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The wife has bought a cocker spaniel/poodle mix.
I heard on here over the years that you need to build a dog up to a decent distance or you knacker their hips?
I have a 1 hour 14km loop I like to ride of an evening during the week, is this a reasonable distance for a dog?
Any advice welcome.
Need more info, e.g. age, fitness. How long has he been with you? Is it a rescue or bought as a puppy?
If a pup, needs to be fairly well grown before doing too much.
How fast are you planning to ride? If a gentle pace it's not too long, but not much fun for the dog if he doesn't get to stop and smell things etc.
I've a labrador (getting quite senior now though he's still puppy-like in many ways) and with him and our previous lab too, the guidance we've always been given is about a year old before they're joints have matured to be able to do longer or faster things.
Enjoy the puppyness whilst it lasts.
Yes you definitely need to wait a while, although how old I'm not too sure. Might be worth checking with your vet.
I take mine several times a week on the commute to work which is I suppose about 2.5-3 miles. There and back at the end.
Longest I've done with him is about 11 miles but that's obviously with plenty of stops and changes of pace.
It's easy to forget to go slow on the bike but when mine wants to run, unless it's a decent downhill section there's no way I can catch him.
It does take some training. Mine has the habit of running right under my front wheel, looking back at me. I think this is my fault as he is always waiting for me to drop into a sprint/do something exciting.
From the blue cross website, but also what we were advised at puppy training classes:
A general guide for exercising puppies is to allow them one to two sessions of five minutes walking for each month of age, so for example, a four month old pup could enjoy walks of 20 minutes at a time, once or twice a day.
this applies up to about a year old although others suggest once they have grown fully skeletally at about 8-10 months
If you take them running on armoured surfaces (a lot of trail centres), then it rips off the skin on their paws. Don't ask how I know this.
I started taking mine when they were about 2 years old, but even then always a very chilled, gentle ride otherwise it just seems a bit unfair taking them somewhere with so many exciting things to smell but no time to investigate further.
The dog is currently 4 months old, off road I'm doing about 12kmph. Can potter on the road to and from. There is a lot of small ups and downs plus technical (for me) so not fast.
I guess I could throw the bike and dig in the car to drive there and do two loops.
I have a 1 hour 14km loop
Just take it easy, make sure there are short cuts in case the dog starts flagging. In warmer weather, a stream or something they can cool off in.
I had a GSP, which are renowned for their stamina, I would’ve considered 11k a very long day out. (Mainly because my 11km would’ve been a hell of a lot more for the dog, she didn’t just stick by the bike wheel the whole time. )
My Cocker at 1 is still a bit of a pain on walks - she gets distracted by anything and everything. However, on a bike ride she's super well-behaved. We go together on the flat, she just about keeps up on the downhills and of course on the climbs she kicks my ass. But mostly she sticks close and, without any specific training, seems to implicitly 'get' that she's supposed to stay near my back wheel (and never in front of it).
I don't do miles and miles with her. 5-10km seems like a good distance but YMMV.
From the blue cross website, but also what we were advised at puppy training classes:
A general guide for exercising puppies is to allow them one to two sessions of five minutes walking for each month of age, so for example, a four month old pup could enjoy walks of 20 minutes at a time, once or twice a day.
this applies up to about a year old although others suggest once they have grown fully skeletally at about 8-10 months
Yeah, I had a look into where this guidance comes from. It's basically completely made up with no evidence base to support it. There's the odd paper describing beagles on treadmills for hours on end in the first year of their lives with no impact on skeletal growth or arthritis etc and basically no evidence to suggest overexercising is harmful.
Basically, whilst I might be tempted to start gently and build up (as with any exercise programme), take that somewhat strict guidance with a massive dose of salt, and feel free to ignore any zealots that tell you you're doing it wrong. On the other hand, if you make your dog too fit then it's harder to wear them out.
In warmer weather, a stream or something they can cool off in.
Yes, definitely this. My dog seems to need to drink a lot more than I do, too. I can probably ride for an hour or so (10km off road) without needing any water, but the dog drinks gallons in the same distance. If you're not going near streams then bring a bottle of water / small bowl. Someone at my dog class today had one of these, which looked clever - think I'll order one. https://brbpets.com/products/hydro-smart-travel-bottle
That sounds like way too much for a 4 month old. It's quite intense exercise (non stop, fast, uneven terrain, lots of turns). Obviously all dogs are different and yours might be fine but it's a risk I wouldn't take when you have 15 years ahead. Build up steadily and start slow imo.
Ha, no chance I'm taking it out straight away at that distance, we walked the 2km inner loop today and she loved it.
Might just do that loop with her on off days when she's 8 months or so.
Never
Puppies (wild dogs) lolloping along with the pack or on a science experiment tread mill is a very different scenario to a mountain bike ride. Inevitable speed, mixed surfaces, jumping over and the worst of all, running down gradients.
Consider also that many dogs get stressed out by being "left behind" and what is suggested some dogs see as having to chase.
4 mo is too young, without expert knowledge I'd happily advocate for 12mo minimum and a slow introduction to bike etiquette follow/side/ahead/ etc. What about reliable recall?
My Lab/Shep/Rotty/Bear/Racoon cross was 18mo before first decent rides. Started short trail loops after 12mo, figured out bikes/wheels are worth avoiding the first time she saw a chipmunk on the other side of me and decided that running under my front wheel would be as good plan. A heavy tyre buzz and me over the bars and on the floor was enough learning to leave the critters alone.
I loved having a riding buddy that was available anytime I wanted to go. Would follow me without hesitation was an expert with line choice. Some questionable french lines as she got older though
She ended her riding career at 8 I think. She's 15 now but still looks hopeful when I grab my shoes and helmet.
Ahh someone has beaten me to dispelling the 5 minutes per month rule. Basically it’s been disproved as there is no hard and fast evidence. Genetics is where it’s at, when you go to the doctors you’ll get asked if you have a family history of X,Y and Z? I have IBD, as does my brother, uncle, niece, it’s in the genes and the same is true of dogs and their bones. Labrador’s have an awful time with hips and knees because it’s been bred in and is now almost unavoidable, you pay mega bucks for purebred dogs to include those pesky hip scores which will help avoid any issues down the line.
However, what’s very important for growth and development across all species is rest! At 4 months your 11kms is going to completely wipe your pup out and at such a vital age it’s more important to focus on things like building your relationship, getting the foundations in place. When I brought my latest home, I had an a4 page of all the places, environments, things he needed to see, no way I’d have had time for a big ride like that in a day as well as do that list and allow him time to rest.
You have a lot of time to come yet, do the important stuff first like start embedding your recall, starting building up your relationship and trust.
My old trail dog passed on a year ago and my new canine friends have such a strong prey drive that I’m not sure I could let them loose in the countryside for fear of going home empty handed!!😀
My old Bearded Collie was trained from about 18 months old using the command “follow”. He would basically chase me but knew not to come in front of the bike.
Started off doing rides along the river bank where he had nowhere else to go, but to follow until he properly understood the command before venturing into the woods/open countryside. Build the distance gradually, you will soon learn what pace suits the dog, take water, treats/food and have plenty of stops along the way.
I’m fairly sure that the breed, used for herding in the hills made the training straightforward and his stamina was better than mine although as he got older he preferred me riding my fatty.
I still miss him every day!
This should help: https://singletrackmag.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/07/talking-trail-dogs-with-bark-and-ride/
Wait, your puppy can ride a bike?
As a grumpy mtber and dog owner, I'm with Beargrease....never. go for a dog walk or go biking.
Best time is when no other riders are using the trails...
Saying that (largely as a joke), they need to learn so wait until the development/growth stuff is done (is it a year before allowing them to jump and stuff?), then get it out and get used to the bike and running very close behind you - also work on recall.
I prefer not having dogs around me but no issues with others bringing their dogs - as long as they stay well away from me (normally not a problem as I'm last by a long margin!).
Nothing constructive to add, but I’m not a ‘dog’ person but capitulated to getting a border collie two years ago, mainly from pressure from my 14 year old son who wanted a trail dog.
Started taking her out around 18 months old, and I didn’t really relish having her with me on rides, I now love taking her, had her out this afternoon, 18 miles (she’ll have done considerably more) 800m climbing.
I don’t take her on big group rides, but if I’m going out with her I invite others along from our WhatsApp group and they seem to enjoy having her along - I suspect dogs are like kids, you get what you’re given, or what they grow up to be!
Hope you and your dog enjoy it!
Oh and for the record, my son has taken her out trail- riding…….
Never!!!
I think it is the getting them properly trained that is the issue for many - takes time and a lot of effort.
Saying that, plenty of dogs that are well trained and are great...
At least 18months old and then a good few month building up. Mine do 12km gravel regularly which is a 6km climb so even if I go hard they are just lolloping along if they dash off into the woods I wait. The descent is on the brakes so no faster than the climb. Takes just over an hour. There's burns and a "river" for dipping into.
If I'm doing MTB with segments then we can end up at 16km but we take our time. Molly hates losing so she runs ahead, Dave is content to drop in on my wheel.
We tend to ride when or where other mtbers won't be about.8am on a Saturday or 2pm on a Friday if going to Yair.
My working Cocker Spaniel came out with me from when he was about 3-4. I would never take a dog any younger.
Never trail centre's either always early or late local trails. He just got it. He did linger at my front wheel once but a good nudge meant he never did it again.
I retired him at about 7. He'd still go today but at 10 he'd be destroyed. I wouldn't take a dog over 10 miles on a fast moving bike in any weather.
Just my opinion. They can't tell you when they've had enough.
A mate has a lab, and comes from a proper working dog background.
He waited till the dog was a year old nd properly "trained" before trying to start riding with her.
Mine started coming out with me for small loops around 18 months , we never went to far as i was always aware that if she hurt herself i had to get her back and she would keep running no matter what . Biggest ride we did was Drumlanrig red which worked really well as the twisty nature of it meant you were never going that fast and there was plenty of puddles and water on the route , the surface was nice and soft for her feet too . We had a local loop that took about an hour that we did which was a climb and descent and i always made sure i was taking it easy on the down , when you ride with a dog you have to ride differently I feel , put the dogs needs first .
One thing i did do when she was a puppy was ride my bike around the garden just so she was used to seeing me on it and it wasn't something totally new when she was older .
Need more info, e.g. age, fitness
The dog is currently 4 months old,
Yes, but what about you?
It?
14k in an hour sounds hard for a dog any age
As above wouldn't take them till much older, and very well trained
Generally I’d say to wait till skeletally mature. Yes there is a lack of hard scientific evidence for it. Mostly that’s because it’s hard to get that evidence and who is going to pay for it?
Anyway let them get mature both for physical but also behavioural so they are well trained and recall good.
My working lab might have done 4-5k at a slow pace from about 9 months to get him trained. Now at 14 months 10 k at a decent pace leaves him pleasantly tired for an afternoon.
Start training with bike from 8-9 months and the work it up with that type of dog would be my thoughts.
I have a Sprocker Spaniel. Very high enegry, lots of stamina. Absolutley lovely dog. I considered taking him on an MTB ride, but it just didn't seem fair to me, it's probably faster than they would naturally want to do. Not judging those that do. That's just me.
I decided to level the playing field, and last Autumn took up trail running instead. That way if I'm getting anywhere near tired, he's nowhere near his limits. He runs rings around me - runs ahead for some mandatory sniffing, runs back to tell me to hurry up!
Running with your dog is one of the best things ever, and feels like it builds a strong bond.
I waited until he was 18 months before running any distance with him.
We have a 2 year old cockapoo. She runs 3 times the distance I cover in a straight line whether riding or walking. My assistant has a working cocka. She has tracked her dog. It runs upto 5 times the distance. As others have said it’s not just about building the stamina, you really need to let them mature. I do two longer days each week but otherwise am now quite cautious after having a few active folks report problems with their dogs.
when you ride with a dog you have to ride differently I feel , put the dogs needs first .
Very much this. The ride should be about exercising the dog, well within it’s limits of speed, duration and distance. Looking back, family rides when the kids were younger were great fun with the dog.
My Irish terrier was 18 months (Vet advised to allow joints n bones to develop) before I started with her, Also took time to train her to run behind the bike as IMO nothing worse or more dangerous than a dog running in front of the bike.
Thanks all, she's well used to people on bikes so that won't be an issue.
So it looks like next summer will be good for starting and it sounds like just the pootles around the woods for the dog.
Our Vizla is up for pretty much anything you can do off-road on a bike. She's almost 2 now. Started with the bike at about 4 months but that was only 10-15 minutes short loops (and not that often) so she got used to the bike and learned to stay out of the way etc.
From about a year we started to let her come to more/longer routes. We are typically 15-20km over a couple of hours (with 600m of climbing in that) and she eats it up... way faster than us on the ups so she can get a rest or (more often) run into the woods to explore. On the downs she is normally faster anyway but keeps well out of the way. Typically 2-3 times a week so she gets a good rest and recovery between.
She's just been spayed so she is recovering with minimal exercise. You should see the dirty looks she gives you as you get the bike onto the car and she's locked in the house. Poor thing..
Surely this is a thread that demands photos though?!
Beautiful dog. Jealous! 😥
I started riding with Muttlee when she was 6 months.
She's a Springer-collie and 6 years old now.
Started with the normal 5km loop around the river - which we walked all the time.
We do this every morning now. And walk with a tennis ball in the evening. Plus lunch if MrsSC can be bothered.
Running with a bike is easier for her than chasing a tennis ball - which occasionally results in strains from the twisting.
Get a Julius harness and traffic-lead for any road bits.
Recall is to the bike bell. Ping!
At a year of age plus I'd say 14km is perfect.
Listen and watch the dog. On Thursday I did 14km with Muttlee. Took a small bowl for her to have some water (it's actually a lid from a Trespass dog-bottle) and we both enjoyed it. Saw fox, deer and red squirrels.
Yesterday was a 8km loop via the brewery. Muttlee loves going to the brewery 🙂
Started with Fin at about 1 year old. By that time she was well trained in command's and took to it naturally.
Most of the time she will run at the left hand side of the rear wheel. When it's steep and technical I tell her to go and she will run a short distance in front so I don't catch her with the bike.
It's a great feeling when we are on the trails together
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I considered taking him on an MTB ride, but it just didn’t seem fair to me, it’s probably faster than they would naturally want to do.
This - I'd be careful
My feeling is that just because a dog can keep up with you doesn't mean you should force it to do so. You are their pack leader and they will do all they can to stay with you regardless of what it's doing to them.
Quick story: we bred a litter of working cockers, we kept on and my BIL had another. He's taken her biking quite a lot and now, at 6 years old, has a knackered back (disc problems) - vet says there's nothing they can do other than painkillers.
Your choice but I'd certainly not be taking a smaller dog biking on a regular basis.
Definitely just play it really careful and not on the road or when it's hot.
My Beech used to absolutely adore going out with us. It was the most excited you would ever see her. It's really addictive for her and for us to see her so happy and excited and so you do get tempted to over do things or take them when you probably shouldn't.
I'm not one for living a life avoiding all risk so there were a few occasions where we made a mistake such as a short local woods loop on a hot evening where she ran her paws raw. She'd run those surfaces and distance many times but the evening was a bit hot and she had sweated through her paws which then caused the issue. If I remember rightly we'd bumped into friends in the woods and they were riding faster and she always wanted to be front of pack. We felt terrible and carried her home and bandaged her paws.
She also developed arthritis about age 8 and we stopped all riding and ball throwing. She was still climbing mountains age 12 though and we said goodbye to her in October age 13. I truly believe if we could ask her if she wanted a very controlled and careful life but no arthritis Vs the adventure packed life spent doing all the things we did together but some pain in her later years she'd choose the latter.
I would think twice about taking another dog riding though. I mean if you get them into it they see you putting the gear on and go crazy, it's hard to resist but if they never knew about riding they wouldn't miss it.
if they never knew about riding they wouldn’t miss it.
Canine psychologist in our midst 😉
Disappointed to find out no one has posted:
"When their paws can reach the pedals..."
Our 8yo cockerpoo comes riding with me occasionally, but I keep it to a 5k loop of the local woods with unsurfaced trails. He does absolutely love it though!
My dog seems to need to drink a lot more than I do, too. I can probably ride for an hour or so (10km off road) without needing any water, but the dog drinks gallons in the same distance
And plenty of poo bags or a shovel 🙂
I used to carry a soft fold up bowl and carry more water than usual.
I used to do mixed ride with leads on and a bit of bike walking in between road sections.
I’d think of it as a dog ride with the bike as opposed to taking the dog mtbing as shark bait says they seem to love it so much they’ll easily overdo it unless you exercise some control for them.
Had 2 springers from same batch one developed leg problems (both developed cancer).