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About a week ago I asked an electrician, a builder and a gas fitter to get in touch with someone regarding things that need doing and none of them have done so.
They haven't even made contact to arrange an appointment, let alone been and done anything. How many sodding times do I have to ask people to do things?
This is by no means the first time that building tradesmen have let us down and my opinion that a lot of building tradesmen in Britain are useless asshats is in no way lessened.
Utter, utter waste of space, the lot of them.
Well they obviously don't need your work and have plenty on, which suggests that they are not "useless twunts".
As above, they are probably busy working.
A simple call to make an appointment, having said that they would do so, would have been courteous and professional - something that is very uncommon in this country.
One is new to us, the other two have form for this.
How sodding hard is it to make a phone call, and why do I bloody well have to chase these morons all the time?
Don't suggest that we find someone else - they all seem to be the same.
As before - effing useless and unreliable. Just about sums up the building trades in this country.
Oh, and if you don't have the capacity to take on the work, don't bloody well say that you will do it in the first place.
Asshats.
One is new to us, the other two have form for this.
How many chances are you giving them.
Don't suggest that we find someone else - they all seem to be the same.
Well if you keep going back to the ones who don't show....
Are they one man bands? Try somewhere with a boss and someone to make the appointments.
the other two have form for this.
I'm sure the answer is obvious but I can't figure it out, why did you offer them work if they "have form for this" ?
I did just mention that the new one is turning out the same...
How many chances? Too bloody many it would seem.
Yes, one man bands. That could well be our mistake, but bigger companies seem to charge extremely large amounts of money.
All will be getting very snotty telephone calls today!
@ernie - because they're all the bloody same and it's 'better the devil you know'!
Are they one man bands? Try somewhere with a boss and someone to make the appointments.
The problem with somewhere with a boss and someone to make the appointments is that overheads start kicking in and with that comes higher prices.
People like one man bands because they're cheap. The problem with them is they've got no slack in the way a firm employing several people has. If the sole traders work overruns, as it often does, then everyone has to wait. Plus of course they can't afford to spend time without any work so the tendency is to take on more rather than less.
@ernie - but is it so very hard to call and explain if there is a delay? If I just turn up on site a week late I should expect my customer to make some fairly pithy comments at the very least...
Perhaps they don't find you to be a very approachable person ?
Do as Mike suggests and make an appointment with a reputable building firm which employs staff. Expect to pay them for their services though.
If you want to save money and be your own project manger then expect to have to chase people.
the common factor seems to be you/the job.
Is it small beans? are you being demanding? I had someone ask for written plans and a quote for job that would make £50 profit. they didnt get a return call.... why waste my time.
see above for the example, working for a small business the small jobs can kill you. All the profit is taken up by quoting and visiting and calling and putting off other work, then it's always more than they think and then they are never happy 🙂 (Consulting not building) If it's too small it will go onto the "when I get a chance pile". Unless you can find a good local who is working to keep themselves busy rather than making a living then you will struggle.
I read somewhere that tradesmen are the only [i]real men[/i] anyway - and you are merely a boy wearing your dads suit. On that basis, you should not expect them to lower themselves to your level. They are [i]sculpting the future[/i] FFS!
We tried to get a plumber-in at my OHs rented flat in the big london. We ended up going to Pimlico plumbers in the end, on the basis that they returned the call 😕 I begrudged paying through the nose for Pimlico - but once you factor in your time/stress/hassle, i recon they are actually cheaper.
It's not easy as a one man band to deal with customers. Out the door in the morning after sorting the kids out. Drive/cycle to job, set yourself up. Do work. Repeat.
I bearley get a minute to text never mind call someone.
Bloody annoying though when someone doesn't get back to you I know.
Try putting your jobs into ratedpeople.co.uk.
All will be getting very snotty telephone calls today!
That'll certainly encourage them to turn up.
Does seem to be one common denominator amongst this. I'd take a guess that the trade guys get work if they're still in business, so I wonder what the issue is.
The ones in the North are useless too
hth
Yes. The building trade. It does seem to be a sector where you can get away with this sort of behaviour. Any other job and you'd go out of business. Ernie makes a good point that if you are project managing then chasing is part of that job but it is still frustrating.Does seem to be one common denominator amongst this
We've been doing some works recently and I'd say about 1 in 10 get back to you when they say they will.
Drac, I think I have the answer to this one. 😉
Yes. The building trade.
No, try again.
Go on then, enlighten me. It can't be the OP because this happens to a lot of people so what is it?No, try again
There does seem to be something about the building trade that makes people think that normal expectations of returning calls and timekeeping don't apply to them. I say that on the back of experience with members of the family in the trade and having just completed having 2 houses refurbed in the last 2 years. It makes people stressed and resentful and I'm sure it's all eminently avoidable.
I'm spending today stuck waiting/hoping for the shed people to turn up.
Go on then, enlighten me. It can't be the OP because this happens to a lot of people so what is it?
Seems to happen every time with the OP, where I as I've never had an issue. Sometimes the client or job just aren't worth their time. Of course the OP could try calling them back but that must be too much of an effort.
Good thing we're in the EU so you can hire some easy Europeans. 😉
Try putting your jobs into ratedpeople.co.uk.
Yeah ok. After the app telling us it was contacting 1600 selected firms, we got a call from one who quoted nearly £4k to decorate the downstairs and upstairs hallway. Which I ended up doing myself at the cost of three Saturday's and £200 materials.
I know a Polish chap who lectures o on building at his local college - he brought two students with him for the summer to work on our old house... 😉
One of my riding buddies is a builder, he never returns calls when we are trying to arrange weekend rides !
He always turns up though !
How sodding hard is it to make a phone call, and why do I bloody well have to chase these morons all the time?
Does your attitude towards the horny handed serf come across when you do eventually speak to them ???
Seriously, how does one go about becoming a builder? I quite fancy some DIY but I have a hard time knowing which end of the nail is up. Is there a City and Guilds course or something I can take?
I predict this doesn't end well for the OP 😉
Plenty of that here in the East Midlands. A colleague of mine is having his £50k grand designs extension royally screwed over by teams of incompetent sub contractors.
Just noticed East Europeans not easy Europeans. Sorry
two different builds going on on my morning commute - one extension and one new driveway/garden redesign. Both are being handled in a way that makes me very glad they are not my houses, the driveway team are comical
On the other hand my neighbour is having an extension and the builder is excellent - good workmanship, everything tidy at the end of the day so as not to inconvenience other people in the road etc,
This fully and completely scientifically backs up my hunch that 2 thirds of tradesmen are cowboys
Hi all,
I've been reading all your comments with interest. My name is Becca and I work at a TV company called Little Gem.
We are looking for people who are currently having difficulty with their builders. Our expert might be able to help.
If you're interested in finding out more send me an email - rebeccemoss@littlegem.tv
Thanks!
On one hand I can see how a small business / one man band may not answer their phone during the day and also has problems with time waters / tyre kickers, but it is so frustrating to deal with their inability to return messages within a reasonable timeframe.
Dunno - is every one called Julian a boorish middleclass physically inept whinging machine?
Bit of a lottery really, but having worked for my fair share of "profesional" building companies I would say that they charge mcuh more and do not seem to be any better in general, though you do get to talk to someone.. rarely makes a difference.
as a one man band first thing I ask is are you in a hurry? if so I usually suggest they find someone else 😉
Sounds like you want the trades to be self organising TBH that's is what [u]Good[/u] Project Managers are for...
Like you say any outfit that can coordinate and manage multiple disciplines tend to cost more, but there comes a point at which that extra spend starts looking like it did have some value, typically that's when winter is imminent and your extension is just a bit of rain sodden stud work with an old tarp flapping around it...
Save time or save money? which would you prefer?
Same here in Scotland, I find it really hard to spend money with tradesmen, it is like you are asking them for a favour!
Our neighbour is having a simple extension, a garage on the side with a bedroom above. It took him months to find a builder and they have told him the build will take 9 months! They have been in for 2 months already and I reckon in that time they have only worked for 10 - 15 days.
I've tried to source tradesmen every which way - randomly out of the Yellow Pages, via ratedpeople.com, through personal recommendation, family members, whatever. I've tried all the variations, from what seem like large, established companies to one-man bands. It strikes me that finding decent ones is an expensive game of Russian roulette.
The good, as in capable of what I would consider to be normal, everyday levels of common courtesy and professionalism you might encounter in other walks of life, are far outnumbered by the bad. It seems that the primary requirements to set yourself up as a tradesman in this country are a white van and a brass neck.
Not returning calls, returning calls then not showing up, showing up to do an estimate then not providing a quote, showing up to do a job then going AWOL for a fortnight before completing the job, accepting a job, then saying they're too busy, their mate will do it, then the mate not showing up, coming up with all manner of cock and bull stories about vans not working, other vans not working, other [i]other [/i]vans being involved in a crash, all on the one day, turning up to fit stuff and not knowing how to fit it, reading the instructions with their lips moving while standing in front of me and charging me £70 an hour plus VAT for their valuable time and incomparable expertise... 👿 👿
If I was king for a day, I would have compulsory DIY classes at school along with maths and English to remove the mystique from a lot of these tasks and empower ordinary people to do them themselves and put a good portion of these lazy, boneheaded, venal shysters out of business.
And if you're one of the good ones whose quality of work and reputation has filled up your diary for the foreseeable, then a bit of honesty, even a text along the lines of "sorry mate too busy" would suffice when managing customer expectations. Don't just purport to offer a service then ignore people that your adverts have lured in.
I'm an electrician,I turn up for jobs 5 mins early, work tidily and professionally and try not to inconvenience any customers.
We're not all bad but there does seem to be a higher proportion of people that do the opposite in the trades.
I now work for the organisation that oversees the training of electrical apprentices and try to instill in them the need for professionalism and good communication.
It's not easy with whole classes of bored looking and seemingly indifferent 17 year olds though!
And to add to the list, doind a job then trying to charge way more than the quote.
I had a stove fitted a couple of years ago, told him my budget and siad that is my limit, if you can't do it for that then I won't get it done. He was happy, spent a couple of days getting the work done then phoned me that evening to tell me the price had gone up by 600 due to needing extra bend sections on the flue pipe. Never thought to mention it as the job was ongoing and apperently it is impossible to work out how many sections are needed until the work is underway!
We had a full and frank discussion.
My boss recently had a block wall builtat home. He bought all the materials, hired equipment then got 2 agency brickys from the company that supplies us with structural steelfabricators.
He kept on top of them, they did a great job, he gave them a cash bonus for finishing the job early.
If you can project manage, why pay someone else to do it
Gad exactly the same issue with getting part of my kitchen work done, had about 10 fitters/builders/carpenters around each for about 2 hours discussing it.
Only 3 bothered to quote, only 1 without chasing.
He got the business then fell of a roof... but arranged another guy he knew and trusted to do the work. We met, agreed, and he's done a fantastic job and will be getting some more work in the new year.
It is, like everything else, about who you know.
I predict this doesn't end well for the OP
I doubt he needs to worry about ending up under a patio.
My neighbour got a couple of quotes in to re-tile her roof. Unfortunately she chose the most inept bunch of idiots on the planet and they were kicked off the job after two weeks of sunbathing on the scaffolding.
We later discovered his nickname is Mr Buckets, because when he's finished a job, you need them!
The replacement crew, two blokes, undid the duff work and completed the whole job to a very high standard, in a week! There are good'uns out there, just got to find them.
@littlegem-
Great, just what the building industry needs, yet another 'expose' of cowboy builders.
Grand Designs has a lot to answer for in terms of unrealistic expectations in the mind of the client, who expects everything to be built in the edit, with little understanding of how the trades work.
Perhaps you should make a documentary about how these trades really work, the difficulties of supply and demand, the complexities of project management, and about how hard it is to keep up with all the ' extras' that clients ask for with little understanding of the impact on budget and build time.
But you probably wouldn't, as good building practice wouldnt make for good tv.
As a self-employed sparky, here's my persepective on this.
Person rings me. Can I do this job? Yes, but I cannot get round to see you for another week, but I can do the job in 3 weeks time when I have 5 days spare.
I go round, quote for them, get the job, book it in, then get a call saying its been put back a week. I've already told them that I only have that one week spare, but then it is my fault for letting them down.
If it was only my work on the job, then it wouldnt be a problem, once you involve other Trades, it gets far too complicated, and can be prone to over-runs.
I've got 3 local Builders who always use the same ancillary trades for their work. It runs like clockwork with all of them.
Getting 3 independents in, and hoping for them to work together can be rather problematic.
I used to do anything, but you learn to turn down work after a while, it just isnt worth doing some work. One chap texts me. I've told him to ring, as I rarely reply to texts. He then complains that he never gets a reply to his texts. If he rang up, he'd get an instant answer, but texts get repied to when I have a moment spare, which can be a week later.
To the OP, you want a small contractor who will supply the other trades. It is down to him to arange it all then.
Great, just what the building industry needs, yet another 'expose' of cowboy builders.
Someone should do an expose on how the qualifications to be a TV show researcher, essentially boil down to being able to use Google.