Kitchen knife trackworld

A quality whetstone and a sharpening skills session? (I've no idea on knife brands, so watching with interest.)

My chef's knife is a Sabatier that was donated to me by a chef friend after he upgraded. It had clearly had a long and hard life so I took it to a local butcher to ask if he'd sharpen it. He turned it into something you could shave (carefully) with and wouldn't take payment, saying "just come to me when you need your meat, hey?" I promised him faithfully that I would (being a lifelong vegetarian) and stuck a banknote in the tips jar.

Have a look at ProCook. Their knives are really well made, German steel and the handle scales are riveted through the tang and are mostly canvas or wood Micarta, which is lovely to hold, and grippy. I’ve got a couple, a Santoku and a Nakiri, and they’ll almost certainly outlast me. <br />They’re also very reasonably priced. I had a Global knife once, and honestly I wouldn’t have another - the blade wasn’t straight, and I wouldn’t trust the blade/handle joint under pressure, but the ProCook knives are through-tang.

https://www.procook.co.uk/shop/knives-scissors/santoku-nakiri-knives

Global knives are like the Bose of audio... almost good but very overpriced for what they are.

If it's a gift, I'd look for a Jap knife, maybe something like this

https://thesharpchef.co.uk/collections/gyuto/products/tojiro-dp-cobalt-3-layer-vg-10-core-180mm-gyuto-knife-fujitora

Or if you want something smaller, something like this

https://thesharpchef.co.uk/collections/petty-utility/products/tojiro-dp-cobalt-3-layer-vg-10-core-150mm-petty-utility-knife-fujitora

The high end procook knives are pretty good, but thier cheaper ones are cheap and not very good.

Equally with 'global'... I'd actually be offended if someone gifted that crap to me.

Our Global knives (5 of them) hold their edge better than Santoku knives (6 of them) when using the same sharpening and cleaning process.  They’re also lighter/easier to handle for small hands.  Our kids find them much easier to use when helping to prepare meals.  <br /><br />

FYI - Santoku and Global are at the very least the same distributor if not the same company in the UK.

Santoku is just a style/shape of knife,not a brand as far as I'm aware. Think it means "3 virtues" - I.e. Good for meat, fish and veg chopping.

There's a knife nerd subreddit that may be helpful here, has recommendations at various price points. I've bought a nakiri and a gyuto based on this in the past and i love them both. I think general advice would be not to get a block, they're apparently not good value for the quality of knives you get. If you've already got a chefs knife you like then I'd suggest a nakiri with a slightly rounded tip so you can rock chop if necessary - mine is probably my most used knife now. I'd also agree with either getting existing knifes properly sharpened or getting some stones and learning to do it yourself. It's not that hard and it can be quite a nice mindful way to spend an afternoon!

Is Santoku a knife brand as well as a style? That's confusing...

Depends a bit on the budget and if you want to end up with a good workhorse knife (e.g. Victorinox and Procook) or something a little fancier (Wusthof Classic, Global etc.) or push the boat out and get a a fancy Japanese one (although be careful with the latter, a lot are single-edge blades which can take some getting used to). Personally I have a few I.O.Shen knives ( https://ioshen.co.uk/product-category/all-knives/) and can recommend them (they're sort of at the low end of fancy), they have quite big handles though so not great if you have small hands.

Cougar's suggestion of something sharpening related is good to, pointless having blunt fancy knives or being afraid to use them as you don't want to blunt them as you don't know how to sharpen. Personally I tried getting into whetstones but never enjoyed the process enough to practice enough to get good with them, ended up getting a Worksharp Precision Adjust Pro which is brilliant (I figured it would give a decent edge but I'd still need to do some finishing on a whetstone but it does such a good job I rarely bother with a whetstone now). That said it seems a lot pricier now then when I bought mine (I'm sure it was more like £250 not £350 🙁 ) https://www.knivesandtools.co.uk/en/pt/-work-sharp-professional-precision-adjust-wsbchpaj-pro-i-sharpening-system.htm   (don't bother with the non Pro versions though they have a lot of issues)

I've had a Robert Welch santoku for about 6 years now and it is still as sharp as the day I got it. I think part of that is only ever using it on wood or plastic chopping boards, no bamboo or ceramic or glass nonsense. It's also stored in a Bodum knife block (the one with the plastic bristles inside) so the edge is never clattering against the inside of a drawer or other cutlery.
The handle looks a bit bulbous although it's very comfortable to hold, and there's no fancy Damascus steel pattern to show off on your magnetic wall knife holder, but I'd happily have the full set if the opportunity ever comes up.

As I have no need of new knives it's nice to have a look at all the pretty pretty blades. There's a nice stainless nakiri and a carbon one as well - carbon needs a bit more care as they'll rust if left wet for too long, but I've had no issues using mine for an hour or so without cleaning/drying it. There's also a rather lovely stainless gyuto though it may be a little above your budget.

Maybe a complete change of style, and get a Chinese cleaver? I've got one and it's fun to change your chopping/cutting style every now and then.

From @ebennett 's linked page, for example: https://cuttingedgeknives.co.uk/collections/cleaver/products/hatsukokoro-vg10-175mm-chinese-cleaver

I've got a set of procook micarta and I'm happy with them.

If you want fancy look at bourne knives on Instagram.... beautiful.

For those who are looking on this thread out of interest for themselves, it would be remiss of me not to point out the hebtroco knives:

https://hebtro.co/product/sheffield-chef-knife/

I have been using Global knives for 20+ years (the same 2, I think they’re pretty good!) but the Hebden hipsters sent one of theirs in to FGF in May and I’ve been using it in rotation with the Global ones. Even chopped enough veg  to make sushi for 100 for my wedding with it! The hebtroco feels nicer, and the weighting is better imo. The handle doesn’t feel cold like the metal global ones - not a biggie but it does feel nicer to pick up! There’s more space under the handle for your forefinger than there is on my Global equivalent, but the handle is chunky enough to fill your palm. It’s still very sharp, and I’ve yet to invoke the 1x free send it off to get sharpened option. The only downsides are yes it’s very speedy (but, made in the UK) and you can’t put it in the dishwasher (or leave it soaking in a sink full of dishes!). But as a very nice and functional thing… lovely. I’ve noticed they have a bread knife now too, which is a chunk cheaper than the Chef’s knife.

If you’re the sort of person who likes to buy UK made things, this is the company that makes the hebtroco knives: https://www.s-staniforth.co.uk/49-knife-ranges

Have a look at Robert Welch. They've got a couple of ranges, the Signature Cook's version and the Pro Chef versions.

I treated Mrs Scape to one of their Signature cook's knives which has a bulbous, ergonomic handle as it fitted her hand beautifully  (she has a couple of grip issues). It's well used and a couple of swipes through a Chantry steel each use keeps the superb edge , well, superb.
I've just bought my daughter in law one of their pro chef's 6" knives, and it has a lovely, more conventional handle with a good broad but balanced blade. If I was looking to replace any of mine, I'd look there.

and you can’t put it in the dishwasher (or leave it soaking in a sink full of dishes!).

*Shudder*
My ex used to do that occasionally. The tray in the dishwasher looked like freddy kruger had been trying to load and unload it, and the knives didn't enjoy it much either, and leaving them to soak!!! Doing the dishes was like apple bobbing with added piranahas. Have cut myself to the bone more than once getting hold of an unexpected knife.

FWIW i use the wooden handled IKEA knives now, not expensive, hold an edge well and nice to use.
I also sharpen the whole lot once a year using a proper set of stones. I've got an assortment of other knives (some weren't cheap!) that i've accumulated over the decades and the IKEA ones are still my go to.

"Wood handle is made from sustainably sourced British yew."

Yew has no place in the kitchen. Who the **** made the decision to use Yew in  food preparation?

They're not flash but I have a wood handled Victorinox that I use all the time. It's almost 20 years old and still going strong.

I have a Global knife too but don't really like the handle.

I'm a bit of a knife nerd as well.. I think Victorinox are a great compromise between price and quality - they're also available with Rosewood handles which look a lot nicer than the plastic versions.

Beyond that Dick and Wusthoff both make really nice knives.

I've got 2 set, some high end Sabatier and some Global. Neither are better than the other but they are very different.

The Global knives are very light and feel almost delicate. For me this means I'm really conscious of how I treat them which is no bad thing. It's worth noting they also have a low edge angle, 10 degrees compared to most other knives that are 15 or 20. This doesn't make much difference in use but it does mean you need a dedicated Global sharpener (if you use one) to keep that angle. Or you need to go lower on a whetstone.

The Sabatier are much, much heavier and feel more tool like. Because of this they get throw around a bit more and I'm happier learning to sharpen them on a whetstone myself as I feel I'm less likely to do lasting damage.

If I could only keep 1 set it'd be the Global's, but if you like a bit of heft in your knife they are not the right option.

Thanks for the responses so far, really helpful.  There's some nice knives recommended, some out of budget!  I've gone back to look at what I have already and didn't realise the Lion Sabatier 20cm / 15cm / serrated utiility knives that I have at the moment are well regarded / reasonably pricey (I guess that's inflation!).  This makes me think that my search should focus on a style of knife I don't have like a Santoku and also a better sharpener (I've used a steel for years).

For the in laws the Pro-Cook Professional range looks like the best option in terms of bang for buck.  Victorinox get good reviews too but for the prettier handles the cost goes right up.

Another vote for Victorinox here.

We were gifted a set of Richardson-Sheffield Sabatier knives about 15 years ago when grandmother-in-law used to sit infront of QVC all day buying things and then decided afterwards who to give them to. They've held up really well but I'm slowly replacing/adding to them with the Victorinox Classic knives. Nothing special to look at but ours live in a knife holder in a drawer so it's all about function over form. So far I've got a santoku and a little pairing knife. They hold their sharpness well and a couple of swipes through an Anysharp sharpener gets them sufficiently sharp again for everyday use. I have a whetstone set that was bought with good intentions but life never seems to give me sufficient spare time to sit down with it and learn to use it properly.

Zwilling/Henkels or Wusthof are the two classic German makers.

Our Wusthof must be 20 years old and still going strong.

Sharpening - I've wasted loads of money on different sharpening things over the years but by far the best is this one

Effective and super quick. A steel is just for honing, and if you don't know what you're doing then youre more likely to blunt it than anything else.  This actually sharpens (and then hones) and you can't screw it up.

We've got Globals, Lions, numerous lesser sabatiers and Sheffield steels. The Lion is insanely sharp but too big , it's like a sword.

Best knife I've ever used was a plastic handled sheathed knife made by someone like Mora in Sweden. Brilliantly versatile.

I have a collection of various Lion knives which are now over 40 years old still going strong. I keep meaning to treat them to a proper professional re-sharpening but there is plenty of meat left on the blades. If we are staying in an unknown rental property I generally take a couple of my own knives as "holiday knives" can be of dubious quality.

Doing the dishes was like apple bobbing with added piranahas. Have cut myself to the bone more than once getting hold of an unexpected knife.

I had to have a Conversation about this. My partner is used to blunt knives because they're "safer." I don't really want to find one of mine by feel in the washing up, floating around loose in a drawer clattering against gods know what else, or hearing from the other end of the house the distinctive clack-clack-clack against a glass chopping board. The one saving grace here is that she won't use my primary Sabatier because she's scared to death of it.

Australia's answer to Global is the Füri. Insanely sharp & come with a sharpener.
+1 for the cleaver as well.
Learnt the hard way about dishwashers with our last set of Scanpan knives.

Thanks for the mention Hannah.

Regarding knife sharpening and stuff, I did an evening course here - https://www.communitycutlery.co.uk - in Ilkley and got a whetstone and a strop to keep my knife in good order.

For those who are looking on this thread out of interest for themselves, it would be remiss of me not to point out the hebtroco knives

6 inches? "Call that a knife"?

Yew has no place in the kitchen. Who the **** made the decision to use Yew in food preparation?

lol

That would be https://www.s-staniforth.co.uk who have been making knives for over 150 years.

“Call that a knife”

That's at least the third time I've read this quote on here in recent days and I'm pretty sure it's incorrect, unless you're quoting something other than what I think you're quoting. He says "that's not a knife."

I have several Global knives and whilst they are excellent and retain their sharpness well, I do find the handles a little uncomfortable and slippy - particularly on the larger knives.

Have a look on Kin knives website for more inspiration:  https://www.kinknives.com

One day I'll own a knife from https://blenheimforge.co.uk, until then you can go there and learn how to sharpen your knives on a whetstone. I found it very enjoyable and now I know how to keep my knife sharp.

Until I can afford/justify one from Blenheim Forge, I own this and it's great although you do need to be careful with the carbon steel blade.

He says “that’s not a knife.”

You are indeed correct.

Wusthof Classic  fan here! They take and hold a great edge, and assuming you're very happy with the looks of your original Sabatier, will be very 'in keeping'.  Good excuse to make yourself a new knife block too! From bottom, 16cm flexible filleting knife, 26cm bakers knife (I bake Fat loaves), 15cm boning knife, 22cm cooks, and a 10.5cm kitchen surfer. Subsequently added 16cm cooks as Daughter wanted something more manageable.

Had them a while now, no issues with loose scales/rivets (or anything else to be fair).

As others have said, Global are also well respected (had a former student who had been a pro chef recommend them, though he also felt there was an element of the VW van 'brand snobbery' effect going on there too). Just depends what you want looks-wise eh?

The one saving grace here is that she won’t use my primary Sabatier because she’s scared to death of it.

I have had a girlfriend swear the first time she's picked a knife up at my place.
Managed to neatly and smoothly slice the top couple of layers of skin off her knuckle...
No blood, just a nice neat disc of skin.

I've had my Globals for about 20 yrs and whet stone sharpen them. I like them but the big thing I reckon about knives is how they feel in your hand. Go to a good cookshop and pick some up and see if you like them.

I’m a bit of a knife nerd as well.. I think Victorinox are a great compromise between price and quality

I find the steel in them is pretty soft and they dont hold a good edge for long

Most of the knives you get seem to be split into two categories. Professional as tools for the job, or fancy to adorn someones kitchen.

I've a small collection of Vitorinox left over from my time in the meat trade(couple of boning knives 5"/6" and,10"/12" steak knives), a couple of Sabatier I dont really like as there is Sabatier and there is Sabatier, and I unfortunately picked up the former, and my main 8" chopping knife which is a Samuel Stanforth, and holds a wicked edge. I use the Stanforth one pretty much daily.

https://www.s-staniforth.co.uk/57-professional

Imho a good quality knife should cost you no more than about 60 or 70 quid, for a 10" cooks(chopping) knife, and up to about 35 for paring.

If you're wanting to spend a couple of hundred quid on a home kitchen knife, I've got this bridge for sale...

The basic choice is Japanese (sharp, light, hard, brittle) or German (less sharp, heavier, softer, less brittle). Both are great knives.

For "Japanese" , Kai might be a good starting point

For "German", Wusthof or Zwilling. The Wusthof 4582 "deep" chefs knife is a standard.

A 20cm "chefs" knife would be the most-used one in the repertoire. In the Japanese style, this would be a Santoku, but mainstream Japanese brands also make western shaped Chef's knives.

Another poster mentioned the hand-crafted likes of Blenheim forge (which is 2 mins from my house). They are very very lovely, but a 2 couple of whetstones and some patience will get you a very keen edge on many other cheaper blades.

Knives are like cars and bikes. People want to spend more to get a premium product even if it's no better than a regular product

My nephew is a high end chef, worked in several very fancy places He's got fancy knives too but reckons Fibrox Victorinox are the most used knives in the trade for good reasons, they just work. The average person doesn't need anything more expensive

If your want a conversation piece get fancy artisan knives

If you like leg of lamb and want to impress the dinner guests, get yourself a ham gouge.

This thread has been excellent for helping me focus on what I’d actually like rather than think I want.  I’ve currently moved from a set of 3 Global knives of which in reality I’d probably just use one to looking at a Wusthof Classic Santoku 18cm.  Current reasons being;

- I don’t have a Santoku type knife so it’s nice to have something different to try.

- I already have decent Sabatier LION 8 and 6 inch cooks knives and serrated utility knife that have done well for 17 years and probably just need some tlc to get them back to best.

- I like the Sabatier handle and feel, the Wusthof is similar in that regard. The Global is an unknown.

- I have my knives on a magnet, the Wusthof holds a similar aesthetic to the current knives so fits in.

- Global knives would need a different sharpener, if I’m investing there too I’d rather buy one than two so I can do all my knives (sorry but I can’t see myself ever using a whetstone).

- There are some lovely knives out there but I’m not going to drop well upwards of £100 on a single one at the moment.

If I like the Wusthof I can add as required.

We have a set of 5 global knives that were a wedding present 18 years ago. Have a ceramic sharpener, and the knives are scarily sharp, and you'd not know they were that old.

Also have a couple of wusthof, and they are no where near as good

Edit if you are buying a santoku as a Japanese knifr, won't you need a different sharpener from your European wusthof anyway?