No =- they guy was cycling down the street when a cop runs up to him. He stops -and the cop beats him to the ground with his baton, keeps beating him while he lies on the ground and then kicks him for good measure - then releases the youth completely allowing him to get up on his own. If the boy had been any threat do you really think they would have released him and let him stand up on his own?
I would prefer to see some "discipline" being handed out to people who were looting, rather than small boys riding their bikes down an otherwise deserted street
agree with Woppit. Cough.
Bet those manly tooled up cops in their armoured protective gear are well pleased with themselves smacking down some kids on bikes down a quiet sideroad. They strangely have a much more standoffish attitude down on the burning High Street where the real aggro (and cameras) is.
Wonder what those kids did though?
Elfinsafety - Member
Ok then, so if you get pulled over for speeding, you think it would be ok for the police to drag you out of your car and give you a similar beating then?
If I had previously thrown a brick through a shop window, terrorised a little old lady, stolen some CK boxer shorts & waved a knife at staff in McDonalds then yes, I probably would expect to be dragged out of the car & given a beating.
watch it again you clown
NorthenStar - are you really a clown?!! Do you have one of those bow ties that whirls round?? How about a flower that squirts water. Please tell me you have a flower that squirts water??!!
Good on em i say, if they need any volunteers, i'll be at the front of the queue. Scumbags.
Northernstar - what happened earlier is irrelevant. Even if the kid claimed to have a knife to keep beating him on the ground is uneeded and anyway they just leave him alone after the beating.
Okay clearly your vision and sixth sense is better than mine 😕
So perhaps if you were in the polices shoes trying to control rioters and looters what would your approach be? How would you deal with the sort of people who are smashing up your local town and burning your property?
Perhaps a quick slap on the wrist followed by a stern warning of 'if you wouldn't mind perhaps not doing that again'?
Only joking, but seriously if you are so quick to pass judgement I would like to know what you propose is the alternative?
I am not 100% sure they were under 18, though as we couldn't see their ID. However perhaps if they had been arrested after their beatings then their ages could be verified"
In the meantime we can stop bleating on about child abuse then. I await the report that may or may not get filed when the police get round to it.
Why are people trying to give 'the children' excuses or trying to protect them?
OK from that particular video you cant work out the full scenario, but I'm going on the assumption that they had been involved in trouble, hence why the Police were obviously tracking them and asking them to stop, which by the way they actually increase their speed to get away, which is not logical if you havent done anything wrong..
Anyhow back to my point. These children stopped being children when they started lobbing bricks at Police and buildings and setting fire to stuff. Behave like animals and expect to take the consequences.
NorthenStar - are you really a clown?!! Do you have one of those bow ties that whirls round?? How about a flower that squirts water. Please tell me you have a flower that squirts water??!!
And big curly shoes.
Looks excessive to me to be honest.
Good on em i say, if they need any volunteers, i'll be at the front of the queue. Scumbags.
+1
gravitysucks - MemberWatched it a couple of times now. It doesn't look excessive to me. Firm and fast. They quickly and effectivly restrained the culprits.
I don't see them being restrained though.
OK, but I take it you agree that if you beat a child like that, you would be arrested for child abuse.
hence why the Police were obviously tracking them and asking them to stop, which by the way they actually increase their speed to get away,
the one that is beaten stops and does not resist in any way.
druidh - MemberTo make an arrest would involve taking police off the streets back to the station to do all the processing and paperwork. Where would you rather they were deployed?
When it reaches the point where police resources are being overwhelmed by the scale of the offences, you can't really expect them to be running back to the station with every minor offender. The alternative is to increase the police resources by supplementing them from elsewhere - the army for instance?
The threat of a "dry bumming" from the police would be a lot more effective than the threat of arrest or even a beating. This would eliminate the detritus from our streets... or perhaps increase the homosexual male population.
this vid is on Sky news soon, lets see what bullcrap Kay Burley says about it!
"Does the vid show what went on before that promoted the people to be chased by the Police? " No but it seems to suggest that there were two bodies of police a sweeping line seen at the very end that the youths are going away from and the group that cut them off.
"Is the zoom of the video good enough that you can see clearly whether or not the people are resisting arrest? "Yes very clear you see the boy put his bike down back off and get beaten and you see the other kicked on the ground
"Is the quality good enough to see whether the people being stopped had an weapons (knives etc.) that they may use against the police?" yes and of course not one of the officers thought any youth had a weapon you can tell this as despite having plenty of officers to do so not one youth is searched or arrested .
"Do we know what went on after the video stopped? No." correct but we can see that the youths are all allowed to go on their way suggesting that either they had done no wrong or the police were playing at Judge Dredd and thought that the beating was enough.
"So, can anyone make a judgement as to whether it is right or wrong on the evidence? " yes wrong! random beatings are not lawful and counter productive. Those lads now either think they can riot and get away with just a bit of stick or if they were not up to no good will now hate the police and may well feel entitled to express that hatred , if the police don't obey the law why should they?
the army for instance
No way, this is not a war - just civil disobedience. Deploying the army really would send out the wrong message. This is the UK not Libya!
richc - of course.
Though if they had just set a building alight, putting other's lives at risk or thrown a brick at a police officers head then, whilst still being abuse, I couldn't care less.
police can use shock & awe tactics. I belive those "cyclists" were in shock & awe!
Druidh -So you think it is acceptable to beat a youth who is not resisting because he [b]might have[/b] done something wrong.
I am astonished you think that is acceptable Druidh. warn em off fine - even give 'em a scare - but beat him with the baton while he is lying on the ground?
Fair enough, I am just a wooly liberal who thinks Child Abuse is wrong regardless of the excuse.
Everyone saying that it doesn't matter what has happened before, of course it does. The police will up the level of force as what has been used on them previously. If a criminal has a record of firearms offences they don't send round a lone policewomen to arrest him. Instead they would send overwhelming numbers around with firearms support and he would be wrestled to the ground and hand cuffed ASAP to prevent any officers or bystanders getting injured.
Why the hell should the police find out the hard way that the pursued want to come quielty now that the bodycount is in the polices favour.
I am just a wooly liberal who thinks Child Abuse is wrong regardless of the excuse.
There is no evidence they were younger than 18!
if it's not child abuse then it's assault.
He stops -and the cop beats him to the ground with his baton, keeps beating him while he lies on the ground and then kicks him for good measure - then releases the youth completely allowing him to get up on his own
So perhaps not THAT excessive beating force if the guy can get up an walk off on his own.
craig - that would be fair enough - however beating a youth with a club when he is not resisting in any way and a has stopped is never acceptable
'Av it...
The lads were riding round in a group with hoodies on, in an area that obviously was having trouble.
The line of riot police behind them, the chopper following them and the fact the police started running to the junction before they could see the 'hoodies' (almost like someone had told them they were there) - that all says to me that they weren't random kids on the street.
I agree with above - way too heavy-handed and that is exactly why people dislike the police.
People will always dislike the police. If everyone liked the police then there's something wrong.
Not seen what you are on about but is this the modern equivalent of a clip round the ear from a bobby that our parents were so nostalgic about?
At least with chavs we have a minority it's ok to hate.
I STARTED READING THIS AND BASICALLY CAN'T BE ****ED ANY MORE AFTER A FEW OF YOU LOT STARTED JUMPING IN AND BANGING ON ABOUT HOW THE POLICE WERE HEAVY HANDED, HOW THESE SCUMMERS, WHO WERE OUT ON THE STREET IN GANGS AFTER BEING WARNED NOT TO, WERE NOT DETAINED, HOW THEY WERE ONLY KIDS ETC ETC.
BASICALLY, WATCH THE ****ING VIDEO AGAIN - YOU SIMPLY CAN ONLY DISCERN FROM IT THAT SOME T**TS GOT A BEATING. AT THE END OF THE VIDEO TWO OF THEM ARE STILL BEING DETAINED BEHIND THE FENCE. YOU SIMPLY CAN NOT TELL THE AGE OF THESE FERAL SCUMBAGS, AND YOU DO NOT HAVE THE SAME INTELLIGENCE THAT THE POLICE HAVE HAD LEADING UP TO WHAT YOU SAW. HOWEVER IT DOESN'T STOP A LOAD OF CONCLUSIONS BEING DRAWN.
THROWING EVIDENCE OVER THE FENCE? MORE LIKELY TO BE A BRICK, NO?!
HAVE YOU SEEN ANY OF THE VIDEOS ON YOUTUBE OR HEARD ANY OF THE RIOTERS GIVING INTERVIEWS BASICALLY SAYING THEY DON'T GIVE A S**T?
WE NEED TO BE BACKING THE POLICE TO DO WHAT THEY HAVE GOT TO DO, NOT GETTING ALL HUMAN RIGHTIST B*LL*CKS ON THEM.
Everyone saying that it doesn't matter what has happened before, of course it does.
Here here! No one knows what they have been up to and no-one can tell from the video. Perhaps they have just badly assaulted an old lady? What would everyone's reaction be then I wonder?
That's the whole point - we just can't tell what has gone on from the video!
The only problem I saw was not giving them a proper shoeing, little scrote managed to get up too easily
There is no evidence they were younger than 18!
Knee jerks need no evidence.
What - run up behind them wearing a scary mask and shout boo! ??TandemJeremy - MemberI am astonished you think that is acceptable Druidh. warn em off fine - even give 'em a scare -
People will always dislike the police. If everyone liked the police then there's something wrong.
Normally you find that the people who hate the Police are those people who have something to hide or are up to no good!
TJ - still not heard your proposed alternative solution to the police handling of this sort of situation. Interested to hear that's all 😀
Druidh - so you think it is acceptable to beat someone who is not resisting?
[img] 
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jerks need no evidence
FTFY
Do think this thread will get over 30 pages of outrage and total bollocks from the same old gobshites?
Northern star - act within the law and their training. Police can and do use a lot of force legitimately. Shame the use a lot of force illegally there.
cops get a lot of training on use of force and I have seen it used many times.
I dunno mt. But it is STW at it's finest 😀
Hang on I'm outta breath reading that....
Not seen what you are on about but is this the modern equivalent of a clip round the ear from a bobby
Sort of, just as a kid you'd be slapped in the face or throttled until you understood your wrong doings instead. This is more on a par with getting touched up whilst drunk, or being stupid enough to be in the wrong place. If anyones old enough to remember being swept up, locked up and in court the next day just for being in the wrong place at the wrong time.
And they used to let your tyres down so you'd have to walk home, those lot up there are soft I tell you.
TandemJeremy - Member
Druidh - so you think it is acceptable to beat someone who is not resisting?
POSTED 45 SECONDS AGO # REPORT-POST
For all we know it wasnt the first intercept, they could gave been chasing them for half the night - i love your view of always seeing the positive in everyone.
hypothetical scenario for the 'oh its abuse' brigade.
you witness a teenager mugging a child for his bike, who then cycles towards you on his way off with the bike. I assume you would all ask him politely to stop and please would he mind handing the bike back?
I wouldn't, I would drop the shoulder as he came past me and knock the thieving scumbag off the bike. technically you would say thats abuse, I would say they lose their human rights whilst transgressing the law.
the reason all these pikey scum can loot for days on end is because the police cannot touch them, its totally ludicrous.
so you think it is acceptable to beat someone who is not resisting?
How do you know the man that got of the bike didn't shout "come on then you pig scum, I've got a knife"?
peaches be a dear and watch the video again you see the lad who goes behind the fence walk off free and the officer who shoved him out of sight walk back in to sight without a prisoner.
M6TTF - use your eyes
camerone - that would be reasonable and proportionate. Hitting him with a weapon while he lays on the ground would not.
Have you ever been hit with a full blooded blow from a baton? or a full blooded kick from a steel capped boot? Both of these actions have the very real potential to be life-threatening (internal bleeding etc) and really are an excessive use of force, surely everyone would agree on that? I'm all for these scrotes getting a 'clip around the ear' and a bit of old-school corporal punishment, but what those cops are dishing out there is not appropriate surely?
Do think this thread will get over 30 pages of outrage and total bollocks from the same old gobshites?
I hope so. it keeps me entertained.
Elfinsafety, I'm not sure I understand any of your posts beyond the fact that you like being deliberately contrary and some sort of right on crusader, but is it not reasonable to assume that youths on bikes late last night in Manchester city centre were deserving of punitive action from the police simply for being there?
Also, why the affected colloquialisms in all of your posts? It's a bit like reading the posts of a character created by a right wing lunatic who wants to denigrate anyone vaguely to the left of Norman Tebbit.
TJ - I like your posts and the clear moral stand you often take, but in this case you sound like an apologist. On the other hand, given that probably the majority of the population including me now wants summary justice exercising on people like these without bothering with the niceties of any human rights considerations, I'm glad you continue to speak up as a counterbalance.
just been told a gun shop & b&q has been turned over in Bolton - not sure how true though!
the solution is that they do their job, arrest, and seek conviction!
psycle - you will never convince the bloodlust / wannabe / keyboard warriors I guess. They get a hard on at the idea of the cops giving someone a good kicking.
I knew there was a thick reactionary element on STW - I hadn't realised just how unpleasant.
Hypothetical dream scenario - If someone was stealing and cycling off on my bike, I'd expect a bunch of tooled up riot police to come charging from nowhere and give 'em the smackdown! 🙂
you witness a teenager mugging a child for his bike, who then cycles towards you on his way off with the bike. I assume you would all ask him politely to stop and please would he mind handing the bike back?I wouldn't, I would drop the shoulder as he came past me and knock the thieving scumbag off the bike. technically you would say thats abuse, I would say they lose their human rights whilst transgressing the law.
And I'd do the same (I hope), but I wouldn't then put a couple of swift kicks into the ****er... unless he attacked me, in which case it'd be on. I'd just attempt to restrain him (arm behind the back, that sort of thing), I wouldn't then beat him...
psychle - Do you not think throwing a brick at some ones head could kill them, or setting fire to a building without checking no ones inside it?
But thats ok is it?
Getting upto no good, police catch up with you & give you a hiding... been happening since time began, made me laugh tbh!
Do think this thread will get over 30 pages of outrage and total bollocks from the same old gobshites?
Defo, this is far more serious than the rioting ever was, it totally neutrals it all out. 😆
Bollocks I am agree with TJ.
I have no problem with criminals being restrained and arrested, I do like most sane people have an issue with summary justice, punishment and release on citizens handed out by the Police.
If those kids/adults were upto to something then surely the due process is to at least arrest them?
M6TTF - use your eyes
camerone - that would be reasonable and proportionate. Hitting him with a weapon while he lays on the ground would not.
What's that supposed to mean? There's not hours of footage - how can you possibly know what went on prior to that minute of footage
Shame the use a lot of force illegally there
Oh didn't realise you were a judge. Case dismissed!
Kevevs - it certainly been a classic week for all spectrums of view. I mean how the hell does anyone troll this week?
Has anyone suggested that those bike the kids/adults/people of uncertain age were on had been stolen from Harry Halls? Anyway it's raining now so it should all soon be over unless a well stocked umbrella shop has been done over.
psychle - Do you not think throwing a brick at some ones head could kill them, or setting fire to a building without checking no ones inside it?But thats ok is it?
No, it's not, and I'm not saying it is. All I'm saying, purely based on the video posted (and with no care as to what happened prior), is that what those policefolk are doing is wrong and they need to be held accountable for it... it's excessive force, pure and simple...
sure, tackle 'em off their bikes, slam them to the ground and restrain them (trust me, that's going to hurt plenty! enough to 'teach them a lesson') but there's fug all need for the baton strikes and kicking...
Without knowing exactly what the Police knew about those lads, you lot really are talking about a load of waffle.
Even if we did know... we have a legal system in place to deal with crime... and I'm guessing that if those guys were serious perpetrators they'd have been arrested.
Police use force to protect the public - shocking! 😯
Have you ever been hit with a full blooded blow from a baton? or a full blooded kick from a steel capped boot?
Yes, and that's not what's happening there. That 'kick' is a tap, and the harsh blows look like there to the back of the legs. Akin to dusting a carpet and passing a ball to a child.
I can't tell you what it's like to be knocked out cold with a baton, it was a rounders bat. Not sure what boots they had on. Victim of mistaken identity. Edgware Road tube station 1974.
crankboy - Member
peaches be a dear and watch the video again you see the lad who goes behind the fence walk off free and the officer who shoved him out of sight walk back in to sight without a prisoner.
no, you might want to see that, but there is a lot of panning out of shot from the camera. you see TWO scumbags pushed against the fence on the right and a lot of riot police moving about along with a few non-police movements, all of which appear as darkened bodies due to the light. so you can NOT say that they have been beaten and left to walk off freely because you simply can not see the whole picture and identify exactly who is who. plus, do you actually think that someone who has just received a 'proper beating' would walk off so calmly and with no limping or anything.
it's all wild speculation. none of you know exactly what's gone on.
richc - Member
If those kids/adults were upto to something then surely the due process is to at least arrest them?
druidh - MemberTo make an arrest would involve taking police off the streets back to the station to do all the processing and paperwork. Where would you rather they were deployed?
Have you ever been hit with a full blooded blow from a baton? or a full blooded kick from a steel capped boot? Both of these actions have the very real potential to be life-threatening (internal bleeding etc) and really are an excessive use of force, surely everyone would agree on that?
you are assuming the police aren't trained in where to hit someone that causes maximum amount of pain without causing lasting damage!
Police use force to protect the public - shocking!
Precisely!
No need to arrest, no need for anything else - the police used the the force they felt was necessary to [b]maintain public order[/b]
Zulu-Eleven - MemberNo need to arrest, no need for anything else - the police used the the force they felt was necessary to maintain public order
Come on, really? Where do you see public order being maintained there? No credibility at all.
it's all wild speculation. none of you know exactly what's gone on.
Sense at last.
So after *just* 4 days of rioting, we have managed to degrade to summary 'justice' distributed by the Police with our having to bother with courts or evidence, throwing away centuries of legal practice to ensure we protect the belief 'innocent until proven guilty'
You hoping for another 4 days of rioting, so you will be able to lynch a hoodie for looking down the street you live on?
They were [b]all over the road [/b]and everything Z-11!
MRanger156 - MemberPolice use force to protect the public - shocking
The member of the public they were protecting was where exactly? Protecting them from what exactly?
remember the youth is released after his beating - he is not even restrained on the ground so the cops knew he was no threat. They simply beat him and then leave him to get up on his own.
I knew there was a thick reactionary element on STW - I hadn't realised just how unpleasant.
You mean an element on STW that thinks criminals should not get away with it? An element that believes that the police should be allowed to control and punish troublemakers and the antisocial behaviour that blight the lives and freedom of law abiding citizens? An element that perhaps has an open enough mind to not jump to conclusions about what has gone on in a video where they can only see a small part of the whole story?
Gosh how unpleasant!
Have you ever been hit with a full blooded blow from a baton? or a full blooded kick from a steel capped boot? Both of these actions have the very real potential to be life-threatening (internal bleeding etc) and really are an excessive use of force, surely everyone would agree on that? I'm all for these scrotes getting a 'clip around the ear' and a bit of old-school corporal punishment, but what those cops are dishing out there is not appropriate surely?
psycle - you will never convince the bloodlust / wannabe / keyboard warriors I guess. They get a hard on at the idea of the cops giving someone a good kicking.I knew there was a thick reactionary element on STW - I hadn't realised just how unpleasant.
I have no blood lust / wannabe / keyboard warrior but I have been on the receiving end of more minor civil unrest and even behind a full shield it isn't pleasant. Bricks still hurt, visors smash along with the face behind it and flames are still hot, trying to keep a professional attitude is hard. These police officers may not have had rest for the last 24 hours, seen their mates injured and even had their holidays cancelled just because some scrotes think it their right to go and take what they want. They are not taking on the authorities like in the G9 riots they are going committing mass theft and vandalism.
It's not a perfect world and your black and white views are an ideal that excludes human emotion on both sides.
Waht criminal? Innocent until proven guilty? Or do you mean the criminal in the uniform?
You think the police should be allowed to punish people do you? Death squads perhpas?
You can clearly see unreasonable and illegal force being used there. No doubt possible in any rational mind.
The member of the public they were protecting was where exactly? Protecting them from what exactly?
Dunno think there's been some trouble since Sturday night, gangs of kids calling each other up to go a lootin. that might be it.
richc - Member
So after *just* 4 days of rioting, we have managed to degrade to summary 'justice' distributed by the Police with our having to bother with courts or evidence, throwing away centuries of legal practice to ensure we protect the belief 'innocent until proven guilty'You hoping for another 4 days of rioting, so you will be able to lynch a hoodie for looking down the street you live on?
Well said. Some of the comments are unbelievable.
You can only comment on what happens in the video, everything else 'they shouldn't be there' etc is speculation. From that video it's completely OTT.
