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My 5 series touring (PCP) is going back sometime between now and December. BMW are increasingly desperate for me to buy something else from them. COVID-19 has changed lots for me - far less travelling (was doing 20k PA) and with the kids either at Uni or driving themselves, need for a 'big' car has gone.
We're going to run with one car for me and my better half. She currently has a Fabia and doesn't want anything much bigger. Tricky set of requirements then
- Hybrid preferred - so much of our (rural) mileage is 6 miles to town or 12 miles to bigger town 🙂 So I like Plug-in options with 30+ mile range.
- Estate/Hatch. Probably hatch so I can get a bike in (wheel off) and a labrador. But not at the same time!
- Not much bigger than a Fabia. So Golf sized has been accepted as the baseline.
- Not much else, if I was still driving lots I'd be looking at auto cruise control etc but I really can't see me going back to it.
I quite liked the BMW 1 series but no Hybrid. The X1 is (apparently) too big and ugly. I've been looking at a Golf GTE (but hard to source) or something similar. Expect 10k miles a year max and we'll do a 4 year deal this time.
Any thoughts? I've been doing some research and nothing has really stood out. BMW have a lightly used 330E saloon which was great to drive but fails to meet any of my requirements This didn't stop them trying extremely hard to sell it to me 😉
Unimog.
You know it makes sense.
New Jazz Hybrid?
Not cheap, but they look excellent. Crazy amount of space inside.
Unimog.
I know it makes sense. Carol (my long suffering wife) may argue - with some justification that this fails to meet requirement#1. Oh and #2 as well 🙂
Oooh Rusty, that's a good shout. We had a Jazz for 8 years and abused the heck out of it and it WOULD NOT DIE. Right I'll go look at one of those.
The inlaws have just got a Corolla hybrid, which is a lovely looking thing. Theirs isn't a plug in though.
When I was looking at hire cars last year the Merc A-class was one the cheapest in the "cars I'd actually want to own" category. Seems they do a hybrid too.
If you're just handing it back after the lease period expires, PCH is probably cheaper than PCP. The whole point of PCP is to pay more of it off so that it's cheaper for you to buy at the end. PCH doesn't officially give you a purchase option but the last one I handed back asked me if I wanted to buy it before it went to auction.
Is a mini clubman hybrid on the horizon?
Thinking the same we and we are thinking a Volvo XC40 recharge. Slightly bigger comfy hatch SUV style with good hybrid Tech and a bit more upmarket that some.
Merc A-class was one the cheapest in the “cars I’d actually want to own” category.
Never had a Merc. But that does look like it would meet requirements. Cheaper than a Golf as well. Which I can't get my head round!
Is a mini clubman hybrid on the horizon?
Not on mine 🙂
@kryton57 - a friend has an xc40. It's a great car. But bigger than we need. I nearly bought an xc60 instead of my 5 series. Comfiest seats ever!
PCH is probably cheaper than PCP
I might even business lease it. As it's my company. Although based on number of miles I'm intending (not) to do, this might not make sense,
You might struggle to get a modern bike in a hatch with one wheel still on. There's no way I'd get my (admittedly large, 29er) FS in my (MK2) Focus with either wheel still on.
I see a few of thee new Corolla Hybrids around these parts and they look quite nice. Not too big, not too small, decent styling and look good with decent wheels.
They should take roof rack too for bikes.
The inlaws have just got a Corolla hybrid
We did look at those earlier. Same as the Jazz, self charging which is not ideal. But significant cheaper than plug ins.
Cheaper than a Golf as well. Which I can’t get my head round!
The probably overly-simplistic answer is, "prestige" marques tend to depreciate slower.
You might struggle to get a modern bike in a hatch with one wheel still on.
Worth considering as well, those batteries have to go somewhere. On the admittedly rare occasions I've looked at a hybrid, a good chunk of boot space was lost because of it.
The whole point of PCP is to pay more of it off so that it’s cheaper for you to buy at the end.
No it's not. Plenty now leave you with nothing at the end to keep payments down. Those that do do it to give you a deposit on your next PCP. The last thing they want you to do is buy it!
I might even business lease it.
Full electric then? No BIK at the moment so leases are cheap. Thought about the BMW i3s? I have one, you can fit a bike in and it's ace!
The space is definitely a concern - also for large dog! The majority of the time I need to transport a bike, it's using a towbar rack. The BMW was almost to nice inside to get dirty but I've been chucking dusty bikes in this summer.
It's that compromise between getting something that's big enough for me and small enough for Carol. I could just turn up with a clean bike and see how well it fits. Bonus is it's likely to upset the sales person 🙂
There is a hybrid coming for the 1 series but it's going to be stupid money based on the cost of the current non hybrid versions.
I guess the other question is: the significant extra cost of a PHEV versus the overall reduced MPG of a self charging one (like the Honda and Toyota mentioned above).
We both really like the idea of not burning fuel on short journeys, but overall I wonder what the real environmental difference is between the two over 4 years.
No it’s not. Plenty now leave you with nothing at the end to keep payments down. Those that do do it to give you a deposit on your next PCP. The last thing they want you to do is buy it!
Hence BMW offering me a monster 'trade up' for returning my 10,000 UNDER mileage 5 series. Honestly if they had a car I wanted, I'd buy it just to save the hassle.
Full electric then? No BIK at the moment so leases are cheap. Thought about the BMW i3s? I have one, you can fit a bike in and it’s ace
I'm soooo tempted. But I'm bad enough when I'm down to 1/4 of a tank of diesel! I just think the range anxiety would be a problem based on the UKs somewhat rubbish charging infrastructure...
The current Mercs are great - get an AMG Premium spec one and get a vehicular equivalent of a 68" widescreen telly for a dashboard...
They come complete with augmented reality sat nav 😂
They come complete with augmented reality sat nav
I now know what's been missing in my life 😉
The Hybrid Mercs don't get great reviews. The thought of test driving lots of cars fills me with no joy whatsoever. If I needed the space, I'd just buy my current car. But only because it means I'd only have to visit a showroom once...
Yeah my current car is up for renewal shortly so I have just ordered a new one on the back of it ticking all the boxes - I got to sit in one but didn't actually get to drive it.
And yes, one of the boxes was augmented reality satnav 😉
I could just turn up with a clean bike and see how well it fits. Bonus is it’s likely to upset the sales person
I did this with my former 120d, my Salesman had decided to have the day off and the receptionist overseeing the exercise was a bag of nerves.
Could you do full EV? TBH I thought my hybrid was a lot of faff and it was no better on mpg than a decent modern petrol when you worked it out.
Is the new VW EV appearing on lease lists yet?
https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/volkswagen/id3/352483/new-volkswagen-id3-2020-review-pictures
A mate has an i3, that's interesting. Not sure you'd get an MTB in the back though, although it is bigger inside than you'd think.
Golf GTE is pretty good, I liked mine. But if you do limited mileage and tend to hand back, I’d be looking at the Renault Zoe PCH deals at the moment. Yes, full electric but over 200 mile range means it should handle longer trips easily too.
That new VW EV has the best looking grille of any EV I have seen so far - many of them just look like the designer didn't know what to do now they don't need to consider engine cooling. Yes Tesla, I am looking at you.
Yack - they remind me of...
Could you do full EV?
Maybe for our next car. Not sure the ID3 will be here in time and I expect there will be some very long lead times.
I keep circling round the 'is PHEV just a transitional technology' and would it be better to bite the bullet and go full EV or save a bunch of cash and maybe take a 24 month lease on a petrol.
Can you discuss cars?
Hybrid preferred
Yes, you may.
The greenest thing you could do would be to buy your current car and run it for a few more years. I get that it is probably too big for your wife though.
Would they do you a good deal on the BMW 225xe Active Tourer Plug-in Hybrid? - looks like it fits the bill size wise.
The new Octavia comes with a PHEV option I believe.
Or Hyundai Ionic PHEV although that’s a bit long in the tooth
We’re going to have to get a new car in the next year or so to remain ulez compliant.
Ford are doing 0% interest on the PHEV kuga, which is getting good ish reviews.
If I’m honest, I would prefer a Tesla but a) don’t have a driveway and b)don’t have the money.
PHEV seems like it will work for us - wife’s commute is within range, and she can charge at work every couple of days.
Just need a test drive now...
Alex & PP, Unimog for weekdays but must be AMG black edition.
For weekends I suggest
I know it's a little modest but has that je ne sais quoi.
Unimog.
I know it makes sense. Carol (my long suffering wife) may argue – with some justification that this fails to meet requirement#1. Oh and #2 as well 🙂
Unimogs are compact*!
*Next to a Zetros.
Would they do you a good deal on the BMW 225xe Active Tourer Plug-in Hybrid? – looks like it fits the bill size wise.
We're going to look at one this weekend. I guess it depends on the deal. It's not my first choice but since the priorities are a car we can both drive, it might be the best compromise.
Ford are doing 0% interest on the PHEV kuga, which is getting good ish reviews.
It's a shed load of cash tho. I was surprised how expensive even the base models are. I guess we'll add it to the list.
The new Octavia comes with a PHEV option I believe
Might not pass the size test, but I've driven a few of those when my Yeti(s) were being serviced. Defo an option I hadn't thought of. I really like Skoda's, shame they don't do the Karoc with a PHEV yet. Still again blooming expensive.
A mate has an i3, that’s interesting. Not sure you’d get an MTB in the back though, although it is bigger inside than you’d think.
You can. 😉
BMW have been left behind in the past few years, not really keeping up with what people want. Too much focus on their big saloons.
Though saying that, their new 3 touring with the m340i engine looks incredible. Expensive though.
If you really want electric, you're shopping at the worst time imo. I think give it another 2-3 years and they'll be many more options out there. We're just on the cusp, but the only real players are few and far between.
Jag have a electric SUV that looks alright, but... it's a Jag. And electric. Not a combo I'd be keen on.
BMW have been left behind in the past few years, not really keeping up with what people want. Too much focus on their big saloons.
I tend to agree - their SUVs all look awful, especially the X1 and X2 (although they do seem to have just about got on top of the styling issues with the very latest models coming out).
I'm not a fan of the BMW X series. I liked my touring and I've driven the new 3 series and it's really nice. But the 330E touring is north of 40k. Nothing is that nice!
Popped into the Skoda dealer (where we've bought 3 cars so they seemed okay with me turning up a bit stinky after a ride 🙂 ). Fella there told me PHEV Octavia's are mid next year for UK delivery 🙁 Had a look around at a standard one and was impressed.
They offered to sell me a demonstrator and buy it back at at agreed price to tide me over between mine going back and the new ones being available. I'm thinking about that as an option.
Of everything I've looked at, that Octavia is probably the current best option.
I think the new one looks pretty decent. Mid next year for a PHEV though! I was considering me of those myself but not until next year. Wonder if it’s a rolling waiting list.
Apparently Skoda haven't told them yet! No pricing or anything. Just Q1 or Q2. They can't even order them apparently. I guess that engine is used in lots of different cars across their whole range.
Everything in the showroom looks pretty well sorted now. I did pine after a couple of 2nd hand Yeti's.
Quick update for anyone in a similar situation.
PHEV: the only thing I've found that's available, meets the 10% BIK rules and meets most of what we want is the Passat GTE. It's a lot of cash tho and some analysis suggests it's looking marginal in terms of running through the company. And it's only 6 inches shorter than my current car.
Other: As my 520 is way under mileage and in good condition I can give it back any time for zero cost (it has 3 payments to run). As I said before they REALLY want to keep me as a customer. The only non PHEV I'd consider is the 1 series. Drove the 118 m-sport today and it's fine and they'll do a monster deal on a new one but that got me thinking..
... if that deal is going to cost me £x, what else can I get. Before the whole PHEV idea I was going to buy a Skoda Korac. Having been through all this, that might be where I end up.
and it’s fine
I wouldn’t be buying car that I felt “fine” about. Maybe have some fun and go for one of those Orange Fiestas, there’s a thread on here somewhere... 😉
e-cargo bike.
Al, you really need to study your usage profile carefully before choosing the PHEV option. We looked at the Outlander PHEV several years ago but the vast majority of our trips were travelling to the south coast about 6 times a week, 28 miles each way. On a warm day, wind behind us we might just have made it one way on the battery (claimed 32 miles) which meant using fuel on the way back. Carting those batteries round reduced the fuel consumption to something like 30mpg. I got 60mpg out of my old Audi (before it failed its MOT last year) so it simply didn't make sense. I'd use the same amount of fossil fuels in the PHEV as I would the non-PHEV.
We sat and waited it out for the eGolf which we've now had 18 months and have found absolutely brilliant. Someone will be along shortly to say "the range on those is S**t" and comparatively it is but it meets our needs perfectly. We can easily do the south coast round trip and since lockdown we've been using it to drive stuff into C. London as Laura working from home. I've never charged it outside the home - I can't deal with the idea that I'm dependent on a publically available socket being a) available and b) working. We have a bigger car for the big journeys that has road tax (sorry VED) of £30 and does 60mpg.
I've looked at carting bikes inside the Golf - I'm sure it's doable but I took one look and couldn't be arsed.
So you might be better off with a small full electric vehicle for the local trips and keeping something bigger which is relatively emissions friendly for the larger ones. I mean it's not like you're short of parking 😉
Jag have a electric SUV that looks alright, but… it’s a Jag. And electric. Not a combo I’d be keen on.
And an SUV.
I wouldn’t be buying car that I felt “fine” about.
I'm really not bothered about it. It's a nice car but for that money there's probably something that suits us better.
e-cargo bike
At some point I'll get something like that. But it doesn't solve the problem of say driving to Preston. And I'm not sure we'd get two labradors on one 😉
you really need to study your usage profile carefully before choosing the PHEV option
It was that chat we had at BPW last year Nig that put me on this road. I think we'd be fine for most of our local journeys - prob hereford and back is the longest which is about 26 miles. I always had factored in 'half way charging' at a supermarket or something if necessary but I take your point about not being dependant on UK crappy infrastructure.
The problem I have is I've no idea about future usage. I know I won't be using the car as much for work (and I'd already started to take the train more anyway) but I'm not sure I can commit to fully electric.
Ideally a small-ish electric and a big-ish not very expensive thing would work. Except we're trying to get down to one car.
Maybe I'll just buy something cheap-ish for cash in November and see how things play out in the next 12 months.
If anyone comes back searching for a similar thread, I thought I'd post the result.
Ended up with the petrol Karoq. Decided we will go full electric when the lease expired or mid way if Skoda come up with a full electric we can trade for.
Nice choice. Im interested to know if you found there wasnt enough choice vs cost for mid sized electric?
This is the position we find ourselves in, in that if we wait a couple of years im pretty sure a decent priced small electric suv will be easier to buy.
Pretty much. The more I looked at PHEV, the more it felt like a transitional technology. It was a significantly higher cost to find out, so we decided we'd wait a couple of year to see what a) range of electric cars are on offer and b) if the UK infrastructure improves.
I'm probably less worried about b) as I don't think I'll be doing that many 300+ mile drives. Again tho, a couple of post COVID-19 years experience of work will help.
There's a chance we'll move house in 2-3 years as well and I expect we'll move from very rural to semi rural which might also change our driving habits.
Ok so yes exactly the same. We'll be doing outer London school runs during the next 3 years, so it feels sensible to a) wait or b) get the XC40 Recharge on pcp so we have options to change to full electric in 3 yrs.