I had a test drive in a GR Yaris today, ABSOLUTELY BONKERS, this car has two physical states parked and WARP DRIVE what a machine.
Roll on the 6th of January
What's the range on battery ?
Anyone seen the Citroen Ami? Seems a cool little thing.
I saw this when they were first announced and thought it looked amazing (and still does). But like a lot of these super mini type things I just couldn’t get past the price!
I would imagine the range of the battery would be about 100,000 miles.
That's the one they built specifically to exploit the new rally rules which were then cancelled, right?
Insane machine. I want its engine and drive train in a 7 just to kill myself giggling
Want one! Not a big rally fan - but there is something about homologation specials.... 🙂
260hp and 4 wheel drive in a Yaris with a carbon roof and frameless doors. I’d love one.
They are pulling 277bhp on the Dyno and I can believe it. Toyota also say track days won't affect the warranty.
I'd like one. Engine performance seems about right by numbers, quick but not unnecessarily so. More importantly what did it feel like to drive? Am all about the chassis feels, cornering/ bumpy road performance...did it give that certain fizz to the undercarriage through the undercarriage?
Fast isn’t everything though is it. Was it fun in the corners? Did it allow slip even being 4wd or is it a bush finder ie mega grip beyond sage road speeds ?
It's like a modern one of these.
Braap
Cornering is other Worldly, hard to explain its like a push pull effect sort of feels like it's rotating on an imaginary axis. It makes you think you can take any corner at any speed you please.
They do look good, if I had some spare cash I'd give one a try for a while, but I fear it'll be like a lot of other 4wd cars, very fast in most conditions, but not much fun.
I've tried a load of different 'types' of carover the last 30 years of driving, 4wd, fwd, mid engine rwd, front engine rwd, and the type I keep coming back to is front engine rwd. There's something about the ability to slide at will that makes them more fun than the rest, for me anyway, I appreciate others may get their fun in different ways.
But of the 4wd cars, this yaris does look like it would be the most fun, and I appreciate that Toyota have made it.
I want one. I really hope that - unlike the Megane R26.R and Trophy R models (for example) - they sell a ton of them, to encourage them to continue in this vein!
Will end up with a popping and farting remap and being ragged round northern mill towns in a few years time but as long as STWers can make progress till then that's great.
Fast isn’t everything though is it. Was it fun in the corners?
Indeed. My old Hillman Imp was great fun in the corners at anything above 30mph.
It makes you think you can take any corner at any speed you please.
Ah so completely dull and dangerous then.
Put a deposit down on when in March, test drive, cancelled order, deposit returned.
For me there was too much grip so it wasn't much fun at normal speeds.
How did you get a test drive? Had a look on Toyota's website and couldn't book one
had a deposit on one since March this year so was front of queue for a test drive
have a look on Pistonheads thread for dealer near you with a test driver
Also a short review in Motor Sport this month if that helps
Pretty ace these, I really like that they haven't just gone for mad power (in a straight line, it's about as fast as my sensible daily, but I bet it can take corners at a pace that would leave me upside down in a field...)
Looks like a great car! In another life I would love one. And no, you don’t need to drive like a loon on public roads to appreciate one.
Should the Set For Life lottery cough up, then I’m putting my name down for one! I’ve driven lots of Yarises, as well as Aygos, and they always seem to be begging for a bigger motor and better drive-train, just for the shits’n’giggles, like Fiat 500 Abarts with the boot lid propped open. As Castle Combe circuit is a short drive away, it would be the perfect little track day car, and fun on the local A- and B-roads, without being stupidly powerful, a bit like MX-5’s are.
And no, you don’t need to drive like a loon on public roads to appreciate one.
Well, no, but I'm sure all the mouthbreathing weapons that pop and bang up my road at 20mph over the speed limit will appreciate it very much.
I just found that it wasn't very interesting to drive at legal speeds, whereas Caterhams, origional Minis and aircooled, first gen watercooled 911's are in my opinion.
I don't get the 'too much grip' talk that goes on.
Unless you are a driving God and can flick the back end out at will and under complete control, then I'd rather have a car that grips the road.
But then I'm not surfmatt
The 'too much grip' talk is related to the reasons why a car like the GT86 shipped on the Eco tyre Michelin Primacy, intentionally lowering grip levels so the driver can interact with a lively chassis at sensible road speeds. The fact that the GT86 and GR Yaris exist at the same time from Toyota is quite unexpected and welcomed by enthusiasts, form the sounds of it the GR hits most points spot on for its intentions- Agree though that the fine points of handling and car control will be utterly lost on the majority of drivers by all observations, who will be better served by maximum grip and all systems on.
I just found that it wasn’t very interesting to drive at legal speeds, whereas Caterhams, origional Minis and aircooled, first gen watercooled 911’s are in my opinion.
Agree on the Caterham as used one as a daily driver for a few years but also had a Mini as a daily driver and was interesting in a "god this is uncomfortable" kind of way. Never had a 911 but had a Boxster for a while and I would say that was even too competent to be fun.
If I was still into cars I would probably now settle for a Caterham 160 as has enough power at legal speeds but has nice narrow tyres to provide some fun (in similar way to GT86 mentioned above)
I don’t get the ‘too much grip’ talk that goes on.
Unless you are a driving God and can flick the back end out at will and under complete control, then I’d rather have a car that grips the road.
Its not about needing to be a driving god, a nicely balanced car, with rwd, an lsd , a reasonable amount of power, and lowish grip is pretty easy to slide about at lowish speeds - driving godliness is necessary at high speeds and with high grip.
Its just different opinions of fun, maybe a bit like bikes, some people like poppy and playful bikes, others want to just plow through stuff at warp 9 .
Awesome car created at great expense by a company old enough to know better. There won't be many more cars like this. I hope the owners enjoy them as intended before everything goes fully electric.
It's a shame they went to all that trouble and won't get to race it as intended. I don't follow the WRC that closely but major rule changes will finally remove the need to start with a production chassis all together. In a couple of years they'll all be near identical off-road NASCAR type things.
Unless you are a driving God and can flick the back end out at will and under complete control, then I’d rather have a car that grips the road.
It's really not that hard or mortally dangerous to have fun in a car. There's a time and a place unfortunately lots of people are a poor judge of those conditions.
It sounds like a modern Mitsubishi Evo.
My brother had one, it was quick enough in a strightline but other worldly in the corners. It had plenty of grip but was also adjustable. You could pretty much go sideways when ever you fancied, it was like driving a big kart.
But, it was a bit of a pig at low speeds, the heavy clutch, drive train shunt and turbo lag made it pretty hard to drive it smoothly in normal traffic.
I imagine this Yaris is a lot more sorted though
I remember my first passenger ride in an Evo. It was properly fast in a straight line but nothing unusual compared to other fast stuff. The way it changed direction though, holy Jesus. It was mind blowing.
It had all the grip in the world, right up until you didn't want it to grip then it would slide forever. I've been in loads of other stuff since then but I still remember how violently quick it was around twisty stuff, (including a karting track!)
Build quality was shocking though. I never wanted to own one as I had a few mates who just endlessly poured money into them before retreating, defeated into a TDi.
Hopefully the Yaris has a little of that agility. I much prefer smaller cars these days.
Build quality was shocking though. I never wanted to own one as I had a few mates who just endlessly poured money into them before retreating, defeated into a TDi.
Yeah, sounds familiar. I think my brother's ran right less than half the time. One week it had a miss-fire, the next week it had a slipping clutch etc, then a sooty throttle body, then a faulty rear diff. They were quite easy to work on though. I remember helping him change the fuel pump during our lunch our in the office car park!
I'm pretty sure the new Yaris won't have the same issues
Matt Watson @ CarWow test drove one and gave it full marks.
Absolutely bonkers. I want one.
It sounds like a modern Mitsubishi Evo.
Pretty much, certainly the later ones that weren't based on a 'normal' base car.
It's a Yaris only in name really, different shell, hell pretty much a bespoke body that Yaris front and CRV rear, bespoke engine, bespoke drivetrain.
I'd love one, but I can't afford a weekend car and it's too small for a daily for me.
The funny thing is most experts reckoned there wouldn't be another car like it, a Sold at a loss, Halo car for a mainstream brand.
I don't think it will end up in the hands of the pop and bang lot, it's a bit too car nerdy for that.
Actually, it may be a bit more Escort Cosworth than Evo, only slightly.
The Escort Cosworth wasn't really an Escort, it was more like a modernised Sierra with an Escort looking body, they had little in common past the cosmetics.
It’s a Yaris only in name really, different shell, hell pretty much a bespoke body that Yaris front and CRV rear, bespoke engine, bespoke drivetrain.
What? You mean my base model Yaris isn't just like the ones the rally drivers use?
The Escort Cosworth wasn’t really an Escort, it was more like a modernised Sierra with an Escort looking body, they had little in common past the cosmetics.
People always trot out this little factoid. That an Escort Cosworth was really a Sierra.
It's because the first Escort prototypes were built on cut down Sierra floorplans because they had a prop tunnel and room for a rear diff, unlike the front wheel drive Escort.
After that they certainly weren't cutting and shutting Sierra's on the production line in Germany.
One of the car magazines has just got one to 60 in 4.6 seconds.
My wife has no interest in cars so I let her drive it first, she now wants to go to Rally school and said shall we get two and so we can race each other on a track.
People always trot out this little factoid. That an Escort Cosworth was really a Sierra.
It’s because the first Escort prototypes were built on cut down Sierra floorplans because they had a prop tunnel and room for a rear diff, unlike the front wheel drive Escort.
After that they certainly weren’t cutting and shutting Sierra’s on the production line in Germany.
No they weren't cutting up old un-sold Sapphire bodies, but the chassis or floor of the monocoque depending on how you feel about 'chassis' was based on a design used on the Sierra, only modernised so it used a longitudinally mounted engine, had a transmission tunnel and independent rear suspension, compared to the Escort which had a transversely mounted engine, FWD and a torsion beam rear. It's longer, wider and taller than an Escort, with a longer wheel base and wider track.
Yeah but by that point it was very much an Escort Cosworth and nothing else. Only the very first test donkeys ever started life as a collection of other bits.
Sorry, I don't disagree with you I just spent way too many years hanging around with car bores and I'd always here "but an Escort Cosworth isn't even an Escort it's a Sierra don't ya know" type comments which is just bollocks and ignores all that stuff you just typed.
Anyway, the new Yaris. Yeah looks mint. Mr Catchpole likes it but is a bit subdued where everyone else is gushing about it. I think he was expecting it to be a bit more mental.
I can't be bothered to watch all of the identical 'first drive' videos on YouTube where they recite all the marketing guff. Who really cares how many spot welds the body has? Or how many metres of adhesive they used? Nobody in the history of cars. But if Toyota write it, they'll read it out on camera.
my mate has one on order and oddly an A45S plus merc. He is trying to decide which one to go for before either turn up at the dealer.
I really like the Yaris, as mentioned, seems like a genuine modern Evo or Impreza (and I am an impreza lover, just not he running costs).
If I had a spare 34k, I would have an order in for one. But seeing as I don't, my old school EP3 JDM Civic type-r keeps a smile on my face... thankfully!
I've watched a few videos about the GR and whilst I can see the appeal, its:
a) £30k for the base model without nav etc
b) still very much a Yaris inside
b) still very much a Yaris inside
Cars like this are always bland inside because it's not where they've spent the money. Have you ever been in a Lancia Delta or the aforementioned Escort Cosworth? They're crap and they sell for vastly inflated sums of money.
If you want a posh interior you buy a luxury car. This is the kind of car where you pull everything out to fit a roll cage and bucket seats.
It's the aspiration of function over form, with genuine motorsport roots that's exciting. It helps that it's probably the best bang-for-buck you can buy new today. Most fast cars are a more product of marketing than engineering but this bucks the trend. If you need a car to project an image, it's probably not for you.
I owned a couple of Toyota Celica GT4s (their last 4wd turbo homologated vehicles, some are 30 years old now) and this is the first time since then I've thought a new car this interesting. Apparently Plato did laps Celica GT4 vs GR Yaris for an upcoming Fifth Gear and the Yaris smashed the time with a similar power output.
I would imagine the range of the battery would be about 100,000 miles.
This is excellent and I feel it was missed.
Too much grip is good, I've got a 330bhp RWD BMW and it's shit off the lights.
DaveyBoyWonder
Free Membera) £30k for the base model without nav etc
b) still very much a Yaris inside
I think this is partly a Japanese vs European thing... Here, we kind of expect expensive cars to have nice interiors and toys. In Japan they see performance and luxuriousness as being two separate things- you can have both but it's not the default.
So, frinstance. I have 2 Subaru Legacies of the same age, UKDM and JDM. Both cars get the exact same Bilstein suspension upgrades and make about the same power (UK is 3 litre n/a, JDM is 2 litre turbo) The UK Spec B has an upgraded interior with computer, upgraded stereo, satnav, heated leather seats, etc, 18 inch wheels. The JDM one was more expensive to buy new, and they do the exact same job, but has the exact same interior and stereo as the cheapest spec Legacy you could buy, and rather boring 17s.(to me, that's an upgrade but the world has fallen for big wheels) It doesn't even get cruise control or steering wheel stereo controls.
If you put the JDM model out in the UK literally every review would say "Great engine but £23000 (in 2004 money) for an estate car with poverty spec seats? MADNESS". But the Japanese market absolutely lapped it up.
a) £30k for the base model without nav etc
I suppose satnav would be useful in a rally car as you could get rid of that pesky co driver shouting instructions at you all the time along with losing the 80kg of weight.
Mmmmm...It’s awd for a start which is boring. Do you remember the similar hype around the gt86? Those things are just slow.
Fantombiker have you driven either of them?
I'm a biker as well and I can tell you the Yaris is a masterpiece of engineering and it is motorbike quick and it certainly isn't boring.
It’s awd for a start which is boring
This isn't your grannies Vag Haldex system though is it. It's permanent not on-demand for a start, Bias can be adjusted from front to rear either 60/40, 50/50, or 30/70 - and in the circuit pack is combined with a Torsen LSD. That 30/70 setting should see you right for a more rear biased cornering adjustability. The remarkable thing they've done is combined all the above with a solid suspension setup and it still comes in at around 1280 Kg - if it was pushing 1500kg like a golf R then it wouldn't be so interesting.
Mmmmm…It’s awd for a start which is boring. Do you remember the similar hype around the gt86? Those things are just slow.
It's boring in a VW or Audi shopping trolley but it's certainly not boring when you can light up all four tyres.
Have you ever driven a GT86? Standard models are underpowered and make a crap noise but they're magic to drive.
Just been across the town and I see there’s a new GR Yaris in white sitting next to a mates scallop boat at the harbour (kirkcudbright, Galloway), time to call him to see who’s it is and get a run out in it before it gets written off (fisherman & fast cars round here usually end up in fields)
Decent drag race on the carwow YouTube channel today - Golf GTI vs Ford Focus ST vs Skoda Octavia vRS
Golf a clear winner even though the Ford has quite a bit more power.
OP - do you now have a GR ? How is it going ?
Currently on 500 miles, haven't given it the full beans yet but what a car.
It has an ability to safely overtake. 😜
It's the years of bangernomics that has allowed me to buy one, life's too short and all that b******.
Never wanted a new car as much as I'd like a GR (I'll have a white one please!)
Alas, my 14 year VW caddy will have to do.
May offend some, driving on a public road.
But.
😱😱😱
OP interested to know how you get on . I’ve been looking at Porsche Boxters for similar money, but this is a potential option.
The only bit that worries me that people are saying it’s like an old Impreza which is good in some ways but you had to be a very capable driver to have fun in that without killing yourself.
Does it stick to the road like glue or actually move around a bit?
That vid - he knows what he’s doing , unlike most of us 😂
Recently got a shot of an M2 Competition. Knew I shouldn’t as the comedown would be horrendous after it, I wasn’t mistaken. Now trying to work out how to get fun cat back in my life...... 😩
a) £30k for the base model without nav etc
Who gives a toss about installed satnav in a performance orientated car? If the infotainment system has CarPlay, it’ll run satnav from your phone, or else just stick the phone to the screen like I did for 100,000 miles driving for BCA.
We’ve had a couple of Focus ST’s in for repair, 16-plate models, and they’re really basic inside, about the same as an equivalent year EcoSport or Fiesta - again, money is spent on the really important engineering, nobody has ever bought something like this Yaris, or a Caterham, or one of the performance Renaults, and complained about the lack of luxury toys in the cockpit.
like I did for 100,000 miles driving for BCA
You drove for BCA? You never mentioned.... 😉
For me the entertainment in driving a vehicle fast is getting it to or towards its limits. Vehicles with fantastic performance like this you really cannot do so on a public road unless you really are a driving god and prepared to risk serious jailtime and if something does go wrong then the consequences are much worse
An old mini is a much less good car dynamically but ordinary mortals can feel they are getting it to its limits on roads without doing stupid speeds
My old BSA footrests to the ground throttle wide open in 3rd felt fast as eff. The same corner I could take faster on my BMW and feel nothing like the thrill.
this is a large part of the reason I stopped riding motorbikes - it was all going to end in tears one way or another
Could any of you use a car like the Yaris to anything like its potential or are you going to end up with a dull experience simply because you can get nowhere near its limits?
Having no grip isn't about drifting every corner it's about arriving and being able to choose which end of the car has grip and adjusting that using the throttle, brakes and steering. Practicing that is the most fun part of driving imo. But the key is you can do it at a slow enough speed that if you then spot a hazard you can cut the fun in a safe distance. One of the best cars I've driven for that is a Citroen c1. Slow af but hella entertaining on the right road.
Maybe on a bike forum it's easier to understand in bike terms... I make the same decision on my MTB - good grippy tyre up front but just a ground control out back so the lariness can be had at a safer speed
Yes TJ proper dull that's what it is.
Your words are wise but without a hint of wisdom.
Its my experience that the best handling and fastest vehicles I have ridden / driven only become fun at ludicrous speeds. could you drive a car like the superduper yaris to anywhere near its limit?
Probably the best handling / fastest thing I have ever ridden / driven was my mates gsxr 7/11 streetfighter I was riding it on the torque ie midrange revs in 3rd and 4th on a nice twisty road. I was getting to grips with it nicely and I thought just cruising nowhere near its limits. I looked at the speedo to see 90+ mph as the front wheel lifted. I never got anywhere near its limits. I didn't dare to enter the top 1/3 of the rev range.
I personally find it more fun to be able to take a vehicle right thru its rev range with the throttle wide open, I like to be able to think I have got close to its limits. I find that more rewarding
Mayvbe you do track days? maybe you can find fun driving at 15% of the vehicles capability, mnaybe you are enough of a drivbing god to get to its limits on the road?
I was asking questions and describinbg my own experiences
Now tell me - can you thrash a vehicle like that on the road or not? do you find it fun to drive at 15% of the vehicles ability?
Now tell me – can you thrash a vehicle like that on the road or not?
can you or should you...
I had a test booked for one just before Xmas, but it got cancelled due to going into tier 4, will have to wait until it’s over now. Booked it by going into Toyota dealer and just asking about it.
Owned a evo 7 for last 11 years, want to see how it compares, as for the people saying evo’s need a lot of maintenance, in 11yrs mine has had 2 cam belts and a oil change every year so it’s been very good in that respect.
Too much grip is good, I’ve got a 330bhp RWD BMW and it’s shit off the lights.
Actually I'd agree, my 951 has similar power but no mod cons, like abs or traction control coupled with eighties turbo lag etc so a car like the Yaris will be better in every way on our variable grip road surfaces.
Can you still have fun without breaking the law?
Dunno not driven one, but I'd like to.
I'm tempted by one of these as well.
Going to book a test drive one lockdown is over.
I've moved out of an E46 M3, which at its limit (or mine) slid around everywhere on demand. Input, feedback, sound... all an absolute pleasure. Grip, speed... hmmm not the fast motor i've owned.
Jumped into a DC5 integra after and its like a go kart. lift off oversteer on tap and the noise is on par with the M3 (almost). As involved as the M3... not really, quicker over my fav bit of road... 100%. So my point...
My worry with the GR is that its like my current toy but further refined. Most of us aren't Ari Vatanen standard, but sensible speeds, a good whip is exactly that. My bangernomics Focus estate bike box which cost me £600 last year was a hoot at max chat (circa 40mph). All relative i guess.
I watched a vid on the car last night and the guy reviewing said even in 30/70 it had too much grip to be fun to drive on the road. Doesn’t mean it’s not very very rapid but I guess it depends what people want in a car.
I’m going to test drive one when I can, but I’m reality the monthly payments put it in the same category as thinks like Porsche.
Edit: The vid was the one linked above in the black car
I still haven't seen one in the flesh but that's not too surprising given my current daily routine. I'm surprised by the lukewarm reception to be honest. I thought the car would be a little more lairy and people seem disappointed that it isn't slithering all over the place at B-road speeds.
It's the aftermarket tuners that will release this cars full potential and I look forward to whistling turbos and 4 wheel drifts.
I'm still in the honeymoon period with the Fiesta PE but maybe I'll take a look in a couple of years.
Just had a quick look on the toyota used cars site to see whether any of these are hitting the second hand market yet - there's only one listed and they want £39k for it!
Anyone know what the current lead time is for a new one?
I really want to like this car, its got a lot about it that that should appeal to enthusiasts, but I just wonder whether it'll be similar to my old audi s3, bonkers fast on the road in almost any conditions, but terminally dull. I have no idea how a car that fast could be so dull.
but I just wonder whether it’ll be similar to my old audi s3, bonkers fast on the road in almost any conditions, but terminally dull.
Nothing can be as dull as an Audi.
I’ve not driven one but all the press people who drive it appear to have genuine smiles on their faces.
That Yaris GR looks great fun - and surprisingly affordable on finance according to the targeted ads popping up in my Facebook feed! Wether it's fun at everyday road speeds is a different matter, may feel too refined?
I'm making do with this Type-R for the time being - I bought it on a whim at the beginning of December for just over £3k as a stop-gap car but I'm really liking it and may keep it for a good while longer. Feels fun and 'skippy' even at slow speeds, and that VTEC engine is great! 🙂
I also like it because it is pretty basic - but I've made the dangerous step of lurking on Type-R forums now and an HKS Racing Air Intake may make it's way onto the car. 😬
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and surprisingly affordable on finance according to the targeted ads popping up in my Facebook feed!
Depends on what you call affordable!
Headline of £300 per month + £8,000 deposit- no thanks who wants to Chuck 8k away!
Getting the deposit down to a more reasonable level approx £2k - payments up to £538pm!
Have you ever been in a Lancia Delta
Unit next to us does sign writing, vinyl wraps etc. They had a Delta in, the full fat version. It was up for sale for £80k but the owner would throw in the spare set of wheels for that.
The interior wasn't out of the standard road version, there's a bazillion gauges and they're all cranked over so the needles are in your eyeline. It's basic, but not the same interior as your grandad Yaris sort of basic. More, bits of webbing where the door handles used to be basic.
