You don't need to be an 'investor' to invest in Singletrack: 6 days left: 95% of target - Find out more
[img] 
?w=560[/img]
Yes lets do what ISIS does with beheaded westerners
That will show them the moral truth of our way of life 😕
Glorifying the death of your enemy is the issue here and both sides think they are justified in doing it
Yes lets do what ISIS does with beheaded westernersThat will show them the moral truth of our way of life
Glorifying the death of your enemy is the issue here and both sides think they are justified in doing it
spot on there JY. this vile piece of shit has had his 15 minutes. if he is now dead lets leave it at that.
No problem with them doing it, they just need to stop gloating. same when we took out the UK resident, all the uproar just because they though it a good idea to tell everyone.
Carry on, but FFS keep it quiet!
Good riddance, pardon my language, but f@£k him. A sick psychopath who delights in torture and murder.
Jihadi Gone.
As Jeremy Corbyn would say:
Anyone else think there's no need, or perhaps no good in reporting this (or making it a big news story) ?
Extra judicial killing of a British citizen, probably collateral damage...blah blah blah.
It's not hard to imagine IS will soon have a video out showing the civilians that were killed in the strike (whether true or not) and it'll probably just create a vacuum or an opportunity for someone else in their organisation to step up and show how depraved he is.
Are there any civilians left in the Godforsaken desert that ISIS have captured? There's been four years of drought in Syria and most farmers gave up and went to the cities or walked to Europe a long time ago.
It would have been better if he had been captured and brought to justice. Broadmoor would seem to have been the appropriate place for him to spend the rest of his life.
Jihadi Paul, George and Ringo must be shaking in their shoes...
Capture and trial would've probably been better, but I suppose it's a war and wars need propaganda to remind us why we are involved
Where did "Jihadi John" come from in the first place? Name not actually John. Why did we end up glorifying this scumbag, giving him a rockstar nickname and making him more notorious?
These things can be pretty grey area but it seems like seizing him and bringing him to justice would have been hard and dangerous to do. OTOH, they say he wasn't actually involved in ISIS military operations or terrorist planning against the UK so the "self defence" line is a hard sell, likewise the "strike at the heart of islamic state"- he was an accomplished murderer but that seems to be about it, ISIS doesn't lack scumbags. Quite comfortable about him being dead tbh but not totally happy with the full package. Will it save a single life or will Jihadi Jimbob just take over?
Ninfan just can't help himself, it's a shame.
According to wiki
Emwazi was given the nickname "John" by a group of his hostages. The hostages said that he was part of a terrorist cell they called "The Beatles", and that he guarded Western hostages while handling communications with their families. The nickname refers to John Lennon of the Beatles, and the three other group members share the first names of the other Beatles. The cell members all had British accents.[20] The nicknames "Jihadi John", "Jailer John" and "John the Beatle" were created by the press.[4]
spot on there JY.
not quite - his victims were innocents whereas 'our' victim here was not.
Hopefully he was in a car full of IS members. Nifan 😀
The UK has been tracking him for sometime, it's my view we got specific intelligence as to his location and the government tried to use that to get a Parliamentary vote to attack IS in Syria. When it was clear that may not happen we have co-ordinated the actual attack with the US.
He is indeed just one IS member but killing him is a major proganda victory against IS, add that to Russia's involvement which once it secures Aasad's position will turn towards IS and the Kurds recent victories in Iraq - all collectively putting massive actual and physiological pressure on IS. This is a long term war, we and the governments of the Middle East will be fighting them for many years to come.
It would have been better if he had been captured and brought to justice. Broadmoor would seem to have been the appropriate place for him to spend the rest of his life.
Nah, a waste of good money.
the big question for me is why now? i mean they could have got him at any time, given the claimed surveillance technology and intelligence.
how do we know he is dead for definite? did somebody on the ground go and confirm the kill? or have ISIS confirmed it?
if so have ISIS said "yeah you got him good and proper" just to get the west off its back over him?
we know how "reliably accurate" US drone strikes are...i'd be amazed if it was actually him they got...not to mention the countless number of civilians they more likely have struck.
tome it seems like they are trying to give his "claimed" demise some airtime and whip up some applause while they bury some more bad news elsewhere.
Agree with Junkyard
@gonzy, see my post. I think we wanted to target him but as that's not possible we've handed the intelligence over. It's also possible the specific location intelligence we only have now or we've been tracking go him and my tiring his communications to collect additional information on other senior IS figures
Remember the poppy thread and folk talking about the glorification of war?
No point second guessing the whys and hows. We'll probably never know.
Reading the language; I'd be very surprised if they hadn't got him. Good for them. Still no reason for it to be in the papers though.
He is indeed just one IS member but killing him is a major proganda victory against IS
and equally ISIS can come back and sey "here he is still alive....you missed"
its all propaganda from both sides and its a load of bollocks.
they didnt need to make this into a news item and give more publicity to him and ISIS.
i suspect they have brought it up and stuck it in the news to divert everyones attention from something else
they could have got him at any time, given the claimed surveillance technology and intelligence.
Maybe they decided to monitor and wait until they could get him with the minimum possible risk to innocent civilians?
how do we know he is dead for definite? did somebody on the ground go and confirm the kill? or have ISIS confirmed it?
S'funny, I recall the lefties (inc. Corbyn) making similar allegations about the death of Bin Laden
Taste, please, taste....
scotroutes - MemberRemember the poppy thread and folk talking about the glorification of war?
Do we think the drone had a poppy on the side of it?
[i]He is indeed just one IS member but killing him is a major proganda victory against IS[/i]
really?
we started the propoganda by giving him the name, glorified his activities, and then glorified his death, if there's any propaganda going on here, you seemed to have swallowed it whole.
Dunno, but do drones get kill markings?
we started the propoganda
What's this "we" business? The newspapers don't speak for me, do they for you?
I've got no problem with them wiping him out, he was/is a direct threat to UK citizens and therefore a legitimate target.
However, I agree it shouldn't be sensationalised, but if reporting it deters other UK citizens from travelling to Syria to get involved in this, then maybe it can be justified.
Jihad John Hellfire missile catching champ 2015
jambalaya - MemberHe is indeed just one IS member but killing him is a major proganda victory against IS,
I wonder. We gave him visibility and notoriety here; how much do ISIS, or ISIS supporters, or civilians in the area, care? Or even know? Was he a household name in Syria? And if he is, will it be a propaganda blow or a martyrdom?
It's a propaganda victory here, for sure. Not sure that's really very important.
his victims were innocents whereas 'our' victim here was not.
That's entirely a matter of perspective.
Northwind
I wonder. We gave him visibility and notoriety here; how much do ISIS, or ISIS supporters, or civilians in the area, care? Or even know? Was he a household name in Syria? And if he is, will it be a propaganda blow or a martyrdom?
I was listening to a podcast a few days ago wherein a former US Navy Seal was recounting his exploits in Afghanistan, notably looking for Bin Laden. He commented that they'd be asking people in Afghanistan if they knew where Bin Laden was, and the people replied "who is Bin Laden?".
Yes lets do what ISIS does with beheaded westerners
But its not the same at all - the people he killed were innocent civilians
I'm delighted if hes dead, disgusting scum. Hope he rots and this is some small comfort to the families of those he killed.
scotroutes - MemberDunno, but do drones get kill markings?
I hope so, don't want them to start off annoyed when they become self-aware!
how do we know he is dead for definite? did somebody on the ground go and confirm the kill?
Are you volunteering?
The reports I've seen haven't claimed certainty anyway. If he is dead that makes the world a slightly better place. IMO of course.
I'm sure a few psychiatrists would have been interested in interviewing him in prison, to get an understanding of the levels of intellectual and sexual frustration amongst Muslim youth that leads them to extremism.
That's entirely a matter of perspective.
ok, who amongst the journalists and aid workers that he beheaded wasn't ?
its all propaganda from both sides and its a load of bollocks.
I think that about covers it. It all seems murky and odd. The media highlights a number of UK individuals who appear in glossy ISIS propoganda. They are then killed without any questions being asked.
globaltiI'm sure a few psychiatrists would have been interested in interviewing him in prison, to get an understanding of the levels of intellectual and sexual frustration amongst Muslim youth that leads them to extremism.
Why would they need to bother when you've got it sussed. I always wondered how people get radicalised, now I know it's their inability to have a tommy tank. Thanks.
copa - Memberits all propaganda from both sides and its a load of bollocks.
I think that about covers it. It all seems murky and odd. The media highlights a number of UK individuals who appear in glossy ISIS propoganda. They are then killed without any questions being asked.
And in so doing they create Jihadi Billy Bob, or Jihadi Pierre, or whatever.
He is indeed just one IS member but killing him is a major proganda victory against IS
Huzzah.
Are you volunteering?
sorry. bit busy this weekend....need to service the bike, change wheels over, change shock over....and wash my hair!
Alligators in the sewers,i love m&m's.
spot on there JY.
not quite - his victims were innocents whereas 'our' victim here was not.
i was agreeing with Junkyards assertion that glorifying the death of your enemy is wrong. ISIS do it and use it for propaganda and now the west is doing it for the same reason. whether you cut their heads off, blow them up, shoot them or stab them with a pointy stick....its all irrelevant. it doesnt need to be sensationalised and paraded as some form of victory.
we are not disputing that Jihadi John was a vile piece of shit. he is a murderer plain and simple but glorifying his death will serve no purpose. if anything ISIS will prbably use his death to their advantage by trying to now portray him as some sort of martyr and that will only encourage more to take up his mantle.
ok, who amongst the journalists and aid workers that he beheaded wasn't ?
If you're asking me, they were all innocent. If you ask the people who did it, they would say none of them. Perspective, see.
[quote=globalti opined]I'm sure a few psychiatrists would have been interested in interviewing him in prison, to get an understanding of the levels of intellectual and sexual frustration amongst Muslim youth that leads them to extremism.
More insights like that ought to bring about world peace
Just the same as the disrespect they have for us.
And Gonzy nails it Jihadi john - why did we give him a name ?- glorified and revelled in the death of his mortal enemy who he had no respect for and de humanised. THis threads has aspects of the same but just us to them. Both sides, of course, think they are correct and have reasons.
killing him is a major proganda victory against IS,
In what sense is it a propaganda* victory for us - we just killed him do you really think Jihadis everywhere have just given up the fight and embraced western values? IS suddenly looks like a bad idea after westerners just made another martyr? In what way have we persuaded folk IS is bad by this act?
What we have done is get revenge.
meaning
pr?p???and?/
noun
1.
information, especially of a biased or misleading nature, used to promote a political cause or point of view.
What's with all the hating? "Gordon is a Moron" might not be a masterpiece, but a drone strike seems excessive.
More good news, I see. The Peshmirga have re-taken Sinja.
I think the message is clear. "We will find you, target you and completely *** you up".
Excellent.
So now all the resources men and time that IS were putting in to keep this man alive and hidden away are now freed to be employed in active warfare.
If he wasn't part of IS strategy planning and wasn't able to move freely to act as a recruiting agent then killing him may well achieve no more than putting more IS in to the field.
Far better to wound your enemy than kill him, It takes a lot more resources out of their front line and to all intents and purposes he was wounded.
... but it brings them back into the "front line" where they can be slaughtered in greater numbers...
More dead people on either side then till one side runs out of people to die, haven't we tried that one before
One side wants to fight to rid the planet of an infestation of degenerated scum and the other side want to be "martyrs".
Everybody happy, then.
PS: In the meantime, beginning a process of cosying up, Putin is still maneuvering to make a ground commitment uncriticised by "The West".
Probably with full strength, I would imagine.
I think the message is clear. "We will find you, target you and completely *** you up".
Have you any idea what an idiot that comment makes you look? Were you beating your chest after you typed that? You do realise that this is real life and not a game of football don't you?
[url= http://newsthump.com/2015/11/13/jihadi-john-left-hugely-disappointed-by-quality-of-virgins/ ]jihadi-john-left-hugely-disappointed-by-quality-of-virgins[/url]
There once was a fellow now dead
With strange habits it is said
Asked "why are you here?"
He said I'm feeling quite queer
but this isn't how I normally give head.
You do realise that this is real life and not a game of football don't you?
Calm down, dear.
Yes it's real life. Yes, I think that's the message. No beating of chest, just a simple indication of what your fate will be if you go round videoing yourself cutting people's heads off with knife thinking that you are protected by god and invulnerable.
Simples.
Why now does seem pertinent... at the same time as the Kurds/Yazidi's have success, Iraq is pushing forward and things in Syria aren't going so well for IS/Daesh this seems to be some propaganda aimed at demoralisation.
Next is to heavily prosecute some of those idiots buying illegal antiquities and funding IS/Daesh destruction of ancient sites.
After all Winter is Coming and an army needs money/food to fight.
What Musashi called "Beating In the Edges".
ihadi-john-left-hugely-disappointed-by-quality-of-virgins
even worse when it turns out that he actually gets is
[img]
[/img]
JimJam :
I was listening to a podcast a few days ago wherein a former US Navy Seal was recounting his exploits in Afghanistan,
Joe Rogan podcast by any chance?, that episode was pretty good.
Joe Rogan podcast by any chance?, that episode was pretty good.
+1
His death was too quick. Shame we were unable to extract the bastard.
The sad thing is that Mr Jihadi was just a pathetic puppet used for PR purposes. The reason he was put in front of the camera was because he had an English accent. I'm not sure this chap was a command and control influence for IS.
By glorifying his death we're just as bad, and only adding to fear they're trying to create. This guy was nothing, and the next person with a western accent, and who's stupid enough, will be in front of the camera pronto.
He deserved to die. He also deserved to be actively ignored.
Reports say 4 people in the vehicle including one of the other "Beatles" also that a total of 14 airstrikes where launched over a 1 hour period in the centre of Raqqa. That sends a very strong signal to IS
And a great signal to the innocent bystanders probably killed. Poor bastards.
That sends a very strong signal to IS
I imagine this will have really changed their world view now that they know the U.S. disapproves of their activities.
😆
Mr Woppit - Member
You do realise that this is real life and not a game of football don't you?
Calm down, dear.Yes it's real life. Yes, I think that's the message. No beating of chest, just a simple indication of what your fate will be if you go round videoing yourself cutting people's heads off with knife thinking that you are protected by god and invulnerable.
Simples.
^^ this.
Sending 'signals' is pointless, they will not change, they will not stop. They all must be killed before they achieve the unthinkable.
As a soldier, I'm all for wiping these scumbags off the face of the earth. But this bothers me, on the battlefield we're not supposed to exploit enemy dead. It's against the rules of war, law of armed conflict and general decency.
This is the same in my opinion. It should have just been a very simple press release to confirm that a high value target involved in the murder of multinational civilians has been targeted and prosecuted successfully.
Capture and trial would've probably been better,
Kimbers you are obviously a friend of terrorists.
Actually I've since learned he was an SClub7 fan, if Cameron had explained that in his statement outside number 10 with his special victory over the terrorists portable lectern, I think a lot more people wouldve understood the necessity of this assassination
Kimbers. I like it. I also heard he was a big fan of Katie Hopkins and Piers Morgan. Nuff said.
Well said moose. No need for this....very poor
we are not disputing that Jihadi John was a vile piece of shit. he is a murderer plain and simple but glorifying his death will serve no purpose.
How do we know he killed anyone? It seems to be based purely on what the intelligence services say. Or is there some other reason for such certainty?
As a friend of John Cantlie's family I really hope this does not end poorly for him.
+1 Moose, well said.
I am not bothered in the least that he is dead, it does seem a bit grasping at straws to me though, everyone admits that he was a no one in the hierarchy of IS though so this almost looks like a "We need good news" strike, hence all the media attention.
Reading between the lines, we're making bugger all progress.
And after the fiasco of the US claiming that they had killed the same high value target three times in Libya this year i do wonder, how will we ever know.
I wonder if a woman flew the weapon?