[Closed] Kids and Food

Just keep plugging away. No treats or puddings unless they eat some sort of vegetable/fruit. Praise the good, ignore the bad. Prepare for the long haul.

Eldest is 16. Only eats peas or baked beans in their natural state. Bolognaise is how we hide the rest. Still has a kids multivitamin as an insurance. He's 6 foot tall, skinny as a rake, it's not killed him. Just discovered curry, so he's getting there. What happens in 18 months when he heads for uni, who knows.

Youngest is 13. Takes after her dad and hoovers up most things. Now discovered she's been hiding snacks and chocolates in her room which explains the additional puppy fat, despite 8 hours of sports a week. It can go both ways with kids

Bribery, extended trade negotiations and extortion.

Nothing to add except to say you're not alone. My eldest used to be ok but my youngest will only eat plain pasta, plain rice or sausages (without skin).
Drives nuts especially as that seems to have made the older one regress.

She's still young (2 1/2) so we're trying the "make stuff and leave it on the table and see if she helps herself" trick. Not having a lot of success but I've head it can be a long game. I presume your two are too old for this?

Just to also say, my sister used to be the same, now she eats all sorts of things, loves spicy food and really enjoys cooking/baking

My 3 three are 19, 17 & 17..... can still be a pain in the arse (although better than 10 years ago). Pretty much given up - we make what we want and if they don't eat it then that's their lookout !!

We promised ourselves that we wouldn't be making separate meals for us/each of the kids. Hey ho. Rollseyes

FWIW we have always mashed carrots into the mash - and serve carrots on the side. That way they're always eating some.

Our eldest is proving to be a real godsend as he - despite being a picky eater earlier in life - is willing to give most things a go. We used "you need to show your little brother and sister" a lot with him. He now puts more sriracha sauce in his ramen than I can cope with (he's 9!).

Also onions - he actively searches them out to remove. Middle child will eat them but doesn't like them. Youngest? She asks for raw onions to eat as a snack. 😉

We had an early lightbulb moment, when our first child was joined by our second - and we found ourselves preparing meals for baby, kid and ourselves separately.

I do most of the cooking and have had some success with the following over the years (kids are now 10 & 7):

- Lots of hands-on foods / meals: this is a bit risky, but involves making different parts of the meal accessible in bowls on the table. A typical meal might be something like making your own south American style wrap with a bean mix (often blended / crushed), guacamole, red cabbage-based salad mix, cheese, herbs, tortilla etc etc. If you put it all on the table and encourage making your own mix then it often helps to get new flavours acquainted with and is usually more successful than a prepared meal.

- Disguise: for example, you'd be surprised how readily a parsnip or swede can be slipped into a mash. When I know something like a veg / cauliflower curry would be unpopular or picked-at, I will mash it up so that it's indistinguishable.

- Help with cooking and choosing their own food: I've always found that the kids will eat what they've prepared, especially when they've chosen what it is. Our eldest is getting slightly fussier as she gets older, so I now tend to give her a cookbook (e.g. Anna Jones, Modern Way to Cook) and ask her to choose a few meals in advance. Where possible, I will then have her lead on the cooking. Some of these meals tend to be popular for a few times and then fall by the wayside, but it's a good way to keep them trying new things. In general, I think kids are often encouraged to "bake" and this tends to mean sweet things like cake. Both are keen on this and I've tried to encourage things like cheese scones as a gateway to making other savouries.

I don't know what will work for other people, but this seems to be working for us! As a result, we eat the same as the kids and I'm pretty happy with their nutrition etc. Not perfect of course!

We also eat together most days of the week, which is a little challenging with work etc but I feel is a compromise that's well worth it.

Agree with comments above that you have to enforce it so you're not making individual meals. You can choose your battles though. We tend to compromise and only serve up veg the kids will eat, not a huge variety right now but at least it's getting some green stuff down them. Another cheeky trick is to hide the veg, so you can do that in things like pasta sauces. Means cutting up the veg much smaller than you might do normally to help it disappear, but works for us.

Travel back in time and when they start solids feed them what you have, that way they’ll eat pretty much anything.

There’s very little my 2 don’t eat they’ve gone off one or 2 things as their tastes have changed but it’s very little.

Also always worked on there’s no alternative meal it’s the same or nothing.

I feel your pain.

I'm trying to get ours involved in preparing some food, it does seem to help.

You can get a knife (Kuhn Rikon) that is sharp enought to cut fruit / veg but but not to really cut or stab yourself (I'm happy letting a 2 year old use it under supervision, a 6 year old should make good going of a carrot with it). I try and get mine along side me cutting stuff. Doesn't awlays work but a great way to get them familiar and happy handling and kids of fruit and veg.

`m fed up of eating kids food everyday.

That was your choice then and still is now. Cook what you want to enjoy as a family and make simple tweaks where relevant. Do not simply bow to the little ones' demands. If you think there's some kind of eating disorder kicking in then see a doctor.

Here's how we roll. Monkey jnr has oddly grown up having no issue with fruit and veg - he'll eat most of it. Only major things he doesn't like are eggs, onions/leeks/mushrooms and parsnips. Eggs not an issue as we just add those to our plates, not his. Onions/leeks/shrooms - easy, we either blitz them so he doesn't know they're in the mix, eg spag bol, chilli, asian etc or we cook them quickly on the side for us. Parsnips get mashed in with swede or sweet potato etc.

I know there are extremes where kids actively seek out foods they want to avoid. Sure, that can be trickier at times to manage. But it's pretty simple to mix in what they don't like or just keep it separate.

I've not read it but my partner has,

https://www.amazon.co.uk/French-Children-Dont-Throw-Food/dp/0552779172

Travel back in time and when they start solids feed them what you have, that way they’ll eat pretty much anything.

Doesn't work, even with a time machine. Our first we did all the hippy weaning stuff with lovely solid food. She would eat any vegetable, fish or meat from 9 months to 3 years. We even took to preaching to others about how our woke and progressive ways had blessed us with an olive eating mini gourmet. Now we're all plain pasta and fish finger sandwiches with the crusts cut off.

The 2nd one will eat anything, no bother.

The 3rd one stuck 2 fingers up to our attempts to feed him good food from the start.

Whenever I hear parents going on about how their 2 year old will only eat proper Cantabrian anchovies and wagyu beef I laugh to myself at the thought of them crying while they order McChicken Nuggets with a side nuggets and cheesy pasta in a few years time.

3 kids - 9,8 and 5.
9 is by far the fussiest but will eat most things we give him, leaves bits on the side sometimes.
8 is the most adventurous and always want to try some of ours if it's different or we're eating later than them.
5 was a pain a couple of years ago when she decided she didn't like potatoes or anything potato based. What kind of child doesn't like oven chips?? It was starting to frustrate me as it limited what the rest of us were eating to the point where I started giving her a slice of bread and butter when the rest of us had potatoes. Couldn't see the end of it and thought we were in to years of no potatoes. Then a few months ago she asked for mashed potatoes because Granny had given her some and she loved it. Now she's fully on the potato wagon as if it;s her favourite food!
My theory is that because she idolises granny then if Granny likes it it must be amazing.

Is there someone your kids look up to in a more exciting sense that could encourage them in to trying different foods? Us parents are boring rule-setters who force them to eat things they don't want. But if "your mate Dave" who is so amazing and everything he does is brilliant eats brocolli then they might need to eat brocolli too to be as cool as Dave.

@tomd, that may be your experience but it worked for me. I can't think of any occasion when I've had to cook separate adult and kids meals. They eat what I eat. Simples.

The problem isn't so much getting them to eat some veg. Its broader than that. Youngest wont eat anything potato. None of them will eat rice. Nothing with any spice or sauce that isn't gravy. It seriously limits the food you can make. I have tried the "this is what we are eating you either eat it or you don't" method, eldest didn't eat for weeks.
So we end up with a weekly menu of bolognaise, pizza, sausage, pasta bake, chicken nuggets and a roast on sundays.
The plan since Christmas has been to introduce one new meal a week that they have to at least try, in the hope that they might actually like one or two. They also have to cook one meal a week for the whole family. Hoping that once they see how much effort goes into preparing a meal they may be a bit more respectful of others efforts. Also they might eat it if they made it.

As wilh almost behaviour with kids, both bad and unfortunatley, it is a phase.   It will only become 'permanent' if you let it, as others have said.

Make what you want to eat (within reason.. i wouldn't go making devilled kidneys anything) and they will, eventually, learn to like it.     My only rule with food with the kids is that they must try everything. in front of them.  They can of course not like it mind.For example there is always a little bit of salad on their plate,my<span style="font-size: 0.8rem;"> son now loves it and my daughter has nowprogressed to cucumber tomatoes and weirdly olives after initially turning her nose up at the lot</span>

I have tried the “this is what we are eating you either eat it or you don’t” method, eldest didn’t eat for weeks.

You sure about that? Kept a count on the biscuits, slices of bread, etc.?

We got our youngest to eat carrots by asking her to pretend to be Rebecca rabbit from Peppa pig. Sort of works as they come straight back out of her mouth again but at least she's trying them!

This is the problem kids are individuals we could give parenting tips all day but if your kid doesn’t want to eat something then they won’t. I’m not buying the not eating anything for weeks though they were just didn’t eat what you wanted them to or your partner secretly gave in.

This is the problem kids are individuals we could give parenting tips all day but if your kid doesn’t want to eat something then they won’t. I’m not buying the not eating anything for weeks though they were just didn’t eat what you wanted them to or your partner secretly gave in.

She literally didn't eat an evening meal for two weeks. There were of course one or two meals in those two weeks that she liked anyway. So, apart from breakfast and packed lunch at school, she only ate an evening meal once a week. So she wasn't starving but would rather not eat in the evening than try anything new.

Surprising reading this thread as my two (14 & 17) aren't fussy (aside mushrooms & courgette) and never have been really. Don't know whether that's luck or how we did it from a young age... always eat meals together as a family, originally the classic no pudding if didn't eat main, same food for everyone, varied menu each week (no repeats) and, last few years, everyone chooses a meal each week for us all to eat.

We always went down the 'just try it once and if you don't like it fine' route.

Just one mouthful was acceptable, and if she didn't want anymore than made no fuss about it. Before long she would automatically try everything and just ended up eating it. There are a few foods she doesn't like, but that's to be expected it.

The main thing was we didn't make a big deal out of it if they didn't eat it.

Don't keep trying to feed them the same food they have already decided they don’t like - try new things together as a family. Or eat things in front of them and just let them decide for themselves if they want to try it. Our girls eat some weird things that they like after seeing me eating then deciding they will have some of it.

Also get them involved in the preparing and cooking of meals.

This is the problem kids are individuals we could give parenting tips all day

I have a working theory that advice from anyone who hasn't personally raised some large double-digit number of children should be taken only with a large pinch of salt*.

I remember some fellow, on hearing that our kids had trouble going to sleep, saying with no hint of irony: "Oh, we never had any problems with ours. We always used to put them in their beds, make it nice and quiet, and turn the light off". To which I responded: "Oh, what a good idea, I hadn't thought of that".

Anyway. Just another "you are not alone" post. We've done all the feed-them-what-you're-having type stuff from birth, and there has seemed to be a certain age where they start digging their heels in (or discovering their own taste, depending on how you look at it).

Our approach is varied. We do mix-and-match type meals (e.g. wraps) where you can pick what goes on your plate from a selection. We hide vegetables in sauces. We periodically revisit previously rejected foods to try them again. We use vile threats and exhortations. Sin of sins, we sometimes have separate kids/parents meals.

Although it's often difficult I try to take a long view. I remember eating basically the same meal night after night as a kid, and it doesn't seem to have killed me. My wife's cousin who would only eat baked potato with beans is now a chef wot has been on the telly. So long as there are some calories going in, and those calories are not all cake-derived, it'll probably be OK in the end.

[*] What? No, I know you don't like salt. You have a pinch of another spice, whatever you like. Oh? You don't like other spices? No? And *you* don't like pinches? Uhm. OK, well take it with a baby plum tomato then. Will that do you? At this point I don't really care any more, I just want to get this over and done with so we can all go to bed. You know what, have a biscuit, I'm opening this wine.

I struggle with long sentences as I've not got time just now, but the solution is:

Get them cooking. It was a revelation. My kids were picky central till they started cooking. Then they realised how much work was involved, the joy of creating something and the fact that these things (onions, spices) weren't scary, they were just ingredients that they had added to the recipe.

Complete revelation
I think I did a thread about this year's ago. I'll try to find it.

I was having a conversation with someone about this recently and started to think back on my childhood. Until the day I left for Uni (and haven’t “lived” with my parents since) I don’t ever remember being given a choice about what to eat. You ate whatever was put in front of you or you didn’t eat at all, your choice. My mum made lovely home cooked food (morning frozen or packaged) every day and I don’t ever remember not liking anything (apart from marrows, yuck!). There was the odd thing each of us kids didn’t like but hardly anything and my mum just didn’t put it on our plate but that was fairly rare.
The person I was speaking to said that kids choose a lot what they eat now, some parents do menus! Is this really true? I don’t have kids so don’t have any exposure to it hence asking. But why are kids dictating what they have to eat anyway?

The only thing I’d change about me growing up was having to eat everything on the plate - if I hadn’t have had to go that I might not have been such a glutton now - I can’t leave until the plate is empty!

Get them cooking. It was a revelation.

Us kids used to help our mum to cook I wonder if that helped? Although I have to say I preferred drizzling the syrup onto the treacle tart much more satisfying than peeling carrots, I can’t think why. 😂😂😂😂

I feel your pain, we've got a 3yo and a 1yo. One year old is an eating machine, 3yo is a wee fussy madam. Some nights can be pretty soul destroying as you scrape the barely touched plate into the bin. I just try to keep plugging away and don't get to disheartened, I'm sure there's far worse things you can be doing as a parent. My thoughts are not get too hung-up on what the absolutists on the internet say about parenting: "we just did XXXX and we were fine, you obviously just didn't do it right". Listen and try fair enough, but don't beat yourself up! Some things have gone well/easy for us and some have been a challenge. As Drac said, they're all different! I'm sure OP knows I just figure it's a point that needs re-itterating.

Edit: Tom Parkin +1

I've tried every suggestion on this thread.

We tried getting strict with the 'they eat what we eat' method. We called it quits after day 3 of my son eating nothing (and yes, I do mean nothing). Funnily enough, he did eat what we ate from about the age of 1 1/2 to 2 1/2, then pickiness set in and grew from there.

He actually quite enjoys cooking but then won't eat what he makes.

No advice, I'm afraid. Kids suck.

Ha. It's enough to drive a man to just lashing chilli sauce on his dinner every night.

We get our kids to eat veg by serving it raw as 'nibbles' before the meal - when they are hungry. Sometimes while watching TV slackjawed after school. (Carrots, cuc, iceberg lettuce wedges...). Then I don't care if there is nothing fresh on their main meal plate. I admit that this is sort of avoiding the issue though.

Can you bore them into submission? Plain pasta sandwiches every night?

My only other observation is that temperature of food is very important when trying new food. If the first bite is too hot then our youngest won't even try a second bite. Ever.

Good luck. It can only get easier.

I read the title as Kids as Food

My 3 are all different despite being brought up the same. 2 of them are twins so they were at the same stage at the same time but they still turned out with different preferences.

For what it's worth as a kid I'd eat potatoes carrots and peas - as long as the shell wasn't broken on the pea and if a particular family friend had cooked them runner beans. Then I left home, thought what is this crap I'm eating, gave up meat and walked into a greengrocers and bought a big pile of vegetables. Over 35 years later I still eat piles of vegetables. The point is if they are going to change it'll be when they decide to!

We just removed the food and presented no alternative. If they're not eating, they're not hungry.

It may take a day or two, but hungry kids eat.

I have a working theory that advice from anyone who hasn’t personally raised some large double-digit number of children should be taken only with a large pinch of salt*.
I remember some fellow, on hearing that our kids had trouble going to sleep, saying with no hint of irony: “Oh, we never had any problems with ours. We always used to put them in their beds, make it nice and quiet, and turn the light off”. To which I responded: “Oh, what a good idea, I hadn’t thought of that”.

Yep I get that, and I knew before I posted that this would end up full of smug parents telling everyone how there 4 year old eats everything.
Im not bothered about what the kids eat. I know its a phase and they will get more adventurous as they get older. What we are really struggling with is not being able to eat food that isn't beige and actually has some flavour. We are sick of eating kid friendly food. So its either get them to eat what we eat (nigh on impossible) or we cook two meals (vowed never to go that route, but it seems the only way)

Just found the "thread" . TBH it just comes across as an arragobrag, but I really do feel your pain and think this is a good solution. Try it.
https://singletrackmag.com/forum/topic/anyone-elses-kids-horribly-fussy-eaters-potential-solution/

I was a picky eater as a kid. My mother cooked dinner as normal. I sat at the table until I ate it. she would however remove stuff ( like offal) from the menu if I really hated it ( not at that mealbut she wouldn't cook it again). NO fuss, no drama no pudding if my plate was not clear. I sat there until I ate it or for an hour or more. No alternatives provided

She does tell a tale of a battle over icecream when I was 4. I wanted to eat it with my fingers. she wanted me to use a spoon. apparently I sat there refusing to use the spoon for 2 hours until it was just a puddle then had to use a spoon.

A battle of wills between me and my mother was apparently something to behold. NO arguing, no drama. Eat it or go hungry. she won.

We just removed the food and presented no alternative. If they’re not eating, they’re not hungry.

It may take a day or two, but hungry kids eat.

Just out of interest, how many days would you realistically go before throwing in the towel?

Like I said earlier, we managed three. Seeing him wandering around half out of it, pale and ill looking, we eventually decided that it was worse parenting to continue to deprive him of food he would eat than to give in and let him eat some slices of bread.

We've done weeks of the child sitting at the table for hours not eating and then only having a slice of bread.  Wasn't working and I didn't want her memory of childhood to be one of epic battles of will.  I try and cook things that I can assemble into different versions at the end.  A bit painful but it's a case of picking your battles and that wasn't the one I cared about the most

We are sick of eating kid friendly food. So its either get them to eat what we eat (nigh on impossible) or we cook two meals (vowed never to go that route, but it seems the only way)

Aye, I also dislike separate meals. If nothing else, in our house it usually means "parents eat after the kids go to bed", which can mean you don't end up eating until quite late. Sometimes it's the old favorite muesli tea at 2145 or so...

However. Sometimes you just need to eat something you actually want, rather than another iteration of the short list of things your kids will accept. Having a night off every so often isn't going to be the end of the world, IMO.

tomparkin - was just about to say similar.
How about cooking a seperate meal a couple of nights a week to break the beige monotany? We tend to eat the same during the week but sometimes on a Friday or Saturday will have something a bit posher. I'm not wasting decent steak on an unappreciative 9 yr old.

Our 9 year old can be a pain when it comes to eating but hes been better since we got him to help plan and cook the meals and he really enjoys the cooking. Sometimes he loves stuff he would never have tried before and other times he will at least try it before saying he doesn't like it.

Bribery, extended trade negotiations and extortion

This. Add in no thumb exercises if they don't eat.

A battle worth having IMO, and we are still having with 13 and 17 year olds...

As mentioned before getting them involved in planning the meals makes a big difference. I let the kids choose 2 evening meals each a week, which must be reasonably balanced and a minimum of 2 veggies, soup as a starter is a good way to get another portion in. We all have to eat each others choices, including mine. If it's something new or that they don't like just give them a manageable portion, even if it's only a spoonful or two at least they are trying. Experts say it takes around 15 tries for your palette to adjust to new flavours or textures, I still can't manage eggs after a fair few decades and the little monsters will put them on the menu if I make a veggie curry

Tranquiliser sausage followed by intraveneous broccoli

I gave my kids a choice. But the choice was always something like Brocoli or carrots, or Mash or boiled spuds.

IE they got wholesome food that I wanted them to eat, but had some agency about it.

Then a few months ago she asked for mashed potatoes because Granny had given her some and she lo

This definitely. On the early days most of the progression we had was when they are something at school or so where else where they didn't have a choice.

We just give them what we eat (4 & 2). Sometimes they eat it, sometimes they don't. Neither has shown any signs of malnutrition.

One thing I've noticed is that neither are big eaters at dinner time, no matter what. The youngest loves breakfast and will happily eat three courses.

Eldest tends to go big at lunchtime. In fact I think he would happily eat constantly from about 12:00 - 15:00 and forgo all other meal times.

While you may think it can only get better in time, that's not always the case: my eldest (19 y.o.) has decided she's going vegan 🙄

Thankfully she lives about 1500km away so the Sunday roast is safe.

"You don't have to eat it" has worked for a couple of our friends.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/6-words-that-will-end-picky-eating_b_7139710

there is no such thing as "kids" food, it is just a trap to get them addicted to processed and fast food.

My kids have never had a choice about what they eat, only whether to eat it, unsurprisingly they have never chosen to go hungry.

They have always had whatever my wife and I were eating, before they grew teeth I pureed whatever I was having for dinner. They learned to accept tastes and flavours before they were able to say no. Admittedley there seemed a cut off point around the time that they started walking where introducing new foods became more difficult which I theorise is an evolutionary adaptation to stop them wandering off and eating strange new foods that could be poisonous.

My eldest was eating herring, bones and all before they was 1, 13 now and complained this morning that I hadn't shared my kippers with them.

Our youngest fits into the pattern above when it comes to onions, mushrooms and courgettes, but she's starting to enjoy spices thanks to Nando's!
Then there's the irrational stuff: hates cauliflower, loves broccoli. Hates cooked carrots, loves them raw.
One really easy way to get a decent range of veg into them during the winter months is soup. You'd be surprised what you can get away with when it's hidden in a warm bowl of nondescript beige.

Then there’s the irrational stuff: hates cauliflower, loves broccoli. Hates cooked carrots, loves them raw.

That's not entirely irrational. I love cauli - I can happily eat it cooked or raw by itself. I will eat broccoli but it doesn't give me joy. Likewise I love raw carrot but can take or leave it when cooked.

Generally think mine (14 and 11) are alright. although for lifelong vegetarians there are more vegetables on the proscribed list than I'm happy with. Given the choice, they'd each eat a bucket of plain cooked pasta every night but they'd end up with scurvy or rickets or something so we're not doing that.

I think there's two fronts to the battle - the first is ensuring they eat a healthy balanced diet. My weapon of choice here has always been the knife - chop things finely enough and they won't know or care what it is. They'll eat a surprising quantity of onion, mushroom and broccoli if it's not easily identifiable beneath the comforting shroud of a herby tomato sauce.

The second front is the risk of them embarrassing you and your wife when served food containing unfamiliar or proscribed ingredients by someone else. "URGH is that a piece of AUBERGINE!?!?" type of thing. This can be much harder to negotiate. I find a look of parental menace served alongside the dish to be an effective strategy, a clear "shut up and eat it or there's no XBox for a week" sort of glower.

Cooking something that's just for me and Mrs Tyred feels like a rare treat.

No kids, that is not aubergine it is eggplant worked as did Zucchini not Courgette.

@johndoh
My daughter says that cauliflower is "sick broccoli"! Kid logic rules.
But yeah, I fully get why crunchy raw vegetables would trump cooked, but that's also down to good old 'cuisson a l'anglaise'; the noble art of boiling veg until there's no goodness, texture or taste left. For what it's worth I've had some success with roasting and grilling too.

I’m not wasting decent steak on an unappreciative 9 yr old.

There’s been great upset in our house for not buying them steak when we have it from a very young age.

The One Where Cougar Outs Himself As A Bloody Weirdo:

I'm not a parent, but I was that kid. To an extent I still am. So here's a view from the other side, from what I can remember.

My mum once told me that as soon as I was old enough to learn to say "no" I did, when I was little I could count the number of things I would eat on the fingers of one hand (well, maybe a slight exaggeration but not far off). I've had a love / hate relationship with food all my life.

As regular readers will know I've been vegetarian for 30 years, right back at the start this decision was at least in part just an excuse to say "no" as an adult, but it turned out that it actually fixed a good deal of the problem for me. I've always found the concept of eating meat to be revolting, as a kid I'd eat things like oxtail soup so long as it was sieved to get all the bits out and laced with so much white pepper that it was unrecognisable, so deciding not to do so actually removed a lot of pressure.

It's hard now to put my finger on exactly what the problem was, aside from the 'meat' issue. Smell was (and is) a primary issue, if I didn't like the smell of something then there was no way in hell I was putting it in my mouth. I've never eaten things like fish, fried eggs, bacon, because to me they stink to the point of making me want to gag.

Texture was another problem. I've only started eating peas in the last couple of years because I hated the 'feel' of them in my mouth. I can eat them now if they're in something (like say a curry) so long as I don't think about it too much and just swallow them straight down.

Fear of the unknown probably played a part too. Like, I didn't know whether I'll like something or not, so I wouldn't try just in case I didn't like it. Being able to eat something without knowing exactly what was in it took me decades to even start to deal with. I wonder whether this is tied into the suggestion others have made around getting kids to help with the cooking process? Certainly I found it a lot easier* to start to open up my horizons when I was in full control of exactly what I was eating. These days I actually love cooking, back when I was living with someone permanently it became my "me" time where I could stick headphones on and potch about in the kitchen for half an hour.

There is also a definite psychological element here. Example, a few years ago I got some chilli bean soup or other from Pret. I carefully poured over the ingredients list first and everything was "safe," bought it and it was really good. Halfway through, something in the back of my brain went "nope" and I started to gag on it. I ended up throwing the rest of it away, I knew if I had another mouthful I'd be sick. I actually said to my partner at the time, "this is bloody ridiculous, there's nothing in here I don't like, it's absolutely delicious, and I can't eat it."

I genuinely believe that, for me at least, it's a form of phobia. Like, I don't consciously have a fear of heights. On holiday recently I went in one of those skyscrapers which has a sort of bay window on the top floor with a glass floor. I strode out onto it full of confidence knowing that it was perfectly safe, and as soon as I stepped out onto it my subconscious had other ideas and I was shaking like a shitting dog. My relationship with food isn't wholly dissimilar.

I'll have a think about what didn't help and what might have (though I can't be certain now), but that's probably another post.

(* - as in "really difficult" rather than "impossible," it's all relative)

Have posted previously on this topic and still in a painful stage with sweajnr so whilst it's not great it's comforting to know it's not just us.....

"It may take a day or two, but hungry kids eat."

We tried this tactic of eat it or go hungry and ended up having some fun at the GP's when it was decided during a check-up that he was malnourished.  How to make a parent feel even worse...  Following that adventure our current tactic is that providing it isn't sugar calories in is the most important criteria followed by nutrition.

What didn't work:

"You'll eat it if you're hungry enough." Nope, I'd cheerfully have starved to death.

Force. That just left me traumatised and exacerbated the problem.

Stealth. My mum once gave me what I thought was bread and butter, then told me afterwards that it was Dairylea. I promptly threw it straight back up again.

The element of surprise. Even as an adult, shoving a spoon / forkful of food at my face going "here, try this!" is guaranteed to have me recoiling yards. It's involuntary, I can't help it.
This actually happened to me as recently as this weekend, my girlfriend was sitting next to me eating a yoghurt, I knew exactly what she was eating and I like yoghurt, but when she suddenly went "want to try some?" and thrust a loaded spoon at me I almost fell over the side of the couch.

What might have worked, or at least helped:

Variations on safe foods / very similar foods. Like, they like Heinz tomato soup, maybe try Batchelor's?

Marketing. I loved chips, but presented with a plate of mash I wouldn't eat it. If I'd been told it was "the inside of chips" that might have helped.

Removing the pressure. Like, leaving me to try something under my own steam on my own terms, rather than shoving something in front of me full of expectations and watching me like a hawk.

As an extension of that, letting them eat how they want. If they'll only eat fish fingers if dipped in custard, don't say no because it's "wrong." When I did try mashed potato I asked for ketchup and was refused; my thinking was that it was coarse and lumpy (texture thing again), dry and tasteless, and it needed something moist to offset that, though I didn't tell them this at the time. If I'd been allowed ketchup or, with the benefit of hindsight maybe gravy of a bit more milk / butter and salt in the mash I'd have been fine.

Not over-facing. A tablespoon of mash would've been way less intimidating than a bloody great plateful.

Capitalise on what they do like. Again, it took me years to realise but I like strong flavours and spice. I love Marmite, chilli, curry, but even when I was little I was a demon for things like pepper and HP Sauce, my folks didn't seem to notice.

Following on from that, my gran used to give me bread with everything, I'd routinely have four slices of Warburton's Toastie with whatever I was eating, sometimes followed by an entire canned sponge pudding to myself or some such. I realise now that this was just her way of getting some calories - any calories - into me.

Not cross-contaminating. Never mind eating fish, I wouldn't eat chips that had touched fish.

Something else just occurred to me that should have been in my previous post: I think psychologically I found eating to be an invasive process, certainly as a kid. Like, "you want me to put this stuff inside my body? What if I can't get it out again?" Maybe that might be a consideration, reassuring them that even if they don't like it it won't harm them and they'll poo it out again. (Yes, of course I knew how biology worked, but as you may have worked out by now this entire thing isn't exactly rational.) [EDIT: I've just thought, what might well have really helped me here is being allowed to taste something and spit it out rather than an expectation of having to swallow it.]

I hope some of this is useful. Yes, I'm a freak with food and eating out is a trauma.

Variations on safe foods / very similar foods.

Actually, I've just remembered, this was another turning point for me. As a student, the lad I was staying with at the time went "fancy some spaghetti?" I said sure, expecting a can of Heinz' finest, and was absolutely mortified when he cracked open some actual spaghetti and a jar of Ragu. I forced it down I think partly because it was just the right time and place for my brain to go "I'll give it a go" and give me a break, and partly just to save face.

Because that's the other thing with this affliction, it's utterly stupid and it embarrasses the shit out of me. A few years ago, I wouldn't have been able to bring myself to even write these posts (in fact I think the first time I 'came out' to anyone other than close friends was on a similar thread on STW a few years back). I hate hate hate being the centre of attention at mealtimes (probably another childhood PTSD) and people being "helpful" in reading menus at me are just... I appreciate it's well meaning but really, I can actually read, will you please just **** off and leave me alone to quietly die of embarrassment whilst I make "I'm not really hungry" excuses and order a bowl of onion rings?

As others have said, having them get hands on in the kitchen helps (there are cook books on for kids, e.g. Nancy McDougall's, Kids first ever cookbook, has a satay style recipe she calls sticky chicken which is worth a go (and has some suggestions like using sausages instead). I don't think its about getting them to respect the effort that has gone in, just have an interest in food. Then there are people making family friendly recipe books like Fay Ripley's, What's for Dinner; and Nadiya Hussain's Family Favourites. (Nadiya's quick food, and Jamies' 15 (actually30!) minute meals are probably also worth a look as at the least - whilst some beige crap is cooking you can make something nice).

Here are my parenting observations around food though:
1. If they aren't hungry they won't eat / eat quickly. If you associate a food with a bad experience it sticks.
2. If they don't eat quickly some of that stuff will get cold. We even "let the kids stuff cool down before serving". Some of it tastes terrible cold. If you associate a food with a bad experience it sticks.
3. We tend to overload their plates and expect them to leave what they don't want. This reinforces the idea that they didn't enjoy it (because they left loads).
4. We tend to underseason children's food because salt is bad (but seasoning is not just salt!). If you associate a food with a bad experience it sticks.
5. Things like onion I can get rejected if the lumps are too big. They will eat it finely chopped, cooked through stuff so its not the taste. At some point they have had some underdone big lumps of onion (probably at my mothers!). If you associate a food with a bad experience it sticks.

We all know that cliche, 'the first taste is with your eyes', well I think it is especially true for children. And if your eyes tell you this is just like the stuff they tried to force you to eat last week you reject it.

My children seem to have some sort of cutlery usage failure and so the more complex the eating the less they will like it. Give them a spread of food on the table where they can help themselves and more often than not mine will try it all!

BUT I actually think the biggest problem is my other half, because she will make a drama out of any refusal, and if you associate a food with a bad experience it sticks. Far better to shrug and either offer something else simple (my go to is toasted cheese*) if you think they tried but just didn't like it, or say thats fine go and do whatever you want if they just seem uninterested. Its not impossible they are well enough fed from Lunch etc to not be hungry - we worked out why the kids were never hungry when they came back from MIL's after school when we discovered she thought they needed snacks at 4pm!

*mine are now old enough that they get told to make themselves something like that (not every one of my kitchen experiments is a success).

That's probably the best post I've read on here so far.

We all know that cliche, ‘the first taste is with your eyes’, well I think it is especially true for children.

For me it was smell. A lot of food just stinks to me, I think "how can you possibly eat that?" The ubiquitous "yes but bacon" vegetarian-bashing trope makes me laugh, I think it smells absolutely revolting. Going past the fish market with my grandparents as a kid, I'd hold my breath until we'd passed.

Presentation was probably a distant second.

‘the first taste is with your eyes’, well I think it is especially true for children.

Once you've established whether a child looks tasty are you then advocating eating it?

Thanks for sharing Cougar, genuinely illuminating and given me some ideas.

Our 1 and 4 year olds will eat most things as long as it's not spicy. The oldest may decide she doesn't want something on the plate one day but will live it a few days later. Their nursery has a chef which helps as some nurseries and most schools have awful outsourced slop. Because we also eat all meals together as a family, obviously for some that's not possible but I think it helps.
I'm not smug though as they both still sleep in with us. Kids huh

Thanks for sharing Cougar, genuinely illuminating and given me some ideas.

Cool, I just hope it helps. That was hard. Let us know how you get on?

A couple of further thoughts after reading back my posts here.

I talked a few times about "safe" foods without really realising. Maybe explore what's "safe" with your kids and why, then pick at that?

And this, as an adult:

Removing the pressure. Like, leaving me to try something under my own steam on my own terms, rather than shoving something in front of me full of expectations and watching me like a hawk.

Relatively recently I had a close friend who wanted me to try guacamole. Rationally this is a fairly easy ask, it's mushed veg and garlic. But the way she went about it was high pressure, to a point of chasing me around the house with a spoon. No, not if my life depended on it. She went on about this for like two years.

I eventually tried the stuff, left alone in a kitchen one time there was some there, I thought "why not?" and funnily enough I rather liked it. But, I guess, it had to be my call and in private rather than with everyone watching.

Eh, maybe I'm just a control freak. (-:

BruceWee
Just out of interest, how many days would you realistically go before throwing in the towel?

We never made an issue out of food. Just took the line that if they didn't want to eat something then they weren't hungry, and didn't offer more food or substitutes. This was when they were very young, so when they got older if they wanted their pudding, they ate what went before.

Similarly we'd tell them when we were going to tidy their rooms and to leave everything they wanted to throw out on the floor.

This ☝️ Exactly how it works in this house and it works.

Cougar - you have ( IIRC) said before that you have strong aspie traits. Your reaction to food as a kid sounds quite aspie to me especially the stuff about textures

Mine are fussy.

Will eat spaghetti bol. With cheese.

Wont eat lasagne.

Will eat mac and cheese with side of broccoli etc.

Wont eat broccoli pasta bake.

Anything with "bits" creates fuss.

Meat will get eaten at grandmas and school etc but not at home unless reconstituted or breaded.

Lots of stand offs. Lots of spoon feeding.

Spoon fed my 5 year old cream of tomato soup last night (trying to introduce soups) has ate it before but now refusing.

Feel your pain.

So heres how last nights tea went.

Eldest was out at Guides, so it was just me and Mrs Trailwagger with littlest 6 yr old.

Made sweet potato wedges, green beans and salmon for the misses, fish cakes for me, and nuggets for little one (was going to be cod but hadn't realised we had none left in the freezer).

She tried the wedges but didn't like them (despite mashed sweet potato being her favourite thing). She tried some of mums salmon, didn't like it. She tried some of my fishcake, didn't like it. She tried a green bean, didn't like it. She ate the nuggets. As advised on here I didn't make a big deal of it, I was happy that she tried everything. On to tonight. Chicken Enchiladas, could be interesting.

Will eat spaghetti bol. With cheese.

Wont eat lasagne.

I'd perhaps work on this. It's not "lasagne," it's "spaghetti bol in layers." You could perhaps even make it with spaghetti rather than lasagne sheets to start with.

We never made an issue out of food. Just took the line that if they didn’t want to eat something then they weren’t hungry, and didn’t offer more food or substitutes.

So presumably you've not had your child go for three days without eating? Or taken your child to the doctor only to be told they're malnourished as another poster on this thread experienced?

I think you should accept the possibility that your kids aren't particularly picky eaters and for those of us who have genuinely picky eaters your advice isn't very useful and can actually be harmful.

I’d perhaps work on this. It’s not “lasagne,” it’s “spaghetti bol in layers.” You could perhaps even make it with spaghetti rather than lasagne sheets to start with.

We still have this argument with our girls (aged 10). It is the identical ragu but of course lasagne does have the addition of white sauce (which they like if we make it as a plain pasta with white sauce) but the texture does change quite a bit.

We did a beef stroganoff last night but made the mistake of adding sweet red pepper so a meal they normally will eat became a battle because it was different (even though we told them they could leave the red pepper if they didn't like it).

I’d perhaps work on this. It’s not “lasagne,” it’s “spaghetti bol in layers.”

You clearly do not have any kids.

BrudeWee
...I think you should accept the possibility that your kids aren’t particularly picky eaters and for those of us who have genuinely picky eaters your advice isn’t very useful and can actually be harmful.

My kids could manage a day to a day and a half, but hunger is a strong motivator. If an active kid goes 3 days without eating then it has a different problem.

Picky eating didn't exist when I was a kid, it's a First World problem.

Well as Cougar's come out on this thread, I'll join in.  I've suffered from being a picky eater all of my adult life.  And I mean suffered - it's embarrassing, it's socially limiting, it's a great thing to beat yourself up about if you're in the least bit suffering with depression.  I posted on here about it and got some good advice:

https://singletrackmag.com/forum/topic/fixing-a-weird-relationship-with-food/

First off, the biggest relief for me was finding out that I wasn't alone with this.  In fact on a subsequent trip to South America I met another guy who used exactly the same language about "safe" food, but he was more open about it and would actually request special meals rather then trying to hide his struggle as I did.  I'd managed to make a bit of progress by then so could share some of that but I've got no idea if he ever did anything about it.

For me it seems to go back to childhood standoffs over meals - parents trying to sneak stuff in (eg. putting baked beans in stew), being forced to sit over a cold plate until one of us gave in.  That developed into me asking "what's for tea" and saying "can I not have XYZ", then using that as a way to take control and protect myself from those unpleasant situations.  Then into cooking - I'd only cook with stuff I knew and would modify recipes to cut out anything else so I stayed in control again.  That protection method got reinforced until it was so deep in me that I couldn't even recognise it.   The therapy linked in my original thread helped me face that as an adult and adopt a more rational approach to food and I believe the same guy offers something for youngsters too.

I'm still nowhere near a 'normal' eater.  I still have a long list of "unsafe" food and despite making a bit of progress here and there my normal restaurant experience is to go through the menu crossing off anything that seems unsafe (does it mention tomatoes? or peppers?   a bed of cabbage?) and that hopefully leaves me with something I can eat.  I'll occasionally get days where I feel like I can push the boundaries in exactly the same way that one day you'll be riding along and just ride that line you've always avoided before.  It feels natural and unforced, and you accept the consequences.  In either case having a crowd of people egging you on to "just try it" and watching your every move will make you less and less likely to give it a go.

So to all of those with kids - yes it's a phase that most kids go through,  With any luck they'll grow out of it.  But please do all you can to stop them making it an issue that they'll carry with them for years.

If an active kid goes 3 days without eating then it has a different problem.

Such as?

Picky eating didn’t exist when I was a kid, it’s a First World problem.

I think you'll find it did.

It's true that in the First World we eat a far more varied range of foods. In Third World countries the children aren't expected to eat anything like the range of flavours, colours, and textures we expect our kids to eat.

Picky eating didn’t exist when I was a kid, it’s a First World problem.

There are descriptions of serious eating disorders throughout history. The first "modern" documented account of anoerxia nervosa was in the 18th Century. I think what you meant was:

Picky eating didn’t exist in my limited experience when I was a kid, it’s a First World problem.

Haven't read everything here but here's my experience. I know we've been "lucky" in that our daughter (4 - and a half!!) eats very well. Veggies no problem - she's the one kid at nursery who asks for and eats sprouts. Never really had a problem, but sometimes she says "I don't like that!" before she's even touched it or seen it. IGNORE that. Put it on the table and say something like "We just want you try it" (make that a rule) and if they try it and don't like it, fine. But leave it on the plate and don't make a fuss. 9/10 times with any complaints, there's an empty plate after 10 minutes (this happened last night with cauliflower).
Again, we might just be very lucky, but don't give in to complaints of not liking something straight away.
Eat the same as your kid. If there's spice or controversial additions to the dish, add them at the end after you've taken out the kid's portion. Then you're eating the same as far as they're concerned.
Make something fun out if it, e.g. rice with beans / lentil / veggies in it is "treasure rice".

All that said, I've seen some horror shows of kids not eating and it's seemingly nobody's fault. It's just unnecessary to give in to complaining a lot of the time (without wanting to sound *too* sanctimonious).