[Closed] Lightweight Down Jacket

good question, following.

What's she using it for ?

It's really designed as a warm layer for mid-high activity in freezing conditions. But with a low pack size making it suitable for an emergency layer in a back pack.

If she's standing round in it watching the kids play footie then it and nothing of its style will work.

Mainly used when out walking, occasionally around the Peaks (touristy walking routes etc) but usually just local countryside. However, I'm sure there will be some of the standing around at the park etc. Didn't know if it was worth going for a more 'full down' jacket?

She should just learn how to layer up like molgrips 😛

[url= http://www.gooutdoors.co.uk/mountain-equipment-womens-arete-hooded-jacket-p392357 ]http://www.gooutdoors.co.uk/mountain-equipment-womens-arete-hooded-jacket-p392357[/url]

You might get lucky and find one of these in a store close to you.

Montane stuff is very impressive, I’m off to the factory shop on Friday for some bargains.

I bought a berghaus ramche hyperdown jacket at the weekend from berghaus outlet store at gretna. Very light and very warm. Packs into a tint wee bag.

Get her a Decathlon/ Quechua hooded down jacket. They're so cheap and ace. The hood makes loads of difference and it's definitely pretty snuggly in cold weather.

As well as one of them, I also have an Arcteryx down jacket which is lighter, has a better construction and packs down a lot smaller. It was about 8 times the price though, and isn't really any warmer. If your wife will use it just for mooching around and doesn't need packability then I wouldn't bother.

This may not constitute sensible Christmas present buying advice if your wife will turn her nose up at Decathlon stuff.

P.S. That Mountain Equipment offer is a good deal if you can get it...

The thermoball jacket will be similarly warm to the microlight, maybe slightly less but not a huge amount in it

They're both quite light fills, just get something thicker if she wants more warmth. Will be heavier and bulkier though. If it's for general outdoor use I find synthetic much more useful

Not down, Primaloft. Just got Finisterre Nimbus which is lovely and warm for walking the dog. Fleecy pockets as well!

I'm sure it's been done to death on here (and I feel like it has come up multiple times recently) but I would go for synthetic over lightweight down for a variety of reasons.

Different brands have distinctly different cuts too so the best technical all round jacket may not fit the best.

[url= http://responsibledown.org/ ]Think about the geese keeping you warm[/url]

Cheap down is less likely to have been produced ethically. Even expensive certified down may have been produced alongside down that isn't.

Primaloft type insulation is superb nowadays and the justification for down, and cheap down especially, is hard to make. I have had down jackets in the past(and still own them) but I haven't worn one since 2008, they are all outperformed by modern artificial alternatives. Yes there are situations where down is better but it won't be around the park.

Yes there are situations where down is better but it won't be around the park.

Agreed. But anywhere that packability is key the down still pisses all over down in a warmth for cu cm capacity.

Unlikely to be an issue for the op.

Realistically a buffalo would probably be the best option for the above how ever they are not even close to fashionable as practical as they are. My wife steals mine when we are away says it's great for staying warm-up when I suggest she buys one she exclaims they are ugly and busts another disposable item from the Rab catalogue

[url= https://www.phdesigns.co.uk/sales-and-special-offers ]PHD Winter Sale[/url] started this week. Minumus Jacket/Pullover is superb.

Mrs Dubs has the Rab Microlight from last year.

Normally she is colder that Jean Claude Van-Damme drinking a Coors Light but has few (if any) complaints with the jacket.

She wears it standing around playgrounds shouting at children rather than any form of physical activity if that's any guide.

My wife has lived in this on cold days for the last year: https://www.alpkit.com/products/filoment-hoody-womens

It uses ethically produced hydrophobic down - she's worn it without a waterproof in wet weather and even when it's got so wet that it's started leaking at the seams the down doesn't collapse (and thus stays warm). Very impressive. I want one myself but don't want to look like we're in his and hers outfits! 😉

Mostly used for standing around in playgrounds or riding the scooter, so it must be warm!

Realistically a buffalo would probably be the best option for the above how ever they are not even close to fashionable as practical as they are. My wife steals mine when we are away says it's great for staying warm-up when I suggest she buys one she exclaims they are ugly and busts another disposable item from the Rab catalogue

Rab Alpha Direct - kind of like Buffalo but not as warm or heavy and better cut.

In general, down-type synthetic and down jackets are hopeless for active use if there's anything more than minimal exertion involved. Think two layers of not very breathable windproof fabric either side of a wodge of not very good at wicking insulation. Even stuff like PrimaLoft Active, which is supposedly designed for use on the move, is actually pretty bad. Polartec Alpha, which has more in common with Buffalo and/or shelled fleece is an honourable exception to the rule.

If it's just for standing about it, then the thicker it is, the warmer it'll be. Insulation is just trapped warm air, more trapped warm air works better than less trapped warm air. If it's likely to get damp, go synthetic or hydrophobic down.

PHD Winter Sale started this week. Minumus Jacket/Pullover is superb.

Noooooooo!!!!

Hide my credit card now!

Biggest issue with down filled garments is properly maintaining them, especially the stuff with treatments to down and materials. I used to wash mine in the bath with specialist down cleaner, then down to the launderette for an age drying on low. Mostly for that reason, I haven't used a down jacket in 10 years for anything other than winter camping / camping barn type stuff, when it's proper cold and you're sitting around. If it has to be down, I would stay away from light colours, in fact only buy black IMO, then you can get away with collars and cuffs for a bit longer.

I would get her a better Primaloft jacket TBH, one with a hood will give her extra warmth

Iv'e got a Rab Microlight but I wouldn't have another. Warm enough but the Pertex shell is made of a tissue paper derivative, just has to look at something remotely pointy & it rips, I've had it repaired 4 times & now another one's appeared. I've got more feathers hanging out than a moulting duck.

Realistically a buffalo would probably be the best option for the above how ever they are not even close to fashionable as practical as they are. My wife steals mine when we are away says it's great for staying warm-up when

So much this. Although mine is the montane equivalent. I think its mine but i don't think i've worn it in anger 😆

The problem with many ultralight down jackets is that the wind just whistles through them - a hybrid construction with a combination of synthetic and down works well - I have a Marmot jacket that is a combination of Polartec Alpha and down that I've worn comfortably into the -20s. For general casual use where weight / pack size is less of an issue then I'd go synthetic, particularly as it stands up to rain / moisture better.

For a lighter but still very warm construction, I'd put my vote for the Alpkit as well. It is significantly warmer than any synthetic I've ever handled or worn.
Mine is great for both bumming around and also has doubled as a superb evening jacket and packable emergency layer on a week of winter hut to hut in the Alps.
At 600 fill or whatever it is, it's lighter and less warm than a full winter down of say 750 fill. I have a Howies example of the heavier style of jacket and only use it when it's well below zero. The Alpkit is great for everything else.
And at least the down is from an ethical source.

dovebiker - Member
The problem with many ultralight down jackets is that the wind just whistles through them

That's not strictly true, the problem is not the low weight it is the construction method used. The stitch-through type coats have cool spots along the stitching but if it is well made this can be minimised considerably. I've never noticed this on my PHD Minimus winter vest.

I've got a Black Diamond Down/Primaloft hybrid jacket (amongst others), performs wet almost as good as dry...

[url= https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5645/31379024276_d52b9867e7.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5645/31379024276_d52b9867e7.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/PNRGFW ]Primaloft Gold[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/brf/ ]Ben Freeman[/url], on Flickr

[img] [/img]

[quote=jimjam ]I'm sure it's been done to death on here (and I feel like it has come up multiple times recently) but I would go for synthetic over lightweight down for a variety of reasons.

Quite the opposite for me. I have both a down jacket, and a synthetic of similar pack size and weight - the down jacket is far, far warmer. Sure there's the issue of down getting damp, but mine has a water resistant outer and I've worn it in drizzle without problems. Would only choose the synthetic in conditions where I'm definitely likely to get it wet. Admittedly it's a high end down jacket more than twice the price of the synthetic (both high end jackets from the same company - though they do also do clothing suitable for high altitude, so not the top of the range down).

Around the park is certainly one of the situations where I'd choose the down - for that and walking (which is what the OP says his wife will be doing) down is fine, and there's no obvious reason for a Buffalo or similar. To be honest for me in this country, around the park is almost the only time I would use it - it is too warm for active use unless it's really cold out (great for ski touring, or up high in the Alps at night though).

aracer - Member

jimjam » I'm sure it's been done to death on here (and I feel like it has come up multiple times recently) but I would go for synthetic over lightweight down for a variety of reasons.

Quite the opposite for me. I have both a down jacket, and a synthetic of similar pack size and weight - the down jacket is far, far warmer. Sure there's the issue of down getting damp, but mine has a water resistant outer and I've worn it in drizzle without problems. Would only choose the synthetic in conditions where I'm definitely likely to get it wet. Admittedly it's a high end down jacket more than twice the price of the synthetic (both high end jackets from the same company - though they do also do clothing suitable for high altitude, so not the top of the range down).

Well I'm in exactly the same situation as I've got an ME lightline and 3 primaloft jackets and a primaloft gilet and tbh I shouldn't have bought the Lightline as I never use it. It loses something every time it gets soaked and tbh it's too much most of the time. It's nice to have, just so I know I'll have something to wear on extremely crisp cold days that I might find myself standing around, but beyond that...

Personal preference and all that.

https://www.jottnar.com/uk/womens/down-insulation/fenrir
I’ve got the men’s version, and it’s a superb lightweight jacket, I’ve even worn it in fairly persistent rain for some miles, and only had a small amount of ingress at the shoulder seam.
I also have the Decathlon jacket, and the main issue is it leaks down for a pass-time! If you’re wearing a fleece underneath it gets covered with white bits of feather.
Cheap, though.

I happen to have both of these.

The Rab is significantly warmer than the thermoball (thats actually a lot thinner and lighter).

I am however looking at a bigger Rab to see me through the winter months as it's still fairly lightweight

+1 for the cheap decathlon quechua down. I have the lightweight one and it's definitely one of the purchases of the year.

Was in decathlon for the first time ever and tried on the lightweight down one. Was really impressed. Wasn't allowed to buy it though.

I've got a Montane prism, I look forward to it getting cold so I can wear it. Next time jacket will likely be another montane... They're just really well made and well thought out. Like the look of the new primaloft stuff in the icarus

PHD. Look no further.

Edit. Seen it's already been mentioned above. Still. PHD, look no further

I just bought a rab microlight alpine. It's nice, but it's not as warm as the Patagonia down sweater it replaced. I regret not buying another now.

Biggest issue with down filled garments is properly maintaining them, especially the stuff with treatments to down and materials

The hydrophobic down jackets are actually easier to care for - they dry easily in a normal tumble dryer without clumping issues. Big step forwards!

wrecker - Member
I just bought a rab microlight alpine. It's nice, but it's not as warm as the Patagonia down sweater it replaced. I regret not buying another now.

I've got one that is rarely used, size L, dark green.
Open to sensible offers
😉

Like the look of the new primaloft stuff in the icarus

Any idea where the new Primaloft Thermoplume sits compared to the Silver/Gold insulation? The press bumph is saying the best ever etc etc etc but appears to sit in the Black range which is below Silver/Gold.

And what might a "sensible" offer be mr el?
Is it the new army type green?

My SO bought something [url= https://www.thenorthface.co.uk/shop/en-gb/tnf-gb/cagoule-gore-tex-parka-2zx2?variationId=JK3 ]just like this[/url] a few years ago. It comes out in late September and goes back in the cupboard in about late June/early July. Apparently warm enough for northern winters including walks in the rainy, chilly peaks and trips down south to the New Forest and Hayling island

Hey guys and gals, many thanks for all the tips and opinions. Mrs Strawb likes the Patagonia Down Hooded Sweater so think gunna go for that one, assuming the 800 down would be warmer than her current thermoball, any real world knowledge of this particular jacket would be appreciated before I hit 'buy'?

See my post, I love/d mine.

Cheers 'wrecker', I've ordered her the Patagonia so we'll see how she gets on. Thanks to all for the input.

Patagonia stuff is normally excellent quality.

Any idea where the new Primaloft Thermoplume sits compared to the Silver/Gold insulation? The press bumph is saying the best ever etc etc etc but appears to sit in the Black range which is below Silver/Gold.

You can't look at the insulation value of the filling itself in isolation. Lots depends on construction as well - the downside of lightweight down is that mostly the construction is stitch through seams, so every line of stitches you can see reduces insulation, because there's no fill trapped there, and decreases windproofing because stitch holes let wind through.

It's why microbaffled down jackets are less warm than ones using fewer down compartments of a similar spec and explains why stuff like the MHW Ghost Whisperer and the Rab Micro aren't particularly warm. And then there's the fabric, lighter fabrics allow more loft and more warmth. And down density, if it compresses too easily it loses effectiveness etc.

Anyway, all of which is a round-about way of getting to the point that conventional synthetic fills score some plus points by not needing to use down-type baffled compartments, whereas down-like stuff like Thermoplume acts like down and needs more stitching.

TNF Thermoball is particularly bad because as per the name, the balls of insulation roll around, so it needs loads of quilted stitching to hold it in place, so while the fill may be equivalent to reasonable down, the actual garment has so many stitches, that efficiency is significantly reduced. Oh, and the Patagonia Nanopuff kit is effectively 'inside out' for fashion reasons - the brick quilting on the outside actually loses heat...

None of which matters much if you just want a warm-ish jacket, but is a bit more significant if you're on a quest to find something that'll work really well relative to its weight and bulk for mountain use. Sorry, blah, I'll shut up now.

so every line of stitches you can see reduces insulation, because there's no fill trapped there, and decreases windproofing because stitch holes let wind through.

Patagonia's [url= http://eu.patagonia.com/gb/en/product/mens-grade-vii-down-parka/84845.html?dwvar_84845_color=PBH&cgid=collections-high-alpine-kit#tile-2=&start=1&sz=24 ]top end down[/url] uses welded seams, so the outer isn't perforated at all.

The Crux Halo jacket is really nice - Also the Rab Zero G - Lots of primaloft talk - if synthetic is what your after look for Climashield Apex .

I think my down sweater is stitched. Maybe it's not regarded as top end. As a lightweight jacket, it does get little nicks from normal use and the cut is very "athletic". So comfy and wearable for half the year for a hot blood like me. Never been cold in it, it's warmer than the tan I replaced it with.

The [url= https://www.crux.uk.com/product/pyro-jacket ]Crux Pyro[/url] is on reduced at [url= http://www.outside.co.uk/shop/Pyro+Down+Jacket?utm_source=google&utm_medium=shopping&utm_campaign=shopping&gclid=CjwKCAiAoqXQBRA8EiwAIIOWshOr4b9WKcCi4UX5nw5ZwaU69pp93H-csX2dQ0iwwJ5e4LPKDNR-SBoCTgYQAvD_BwE ]Outside, Hathersage for £125 [/url]
Bargain half price jacket.

I've fancied a big down (or even synthetic) jacket for years, but I can never come up with a legitimate use case for them that justifies the expense. The best "standing/sitting around" coat I've ever owned is an inexpensive wool-mix jobbie with a big jumper underneath. Remarkably good in the rain too, and drys quickly. I've got a cheap hoodie on right now with loads of toasty, fleecy insulation. Neither are good if I want to pack them away in a rucksack, but that's not a need for a "standing around" jacket.

The best jacket I've ever had for more active pursuits is Paramo, adding/removing layers underneath as required.

I still want a down jacket, but can't remember the last time I needed a big and warm jacket that needed to pack up small. Maybe when my mountaineering career begins, I might need one 😉

I've fancied a big down (or even synthetic) jacket for years, but I can never come up with a legitimate use case for them that justifies the expense.

We do a fair bit of hill walking, so being able to pack up a warm layer into a small space is a key requirement. I also wear them cycling to work in winter...

I think my down sweater is stitched. Maybe it's not regarded as top end.

It's only their High Altitude range at the moment (I think).

We do a fair bit of hill walking, so being able to pack up a warm layer into a small space is a key requirement.

All my hill walking is with our young kids, and over quite short distances. My rucksack is already full of their coats! Maybe when they're older and we're venturing a bit further, I might "need" a down jacket. Unfortunately so might the 3 kids! 😆

Via a mate on Facebook:

[i]Winter, as they say, is coming. Some of you might be looking for a nice warm coat, perhaps one of the down puffy jackets. If you're looking at things like Patagonia, you're in for around £200 or so. However, you can get nice ones at Uniqlo for around £60.
However, if you buy direct from Aliexpress, you can get the same jacket as the Uniqlo one (it even has a copy of the labels using different letters) for £23, shipped. It takes 2-3 weeks to arrive and the sizing is in asian sizes so read the reviews where people list their body stats and which size fits them.
I took a punt on one as I was looking for a light, warm jacket for outdoor use. I'm 5'10, 75kg and 38" chest. The large fits me nicely, whereas I'm usually a medium, and is very good quality.
The also do cheaper ones without hoods or a gilet version for even less, along with women's specific versions too.[/i]

https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/HOT-2016-Winter-men-90-White-Duck-Down-Jacket-men-s-Hooded-Ultra-Light-Down-Jackets/808761_32610369668.html

Also, same friend goes on to say:

[i]The issue with down jackets is traceability and ethics of sourcing the down. Patagonia lead the way on this. I'm guessing that Uniqlo are good too and that these, being apparently the same jackets and probably made in the same factory by the same people, are just as good. Not all cheap jackets are, if that makes a difference to people. Shop according to your ethics.[/i]

Useful link that, Cougar, I’ve got a couple of Uniqlo jackets, a hooded one and one without, and a gilet, and that price is outstanding!

probably made in the same factory by the same people

Being made in the same factory means nothing. The same factory and same people makes foods for high and low end supermarkets. For one set of meals they use actual quality cheese. For the other they use ez-cheeze. Manufacturer to spec. Factory means nothing.

I'm guessing that Uniqlo are good too and that these, being apparently the same jackets

I've got a Patagonia hooded down jacket and absolutely love it.

This popped up on my Flipboard feed today, I thought it might help some looking for a new jacket. Jöttnar get a good review for their new Expedition jacket, but there are some very interesting items listed.

Thanks to all the helpful comments, Mrs Strawb is very happy with her new Patagonia Hooded Down Sweater/Jacket, really warm apparently, so I'm happily in the good books. Cheers

I'm guessing that Uniqlo are good too

Uniqlo won't provide any information regarding their down sourcing, and since the jackets are made in China I suspect it's not ethically sourced.