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Anyone been? Is it safe? The FCO page on Nigeria is long but doesn't seem to list Lagos as a problem area.
You'll be fine, just make sure work/supplier/customer organise you a car and stay at recognised hotels etc.
Although I remember my driver saying to me:
Driver - Do you need company tonight?
Me - No thank you
Driver - She's safe and clean
Me - No, really, no
Driver - But she's really nice
Me - I'm sure, but no thank you
Driver - You'd really like her
Me - I'm sure, but no thank you
I found out later that it was his sister...
Safe but a bit intimidating....
Try and get a hotel pick up at the airport.
When the guards at the airport, with AK-47s, walk up to you and say 'Have you got anything for me?' just say 'no'.
NB Just about everyone at the airport will try and rip you off.
And remember your Yellow fever certificate or carry some cash (dollars), you can pay your way out of almost any situation and in many cases, that's the only way out....
Immigration at the airport is hilarious, it consists of a number of desks in a row right next to each other and you slowly work your way from one to the other - very slow, hopelessly inefficient and prone to mixing up passports with other people.
The lounges vary from 'very nice' to 'something out of the young ones', I'll dig out some photos....
Everyone demands money from you....
Of all the mobile networks, MTN is the worst - drops calls all the time. We helped them build it and I've never met such a useless bunch of halfwits in my life (although to be fair, they have paid a good chunk of my mortgage over the last 20 years).
The road from the Airport to Lagos varies in busyness from quite quiet to total gridlock depending on time of day, so the airport run varies from 40mins to several hours....
Hotels are all very expensive ($500 / night) and vary a lot in quality - at one I could either have working air conditioning or working water, but never both..
The Wheatbaker was the best one I found, not far from our office: https://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/Hotel_Review-g304026-d1986109-Reviews-The_Wheatbaker-Lagos_Lagos_State.html
I was prepared for the worst on a visit in March 2020 and despite it turning into a bit of an ordeal with the start of the pandemic and lockdown, ive known worse. I got met by the driver just before arrivals, with a pre-arranged password, who then fast tracked me through immigration, baggage collection etc and straight to a driver also with a pre-arranged password.
Had a few nights out in decent restaurants, Raddison hotel was fine, I would say just keep a low profile and watch what's going on around you.
Driver – Do you need company tonight?
Can't see the problem there, it's not nice watching TV on your own when traveling.
My mate used to work for an oil company that insisted they had a guard/fixer. He never looked forward to going there.
My mate used to work for an oil company that insisted they had a guard/fixer
Different region - the oil region is really dangerous for Westerners - you have a £50k price on your head as ransom to the oil company - security for expats is really hot.
When I first started working in Nigeria, 20 years ago, MTN would meet us at the airport with a minibus and they had a pickup following it with a 50mm machine gun mounted on the roof - like something out of Black Hawk Down. And that was for a 'safe' state....
My brother used to work in the oil industry out there Port Harcourt the stories were not pleasant!
This was the loo in the BA Business Lounge in Lagos Airport in 2010 - they have since modernised a bit...
[url= https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52544980041_d9d60da9f8_c.jp g" target="_blank">https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52544980041_d9d60da9f8_c.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/2o4dKVK ]BA Business lounge Lagos, Nigeria[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/brf/ ]Ben Freeman[/url], on Flickr
This is perfectly normal for Nigeria, I was quite relieved it was in such good nick. What did annoy me was the attendant wanting a tip for keeping it in such good nick...
I declined.
Port Harcourt is a bit more stimulating than Lagos. Last time we drove back to the airport on the wrong side of the motorway driving into oncoming traffic, as our side was blocked. Luckily there was a jeep full of armed MOPOL in front of us.
Used to travel to Nigeria (Lagos, Port Harcourt and Warri) a lot back in early 2000's. Very interesting place and somewhere you see how cheap life can be. I must have been 10-15 times usually ok except for the relentless attempted scams. Two best tips I learnt was take food you can make in your room with boiling water incase of craps or full on general strikes, the other tip, take a door wedge and put it under your door when you go to bed. It might have changed by now but doubt it.
It's a shithole.
All the toilets looked like they had come out of Trainspotting
I've not been but I would expect your company to have pre arranged transport and appropriately secure hotel.
I would expect a decent uplift in day rate, unless your rate is already massive and travel to places like Nigeria is expected.
not been for 8 years but when i was down there a number of times for oil related things ( a number of oil Cos have/had their head offices in Lagos - and I was also down in PH . Refused to go to swamp barges in warri for any more than a day trip though. anywhere that needs Gatling runs on turrets to protect it isn't somewhere I want to be sleeping .
port harcourt as a westerner - you might get kidnapped sure -and at least there might be a chance of the cash saving you.
in lagos - you were more likely to be killed on the spot and robbed for the stuff you had on you - western or not.
I wouldnt go back in a rush..... to either.
I would expect a decent uplift in day rate, unless your rate is already massive and travel to places like Nigeria is expected.
this and also as above you really want them to be arranging the security and digs through their agents - you dont have a hope in hell of knowing what your booking
Well that all sounds perfect for Moly the serial worrier... 🤣
It is a shit hole and every day there you probably lose a few hours of your life due to PM10 air pollution as everywhere has diesel generators spewing crap out.
However, Lagos isn't that bad, been there many times over the last 20 years, we had an office there with several expats in an apartment and only know of one gun point robbery (another company) they just took cash and laptops on the road to the airport. Our SA office (J'burg) had more incidents...
Biggest risk in Lagos is probably Malaria - which is rampant. All our staff in the office got it at least once. As an occasional visitor, I managed to avoid it. NB They are much better at treating it out there than back here - as they deal with it every day. Western hospitals in Lagos are very good (as they are private).
Is Mols there to pick up that inheritance money from his new friend Prince Kashhuvus. 😆
All the toilets looked like they had come out of Trainspotting
Even in the office people had to keep their own roll of toilet paper under lock and key. However, it was better than the office in India I visited that looked like it had been shelled by Russian artillery and the toilets were a lake of unspecified liquid.
Still, paid the mortgage!!
I travelled there quite a lot around 2011- 2013, and know people who lived there. I didn't think it was too bad, and I'd rather go there than Moscow as an example. It's a given your company books a car, and a decent hotel - we almost always used the Radisson as well.
Traffic is terrible , and getting to/from the airport can take mind bending amounts of time, usually in a car with armed police support.
Never needed to bribe anyone at the airport. Airport is ok, but again, insanely busy. Business lounge is rubbish.
It's a very big place - and very poor, and you'll see surprising things as life is very open, by the roadside.
Take malaria tablets. I remember one security expert giving us all the usual scare stories, but he wouldn't take them.... next time we visit he's missing from work, got malaria,
Some of the hottest/spiciest food I've ever eaten.
It's not the delta, it's not Port Harcourt. They are a very different kettle of fish.
I've been to a nightclub in Lagos, certainly an experience. The dodgiest nightclub I've ever been was a place in Dubai that was wall to wall E European 'exotic ladies'
anywhere that needs Gatling runs on turrets to protect it
I was never very confident that the blokes manning the guns would stand and fight to save me, and not just run at the first sign of trouble!!
I was never very confident that the blokes manning the guns would stand and fight to save me, and not just run at the first sign of trouble!!
I bet they didn't even have any bullets - the guards will have sold them all on the black market for cash.....
I’ve been to a nightclub in Lagos, certainly an experience. The dodgiest nightclub I’ve ever been was a place in Dubai that was wall to wall E European ‘exotic ladies’
I stayed in a hotel in Kiev a few years ago, total shit hole. The only place with internet was the bar / lounge area on the ground floor and that was just full of 'exotic ladies' who endlessly pestered you when you were trying to work.....
I’d rather go there than Moscow as an example.
I really like Moscow, their underground is just amazing - marble everywhere. Makes London looks very down market...
I had a hotel room overlooking Gorky Park - kept humming the Scorpions song - Wind of Change....
Follow the Moskva
Down to Gorky Park
Listening to the wind of change
An August summer night
Soldiers passing by
Our local underground station...
[url= https://live.staticflickr.com/3231/2674127890_1eb9b98ea4_c.jp g" target="_blank">https://live.staticflickr.com/3231/2674127890_1eb9b98ea4_c.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/55iB4h ]Moscow Tube Station[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/brf/ ]Ben Freeman[/url], on Flickr
I really like Moscow, their underground is just amazing – marble everywhere. Makes London looks very down market…
"Playing into Putin’s hands”
“Playing into Putin’s hands”
I know, been to Moscow and Kiev and much preferred Moscow - they were the opposite of what I expected. Kiev was full of prostitutes and mafiosa. Moscow was very civilised by comparison.
^ isn't Moscow just full of a better class of hooker and gangster?
Been to Moscow several times - always struck me as a place it would be very easy to get into trouble in. Stunning looking women, with gangsters in shiny suits near- by.
That said, I have walked around the outside of Kremlin, just before Christmas at 11.30 at night - with no issues, other than the cold.
However Moscow is not in the same league as Lagos. Lagos is earth's personification of that bar in Star Wars. When I check into my hotel I was given specific instructions - if the fire alarm goes off, we advise you not to leave your room, if anyone knocks on your door , don't answer it, and don't go out of the compound.
I had a hotel room overlooking Gorky Park – kept humming the Scorpions song – Wind of Change….
President Hotel? I've stayed there.
Moscow was very civilised by comparison.
Depends who you hung out with...
President Hotel? I’ve stayed there.
Probably, can't recall...
It did have a gym on the ground floor which was open to the public IIRC.
Your employer's business travel insurers or assistance company should be briefing you. Your employers' basic duty of care should kick in without you having to ask on a public forum where you will only find anecdotal stuff.
Your employer’s business travel insurers or assistance company should be briefing you.
Odds of that doing any more than parroting Foreign Office advice is close to zero...
https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/nigeria
I’ve been to a nightclub in Lagos, certainly an experience. The dodgiest nightclub I’ve ever been was a place in Dubai that was wall to wall E European ‘exotic ladies’
I went to 'bar' (strip club) in Sarajevo in 2001 which had door men armed with Uzis and was full of very rough looking Eastern European 'business men' - the women were pretty hot though.
As a pasty middle class Londoner I was very relieved to leave in one piece.
At 50 i feel i'm getting on a bit for the kind of adventures that could end in the morgue/hospital/a shipping container in the woods - thankfully I only tend to travel for work to 'nicer' places these days.
At 50 i feel i’m getting on a bit for the kind of adventures that could end in the morgue/hospital/a shipping container in the woods – thankfully I only tend to travel for work to ‘nicer’ places these days.
The most scared I have been on a business trip was in Jordan (we'd left Damascas that morning and driven across the desert to Jordan for a meeting, which we were many hours late - mainly as my chaperone, our Head of ME Sales, had been up all night tasting various ladies of ill repute, so we'd set off several hours late).
Anyway, after our very late trip across the desert we needed to change car, so we popped in on a family member, which involved a long stop, cups of tea, being introduced to dozens of random people. Finally we set off in the borrowed car and as it was very late we ended up driving on a very quiet road. At which point we someone got mixed up in what I think was a wedding convoy only it consisted of lots of young men with AK-47s in the back of a couple of trucks firing bullets in the air. My colleague is Palestinian so fits right in but I realised I was the only white person in sight, surrounded by 50 of so armed and drunk young men about 10 miles from the border of Israel. I had a mild panic attack at that point...
Unless my company had a superb travel policy covering Nigeria I would...be hesitant.
Yeah, me too, and that is knowing that (if it was for work) I'd have access to support and a lot of decent information and training. I mean, part of me would like to, but the sensible part of me would politely decline.
You should as a minimum insist on a professional hostile environment training course.
You should as a minimum insist on a professional hostile environment training course
Nah. He lives in Cardiff so makes Lagos look like the hanging gardens of Babylon 😊
Somewhere on the Internet, there's a Nigerian asking asking advice about an upcoming meeting/hardship posting in Cardiff he's been asked to take part in 🙃
Only JOKING. Cardiff's alright...
You should as a minimum insist on a professional hostile environment training course.
Posting on STW....
Boxing day sales...
Trying to get a GP appointment...
Somewhere on the Internet, there’s a Nigerian asking asking advice about an upcoming meeting/hardship posting in Cardiff he’s been asked to take part in
We had some over for a training course one winter and it started snowing. They'd never seen snow, so we spent the afternoon outside with them building snow men outside the office!
Just my view, but if you believe the working conditions might be life threatening, the pay scale must sit somewhere between “life changing” and “never need to work again“.
You should as a minimum insist on a professional hostile environment training course.
Our Field Engineers used to do these courses when we were doing a lot of work on deployed Navy ships East of Suez.
The course was called CONDO (Contractors On Deployed Operations)
They're generally taught by mental ex-special forces guys - quite interesting and good fun.
Nah. He lives in Cardiff so makes Lagos look like the hanging gardens of Babylon 😊
Somewhere on the Internet, there’s a Nigerian asking asking advice about an upcoming meeting/hardship posting in Cardiff he’s been asked to take part in 🙃
Only JOKING. Cardiff’s alright…
Could be worse, you could have been asked to go to Newport...
Odds of that doing any more than parroting Foreign Office advice is close to zero…
The main reputable carriers will have proper training and risk assessment. Why? Because it is a cheap way of reducing indemnity costs for them and bolster their combined ratio.
Our Field Engineers used to do these courses when we were doing a lot of work on deployed Navy ships East of Suez.
The course was called CONDO (Contractors On Deployed Operations)
They’re generally taught by mental ex-special forces guys – quite interesting and good fun.
Hardly the same as travelling on business to sit in an office then return to a 5 star hotel....
Lagos is no worse than J'burg....
Just my view, but if you believe the working conditions might be life threatening, the pay scale must sit somewhere between “life changing” and “never need to work again“.
It's not a war zone. We has an office there for nearly 20 years with 20 odd employees, some local, some expats, two apartments and been flying people in and out every month for years - our insurer charger extra for covering it, but no onerous clauses nor constraints and no hostile zone training courses....
These guys provided training for all Maersk personnel: https://hostile-environment.co.uk/courses/heat