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Grieving children will not be given permission for extra days off during term time even after a death in the family, the Schools Minister has said.
Nick Gibb warned that while pupils can have a day off to attend a funeral at the discretion of the headteacher, they are not allowed to take "extended holiday on the back of that funeral".
Speaking on Radio 4's Today programme Mr Gibb said: "The rules say you can't take leave from school during term time except in exceptional circumstances.
Nick Gibb has warned that children can't have extra days off school after a funeral
"If it’s something like a funeral or something, then the head teacher would be able to give permission to attend the funeral, but not to have an extended holiday on the back of that funeral or other compassionate circumstances."
He warned that taking just one week off during term time can impact a child's GCSE grades and said that fewer children are absent from school following tough new rules on days off.
Mr Gibb added: "We tightened the rules, the rules have always been the case that you should not take time out of terms to go on holiday, but there was an impression given that every parent was entitled to two weeks leave to take a child on holiday."
"That was increasing, it wasn’t just one or two children.
“Any absence, even if it’s illness actually, can damage the long-term chances of a child achieving good GCSE’s if they take just a week off a year."
The Minister said 500,000 fewer school days were missed during term time this year and added the the rules are not too tough because parents have time to book holidays and family events during breaks from school.
A spokesman for Mr Gibb said: "He was not suggesting that grieving children would not be allowed to take extra days off. Of course there may be cases where a child may need to take more days off for compassionate reasons. However, this is entirely at the discretion of the school/head."
Where did we find these people who are supposedly representative of our country?
OK, I could be reading this wrong but isn't the story actually saying that you can't go to a funeral and then take a holiday afterwards as part of that?
If it’s something like a funeral or something, then the head teacher [b]would be able to give permission to attend the funeral[/b], but [b]not to have an extended holiday[/b] on the back of that funeral or other compassionate circumstances
That's what this says.
I can't see anything wrong with that at all, sounds perfectly reasonable.
Time allowed off to attend funerals etc but not extended to take holidays. At discretion of head teacher. Sounds like a perfect compromise.
Grieving children will not be given permission for extra days off during term time even after a death in the family, the Schools Minister has said.
Never needed a couple of week off to come to terms with the death of a family member?
yet closing schools at the drop of a snowflake is ok.
I've only got gingersnaps, do you think they'll go with the hot chocolate?
Never needed a couple of week off to come to terms with the death of a family member?
In general terms I've always found it more useful to get back into a normal routine.
What if that family member is 2 days travel way?
Never needed a couple of week off to come to terms with the death of a family member?
I've been fortunate in that no, I haven't but that's irrelevant. If you read the story rather than the headline it doesn't say that you can't have compssionate time off.
It also doesn't specify how long the compassionate time off can be. It just says that if you go to a funeral, etc you can't then take a holiday (separate from compassionate leave) too.
[quote=legspin ]What if that family member is 2 days travel way?
Well gosh, I'm sure the head teacher isn't allowed to use any discretion at all in that case.
Another example of a minister spouting nonsense when the rules and the way schools apply them are quite reasonable.
“Any absence, even if it’s illness actually, can damage the long-term chances of a child achieving good GCSE’s if they take just a week off a year."
An example of devaluing everything else he said with nonsense. Unless you take the week of the exams off a week really won't make any difference
I can't see anything wrong with not granting additional time post funeral, however I'd expect time to be given immediately following a death if required.
"Any absence, even if it's illness actually, can damage the long-term chances of a child achieving good GCSE's if they take just a week off a year."
Blimey. Is our education system really so intensive that say an eight year old taking five days off for the measles will impact his future grades, further education and employment opportunities?
Or is he perhaps overstating that just a [i]little[/i] bit? 🙄
(Edit: Edukator beat me to the point)
"can" - it's like "reductions of up to 50%"
Just because some bureaucrat won't give you permission doesn't mean you cant do it.
A fine is normally only levied at a parent after 5 days of absence.
Just saying.
"can" - it's like "reductions of up to 50%"
Even then I'd like to see the figures and the methodology for proving causation over correlation there.
You're kidding me? No figures or methodology required to say "can", it's a weasel word.
It's a non story designed to lure the indignant in with a headline.
But by all means, keep frothing 😉
"Another example of a minister spouting nonsense when the rules and the way schools apply them are quite reasonable."
Time for a verbal reasoning test:
Speaking on Radio 4's Today programme Mr Gibb said: "
.The rules say you can't take leave from school during term time except in exceptional circumstances
Nick Gibb has warned that children can't have extra days off school after a funeral...
.""If it’s something like a funeral or something, then the head teacher would be able to give permission to attend the funeral, but not to have an extended holiday on the back of that funeral or other compassionate circumstances
So which bit of the above is nonsense then?
So which bit of the above is nonsense then?
Umm... the bit that Edukator (and I) quoted?
Why are you quoting other bits and then complaining about "verbal reasoning"?
[quote=just5minutes ]Time for a verbal reasoning test:
Do you want to take a resit?
Where's the proof then, or it is just the opinion of a presumably well educated person who would make sure their own kids wouldn't fall behind after a week out of school for whatever the reason?
Is the effect the same for children that are already behind and have parents who don't give a monkeys if they fall even further behind?
Neither, this is:
"Any absence, even if it's illness actually, can damage the long-term chances of a child achieving good GCSE's if they take just a week off a year."
In terms of time after a funeral there are plenty of circumstances that would justify more time, use your imagination, parents do.
Time for a verbal reasoning test:
OH the irony of that statement 😆
If the kids are already behind and the parents don't care a week off won't make any difference.
If the kids aren't behind and the parents care a week off won't make any difference.
Kids who are serious about school and have parents who care keep up and catch up. Kids who aren't serious about school with parents who don't care don't keep up, won't catch up and more or less time off won't make any difference.
The School Minister seems to have not taken much notice of the recent court case...
The father won on the basis that the law is pretty simple - kids must attend school regularly. You'd think the Schools Minister would know about such things rather than spouting nonsense.
So, pretty much the same rule I have to abide by at work for a funeral then?
These kind of headlines are just designed as click bait, not sure why idiot ministers keep getting lured in.
Actually, my answer was in my question.
Juniors school lets them take loads of days out at competitions where they can miss full or half days school, but that's OK as the school says it is.
It got to the stage where there were so many of these 'events' that we put a stop to it as it was leading up to SATS. The school thought it was fine though.
So, pretty much the same rule I have to abide by at work for a funeral then?
What are your work rules?
Where's the proof then
That was [i]my[/i] question!
Where is Nick Gibb's proof that taking five days off school "damage[s] the long-term chances of a child achieving good GCSE's"?
Is the effect the same for children that are already behind and have parents who don't give a monkeys if they fall even further behind?
Exactly! Correlation is not causation.
I'm sure the figures probably do show that kids with poor attendance get lower GCSE marks.
But that doesn't mean we can conclude that [i]any[/i] absence will impact GSCE results. There are way more factors at play than that.
1 day special leave for a funeral for parents, grandparents, siblings, aunts and uncles.
HR can consider an extension if you are actually arranging it.
I'm not sure where this recent non-compromise approach to absence is coming from in School with all the fines and threats of imprisonment for parents.
Just last year we had a letter home from school explaining the amount of time of children should have for various illnesses - some of it was simply stupid, Hand Foot and Mouth, Tonsillitis, Conjunctivitis, Glandular Fever they say none of these illnesses require any time off school - nope in class, with a fever, feeling like death - because if they miss a day it's all over for them.
On the other hand, a wisp of snow hits the ground, closed. Teachers need a day off for 'reasons' a week after they've had 6 weeks off, closed, or perhaps because of pure luck your Son seems able to swing a cricket bat with some skill despite never holding one before in his life - they'll take him out of lessons for a day with 3 of his classmates to go and play another school.
1 day special leave for a funeral for parents, grandparents, siblings, aunts and uncles.
Do you really think it would be fair for a child to only be allowed one day off if one of their parents or siblings died?
I didn't say it was fair, I said it was the same.
And as others have said, getting back to normal, or the "new normal" is often better than sitting around dwelling on things for some people.
So, pretty much the same rule I have to abide by at work for a funeral then?
I don't think my work have any rules saying I can't take some annual leave immediately after a funeral.
We also get five days compassionate leave, plus the possibility of using (unpaid) dependant leave or [url= https://www.gov.uk/parental-leave/entitlement ]normal statutory parental leave[/url].
[i]I can't see anything wrong with that at all, sounds perfectly reasonable.
Time allowed off to attend funerals etc but not extended to take holidays. At discretion of head teacher. Sounds like a perfect compromise.
[/i]
This was my reading of it too. Non-story, except for Daily Mail readers and the like.
I was once disciplined whilst working for the NHS in derby, after the death of my grandmother. Apparently I had to give 7 days notice to attend the funeral.
Morecash
With respect you are comparing apples with skateboards by implying that a child should conform to the same rules as an adult (apologies if I've misunderstood the point you're making and I am not advocating the unscrupulous taking the **** either).
As an emotionally developed adult with more life experience your ability to deal with grief will likely be very much greater than that of (say) a 8 year old child or a teenager pumped full of hormones and teenage angst.
A very wise teacher of mine once said that if you were sick you did more for your education by staying home and getting fit. Sitting there with a cold / whatever you've got a major deterioration in your mental abilities. As far as I'm concerned the same thing applies to people's mental welfare.
Irish_AL if your username is accurate I guess they probably wouldn't understand how we have them buried in 3 days at home - I still find it odd how long it takes to bury/ cremate someone over here.
I'm not sure where this recent non-compromise approach to absence is coming from in School with all the fines and threats of imprisonment for parents.
Its not coming from schools its coming from government.
I am surecI read about a case in Reading recently where charges wete bought against a parent due to poor attendance adter the father had died. Charges were dropped before it went to court. Whole thing was a ****ing disgrace.