[Closed] I'm going to Scotland over Xmas and I have some questions

Deeside,maybe around the Braemar/Ballater area.

From my limited experience, I would expect anywhere further than half a mile from a town or car park will be quiet at that time of the year. It may well be very cold! Whenever I’ve done festive 500, I seldom see anyone. And that’s heading out from the edge of Edinburgh.

Sounds like she'll have hoot, does she really want to do what you want to do?

If she's not a walker Ben A'an is very doable, and you get a good sense of space at the top.

I didn't think it would be busy over the festive period but COVID has taught me to challenge all my assumptions! If a 500 is an option that would be great as it would simplify the planning if nothing else

Sounds like she’ll have hoot, does she really want to do what you want to do?

Wha?

If she’s not a walker Ben A’an is very doable, and you get a good sense of space at the top

She loves walking and has all the gear, that said I also don't want to risk going anywhere where a weather turn would cause us issues so something like that may be a good idea. Looks stunning for the relatively little effort

Apologies I’d I’m off the mark here, but

This is winter with a gf who doesn’t ride

That was my preferred option from the start,

she doesn’t board either

If I was to propose to my partner I’d be making sure we spent the entire holiday as a couple, not doing what I want to do. Staying in a lodge for a couple of nights in/near Aviemore would be my recommendation, the rest touring the Cairngorms in the van.

Schiehallion is a cracking walk on a blue sky frosty morning with good views or cycle around the south side of it with the downhill to Fortinghall , Aberfeldy or Kenmore/Loch Tay area plenty blown wood for your fire and wild parking areas but if the weather turns stay near St Andrews , good walks along the beach, Pilgrims way to ride your bike, trip down to Elie do the chain walk, skiing an hour and ten mins up at Glenshee , plenty of easy munroz to claim

Aye, what Paino said ^

Beinn Eighe is a really lovely walk and you can park in the small carpark at the start of the trail at Loch Maree. The walk isn't long or tough but you get in amongst some amazing mountains, with fabulous views all long the walk.

Your plan sounds just like something that I'd have done 10 years ago.
Which essentially confirms paino and Naebeer's viewpoints perfectly.

Go up to Scotland, nips off for a day boarding.
Take the bike. Squeeze in some biking.
But leave a couple of hours free to spend with her to pop the question

We'll be heading up and touring around at the same time....we both ski though, and I already got the proposal out of the way earlier in the summer!

Plenty of spots in Cairngorms etc to park up responsibly, there's an aire style place on Cairngorm ski car park now, expensive at 15 quid given that the 'facilities' aren't great, epic views though and you can empty toilet cassette there etc.

I'm lead believe that you just need to keep an eye on forecasts/Facebook pages and make a decision on the day for skiing in Scotland. Plenty of nice places to eat etc in Aviemore.

Hammocks can be very limiting as well - you need trees but not plantation?

Chains unlikely to be needed unless you must go down tiny roads high up

At this time of year there's no point trying to plan trips that are weather dependant. The only people sitting down today and picking which ski centre to go to on the 29th December, or which mountain to climb on the 28th or wondering if a trail will be muddy on the 27th are people who have to be in a particular place on a particular day and will go pretty much regardless of the weather. If you want to do it with a degree of comfort all you can really do it head up and then plan a couple of days ahead.

Keep in mind its only daylight for about 7-8 hrs a day, its quite likely to be miserable weather and your snow chains will perhaps get you out of a tricky car park but likely land you either in a queue of other traffic that can't move or the major routes will just have snow gates closed. I'm not trying to piss on your chips but camper vans with a dodgy diesel heater, hammocks in sub zero temperatures, and outdoor pursuits she's not interested in are not making for the best chances of her saying yes!

AFAIK the lifts aren't running at Cairngorm, the train is knackered. Glencoe is the best spot for riding in my opinion, small but steep and loads of fun terrain. If the GF is not a skier / snowboarder I would avoid though, the lodge burnt down 2 winters ago and they've not rebuilt it yet. So she'll be sitting in the van in the carpark for 4 or 5 hours. Glenshee is also worth a shout when they have most of the terrain open. There is a lodge / cafe there but I'd probably not leave anyone there for more than an hour. Lecht is "a snowy hill" in the words of my BIL. Nevis good but I haven't been there in years. Though a day in Fort William is probably more enticing for the GF than any of the other options, which are basically car parks in the middle of nowhere with lifts going up the hill.

Also, hammocks outside? It's baltic at the minute!

Hammocks can be very limiting as well

If I was proposing to an Italian girlfriend I'd want to have somewhere with a big comfy bed to spend the night following the proposal!

If I was to propose to my partner I’d be making sure we spent the entire holiday as a couple, not doing what I want to do. Staying in a lodge for a couple of nights in/near Aviemore would be my recommendation, the rest touring the Cairngorms in the van.

Yeah thanks for all the relationship advice guys, luckily I'm taking my partner away and not yours!

Out of 10 days I'll be doing 2-3 mornings of riding/boarding while she lays in bed. In fact it'll probably be just the one morning of boarding as I'm not sure I'll have the room for the bike & kit along with 10 days worth of cold weather gear. That's what we do on all our van trips, and she prefers as it means she can chill out and read a book while I burn off some steam. I just need to park her up somewhere nice

As for all the useful advice, thankyou! schiehallion and beinn eighe look amazing. Although all those big hills look amazing to someone from as far down south as me 🙂

If you are heading into the hills keep an eye on this forecast:

https://www.mwis.org.uk/

Glencoe is the best spot for riding in my opinion

No way is Glencoe better than Cairngorms for riding.

schiehallion and beinn eighe look amazing

Controversial, I know, but Schiehallion is possibly the most disappointing Munro I've done. It's an amazing looking mountain on it's Northern aspect, but the path up from the south is just a very easy meander, with a bit of a boulder field.

That link is great, thanks beamers! I will be erring very much on the side of caution anyway but the more informed the better

Also, would be great if you would all stop assuming that because my partner is a girl she is unable to withstand any kind of walking/cold/van sleeping/hammock camping. She just doesn't know how to ride a bike or snowboard is all, and is more excited than me about going up there as she always hears me talking about how beautiful it is

@Nobeerinthefridge the Coe does have a functioning lift system, which is a plus...

Aye, but you'll struggle to get a bike anywhere near a track given how cold it's been! Long term weather models look as if it's going to get colder too.

If you're hoping to ride (the bike) have a wee look at this - Storm damage
Glencoe have a temporary cafe and good campervan facilities.
All ski area can be awesome or crap on any given day so stay flexible.

ah I was referring to snowboarding as 'riding.' (never call it boarding).

Beinn Eighe is a really lovely walk and you can park in the small carpark at the start of the trail at Loch Maree. The walk isn’t long or tough but you get in amongst some amazing mountains, with fabulous views all long the walk.

That's a great place to propose... Thankfully she also agreed.

ah I was referring to snowboarding as ‘riding.’ (never call it boarding).

I also usually do this but call it boarding on a mountainbiking forum to avoid these misunderstandings. In the US they universally call snowboarding riding as they call mountainbiking biking instead of riding anyway. At least where I've been anyway

Sounds like Bein Eighe is the best candidate for the important question then!

Chains unlikely to be needed unless you must go down tiny roads high up

This. Also the 'slack' will be an issue, you may need to get creative with some dyneema. At the very least try them on before you need them

Also remember it will be dark. For a long time. 4 til 8 minimum Inverness, on a dreich day much longer

I once fell asleep on the summit of Schiehallion on a hot day. No shirt on so when I woke up I looked like a lobster from the front and a pint of milk from the back. I don't think you'll have that problem at christmas.
Otherwise I'd say book somewhere for a meal on the day of your proposal, keep an eye on the weather reports and the covid reports. Good luck to you and enjoy your trip.

Have a great time btw, hope you get nice conditions and a lovely spot for the moment mate.

I didn’t think it would be busy over the festive period

Are you 'aving a laugh?

Now that the riding/ riding confusion has been sorted, just leaves two things

When people are referring to Beinn Eighe, I think/expect they are referring to Coire Vekerriker ( excuse spelling) not the actual summit. The coire and triple buttress and Loch are amazing. Don't go up Bein Eighe by mistake thinking that's what people are suggesting.
https://www.walkhighlands.co.uk/torridon/coire-mhic-fhearchair.shtml

Also, WRT to hammocks, it's got nothing to do with gender or your missus neshness or not. It's just people pointing out that a hammock is a very cold way to sleep and not to be recommended lightly at that time of year in that location

I happily slept in a snow hole at Cairngorm car park once.

I also had a 5 and a 7 year old kid sleeping in the roof of the campervan at minus 5.5c (-9c outside)

Both were wonderful, but we had the best 5 season Rab bags that money can buy and didn't have the side of a hammock compressing the insulation.

I wouldn't sleep in a hammock at minus 9 at CG carpark.

YMMV

I'd be looking for a place with a good swimming pool/sauna great to warm up if your feeling cold so if the ferry is running get over to Arran, walk up Goatfell cracking wee trip then use the facilities at the hotel just down the road for a swim /sauna and a meal, Arran aromatics are included when you shower
If the weather turns windy your return ferry might say no

We drove to Braemar one Easter. That A road from the South goes over a proper mountain pass (Cairnwell Pass, highest main road in Britain at 670m) with very long stakes at the roadside so I imagine it could very well be properly snowy up there. And there's a signal for cold weather on the way over Christmas in the long forecast.

When people are referring to Beinn Eighe, I think/expect they are referring to Coire Vekerriker ( excuse spelling) not the actual summit. The coire and triple buttress and Loch are amazing. Don’t go up Bein Eighe by mistake thinking that’s what people are suggesting.

Thanks for that! and RE the hammocks we sleep in one at least once a month all year round so have the underblankets, sleeping mats etc to deal with coldness. The first time I did a winter hammock camp assuming my sleeping bag alone would keep me warm I did not have a good night 🙂

Arran is something we would like to see along with Skye, although ferry troubles are something we could do without, living on a small island ourselves 🙂

Deeside,maybe around the Braemar/Ballater area

Now going to Ballater might have me in trouble. Heartbreak ridge is possibly my favourite trail ever and I'd be disappearing off to do that all day, resulting in an unhappy gf and possibly being in trouble with Forestry as I understand it is probably closed along with Mastermind and everything else around there

Controversial, I know, but Schiehallion is possibly the most disappointing Munro I’ve done. It’s an amazing looking mountain on it’s Northern aspect, but the path up from the south is just a very easy meander, with a bit of a boulder field.

You don't walk up a hill to look at the path, you walk up for the view - and it's a stunner, all the way to the Buachaille.

As others have said, there's a lot of darkness (currently 4pm to 8pm, and give it another couple of weeks and it'll be darker for longer. Long time to sit in a van.

Controversial, I know, but Schiehallion is possibly the most disappointing Munro I’ve done. It’s an amazing looking mountain on it’s Northern aspect, but the path up from the south is just a very easy meander, with a bit of a boulder field.

And a zillion false summits.  Great snow slide on a bivvy bag down the northern side tho IIRC

But have you not done the Drumochter munros?  IIRC described in the book as dull mountains with substandard views.  Done them twice in winter in zero visibility!.  Seriously dull.  the second time I nearly spat the dummy but the chap I was with was an avid bagger so I had to do them with him to stop him wandering off on his own

As others have said, there’s a lot of darkness (currently 4pm to 8pm, and give it another couple of weeks and it’ll be darker for longer. Long time to sit in a van.

This is a valid point and something we've considered. It's only half hour more darkness than we'd get at home, and we'd be sat in a house anyway so we've decided we don't care. We like reading and chatting and listening to music so it'll be fine. Add in a couple nighttime walks and a couple nights parked outside a pub/restaurant and it'll not be more than a couple evening where we actually sit in the van all eve. And as we're not booking or committing to anything if we get bored we'll just drive home!

9:30 before the sun rose over the mountains this morning.

Will be nice to see the sun rise without having to be up at the crack of dawn then!

Absolutely! Same (opposite) for sunset too.

But have you not done the Drumochter munros?

Yes, I have, it's all about expectation though. Ditto the cairnwell ones, if you don't expect much, you won't be disappointed.

I'd keep as many options open as possible to make the most of whatever the weather chucks at you. There can be dramatic West/East coast variations depending on wind direction. There can be pockets of good weather to be found when wet in the hills. Spectacular sunrises from the East Neuk of Fife at this time of year. But you wouldn't chose to be here in an Easterly.

Bin the camping. It's winter. 😆 It's not even that it's cold it's more the 17 hours of darkness that's a shift and a half. Campings great if you are getting views and can chill outside. Not so much if you can't! You don't get views at night!

This is a nice spot. Brilliant beach. THe Balintore Inn lets people park on the verge between the pub and the sea.

http://www.balintoreinn.com/

https://goo.gl/maps/3bhYLggRfJK37Mf88

In the winter in the right conditions the nearby Tarbet NEss lighthouse could be a decent spotto see the northern lights. Pretty far north and unobstructed horizon with no nearby light polution.

If you are in that area a visit to Chanory Point to see the dolphins is an idea. Been there twice and seen them both times.

https://www.moraydolphins.co.uk/chanonry-point.html

I camped at Tarbet Ness lighthouse and had dolphins swim past, just a few metres away, in the morning when I was packing up.

Just for a laugh, glen Lyon

4 weeks later

Actually has some good over night places and Ben lawyers is a decent walk.

Also, I plan on proposing to the gf up there, preferably up the top of a mountain/hill, somewhere with a spectacular view we’ll remember. Any suggestions?

You could take her up The Whangie.

Bear in mind the Kingshouse is a bawhair from the Glencoe car park, seems probable it's a nicer place to chill.

Anyway, hope it's a good trip!

You could take her up The Whangie.

Make sure you spend time on the Paps first in preparation.

Make sure you spend time on the Paps first in preparation.

Good advice that. I assume you are a married man? 🙂

Yes, don't forget the mhor play.

Bookmarking this thread for many reasons

I understand that (Sgorr nam) Fiannaidh is also a popular route

If you're there for New Year, Newtonmore has a great NYE do where people meet at opposite ends of the village with flaming torches that you can buy the march behind two pipers toward each other to meet at a bridge in the middle of the high street then cross it together for a fire and whisky party.

That'd put you in the Cairngorm area for some short bikes to sneak in in the morning (Laggan, both the trail centre and Laggan Brown off piste are nearby, and High Burnside for more Golfie style stuff if either are open). Aviemore isn't a nice place to be a tourist but there's plenty of munros to hike (I'd go for one of the Cairngorm summits if the weather is good, otherwise head south for Schiehallion or it's really bad Ben Vrackie behind Pitlochry is a lovely walk up a Corbett).

I suspect some of the big estate houses will be doing Christmas stuff then too. There's a nice low level walk to see wildcat statues in Newtonmore and the Highland Wildlife park is very cool - it is a safari park that focuses on animals that live on the tundra or snow so there'll be things you've never seen or heard of.

There'd be somewhere to hammock but that sounds shit to me so wouldn't know where to start.

I was expecting this thread to be about the risk of new covid rules derailing your plans. (I'm planning to go the Scotland for New Year too).

You may not have a problem at this time of year, but I went to Scotland in a campervan in August, and found it very difficult to park it anywhere except a campsite. I understand why and was happy to do that, but you may find a lot of places blocked off.

Isle of Mull. It's beautiful with some stunning hills. Some of the best place to park your van is on the west side of Ben More looking out to Eorsa island.

Also look at Arran and Skye. Torridon is also fantastic, there's a campsite in Shieldaig with a view of one of the nicest sunsets I've ever seen.

Oh yeah, best check out the latest restrictions in Scotland, I think they changed today 😬

No restrictions on anything OP is planning.

Seconded for Ben A'an, amazing views on a clear day. The Isle of Arran is beautiful, there's various hill/mountain terrain for walking, cracking views, great beaches and it's an island you can drive around in a day but spend a couple days exploring. Reached by ferry from Ardrossan on west coast south of Glasgow, takes about an hour. Islay / Jura are also gorgeous on the West Coast, very rugged and great beaches, will be quiet I think around that time out of season. Islay is distillery central. I was biking at Bike Glenlivet recently and a couple who were hillwalking had just got engaged just as I arrived on the bike at the summit of the big hill top of the red - Cairn Daimh I think? Awesome views from the trig point (I took a photo for them!), it's not too far from Aviemore. You could pretend to be doing a bike ride recce.. Good luck with the proposal, what a lovely thing to be planning, lucky girl!! 🙂

Leave the hammocks at home and sleep in the van. Go to Aviemore and park in the ski car park or better the other one which name I can't remember ! Walk up the hill to board while she drives down to Aviemore for a more sensible use of the day.
Or go to Fort Bill.

It’s only half hour more darkness than we’d get at home, and we’d be sat in a house anyway so we’ve decided we don’t care.

I'm in the Borders, you're proposing on going a lot further north.

No restrictions on anything OP is planning.

Except the restrictions may mean businesses don't open - and/or restrict numbers. Could make it tricky to find anything open or with space.

I can suggest a couple of hammocking locations near Aviemore where you can park the van and sleep beside it. PM me if you're interested.

It’s only half hour more darkness than we’d get at home, and we’d be sat in a house anyway so we’ve decided we don’t care.

At the end of the month sunrise in Inverness is 08:58 and sunset is 15:34. You've not said where you're coming from but London is SR 08:05 and SS 15:55. So if you're coming from south England then it's more like and hour and a half.

About 10 years ago I did similar. Hired a campervan, brought my partner to Scotland for a week just after Christmas. I told her it would be great - snowy walks, glorious views and fantastic Hogmanay parties.

The reality was it was wet/drizzly for the whole time. No views as the clouds were down to around 200m. Anything outdoors was rubbish and lots of wet kit in a camper just makes everything damp. Virtually all campsites are closed and this makes it very difficult to empty waste tanks and restock with fresh water. We eventually went to Rothiemurchus which was open. All visitor attractions are closed apart from the Highland Wildlife park (which is mostly outdoors so you get wet anyway).

For Hogmanay pretty much everywhere is ticket only and we couldn't find anywhere around us that had any tickets left so just sat in the van in Newtonmore until late evening when the street party happened. On the 1st and 2nd everything was closed except fuel stations.

I just remember hours and hours of sitting in a damp van listening to the rain, waiting for it to get light for a few hours so we could sit in the van and watch the rain.

If the weather is good, it could be fun - last year it was cold and sunny for most of the Christmas holidays and walking was great. Biking is likely to be either muddy or icy and lots of trails are closed due to storm damage. Snowsports - it's anyone's guess. Several of the centres have opened this weekend for limited skiing, but it's looking warm for the next couple of weeks, so I suspect there will be nothing. Lots of Hogmanay events are cancelled due to Covid such as the Pitlochry street party on the 1st. By then, pubs, cafes and restaurants may also have more restrictions. And PLEASE think about where you will empty and fill your vans tanks.

Sorry if that sounds negative. Scotland is fabulous which is why I moved here, but you could be up for a really miserable experience. Good luck!

Will be nice to see the sun rise without having to be up at the crack of dawn then!

Not many Italians called Dawn. I'm here all week, try the steak!

I'm from the Highlands and would echo boriselbrus there - the weather could make or break it so in a van I'd leave it until have a good handle on the forecast, at this time of year it's dark most of the day, the sun is very low when it does come up, and everything will be shut for a few days, even more so this year. But if there is a nice high pressure system with frost then it could be nice and pretty. Been a while since we had a white xmas I thiiiink but the last few have either been very mild and wet or cold and frosty from memory. And if you are going up mountains in mid winter and aren't experienced in that then there's a whole load to be careful about there. Glen Affric can be nice in winter but you could get properly stuck there for a while if it snows.

Thanks so much everyone! Enough to keep us busy there, and some really awesome spots and advice

We’ll be calling it on the weather closer to the time, if it’s going to be terrible and the weather’s better down South we can go closer to home but if it’s going to be decent we’re keen

So we went in the end! Been one of the best holidays we’ve had together. Had amazing weather so far, just the one rainy day today which we planned for and just got a load of driving done and a nice chilled pub lunch

Didn’t take the bike or board in the end, weather is great for hiking but conditions not so good for either of those

We’ve been to the Lake District on the way up, Beinn Eighe (my fave so far, although very sketchy at the top of Leathad Buidhe with the path completely coated in ice, and also half the way down), Torridon, Skye and now Lomond

The GF is keen to chill a bit tomorrow and I’d fancy a nice fast solo hike up a big hill so I’m eyeing up Ben Lomond. Forecast seems decent, but could anyone more local suggest what conditions might be like up there? I was thinking it being fairly warm and being fairly South it’d be a good bet but at almost 1000m I realise it’s still potentially quite a different story up there

Obviously if I go for it I’ll assess as I go and turn around if it goes even slightly bad but would appreciate some local and/or more expert insight before deciding

https://www.mwis.org.uk/forecasts/scottish

That's where you'll get the forecast for the hills. Next few days sound "interesting" up there. 😆

Glad you are enjoying it!

Thanks, did see that but it only seems to cover the highlands and doesn’t mention ground conditions at all, just weather

Enjoying would be an understatement 🙂 we’ve been all over the world between us and the scenery here is some of the best, possibly my favourite

Your problem tomorrow looks like wind. There will be a bit of snow but should be soft as it's gonna be warm. Lomond path will be exposed to the SWesterly all the way so may not be very pleasant. I would try the cobbler I think as a bit more sheltered. Just be prepared that when you stick your head out of the coire it might be time to turn round and go home! The rough path to the left about 400m after the boulders will give a more sheltered climb.

Just to say I'm sooooo pleased you are having a great time! Scotland is fabulous and I'm currently stuck in Kent and can't wait to get home.

chrishc777
Free Member

Thanks, did see that but it only seems to cover the highlands and doesn’t mention ground conditions at all, just weather

West Highlands covers Loch Lomond

West Highlands covers Loch Lomond

Ah thanks! Having just driven South for 5hrs I had assumed I wasn’t in the highlands anymore 🤣

So... Did you pop the question?

dufresneorama
Free Member

So… Did you pop the question?

Unfortunately not, it’s a long story but I was picking the ring (family heirloom type situation) up from my my mum on the way up but she let me down last minute. Could have sourced one locally but for reasons I won’t go into it didn’t seem right.

To be fair we’re having an amazing time but there is a ‘mission’ element to the being outdoors, limited light, cold and adverse conditions etc. I’m thinking repeating this in summer and doing it then may make for a better scenario, and she is dead keen to see the place in summer (although I imagine the sensation of having the highlands to ourselves we’ve had the last week wouldn’t be quite there)

We’ve been together for 14 years, it can wait 6 months

Good stuff Chris, glad you've had such a great time.

If you want a quick up n down with fabulous views, Beinn Dubh is a wee steep, grassy cracker.

Starts at Luss primary school, nice wee spot for the good lady to wander about too (though most definitely not in summer!).

Glad you’re having a good trip up here. I haven’t actually liked at a forecast but the wind today just down the road in Ayrshire was a bit nuts - definitely check it out before you head out this morning.

I’m thinking repeating this in summer and doing it then may make for a better scenario,

Summer solstice sunset on top of a hill worked well for me 🙂