. Many are prepared to carry out their violent threats. Some are stealing 100 phones an hour and that's after the moped they are riding has been stolen from someone. Quite often stolen by a delivery driver trying to provide for their family.
Moped crime is out of control. Something is being done.
I love that video. In these sad times it just brings a smile to my face. As the crims go down and bounce it gives me a real sense of satisfaction.
Scary really.
In a way it's a shame that they don't deal as severely with white collar crime like the Phoenix four and other high end frauds. Still you wouldn't expect the powers that be to do anything but shit on the people below, and they seem to be doing that more effectively so it's a start.
This, or something like it, was always coming. Not being a Londoner I don't know how much of the impact of the gangs is real, or imagined but it's become political and seeing as STW is generally not a reactionary bucket of right wing bile and posters who've actually seen them in action think it's not only a good idea, but a bit mild if anything I can't knock it.
As a form of entrainment, it's great - My personal favourite bit of instant justice on Police Interceptors is Dickhead in the Jaws of a PD, but this is a close second.
As ever though, it's the law of unindented consequences that you want to worry about - do we think these hardened, don't give a ****, criminals are going to say "Shit lads, the game's up, time to polish up the ole CV and get that well paid job in the city we've been putting off". I give them a few weeks before they've found a much worse way to take peoples things and get away with it.
I think this is going to be the exception rather than the norm, but it might make a few of them think twice? I'm sure time will tell if this is a genuine tactic, or just "You've met the Met" propaganda and it'll all be back to square one in a few weeks? Really pity the first officer to have a 'ped rider die as a bonnet ornament and that's really not going to help the general consensus by da yoots that Popo is the biggest gang out there.
There are four officers currently facing Gross Misconduct charges because of this. Their actions will almost certainly have been signed off at the highest level and they are being made scapegoats.
You referring to the Hicks case? If so they were all, quite rightly, cleared:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-41697985
If you're referring to a different incident can you link so we can all read about it?
WRT to the central issue, I 100pc support the Met. Seems pretty clear the net result is less people injured overall and less crime, with the added bonus that a higher proportion of the injured people will be perps and therefore able to make a decision for themselves if they want to take on the risk.