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Only a few days to go till La Vuelta 2023 kicks off with a team time trial in Barcelona, and Velogame Spain 2023 is now open.
https://www.velogames.com/spain/2023/
https://www.lavuelta.es/en/overall-route
Will update the thread as time goes on but there are some interesting choices this time - frankly, some of the teans seem to be saying "well we're not as botherad about this one so we'll let the little guys have a chance"
The obvious exception is Jumbo Visma who are sending Vingegaard, Roglic and Kuss, and are obviously aimin to regain the title. Remco Evenepoel is back to try to defend it
G is racing for the Ineos Grenadiers as the nominal team lead, but I have my eye on Thymen Arensman. He's been on the berge of a break foir a while, and Ineos recently had a clear out with Dani Martinez, Tao Geoghan Hart and Pavel Sivakov all heading to pastures new for next season, so they must rate Thymen if they're keeping him
Anyone else caught your eye? Preferably someone racing, but any obvious names omitted?
Have any staged piqued your interest as "I MUST make sure I watch that"? Saldy there will be no coverage on ITV4, but it will be covered live on GCN and the highlights show is often broadcast on Quest - will try to confirm when I find out if that's happening
EDIT - Cycling News haev a preview here which says that ITV4 are going to show highlights
https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/how-to-watch-the-vuelta-a-espana-live-tv-and-streaming/
but ITV4 don't mention it
https://www.itv.com/itvcycling/articles/2023-cycling-on-itv4
You can enter the STW Grand Tours League here : https://www.velogames.com/
The League code is 727626827
Anyone who entered the Giro or TDF version will already be entered into this one
Post up your thoughts, or any interesting articles you find
Not studied the parcours properly but I seem to remember it being extremely climby. Judging by the D-list sprinters on Velogames there aren't many bunch finishes on the cards.
Would be great to see Ayuso kick on from last year's 3rd and enter the top bracket of riders but going to be difficult to even repeat that with Jonas, Rog and Remco there.
Quite a lot of competition for the GC top ten - as well as the 3 favourites & Ayuso you have Thomas, Almeida, Mas, Bardet, Carthy, Dunbar, Vlasov, Caruso and then lots of younger prospects too like Lenny Martinez, Poole, Onley, Uijtdebroeks (had to check spelling of that one!).
It's hard to pick a velogames team with sprinters I've not really heard of, just had to choose the rider I could afford.
Have Ineos "had a clearout" or have riders been moving to greener pastures?
<p style="padding-left: 40px;">Thanks - team "My Pie Is Class" (poor linguistic nod to a favourite team of the 90s) are in...</p>
I picked Pog for the tdf, but I'm picking ving for this one, second and third is anyone's guess.
I'm off for 2 weeks starting Saturday, so I've entered a team to keep me more interested in watching. Team BikeyGood (I really couldn't think of anything clever).
Have Ineos “had a clearout” or have riders been moving to greener pastures?
Bit of both I expect. I think max squad sizes are smaller next year
Have Ineos “had a clearout” or have riders been moving to greener pastures?
My thoughts too. Decent riders not willing to ride in Brexit Bombardiers train to nowhere.
Brexit Bombardiers train to nowhere.
Why the stupid names and bringing politics into it ? If you don't like INEOS then just call them INEOS still, it's riidculously childish, don't you see that ? It's a decent discussion about bikes/racing and people STILL drag agendas into it. Sad sad sad.
"Keep politics out of sport". Yes. Rings a bell.
However, my point was not that - it was that (with some notable exceptions, Tom Pidcock) INEOS seem to ride in a very un-exciting way that is not much fun for the public and is probably not much fun for an attack-oriented rider. I can imagine that TGH will flourish elsewhere.
There’s a bit of a danger that the strength of Jumbo will suffocate the GC race a bit. That said with the parcours it looks like there’ll be good racing for stage wins at the very least.
DSM and FDJ are both fielding teams full of youngsters - it’ll be interesting to see how they fare.
it was that (with some notable exceptions, Tom Pidcock) INEOS seem to ride in a very un-exciting way that is not much fun for the public and is probably not much fun for an attack-oriented rider. I can imagine that TGH will flourish elsewhere.
That's more like it... 🙂
However, i only half agree... in simple terms, they ride now in the only way possible for the team they have available... which is mostly decided by Jumbo and UAE being incredibly dominant. So they're mostly just 'hanging on'
The one thing i don't get though is partly your point here yes...
Is it better to try and win 4-5 stages in a race, or try for 3rd overall...
Personally i think the 4-5 stages is the better plan... but they seem happy trying to hang on for 3rd in GC.
I don't mind Ineos riding in an unexciting way, it's no different to what the other teams do when the boot's on the other foot, and I expect the riders feel much the same.
Where I do think the riders are having second thoughts is the apparent lack of direction and ambition within the team.
Where I do think the riders are having second thoughts is the apparent lack of direction and ambition within the team.
There was a lot of discussion on another place that Remco is the plan... getting rid of TGH and getting Remco in as the GC contender. It's been a weird few seasons for INEOS as they were the superstars for ages, but now, you don't see them at the battles at all. Even with Thomas being flying at times, the rest of the team were a bit, well, meh.
There was a lot of discussion on another place that Remco is the plan… getting rid of TGH and getting Remco in as the GC contender.
That's out of the the window though as Remco has now stated he'll honour the contract he signed till 2026.
However there are (admittedly quite farfetched) rumours of a possible merger between Ineos and Soudal-Quickstep...
have my eye on Thymen Arensman. He’s been on the berge of a break foir
Sixth in last year's Vuelta, sixth in this year's Giro, so I think he may already have ganaged a break foir of sorts, but yeah, flying a little under the wadar I guess.
I’m gutted as they aren’t coming down my way as I always liked catching a live stage 🙁
Where I do think the riders are having second thoughts is the apparent lack of direction and ambition within the team.
I'm not sure it's lack of ambition. I'd agree they don't have the edge they did over some other teams, but mostly it feels like there's a limited supply of super-human GC contenders and the closest they have to that, Egan Bernal, rode into the back of a bus at 60kph and it still getting back to something hopefully closer to his best. That said, he'd still lose out to Pog or Vin in a time trial.
I guess you could say that's a recruitment failure, but realistically there are only so many physiologically super-gifted options out there. If you think about it, the whole Team Sky / INEOS era of dominance essentially came down to Chris Froome being stronger than anyone else. You can do so much with super strong support riders, but ultimately you need a leader to finish things off.
Anyway, it'll be interesting to see where Tom Pidcock focuses next and I've got my fingers crossed for Egan. When you consider how smashed up he was, it's incredible that he's still riding at that level and still improving too.
I’m not sure it’s lack of ambition. I’d agree they don’t have the edge they did over some other teams, but mostly it feels like there’s a limited supply of super-human GC contenders
I can't help thinking that if they'd had ambition to attack, G might have been able to win the G-ro. As it was they let Roglic stay within striking distance for a stage he was ideally suited to.
I’m gutted as they aren’t coming down my way as I always liked catching a live stage
Where's that?
Got 'Team tutti frutti into our STW league (thanks nbt for organising).
Vingegogo - is probably the favourite to win, however one never knows if he's completely 'overdone' it this season and Evenepoel is going to come up with the goods. But 'G' hopefully still has a great opportunity and with a decent team I'm not ruling him out.
The wonderful Thomas DeGendt is a favourite of mine and hopefully he will entertain us as usual (remember Belgium day?).
Lots of youngsters coming up through the ranks, wanting to show what they're made of. It's going to be an interesting race.
Why the stupid names and bringing politics into it ? If you don’t like INEOS then just call them INEOS still, it’s riidculously childish, don’t you see that ? It’s a decent discussion about bikes/racing and people STILL drag agendas into it. Sad sad sad.
Well I think Oily Jim's Greenwash Bombardier's are going to struggle. Don't think the old diesel Thomas has it in him unfortunately.
I hope Remco can give the Jumbo pair a run for their money. Not sure he'll hang on up the big climbs though.
Just built a team inspired by this tweet:
https://twitter.com/friebos/status/1694989748882813013?s=20
Not possible to use only riders from that list so made a few educated guesses to try and have highest elevation possible for my team.
The weather is abysmal! Jayco-Alula have crashed as an entire team. It's pitch bloody dark, spray going everywhere.
Jumbo Visma are 30+ seconds down at the half way mark.
Pouring rain - I think it was hoped there'd be a nice sunset, dusk light etc but it's just ****ing miserable. 😳
Got sent that off Twitter earlier!
Are they ever going to finish Sagrada Familia?
There were cranes around it when I was there in 2009, still cranes around it now.
Also, I'm going to say again how shit that weather looks.
It's mildly moist. And dark. Great ride by the movie stars, conditions have got worse and worse.
When the bikes need lights you know it's grotty.
Team DSM?! Wow.
Movistar did well especially the near pitch dark as they finished.
Ooo, I have a DSM rider in my team! And two EF-EP.
Ineos confirm that Laurens de Plus is out following his crash in the TTT.
That was visually quite different to your normal Vuelta stage
https://twitter.com/killow_/status/1695511683022680544?s=20
Not surprising to see Scotland's first Vuelta stage win for a while.
Pictures and a few quotes from riders here:
https://road.cc/content/news/remco-evenepoel-slams-ridiculous-vuelta-time-trial-303491?fbclid=IwAR2qRAlhnx7kYVKy8a-YlhY3yOJWF2kzFi0McxZTLO23FNJ0NUnP5QIHTgg
Hey, at least nobody kissed anyone. That's progress, in Spain.
The GC for today will be taken 9km from the official finish line as the weather is too bad to be racing on the final circuit. Time bonuses on the climbs will still remain.
[img] https://img.aso.fr/core_app/img-cycling-vue-png/alt-02-ve23/16525/0:0,1787:832-960-0-70/1d3d9 [/img]
So the finish is basically the summit at 178.2km
Hey, at least nobody kissed anyone. That’s progress, in Spain.
I would have loved to see the organiser of that shit show try and kiss Remco 😆😆😆
So the finish is basically the summit at 178.2km
Until someone on GC decides they are going for the bonuses.
I don't really know what happened in the race today, but I love collective action almost as much as I love bike racing so still reasonably happy with how it went.
Roglič and Thomas crashed, together. Pretty normal GC day then.
It's my first time being able to watch the Vuelta on GCN+.
I have a question though. Is the timing/graphics always this bad? Both stages so far any gaps or times seem to be pretty random and may or may not relate to the race.
They’re Eurosport’s pictures via the (Spanish) host broadcaster, so essentially they get what they’re given. Timing inconsistencies were probably down to the weather.
And having no idea when the leaders or the peleton reached the 9km mark? Or the gap between them?
It's seemed a bit random compared to the Tour and the Giro. Yesterday as well there was a lot of confusion over the timings, but given the fact they were riding in the dark that's probably the least of their worries.
First stage TTT was an utter farce. Any club 10, let alone CTT event would have failed the risk assessment. They were lucky to only lose the one rider. 6/8 down on one corner could have seen a whole team depart early. Yesterday was better but still a little mad. Fairytale ending though
Just watched Remco's latest YouTube video reconning today's stage. Not much to learn about the stage but the number of Ineos riders he is meeting... Is he taking the piss by including them in the videos? 🤣
That wasn't what I expected...
Are we allowed spoilers here, before any angry people show up not wanting to know what happened in the race of the threads title!!
It wasn't unexpected. Apart from the bit after the finish.
I don't think that was even much of a surprise given the way the organisers have handled it so far.
I don’t think that was even much of a surprise given the way the organisers have handled it so far.
Looked entirely his own fault to be honest - did he hit his own soigneur? Hell of an impact...
No, think it was an Arkea swanny.
Looked to me like there was so much clutter in his field of vision that he just assumed it would be safe to go right. They'd blocked the left side with security and Vuelta helpers, which was the obvious option.
Great win though - clearly they didnt expect that pace at the line when they planned it out!
It was stupidly windy at the top as well.
https://twitter.com/eurosport/status/1696167630531424594?t=PtpQYIdzuqQA1qd_R9tGZw&s=19
Looked like he was so busy celebrating his win he didn't actually bother to do things like look where he was going or "slowing down".
Minor details.... 🙄
GCN is starting to publish some decent written coverage.
GCN is starting to publish some decent written coverage.
Yes, they're broadening their coverage a bit rather than trying to direct everyone to their app. Worth reading their full race reports, most of which at the moment are about the still-farcical safety elements of racing in the pitch dark and pouring rain...
Tomorrow is an easier day, 185km directly south from Andorra to finish at Tarragona on the coast just down from Barcelona. Listed as hilly rather than a mountain stage and *should* - assuming the weather plays ball and doesn't cause more neutralisations - end in a sprint.
Another big crash, 3.8km to go.
Tiny lull in the build up, bunch swelled up then had to shift left and riders went into the police motorbike parked to highlight the traffic calming bollards.
🙄
OOOOFTTTT That's a brutal finish !
FFS, that was chaos again. Argy bargy on the sprint and then the rider giving it all the shoulder barging led into a big left hander and slid straight into the barriers.
Karma I suppose.
Struggling to get into this Vuelta i must admit, not sure if it is the bad organisation or the weather, should be a great tour in theory with the number of GC favourites there, but just not feeling it yet at all.
My velogames team is struggling, losing Eddie Dunbar and Oscar Onley and Geraint Thomas isn't in the top 10 (yet).
scud - I know what you mean. The Tour of Britain starts on Sunday and I'm more excited about that.
I'm looking forward to ToB to, always good seeing the likes of WvA on british roads.
should be a great tour in theory with the number of GC favourites there
Stage 1 and 2 were a bit of a let down, but if the end of the Andorra stage is anything to go by, it's going to be a good GC battle.
Big climbing day today and the first summit finish of the race.
Vingegaard is 37" back on GC and probably the best climber in the race.
I'm a bit confused at the moment with JV, it seems like Kuss, Rog and Vingo are all in for the GC, Vingo seems to be leading out at times, which you wouldn't usually do if you're set for GC win... but do you just let all 3 have free-reign and see who's got the power in days like these... or do you actively pick one of them and the other 2 sit on front as is the fairly usual thinking
^^
Possibly bluff and double bluff, make the rest of the teams wonder which JV rider to follow?
I think it's better racing than the old days of: here is our team leader/GC contender, here are his cannon fodder.
Gives teams a degree of leeway in who to work for if one of the potential GC guys has an incident plus adds a degree of mystery to it.
I'll have it on in the background - see what happens.
Looks to me like the plan of JC is (or was) to support Roglic. But with the added statement of “if Rog can’t respond, then it’s up to Kuss / Vin to see where they finish”. Being racers they will likely follow orders but hoping for their own chance to appear.
I think today could be the day where the GC sorts itself out, so who is the main player for JV? Is G goosed? Can Remco climb with the worlds best? Tomorrow is a “rest” day for GC, so I can see some riders going all in today. 4000 metres of climbing today, the final climb being 11.5kms at 7.5%.
Well I picked the wrong sprinter for my Velogames team (Dianese), Dunbar was my cheap GC pick so it's not going well. I've got Remco though, and hoping that my semi-random "they'll want to get in breaks" picks will come good later.
Looking forward to today, I'm off work this week and next so hoping for some decent stages to watch.
My team Lantern Rouge are near their pre destined position.
I went for Van den Berg on the theory that he's up and coming and can climb a bit.
He crashed on sprint 1 and was way down the pack on sprint 2
Berenetxea was in the break on day 2 at least
other than that, only Remco is doing anything right now...
Remco is great but I can't see him staying with Vingagoago in the big mountains.
I had Vingagoago in my Le Tour team, he got less points than Pog and I am pretty sure Vin won. I should read how points are scored some time!!
If pog didn;t win he was usually second, plus he got points for white jersey which Remco hol ds in the vuelta
wow. 42 in the break. FORTY TWO! Inlclding Lenny Martinez, Sepp Kuss, Jasha Suterlin and Mikel Landa, if I can follow the poor information we get from GCN
the break has split again but the front group has almost 7 minutes on the peloton
Jay Vine has withdrawn after a crash 🙁
peleton are closing on them so fast now that you do wonder about the accuracy of those timings. I mean its dropped a minute in 2 minutes.
the information in general is absolutely dire in this race. The stuff coming from the race organisers is bloody awful to start with, then we have Carlton and Sean trying to interpret it...
mind you, the peleton are certainly getting a shift on
then we have Carlton and Sean trying to interpret it…
Yes, well, dat is certaintly a challenge but dey are mahkin' de calculaaa-shun