[Closed] iDave Diet Joinee

And that iDave's fatty pre-sportive breakfast gave him little chance of performing well;

What's that based on other than your opinion?

There were 900+ starters, what kind of finish would I need to have done for you to think I'd 'performed well'?

To keep the thread idiet related, i'm never having milk in my coffee again after yesterdays experience! I've been experimenting with this recently and it triggers bad sugar cravings for me.

Mol, did you say a few pages back that you were going to try to increase power rather than lose weight? Apparently its easier to lose weight than increase power fyi.

Solo, i am also grumpy this morning. 😐

That is a good question iDave.

Edukator - I think you're an awesome Troll and I've enjoyed your contribution to this thread.

A question though... how do we know that's you?

Post a picture of yourself with a [s]tin of baked beans[/s] bulb of garlic on your head and a copy of today's paper or I'll continue to think you're a bit of an angry chubster.

Why is everyone so grumpy, TSY excluded*, this morning?

*Stay strong, sugar-tits.

1m 80 then. So about 10kg overweight for a triathlete/performance cyclist.

I'm a househusband, iDave. I didn't look any different when I was teaching, doing geology or any of the other jobs I've done - apart from younger.

Cheers sweet cheeks.

I'm nay too bad, the mrs (ex-mrs... whatever she's called these days) woke me up this morning at 5:40 to say good bye before she went to work.

Couldn't get back to sleep so made it for the early spin class at the gym and then had a run, a flap about on the cross trainer and a good stretch. Legs feel disgusting now, which pleases me.

*is starting to fall in love with Edukator*

I'm nay too bad, the mrs (ex-mrs... whatever she's called these days) woke me up this morning at 5:40 to say good bye before she went to work.

I would call that a current mrs.

so made it for the early spin class at the gym

I don't hate many forms of exercise, but spin is one of them. It's just rotten....not because it's hard, but because it's just so..well..erm...soulless.

it's just so..well..erm...soulless.

You have to get all happy clappy and sing along to the music. TBH I wish I'd just chucked my bike in the boot and gone out for a proper ride.

So as a retired geology teacher what light can you shed on the insulin response to different types of carbs and the subsequent influence on fat storage? Or are you just not wanting to consider the science as your opinion alone holds such sway? You still haven't done anything other than say "I eat bread therefore you're all wrong"

iDiet question...

Is pork pie ok? Someone has just brought a massive Grosevenor Pie in and I bloody love 'em.

You have to get all happy clappy and sing along to the music

I am too much of a misanthrope to do that.

Hmm. Maybe the problem with spinning is me being too much of a joyless **** to get into the spirit of it?

....Nah, it's just shit bruv....loooooool!

Is pork pie ok? Someone has just brought a massive Grosevenor Pie in and I bloody love 'em.

The meat and the wobbly bits should be ok, the rest you can post to Edukator.

The meat and the wobbly bits should be ok

It's got an actual egg in the middle of it. Man reached his pinnacle when he learnt to encase eggs in meat.

I'm grumpy because its raining today and i am sooooo tired after the weekend! And I suspect i'm having sugar come down/withdrawal, having had to fuel on jelly babies and snickers for 70 fast, hilly miles yesterday. 😡

Still, only 3.5 days to work this week and then its holidays!

DGoAB.

Sorry to learn that not all is well in your world today.
Whats the prob ?.
Think I'm suffering bike withdrawal.

But !, interesting discovery, with the milk.
I guess you'll continue to test that theory to see if you've zero'd milk as the culprit.
So, not all bad, maybe ?.

[i]Post a picture of yourself with a tin of baked beans bulb of garlic on your head and a copy of today's paper or I'll continue to think you're a bit of an angry chubster. [/i]
😆

[i]1m 80 then. So about 10kg overweight for a triathlete/performance cyclist.[/i]

You are desperate aren't you.
I guess sitting at home with all those keys in front of you.
You just can't resist, can you.

Heres the news, Ed.
You don't agree with iDave.
[b]Wow !.[/b]
The basis of your [i]knowledge[/i] and so therefore your alternative opinion to iDave, appears to be mostly anecdotal.

Someone called you a name, ah.
Its the interdnets, innit.
You'll get over it, even for a Troll such as yourself.
Not withstanding that you quite clearly suffer a massive dose of small man syndrome.

I've no idea of the level of people out on British sportives, iDave. Even then "well" is in relation to your personal ability. I reckon I've "gone well" if my cardio-vascular system has performed at the top of what I know is possible from expereience/tests and cardio performance the main limiting factor in my performance rather than how the legs felt.

From your own description you were nowhere near being close to the threshold of your cadio vascular capacity for those four hours.

I haven't done cyclosportives for years but finished 102nd in a particularly mountainous "Etape" having "gone well" - heart rate at 160 - 175 up all four climbs.

So I'm confused....

...erm, nothing else to add.

[i]It's got an actual egg in the middle of it. Man reached his pinnacle when he learnt to encase eggs in meat. [/i]

You got that right !.
🙂
I've a Scotch egg in the fridge here at work.

iDave is solely responsible for my, now complete, addiction to scotch eggs !.

[i]Still, only 3.5 days to work this week and then its holidays! [/i]
Thats the spirit !.
😀

And I suspect i'm having sugar come down/withdrawal...

Do others experience this? Have you tried actual drugs??

I'm intrigued just what the body-mass index is of the guy who's called me a "**" and "****" for suggesting that following iDave's banned carbs (grains, bread, pasta, rice) is counter-productive if you want to maintain a stable, healthy weight over many years and perform at a high level in endurance sports

Complete and utter failure to understand the principles involved. And complete and utter failure to shut up when you are making a complete tit out of yourself.

Incidentally, I didn't agree with iDave's ideas at all at first (the argument is probably still around) but I did listen to the evidence, did my own research and put my money where my mouth was and I realised I was wrong.

[i]Do others experience this? Have you tried actual drugs?? [/i]

I've never suffered what I would describe as sugar withdrawal.
But sometimes I will feel very tired.
Not even sure if the two things are related.

I note some folk on here go on about how they're feeling or how they feel at a certain time of day, such as first thing in the morning.

I wonder if these people are slightly over-analytical.
I don't really walk about, constantly looking within to see how I'm feeling.

Perhaps I'm just an air head.
😐

I guess you'll continue to test that theory to see if you've zero'd milk as the culprit.

TSY, i could do with some drugs today, happy pills maybe? If i've had a hard ride and haven't eaten enough/properly, i can also be grumpy the next day. But i think its more the sugar as the second i finished my macchiato yesterday, all i wanted to do was eat and consume sugar. I was a bottomless pit during the ride and couldn't get enough fuel in me. Didn't help that i was expecting an easy 40miles and we ended up doing a fast, hilly 70miles so i didn't have enough of my normal cycling food with me.

I actually was almost in tears on the last climb it hurt me so much after big ringing it all the way and being dragged along the flats at 40-50kph. Mustard had to put a hand on my back to help me up the last climb as my legs were gone! The lengths i will go to to train to beat Molly.

Oh wait, i didn't have any cheesecake or coke, that was the essential training i needed to do for the DGOAB vs Mol TT. FAIL. 😀

Edukator - your post just highlight your lack of understanding of exercise science.

Still waiting for your take on insulin, carbs and fat storage? As in, the science behind why you think carbs don't make people fat.

[i]Incidentally, I didn't agree with iDave's ideas at all at first (the argument is probably still around) but I did listen to the evidence, did my own research and put my money where my mouth was and I realised I was wrong. [/i]

I remember that [i]discussion[/i]

You made iDave glue down his caps lock for a complete post.

I'm with Molgrips on this.

iDave is just the messenger.
This all started when someone suggested stuff to him, since which he has gone off and come up with his own conclusions.

I like iDave's stuff, because I believe he's done his [b]home work[/b].

I know its MDA again, but there are embedded links to other stuff, if you're of a mind to read...
Grains.

it only seems to be milk in my coffee that does it

I don't think that can be right. Try having cereal with milk in it and a black coffee. See what happens.

I actually was almost in tears on the last climb it hurt me so much after big ringing it all the way and being dragged along the flats at 40-50kph

This is why you feel rubbish today IMO. Not sugar withdrawal. If your body is still screaming for sugar... you should have some! (IMO and all that gubbins)

I know its MDMA again

That's ma bwoy.

I'm quite happy talking about insulin or any other scientific aspect, iDave. I worked for Lindt for five years and spent a lot of time discussing nutrition with the company specilist. He took an interest in my sporting activities and provided me with lots of literature to read. Major food companies such as Lindt do a lot of research on the glycemique reactions to their products. Chocolate many on here will be delighted to know doesn't have quite the diasasterous effect on insulin demand/glycemie you might expect for a product that contains 30% sugar. It behaves more like a slow sugar.

There's now a mass of information on the web and typing "what to eat before a competition" into Google will get you informative stuff such as [url= http://www.pponline.co.uk/encyc/eating-before-competition-413 ]this[/url] and [url= http://www.pausatf.org/data/Clubs/eatbefore.pdf ]this which will bring you out in a cold sweat[/url]

You seem to have the idea that you are the fountain of all knowledge and nobody else has a clue which is far from the case, iDave.

This weekend I found out that running on a Jagermeister and bitter hangover doesn't work well.
Managed 8 miles at shuffle pace, then nearly fell over as a muscle in my right calf chose not to fire. So started to walk and then nearly fell over as one of the support muscles in my left leg decided not to fire. Chose a gait similar to crab to walk the rest of the way home.
Decided Jagermiester isn't a performance enhancer.

I'm quite happy talking about insulin or any other scientific aspect, iDave

Go on then?

Your link is irrelevant. I've never suggested people go on a low carb diet, or that they don't use carbs before during and after 'certain' events.

You seem to have the idea that you are the fountain of all knowledge and nobody else has a clue which is far from the case, iDave.

Not really, though it's my job to follow best practice in training and nutrition. I've just asked you for evidence beyond, "me and my triathlon mate eat bread and muesli".

You follow an ancient plan from the French Olympic team which they no longer follow. You're lean because you're very active, not because you eat high GI carbs.

did my own research and put my [s]money[/s] cheesecake where my mouth was and I realised I was wrong.

FTFY 😉

[i]You seem to have the idea that you are the fountain of all knowledge and nobody else has a clue which is far from the case, iDave.[/i]

[b]BS ![/b]

If you could stop looking in the mirror long enough to read the posts, you'd see that iDave has an opinion.
Listen, don't listen.
Its up to whomever.

You're still not enlightening me on the insulin response, fat storage issue.
Procrastinating about Lindt is a weak diversion.

Imo, the medical community are waking up to the possibilty that there is too much sugar in alot of people's diets and that grain based foods may not be as healthy as once suggested.

[i]Decided Jagermiester isn't a performance enhancer.[/i]

I'd disagree.
Based on your post.
Sounds like you received the optimum result from too much Jagermiester.
ie, falling down, parts of you not working properly.
😉

It behaves more like a slow sugar

As opposed to a fast sugar? And what would the implications of that be? Are you implying that some carbs are 'better' than others? 🙄

Ok then. There's nothing wrong with eating bread, pasta or müsli. Eat them, your blood sugar levels will rise as the carbs are digested and you body will produce insulin as a response. As you finish digesting the food the insulin produced declines to match. No problem.

If you eat too much food that has too much fast sugar then the body may produced too much insulin for too long with adverse effects on both blood sugar levels and the feeling of hunger. Eating a ham sandwich isn't a problem though, the body copes just fine (unless you're diabetic).

I don't think that can be right. Try having cereal with milk in it and a black coffee. See what happens.

This is what i have been doing in my experiment. Skimmed milk in my cereal and black coffee. Then i occassionally have a macchiato and it always = sugar cravings. I have cereal twice a day and when i remove the milk from my coffee, i don't want any sugar at all, so its not connected to my cereal eating. Its just an interesting observation.

I don't want sugar today, i'm just a little grumpy/tired but i bet it would make me happier! *snacks on sugar snap peas and pepper*

Have the Hamsters not had their coke today?

snacks on sugar snap peas and pepper

No wonder you're grumpy!

iDave says I have no credentials, know nothing and am not qualified to comment. You, Yeti, rubbish the credentials I choose to give and claim it's not me in the foto.

There's nothing wrong with eating bread, pasta or müsli.

It can have adverse effects depending on your situation.

My point to you Edukator is that our bodies vary a lot. Some people never get fat, some people never get skinny, regardless of what they eat.

Your own experience is only really valid for you. People who find it easy to be skinny often make the mistake of assuming that anyone who is not skinny is stuffing their face with pies constantly whilst sitting on a sofa all day. It's not necessarily the case.

and claim it's not me in the foto

That is what we on STW call 'a joke'.

Are you implying that some carbs are 'better' than others?

I'm saying there's nothing wrong with the carbs you recommend eliminating, the list that started grains, pasta... . They are no worse (and IMO are beter) than the lentils you advise, particualrly if you intend to go running in the next 36 hours.

I don't think anyone on here has suggested eating large quanities of "fast sugars" such as sucrose.

[i]Ok then. There's nothing wrong with eating bread, pasta or müsli. Eat them, your blood sugar levels will rise as the carbs are digested and you body will produce insulin as a response. As you finish digesting the food the insulin produced declines to match. No problem.

If you eat too much food that has too much fast sugar then the body may produced too much insulin for too long with adverse effects on both blood sugar levels and the feeling of hunger. Eating a ham sandwich isn't a problem though, the body copes just fine (unless you're diabetic).
[/i]

Ed.

You're not playing right are you ?.
Have you read the stuff about grains yet ?.
^^^ doesn't seem like it to me.

Edukator - I'm not rubbishing your opinion, it's just that, that one pic could be of anyone.

FWIW I can eat a shed load of bread and pasta and stick at about 76kg have done for ages. In the last couple of months I started eating a pack of mini-eggs a day and lost a kg. The last week I've been on the full blown iDiet and I'm sub 72kg now. Well, almost, I still eat >5 a day in fruit alone.

I do a fair bit of exercise though...

You see, Molgrips, Yeti still doesn't believe it's me in the pic. No joke.

How much do you think your diet increases the risk of colon cancer by, iDave? Always a risk when you increase the proportion of proteins and fats in your diet thus generally increasing meat content and slowing passage. changing the types of carbs won't help much when they are a minority part of your intake.

Edukator - it is a joke. I don't care if it's you in the picture or not, would be funny if you'd followed my request 😀

The baked beans on the head with todays paper is a long standing internet joke and was used on here to challenge my assertion that I'm a man.

I'm saying there's nothing wrong with the carbs you recommend eliminating

What's your evidence? And 'well me and my mates are thin' isn't scientific enough.

Always a risk when you increase the proportion of proteins and fats in your diet thus generally increasing meat content and slowing passage

If you read the diet plan, you'll see that it recommends loads of beans and vegetables. A diet rich in beans and veg results in pretty good bowel function.

molgrips is right......i am eating no more meat and fat than i was prior to going onto the plan.
i am however eating ton's more veg and beans and salad.
and i shyte just the same amount.............. 😉

+1 ton, I've never been so regular, at least twice a day now! 😯

So you use your in joke to mock an adversary you are failing to counter with science and logic. Playground tactics. Laters.

I want some science from you please Edukator. Tell me exactly why there's nothing wrong with lots of high GI carbs for everyone.

and might i add, todays lunch is a real cancer inducing feast...
olives, sun dried toms, prawns, dollop of hummus and carrot sticks... 8)

I'm eating chicken vindaloo and chana dhal. Lovely.

In other news - How to piss off Lance in one easy move 😀

to mock an adversary

😆

I'd rather we talk about specific foods, Molgrips. How about müesli and bread as examples of the grains iDave eliminates that all but diabetics can integrate into a healthy balanced diet compatible with sporting performances at the highest level.

I've already explained the science, refer back to my post on insulin response.

Was the pack of chocolate eggs to get down to 72kg some kind of in joke too, iDave? The stuff in the middle of those things is something with so much sucrose even I won't eat them..

Nope, I was just eating them every evening for a while and I lost weight... no idea why or how. My guess was that I was exercising a lot and that my metabolism is kind of going balistic at the minute.

You're getting confused. I never mentioned chocolate eggs. Or your photo.

How about müesli and bread as examples of the grains iDave eliminates that all but diabetics can integrate into a healthy balanced diet compatible with sporting performances at the highest level

Which sports events? A 10 mile TT or an Ultramarathon? Are they the same in terms of fueling. And as the thread was about weight-loss, can someone who needs to lose 3 stone eat as much of your favourite carbs as they want and lose weight?

What level of success have you had helping the obsese to lose weight with your methods?

And have you ever been over-weight yourself?

Edukator - Member

"Are you implying that some carbs are 'better' than others?"

I'm saying there's nothing wrong with the carbs you recommend eliminating, the list that started grains, pasta... . They are no worse (and IMO are beter) than the lentils you advise, particualrly if you intend to go running in the next 36 hours.

I'm interested in the science behind that last bit. If you're running in the next 36 hours, you'll want plenty of glycogen in your body. But why does it matter if you got that glycogen from lentils or muesli?

My credentials - BA, MA and PhD, 75kg and 6'1" giving me a BMI of 22, i lived with sports scientists for 3 years, i have an all access pass to lots of journals, I got 909 points on fitocracy yesterday, i have brown hair, size 12 feet and support Pompey.

support Pompey.

It was all going so well. Your contribution will have to be referred to a committee.

shut up dave he's already explained the science in his post about insulin.... remember, you eat something.. your body produces insulin, after a while the insulin calms its tits and the body is back to normal. why wont you let him eat his god damn moosly?!

how on earth do you think he got a body that fine for an older, not so rpetty chap? god damn meuslee thats how. if you dont believe the nutritionist who worked for a a chocolate companies advice then i challenge you to post up a photo of yourself as proof not eating moosli makes you a winner.

obviously edukator looks very good for a oldish boy, and i reckon by looking at his physique, that he is one of those lucky people who can eat pretty much whatever he wants, without put any weight/fat on.
unfortunatley, we are not all the same, and some people do put fat on pretty easily.
and not eating bulky stodgy carbs is proving to be (to me, a fat knacker) a good way to cut the bulk.

quiet ton, i'm having none of this rubbish. i know for a fact you're addicted to fish pie and thats full of pie. pie is fed on grains and muesli dont you know.

HOW DO YOU ANSWER THAT THEN iDAVE?!

iDave - Member
support Pompey.
It was all going so well. Your contribution will have to be referred to a committee.

Dammit*. Does one have to follow a top division side to qualify? I listen to podcasts about Arsenal...

*What did the fish say when it hit a concrete wall? Dam.

how many fish does it take to change a lightbulb?

none, they live in water. water and electricity don't mix. remember that as it might save your life one day.

No, fueling for 100m, 10km, 20km, 40km and longer won't be the same. Answering two questions in one: high fibre lentils proabably won't be a problem over 100m so long as there's a toilet handy during the warm up but I'm not the only runner to cut out beans/lentils when I'm intending to run (as opposed to jog) for an hour or more in the coming 36h. Beans/lentils and very fatty foods give lots of runners the runs.

Whereas muesli has similar properties to Imodium.

My credentials - BA, MA and PhD, 75kg and 6'1" giving me a BMI of 22, i lived with sports scientists for 3 years, i have an all access pass to lots of journals, I got 909 points on fitocracy yesterday, i have brown hair, size 12 feet and support Pompey.

I have access to Wikipedia.

Check. Mate.

how many fish does it take to change a lightbulb?

none, they live in water. water and electricity don't mix. remember that as it might save your life one day.

Care to explain electric eels?

[img] [/img]

I'm sorry, did your head explode? ...OR DID I JUST BLOW YOUR MIND!

I get on fine with müesli (we're not talking Alpen here), Cap, if you have problems with müesli try toast or pancakes; grains in a more refined form with less fibre. Wash them down with grape juice rather than orange juice. If you have problems with müesli I'd be very surprised if you got on with lentils and fatty sausage for breakfast.

Low GI for Breakfast ?

[i]Foods with a high index are rapidly digested and result in high fluctuations in blood sugar levels. Foods with a low glycemic index produce gradual rises in blood sugar and insulin levels and [b]are considered healthier[/b][/i]

the electric eel is a myth made up by creationists to try and prove evolution jamie. DUH.

how many fish does it take to cross the road?

none, fish dont cross the road, remember to look both ways when crossing the road guys, it might save your life one day x

Ladies & Gentleman. We appear to have a glitch. Please wait patiently, and page 28 will be along shortly.

We're sorry. We appear to experiencing a longer than usual delay. I can only apologise, and assure you that you're childish squabbling is very important to us here at STW.

*plays muzak*

Edit: Normal service is resumed. Thank you for using STW.

[i]*plays muzak*[/i]

[img] [/img]

A nice article lacking in examples of real food, Solo. Apart from almonds (which are present in my Müseli), what examples of suitable breakfast foods does it give?

Edukator - Member
I get on fine with müesli (we're not talking Alpen here), Cap, if you have problems with müesli try toast or pancakes; grains in a more refined form with less fibre. Wash them down with grape juice rather than orange juice. If you have problems with müesli I'd be very surprised if you got on with lentils and fatty sausage for breakfast.

When did this become about my gut? You're the one who can't digest lentils without needing a toilet nearby for the next day and a half.

I'll ask again... assuming your gut can cop, why is glycogen from muesli better than glycogen from lentils when preparing for a race?

edit - what else is in your muesli? Wouldn't it be amusing if it was low GI!

[i]squabbling[/i]

Squabble.

That word has always amused me.

I know, I've a teeny, tiny, mind.

Whereas muesli has similar properties to Imodium.

Can we get back to talking about real food please?

[img] [/img]

[i]A nice article lacking in examples of real food, Solo. Apart from almonds (which are present in my Müseli), what examples of suitable breakfast foods does it give?[/i]

Are they Low GI almonds...
😉

Ah !, so you are selectively reading some of the links posted.

No mention about how low GI is considered healthier then...

Ok, grains. Bread, pasta, made from wheat flour.
Phytate.
Found in processed grain.

Nondigestible Carbohydrates and Mineral Bioavailability

[i]Generally, ?ber and compounds associated with ?ber [b]in cereal products[/b] (e.g., phytates) have been
found to [b]reduce the apparent absorption of minerals[/b] (such as calcium, magnesium, zinc and manganese) in
humans[/i]

Edukator - Member
Whereas muesli has similar properties to Imodium.
Since you wrote this, Captjon.

OK. Muesli keeps me regular, and lentils keep you within a certain distance of a toilet. It appears you're saying that food affects people differently. Is that correct?

And again, why is your muesli created glycogen better than my lentil created glycogen?

My Müsli contains those grains iDave excludes whatever its G value.

iDave is the one distorting the normal view of high glycemie foods by including things normally considered low G such as grains. Oats are noramlly considered low G and excellent breakfast food but iDave excludes grains. Whole wheat bread is also considered low G by most people. Spaghetti is also considered low G by most people.

I fail to see why iDave excludes carbs that have a lower G than for example the parsnip which is very much a vegetable.

is it possiby because, as mentioned several times, its not a low GI plan, its a plan designed to take better control of the insulemic response?

sometimes i forget that not everyone is as clever as me, but then i read threads like this.

iGenius.

Wow - Jamie - man has evolved further than I ever imagined.